Official Taylormade M1 Driver Thread

[Interpol]

[quote name='rafal' timestamp='1441406795' post='12265124']
What if the chip measures all the strike parameters and automatically adjusts the sliders, face angle, tip stiffness and what not. Like traction control computers in cars.
[/quote]

And how would that be done without having a bunch of motors and servos in the clubhead? Start putting those things in and you have a non-conforming golf club.

[Noke]

[quote name='Interpol' timestamp='1441411053' post='12265316']
[quote name='rafal' timestamp='1441406795' post='12265124']
What if the chip measures all the strike parameters and automatically adjusts the sliders, face angle, tip stiffness and what not. Like traction control computers in cars.
[/quote]

And how would that be done without having a bunch of motors and servos in the clubhead? Start putting those things in and you have a non-conforming golf club.
[/quote]

He was kidding.

[Interpol]

[quote name='sethdavidsdad' timestamp='1441403478' post='12264936']
This is why I think it's possible, the partnership with Microsoft is already there. I can't believe that the end goal was just what is available now (myroundpro). Much like ping did with there Iping app. They offer the app free but they are using it testing and fiting not just with us but with their staff and pros. The end game is data collection and use. First step is always data collection, what you do with it is the future.
[/quote]

Not saying it's impossible, I'm saying it's impractical and unnecessary to do so. Take a look at my previous posting upthread about sensor electronics - there are already data collection solutions out there that do the job nicely, are cheaper and more practical, and don't require inserting electronics into the part of the club that's used to strike a hard ball at 100mph. Arccos, Game Golf, SkyPro, iPing, 3Bays - all of these units are small, unobtrusive, and removable. That's key.

And what benefit does mounting a GPS in a driver head have over just carrying a standalone unit?

A partnership with Microsoft or Apple or Google means nothing.

[quote][color=#282828]He was kidding.[/quote][/color]

[color=#282828]I'm not so sure about that. The level of crazy, outlandish speculation in this thread has really gotten out of hand.[/color]

[sethdavidsdad]

Yeah I can't image why any club maker would want to know:
What golf courses you played?
Which holes you hit driver?
How far you hit it
Where you hit it
Which side of the fairway you missed most.
How many of there drivers are in play
How many times you play, a day , a week, a month?

You are right that would be dumb for a club maker to want info like that. All for a whole $10. Extreme sarcasm alert!!!

They may not do it but this tech is coming. Like or not. It's to cheap not to do.

[Interpol]

OK, let's pick this apart one by one.

[i]Yeah I can't image why any club maker would want to know:
What golf courses you played?[/i]

And that data is best gathered from GPS electronics in the driver head because...?


[i]Which holes you hit driver?[/i]

Why would a club maker want to know this?


[i]How far you hit it[/i]
[i]Where you hit it[/i]
[i]Which side of the fairway you missed most.[/i]

And this type of data gathering is facilitated by having a GPS unit in the driver head because...?


[i]How many of there drivers are in play[/i]

Sure. Because sales numbers wouldn't work as well, and is much less invasive than GPS tracking ALL of their drivers.


[i]How many times you play, a day , a week, a month?[/i]

Wow. And you're really more than willing to give all this information to a club manufacturer sight unseen? The NSA must love you.


[i]You are right that would be dumb for a club maker to want info like that. All for a whole $10. Extreme sarcasm alert!!!
They may not do it but this tech is coming. Like or not. It's to cheap not to do.[/i]

100% complete rubbish. You still haven't given a single reason why it would be better to have integrated circuitry and electronics in a driver clubhead, of all places, versus what's already out there, and your "$10" estimate is completely baseless.

[bobcat]

[quote name='sethdavidsdad' timestamp='1441413054' post='12265462']
Yeah I can't image why any club maker would want to know:
What golf courses you played?
Which holes you hit driver?
How far you hit it
Where you hit it
Which side of the fairway you missed most.
How many of there drivers are in play
How many times you play, a day , a week, a month?

You are right that would be dumb for a club maker to want info like that. All for a whole $10. Extreme sarcasm alert!!!

They may not do it but this tech is coming. Like or not. It's to cheap not to do.
[/quote]

Well, that kind of driver would not be attractive to me, but if you want to speculate as to why TM would want to do such a thing, here is another thought...

I suppose with GPS, collecting at least some of the data you mentioned is not totally out of the question, but a "smart ball" would likely need to be part of the TM plan, along with the "smart driver". Data would likely need to be assimilated somehow on a smartphone, tablet, or computer to be of any use to you. Then again, TM may require you to upload "raw data" in exchange for a monthly "driver performance report" which they would send via email. (I suspect they value your email address and other such personal information far more than your driver stats). I would think that any kind of electronics for a driver would be in the form of a detachable device that you could just clip to the shaft when you needed to capture some data. Putting electronics into a club head does not sound like a very sound idea.

Hard to say whether the average Joe could actually benefit from such driving data, but this kind of program would benefit TM and their "selected partners", (those with whom they share personal information about you). It would provide them the opportunity to bombard you with spam advertising. That spam could come to you via email, text message or even the postal system depending on the address(es) you provided to TM so they could send your "monthly driver performance report". Like other companies, TM stands to make money by collecting and sharing email addresses and any other personal information they are able to collect about you. It is unfortunate, but the collection and sharing of personal data has actually become a profit center all to itself for so many businesses these days. These businesses are always looking for more ways to add to their personal data databases along with ways to keep it current. If you have ever sent in a TM registration card, then you have added personal information to this database. (You really only need the club's serial number and a sales receipt to have the TM warranty honored).

Please don't forget the Privacy Notices TM...

Lets not let the microchip speculation become too serious here...it is nothing more than some pretty far-fetched speculation at this point. What is "possible through technology" is quite different than what is "probable" for a 2016 TM driver release. We can kid around and have some fun with it, but we should do so with "tongue in cheek". We will learn the truth about the "M" Driver soon enough.

[Interpol]

You're also discounting the fact that putting sensitive electronics and sensors durable enough to withstand multiple strikes at 100+mph is no easy engineering feat. And any electronics would require a power source - assuming it's rechargeable, that would add a significant amount of weight to the clubhead. Where would you put that? There's a reason why drivers are hollow.

It's amusing to see so many people giving credence to such a stupid rumor, and pulling possible use scenarios out of thin air without any considerations of practicality or engineering reality.

TM is NOT going to introduce a driver with electronics in it. It's not going to happen. Period. You heard it here first. What they MIGHT do, however, is introduce a standalone device that can analyze swings like a SkyPro, a smartphone app that mates with it, and MAYBE something that works with the Microsoft Band. A rumor like that is much more likely to be reality than a silly electronic driver head.

[sethdavidsdad]

[quote name='Interpol' timestamp='1441416691' post='12265722']OK, let's pick this apart one by one.

[i]Yeah I can't image why any club maker would want to know:
What golf courses you played?[/i]

And that data is best gathered from GPS electronics in the driver head because...?


[i]Which holes you hit driver?[/i]

Why would a club maker want to know this?


[i]How far you hit it[/i]
[i]Where you hit it[/i]
[i]Which side of the fairway you missed most.[/i]

And this type of data gathering is facilitated by having a GPS unit in the driver head because...?


[i]How many of there drivers are in play[/i]

Sure. Because sales numbers wouldn't work as well, and is much less invasive than GPS tracking ALL of their drivers.


[i]How many times you play, a day , a week, a month?[/i]

Wow. And you're really more than willing to give all this information to a club manufacturer sight unseen? The NSA must love you.


[i]You are right that would be dumb for a club maker to want info like that. All for a whole $10. Extreme sarcasm alert!!!
They may not do it but this tech is coming. Like or not. It's to cheap not to do.[/i]

100% complete rubbish. You still haven't given a single reason why it would be better to have integrated circuitry and electronics in a driver clubhead, of all places, versus what's already out there, and your "$10" estimate is completely baseless.[/quote]
You asked why they would do it and I told you.
This is a driver thread I won't argue with you about it any longer. I'm sure the rest of the people are tired of hearing it.

[Interpol]

[quote name='sethdavidsdad' timestamp='1441418221' post='12265838']
You asked why they would do it I told you. Dude your car, phone, and credit card track you everywhere you go now. Like it or not they usually only ask for your consent if they give or sell that info to others.[/quote]

My car does not send GPS tracking data to anyone. Neither do any of my credit cards. And I'm not one of those sheep that rolls over and lets outside agencies track data about me whether I know about it or not.

[quote]This is a driver thread I won't argue with you about it any longer. I'm sure the rest of the people are tired of hearing it. You can buy a chip that fits on your keys called tile for $25 dollars no expensive electronics required. Heck the full cost of a iPhone is only $218 to make. We are talking about much less than that. I remember people like you saying I don't want to text and look at the web on my phone I just want to make calls from my home phone not carry it with me.
[/quote]

This IS a driver thread - and you are supposed to be giving practical reasons WHY having electronics in a driver head is a good, useful idea. You haven't provided any yet.

I don't want a computer that can hit golf balls. I also don't want my driver to be able to make coffee, wake me up in the morning, give me a massage, etc. It's just unnecessary expense and extraneous gimmickry that has the potential to break down.

The fact that you're using the Tile as some kind of proof of concept only shows that you're not qualified to be discussing this topic at all. First of all, the Tile is a passive Bluetooth transmitter - it doesn't gather any data. Second, it's not sitting inside a driver and getting smacked around repeatedly with forces that probably exceed 100Gs. Third, it's powered by a CR2 battery and the entire unit weighs 36 grams. Where exactly are you going to redistribute that weight in a driver head, and what do you suggest people do when the battery dies?

One more time: it's a stupid, impractical idea. Prove me wrong.

[sethdavidsdad]

You must drive a really old car. I'm sorry.

[Interpol]

[quote name='sethdavidsdad' timestamp='1441419678' post='12265952']
You must drive a really old car. I'm sorry.
[/quote]

What the hell does that have to do with anything we're talking about?

[Interpol]

[quote name='pegleg' timestamp='1441420093' post='12265994']
I would bet serious money that if TaylorMade put any kind of computer tech in their (non-fitting) golf clubs, they would do it once, and once only.

Manufacturers have enough problems getting their badges to stay in place, and remember where and by whom these clubs are being manufactured.

The returns and repairs would be through the roof, retailers would go as far as to boycott, it would be a pretty epic disaster.
[/quote]

Absolutely right. A blunder like this would be the death knell for any company. I'm pretty sure TM management isn't that stupid, however.

[bobcat]

While its all purely speculation, the only thing that would make any sense would be some sort of detachable device that you could clip to the shaft when you wanted to capture some sort of driver data. I can't imagine TM wanting to place any kind of electronics either on or inside the club head. That would be asking for a whole lot of product failures and TM could never afford or tolerate the warranty issues associated with that.

[Noke]

[quote name='Interpol' timestamp='1441419750' post='12265962']
[quote name='sethdavidsdad' timestamp='1441419678' post='12265952']
You must drive a really old car. I'm sorry.
[/quote]

What the hell does that have to do with anything we're talking about?
[/quote]

Hey man, could you just chill out a little bit? This is a golf forum. It's supposed to be a fun place, ya dig? People here can have opinions without necessarily needing to be 100% correct. I understand that you may feel that people have been harsh with what you've written but try to take the high road and laugh it off. The squabbling is a bit much and dilutes this thread.

Oh, and Rafal was kidding.

[Interpol]

[quote name='nohny noke' timestamp='1441421941' post='12266112']
Hey man, could you just chill out a little bit? This is a golf forum. It's supposed to be a fun place, ya dig? People here can have opinions without necessarily needing to be 100% correct. I understand that you may feel that people have been harsh with what you've written but try to take the high road and laugh it off. The squabbling is a bit much and dilutes this thread.

Oh, and Rafal was kidding.
[/quote]

I'm perfectly chill, thanks. It just saddens me to see how little common sense some people have. It's easy to say "X is possible" but what's possible isn't always practical. But I guess that's why they're not the ones running golf companies, right?

[IHFN]

As for why a chip in the club would be practical the very simple answer is that it could potentially give you the data that all of these other applications or equipment give you...for the cost of a driver. Instead of having to pay another 100 or 200 or 10,000 dollars for launch information, you get it all in your driver.

I see that as a pretty good thing. And I'm not sure how that's a bad thing.

And I don't see how anyone can negatively bash the potential of something like that before even seeing it. The way technology is going these days, PCB boards are becoming much better at handling the stress of vibrations and impacts. I highly doubt that they'd release something like a chip in a club that would cause the chip to break on every swing over 100mph. They have simulation software to test every board that is made to know how far it can be pushed before it breaks. I work in the PCB industry so I can personally speak for this.

Sure there will always be exceptions in the initial release of something like this and sure some may break. There is always a flaw when creating something new and trying to revolutionize something. But I'm glad someone is trying to push the boundaries and bring us a launch monitor in a club.

I know right now I'm struggling because I don't have a good fitter around here and I have to buy shaft after shaft until I find the right fit. If I had a club that gave me all the information, that would be worth a TON of money for me.

So I'm all for bringing as much technology to a driver like this.

[Interpol]

[quote name='IHFN' timestamp='1441425337' post='12266360']
As for why a chip in the club would be practical the very simple answer is that it could potentially give you the data that all of these other applications or equipment give you...for the cost of a driver. Instead of having to pay another 100 or 200 or 10,000 dollars for launch information, you get it all in your driver.[/quote]

Sure. Until you try gathering swing data from last year's Titleist driver. Or TM fairway wood. Or your Ping hybrid. Or your Mizuno irons. Or your Callaway wedges. Or your Scotty putter. Oh wait, you can't. Sounds like paying $120 for something like a SkyPro that works with ALL of these clubs is a better proposition now, doesn't it.

Now, if TM wants to bundle in a SkyPro or a 3Bays package with the sale of every driver, go for it. It wouldn't be the smartest business decision to do so, though.

[quote]I know right now I'm struggling because I don't have a good fitter around here and I have to buy shaft after shaft until I find the right fit. If I had a club that gave me all the information, that would be worth a TON of money for me.

So I'm all for bringing as much technology to a driver like this.
[/quote]

Until one can demonstrate how an electronic driver head can give a golfer a better (and cheaper) fitting than what is currently used (impact tape, strike pads/lie boards, launch monitors), it's nothing more than a solution to a nonexistent problem.

[DatSliceDoe]

Hmmm, interesting news about the Peter FInch, Rick Shiels trip to NYC for the TMAG event... about 11m30s into the video

[media=]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4rIaDhdD0E[/media]

[IHFN]

[quote name='Interpol' timestamp='1441426221' post='12266420']
[quote name='IHFN' timestamp='1441425337' post='12266360']
As for why a chip in the club would be practical the very simple answer is that it could potentially give you the data that all of these other applications or equipment give you...for the cost of a driver. Instead of having to pay another 100 or 200 or 10,000 dollars for launch information, you get it all in your driver.[/quote]

Sure. Until you try gathering swing data from last year's Titleist driver. Or TM fairway wood. Or your Ping hybrid. Or your Mizuno irons. Or your Callaway wedges. Or your Scotty putter. Oh wait, you can't. Sounds like paying $120 for something like a SkyPro that works with ALL of these clubs is a better proposition now, doesn't it.

Now, if TM wants to bundle in a SkyPro or a 3Bays package with the sale of every driver, go for it. It wouldn't be the smartest business decision to do so, though.

[quote]I know right now I'm struggling because I don't have a good fitter around here and I have to buy shaft after shaft until I find the right fit. If I had a club that gave me all the information, that would be worth a TON of money for me.

So I'm all for bringing as much technology to a driver like this.
[/quote]

Until one can demonstrate how an electronic driver head can give a golfer a better (and cheaper) fitting than what is currently used (impact tape, strike pads/lie boards, launch monitors), it's nothing more than a solution to a nonexistent problem.
[/quote]

Your first comment confuses me as I don't care about any of those things nor should anyone when trying to get fit for this specific driver. All I'm trying to do, or anyone is trying to do, with the chip in it is find the right shaft and configuration for that specific driver. Sure I may want to know last years drivers launch numbers, but guess what? That company isn't as ahead in the times and they didn't provide me with a chip to track it.

Otherwise, why would I want to go back to last years driver or change to a 3 wood or an iron? How is it Taylormade's fault that they put a chip in a driver, but now you can't use that chip to setup your old driver or 3 wood? They are simply giving me more information than what I currently have. I don't understand how that is now a bad thing or a burden on you.

It can be an advantage in fitting for the following reasons:

1. I can go into a place like Dicks that has awful launch monitors that read the same thing no matter what and try different shafts and/or configuration and see what the actual numbers are.

2. I can hit balls into a net in my bathroom with different shafts and configurations and see what the actual numbers are and what shaft and/or configuration works best.

3. I don't have to pay money every time I want to try a different configuration on the driver or just happen to want to see what it does to my launch conditions after making any type of swing change, tee height change, stance change, grip change, etc (I could technically make that 4-100, but I'll save the space).

I seen this as an open exploration into the game of golf.

[Interpol]

[quote name='IHFN' timestamp='1441427734' post='12266500']
Your first comment confuses me as I don't care about any of those things nor should anyone when trying to get fit for this specific driver. All I'm trying to do, or anyone is trying to do, with the chip in it is find the right shaft and configuration for that specific driver. Sure I may want to know last years drivers launch numbers, but guess what? That company isn't as ahead in the times and they didn't provide me with a chip to track it.[/quote]

Sorry for misunderstanding you. It looks like you were talking about using clubs embedded with chips for fitting purposes, correct?

There are other problems with this concept:[list=1]
[*]The presence of electronics and additional weight in a driver head meant to fit a golfer means that unless the driver you're buying has the exact same weight and swing dynamics of the fitting club, any numbers you get out of it wouldn't be very useful.
[*]There is no way to monitor ball launch using sensors in a club alone. There is a reason why Foresight GC2 and TrackMan monitors have to use cameras and radar to extrapolate ball trajectory, speed, and spin data.
[/list]

[quote]Otherwise, why would I want to go back to last years driver or change to a 3 wood or an iron? How is it Taylormade's fault that they put a chip in a driver, but now you can't use that chip to setup your old driver or 3 wood? They are simply giving me more information than what I currently have. I don't understand how that is now a bad thing or a burden on you.[/quote]

As a concept, putting a chip in a driver meant only to be used for fitting purposes is much more practical than putting a chip in a driver meant to be used in regular play.

[quote]It can be an advantage in fitting for the following reasons:

1. I can go into a place like Dicks that has awful launch monitors that read the same thing no matter what and try different shafts and/or configuration and see what the actual numbers are.

2. I can hit balls into a net in my bathroom with different shafts and configurations and see what the actual numbers are and what shaft and/or configuration works best.

3. I don't have to pay money every time I want to try a different configuration on the driver or just happen to want to see what it does to my launch conditions after making any type of swing change, tee height change, stance change, grip change, etc (I could technically make that 4-100, but I'll save the space).

I seen this as an open exploration into the game of golf.
[/quote]

I won't deny any of these points you made, but as I mentioned above you can't generate launch and ballflight data with accelerometers and force sensors alone. You still need some way to track the projectile, and there is no way having the electronics in the clubhead helps you do that.

[IHFN]

[quote name='Interpol' timestamp='1441428891' post='12266558']
[quote name='IHFN' timestamp='1441427734' post='12266500']
Your first comment confuses me as I don't care about any of those things nor should anyone when trying to get fit for this specific driver. All I'm trying to do, or anyone is trying to do, with the chip in it is find the right shaft and configuration for that specific driver. Sure I may want to know last years drivers launch numbers, but guess what? That company isn't as ahead in the times and they didn't provide me with a chip to track it.[/quote]

Sorry for misunderstanding you. It looks like you were talking about using clubs embedded with chips for fitting purposes, correct?

There are other problems with this concept:[list=1]
[*]The presence of electronics and additional weight in a driver head meant to fit a golfer means that unless the driver you're buying has the exact same weight and swing dynamics of the fitting club, any numbers you get out of it wouldn't be very useful.
[*]There is no way to monitor ball launch using sensors in a club alone. There is a reason why Foresight GC2 and TrackMan monitors have to use cameras and radar to extrapolate ball trajectory, speed, and spin data.
[/list]

[quote]Otherwise, why would I want to go back to last years driver or change to a 3 wood or an iron? How is it Taylormade's fault that they put a chip in a driver, but now you can't use that chip to setup your old driver or 3 wood? They are simply giving me more information than what I currently have. I don't understand how that is now a bad thing or a burden on you.[/quote]

As a concept, putting a chip in a driver meant only to be used for fitting purposes is much more practical than putting a chip in a driver meant to be used in regular play.

[quote]It can be an advantage in fitting for the following reasons:

1. I can go into a place like Dicks that has awful launch monitors that read the same thing no matter what and try different shafts and/or configuration and see what the actual numbers are.

2. I can hit balls into a net in my bathroom with different shafts and configurations and see what the actual numbers are and what shaft and/or configuration works best.

3. I don't have to pay money every time I want to try a different configuration on the driver or just happen to want to see what it does to my launch conditions after making any type of swing change, tee height change, stance change, grip change, etc (I could technically make that 4-100, but I'll save the space).

I seen this as an open exploration into the game of golf.
[/quote]

I won't deny any of these points you made, but as I mentioned above you can't generate launch and ballflight data with accelerometers and force sensors alone. You still need some way to track the projectile, and there is no way having the electronics in the clubhead helps you do that.
[/quote]


Ok, we are on track now together and I see what you are saying as well. Yeah, I was talking about using the chips for fitting purposes. But I assume that the retail drivers would have the chips in them as well to track your driver data through a round. The weight of a chip like that would be no more than what you are adding to a club via Game Golf or Arccos. It took me several rounds and a few range sessions to get used to Arccos. The next gen of those should be lighter as they for sure change the swingweight and feel of the clubs.

You have a valid point and question about how much data it can gather. But that's the unknown right now. At this point in time, those are the only ways to track a ball and know those type of statistics. But we don't know for sure what they are coming out with. If the chip only gave you swing speed? Ehhh.

But even if it gave you the layout of your swing in a graphical app of some kind, I would like that benefit. This is all based, of course, on the fact that the driver actually performs.

[Interpol]

Ok, we are on track now together and I see what you are saying as well. Yeah, I was talking about using the chips for fitting purposes. But I assume that the retail drivers would have the chips in them as well to track your driver data through a round.

 

Having chips in all of their retail drivers would make little economic sense as you'd be increasing the overall cost of manufacturing of a product for a feature that nobody knows how many people would actually use on a regular basis.

 

The weight of a chip like that would be no more than what you are adding to a club via Game Golf or Arccos. It took me several rounds and a few range sessions to get used to Arccos. The next gen of those should be lighter as they for sure change the swingweight and feel of the clubs.

 

The weight of Game Golf/Arccos/SkyPro/3Bays sensors have little to no impact on the golf swing because their location on the club is closer to the swing axis. The centrifugal force from additional weight placed in the clubhead is exponentially higher. Even 5g in the clubhead will feel significantly more noticeable in the clubhead than in the butt of the shaft. The use of lead tape on a clubhead bears this out.

 

You have a valid point and question about how much data it can gather. But that's the unknown right now. At this point in time, those are the only ways to track a ball and know those type of statistics. But we don't know for sure what they are coming out with. If the chip only gave you swing speed? Ehhh.

 

You can be as creative as you want to be, but you can't break the laws of physics. So while we don't know for sure what they are coming out with, we can be fairly sure what they CAN'T come up with.

 

But even if it gave you the layout of your swing in a graphical app of some kind, I would like that benefit. This is all based, of course, on the fact that the driver actually performs.

 

You can already do that. Have you seen the SkyPro? I have one and it's a neat device. Plus, it was only about $100, I can use it on any club, and I can remove it when I don't need it. MUCH more versatile than sensor electronics mounted permanently in a driver.

 

[IHFN]

Ok, we are on track now together and I see what you are saying as well. Yeah, I was talking about using the chips for fitting purposes. But I assume that the retail drivers would have the chips in them as well to track your driver data through a round.

 

Having chips in all of their retail drivers would make little economic sense as you'd be increasing the overall cost of manufacturing of a product for a feature that nobody knows how many people would actually use on a regular basis.

 

The weight of a chip like that would be no more than what you are adding to a club via Game Golf or Arccos. It took me several rounds and a few range sessions to get used to Arccos. The next gen of those should be lighter as they for sure change the swingweight and feel of the clubs.

 

The weight of Game Golf/Arccos/SkyPro/3Bays sensors have little to no impact on the golf swing because their location on the club is closer to the swing axis. The centrifugal force from additional weight placed in the clubhead is exponentially higher. Even 5g in the clubhead will feel significantly more noticeable in the clubhead than in the butt of the shaft. The use of lead tape on a clubhead bears this out.

 

You have a valid point and question about how much data it can gather. But that's the unknown right now. At this point in time, those are the only ways to track a ball and know those type of statistics. But we don't know for sure what they are coming out with. If the chip only gave you swing speed? Ehhh.

 

You can be as creative as you want to be, but you can't break the laws of physics. So while we don't know for sure what they are coming out with, we can be fairly sure what they CAN'T come up with.

 

But even if it gave you the layout of your swing in a graphical app of some kind, I would like that benefit. This is all based, of course, on the fact that the driver actually performs.

 

You can already do that. Have you seen the SkyPro? I have one and it's a neat device. Plus, it was only about $100, I can use it on any club, and I can remove it when I don't need it.

 

 

 

First, you are again naming a product that costs extra money to use. They would be offering something that comes with the club. And has there been anything stated that the cost of the drivers would be more now? I seriously haven't seen it so it's an honest question. But I'm confused at how you seem to be ok with spending hundreds of dollars on aftermarket stuff but would be upset at paying a little more (or nothing more or who knows more as it's all just speculation) for that technology built into a club so you wouldn't have to buy that stuff? Within 3 years probably every driver would have it and within 10 years every iron will have some type of tracking technology built in.

 

As for the weighting, I see what you are saying. However the Arccos weighs 15 grams because they have to put it in a casing to protect it from the elements. I'm sure the actual pcb board in it weighs 1 to 2 grams.

 

And again, if the club performs, who cares how much it weighs or adds to it? I highly doubt they will be selling a 215 gram driver head and saying, "This thing is great! It's super heavy because of this chip..."

 

They'll find a way to make it work with the same setup as every other driver they've had.

 

Then again, are we even sure they will have a chip?

[Interpol]

[quote name='IHFN' timestamp='1441431983' post='12266688']
First, you are again naming a product that costs extra money to use. They would be offering something that comes with the club. And has there been anything stated that the cost of the drivers would be more now?[/quote]

Come on. You seriously believe that a club featuring all this wonderful new complex tech WON'T cost more than their competing lower-tech counterparts?

It's bad business to offer a product with extraneous features that not all of its buyers will use, or want to use. Cable TV pricing is a good example of that.

[quote]I seriously haven't seen it so it's an honest question. But I'm confused at how you seem to be ok with spending hundreds of dollars on aftermarket stuff but would be upset at paying a little more (or nothing more or who knows more as it's all just speculation) for that technology built into a club so you wouldn't have to buy that stuff? Within 3 years probably every driver would have it and within 10 years every iron will have some type of tracking technology built in.[/quote]

First of all, if you're talking about the SkyPro, it's not "hundreds of dollars", it's only $100. Second, that $100 buys me not just the ability to track and analyze my swing when I hit driver, but also with EVERY other club in my bag. And third, I don't wan't a device like this built into any of my clubs. What if the electronics fail or I need to change the battery? Do I need to send it back to the manufacturer and be without my driver for a few weeks? Now multiply that scenario by 14 (or whatever number of clubs you have in your bag) and you'll soon see that the logistics and additional costs of warranty repairs would be an epic nightmare for the manufacturer.

The whole concept has so many downsides it should be written off as a fail on multiple levels. You're introducing electronics into a product that doesn't NEED electronics to perform its primary duty (launching golf balls), nor does it make the product work better. In addition to it being superfluous, it becomes another potential point of failure. Nobody wants that.

[quote]And again, if the club performs, who cares how much it weighs or adds to it? I highly doubt they will be selling a 215 gram driver head and saying, "This thing is great! It's super heavy because of this chip..."

They'll find a way to make it work with the same setup as every other driver they've had.

Then again, are we even sure they will have a chip?
[/quote]

No, this was just another rumor about the M1. I have no idea where it came from, but whoever made it up is probably having a good laugh right now.

You've brought up some good points, but it's still not a practical idea.

[IHFN]

[quote name='Interpol' timestamp='1441432947' post='12266712']

You've brought up some good points, but it's still not a practical idea.
[/quote]

I just don't see how you can be so against something that you know so little about and hasn't even been released. But we aren't going to convince each other either way. I could continue to go back and forth but there's no point to it. To me it's as practical as it can get and I have no doubt that within the next 5 years every club will have tracking built into it.

It has to start somewhere and with one club. You don't HAVE to buy this driver. It's just an option.

At least there aren't claims of another 20 yards of distance...

Yet...

[Interpol]

[quote name='IHFN' timestamp='1441434472' post='12266744']
I just don't see how you can be so against something that you know so little about and hasn't even been released. But we aren't going to convince each other either way. I could continue to go back and forth but there's no point to it. To me it's as practical as it can get and I have no doubt that within the next 5 years every club will have tracking built into it. [/quote]

Pipe dream. I'm not against anything. All I did was present points about why this kind of technology isn't feasible or realistic in any aspect - business, economics, engineering, or otherwise. How about you at least make an attempt to show why any of the points I made above are wrong, instead of just saying "well, I still think it's practical" without any justification?

Again: [color=#282828]You're introducing electronics into a product that doesn't NEED electronics to perform its primary duty (launching golf balls), nor does it make the product work better. In addition to it being superfluous, it becomes another potential point of failure. Combine that with the fact that not everyone wants or needs such a feature, and that makes it impractical.[/color]

[color=#282828]And I'd be really interested to know how you'd integrate sensor technology like this into an iron or a wedge. Just saying "I think it can be done" doesn't cut it.[/color]

[color=#282828]One more thing that puts the nail in the coffin of this silly idea: [/color]Rule 4a, Appendix II of the Rules of Golf states that all parts of a clubhead "must be rigid, structural in nature and functional", and the USGA's interpretation is that "t[color=#000000]his provision basically means that the design of the clubhead must be free from gimmicks". In other words, [b]electronic components in a clubhead make it a non conforming club.[/b] Sorry to burst your bubble but no, you won't be seeing this tech in "every club" in 5 years. Now can we put this ridiculous rumor to rest already?[/color]

[quote]It has to start somewhere and with one club. You don't HAVE to buy this driver. It's just an option.

At least there aren't claims of another 20 yards of distance...

Yet...
[/quote]

I'll evaluate the M1 when it comes out and demo it. If I like it, I'll buy it. But the M1 won't have electronics in it. You can be sure of that.

[KrazyTrain18]

I have a feeling the M1 will be another really expensive driver that flops when it comes out, TM needs to start to focus on performance rather than gimmicky innovation.

[Flagrant]

[attachment=2940406:ImageUploadedByGolfWRX Mobile1441458169.832522.jpg]

I'll just leave this here.

[justasgood]

Enough of the speculation... The "M" in relation to marketing is simply MMM.....MMM.....good.

Tinfoil hat off...

[creecool]

It looks like a Versa version of the R15