Mini Tours: I don't get it

[EKELLY]

Having tried and not made it....my opinion

 

You can be a very good player if you drive it well and have a solid short game. All scratch/+ handicap players have this.

 

But what makes a player a PGA Tour player vs a mini tour player are 2 things that have been mentioned. The mindset and then the iron play from 160-225 yards.

 

1. Mindset. The PGA Tour guys did something along the way that gave them the confidence they belonged. Only a few knew they belonged the whole time. But one win or one good week at the right time and presto, the confidence builds on itself. And that confidence makes it easier to focus with all the variables at the PGA Tour level (crowds, cameras, travel, different grasses, big money, trouble filled finishing holes, etc). Mini Tours at the lower level have nobody watching, a couple of cameras, stay in the same area, and the money isn't earth shattering. There is a whole different level of confidence and focus that is required. Obviously some players with contacts get more chances to get this confidence at the top level, but that's the way life is.

 

2. Mid/long iron play. On 7000+ yard courses this is so important. Richie mentioned it early in this topic. Any scratch player can make birdies with a 9 iron. But can they make birdies with a 5 iron? Or do they miss the green and have the pressure of constantly relying on their short game. It's not necessarily about hitting it close from 185. It's about being consistent so you are putting for birdie from say 30 feet, rather than say 60 feet or chipping from just off the green or worrying about avoiding the water so you bail out. On a longer course, you can't score unless you have a really consistent game with 3 through 7 iron.

My father told me when I was younger "you don't get better hitting wedge into every hole", and he was right......I only got pretty good when I wore out the 3-5 irons on the range, then my short irons were even better......Good statement, very accurate.....

[Pargolfr00]

Thought it was an interesting addition to this thread. Rickie just closed out this week 56/56 from inside 7ft. He was T175 in putting going into the week. Not too many of us could do 56/56 from 7ft at our home course, not to mention in a PGA tour event.... but based on some of the comments I do understand some of you would think that there isn't much difference between the two......

[b.helts]

Thought it was an interesting addition to this thread. Rickie just closed out this week 56/56 from inside 7ft. He was T175 in putting going into the week. Not too many of us could do 56/56 from 7ft at our home course, not to mention in a PGA tour event.... but based on some of the comments I do understand some of you would think that there isn't much difference between the two......

 

Back when Zach Johnson's career and my career hit the ole fork in the the road, he was playing a couple of hooters tour events as a warm up I guess, before heading to his first year of buy.com. He had played in a couple of PGA tour events the previous fall and I asked him what the main differences were. He said first and foremost, when you get there you immediately become a better putter. The reason is because the greens are so good and the pin positions so fair that if you hit a putt online, it goes in. Great for confidence and stats like 56/56 from 7ft and in.

 

So yeah, I'd say there is a big difference between the PGA tour and my local, public club.

[mjen43]

Thought it was an interesting addition to this thread. Rickie just closed out this week 56/56 from inside 7ft. He was T175 in putting going into the week. Not too many of us could do 56/56 from 7ft at our home course, not to mention in a PGA tour event.... but based on some of the comments I do understand some of you would think that there isn't much difference between the two......

 

Obviously he had to have putted great this week but these kind of stats can sometimes be misleading. Maybe he was 50/50 from inside 3 feet and 6/6 from 3-7. Maybe he only went 6/6 from inside 3 and 50/50 from 3-7. One of these is good putting (expected from someone who won a PGA Tour event that week), the other is superhuman. What the actual breakdown was, who knows?

 

If I go hacking it around my local muni missing every green in reg, chipping it to 15 feet and two putting every time. My stats from inside 7 feet would look great as well.

 

There's better stats that explain how well someone putts.

[Pargolfr00]

Thought it was an interesting addition to this thread. Rickie just closed out this week 56/56 from inside 7ft. He was T175 in putting going into the week. Not too many of us could do 56/56 from 7ft at our home course, not to mention in a PGA tour event.... but based on some of the comments I do understand some of you would think that there isn't much difference between the two......

 

Obviously he had to have putted great this week but these kind of stats can sometimes be misleading. Maybe he was 50/50 from inside 3 feet and 6/6 from 3-7. Maybe he only went 6/6 from inside 3 and 50/50 from 3-7. One of these is good putting (expected from someone who won a PGA Tour event that week), the other is superhuman. What the actual breakdown was, who knows?

 

If I go hacking it around my local muni missing every green in reg, chipping it to 15 feet and two putting every time. My stats from inside 7 feet would look great as well.

 

There's better stats that explain how well someone putts.

Yea... you guys are probably right... I guess it does get easier the higher you climb... thanks for the perspective.

[sneaky_pete]

I remember playing in a Pro-Am in Mundubbera, Queensland 20 odd years ago. The one thing that struck me then, as it does now looking back on it, was that pretty much every young pro playing in the two day event hit the clubhouse bar after the first round to 'get on it'. Most of them were there for a good time it seemed. There was only one player who went straight to the range to practice, and his name was Rod Pampling. I had the pleasure of playing with him on the first day and I will never forget it. Great player and he was focused on what he was there to do - play golf.

 

I am glad that he made it!

[nikegal]

Thought it was an interesting addition to this thread. Rickie just closed out this week 56/56 from inside 7ft. He was T175 in putting going into the week. Not too many of us could do 56/56 from 7ft at our home course, not to mention in a PGA tour event.... but based on some of the comments I do understand some of you would think that there isn't much difference between the two......

 

Obviously he had to have putted great this week but these kind of stats can sometimes be misleading. Maybe he was 50/50 from inside 3 feet and 6/6 from 3-7. Maybe he only went 6/6 from inside 3 and 50/50 from 3-7. One of these is good putting (expected from someone who won a PGA Tour event that week), the other is superhuman. What the actual breakdown was, who knows?

 

If I go hacking it around my local muni missing every green in reg, chipping it to 15 feet and two putting every time. My stats from inside 7 feet would look great as well.

 

There's better stats that explain how well someone putts.

Yea... you guys are probably right... I guess it does get easier the higher you climb... thanks for the perspective.

Hi Par :) Though there are other stats that do measure one's putting competency, and contrary to what most WRXers state regarding 56/57 from 7' and in being no big deal, and while examples can be made to show that it is indeed nothing special, trust me here, every Player that I know who has Played under the gun would say two things, #1, they'd take that stat every single tournament and 2, there were some very fine putts made in those 56 and many Players would not match that. Your perspective is fine :) Madison

[b.helts]

Hey Maddie. I don't recall anyone in this thread, or anywhere else, stating that 56/57 (sic) from 7' and in was "no big deal"

 

Maybe you can point me in that direction so I can tell him or her off.

 

 

[Shilgy]

The reason is because the greens are so good and the pin positions so fair that if you hit a putt online, it goes in. Great for confidence and stats like 56/56 from 7ft and in

[b.helts]

Hi shilgy. Glad you popped in. I saw a subtle swipe in another thread and wondered if it were my post you were talking about.

 

First, I was relaying was Z told me. Second, even if you had a putting machine, making 56/56 from 7 feet might be impossible on many muni greens.

 

Therefore, my contention is, while 56/56 is an incredible accomplishment, it's easier to do on PGA tour quality greens than most mini greens.

 

Those of you that think I'm saying 56/56 is easy are wrong. I didn't say that, that's your poor assumption. Nothing more.

[Shilgy]

Hi shilgy. Glad you popped in. I saw a subtle swipe in another thread and wondered if it were my post you were talking about.

 

First, I was relaying was Z told me. Second, even if you had a putting machine, making 56/56 from 7 feet might be impossible on many muni greens.

 

Therefore, my contention is, while 56/56 is an incredible accomplishment, it's easier to do on PGA tour quality greens than most mini greens.

 

Those of you that think I'm saying 56/56 is easy are wrong. I didn't say that, that's your poor assumption. Nothing more.

Reminds me of a comment a old playing companion told me. He said he could understand why I fixed pitch marks on my putting line as the ball may deflect off line. His theory when putting was not to fix them as he knew he would not start the ball on line and it might deflect into the hole.

And yes-for a good putter the tour greens are a bit easier probably on certain putts. Flip side is that on slower greens you don't need to play that 4 foot slider outside the hole and get speed and line perfect.

[mjen43]

Looking at one of the articles on PGA Tour.com. It says Zach Johnson and Chad Collins were also 100% from inside 7 feet this week (along with Fowler). Zach Johnson finished in 27th, 10 shots back at -2 and Chad Collins came in 4th at -7, 5 shots back.

 

It also says Rickie Fowler made 5-7 putts from 10-15 which was T1 for the week and tied his career best of making 5 putts from outside 20 feet for the week.

 

These numbers lead me to believe that Fowler's putting this week was indeed insane. I would also probably think that this had to have been the best putting week of his life. This definitely shows what a top ranked player in the world is capable of when they are at their very best, however, it is also an extreme outlier. I would think the average tour player would be lucky to have a week on the greens like this maybe once in their career (top players maybe once a year).

 

Compared to any mini-tour player, Fowler obviously would have smoked them this week on the greens and scorecard, but it's really not that fair to attribute a week like this as the difference between a mini tour player and a Tour player. The difference between a good mini tour putter, and the average tour player for any given week on the greens would probably be indistinguishable.

 

The difference between Fowler this week and the average tour pro this week on the greens is much, much, much, greater than the difference between the average tour pro and good mini tour putter. Not being able to putt like Fowler this week would certainly not hold anyone back from making it on tour.

[PJ72]

Looking at one of the articles on PGA Tour.com. It says Zach Johnson and Chad Collins were also 100% from inside 7 feet this week (along with Fowler). Zach Johnson finished in 27th, 10 shots back at -2 and Chad Collins came in 4th at -7, 5 shots back.

 

It also says Rickie Fowler made 5-7 putts from 10-15 which was T1 for the week and tied his career best of making 5 putts from outside 20 feet for the week.

 

These numbers lead me to believe that Fowler's putting this week was indeed insane. I would also probably think that this had to have been the best putting week of his life. This definitely shows what a top ranked player in the world is capable of when they are at their very best, however, it is also an extreme outlier. I would think the average tour player would be lucky to have a week on the greens like this maybe once in their career (top players maybe once a year).

 

Compared to any mini-tour player, Fowler obviously would have smoked them this week on the greens and scorecard, but it's really not that fair to attribute a week like this as the difference between a mini tour player and a Tour player. The difference between a good mini tour putter, and the average tour player for any given week on the greens would probably be indistinguishable.

 

The difference between Fowler this week and the average tour pro this week on the greens is much, much, much, greater than the difference between the average tour pro and good mini tour putter. Not being able to putt like Fowler this week would certainly not hold anyone back from making it on tour.

 

Nice post and I agree with 99% of it.

 

The last paragraph about the good mini tour player and average tour pro's putting I would agree with too UNTIL you put the mini tour guy on the PGA tour with all the crowds, TV cameras and other distractions. I would imagine that his game would suffer in every aspect due to this. Many DO cope though...sometimes.

[justwellsy]

I really think that if you are an "OK" ball striker, but have an amazing wedge game, short game, and putting, you're better prepared for some kind of tour. As some have stated here. I've played with those guys who hit seemingly every green but can't putt and they just can't go low enough on a regular basis.

 

There's a difference between the pure ball striker +2 and the "wizard" +2