Jimmy Ballard

[bluedot]

1 hour ago, SandPiper said:

We all have our reasons to stick it out with a method of swinging a golf club. I find it fascinating that for 30 years you received “Ballard” teachers tutelage and played some “good” golf.

 

Please tell me before you scraped the method bc of old age you sought out Jimmy thru video to get your last lesson.  After 30 years of Ballard I cant imagine not seeking out one last lesson from the man himself bf you decide to exit to whatever new swing you have now. 
 

In conclusion, Rocco has come bak to Ballard  fundamentals and seems more excited than ever this past month. I think he approaching 61 hits it 280 yards.  Look at his record under Rick Smith and you’ll see dismal results. 

I respect that you are dedicated to Ballard’s teaching; we share that admiration for his work. You’ll have to take my word for that; I’ve said it several times now, and I stand by it.

 

But I don’t think you know more about my age, my body, and especially my golf game than I do, and it’s pretty tiresome for you to write to me and others as if you do.  I respect your opinions; you could offer the same courtesy to others, I think.

 

I’m done here.

[SandPiper]

9 hours ago, bluedot said:

I respect that you are dedicated to Ballard’s teaching; we share that admiration for his work. You’ll have to take my word for that; I’ve said it several times now, and I stand by it.

 

But I don’t think you know more about my age, my body, and especially my golf game than I do, and it’s pretty tiresome for you to write to me and others as if you do.  I respect your opinions; you could offer the same courtesy to others, I think.

 

I’m done here.

I take it you never called  Jimmy in those 30 years 🤷‍♂️ 

 

Bye ✌️ 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 29, 2023 by SandPiper

[SandPiper]

On 7/24/2023 at 7:28 AM, torbill said:

 

Exactly.

 

https://www.golflink.com/tipsvideos/video.aspx?v=25734

 

So, how do you teach getting the correct feel of this - in other words, not swaying and not reverse-pivoting.  It’s not an easy thing for me to get right.

To many people keep both shoulders level causing sway and reverse pivot. 

Edited July 29, 2023 by SandPiper

[Ayersjj]

On 4/27/2023 at 1:38 PM, bluedot said:

I'm 70 now, and was a Ballard disciple/player for 30+ years; I've got a lot of posts on this thread, in fact.  I have his book, which is well-worn to say the least, and worked with a couple of Ballard instructors over the years.  As a former college tennis player, it was a great way for me to play golf, though I always felt like I had to practice A LOT to keep the timing necessary to play with the sort of weight shift I was using. 

 

It was a great way for me to play golf.  Until it wasn't.  About 4 years ago, things started to really go sideways, including my golf ball.  I worked HARD to try to fix it, including working with my long-time instructor, who had ALWAYS been able to fix me.  Nothing worked.  Finally, in late 2019, I abandoned ship and went to work with a top-shelf instructor on a more "conventional" golf swing, with really good results.  I'm more consistent than I ever was, and I've picked up distance as well, at an age when that doesn't really happen.

 

With all of that said, here's what I believe.  These are MY beliefs, based on MY experience, so there's no need to try to talk me out of them.

 

1. Forget the pros.  Like athletes in every sport that play on TV for a living, they just aren't like you and me.  And you can forget blaming their "method" for their health or injuries; they make so many swings so fast that what's happening to their bodies just isn't translatable to you or me.  Nobody ever looked smoother hitting a golf ball than Freddie Couples, and his back is a wreck. 

 

2. As for you and me, we don't get back injuries from good swings, regardless of which method we use.  Bad swings cause injuries to the lower back because players are having to use their lumbar spine in a way that it isn't designed for, and often it's because their hips lack the functional mobility to get out of the way so that the thoracic spine can do what it IS designed to do, which is rotate.  The alternative is to use the lower back to throw the upper body up and around and out of the way so the arms can swing thru, and that's a recipe for either slower swing speeds, or injury, or both.

 

3. IMO, the Ballard method is great IF you've got enough hand speed to time your swing to match the weight shift.  In my case, when I lost enough hand speed, I started hitting high blocks or low hooks, depending on what went wrong.  I'd have rounds where everything still worked, but those days became less and less frequent.  By mid-2019, they had almost disappeared.  (My loss of speed isn't a guess; my FASTEST driver swing speed at an early 2018 fitting was equal to my SLOWEST swing speed from four years earlier.  Granted, we're only talking about 4 mph, but in golf, that's enough.)  And just like a draw and a hook are first cousins, so are a weight shift and a sway, and if you sway AT ALL, you better have GREAT hands cause you're gonna need 'em.  Ballard of course doesn't teach a sway, but that danger is ALWAYS there, especially with shorter clubs.

 

4. The other big advantage of the Ballard method is that it isn't overly technical, and that's a good thing.  The mental pictures of "coiling into the right instep and knee", and "staying connected" on the thru swing, are easily understood, and similar to movements most know from other sports.  This isn't surprising because Ballard was teaching what Sam Byrd taught him, and Sam Byrd was an MLB player before he was a golf pro.  MLB hitters are coiled into their back foot while they wait for the pitch, and staying connected is like the throw a middle infielder makes after fielding a ground ball.  If you believe that golf is often over-taught, then Ballard can be a good place to go.

 

5.  At the end of a long period of using Ballard principles and working with Ballard instructors, I do believe that the downfall of the method is it's dependence on timing.  When I had fast hands, I played a running hook ALL THE TIME with my Ballard swing, but my hands aren't fast anymore.  Nowadays, I work on my body as much as I do my golf swing, if not more, so that my hips and shoulders work the way they are supposed to.  The hand speed ain't coming back, so there isn't much reason to worry about that anymore.

 

6. Lastly, I wouldn't try to talk anybody out of using the Ballard method OR the "modern" swing; the similarities are much greater than the differences anyway. 

 

 

Ballard in a nutshell

 

 

Edited November 12, 2023 by Ayersjj

[Ayersjj]

Rocco about to retire frustrated w his game. 

 

https://www.instagram.com/reel/CzU16bMxPvH/?igshid=MTlnamY5eW1wMm9nZA==

 

Edited November 11, 2023 by Ayersjj

[Lefty Adams]

Are Ballard folks still checking this thread? I continue to adhere to the method, because I am friends with Jim Grant, my first  teacher and Jimmy's partner and a legendary golfer in his own right. Here's hoping we can get the thread moving in a positive direction. For me the key is that there's allowance for variation. Sure some core principles, but Ballard and Grant both believe in finding your own feels. 

[torbill]

I follow the topic and get notifications..

Jim Grant is the first assistant I remember, on a VHS Ballard instruction tape that I bought and now long lost.  I’ve never found a video of Grant’s swing, which was distinctively Ballard as I recall.  Do you know of a video that we can see online?

[Scottz]

Hello all, does anyone know of any instructors who teach Ballard’s swing, who offer online lessons? Thanks 

[torbill]

Ballard used to offer an analysis of your submitted video for $150.  Don’t know if he still does that but if he does you won’t find a better set of eyes to tell you what you need to do.  In reply to your question and looking for his $150 thing I found this.  I have no idea what it is about and am not convinced that this is a) Ballard or b) Ballard sanctioned.  Perhaps JJ has some insight.

 

https://jbg.thinkific.com/

 

 

[Boise59]

7 hours ago, Scottz said:

Hello all, does anyone know of any instructors who teach Ballard’s swing, who offer online lessons? Thanks 

Yep I do......

[Boise59]

On 7/28/2023 at 7:19 PM, SandPiper said:

To many people keep both shoulders level causing sway and reverse pivot. 

Curtis never kept his shoulders "level", one of his swing thoughts on the backswing was "let the buttons of his shirt go up on the backswing"

[Jersey golfer]

17 hours ago, Boise59 said:

Yep I do......

That's really helpful.

[Lefty Adams]

On 9/21/2023 at 7:52 AM, torbill said:

I follow the topic and get notifications..

Jim Grant is the first assistant I remember, on a VHS Ballard instruction tape that I bought and now long lost.  I’ve never found a video of Grant’s swing, which was distinctively Ballard as I recall.  Do you know of a video that we can see online?

I was able to get the original video JB made with Jim Grant, and it has Jim for about 15 minutes with JB explaining his principles as Jim swings. I burned on to a disc and can transfer some of it on here. But it may take me a week or so, as I have a busy week. But I will do it. Grant's swing was all-Ballard. He was low-am at the Masters in 66 (Nicklaus's third win). 

[upanddown]

I'm interested in the Ballard connection method and have been bouncing back and forth between it and a more modern centered approach most of the year now.  My only Ballard instruction has been the book and watching some of the on-line instruction with Rocco.  I find I hit the ball very straight with Ballard and plenty long enough, defineately easier on the body.  I know everyone talks about great swings: Rory, Adam Scott etc but when I look at the swings of Hal Sutton, Rocco, Curtis Strange they look really good to me, simple and efficient.  Hope the thread continues and interested in who currently teaches the Ballard method. 

[Jersey golfer]

15 hours ago, Lefty Adams said:

I was able to get the original video JB made with Jim Grant, and it has Jim for about 15 minutes with JB explaining his principles as Jim swings. I burned on to a disc and can transfer some of it on here. But it may take me a week or so, as I have a busy week. But I will do it. Grant's swing was all-Ballard. He was low-am at the Masters in 66 (Nicklaus's third win). 

What is different in that video from his "The Fundamental Golf Swing"?

[Lefty Adams]

6 hours ago, Jersey golfer said:

What is different in that video from his "The Fundamental Golf Swing"?

I would say the earlier one is clearer, fresher, and works through the fundamentals in a more sustained way. The later one was filmed more professionally. Kind of a cool fact but JB's earlier video was the FIRST major instructional video of this type (before Jack, Trevino, Ledbetter, etc).  But both are good. 

[torbill]

9 hours ago, upanddown said:

I'm interested in the Ballard connection method and have been bouncing back and forth between it and a more modern centered approach most of the year now.  My only Ballard instruction has been the book and watching some of the on-line instruction with Rocco.  I find I hit the ball very straight with Ballard and plenty long enough, defineately easier on the body.  I know everyone talks about great swings: Rory, Adam Scott etc but when I look at the swings of Hal Sutton, Rocco, Curtis Strange they look really good to me, simple and efficient.  Hope the thread continues and interested in who currently teaches the Ballard method. 

 

That’s the way I’ve done it.  Not an efficient way, but I haven’t had access to a Ballard instructor.  Better to do it on my own than go to an instructor who isn’t familiar with the method.

 

If you are very straight and plenty long enough, with less stress on the body, how come you are bouncing back and forth? 

[upanddown]

1 hour ago, torbill said:

 

That’s the way I’ve done it.  Not an efficient way, but I haven’t had access to a Ballard instructor.  Better to do it on my own than go to an instructor who isn’t familiar with the method.

 

If you are very straight and plenty long enough, with less stress on the body, how come you are bouncing back and forth? 

Great question... because some days its not working on the range or during the round and  I'm better using something else.   I feel when I have my core and the triangle going back as one and body lifting the club up on the backswing nicely, I'm generally pretty good.  Some days that feel is hard to get right now.  Keep in mind since I'm essentially self taught on this, I'm sure I'm not doing exactly what I feel I'm doing.  Also, more traditional instruction is generally what I get in lessons and sometimes that works too.

[KNOWMOREDOUBLES]

Is there any list of instructors who teach this method?

[torbill]

On 9/25/2023 at 10:42 PM, upanddown said:

Great question... because some days its not working on the range or during the round and  I'm better using something else.   I feel when I have my core and the triangle going back as one and body lifting the club up on the backswing nicely, I'm generally pretty good.  Some days that feel is hard to get right now.  Keep in mind since I'm essentially self taught on this, I'm sure I'm not doing exactly what I feel I'm doing.  Also, more traditional instruction is generally what I get in lessons and sometimes that works too.

 

Don’t we all know it.  I had one of those days yesterday.  Unfortunately I don’t have anything else to switch to, lol.  I get into a decent groove and think that I’ll never have another day like yesterday, and thud, out of nowhere, the roof falls in, nothing works.  I wish that my swing came equipped with a reset button. 

[Ayersjj]

On 9/23/2023 at 11:20 AM, Scottz said:

Hello all, does anyone know of any instructors who teach Ballard’s swing, who offer online lessons? Thanks 

Come to Pinehurst NC. 

 

 

Edited November 12, 2023 by Ayersjj

[Ayersjj]

On 9/25/2023 at 11:42 PM, upanddown said:

Great question... because some days its not working on the range or during the round and  I'm better using something else.   I feel when I have my core and the triangle going back as one and body lifting the club up on the backswing nicely, I'm generally pretty good.  Some days that feel is hard to get right now.  Keep in mind since I'm essentially self taught on this, I'm sure I'm not doing exactly what I feel I'm doing.  Also, more traditional instruction is generally what I get in lessons and sometimes that works too.

Always keep the triangle

Edited November 11, 2023 by Ayersjj

[Ayersjj]

On 9/24/2023 at 11:26 PM, Lefty Adams said:

I was able to get the original video JB made with Jim Grant, and it has Jim for about 15 minutes with JB explaining his principles as Jim swings. I burned on to a disc and can transfer some of it on here. But it may take me a week or so, as I have a busy week. But I will do it. Grant's swing was all-Ballard. He was low-am at the Masters in 66 (Nicklaus's third win). 

👍

 

 

 

Edited November 12, 2023 by Ayersjj

[Ayersjj]

On 9/23/2023 at 6:39 PM, torbill said:

Ballard used to offer an analysis of your submitted video for $150.  Don’t know if he still does that but if he does you won’t find a better set of eyes to tell you what you need to do.  In reply to your question and looking for his $150 thing I found this.  I have no idea what it is about and am not convinced that this is a) Ballard or b) Ballard sanctioned.  Perhaps JJ has some insight.

 

https://jbg.thinkific.com/

 

 

👍

Edited November 12, 2023 by Ayersjj

[SandPiper]

2013 Rocco 💀Still workn w Jimmy B and in a better top backswing position toe down. When he left and went to Rick Smith 2016- present all of a sudden he got rounded w more angles. 

 

 

Edited October 11, 2023 by SandPiper

[Ayersjj]

vertical shaft is balanced

 

Edited November 12, 2023 by Ayersjj

[torbill]

JJ, holy smokes!  I had no idea that you went back that far.

In this case we should assign you to be the one who digs up the elusive video of Jim Grant, lol..

 

Edit:  Ah, going back through your Oct 7 post I now see your 1987 comment.  I had missed that.

Edited October 25, 2023 by torbill

[Boise59]

On 10/11/2023 at 8:45 AM, SandPiper said:

2013 Rocco 💀Still workn w Jimmy B and in a better top backswing position toe down. When he left and went to Rick Smith 2016- present all of a sudden he got rounded w more angles. 

 

 

And hasn't played well since.......

[KNOWMOREDOUBLES]

I went back and read the first two pages and watched Annika’s swing. So simple. Why we don’t teach shifting into the trail leg more often does not make sense to me. You would see Ballard do a demonstration of this and he always really exaggerated the move. It’s never that drastic and I think Annika is the model.

[Rapidcat]

On 10/25/2023 at 2:09 PM, Ayersjj said:

Going on 37 years w Jimmy Ballard.😳

 

 

Is he a sensitive lover? You'd expect that after 37 years together, no?