Dr Kwon

[PracticeSwinger]

52 minutes ago, RobertBaron said:

Someone in the comments on one of the vids mentioned the feel being like heaving a bag of cement onto a truck on the trail side. Dr Kwon responded that that’s exactly right. 
 

In his sessions, Dr Kwon will often have players use a kettlebell to get the  feel of heaving something heavy behind them. Or he’ll lie on the ground and have a player try and lift him one handed.

 

Basically, you have to imagine the golf club is much heavier than it is and feel how you would create momentum with your body to throw a heavier object twice. Once in the backswing and then again in the downswing. 
 

swinging around a kettlebell or medicine ball is probably the best way to get the feel. 

 

 

… or a sledgehammer : easier to replicate the golf club form and feel - and from the top is it definitely impossible to swing it if you try to force it down at the ball; gotta pressure and brace on the lead side and swing it around

 

Great explanation by the way

[kenstl]

Just saw this post after watching a lot of Dr. Kwon’s videos, I really like what he has to teach.  I have been in to Dr. Kwon and The Zen Mechanic (you tuber out of Ireland), both teach footwork first based on pressure plates.  The other two instructors I tend to fall to are Mike Bender and Malaska.  

 

I have been playing for 40 years, single digit hc and although I get something from all of them, the biggest items I solely agree with are 1. You have to know what impact position should look and feel like. 2. Golf is no different from any other sport, footwork footwork footwork and weight transition is fundamental to everything else working.   

[glk]

7 hours ago, Duffer Mark said:

If I understand Kwon correctly, he is teaching not to necessarily rotate the hips back, but to push them back using the ground after the weight shift, right? What's the best way to develop this move? 

https://www.instagram.com/p/B_W03fXF0G3/

don’t use your arms

Edited January 25, 2022 by glk

[agolfman]

For those interested in a more weighted approach, I’ve been using this over the winter with these shift-turn drills.  It definitely creates a “don’t use the arms” feel if you maintain awareness about the body movements required to use it. 
 

IIRC correctly, the original guidance for this included the forward swing starting position to build momentum as well.  No affiliation, won this at a golf tournament. 
 

https://www.momentussports.com/product/strength-trainer/

[Nels55]

I am wondering if anyone knows what weight of kettlebell Dr. Kwon is using?

[GungHoGolf]

28 minutes ago, Nels55 said:

I am wondering if anyone knows what weight of kettlebell Dr. Kwon is using?

10 lbs. 

 

New video up that goes into detail on kettlebell and other training aids:

 

 

[mudge]

Were there any takers on the $3400 BBG-Kwon School that just finished from WRX?

[vman]

4 hours ago, Nels55 said:

I am wondering if anyone knows what weight of kettlebell Dr. Kwon is using?

You can use a little heavier than 10lbs if you're a bit stronger, I'm using a 7kg.

Edited January 25, 2022 by vman

[Forged4life]

3 hours ago, vman said:

You can use a little heavier than 10lbs if you're a bit stronger, I'm using a 7kg.

That’s confusing 🧐😂

[Nels55]

2 hours ago, Forged4life said:

That’s confusing 🧐😂

7kg = 15.432 lbs.  LOL I am using a 16 lb bowling ball so pretty close...

Edited January 26, 2022 by Nels55

[Etzwane]

On 1/24/2022 at 7:53 AM, Nels55 said:

Interesting that all of the info is correct, author, date and title.  But the picture is certainly wrong.  Amazon screw up I guess. 

 

Have you made a seller an offer on the book?  Sometimes they will sell for a lot less then list price.  A few years ago I paid $10 for a golf instruction manual ("Right way golf") that was listed for somewhere around $300 by offering the seller $5.  In that case it was a waste of $10.00 on my part LOL.

 

I haven't, at the time there was some peak in demand because Lynn Blake really advertised drill from the book. There are probably copies in public libraries, at least there were at the time I looked about ten years ago.

[Etzwane]

On 1/24/2022 at 4:29 PM, Forged4life said:

Yea you “let” them go down you don’t make them go down. Subtle but big IMO. I feel if I retract the right scapula at the top it helps with the patience of the shoulders staying closed 

It's only a feel, an image for those that use their arms too much, not to be taken at face value. If the arms were really free falling one would just whiff the ball every single time, there is not enough time in the downswing (in 0.1s a free falling object would travel less than two inches, 8 in 0.2s).

[Crn50]

I stumbled across Dr Kwon while watching utube golf club repair, I'm not very good at the step drill but plan on keeping at it. Looks the business to me...

[Nels55]

20 minutes ago, Crn50 said:

I stumbled across Dr Kwon while watching utube golf club repair, I'm not very good at the step drill but plan on keeping at it. Looks the business to me...

I have found that it helps a lot to video myself doing the drills as I can then see that I am not doing anything close to what it feels like I am doing LOL.  As is often the case the more correct movement will feel rather strange and awkward to me.  For instance this tilt is something that I seem to have to work on constantly as I tend to want to get my head on the other side of the yellow line with my hips forward and my spine tilted away from the target:

 

LOL when I pass through somewhere in the neighborhood of this position it feels so good that I tend to swing with a certain sense of joy which is a lot of fun.  I also tend to swing really hard but that is part of another problem to work on...

[Crn50]

50 minutes ago, Nels55 said:

in the neighborhood of this position it feels so good that I tend to swing with a certain sense of joy which is a lot of fun.  

 

I too feel the Joy after a month in a Coma, just hitting balls badly is so so good after that end of 2019. At 71 I'm looking to be as good as possible, my aim is around 12 which is 8 shots better than now. I have plenty of time lol...

[Hilts1969]

2 hours ago, Nels55 said:

I have found that it helps a lot to video myself doing the drills as I can then see that I am not doing anything close to what it feels like I am doing LOL.  As is often the case the more correct movement will feel rather strange and awkward to me.  For instance this tilt is something that I seem to have to work on constantly as I tend to want to get my head on the other side of the yellow line with my hips forward and my spine tilted away from the target:

 

LOL when I pass through somewhere in the neighborhood of this position it feels so good that I tend to swing with a certain sense of joy which is a lot of fun.  I also tend to swing really hard but that is part of another problem to work on...

 

Im guessing that felt/feels very reverse pivot to you and the worry was being to much target side/in front of the ball?

[Nels55]

4 hours ago, Hilts1969 said:

 

Im guessing that felt/feels very reverse pivot to you and the worry was being to much target side/in front of the ball?

To some extent though I can get past the reverse pivot feeling pretty easily.  The biggest problem for me is that I spent many years training in the opposite movement based on certain teaching and I revert to the learned movement without realizing it.  I am not sure how long it might take to get the new movement ingrained.  At the moment if I don't think about doing it 'correctly' I will tend to do it the old way.  LOL not the best way to play golf that's for sure!

[Hilts1969]

4 minutes ago, Nels55 said:

To some extent though I can get past the reverse pivot feeling pretty easily.  The biggest problem for me is that I spent many years training in the opposite movement based on certain teaching and I revert to the learned movement without realizing it.  I am not sure how long it might take to get the new movement ingrained.  At the moment if I don't think about doing it 'correctly' I will tend to do it the old way.  LOL not the best way to play golf that's for sure!

 

I feel your dilemma, don’t take it to the course but then you naturally ingrain old habits.  

[Duffer Mark]

At my last lesson, I reiterated that I've been trying to learn to use the ground better in my swing. The instructor had me push my legs down and outward in my set-up. Doing this really helped me keep everything together and I started hitting the ball very well. I felt the shift and turn without focusing on making a shift and turn. Now, I need to make time at the range to work on this as well as some of Dr. Kwon's drills, etc. 

[munchies2x]

Managed to read the entire 25 pages on the discussion last night. Few things I want to add here, it seems a number of posters argued that the step drills are nothing new and used it to justify that they are others that already teaching the same thing (i.e. Mike Austin, etc).

 

I am not arguing that this is the holy grail of golf swing, but in my many years on reading and watching golf instructions, there are several thoughts by Dr. Kwon that combined together make this somewhat unique. This is my attempt to summarise what they are:

1. Step drills (obviously), using heavier objects or rope to drill this concept

2. Active back swing, wait for the back swing to fully mature and 80% power (could be feeling) on the down swing

3. The very importance of flow and to avoid jerky/pushing motion in any part of your swing (including artificially pulling the arm/squating). Having the flow will lead to the efficiency of the golf swing.

4. Swing plane, swing plane will take care itself with less wrist manipulation due to active back swing (he doesn't say not to utilise your wrist). He has yet to focus on the swing plane, wrist, arm setup that will produce certain ball flights but again he is not a golf instructor so I'd guess this is something that the pros will get from their own golf instructor.

5. The torque, moment arm and the GRF explanations... and the idea that maximising the moment arm is the faster way to get more speed. Increasing GRF is harder as generally you'd need to get stronger (more mass like Bryson or jump hard like Justin Thomas). Classic example is Jon Rahm vs Bryson - body wise and skill wise, they are almost identical but Bryson driving average is 10% longer, mainly because Jon Rahm's short back swing (less moment arm).

 

 

[Duffer Mark]

I'm halfway through Dr. Kwon’s latest video from today. Pretty good so far. One thing I’m having trouble with is starting the downswing with my back toward the target. 
 

Maybe the reverse C-type of position Kwon mentions would help. Seems at that point the weight has shifted onto the lead foot and then it’s about pushing the ground while completing the downswing. 

[MK7Golf21]

Bit of a critique, I do think Kwon might get faster results out of these people if he wasn't so quick to tell them they are doing it wrong. It's a bit like rubbing your belly and patting your head at the same time when you first try the step drills. They normally start out decent trying to just get use to stepping and swinging but he starts correcting them after each swing too early and they start doing awkward movements.

 

Let them do it for 5-10 mins with positive reinforcement and then start correcting once they get the hang of just doing steps while swinging would probably help them get it faster.

 

Imagine someone correcting you trying to rub your belly and pat your head right when you first try it and you will get completely stuck

Edited January 28, 2022 by Redjeep83

[me05501]

3 minutes ago, Redjeep83 said:

Bit of a critique, I do think Kwon might get faster results out of these people if he wasn't so quick to tell them they are doing it wrong. It's a bit like rubbing your belly and patting your head at the same time when you first try the step drills. They normally start out decent trying to just get use to stepping and swinging but he starts correcting them after each swing too early and they start doing awkward movements.

 

Let them do it for 5-10 mins with positive reinforcement and then start correcting once they get the hang of just doing steps while swinging would probably help them get it faster.

 

Imagine someone correcting you trying to rub your belly and pat your head right when you first try it and you will get completely stuck

 

I disagree, especially based on the fact that he's seeing people for a very short time and then sending them away to work on their own.

 

If someone's natural tendency is to do the drill incorrectly that's what they're likely to fall back to as soon as they're by themselves. At least with the corrections they have a chance of hearing his voice in the back of their minds saying "no!" 

 

It seems like the difference between a fundamentally sound swing and an unsound/inefficient one is hard for a lot of people to discern. You can't tell by looking half the time, and feeling is even harder. 

[MK7Golf21]

39 minutes ago, me05501 said:

 

I disagree, especially based on the fact that he's seeing people for a very short time and then sending them away to work on their own.

 

If someone's natural tendency is to do the drill incorrectly that's what they're likely to fall back to as soon as they're by themselves. At least with the corrections they have a chance of hearing his voice in the back of their minds saying "no!" 

 

It seems like the difference between a fundamentally sound swing and an unsound/inefficient one is hard for a lot of people to discern. You can't tell by looking half the time, and feeling is even harder. 

 

I agree they have limited time which is why I'm saying I think it takes him too long to teach it to them. He starts correcting them after 1-2 tries when they are just trying to get the order of stepping and swinging, that's not natural tendency. At least for me, I would like to try it for awhile before he starts correcting. I would get his corrections down must faster that way.

Edited January 28, 2022 by Redjeep83

[golfarb1]

On 1/26/2022 at 12:13 AM, Nels55 said:

I have found that it helps a lot to video myself doing the drills as I can then see that I am not doing anything close to what it feels like I am doing LOL.  As is often the case the more correct movement will feel rather strange and awkward to me.  For instance this tilt is something that I seem to have to work on constantly as I tend to want to get my head on the other side of the yellow line with my hips forward and my spine tilted away from the target:

 

LOL when I pass through somewhere in the neighborhood of this position it feels so good that I tend to swing with a certain sense of joy which is a lot of fun.  I also tend to swing really hard but that is part of another problem to work on...

Is your spine tilt consistent with some of longest drivers in tour history ?And pound for pound the longest driver in the history of golf 

Jack Nicklaus

John Daley

Dustin Johnson

Bryson deChambeau 

Jamie Sadlowski 

[airjammer]

21 hours ago, Duffer Mark said:

I'm halfway through Dr. Kwon’s latest video from today. Pretty good so far. One thing I’m having trouble with is starting the downswing with my back toward the target. 
 

Maybe the reverse C-type of position Kwon mentions would help. Seems at that point the weight has shifted onto the lead foot and then it’s about pushing the ground while completing the downswing. 

That “sure” was a good video!😂 Everyone who actually watched it will get what I meant. 

[Forged4life]

5 hours ago, Redjeep83 said:

Bit of a critique, I do think Kwon might get faster results out of these people if he wasn't so quick to tell them they are doing it wrong. It's a bit like rubbing your belly and patting your head at the same time when you first try the step drills. They normally start out decent trying to just get use to stepping and swinging but he starts correcting them after each swing too early and they start doing awkward movements.

 

Let them do it for 5-10 mins with positive reinforcement and then start correcting once they get the hang of just doing steps while swinging would probably help them get it faster.

 

Imagine someone correcting you trying to rub your belly and pat your head right when you first try it and you will get completely stuck

Lol. Everyone’s an expert these days 

[623baller]

 

On 1/24/2022 at 9:04 AM, agolfman said:

Just a thought on a different kind of trigger. I’m putting 60% of my weight on my lead foot and creating a trigger move to push (push/turn) off that lead foot to get the backswing started. Definitely helped me with going from the step drill to a static swing. 

 

this is exactly what i did as well to get rid of the steps as well and here's how i do it

 

1. push off on lead foot to start back swing

2. as weight lands on back foot and backswing gets higher feel the weight of the club head to get a sense of where it is in the top of backswing 

3. right before it reaches the very top or what he calls a mature backswing push off back foot and move weight to front foot

4. then just let it go

[munchies2x]

39 minutes ago, 623baller said:

 

 

this is exactly what i did as well to get rid of the steps as well and here's how i do it

 

1. push off on lead foot to start back swing

2. as weight lands on back foot and backswing gets higher feel the weight of the club head to get a sense of where it is in the top of backswing 

3. right before it reaches the very top or what he calls a mature backswing push off back foot and move weight to front foot

4. then just let it go

+1

 

However, I am still trying to time the 'step 4. let it go' just right.

 

Do you find you need to adjust the swing plane/wrist/hand position at that time or is that just automatic?

[623baller]

1 hour ago, munchies2x said:

+1

 

However, I am still trying to time the 'step 4. let it go' just right.

 

Do you find you need to adjust the swing plane/wrist/hand position at that time or is that just automatic?

yea its a weird feeling that im still trying to get a good hang of as well.

 

but i would say after your weight transfer to lead foot and you push off the ground, your arms should just follow your body like a whip or rope if that makes sense. if you focus too much on your hands then you are gona be swinging with them instead of your feet to lower body then to shoulder