Improper iron shaft flex

[nvr3putt]

Do you think your scores or handicap would be any different if your iron shafts were off by one level? (X or R instead of S-flex)

 

[goaliedad30]

Given that I have entered my 60's, if I went from S to X, I'd notice. If I went from S to R, I might improve! Just made that switch in my driver with very positive results; might have to evaluate the rest of the bag now.

[cfmgolf]

If the weight is similar in the two different flexes then no I don't think the scores would change.  If very different weight classes along with flex differences then yes it probably would change your score.  For example you can find a R that is 90 grams and a S that is 120 grams.  Those are so different that it could change your scores.  If the R is 90 and the S is 95 then probably won't.  

[Stuart_G]

17 hours ago, nvr3putt said:

Do you think your scores or handicap would be any different if your iron shafts were off by one level? (X or R instead of S-flex)

 

 

"Off" based on what criteria?

 

There is no objective basis for determining how stiff one's shaft should be - how much it should load/unload during the swing just based on the mechanics of the swing.    There are recommendations based on swing speed - but those are, at best, just something to provide a starting point in the fitting process, nothing hard and fast by any means as many other aspects will influence what might be a good fit.   So never make a judgment of what one "should" be playing based on simple criteria like swing speed.

 

Second - there is no standard for flex.  You can have one model R flex shaft that's actually stiffer than an S flex shaft of a different model.    So using the flex labels by themselves isn't really a good criteria for how stiff a shaft might be - and how the stiffness might have changed when changing flexes between different models - and also on what might be a good fit.   Each shaft model needs to be judged independently for flex.

 

So we can only really ask the question:  what might the effect be of playing a flex for a shaft of a particular model that's not necessarily the flex that's been found (through testing) to be the best fit? (whatever flex that might be for that model)

 

And the answer is simply but likely unsatisfying - it will be different for everyone.    For some people it wont make any difference what-so-ever.  At the other extreme, it could be a complete disaster for their swing.   And on top of that, the answer could be completely different going stiffer vs going softer.   One individual might be fine going stiffer but falls apart going softer (or visa-versa).   It all depends on how well they can maintain their swing as the feel of the shaft loading and unloading changes.    It mostly comes down to how much the player might be using and depending on that loading/unloading feel to help control the timing of their swing and how well they can adjust when the feel changes.

 

Other than that, all we can say is that the tendency is that stiffness is just not as important as many people think for a majority of folks - although it still can be critical for a good portion of the minority.   And it tends to be even less important in the shorter irons than it does in the longer woods and driver.   So most ams will likely see little difference in the score.   But you never know until you try it.  So if your interested in getting an more accurate answer, go out, play around with different shafts and different flexes and see what happens.

 

 

Edited May 9 by Stuart_G

[par4bmw]

3 hours ago, Stuart_G said:

 

"Off" based on what criteria?

 

There is no objective basis for determining how stiff one's shaft should be - how much it should load/unload during the swing just based on the mechanics of the swing.    There are recommendations based on swing speed - but those are, at best, just something to provide a starting point in the fitting process, nothing hard and fast by any means as many other aspects will influence what might be a good fit.   So never make a judgment of what one "should" be playing based on simple criteria like swing speed.

 

Second - there is no standard for flex.  You can have one model R flex shaft that's actually stiffer than an S flex shaft of a different model.    So using the flex labels by themselves isn't really a good criteria for how stiff a shaft might be - and how the stiffness might have changed when changing flexes between different models - and also on what might be a good fit.   Each shaft model needs to be judged independently for flex.

 

So we can only really ask the question:  what might the effect be of playing a flex for a shaft of a particular model that's not necessarily the flex that's been found (through testing) to be the best fit? (whatever flex that might be for that model)

 

And the answer is simply but likely unsatisfying - it will be different for everyone.    For some people it wont make any difference what-so-ever.  At the other extreme, it could be a complete disaster for their swing.   And on top of that, the answer could be completely different going stiffer vs going softer.   One individual might be fine going stiffer but falls apart going softer (or visa-versa).   It all depends on how well they can maintain their swing as the feel of the shaft loading and unloading changes.    It mostly comes down to how much the player might be using and depending on that loading/unloading feel to help control the timing of their swing and how well they can adjust when the feel changes.

 

Other than that, all we can say is that the tendency is that stiffness is just not as important as many people think for a majority of folks - although it still can be critical for a good portion of the minority.   And it tends to be even less important in the shorter irons than it does in the longer woods and driver.   So most ams will likely see little difference in the score.   But you never know until you try it.  So if your interested in getting an more accurate answer, go out, play around with different shafts and different flexes and see what happens.

 

 

Well said.  With my swing, flex in irons is mostly about flight I am looking for.  I can consistently hit a training 7 iron I built using Fuji's MCI Practice shaft that is super flexible.  I can hit it pretty close to my normal dispersion and distance.  Some of my other single digit partners can hardly strike the ball with it.

[Stuart_G]

1 hour ago, par4bmw said:

Well said.  With my swing, flex in irons is mostly about flight I am looking for.  I can consistently hit a training 7 iron I built using Fuji's MCI Practice shaft that is super flexible.  I can hit it pretty close to my normal dispersion and distance.  Some of my other single digit partners can hardly strike the ball with it.

 

That can certainly work well for some people - and if it works for you that's great.  But it's not always very reliable for many.

 

IMO - most would be better off choosing the shaft (both weight and stiffness) for consistency (face impact and dispersion), accuracy, shot shape control, and even just preference for a feel.   Then leave trajectory (launch/spin) for the head and loft selection and fitting.   That tends to be much more reliable.

 

Edited May 9 by Stuart_G

[rsballer10]

I'm playing iron shafts that I think are too stiff for me. But, that's what I was fit to. I'm scoring well, and hitting great iron shots...

[nvr3putt]

4 hours ago, Stuart_G said:

 

"Off" based on what criteria?

 

There is no objective basis for determining how stiff one's shaft should be - how much it should load/unload during the swing just based on the mechanics of the swing.    There are recommendations based on swing speed - but those are, at best, just something to provide a starting point in the fitting process, nothing hard and fast by any means as many other aspects will influence what might be a good fit.   So never make a judgment of what one "should" be playing based on simple criteria like swing speed.

 

Second - there is no standard for flex.  You can have one model R flex shaft that's actually stiffer than an S flex shaft of a different model.    So using the flex labels by themselves isn't really a good criteria for how stiff a shaft might be - and how the stiffness might have changed when changing flexes between different models - and also on what might be a good fit.   Each shaft model needs to be judged independently for flex.

 

So we can only really ask the question:  what might the effect be of playing a flex for a shaft of a particular model that's not necessarily the flex that's been found (through testing) to be the best fit? (whatever flex that might be for that model)

 

And the answer is simply but likely unsatisfying - it will be different for everyone.    For some people it wont make any difference what-so-ever.  At the other extreme, it could be a complete disaster for their swing.   And on top of that, the answer could be completely different going stiffer vs going softer.   One individual might be fine going stiffer but falls apart going softer (or visa-versa).   It all depends on how well they can maintain their swing as the feel of the shaft loading and unloading changes.    It mostly comes down to how much the player might be using and depending on that loading/unloading feel to help control the timing of their swing and how well they can adjust when the feel changes.

 

Other than that, all we can say is that the tendency is that stiffness is just not as important as many people think for a majority of folks - although it still can be critical for a good portion of the minority.   And it tends to be even less important in the shorter irons than it does in the longer woods and driver.   So most ams will likely see little difference in the score.   But you never know until you try it.  So if your interested in getting an more accurate answer, go out, play around with different shafts and different flexes and see what happens.

 

 

In my situation, I was fitted into a KBS $-taper Lite R-flex many years ago but my 7i (32 degrees) carry distance has gone from 140 to 160yds. Ball flight is generally high and straight.

Just wondering if it's time to get fitted again or maintain status quo. 

[Stuart_G]

2 minutes ago, nvr3putt said:

In my situation, I was fitted into a KBS $-taper Lite R-flex many years ago but my 7i (32 degrees) carry distance has gone from 140 to 160yds. Ball flight is generally high and straight.

Just wondering if it's time to get fitted again or maintain status quo. 

 

How good a fit a shaft might be is all about the relative performance of the different options.   So the only way to find out if there is any room for improvement is to go test some alternative options and compare against the current shaft.  

 

Now that being said, if you're happy with the performance there is certainly no big rush to change.  Nothing wrong with the philosophy of "if it's not broke, don't fix it".   Not sure I'd recommend putting out money for a fitting but it certainly couldn't hurt to go demo some stiffer shafts and see how they work for you.    Just realize when working comparing results from different heads - just focus on feel of the shaft, consistency of face impact and the ball flight results, face control, etc..   but don't worry about launch and spin.   That's only useful when using the same head model and loft.

[par4bmw]

52 minutes ago, Stuart_G said:

 

That can certainly work well for some people - and if it works for you that's great.  But it's not always very reliable for many.

 

IMO - most would be better off choosing the shaft (both weight and stiffness) for consistency (face impact and dispersion), accuracy, shot shape control, and even just preference for a feel.   Then leave trajectory (launch/spin) for the head and loft selection and fitting.   That tends to be much more reliable.

 

Makes sense.  Thanks for the advice.