Rules infraction? Marking ball on green...

[Smooth spin scott]

Played in a Municipal golf final Club Championship tournament, and on the 3rd green I was left with a 60 foot putt. I marked my ball by sticking my divot repair tool behind it, so that I could see it from the other side of the green while reading the break. A player said that it should be a 2 stroke penalty for using the divot tool as a marker...he said "not using a round marker to mark my ball". Just wondering what the rules are for what type a marker can be used....I've seen people use tees during casual rounds but not sure about official events.

 

What's the ruling?

 

Discussed by group: The group agreed not to penalize me, because no one else was quite sure about the rule. When we asked the pro after the round, he honestly said he had no idea, he was under the impression anything can be used to mark a ball as long as it's replaced to the original spot.... Now I was 18 out of 80, prizes to top 10, so no one got hurt out of the situation, and even with the 2 stroke it brought me from 77 to 79, which moved me to 19 with 4 other guys. So no biggie.

[KevCarter]

No penalty.

[mtsmith]

Pretty sure you could mark a ball with a 'D' Battery if you wanted too....

[vferrari]

No penalty.

See decision [b][i]20-1/16 Method Used to Mark Position of Ball

"[/i][/b][b]Q. [/b]The Note to Rule [url="http://www.usga.org/bookrule.aspx?id=14292#20-1"]20-1[/url] provides that "the position of a ball to be lifted should be marked by placing a ball-marker, a small coin or other similar object immediately behind the ball." Is a player penalized if he uses an object that is not similar to a ball-marker or small coin to mark the position of his ball?

[b]A. [/b]No. The provision in the Note to Rule [url="http://www.usga.org/bookrule.aspx?id=14292#20-1"]20-1[/url] is a recommendation of best practice, but there is no penalty for failing to act in accordance with the Note."

[Newby]

There is nothing preventing you using your pitchmark repair tool as you did.
The note to Rule 20-1 is only a guide.

[i][b]Note:[/b] The position of a ball to be lifted should be marked by placing a ball-marker, a small coin or other similar object immediately behind the ball.

[/i]See the link to Decision 20-1/16 below

[url="http://www.usga.org/bookdecision.aspx?id=14293#20-1/16"][i]http://www.usga.org/bookdecision.aspx?id=14293#20-1/16[/i][/url]

[jaskanski]

Within reason, you can mark your ball with whatever you like, as long as you can replace your ball to it's original position. You could have used a driver to mark it's position without penalty.

[mikpga]

Flat and round is a RECOMMENDATION by the USGA...

[vferrari]

following up on the decision posts:

1. odd that the pro didn't know that
2. someone in your group should carry a rule book

[QuickFeet]

[quote name='jaskanski' post='1948088' date='Sep 13 2009, 11:08 AM']Within reason, you can mark your ball with whatever you like, as long as you can replace your ball to it's original position. You could have used a driver to mark it's position without penalty.[/quote]

Almost. You cannot use a "loose impediment" to mark the position of the ball.

[jaskanski]

[quote name='QuickFeet' post='1948175' date='Sep 13 2009, 06:14 PM'][quote name='jaskanski' post='1948088' date='Sep 13 2009, 11:08 AM']Within reason, you can mark your ball with whatever you like, as long as you can replace your ball to it's original position. You could have used a driver to mark it's position without penalty.[/quote]

Almost. You cannot use a "loose impediment" to mark the position of the ball.
[/quote]

I would say you could. A rabbit dropping is a loose impediment and is also perfectly reasonable to use to mark the position of your ball on the green. Or an apple fallen from a tree, banana skin....the list goes on. In other words, you're wrong.

[Newby]

[quote name='QuickFeet' post='1948175' date='Sep 13 2009, 06:14 PM']Almost. You cannot use a "loose impediment" to mark the position of the ball.[/quote]

Not quite. According to Decision 20-1/16 (linked above) a loose impediment 'is not recommended but is permissible.'

[larrybud]

[quote name='jaskanski' post='1948181' date='Sep 13 2009, 01:19 PM'][quote name='QuickFeet' post='1948175' date='Sep 13 2009, 06:14 PM'][quote name='jaskanski' post='1948088' date='Sep 13 2009, 11:08 AM']Within reason, you can mark your ball with whatever you like, as long as you can replace your ball to it's original position. You could have used a driver to mark it's position without penalty.[/quote]

Almost. You cannot use a "loose impediment" to mark the position of the ball.
[/quote]

I would say you could. A rabbit dropping is a loose impediment and is also perfectly reasonable to use to mark the position of your ball on the green. Or an apple fallen from a tree, banana skin....the list goes on. In other words, you're wrong.
[/quote]
"Perfectly reasonable" isn't exactly the words I would use!!!!

[Sawgrass]

[quote name='larrybud' post='1948760' date='Sep 13 2009, 08:07 PM'][quote name='jaskanski' post='1948181' date='Sep 13 2009, 01:19 PM'][quote name='QuickFeet' post='1948175' date='Sep 13 2009, 06:14 PM'][quote name='jaskanski' post='1948088' date='Sep 13 2009, 11:08 AM']Within reason, you can mark your ball with whatever you like, as long as you can replace your ball to it's original position. You could have used a driver to mark it's position without penalty.[/quote]

Almost. You cannot use a "loose impediment" to mark the position of the ball.
[/quote]

I would say you could. A rabbit dropping is a loose impediment and is also perfectly reasonable to use to mark the position of your ball on the green. Or an apple fallen from a tree, banana skin....the list goes on. In other words, you're wrong.
[/quote]
"Perfectly reasonable" isn't exactly the words I would use!!!!

[/quote]

Yep. Not all that reasonable. That's why so few pros carry rabbit droppings in their pockets. (I'm pretty sure about this.)

[KevCarter]

[quote name='Sawgrass' post='1949522' date='Sep 14 2009, 09:24 AM'][quote name='larrybud' post='1948760' date='Sep 13 2009, 08:07 PM'][quote name='jaskanski' post='1948181' date='Sep 13 2009, 01:19 PM'][quote name='QuickFeet' post='1948175' date='Sep 13 2009, 06:14 PM'][quote name='jaskanski' post='1948088' date='Sep 13 2009, 11:08 AM']Within reason, you can mark your ball with whatever you like, as long as you can replace your ball to it's original position. You could have used a driver to mark it's position without penalty.[/quote]

Almost. You cannot use a "loose impediment" to mark the position of the ball.
[/quote]

I would say you could. A rabbit dropping is a loose impediment and is also perfectly reasonable to use to mark the position of your ball on the green. Or an apple fallen from a tree, banana skin....the list goes on. In other words, you're wrong.
[/quote]
"Perfectly reasonable" isn't exactly the words I would use!!!!

[/quote]

Yep. Not all that reasonable. That's why so few pros carry rabbit droppings in their pockets. (I'm pretty sure about this.)
[/quote]

The problem I had was when I stuck my hands in my pockets the droppings would sometimes get stuck in my fingernails and the smell was hard to get rid of. Strange, because these are some of the firmest droppings I have ever experienced. I've heard the only turds that may be firmer are armadillo turds, but we don't have many of those in Minnesota, and armadillo turds are too expensive in the stores. I guess I'll just go back to quarters.

Kevin

[ZBigStick]

Again someone adapting what they saw or heard from the PGA and trying to apply it to USGA rules.

"Ian Woosnam used a key once which was not deemed to be coin like and thus was penalized."

I am very surprised the pro did not know nor had a rule book and the book of decisions to look it up.

[jaskanski]

Technically, you don't even need a marker. Decision 20-1/16 states:
Q - Is it permissable to mark the position of a ball on the putting green by scratching a line on the green with a tee?
A - Yes, provided the surface of the green is not tested (rule 16-1d) or the scratched line does not indicate a line for putting (rule 8-2b). However the practice is not recommended due to the possibility of damage to the putting surface.

There you have it. Just how you scratch the green without damaging it or convincing your opponent that you're not testing the surface is rather unclear though. Consequently, I'll continue to use blackbird feathers stuck in the green, or rabbit droppings (at least a day old), or a Jolly Rancher. Just don't get the last two mixed up in your pocket...

[Newby]

For a short while the PGA Tour didhave an illegal Local Rule specifying that the ball marker had to be small and round (or words to that effect). It didn't last long.