2023 Solheim Cup (Sep 22-24)

[heynow]

Solheim Cup is great, but I feel that it's gotten a bit antiquated. 

When it started over 30 years ago,  it was safe to assume that with the top women golfers from the US and Europe, that people would be watching pretty much all the best female players in the world (of course with a few exceptions).

In the past 10-15 or so years,  the huge rise in the quality of many many many players from the rest of the world especially the continent of Asia,  it seems that this format needs to change.  

Perhaps if there's enough interest,  maybe the the winning team from the Solheim should then play an international team (like the President's Cup team). 

Men's golf has the President's Cup.   For the ladies, an international team like the President's cup is a scary good team.   Maybe somehow this can get incorporated for the women.

 

This year's winning European team is great,  but I think we all know that a ladies team even just from the continent of Asia (we know the names) would be favored over the European or US teams.

[mshills]

No less than four 100% clickbait headlines on the front page of GolfWRX referring to Lexi Thompson.  SMH.

[ChronicSlicer]

1 hour ago, Rapidcat said:

 

Retaining isn't as good as winning and we're not entirely happy, it's a partial success only.

 

Win and 'bury' your opponents.

Agreed 100%. I admit I like to keep things as original as possible (I don't even like the Evian as a major, no need for 5) but at the same time I'm not a fan of ties as an overall outcome. It is what it is, but maybe a change wouldn't hurt.

[DuenPhen]

1 hour ago, heynow said:

Solheim Cup is great, but I feel that it's gotten a bit antiquated. 

When it started over 30 years ago,  it was safe to assume that with the top women golfers from the US and Europe, that people would be watching pretty much all the best female players in the world (of course with a few exceptions).

In the past 10-15 or so years,  the huge rise in the quality of many many many players from the rest of the world especially the continent of Asia,  it seems that this format needs to change.  

Perhaps if there's enough interest,  maybe the the winning team from the Solheim should then play an international team (like the President's Cup team). 

Men's golf has the President's Cup.   For the ladies, an international team like the President's cup is a scary good team.   Maybe somehow this can get incorporated for the women.

 

This year's winning European team is great,  but I think we all know that a ladies team even just from the continent of Asia (we know the names) would be favored over the European or US teams.

The problem with your thought is that in Asia, a lot of inspiration for women’s golf is to prove that we too belong on the biggest stage.

 

South Korea has done more than enough to prove that they are the best nation in the world. To force them into a President’s Cup team is to tell them that no matter what they did, they are still seen as less on their own. This is the nation that in the 2000’s led Team Asia against the whole world in the Lexus Cup. This is the nation that brought record crowds for their nation in the 2018 International Crown.

 

Proposals to copy men’s President’s Cup fall to the very rationale of western superiority that we are fighting against. If there is to be a Team Asia, the opponent in my opinion must be at minimum combined USA/Europe. 
 

Else, one can do USA v Korea. I remember talks on this very forum in the mid 2010’s about how this should have happened and people speculated that the only reason the Americans refused was due to fear that it would show the truth - that they had been utterly surpassed.

 

(Alternatively, maybe match the Solheim winners with combined Thai-Aussie team - who are after all the International Crown finalists)

 

 

Edited September 25, 2023 by DuenPhen

[ChronicSlicer]

50 minutes ago, heynow said:

This year's winning European team is great

Haven't you been reading any of the last few pages, Europe did not win, they tied, Europe just retained the Cup so it doesn't collect dust on a shelf.

[jt2gt]

On 9/19/2023 at 2:20 PM, 18majors said:

 

Keely Levins is on point on her assessment of Rose Zhang:

Players to watch, handling pressure, winning formulas and more: Our writers break down all things Solheim Cup

 

Keely Levins:

"All of the rookies are LPGA winners, so it feels like just about any of them could have a fantastic week. But I think Rose Zhang will be one to score the most points. She has proven herself in team play, going 7-0-2 in her two Curtis Cup appearances, and has a steady, confident demeanor that should carry her well through the week. She also has that intangible star quality and hasn’t done anything huge since winning her pro debut back in June. It feels like she’s due for some fireworks, and they could go off in Spain. —K.L."

 

 

Keely and Golf Digest gonna have to keep waiting for RZ to do something huge.  Her and JenK kind of a let down.  Judy always comments on JenK's mental side, maybe those two should have a talk.  

[wobgon]

8 hours ago, ColinKelvin said:

Have a read of this, it may help to explain the European team identity:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2023/sep/25/the-whole-of-europe-is-behind-you-ryder-cup-players-on-unique-identity

 

The European ("DP World") tour is a lowly feeder tour now, but from the 80s through to the 00s it had a super-strong identity which fed into the Ryder Cup team, and vice versa.  The players on the team feel "European" and are usually the RC underdogs - which helps make every contest against almost always super-strong US teams fiery and engrossing.  That's why millions of people find it exciting.

Not questioning identity nor does identity play in to what i said.

[ChronicSlicer]

1 minute ago, DuenPhen said:

people speculated that the only reason the Americans refuse is due to fear that it will show the truth - that they have been utterly surpassed.

 

 

 We always win, even when we don't. We're even better at hiding the truths, until they leak out of course. 😂

[ChronicSlicer]

1 hour ago, mshills said:

No less than four 100% clickbait headlines on the front page of GolfWRX referring to Lexi Thompson.  SMH.

Gotta get them views bro..

[Dpavs]

1 hour ago, pmcuk said:

 

Cups don't go on shelves. The whole thing about a cup is you win it and retain it until somebody else wins it from you. 

 

Like in football you routinely have draws in league matches but if it's a cup you have a penalty shootout and somebody has to win it. It's in the nature of a "Cup" event. 

 

 

.

 

True.... but then sports events for championships do not end in ties either... save for these two in golf as far as I know. So either there needs to be a clear winner or no winner in my book.

[tatertot]

8 minutes ago, Dpavs said:

 

True.... but then sports events for championships do not end in ties either... save for these two in golf as far as I know. So either there needs to be a clear winner or no winner in my book.

To be the champ ... you have to beat the champ. It's that simple. Fights end in draws. 

[8602081]

48 minutes ago, ChronicSlicer said:

Haven't you been reading any of the last few pages, Europe did not win, they tied, Europe just retained the Cup so it doesn't collect dust on a shelf.

 

Europe won and deserve their win..

 

That's the advantage of being past champion.. If you tie, you keep the cup, therefore they won..  You're playing for the cup...

 

[18majors]

 

 

Say what you want about the Solheim Cup; but as an expert I'd say nothing beats Solheim Cup on poster participation in our little precious sub-forum "LPGA/Ladies Golf Talk".

 

That's alone is a good reason to keep the Solheim Cup for as long and strong as it can; Viva "the Solheim Cup"!

[ChronicSlicer]

5 minutes ago, 18majors said:

 

 

 but as an expert I'd say

Hands down post of the year 🤣🤣

[heynow]

2 hours ago, DuenPhen said:

The problem with your thought is that in Asia, a lot of inspiration for women’s golf is to prove that we too belong on the biggest stage.

 

South Korea has done more than enough to prove that they are the best nation in the world. To force them into a President’s Cup team is to tell them that no matter what they did, they are still seen as less on their own. This is the nation that in the 2000’s led Team Asia against the whole world in the Lexus Cup. This is the nation that brought record crowds for their nation in the 2018 International Crown.

 

Proposals to copy men’s President’s Cup fall to the very rationale of western superiority that we are fighting against. If there is to be a Team Asia, the opponent in my opinion must be at minimum combined USA/Europe. 
 

Else, one can do USA v Korea. I remember talks on this very forum in the mid 2010’s about how this should have happened and people speculated that the only reason the Americans refused was due to fear that it would show the truth - that they had been utterly surpassed.

 

(Alternatively, maybe match the Solheim winners with combined Thai-Aussie team - who are after all the International Crown finalists)

 

 

 

Agree 100%.   I don't know the best way to bring other countries/continents into the mix.  The whole point of my original post was just having USA vs Europe in women's golf in 2023, I feel is somewhat outdated since it originally started in 1990.  When you have the Ryder Cup for the men,  it's safe to say that it will have most (of course, not all) of the world's top golfers.    Then there's a President's Cup for the rest of the world's top men.   Don't get me wrong, I enjoy the Solheim cup,  but just wish there was some other way to bring in the rest of the world (like the President's Cup) for women's golf.   There's way too many dominant women golfers from outside the US and Europe (that's an understatement)

Edited September 25, 2023 by heynow

[freddi22cl]

2 hours ago, heynow said:

Solheim Cup is great, but I feel that it's gotten a bit antiquated. 

When it started over 30 years ago,  it was safe to assume that with the top women golfers from the US and Europe, that people would be watching pretty much all the best female players in the world (of course with a few exceptions).

In the past 10-15 or so years,  the huge rise in the quality of many many many players from the rest of the world especially the continent of Asia,  it seems that this format needs to change.  

Perhaps if there's enough interest,  maybe the the winning team from the Solheim should then play an international team (like the President's Cup team). 

Men's golf has the President's Cup.   For the ladies, an international team like the President's cup is a scary good team.   Maybe somehow this can get incorporated for the women.

 

This year's winning European team is great,  but I think we all know that a ladies team even just from the continent of Asia (we know the names) would be favored over the European or US teams.

 

i think USA is 3rd..oh my times have changed  .... i'd like The  President's Cup team Vs anyone 🙂

[Dpavs]

1 hour ago, tatertot said:

To be the champ ... you have to beat the champ. It's that simple. Fights end in draws. 

 

You are correct in this is the way it works currently, but it does not preclude my ability to have an opinion that it would be better if it were set up differently. You don't have to agree of course. 😉

Edited September 25, 2023 by Dpavs

[freddi22cl]

 

 

but i like this swing ..haha

[sergizmo]

^^^

That is an athlete. More players like Grant will draw viewers to women's golf, not players that drive it 230. 

[18majors]

 

The 2023 Junior Ryder Cup will take place three days from Tuesday Sep 26 to Thursday Sep 28; it'll be televised.  Team USA is strong on paper, it includes Gianna Clemente, Anna Davis and Yuna Wilson:

The 2023 Junior Ryder Cup

[jimecherry]

8 minutes ago, sergizmo said:

^^^

That is an athlete. More players like Grant will draw viewers to women's golf, not players that drive it 230. 

viewers wont come unless someone wins alot so your right about 230 not being the number as i dont think anyone that won this year averages that low.

[DuenPhen]

48 minutes ago, heynow said:

 

Agree 100%.   I don't know the best way to bring other countries/continents into the mix.  The whole point of my original post was just having USA vs Europe in women's golf in 2023, I feel is somewhat outdated since it originally started in 1990.  When you have the Ryder Cup for the men,  it's safe to say that it will have most (of course, not all) of the world's top golfers.    Then there's a President's Cup for the rest of the world's top men.   Don't get me wrong, I enjoy the Solheim cup,  but just wish there was some other way to bring in the rest of the world (like the President's Cup) for women's golf.   There's way too many dominant women golfers from outside the US and Europe (that's an understatement)

The solution to me right now is obvious - properly promote the International Crown. Give it the gravitas it deserve. Don't let it fall into 3-hour Golf Channel slots that leaked into Peacock. Don't let GC put cameras only on USA matches, and don't let commentators discuss it as if it's 'preparation' for Solheim.

 

To me, International Crown is Solheim+, and it is being failed (borderline sabotaged) by people who are supposed to promote it. Thank goodness that a Korean company now holds sponsorship. If there is one country that will keep the Crown alive, it's Korea.

 

Every world competition has to start somewhere. Cricket World Cup was once in the shadow of the Ashes, and now most knows its true worth even if some still holds out against it.

Edited September 25, 2023 by DuenPhen

[Pops99]

5 hours ago, Jonnyuk74 said:

I think we are, a draw is a common result in a lot of sports here, namely football and cricket. Even boxing? Think the point is the holders do just need to retain, where the challengers have to come and 'win' it back. It's all quite simples really. I'm cool with it, it's history and way it's always been. 

Probably be a lot less complaints about it next week at the RC if it's a tie and the US retains. 

[Jonnyuk74]

1 hour ago, sergizmo said:

^^^

That is an athlete. More players like Grant will draw viewers to women's golf, not players that drive it 230. 

I might be her biggest fan, I'm not sure. But I do believe she is the great hope in womens golf. She has pretty much everything going for her and more. Young girls will wanna be like her, women golfers want a swing like her and men just wanna watch her?! You get the idea 🤣 .. defo major for Linn next year. 🚀💯🇸🇪

[gioreeko]

3 hours ago, tatertot said:

To be the champ ... you have to beat the champ. It's that simple. Fights end in draws. 

only because there's no overtime in boxing

[gioreeko]

1 hour ago, Jonnyuk74 said:

I might be her biggest fan, I'm not sure. But I do believe she is the great hope in womens golf. She has pretty much everything going for her and more. Young girls will wanna be like her, women golfers want a swing like her and men just wanna watch her?! You get the idea 🤣 .. defo major for Linn next year. 🚀💯🇸🇪

so gorgeous too, Charley Hull and Grant really showing the beauty and athleticism of golfers

[gioreeko]

6 hours ago, NMBob said:

 

Kind of unwritten rule in Boxing.   You gotta knock out the champ.   That is the rules for this.   If you are the champ, its 14 points to keep the champ belt.  If you are the contender, it is 14.5.  

you don't have to "knock out" the champ. you can beat them decisively and win the title. Boxing is different in that there's no overtime, extra innings, etc. 

[ChronicSlicer]

3 hours ago, Jonnyuk74 said:

She has pretty much everything going for her and more. Young girls will wanna be like her, women golfers want a swing like her and men just wanna watch her?! 

Sounds kinda like you're describing Nelly Korda, who by the way gained a thousand IG followers(713k) shout out to @18majors 👋

[woahnelly]

4 hours ago, DuenPhen said:

The solution to me right now is obvious - properly promote the International Crown. Give it the gravitas it deserve. Don't let it fall into 3-hour Golf Channel slots that leaked into Peacock. Don't let GC put cameras only on USA matches, and don't let commentators discuss it as if it's 'preparation' for Solheim.

 

To me, International Crown is Solheim+, and it is being failed (borderline sabotaged) by people who are supposed to promote it. Thank goodness that a Korean company now holds sponsorship. If there is one country that will keep the Crown alive, it's Korea.

 

Every world competition has to start somewhere. Cricket World Cup was once in the shadow of the Ashes, and now most knows its true worth even if some still holds out against it.

 

I agree. When Korea hosted the intl crown it was like a rock concert. The US should never host it again 😂

 

I'm surprised Jeen did not tee it up on KLPGA this week, perhaps she is on Team Thailand for the Asian Games ahead ?. Can't find anything about the rosters except China is fielding their 3 best, India has Aditi + 2 teenagers. 

[DuenPhen]

38 minutes ago, woahnelly said:

 

I agree. When Korea hosted the intl crown it was like a rock concert. The US should never host it again 😂

 

I'm surprised Jeen did not tee it up on KLPGA this week, perhaps she is on Team Thailand for the Asian Games ahead ?. Can't find anything about the rosters except China is fielding their 3 best, India has Aditi + 2 teenagers. 

Bring the Crown to Thailand!

 

Jeen is defending Walmart in Arkansas this upcoming week.

 

To the Asian Games, Thailand are sending PK Kongkraphan, Eila Galitsky, and Piano Yubol.

 

Korea are sending amateurs: Minsol Kim, Jiyoo Lim, and Yeji Park.

 

And so will Japan: Saki Baba, Mizuki Hashimoto, and Mamika Shinchi.

 

The entry list: https://info.hangzhou2022.cn/en/results/golf/sport-entries.htm

Edited September 26, 2023 by DuenPhen