To cap or not to cap

[reggiehdz]

2 hours ago, smashdn said:

 

The guy who is a six should.  I suppose it is possible to be ignorant of it but would think it very unlikely he doesn't know what that number means when he plays against other golfers.

 

Just tell them, "Jim Bob, you are a six and I am a fifteen.  I get nine shots on you today.  What are you other guys so I can calculate who gets what?"  If they don't understand, teach them.  If they won't then don't bet.  The fact you should be getting nine shots should be pretty telling as to why you don't want to (and shouldn't) play straight up.  Those other guys should be getting strokes too (against the lower cap players).

The lower handicap gets it. We’ll do side games and use strokes. The other two seem to have no interest in maintaining a handicap. 
 

That’s where I feel we’re limited.

 

 

 

[GoGoErky]

1 hour ago, reggiehdz said:

The lower handicap gets it. We’ll do side games and use strokes. The other two seem to have no interest in maintaining a handicap. 
 

That’s where I feel we’re limited.

 

 

 

If they are only competing within the group and not formal comps and they play straight up all the time there really is no need to keep a handicap 

 

The group I used to play with all the time used handicap for the larger group but within the normal foursome we never used them. Now that I don’t play with them and don’t do any other competitions I stopped keeping a handicap

[Long_Left]

3 hours ago, reggiehdz said:

I’ve got some buddies outta town who do quota games. I love it. That’s what I wish I could everyone in my current group on. But I don’t want to have to track everyone’s scores and calculate indexes for em. 

The guy in the group who introduced us to this method of scoring tracks it at his home club, they have a 3" 3 ring binder and everyone has a page in it for 75+ players, they track it all by hand but the game has been going on for so long that everyone helps. I live over 1000 miles away and play in the game maybe once a year when I visit and I have my own page in their book. Most of them keep two cards, one gross score and one group points.

 

Our annual trip group is just the 4 of us so it's pretty simple to track on a google sheet but in a group of 20+ it takes some initial planning to get it right. Has the added benefit that anything over bogey is dead so it helps with pace.

[betarhoalphadelta]

4 hours ago, reggiehdz said:

The lower handicap gets it. We’ll do side games and use strokes. The other two seem to have no interest in maintaining a handicap. 
 

That’s where I feel we’re limited.

 

 

You don't need much to "maintain" a handicap at least for your group play. 

 

How do you track scores now? Paper scorecard or electronic? Do you keep the scorecards, if paper? 

 

All you need to do is to fire up a spreadsheet with scores and calculate it manually. It's not hard. Especially if you always play the same course, or if you don't necessarily care about adjusting for slope. Just keep score relative to par (instead of relative to course rating) and average the best 8 of last 20. 

 

The 6 may not be a "6" with this method and you might not be a "14" with this method, but it should be good enough relative skill adjustment for establishing strokes. 

 

If you keep them electronically, however, the apps will basically generate you a handicap over time. I maintain an official handicap and track scores through The Grint, but my buddies all play 18Birdies so when we play together, my score is ALSO being tracked via 18Birdies. This means that not every score from my "true" handicap is used for our skins game, but it's close enough for $1 skins...

[reggiehdz]

3 hours ago, betarhoalphadelta said:

 

You don't need much to "maintain" a handicap at least for your group play. 

 

How do you track scores now? Paper scorecard or electronic? Do you keep the scorecards, if paper? 

 

All you need to do is to fire up a spreadsheet with scores and calculate it manually. It's not hard. Especially if you always play the same course, or if you don't necessarily care about adjusting for slope. Just keep score relative to par (instead of relative to course rating) and average the best 8 of last 20. 

 

The 6 may not be a "6" with this method and you might not be a "14" with this method, but it should be good enough relative skill adjustment for establishing strokes. 

 

If you keep them electronically, however, the apps will basically generate you a handicap over time. I maintain an official handicap and track scores through The Grint, but my buddies all play 18Birdies so when we play together, my score is ALSO being tracked via 18Birdies. This means that not every score from my "true" handicap is used for our skins game, but it's close enough for $1 skins...

Same, I use the grint. The 6 does also so it’s easy to track his if he’s not entering them himself. 
 

they’ll keep their scores on paper. I should start snagging the scorecards at the end. Hadnt thought about doing it very post round. 

 

ideally they would have a grint account but I can’t even get the other two to do that. 

[betarhoalphadelta]

4 minutes ago, reggiehdz said:

 

ideally they would have a grint account but I can’t even get the other two to do that. 

If they're that lazy, don't bet with them.

 

Honestly all you need to do is put their email in for the grint for them for one round. Simply ask them at the end of each hole what they made and enter it yourself. They don't have to actually do ANYTHING except set up the account, and once you put in their email the first time, I believe the grint will email them and all they have to do is the basics of setting up the account.

 

If they can't even be bothered for that, don't bet. Their laziness is designed to take advantage of you, and you should view it that way.  

[bluedot]

There are groups that don't use handicaps, even if all the players in the group have indexes; typically these are called "scratch games" or something of the sort.  But the common factor(s) in such groups is that the players likely have low single digit indexes in a pretty small range, and that higher indexes simply don't play, for obvious reasons.  These games also tend to be higher dollars, often with LOTS of side bets, at least in my experience.

 

Other than games like that, I'd guess (but can't, of course, prove) that the number of regular games that don't use some form of index is very, VERY small.  Whether it's a USGA index, or the Grint, or even an index within the group itself based on past performance, the group uses something.  That's one of the many great things about golf; the handicap system can be used a number of different ways to equalize competition.

 

The more of this thread I read, the more it seems that the OP might want to seek a new group; these guys are either just lazy, or they are stroking their own egos by winning money from a less skilled player.  Either way, I think I could do without them.

[Strategery]

Trying to pressure friends into betting when they have made it clear they don't want to compete. You sound like fun.

[nsxguy]

On 2/20/2024 at 2:29 PM, reggiehdz said:

How do I go about changing my current playing group’s mind to utilize handicaps? I’m a 15 index and most the guys I play with are between 6-10. One maintains a handicap the others don’t.
 

Our games are usually low stakes($1 skins, two man $5 Nassau). They just like to play straight up. I’d like to feel like I’m competing but most times it’s more like I’m donating money.

Am I making too much of it? Should I abstain? Should I find a new group?

 

 

Better(?) late than never ?

 

So what have you done, if anything ? 

[reggiehdz]

@nsxguy
It’s been a slow start to the season for me. 
 

I’ve played with them once. No skins, we did a 2v2 best ball. No strokes.  I didn’t bring it up. For what it’s worth, my team won. 
 

I was able to add a round to my guy’s grint. So we’re 36 out of 54 holes towards a handicap, lol.

 

Edited April 26 by reggiehdz
Tag

[reggiehdz]

On 2/23/2024 at 9:14 AM, bluedot said:

There are groups that don't use handicaps, even if all the players in the group have indexes; typically these are called "scratch games" or something of the sort.  But the common factor(s) in such groups is that the players likely have low single digit indexes in a pretty small range, and that higher indexes simply don't play, for obvious reasons.  These games also tend to be higher dollars, often with LOTS of side bets, at least in my experience.

 

Other than games like that, I'd guess (but can't, of course, prove) that the number of regular games that don't use some form of index is very, VERY small.  Whether it's a USGA index, or the Grint, or even an index within the group itself based on past performance, the group uses something.  That's one of the many great things about golf; the handicap system can be used a number of different ways to equalize competition.

 

The more of this thread I read, the more it seems that the OP might want to seek a new group; these guys are either just lazy, or they are stroking their own egos by winning money from a less skilled player.  Either way, I think I could do without them.

I missed this reply but you nailed it. Thats what’s I appreciate about golf. 
 

I’ve been looking into TGA fun golf events and a city league