Phoenix Area Course Conditions - 2012

[robert horneman]

I am a member of Arrowhead CC in Glendale,AZ.
Our course is experiencing the worst summer conditions i have seen in the 26 years that I have been a member.
Two PHD type turf experts have been to the course and taken soil samples. We should have the results in a week or two.
They feel the problem is little to no oxygen in the root zone.
We had a qualifier for the USGA SENIOR OPEN here in late June. The USGA wanted the course hard and fast so our course was dried out ,the greens cut short and double rolled during 100 plus temps.
Four of our greens have large sections of just dirt! I am getting pretty good at reading dirt on my putts.
We have always had some of the best greens in the valley.
If you are in the area DO NOT play ARROWHEAD for the forseeable future. Hopefully they will get it fixed and our course will be playable again.

[One_Putt_Blunder]

Sad to see Arrowhead go downhill. It was in great shape a couple years ago when I first played it in the Friday skins game. Each time since then there seemed to be a new issue every time I played although one was when the vandals got the greens

[silentcmh]

Anyone played Dino Mtn lately? Going there a week from Sunday.

[fore_life]

Playing Papago Monday with jay4, will post feedback though it looks lush fro an airplane haha

[CJ Hanson]

[quote name='silentcmh' timestamp='1341603913' post='5228070']
Anyone played Dino Mtn lately? Going there a week from Sunday.
[/quote]

Played there about two weeks ago. Course was in nice shape. Bring water though. They have no water on the course and they charge $2.50/bottle (for a 12 oz bottle). Definitely worth the trip out there.

[silentcmh]

Dobson Ranch was pretty banged up today. It's usually in good condition even in the dead of summer but it was looking rough. The greens are spongy and bumpy. The fairways are a mix of swampland, dead hardpan and lush grass, often within the same fairway. Most bunkers were very firm and lacking a sand.

[silentcmh]

[quote name='CJ Hanson' timestamp='1341635876' post='5231032']
[quote name='silentcmh' timestamp='1341603913' post='5228070']
Anyone played Dino Mtn lately? Going there a week from Sunday.
[/quote]

Played there about two weeks ago. Course was in nice shape. Bring water though. They have no water on the course and they charge $2.50/bottle (for a 12 oz bottle). Definitely worth the trip out there.
[/quote]

Yeah, definitely planning to bring water. At least the course was upfront with us about the water situation. They don't seem like they try to hide it at all. Were there coolers on the carts with ice? And is there anyway at all to re-wet my towels throughout the round, like a bathroom sink or anything?

[fore_life]

If I remember correctly, they don't have coolers, and only one restroom per side

[wcb231]

My buddy and I have been making the Padre course at Camelback a regular spot for us every weekend. We've been able to get on for $20. Fairways are as green as you can ask for at this time of the year. Greens rolling pretty decent and receptive to your iron shots. We played our first round there three weeks ago and we're going back once a weekend now.

[fore_life]

[quote name='wcb231' timestamp='1341685943' post='5232906']
My buddy and I have been making the Padre course at Camelback a regular spot for us every weekend. We've been able to get on for $20. Fairways are as green as you can ask for at this time of the year. Greens rolling pretty decent and receptive to your iron shots. We played our first round there three weeks ago and we're going back once a weekend now.
[/quote]

Good to know, I use to play there all of the time, but haven't been there for about 1 or 2 years. Need to get back out there, always liked the layout

[One_Putt_Blunder]

[quote name='fore_life' timestamp='1341686087' post='5232912']
[quote name='wcb231' timestamp='1341685943' post='5232906']
My buddy and I have been making the Padre course at Camelback a regular spot for us every weekend. We've been able to get on for $20. Fairways are as green as you can ask for at this time of the year. Greens rolling pretty decent and receptive to your iron shots. We played our first round there three weeks ago and we're going back once a weekend now.
[/quote]

Good to know, I use to play there all of the time, but haven't been there for about 1 or 2 years. Need to get back out there, always liked the layout
[/quote]
you have put up some solid scores there too. If you come up this way for a round let me know while I cant play maybe I can head down that way for a beer.

[CJ Hanson]

[quote name='silentcmh' timestamp='1341644044' post='5231312']
[quote name='CJ Hanson' timestamp='1341635876' post='5231032']
[quote name='silentcmh' timestamp='1341603913' post='5228070']
Anyone played Dino Mtn lately? Going there a week from Sunday.
[/quote]

Played there about two weeks ago. Course was in nice shape. Bring water though. They have no water on the course and they charge $2.50/bottle (for a 12 oz bottle). Definitely worth the trip out there.
[/quote]

Yeah, definitely planning to bring water. At least the course was upfront with us about the water situation. They don't seem like they try to hide it at all. Were there coolers on the carts with ice? And is there anyway at all to re-wet my towels throughout the round, like a bathroom sink or anything?
[/quote]

There is a snack bar/bathroom that you drive by after #5 and #10 where you can wet your towel. I'm pretty sure they have coolers on their carts now because I bought four waters and I know they were cold when I drank from them.

[Clueless]

I have been reading this thread with interest. Golf in AZ will never be as conditioned as pre- recession moving forward. Even during the prime season. The economies of scale dictate less overseed per acre and less bunker and green maintenance. Out of towners foot the bill and don't complain about conditions as there is snow back home and they are just happy to be outside in a pair of shorts and a beer. I have heard rumors of some course closures all together in the summer moving forward by some pretty big names. Phoenix is overbuilt and will need some fallout (course closures) and price increases to better course conditions. Locals continue to bargain hunt, then complain about conditions LMAO .

[silentcmh]

[quote name='Clueless' timestamp='1341723699' post='5235708']
I have been reading this thread with interest. Golf in AZ will never be as conditioned as pre- recession moving forward. Even during the prime season. The economies of scale dictate less overseed per acre and less bunker and green maintenance. Out of towners foot the bill and don't complain about conditions as there is snow back home and they are just happy to be outside in a pair of shorts and a beer. I have heard rumors of some course closures all together in the summer moving forward by some pretty big names. Phoenix is overbuilt and will need some fallout (course closures) and price increases to better course conditions. Locals continue to bargain hunt, then complain about conditions LMAO .
[/quote]

Thanks for enlightening us, Clueless. You've truly earned your name.

Nothing you said there is news to anyone. In the past few years we've already been seeing courses close for the summer or only open for 4-5 days a week or staying open every day but not letting people tee off past noon or so.

And who's complaining? If a course is in rough shape in the middle of July in the desert, none of us regular commenters complain but we do share the info with others. That's what this thread is for. If a course is in very bad shape and we say it's in very bad shape, that's not complaining. That's putting this thread to good use.

When I ask how a course is in July, I'm not expecting anyone to tell me a course is lush and pristine. But if a place is a dump with punched fairways and burnt turf for greens, I will spend my money on bargain green fees at another course that is in at least average condition.

If someone came here and said "I can't believe the muni I paid $15 to play in August isn't perfect," then that would be complaining. I haven't seen anything like that on here.

But you just keep LMAOing to yourself and thinking you're clever.

[teejaywhy]

Personally, I think the standard of expectation for a course to have a consistent GREEN color is not just unreasonable, but is in fact detrimental to the game. The typical result of green is SOFT, and soft conditions detract from playability, in fact, force a singular method of play.

Not to say that truly poor conditioning can't detract from the enjoyment of a round, but seriously, some of these reviews are borderline wuss.

Give me a firm/fast course with brown patches anyday over an overwatered slog. Southern Dunes with no grass at all would be a better play than 80% of the courses in PHX.

[One_Putt_Blunder]

Man I miss the days when Southern Dunes and Vista Verde did not overseed for the winter. That was some enjoyable golf and really the way Southern Dunes should be kept. IMO that course plays much better firm and fast not lush and slow.

[Clueless]

[quote name='teejaywhy' timestamp='1341782081' post='5238332']
Personally, I think the standard of expectation for a course to have a consistent GREEN color is not just unreasonable, but is in fact detrimental to the game. The typical result of green is SOFT, and soft conditions detract from playability, in fact, force a singular method of play.

Not to say that truly poor conditioning can't detract from the enjoyment of a round, but seriously, some of these reviews are borderline wuss.

Give me a firm/fast course with brown patches anyday over an overwatered slog. Southern Dunes with no grass at all would be a better play than 80% of the courses in PHX.
[/quote]

Couldn't agree more.

[FallingUp]

[quote name='wcb231' timestamp='1341685943' post='5232906']
My buddy and I have been making the Padre course at Camelback a regular spot for us every weekend. We've been able to get on for $20. Fairways are as green as you can ask for at this time of the year. Greens rolling pretty decent and receptive to your iron shots. We played our first round there three weeks ago and we're going back once a weekend now.
[/quote]

Ive been playing there before work just about every Friday. I enjoy the Padre course. I played the Indian Bend course the day before it closed for renovation, it was in awful shape!

I played ASU twice last week, as usual it was in very good shape.

[fore_life]

Anyone want to play camelback next wed or thur morning?

[moxie]

[quote name='teejaywhy' timestamp='1341782081' post='5238332']
Personally, I think the standard of expectation for a course to have a consistent GREEN color is not just unreasonable, but is in fact detrimental to the game. The typical result of green is SOFT, and soft conditions detract from playability, in fact, force a singular method of play.

Not to say that truly poor conditioning can't detract from the enjoyment of a round, but seriously, some of these reviews are borderline wuss.

Give me a firm/fast course with brown patches anyday over an overwatered slog. Southern Dunes with no grass at all would be a better play than 80% of the courses in PHX.
[/quote]

Who said anything about wanting an overwatered slog? While I haven't been playing long I love playing when things get hard and fast, it requires very good shot making which is almost impossible for me most days but still a fun challenge..
If I am paying $40 to play a course in June/July and the Pro Shop is warning me about the conditioning I am going to make a note of it, and mention it here, especially if it affects playability.
I guess my expectations for my money are out of line? Any other courses I should shy away from posting conditioning facts about?

[b]ASU Karsten [/b]- 7/6/2012 - $20
Course was in good shape, though we only got to finish 15 holes. Who closes a golf course at 7pm in Arizona Summer Madness?
I have heard Karsten can be love/hate, and for whatever reason I loved the place. Would definitely play again.

[fore_life]

Played Papago today, continues to be one ofthe best values in the phx area. Fairways are fantastic, greens have come in nicely as well. One more good solid mowing and they should be back to usual.

[fore_life]

Moxie, golfnow shows an aeratio alert at karsten, are the greens punched?

Also, morning times at camelbak are 39, seems a little pricey, Papago was 26 at 740. It's my last round I can play this month, saw ocotillo has 49/unlimited golf, anyone been out there?

[silentcmh]

[quote]
[b]ASU Karsten [/b]- 7/6/2012 - $20
Course was in good shape, though we only got to finish 15 holes. Who closes a golf course at 7pm in Arizona Summer Madness?
I have heard Karsten can be love/hate, and for whatever reason I loved the place. Would definitely play again.
[/quote]

I know of at least several courses that make people come in by a certain time or don't let people tee off after a certain time. It's just a summertime cost-cutting measure. Why keep the lights on and several people on staff for a group or two on the course? The course is losing money by doing that.

I used to work at a few courses in town and you realize how useless it is to keep the buildings open and staff on because there are literally less than four people on the course during the last couple hours of the day.

[moxie]

The greens were alright, they were holding long shots very well. They didn't add any strokes for me but they weren't super smooth.
I think they might have started punching today from a few places I checked. Which is a bummer cause I enjoyed playing there, shame to have to wait a few weeks

I have always wanted to play Papago, I will have to see if I can make it up there soon.

[moxie]

[quote name='silentcmh' timestamp='1341872992' post='5245538'] [quote] [b]ASU Karsten [/b]- 7/6/2012 - $20 Course was in good shape, though we only got to finish 15 holes. Who closes a golf course at 7pm in Arizona Summer Madness? I have heard Karsten can be love/hate, and for whatever reason I loved the place. Would definitely play again. [/quote] I know of at least several courses that make people come in by a certain time or don't let people tee off after a certain time. It's just a summertime cost-cutting measure. Why keep the lights on and several people on staff for a group or two on the course? The course is losing money by doing that. I used to work at a few courses in town and you realize how useless it is to keep the buildings open and staff on because there are literally less than four people on the course during the last couple hours of the day. [/quote]

I definitely understand, I'm just complaining in fun. I play my best golf in the afternoon, and I have to work until 4 on weekdays, Makes it hard to squeeze in a foursome. And the guy picking up the flags said we could squeeze in another hole, which was nice. We actually had two fours in front of us and one behind, so a pretty full afternoon.
One of the many reasons I love Kokopelli though, they don't seem to expect me back until 30 minutes after sunset. Haha.

[fore_life]

trying to figure out where to play on thursday, maybe wekopa, maybe dino mountain? both are $45, Im thinking maybe just wekopa as I enjoy the layout much better.

[teejaywhy]

I think you should play Arizona Grand Mark. It's real cheap, in fact, I think they will pay you to play it. And I've heard they have the best driving range in town.

[fore_life]

Haha funny you mention that! My buddy jade offered to pay for me to play there with him and I still had to pass.

[moxie]

[quote name='teejaywhy' timestamp='1341926831' post='5248798']
I think you should play Arizona Grand Mark. It's real cheap, in fact, I think they will pay you to play it. And I've heard they have the best driving range in town.
[/quote]

But how are the conditions? I don't want ANY brown spots, even if they are paying me.

[ricar1610]

Anyone played Wigwam Gold recently? LIke in in the last few days/weeks? Playing there Tuesday in a tourney and was wondering about the greens - have played there a million times but not this year. Thanks!