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Fighting Gravity and THE Club Weight

BB28403BB28403 Advanced Members Posts: 2,723 ✭✭
Do you guys think players fight gravity and the weight that is inside the club? And perhaps better players know how to use the THE club weight with gravity and the natural way the club wants to fall.



Are a lot of players losing energy in the swing because they go against the natural downward path the clubhead and weight want to travel?



Would love to hear your thoughts on the subject.
«13456

Comments

  • iteachgolfiteachgolf Advanced Members Posts: 16,488 ✭✭
    If the club just fell from gravity, it’d never get to the ball and would be traveling extremely slowly. Gravity has a negligible affect and has been discussed plenty. To get the club to shallow players are actually applying a force on the handle in opposite direction of gravity. The golfer is the one who applies the force that makes the club move.
  • Hilts1969Hilts1969 Advanced Members Posts: 1,000 ✭✭
    Not really the club is far too light to be concerned by gravity. I have tried the gravity thing and it didn’t work but saying that I have tried everything.
  • Boris2016Boris2016 Banned Posts: 38
    iteachgolf wrote:


    If the club just fell from gravity, it'd never get to the ball and would be traveling extremely slowly. Gravity has a negligible affect and has been discussed plenty. To get the club to shallow players are actually applying a force on the handle in opposite direction of gravity. The golfer is the one who applies the force that makes the club move.




    Wow, what an inspirational post. Of course, if the club just fell from gravity it would never get to the ball.....how could it!



    Hilarious!
  • iteachgolfiteachgolf Advanced Members Posts: 16,488 ✭✭
    Boris2016 wrote:

    iteachgolf wrote:


    If the club just fell from gravity, it'd never get to the ball and would be traveling extremely slowly. Gravity has a negligible affect and has been discussed plenty. To get the club to shallow players are actually applying a force on the handle in opposite direction of gravity. The golfer is the one who applies the force that makes the club move.




    Wow, what an inspirational post. Of course, if the club just fell from gravity it would never get to the ball.....how could it!



    Hilarious!




    Go read other threads and that’s not obvious to many. Gravity has a negligible affect on the club and shouldn’t even be given a second thought
  • Boris2016Boris2016 Banned Posts: 38
    iteachgolf wrote:

    Boris2016 wrote:

    iteachgolf wrote:


    If the club just fell from gravity, it'd never get to the ball and would be traveling extremely slowly. Gravity has a negligible affect and has been discussed plenty. To get the club to shallow players are actually applying a force on the handle in opposite direction of gravity. The golfer is the one who applies the force that makes the club move.




    Wow, what an inspirational post. Of course, if the club just fell from gravity it would never get to the ball.....how could it!



    Hilarious!




    Go read other threads and that's not obvious to many. Gravity has a negligible affect on the club and shouldn't even be given a second thought




    Well, thank you so much for the clarification. There is enough to think about , who the heck is thinking about Gravity?



    Some of the posters here, how the **** do they even procreate. If they made it as complicated as the golf swing, foreplay would take 5 hours. And then of course, we have to consider "Gravity"



    Hilarious dude, this is all hilarious.



    Anyway, I can't thank you enough for all this wisdom about "Gravity".
  • iteachgolfiteachgolf Advanced Members Posts: 16,488 ✭✭
    Boris2016 wrote:

    iteachgolf wrote:

    Boris2016 wrote:

    iteachgolf wrote:


    If the club just fell from gravity, it'd never get to the ball and would be traveling extremely slowly. Gravity has a negligible affect and has been discussed plenty. To get the club to shallow players are actually applying a force on the handle in opposite direction of gravity. The golfer is the one who applies the force that makes the club move.




    Wow, what an inspirational post. Of course, if the club just fell from gravity it would never get to the ball.....how could it!



    Hilarious!




    Go read other threads and that's not obvious to many. Gravity has a negligible affect on the club and shouldn't even be given a second thought




    Well, thank you so much for the clarification. There is enough to think about , who the heck is thinking about Gravity?



    Some of the posters here, how the **** do they even procreate. If they made it as complicated as the golf swing, foreplay would take 5 hours. And then of course, we have to consider "Gravity"



    Hilarious dude, this is all hilarious.



    Anyway, I can't thank you enough for all this wisdom about "Gravity".




    Don’t wanna read about it then don’t. Plenty of people obviously think about it and guys like Malaska babble on about it and spread misinformation. Thanks for your wonderful contribution though
  • sdandreasdandrea Steve Advanced Members Posts: 2,316 ✭✭
    Just hit the ball, go find it and hit it again. Enjoy the game.
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  • JagpilotohioJagpilotohio 45+ inch drivers are evil. Advanced Members Posts: 7,051 ✭✭
    LOL. 10 pm in Berlin. Maybe some adult beverages have been consumed before posting.
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  • Boris2016Boris2016 Banned Posts: 38
    iteachgolf wrote:

    Boris2016 wrote:

    iteachgolf wrote:

    Boris2016 wrote:

    iteachgolf wrote:


    If the club just fell from gravity, it'd never get to the ball and would be traveling extremely slowly. Gravity has a negligible affect and has been discussed plenty. To get the club to shallow players are actually applying a force on the handle in opposite direction of gravity. The golfer is the one who applies the force that makes the club move.




    Wow, what an inspirational post. Of course, if the club just fell from gravity it would never get to the ball.....how could it!



    Hilarious!




    Go read other threads and that's not obvious to many. Gravity has a negligible affect on the club and shouldn't even be given a second thought




    Well, thank you so much for the clarification. There is enough to think about , who the heck is thinking about Gravity?



    Some of the posters here, how the **** do they even procreate. If they made it as complicated as the golf swing, foreplay would take 5 hours. And then of course, we have to consider "Gravity"



    Hilarious dude, this is all hilarious.



    Anyway, I can't thank you enough for all this wisdom about "Gravity".




    Don't wanna read about it then don't. Plenty of people obviously think about it and guys like Malaska babble on about it and spread misinformation. Thanks for your wonderful contribution though






    Plenty of people think about Gravity? LOL! Dude, I gotta change my panties, I am laughing so hard.



    I have yet to play with anyone who ever mentioned gravity, or even remotely hinted at it. And play well over 100 rounds a year. So plenty of people? How many is plenty in your world?



    Have had dozens of lessons, never heard any reference to "Gravity". Played in college and high school, no mention of "Gravity". Where have I been? How could I possibly have played all these years and never considered "Gravity"



    The day I here someone comment on gravity and their golf swing, I will surely let you know. Chances are that climate change will have set in, and all the coastal cities will have been evacuated from the surging water.



    Funny, the way you say another instructor is "bablbing". Real professional.



    Well, God bless you my firend, and may the forces of gravity be well for you~.
  • SocratesSocrates How can it be so *&#% hard to make a shoulder turn? WinnipegAdvanced Members Posts: 9,046 ✭✭
    Boris2016 wrote:

    iteachgolf wrote:

    Boris2016 wrote:

    iteachgolf wrote:


    If the club just fell from gravity, it'd never get to the ball and would be traveling extremely slowly. Gravity has a negligible affect and has been discussed plenty. To get the club to shallow players are actually applying a force on the handle in opposite direction of gravity. The golfer is the one who applies the force that makes the club move.




    Wow, what an inspirational post. Of course, if the club just fell from gravity it would never get to the ball.....how could it!



    Hilarious!




    Go read other threads and that's not obvious to many. Gravity has a negligible affect on the club and shouldn't even be given a second thought




    Well, thank you so much for the clarification. There is enough to think about , who the heck is thinking about Gravity?



    Some of the posters here, how the **** do they even procreate. If they made it as complicated as the golf swing, foreplay would take 5 hours. And then of course, we have to consider "Gravity"




    You should search the phrase "tantric ****" but not in this forum.

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  • Man_O_WarMan_O_War Advanced Members Posts: 2,663 ✭✭
    not so much gravity but the better players know how to swing a club with weight at the end of it. Weight that gets thrown around during the swing, gets dynamically heavy with speed to compress a ball.

    they know to stay ahead of the weight in the circle.....some better players also let the club fall freely from the top..they call that using gravity...free fall, then use rotation to sling in through. It's simply complicated
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  • BB28403BB28403 Advanced Members Posts: 2,723 ✭✭
    Ok now that a few have replied , here is the video that made me think of it. Watch it and still think about what he is saying and my original question.



    [URL]
  • GautamaGautama Advanced Members Posts: 746 ✭✭
    Boris2016 wrote:






    Plenty of people think about Gravity? LOL! Dude, I gotta change my panties, I am laughing so hard.



    I have yet to play with anyone who ever mentioned gravity, or even remotely hinted at it. And play well over 100 rounds a year. So plenty of people? How many is plenty in your world?



    Have had dozens of lessons, never heard any reference to "Gravity". Played in college and high school, no mention of "Gravity". Where have I been? How could I possibly have played all these years and never considered "Gravity"



    The day I here someone comment on gravity and their golf swing, I will surely let you know. Chances are that climate change will have set in, and all the coastal cities will have been evacuated from the surging water.



    Funny, the way you say another instructor is "bablbing". Real professional.



    Well, God bless you my firend, and may the forces of gravity be well for you~.




    http://www.golfwrx.com/forums/topic/1695230-letting-gravity-drop-the-club-is-the-best-advice/



    One of many. Take it you're new to the site, lol.
    "I see the distorted swings, the hurried rounds, and now the electric carts tae ruin the course and rob us of our exercise...we have gone off the mark, gone after the wrong things, forgotten what it's all about"

    -Dr. Julian Sands, Golf in the Kingdom
  • Boris2016Boris2016 Banned Posts: 38
    Gautama wrote:

    Boris2016 wrote:


    Plenty of people think about Gravity? LOL! Dude, I gotta change my panties, I am laughing so hard.



    I have yet to play with anyone who ever mentioned gravity, or even remotely hinted at it. And play well over 100 rounds a year. So plenty of people? How many is plenty in your world?



    Have had dozens of lessons, never heard any reference to "Gravity". Played in college and high school, no mention of "Gravity". Where have I been? How could I possibly have played all these years and never considered "Gravity"



    The day I here someone comment on gravity and their golf swing, I will surely let you know. Chances are that climate change will have set in, and all the coastal cities will have been evacuated from the surging water.



    Funny, the way you say another instructor is "bablbing". Real professional.



    Well, God bless you my firend, and may the forces of gravity be well for you~.




    http://www.golfwrx.c...he-best-advice/



    One of many. Take it you're new to the site, lol.




    One of many??? Maybe in your imagniary world. Played golf for many years all over the world. Played venues that some of you hourly workers only dream about. Never heard anyone talk about gravity. This is hilarious, utterly hilarious. Gravity is there, it is present with everything we do, but no one ever brings it up. When I take a ****, the brown masterpiece goes down the drain. Why? Because of gravity, otherwise it might fly in the air and end up in my left nostril.. It just happens, I do not say "wow, that gravity saved me from getting a load of **** up my nose".



    There is enough to think about when playing golf. No rational person ponders "gravity".



    Some of you are so obsessed with every detail of the golf swing. Do you worry about how the angle of your left **** in relation to your left semeniferous tubule deviates as you go from backswing to transition.? This is probably something some of you really worry about, and are very happy to part with a hundred to get answers to. There are quite a few gurus out here that will be all to happy to take your cash, and focus on all your concerns with regards to your left ****.

    .



    Thanks for this comedy relief. The gravity of all this is truly breathtaking.
  • GautamaGautama Advanced Members Posts: 746 ✭✭
    Boris2016 wrote:

    Gautama wrote:

    Boris2016 wrote:


    Plenty of people think about Gravity? LOL! Dude, I gotta change my panties, I am laughing so hard.



    I have yet to play with anyone who ever mentioned gravity, or even remotely hinted at it. And play well over 100 rounds a year. So plenty of people? How many is plenty in your world?



    Have had dozens of lessons, never heard any reference to "Gravity". Played in college and high school, no mention of "Gravity". Where have I been? How could I possibly have played all these years and never considered "Gravity"



    The day I here someone comment on gravity and their golf swing, I will surely let you know. Chances are that climate change will have set in, and all the coastal cities will have been evacuated from the surging water.



    Funny, the way you say another instructor is "bablbing". Real professional.



    Well, God bless you my firend, and may the forces of gravity be well for you~.




    [url="http://www.golfwrx.com/forums/topic/1695230-letting-gravity-drop-the-club-is-the-best-advice/"]http://www.golfwrx.c...he-best-advice/[/url]



    One of many. Take it you're new to the site, lol.




    One of many??? Maybe in your imagniary world. Played golf for many years all over the world. Played venues that some of you hourly workers only dream about. Never heard anyone talk about gravity. This is hilarious, utterly hilarious. Gravity is there, it is present with everything we do, but no one ever brings it up. When I take a ****, the brown masterpiece goes down the drain. Why? Because of gravity, otherwise it might fly in the air and end up in my left nostril.. It just happens, I do not say "wow, that gravity saved me from getting a load of **** up my nose".



    There is enough to think about when playing golf. No rational person ponders "gravity".



    Some of you are so obsessed with every detail of the golf swing. Do you worry about how the angle of your left **** in relation to your left semeniferous tubule deviates as you go from backswing to transition.? This is probably something some of you really worry about, and are very happy to part with a hundred to get answers to. There are quite a few gurus out here that will be all to happy to take your cash, and focus on all your concerns with regards to your left ****.

    .



    Thanks for this comedy relief. The gravity of all this is truly breathtaking.




    Never said I personally gave gravity any thought there Boris, only shared one of many threads you'll find where people do, because you seemed so certain no one had ever brought it up before. And iteach's point was that they should not give gravity any thought, so I'm not clear what you're reacting to really. You're arguing with no one at all here pal.
    "I see the distorted swings, the hurried rounds, and now the electric carts tae ruin the course and rob us of our exercise...we have gone off the mark, gone after the wrong things, forgotten what it's all about"

    -Dr. Julian Sands, Golf in the Kingdom
  • Boris2016Boris2016 Banned Posts: 38
    Gautama wrote:

    Boris2016 wrote:

    Gautama wrote:

    Boris2016 wrote:


    Plenty of people think about Gravity? LOL! Dude, I gotta change my panties, I am laughing so hard.



    I have yet to play with anyone who ever mentioned gravity, or even remotely hinted at it. And play well over 100 rounds a year. So plenty of people? How many is plenty in your world?



    Have had dozens of lessons, never heard any reference to "Gravity". Played in college and high school, no mention of "Gravity". Where have I been? How could I possibly have played all these years and never considered "Gravity"



    The day I here someone comment on gravity and their golf swing, I will surely let you know. Chances are that climate change will have set in, and all the coastal cities will have been evacuated from the surging water.



    Funny, the way you say another instructor is "bablbing". Real professional.



    Well, God bless you my firend, and may the forces of gravity be well for you~.




    http://www.golfwrx.c...he-best-advice/



    One of many. Take it you're new to the site, lol.




    One of many??? Maybe in your imagniary world. Played golf for many years all over the world. Played venues that some of you hourly workers only dream about. Never heard anyone talk about gravity. This is hilarious, utterly hilarious. Gravity is there, it is present with everything we do, but no one ever brings it up. When I take a ****, the brown masterpiece goes down the drain. Why? Because of gravity, otherwise it might fly in the air and end up in my left nostril.. It just happens, I do not say "wow, that gravity saved me from getting a load of **** up my nose".



    There is enough to think about when playing golf. No rational person ponders "gravity".



    Some of you are so obsessed with every detail of the golf swing. Do you worry about how the angle of your left **** in relation to your left semeniferous tubule deviates as you go from backswing to transition.? This is probably something some of you really worry about, and are very happy to part with a hundred to get answers to. There are quite a few gurus out here that will be all to happy to take your cash, and focus on all your concerns with regards to your left ****.

    .



    Thanks for this comedy relief. The gravity of all this is truly breathtaking.




    Never said I personally gave gravity any thought there Boris, only shared one of many threads you'll find where people do, because you seemed so certain no one had ever brought it up before. And iteach's point was that they should not give gravity any thought, so I'm not clear what you're reacting to really. You're arguing with no one at all here pal.




    Dude, I am not here to argue for hours with you about gravity. If this is something that is important to you, and something that you ponder for hours on end, good for you. It is a harmless activity. I wish you well in your journey, May God bless you, I wish you all the best.
  • glkglk send it in jerome Advanced Members Posts: 3,231 ✭✭
    And as a man of his word, boris2016 will not be arguing gravity or anything else for hours on golfwrx.
  • sdandreasdandrea Steve Advanced Members Posts: 2,316 ✭✭
    Gravity is a b****. The older I get, the more I hate her.
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  • GautamaGautama Advanced Members Posts: 746 ✭✭
    glk wrote:


    And as a man of his word, boris2016 will not be arguing gravity or anything else for hours on golfwrx.




    image/laugh.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':lol:' />



    Indeed...apparently he subscribes to the illiterate lunatic school of trolling. Love those.
    "I see the distorted swings, the hurried rounds, and now the electric carts tae ruin the course and rob us of our exercise...we have gone off the mark, gone after the wrong things, forgotten what it's all about"

    -Dr. Julian Sands, Golf in the Kingdom
  • jolajola Advanced Members Posts: 401 ✭✭
    This is great entertainment .What a thread.
  • hurley999shurley999s Members Posts: 98 ✭✭
    Thread summary:



    - what’s everyone think about letting gravity control the swing?

    - nonsense, it’s been covered before

    - ha! Who thinks this? Just swing!

    - it’s actually been discussed a lot before. Many posts. It’s been debunked.

    - ha! I’ve never heard such rubbish from any playing partners on any continent!

    - nobody is saying it’s correct, just that the question gets brought up a good amount

    - ha! I shall have you horse whipped! I’ve never heard this before! I will not debate further!

    - ???



    ...and here we are!
  • BB28403BB28403 Advanced Members Posts: 2,723 ✭✭
    Did anyone watch the video? Lol
  • hurley999shurley999s Members Posts: 98 ✭✭
    I watched 5 minutes...couple thoughts. First, in the first few minutes he’s talking about momentum. Most of the discussion here about gravity is in reference to previous posts about gravity/arms falling from the top. So different nuances. Second, the part about the club falling around 4 mins, yeah that’s correct if you’re holding the handle in a static pose, but the point is, the person exerts much more meaningful force on the club. Sure things can be more or less efficient depending on what the person is trying to do with the club.



    Bottom line, I don’t even know where I’m going with this but I think definitions need to be clear about what specifically is being referenced (gravity, momentum, etc) and at what point in the swing, etc otherwise it lends itself to the confusion seen in this thread.
  • Timbo929Timbo929 Advanced Members Posts: 338 ✭✭
    hurley999s wrote:


    Thread summary:



    - what’s everyone think about letting gravity control the swing?

    - nonsense, it’s been covered before

    - ha! Who thinks this? Just swing!

    - it’s actually been discussed a lot before. Many posts. It’s been debunked.

    - ha! I’ve never heard such rubbish from any playing partners on any continent!

    - nobody is saying it’s correct, just that the question gets brought up a good amount

    - ha! I shall have you horse whipped! I’ve never heard this before! I will not debate further!

    - ???



    ...and here we are!


    LOL!



    I heard the voice of Morgan Freeman when I read “... and here we are”.
  • PorscheFanPorscheFan Advanced Members Posts: 1,149 ✭✭
    edited March 11
    BB28403 wrote:


    Did anyone watch the video? Lol




    I did. I really do think it's more about efficiently building force and using momentum vs. the 'g' word, which always seems to take things in mysterious directions. We should all make a pact not to use it. iTeach said it best on that one...



    So, yes, building forces smoothly and getting speed and the right part of the swing - all good.

    Not fighting yourself or the forces you've already generated in the swing - all good.



    That said the golf swing is about generating forces in opposite directions at different times (backswing, downswing, throughswing)… You build energy and speed in the downswing and then (as iTeach said) have to apply a net force to the handle in the opposite direction otherwise the club would just drive into the ground. So, you deliberately create different forces in different directions, but it also makes sense that you build those in the most efficient way possible. It's those seemingly contradictory ideas that seem to make some people go looney tunes...



    That g-word, though... It's like feeding gremlins after midnight.
  • spoonek9spoonek9 Advanced Members Posts: 467
    iteachgolf wrote:


    If the club just fell from gravity, it'd never get to the ball and would be traveling extremely slowly. Gravity has a negligible affect and has been discussed plenty. To get the club to shallow players are actually applying a force on the handle in opposite direction of gravity. The golfer is the one who applies the force that makes the club move.




    I just don't get how you can use the term gravity in your description but say it has little to do in the swing.



    Gravity is a force.
  • juststevejuststeve Advanced Members Posts: 4,661 ✭✭
    edited March 11
    Perhaps the best thing to say about the role of gravity in the golf swings is that its a matter on which reasonable minds can differ. People like Malaska, Flick, Clements and David Lee think gravity plays an important role in the swing. One of the esteemed teachers on this site think gravity is a negligible factor. Neither point of view should be dismissed out of hand. None of those folks should be accused of babbling and spreading false information. The first step to profound ignorance is to convince yourself that you know more than you do.



    Steve
  • spoonek9spoonek9 Advanced Members Posts: 467
    juststeve wrote:


    Perhaps the best thing to say about the role of gravity in the golf swings is that its a matter on which reasonable minds can differ. People like Malaska, Flick, Clements and David Lee think gravity plays an important role in the swing. One of the esteemed teachers on this site think gravity is a negligible factor. Neither point of view should be dismissed out of hand. None of those folks should be accused of babbling and spreading false information. The first step to profound ignorance is to convince yourself that you know more than you do.



    Steve




    Agree
  • jslane57jslane57 Advanced Members Posts: 3,929
    I’m enjoying this discussion. I think gravity is a fine thing to think about when swinging. Why? The smoothest and most balanced swings seem to at least begin at the same rate that gravity would start the swing. Swinging too fast or too slow is something people can see. What are you seeing? A natural speed of things, and gravity may be that guide. Of course there are lots of things as well like leverage, timing, and force...
  • chigolfer1chigolfer1 Advanced Members Posts: 759 ✭✭
    Boris2016 wrote:

    Gautama wrote:

    Boris2016 wrote:


    Plenty of people think about Gravity? LOL! Dude, I gotta change my panties, I am laughing so hard.



    I have yet to play with anyone who ever mentioned gravity, or even remotely hinted at it. And play well over 100 rounds a year. So plenty of people? How many is plenty in your world?



    Have had dozens of lessons, never heard any reference to "Gravity". Played in college and high school, no mention of "Gravity". Where have I been? How could I possibly have played all these years and never considered "Gravity"



    The day I here someone comment on gravity and their golf swing, I will surely let you know. Chances are that climate change will have set in, and all the coastal cities will have been evacuated from the surging water.



    Funny, the way you say another instructor is "bablbing". Real professional.



    Well, God bless you my firend, and may the forces of gravity be well for you~.




    http://www.golfwrx.c...he-best-advice/



    One of many. Take it you're new to the site, lol.




    One of many??? Maybe in your imagniary world. Played golf for many years all over the world. Played venues that some of you hourly workers only dream about. Never heard anyone talk about gravity. This is hilarious, utterly hilarious. Gravity is there, it is present with everything we do, but no one ever brings it up. When I take a ****, the brown masterpiece goes down the drain. Why? Because of gravity, otherwise it might fly in the air and end up in my left nostril.. It just happens, I do not say "wow, that gravity saved me from getting a load of **** up my nose".



    There is enough to think about when playing golf. No rational person ponders "gravity".



    Some of you are so obsessed with every detail of the golf swing. Do you worry about how the angle of your left **** in relation to your left semeniferous tubule deviates as you go from backswing to transition.? This is probably something some of you really worry about, and are very happy to part with a hundred to get answers to. There are quite a few gurus out here that will be all to happy to take your cash, and focus on all your concerns with regards to your left ****.

    .



    Thanks for this comedy relief. The gravity of all this is truly breathtaking.




    Not sure if you're for real or not. I'd say about 90% of the things we talk about on this instruction forum I have never discussed once in real life with playing partners.
  • dj*dj* Members Posts: 71 ✭✭
    juststeve wrote:


    Perhaps the best thing to say about the role of gravity in the golf swings is that its a matter on which reasonable minds can differ. People like Malaska, Flick, Clements and David Lee think gravity plays an important role in the swing. One of the esteemed teachers on this site think gravity is a negligible factor. Neither point of view should be dismissed out of hand. None of those folks should be accused of babbling and spreading false information. The first step to profound ignorance is to convince yourself that you know more than you do.



    Steve




    Agree, the babbling knock on Malaska was uncalled for but not totally unexpected as some instructors denigrate others perhaps in an attempt to quiet their own sense of insecurity.
  • dj*dj* Members Posts: 71 ✭✭
    Gravity, or the free drop limiting hitting from the top, is the admission price for dropping into the slot. Many old time players speak highly of it. Here is Trevino, and he was no slouch.



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  • crapulacrapula Golf! Advanced Members Posts: 1,743 ✭✭
    I tried using gravity and my swing speed was only 14 miles per hour.



    I'll sum up the video for anyone who doesn't want to watch... Don't Pull the Handle From the Top.
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  • farmerfarmer Advanced Members Posts: 7,714 ✭✭
    Gravity does not drop the club into the "slot". That is a result from what the body is doing.
  • SteelyDanSteelyDan Members Posts: 57
    I'd put it like this: gravity is a very important external force in the swing, but there's no way it can do the job alone.
  • juststevejuststeve Advanced Members Posts: 4,661 ✭✭
    SteelyDan wrote:


    I'd put it like this: gravity is a very important external force in the swing, but there's no way it can do the job alone.




    Dan:



    No one has said gravity alone can swing the club. What might be suggested is that gravity can start the club moving and needs to be assisted to produce adequate speed.



    Steve
  • iteachgolfiteachgolf Advanced Members Posts: 16,488 ✭✭
    edited March 11
    spoonek9 wrote:

    iteachgolf wrote:


    If the club just fell from gravity, it'd never get to the ball and would be traveling extremely slowly. Gravity has a negligible affect and has been discussed plenty. To get the club to shallow players are actually applying a force on the handle in opposite direction of gravity. The golfer is the one who applies the force that makes the club move.




    I just don't get how you can use the term gravity in your description but say it has little to do in the swing.



    Gravity is a force.




    Yes it is a force. One that is extremely tiny compared to the other forces at play. Which is exactly why I said it’s negligible.
  • iteachgolfiteachgolf Advanced Members Posts: 16,488 ✭✭
    juststeve wrote:


    Perhaps the best thing to say about the role of gravity in the golf swings is that its a matter on which reasonable minds can differ. People like Malaska, Flick, Clements and David Lee think gravity plays an important role in the swing. One of the esteemed teachers on this site think gravity is a negligible factor. Neither point of view should be dismissed out of hand. None of those folks should be accused of babbling and spreading false information. The first step to profound ignorance is to convince yourself that you know more than you do.



    Steve




    It’s not an opinion. It’s physics. And there’s a reason all of the top PHDs in golf all have the same conclusion. It’s absolutely spreading false information if what their saying isn’t factually accurate. Gravity’s affect can be directly measured, and as I said is negligible
  • Krt22Krt22 Advanced Members Posts: 6,035 ✭✭
    spoonek9 wrote:

    iteachgolf wrote:


    If the club just fell from gravity, it'd never get to the ball and would be traveling extremely slowly. Gravity has a negligible affect and has been discussed plenty. To get the club to shallow players are actually applying a force on the handle in opposite direction of gravity. The golfer is the one who applies the force that makes the club move.




    I just don't get how you can use the term gravity in your description but say it has little to do in the swing.



    Gravity is a force.




    Because it's negligible given it's magnitude and direction relative to the force(s) applied by the golfer.



    Wind resistance is a force, no one talks about it when it comes to putters. Why? Because in that case it's negligible.
  • MillbrookMillbrook Advanced Members Posts: 1,689 ✭✭
    BB28403 wrote:


    Did anyone watch the video? Lol




    PC talks about weight, forces and momentum. So yes he is referencing gravity obliquely but not in the sense that gravity will do something for you. Rather using the sense of the weight rather than fighting it.

    As Iteach says it's negligible but you still have to control the forces or produce the right ones in the golf swing and gravity won't help you there IMHO.
    All comments are made from the point of
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  • farmerfarmer Advanced Members Posts: 7,714 ✭✭
    juststeve wrote:

    SteelyDan wrote:


    I'd put it like this: gravity is a very important external force in the swing, but there's no way it can do the job alone.




    Dan:



    No one has said gravity alone can swing the club. What might be suggested is that gravity can start the club moving and needs to be assisted to produce adequate speed.



    Steve
    For gravity to start moving the club from the top, you would have to come to a complete stop, relax completely, and only then would gravity begin to pull your arms down. Gravity is a nice example of what would happen if you don't **** it up, but it is a static force, not dynamic.
  • juststevejuststeve Advanced Members Posts: 4,661 ✭✭
    iteachgolf wrote:

    juststeve wrote:


    Perhaps the best thing to say about the role of gravity in the golf swings is that its a matter on which reasonable minds can differ. People like Malaska, Flick, Clements and David Lee think gravity plays an important role in the swing. One of the esteemed teachers on this site think gravity is a negligible factor. Neither point of view should be dismissed out of hand. None of those folks should be accused of babbling and spreading false information. The first step to profound ignorance is to convince yourself that you know more than you do.



    Steve




    It's not an opinion. It's physics. And there's a reason all of the top PHDs in golf all have the same conclusion. It's absolutely spreading false information if what their saying isn't factually accurate. Gravity's affect can be directly measured, and as I said is negligible




    Two well know instructors who disagree with you are Jim Flick and Mile Malaska. When the greatest major champion of them all needed a coach after Grout died he wen to Flick. When he needed someone to lead instruction at his academy, he went to Malaska. Wonder why Nicklaus didn't chose the top PHDs in golf?



    Steve
  • MonteScheinblumMonteScheinblum Rebellion Golf Sponsors Posts: 18,146 ✭✭
    An airplane flying level

    You stick to the wall when they pull out the floor in that old throw up carnival ride that spins





    Two examples of gravity being overwhelmed and negated by other forces



    Golf swing fits here.



    Center of mass mostly moves up first move down, unless there is an additional hinging in the wrists...then it moves up later.



    Hands and arms move down as a result of one or both of the following:

    Regaining flexion

    Over tilting shoulders



    ...plus it’s been measured



    Now if you want to argue that the “feel” of gravity dropping something to avoid something bad you’re doing, that’s another kettle of fish. Aside from that, gravity is just another buzz word that has very little true meaning in how the swing actually works.

  • iteachgolfiteachgolf Advanced Members Posts: 16,488 ✭✭
    juststeve wrote:

    iteachgolf wrote:

    juststeve wrote:


    Perhaps the best thing to say about the role of gravity in the golf swings is that its a matter on which reasonable minds can differ. People like Malaska, Flick, Clements and David Lee think gravity plays an important role in the swing. One of the esteemed teachers on this site think gravity is a negligible factor. Neither point of view should be dismissed out of hand. None of those folks should be accused of babbling and spreading false information. The first step to profound ignorance is to convince yourself that you know more than you do.



    Steve




    It's not an opinion. It's physics. And there's a reason all of the top PHDs in golf all have the same conclusion. It's absolutely spreading false information if what their saying isn't factually accurate. Gravity's affect can be directly measured, and as I said is negligible




    Two well know instructors who disagree with you are Jim Flick and Mile Malaska. When the greatest major champion of them all needed a coach after Grout died he wen to Flick. When he needed someone to lead instruction at his academy, he went to Malaska. Wonder why Nicklaus didn't chose the top PHDs in golf?



    Steve




    They can be good teachers but also have no clue what they are talking about when it comes to physics and gravity. I have no clue why you don’t understand that.



    They can disagree all they want, and they’d be wrong. Doesn’t mean they are bad teachers, but it does mean their explanations of “why” is wrong even if the what might help some players.
  • cxxcxx Advanced Members Posts: 3,029 ✭✭
    I don't think you can make any kind of swing without gravity. Maybe if you strapped your feet to the ground, otherwise you'd just go flying off in a strange looking twitch.
  • ShilgyShilgy Advanced Members Posts: 11,108 ✭✭


    An airplane flying level

    You stick to the wall when they pull out the floor in that old throw up carnival ride that spins





    Two examples of gravity being overwhelmed and negated by other forces



    Golf swing fits here.



    Center of mass mostly moves up first move down, unless there is an additional hinging in the wrists...then it moves up later.



    Hands and arms move down as a result of one or both of the following:

    Regaining flexion

    Over tilting shoulders



    ...plus it’s been measured



    Now if you want to argue that the “feel” of gravity dropping something to avoid something bad you’re doing, that’s another kettle of fish. Aside from that, gravity is just another buzz word that has very little true meaning in how the swing actually works.
    Monte, I recall reading quite often how you acknowledge that different phrasing of the same move can be huge in teaching students. What gets the message across is different from student to student. IMO what most here and Flick and Malaska are saying is gravity is that "feeling" of the arms dropping rather than yanking the handle.



    Personally I am a big believer in "whatever works". If a student is striping the ball with the move you feel is best for him that is powerful and repeatable from what I have read you most certainly would NOT tell him he is wrong if he says the feeling is of letting gravity start the forward swing from the top.
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  • MonteScheinblumMonteScheinblum Rebellion Golf Sponsors Posts: 18,146 ✭✭
    Shilgy wrote:



    An airplane flying level

    You stick to the wall when they pull out the floor in that old throw up carnival ride that spins





    Two examples of gravity being overwhelmed and negated by other forces



    Golf swing fits here.



    Center of mass mostly moves up first move down, unless there is an additional hinging in the wrists...then it moves up later.



    Hands and arms move down as a result of one or both of the following:

    Regaining flexion

    Over tilting shoulders



    ...plus it’s been measured



    Now if you want to argue that the “feel” of gravity dropping something to avoid something bad you’re doing, that’s another kettle of fish. Aside from that, gravity is just another buzz word that has very little true meaning in how the swing actually works.
    Monte, I recall reading quite often how you acknowledge that different phrasing of the same move can be huge in teaching students. What gets the message across is different from student to student. IMO what most here and Flick and Malaska are saying is gravity is that "feeling" of the arms dropping rather than yanking the handle.



    Personally I am a big believer in "whatever works". If a student is striping the ball with the move you feel is best for him that is powerful and repeatable from what I have read you most certainly would NOT tell him he is wrong if he says the feeling is of letting gravity start the forward swing from the top.




    There should be two separate discussions.



    1. What feels can create proper movements

    2. What is actually happening.



    On number 1, and crudeness aside, this actually happened. A guy had some “digestive issues.” He was a chronic EE. He showed up one day for a lesson and his EE was greatly diminished. I excitedly asked him what he was doing. He sheepishly admitted he had some bad food the night before and the only way he could avoid making a mess of himself was to clinch his cheeks together to start his downswing. In reality, regaining flexion and squatting is the opposite move, but for whatever reason, it worked.



    My no turn cast drill. I am very clear that it doesn’t actually happen the way I describe, but it has worked for thousands of people.



    You can’t mix the two discussions. They are two separate and often mutually exclusive topics.



    The point is mixing the two can have dire consequences.



    The feel of gravity can work to eliminate some chronic transition issues.

    In realty, the type of hair products I use has almost as much actual affect.



  • ZitlowZitlow Advanced Members Posts: 104 ✭✭
    BB28403 wrote:


    Do you guys think players fight gravity and the weight that is inside the club? And perhaps better players know how to use the THE club weight with gravity and the natural way the club wants to fall.



    Are a lot of players losing energy in the swing because they go against the natural downward path the clubhead and weight want to travel?



    Would love to hear your thoughts on the subject.






    An in to out swing fights gravity and your body mass, a little over the top utilizes gravity and helps you stay out of your own way.
  • iteachgolfiteachgolf Advanced Members Posts: 16,488 ✭✭
    Zitlow wrote:

    BB28403 wrote:


    Do you guys think players fight gravity and the weight that is inside the club? And perhaps better players know how to use the THE club weight with gravity and the natural way the club wants to fall.



    Are a lot of players losing energy in the swing because they go against the natural downward path the clubhead and weight want to travel?



    Would love to hear your thoughts on the subject.






    An in to out swing fights gravity and your body mass, a little over the top utilizes gravity and helps you stay out of your own way.




    WUT??
  • ScratchyDawgScratchyDawg Advanced Members Posts: 314 ✭✭
    Interesting video on the subject...



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