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Gripping down 2" not same as removing 2"

 JD3 ·  
JD3JD3 Members  5091WRX Points: 414Posts: 5,091 Titanium Tees
Joined:  edited Aug 14, 2019 in WRX Club Techs #1

Often hear try gripping down before cutting a shaft down. That may give an indication of stiffness but not actual dynamic feel. Gripping down leaves 2" sticking out with acts as a counterbalance during the swing. Maybe the reason some like Tommy Fleetwood prefer gripping down ...just a thought

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Comments

  • North ButteNorth Butte Members  11965WRX Points: 1,712Posts: 11,965 Titanium Tees
    Joined:  #2

    There is no discernible “counterbalance” from that little bit of shaft and grip sticking out. But the grip does get skinnier when you choke down.

    A lot of these Tour players you see who always grip down have been doing that since they were eight years old and 4 feet tall playing clubs that were too long for them. Habit.

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  • Adam CAdam C Members  913WRX Points: 482Handicap: 4Posts: 913 Golden Tee
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    There is a very small amount of SW discrepancy between gripping down and cutting down equal amounts. Comes out to about 1 SW point per inch. So going down 2 inches should give you about 2 SW points difference.

    Posted:
  • buntabunta Members  833WRX Points: 487Posts: 833 Golden Tee
    Joined:  edited Aug 15, 2019 #4

    Its not just a matter of swingweight . Gripping down gives you more sense of "control" over the club. Thast why we choke down when we are punching out, or when we try to flight it lower.

    Posted:
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  • Stuart_GStuart_G New HampshireMembers  25593WRX Points: 1,961Posts: 25,593 Titanium Tees
    Joined:  edited Aug 15, 2019 #5

    On -, @Adam C said:

    There is a very small amount of SW discrepancy between gripping down and cutting down equal amounts. Comes out to about 1 SW point per inch. So going down 2 inches should give you about 2 SW points difference.

    Only if you are in the camp that believes the swing weight changes due to grip/butt side influences are actually meaningful in any way. I'm not in that camp.

    On -, @bunta said:

    Its not just a matter of swingweight . Gripping down gives you more sense of "control" over the club. Thast why we choke down when we are punching out, or when we try to flight it lower.

    The added control is an effect, not a primary cause. It comes from both the shorter length and the lower swing weight which both help make manipulation of the club easier through the swing.

    Posted:
  • hd.softailhd.softail Members  554WRX Points: 139Posts: 554 Golden Tee
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    On -, @JD3 said:

    Often hear try gripping down before cutting a shaft down. That may give an indication of stiffness but not actual dynamic feel. Gripping down leaves 2" sticking out with acts as a counterbalance during the swing. Maybe the reason some like Tommy Fleetwood prefer gripping down ...just a thought

    Agree 100%. I'm finding this especially true in putting. For me 33" is the perfect length putter however, I find I putt better with a putter at 33.5" and choked down 1/2". Choking down just that 1/2" for me keeps the putter shaft more vertical through the stroke, when gripping on the very end of a 33" putter I tend to get a little "flippy" if that makes any sense. Definitely something to what your saying and not just a matter of guys who played longer clubs as kids. I think the counter-balance putter trend shows some truth in this logic.

    Posted:
  • Z1ggy16Z1ggy16 Members  9791WRX Points: 1,674Posts: 9,791 Titanium Tees
    Joined:  #7

    Somebody like StuartG can correct me but won't there still be a difference in actual butt CPM when you cut, vs just choke down? I've never been able to choke down then cut a shaft and go hmm that feels completely the same. I almost always prefer a 44.5'' playing length over 45.5'' and choking down an inch.

    The same thing happens to me with hockey sticks - Because I am on the shorter side and I prefer a shorter stick on top of that, I'm often cutting like 4-5'' off a new hockey stick. Even though the total "stiffness rating" might not change I swear the stick always feels a bit more firm under my hands.

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  • North ButteNorth Butte Members  11965WRX Points: 1,712Posts: 11,965 Titanium Tees
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    On -, @Stuart_G said:

    On -, @Adam C said:

    There is a very small amount of SW discrepancy between gripping down and cutting down equal amounts. Comes out to about 1 SW point per inch. So going down 2 inches should give you about 2 SW points difference.

    Only if you are in the camp that believes the swing weight changes due to grip/butt side influences are actually meaningful in any way. I'm not in that camp.

    On -, @bunta said:

    Its not just a matter of swingweight . Gripping down gives you more sense of "control" over the club. Thast why we choke down when we are punching out, or when we try to flight it lower.

    The added control is an effect, not a primary cause. It comes from both the shorter length and the lower swing weight which both help make manipulation of the club easier through the swing.

    And the skinnier grip

    Posted:
    “1lb beefstak, with
    1pt bitter beer
    every 6 hours.
    1 ten-mile walk every morning.
    1 bed at 11 sharp every night.
    And don't stuff your head with things you don't understand.” 
  • Howard_JonesHoward_Jones Members  11645WRX Points: 2,300Posts: 11,645 Titanium Tees
    Joined:  #9

    On -, @hd.softail said:

    On -, @JD3 said:

    Often hear try gripping down before cutting a shaft down. That may give an indication of stiffness but not actual dynamic feel. Gripping down leaves 2" sticking out with acts as a counterbalance during the swing. Maybe the reason some like Tommy Fleetwood prefer gripping down ...just a thought

    Agree 100%. I'm finding this especially true in putting. For me 33" is the perfect length putter however, I find I putt better with a putter at 33.5" and choked down 1/2". Choking down just that 1/2" for me keeps the putter shaft more vertical through the stroke, when gripping on the very end of a 33" putter I tend to get a little "flippy" if that makes any sense. Definitely something to what your saying and not just a matter of guys who played longer clubs as kids. I think the counter-balance putter trend shows some truth in this logic.

    We cant compare Counterweight in putters with other clubs. (we dont swing the putter like the other clubs)
    For the putter, more weight in the hand (or above the hands) gives a feel of lower head weight, because we added resistance on the top (to prevent the players wrists to break during the stroke).

    Gripping down 2 inch is a lot, and it does add some counterweight, but the effect is small, so its the closest we get without actually cutting down.

    Posted:

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  • Stuart_GStuart_G New HampshireMembers  25593WRX Points: 1,961Posts: 25,593 Titanium Tees
    Joined:  #10

    On -, @North Butte said:

    On -, @Stuart_G said:

    On -, @Adam C said:

    There is a very small amount of SW discrepancy between gripping down and cutting down equal amounts. Comes out to about 1 SW point per inch. So going down 2 inches should give you about 2 SW points difference.

    Only if you are in the camp that believes the swing weight changes due to grip/butt side influences are actually meaningful in any way. I'm not in that camp.

    On -, @bunta said:

    Its not just a matter of swingweight . Gripping down gives you more sense of "control" over the club. Thast why we choke down when we are punching out, or when we try to flight it lower.

    The added control is an effect, not a primary cause. It comes from both the shorter length and the lower swing weight which both help make manipulation of the club easier through the swing.

    And the skinnier grip

    For me a skinnier grip doesn't add any amount of control - but that doesn't mean it might not for someone else - especially if the original grip size was a bit too big to start with.

    Posted:
  • North ButteNorth Butte Members  11965WRX Points: 1,712Posts: 11,965 Titanium Tees
    Joined:  #11

    On -, @Stuart_G said:

    On -, @North Butte said:

    On -, @Stuart_G said:

    On -, @Adam C said:

    There is a very small amount of SW discrepancy between gripping down and cutting down equal amounts. Comes out to about 1 SW point per inch. So going down 2 inches should give you about 2 SW points difference.

    Only if you are in the camp that believes the swing weight changes due to grip/butt side influences are actually meaningful in any way. I'm not in that camp.

    On -, @bunta said:

    Its not just a matter of swingweight . Gripping down gives you more sense of "control" over the club. Thast why we choke down when we are punching out, or when we try to flight it lower.

    The added control is an effect, not a primary cause. It comes from both the shorter length and the lower swing weight which both help make manipulation of the club easier through the swing.

    And the skinnier grip

    For me a skinnier grip doesn't add any amount of control - but that doesn't mean it might not for someone else - especially if the original grip size was a bit too big to start with.

    Yep, I'd say it changes how you swing the club but not necessarily for the better or not necessarily for "more control".

    My ideal grip size is slightly larger than "standard" (whatever that means nowadays). So when I demo a club that's got something like a .600 core Tour Velvet or similar it's already on the skinny side. Not really a problem but it means if I'm demoing driver that feels too long, I can't really choke down 2" and tell a whole lot. Full length it's slightly skinny, down 2" it is really skinny. Feels strange.

    I like the way Bunta put it, "Gripping down gives you more SENSE of "control" over the club". Sometimes that smaller grip feels freer and more easy to manipulate but that can be (in my experience) and illusion of control that doesn't hold up in the long run.

    Posted:
    “1lb beefstak, with
    1pt bitter beer
    every 6 hours.
    1 ten-mile walk every morning.
    1 bed at 11 sharp every night.
    And don't stuff your head with things you don't understand.” 

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