DeNinny's Blade vs CB Experiment and Data

[isaacbm]

[quote name='Sean2' timestamp='1399854758' post='9275965']
Why do you guys persist in exchanging posts with this gentleman? He has all the answers. He is right. You are wrong. You will never convince him otherwise. Save your bits and bytes. :-)
[/quote]I'm with you buddy. No more from me. LOL!

What's the expression? "If I admit you're right then we'll both be wrong!!"

[DeNinny]

[quote name='isaacbm' timestamp='1399865218' post='9276977']
[quote name='Sean2' timestamp='1399854758' post='9275965']
Why do you guys persist in exchanging posts with this gentleman? He has all the answers. He is right. You are wrong. You will never convince him otherwise. Save your bits and bytes. :-)
[/quote]I'm with you buddy. No more from me. LOL!

What's the expression? "If I admit you're right then we'll both be wrong!!"
[/quote]

Isaacbm if we don't there will be no more entertainment value in this thread for just entertainment, but I'll carry the burden of the responses from here on out. Take one for the team, if you will. He's the last troll that hasn't realized this isn't a thread about the debate. It's an open healthy discussion. No troll food here to begin with.

It's interesting to notice that once you take the debate out of the equation there's not too many stories in the favor of the GI camp being a clear choice for score. I'm rather disappointed in that one. Given the passion from some in that camp posting in other threads and also the number of views of this thread, I would have expected a lot more experiences being shared.

[Startzel]

[quote name='DeNinny' timestamp='1399866943' post='9277095']
[quote name=%26amp%3B%2339%3Bisaacbm%26amp%3B%2339%3B timestamp='1399865218' post='9276977']
[quote name=%26amp%3B%2339%3BSean2%26amp%3B%2339%3B timestamp='1399854758' post='9275965']
Why do you guys persist in exchanging posts with this gentleman? He has all the answers. He is right. You are wrong. You will never convince him otherwise. Save your bits and bytes. :-)
[/quote]I'm with you buddy. No more from me. LOL!

What's the expression? "If I admit you're right then we'll both be wrong!!"
[/quote]

Isaacbm if we don't there will be no more entertainment value in this thread for just entertainment, but I'll carry the burden of the responses from here on out. Take one for the team, if you will. He's the last troll that hasn't realized this isn't a thread about the debate. It's an open healthy discussion. No troll food here to begin with.

It's interesting to notice that once you take the debate out of the equation there's not too many stories in the favor of the GI camp being a clear choice for score. I'm rather disappointed in that one. Given the passion from some in that camp posting in other threads and also the number of views of this thread, I would have expected a lot more experiences being shared.
[/quote]

What you're saying is that once you take the science out of the discussion, then your argument has merit.

Please excuse me as I choose to side with facts.

[DeNinny]

[quote name='Startzel' timestamp='1399871009' post='9277305']
[quote name='DeNinny' timestamp='1399866943' post='9277095']
[quote name=%26amp%3B%2339%3Bisaacbm%26amp%3B%2339%3B timestamp='1399865218' post='9276977']
[quote name=%26amp%3B%2339%3BSean2%26amp%3B%2339%3B timestamp='1399854758' post='9275965']
Why do you guys persist in exchanging posts with this gentleman? He has all the answers. He is right. You are wrong. You will never convince him otherwise. Save your bits and bytes. :-)
[/quote]I'm with you buddy. No more from me. LOL!

What's the expression? "If I admit you're right then we'll both be wrong!!"
[/quote]

Isaacbm if we don't there will be no more entertainment value in this thread for just entertainment, but I'll carry the burden of the responses from here on out. Take one for the team, if you will. [i]H[i]e[/i]'s the last troll that hasn't realized [/i][b]this isn't a thread about the debate[/b]. [b]It's an open healthy discussion[/b]. No troll food here to begin with.

It's interesting to notice that[b] once you take the debate out of the equation [/b]there's not too many stories in the favor of the GI camp being a clear choice for score. I'm rather disappointed in that one. Given the passion from some in that camp posting in other threads and also the number of views of this thread, I would have expected a lot more experiences being shared.
[/quote]

What you're saying is that once you take the science out of the discussion, then your argument has merit.

Please excuse me as I choose to side with facts.
[/quote]

Startzel welcome back I have missed you so much and thank you once again for your insight and critical writing skills (which complement your critical reading skills, no?).

But as you know I have asked many times throughout this thread, as all readers too have now seen many times, for you to please quote me. Could you please reference the post number or quote as to where I ever used the word science in this thread?

I completely agree with your desire to side with facts. Before you go, can you please indulge me and the lesser minded readers of this thread the facts behind why I [i]italicized [/i]and[b] bolded [/b]the items in the quote above? It's a puzzle for the lesser minded. They need your help to find out!

[DeNinny]

To All: As the OP I would ask that you all refrain from solving the puzzle until Startzel gives his response.

Afterwards I will allow a brief time for which others can try to solve it. If no one can figure it out by then I will explain it.

[cloozoe]

[quote name='deck' timestamp='1399836534' post='9274353']
Ps I also don't believe the Maltby playability factor either. Too many flaws


Sent from my iPhone using GolfWRX Mobile
[/quote]

Yep. And aside from whatever technical flaws in methodology/analysis, etc., per the original (actual) point of this thread, there are just [i]way[/i] too many variables --virtually infinite-- to ever claim a given club is more or less "playable" for all golfers. Whatever the heck "playable" means.

[cloozoe]

[quote name='Startzel' timestamp='1399871009' post='9277305']

What you're saying is that once you take the science out of the discussion, then your argument has merit.

Please excuse me as I choose to side with facts.
[/quote]

As a hard-headed, data driven rationalist in most aspects of my life, I sympathize with you, Starzel, I truly do. Where, in my not all that humble opinion, I think you go wrong, and in any event where we part company, is that golf is so weird, so full of variables not just in terms of the gear but in terms of the golfer, and that said variables include the mental and emotional as well as the physical...that it starts to look almost as much like an art as a science. And, as in art, while craft and technique certainly play a significant role and we can anaylze the pigments, brushes, and technical methodology of a Rembrandt, it doesn't really explain everything, does it.

[gopherguts]

[quote name='DeNinny' timestamp='1399778059' post='9271551'] [size=6][b]Ok All. I'm going to bow out of my own thread now.[/b][/size] I've said literally everything I have to say about the blades vs CB debate and so have nothing left to share in regards to personal knowledge and opinion on the matter. [/quote]

[quote name='DeNinny' timestamp='1399808442' post='9272451'] [size=6][b]To All, I could not help myself[/b][/size] and come back for [color=#ff0000][size=7][b]just one more post[/b][/size][/color] due to such an excellent question from Startzel. [/quote]

An "engineer" claiming to present "data" and then presents NONE,,,,,,,,,,,

And then can't keep his word,,,,,, not once, not twice,,,,,,,,, but who's counting ???

Excellennnnnnnnnnt,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

[gopherguts]

[quote name='cloozoe' timestamp='1399903615' post='9278617']
[quote name='deck' timestamp='1399836534' post='9274353']
Ps I also don't believe the Maltby playability factor either. Too many flaws


Sent from my iPhone using GolfWRX Mobile
[/quote]

Yep. And aside from whatever technical flaws in methodology/analysis, etc., per the original (actual) point of this thread, there are just [i]way[/i] too many variables --virtually infinite-- to ever claim a given club is more or less "playable" for all golfers. Whatever the heck "playable" means.
[/quote]

FWIW I think it should be called the "Maltby Forgiveness Factor". After all it appears THAT is, in fact, what they're actually saying,,,,,,,,,,,,, but unlike DeNinny, *I* could be wrong,,,,,,,,

[gopherguts]

[quote name='DeNinny' timestamp='1399872671' post='9277369']
To All: As the OP I would ask that you all refrain from solving the puzzle until Startzel gives his response.

Afterwards I will allow a brief time for which others can try to solve it. If no one can figure it out by then I will explain it.
[/quote]


When you get moderating authority give us a call,,,,,,,,,,,

[TJCDAS]

[quote name='Startzel' timestamp='1399821173' post='9273231']
[quote name=%26amp%3B%2339%3Bbladehunter%26amp%3B%2339%3B timestamp='1399818219' post='9272997']
I have a question.....why is it that in every "which iron should I choose G25 or Karstens"? thread we never see an implosion of pointless comments derailing the discussion? And if someone where to say ask "why would you play either one there ugly"? they would be flamed out of existance instantly. Why is it people who Troll for the word "blade" in a thread are allowed to derail legitimate discussion time and time again? Same thing happens if you mention a "smaller" driver.... Its one thing to form an argument based on experience , but another all together to simply say "you cant do that your handicap is too high" That my friends is pure Bull of the smelliest variety


edit...speaking more so to a new friend we all have...but also some old ones too.
[/quote]

Most likely because the G15 and Karsten threads the OPs are actually seeking valuable information. These blade threads are merely "look at me" threads.

But you raise an interesting question. Do any of you blades users actually use the older style small head drivers? Or has everyone gone to the more forgiving 460 cc heads?
[/quote]

It is hard to have a debate on [b]Blades vs..........[/b] while playing 460 cc drivers.

If GI, SGI, USGI, or SuperUberGI make you a worse player, better player,hurt you swing, help your swing, makes you swing less tight, ect..........need to look in the mirror.

If anyone believes that playing blades is some how is better that paying a more forgiving club then they need to put down their 460cc and go back to persimmon drivers.

[gopherguts]

[quote name='TJCDAS' timestamp='1399905629' post='9278827']
[quote name='Startzel' timestamp='1399821173' post='9273231']
[quote name=%26amp%3B%2339%3Bbladehunter%26amp%3B%2339%3B timestamp='1399818219' post='9272997']
I have a question.....why is it that in every "which iron should I choose G25 or Karstens"? thread we never see an implosion of pointless comments derailing the discussion? And if someone where to say ask "why would you play either one there ugly"? they would be flamed out of existance instantly. Why is it people who Troll for the word "blade" in a thread are allowed to derail legitimate discussion time and time again? Same thing happens if you mention a "smaller" driver.... Its one thing to form an argument based on experience , but another all together to simply say "you cant do that your handicap is too high" That my friends is pure Bull of the smelliest variety


edit...speaking more so to a new friend we all have...but also some old ones too.
[/quote]

Most likely because the G15 and Karsten threads the OPs are actually seeking valuable information. These blade threads are merely "look at me" threads.

But you raise an interesting question. Do any of you blades users actually use the older style small head drivers? Or has everyone gone to the more forgiving 460 cc heads?
[/quote]

It is hard to have a debate on [b]Blades vs..........[/b] while playing 460 cc drivers.

If GI, SGI, USGI, or SuperUberGI make you a worse player, better player,hurt you swing, help your swing, makes you swing less tight, ect..........need to look in the mirror.

[b]If anyone believes that playing blades is some how is better that paying a more forgiving club then they need to put down their 460cc and go back to persimmon drivers.[/b]
[/quote]

You know, I think you've got something there.

The smaller, less forgiving head on the persimmon driver would force the player to concentrate more,,,,,,,,,,,

[TJCDAS]

[quote name='DeNinny' timestamp='1399872671' post='9277369']
To All: As the OP I would ask that you all refrain from solving the puzzle until Startzel gives his response.

Afterwards I will allow a brief time for which others can try to solve it. If no one can figure it out by then I will explain it.
[/quote]

If being done posting results in 20 more posts [size=4] I would love to see what happens when someone is all in!!!!!!!!!![/size]

[bladehunter]

[quote name='TJCDAS' timestamp='1399905629' post='9278827']
[quote name='Startzel' timestamp='1399821173' post='9273231']
[quote name=%26amp%3B%2339%3Bbladehunter%26amp%3B%2339%3B timestamp='1399818219' post='9272997']
I have a question.....why is it that in every "which iron should I choose G25 or Karstens"? thread we never see an implosion of pointless comments derailing the discussion? And if someone where to say ask "why would you play either one there ugly"? they would be flamed out of existance instantly. Why is it people who Troll for the word "blade" in a thread are allowed to derail legitimate discussion time and time again? Same thing happens if you mention a "smaller" driver.... Its one thing to form an argument based on experience , but another all together to simply say "you cant do that your handicap is too high" That my friends is pure Bull of the smelliest variety


edit...speaking more so to a new friend we all have...but also some old ones too.
[/quote]

Most likely because the G15 and Karsten threads the OPs are actually seeking valuable information. These blade threads are merely "look at me" threads.

But you raise an interesting question. Do any of you blades users actually use the older style small head drivers? Or has everyone gone to the more forgiving 460 cc heads?
[/quote]

It is hard to have a debate on [b]Blades vs..........[/b] while playing 460 cc drivers.

If GI, SGI, USGI, or SuperUberGI make you a worse player, better player,hurt you swing, help your swing, makes you swing less tight, ect..........need to look in the mirror.

If anyone believes that playing blades is some how is better that paying a more forgiving club then they need to put down their 460cc and go back to persimmon drivers.
[/quote]



In all fairness you have a partial point, but not all of it is accurate. Todays MB irons are not at all the same as a blade that would be played during the persimmon time.Nobody in the argument is playing an actual "blade" im sure.. I own a lot of each and I can tell you a "blade" and a MB are 2 different types of irons.. An accurate comparison would be if you were to say "everyone playing an MB should also be playing a sub 380cc driver for workability and accuracy) ....I would agree with that whole heartedly and wish the USGA would outlaw drivers over 400CC.....Id gladly throw away my 430 and buy whatever new hot face sub 400cc driver came out...I know that everyone doesn't agree with that and I don't ask you too...slower swingers like large drivers because to them they are easier to hit..if you swing harder and are old enough to remember smaller drivers then you realize how much harder they are to swing accurately .

[TJCDAS]

[quote name='bladehunter' timestamp='1399910710' post='9279477']
[quote name='TJCDAS' timestamp='1399905629' post='9278827']
[quote name='Startzel' timestamp='1399821173' post='9273231']
[quote name=%26amp%3B%2339%3Bbladehunter%26amp%3B%2339%3B timestamp='1399818219' post='9272997']
I have a question.....why is it that in every "which iron should I choose G25 or Karstens"? thread we never see an implosion of pointless comments derailing the discussion? And if someone where to say ask "why would you play either one there ugly"? they would be flamed out of existance instantly. Why is it people who Troll for the word "blade" in a thread are allowed to derail legitimate discussion time and time again? Same thing happens if you mention a "smaller" driver.... Its one thing to form an argument based on experience , but another all together to simply say "you cant do that your handicap is too high" That my friends is pure Bull of the smelliest variety


edit...speaking more so to a new friend we all have...but also some old ones too.
[/quote]

Most likely because the G15 and Karsten threads the OPs are actually seeking valuable information. These blade threads are merely "look at me" threads.

But you raise an interesting question. Do any of you blades users actually use the older style small head drivers? Or has everyone gone to the more forgiving 460 cc heads?
[/quote]

It is hard to have a debate on [b]Blades vs..........[/b] while playing 460 cc drivers.

If GI, SGI, USGI, or SuperUberGI make you a worse player, better player,hurt you swing, help your swing, makes you swing less tight, ect..........need to look in the mirror.

If anyone believes that playing blades is some how is better that paying a more forgiving club then they need to put down their 460cc and go back to persimmon drivers.
[/quote]



In all fairness you have a partial point, but not all of it is accurate. Todays MB irons are not at all the same as a blade that would be played during the persimmon time.Nobody in the argument is playing an actual "blade" im sure.. I own a lot of each and I can tell you a "blade" and a MB are 2 different types of irons.. An accurate comparison would be if you were to say "everyone playing an MB should also be playing a sub 380cc driver for workability and accuracy) ....I would agree with that whole heartedly and wish the USGA would outlaw drivers over 400CC.....Id gladly throw away my 430 and buy whatever new hot face sub 400cc driver came out...I know that everyone doesn't agree with that and I don't ask you too...slower swingers like large drivers because to them they are easier to hit..if you swing harder and are old enough to remember smaller drivers then you realize how much harder they are to swing accurately .
[/quote]

A blade is a MB, a Ping S55 is a CB not a blade. Any perimeter weighted club can not be a blade.

MBs when I was young were different from today's MB that the modern club has a shorter hosel, so more weight has been moved to the head portion of the club resulting in the sweet-spot being moved more toward the toe.

The sweet spot today is located in the center of the club head, in my era the sweet spot was located left of the center of the head. The center of gravity also got lower due to the hosel getting shorter.

I would think the center of getting lower would help in getting the ball up higher but I don't know if any forgiveness is added.

[Jackjv21]

I'm sorry, only made it through 5 pages and couldn't bite my tounge anymore. So if I missed anything pertinent to this discussion, please fill me in.

OP, I surely liked the write up. Anytime one can give their opinion in such a creative way, it definitely adds to the forum. I too have played all types of irons (never a super de duper game improver though) such as gi's, cb's, mb's and TRUE blades. All had different aspects in which I liked, and all with different aspects in which I did not like. That being said, there is a distinct difference between an x-14 and a prototype.

In my opinion if when starting to play I had started with a true blade or a sgi, the differences would not be detectable. In the beginning while learning the basics, the true capabilities of each would not be achievable. As progression moves forward, and a true swing has been carved out, that's when I have to start to disagree with the op.

Before I am labeled to one side or the other, please let me explain my opinion. And that's all it is, an opinion. First, I do not disagree that for the op, the difference between an mb a cb where not enough to warrant the use of one over the other. In the true sense of this trying (I say very loosely) to be a scientific experiment, I believe the parameters need to be changed. To say that a blade (really a mb) is no harder to hit than a cb can sound misleading. If I was doing my own test and pit an x forged 13 against a razr mb, the differences might not be detectable. And that would be testing a cb against a mb. But if I were to test an ap1 against an mb, the results would look quite a bit different. In that sense the experiment is flawed. But just the experiment, not the opinion. Maybe instead of stating that a cb gives no discernible advantage to a blade, it could have been worded no advantage in playing an mp60 vs a mp67.

Like always with these blade vs cb arguments, the train flew off the tracks very quickly. And again just my opinion, but the Fonz flew over that shark when the "True experiment" was revealed. How can the lab coat argue with the mice for not completing the maze? A poster disagrees with the op's opinion and then is confronted by another opinion. No true analytical data, just opinions. To be a true experiment op, test then record. Then test and record again. Not test then argue the analytics. I'm sorry to be so blunt, but the words scientific, experiment, data and results were thrown around quite loosely here. Before you ask, yes I am a chemical engineer and I work In a lab.

Op, I really did like the original post. I enjoyed hearing about your experiences with your two clubs. If you were to test a true blade vs a hardline sgi cb I would definitely read your post. I would like to hear the results you would get.

[bladehunter]

[quote name='TJCDAS' timestamp='1399915743' post='9280039']
[quote name='bladehunter' timestamp='1399910710' post='9279477']
[quote name='TJCDAS' timestamp='1399905629' post='9278827']
[quote name='Startzel' timestamp='1399821173' post='9273231']
[quote name=%26amp%3B%2339%3Bbladehunter%26amp%3B%2339%3B timestamp='1399818219' post='9272997']
I have a question.....why is it that in every "which iron should I choose G25 or Karstens"? thread we never see an implosion of pointless comments derailing the discussion? And if someone where to say ask "why would you play either one there ugly"? they would be flamed out of existance instantly. Why is it people who Troll for the word "blade" in a thread are allowed to derail legitimate discussion time and time again? Same thing happens if you mention a "smaller" driver.... Its one thing to form an argument based on experience , but another all together to simply say "you cant do that your handicap is too high" That my friends is pure Bull of the smelliest variety


edit...speaking more so to a new friend we all have...but also some old ones too.
[/quote]

Most likely because the G15 and Karsten threads the OPs are actually seeking valuable information. These blade threads are merely "look at me" threads.

But you raise an interesting question. Do any of you blades users actually use the older style small head drivers? Or has everyone gone to the more forgiving 460 cc heads?
[/quote]

It is hard to have a debate on [b]Blades vs..........[/b] while playing 460 cc drivers.

If GI, SGI, USGI, or SuperUberGI make you a worse player, better player,hurt you swing, help your swing, makes you swing less tight, ect..........need to look in the mirror.

If anyone believes that playing blades is some how is better that paying a more forgiving club then they need to put down their 460cc and go back to persimmon drivers.
[/quote]



In all fairness you have a partial point, but not all of it is accurate. Todays MB irons are not at all the same as a blade that would be played during the persimmon time.Nobody in the argument is playing an actual "blade" im sure.. I own a lot of each and I can tell you a "blade" and a MB are 2 different types of irons.. An accurate comparison would be if you were to say "everyone playing an MB should also be playing a sub 380cc driver for workability and accuracy) ....I would agree with that whole heartedly and wish the USGA would outlaw drivers over 400CC.....Id gladly throw away my 430 and buy whatever new hot face sub 400cc driver came out...I know that everyone doesn't agree with that and I don't ask you too...slower swingers like large drivers because to them they are easier to hit..if you swing harder and are old enough to remember smaller drivers then you realize how much harder they are to swing accurately .
[/quote]

A blade is a MB, a Ping S55 is a CB not a blade. Any perimeter weighted club can not be a blade.

MBs when I was young were different from today's MB that the modern club has a shorter hosel, so more weight has been moved to the head portion of the club resulting in the sweet-spot being moved more toward the toe.

The sweet spot today is located in the center of the club head, in my era the sweet spot was located left of the center of the head. The center of gravity also got lower due to the hosel getting shorter.

I would think the center of getting lower would help in getting the ball up higher but I don't know if any forgiveness is added.
[/quote]


I
agree with all the facts there...My point was more that most guys who are afraid of a MB nowadays are so because of the blades of days gone by. In my opinion if you can hit well any (dare I say it) players cavity then you could also play any MB as well. Now each swing may find one or the other more "forgiving" or just plain easier to hit but that's a whole separate subject. It involves different brands, materials, sole widths, grinds, weight , etc etc etc ....Its much more complex than "blade vs CB" .....It also matters which "blade": and which CB.

[tembolo1284]

So in the end what happened?

[golfwb]

I just want one of these posts to be started by a golfer who is low single digits or scratch. All that I have seen are mid handicappers trying to rationalize there decision.
Front pin mis hit or over water hazard a miss hit with a blade, its going to be penile. Hole a cb or gi on the green or just short. But it appears as though they would rather be short and not have a chance to have a birdie putt.
It sounds like I'm wrong but I would rather have a chance for birdie and a for sure par rather than a lost ball or an up and down for par

[DeNinny]

[quote name='TJCDAS' timestamp='1399905629' post='9278827']
[quote name='Startzel' timestamp='1399821173' post='9273231']
[quote name=%26amp%3B%2339%3Bbladehunter%26amp%3B%2339%3B timestamp='1399818219' post='9272997']
I have a question.....why is it that in every "which iron should I choose G25 or Karstens"? thread we never see an implosion of pointless comments derailing the discussion? And if someone where to say ask "why would you play either one there ugly"? they would be flamed out of existance instantly. Why is it people who Troll for the word "blade" in a thread are allowed to derail legitimate discussion time and time again? Same thing happens if you mention a "smaller" driver.... Its one thing to form an argument based on experience , but another all together to simply say "you cant do that your handicap is too high" That my friends is pure Bull of the smelliest variety


edit...speaking more so to a new friend we all have...but also some old ones too.
[/quote]

Most likely because the G15 and Karsten threads the OPs are actually seeking valuable information. These blade threads are merely "look at me" threads.

But you raise an interesting question. Do any of you blades users actually use the older style small head drivers? Or has everyone gone to the more forgiving 460 cc heads?
[/quote]

It is hard to have a debate on [b]Blades vs..........[/b] while playing 460 cc drivers.

If GI, SGI, USGI, or SuperUberGI make you a worse player, better player,hurt you swing, help your swing, makes you swing less tight, ect..........need to look in the mirror.

If anyone believes that playing blades is some how is better that paying a more forgiving club then they need to put down their 460cc and go back to persimmon drivers.
[/quote]

TJCDAS welcome back to the discussion. The purpose of this thread is not about forgiveness. It is simply about score and what real world experience you have that justifies which type of iron allows you to score the lowest.

If you read other's stories more carefully you may learn why they choose to carry a blade over a more forgiving club. My OP has my reasons but maybe others on this thread can give you some insight as to why. Now as to your assumption they need to have an unforgiving driver, I disagree. I carry a blade iron and a forgiving driver. Why? Because I have proved (to myself only) that carrying the blade does not hurt my score (even though they are not as forgiving as my CB) on average

But my driver is a whole other story. I'm a very erratic driver so in that club it makes sense where it will impact my score. Review isaacbms excellent comments regarding the math of it all. And also why isn't "iron striking" ever higher than putter, wedge, and driver on the recommended things to work on when lowering score? Not one teacher or forum guru has ever put this at the front of the list. It's because it has the least impact. IMHO isaacbm is right. The number of chances where a CB may benefit over a blade in a round is not that significant and to some it is insignificant.

[bladehunter]

off subject but I crack up everytime I see your signature pic.. "that's good Mutha...... Beer!".....Only one better is The episode with Prince...

[tommyrobson]

the problem I found with playing blades is that now I can't look down at GI's and SGI's without noticing how big they are....
screwed myself over

[DeNinny]

[quote name='golfwb' timestamp='1399941865' post='9282871']
I just want one of these posts to be started by a golfer who is low single digits or scratch. All that I have seen are mid handicappers trying to rationalize there decision.
Front pin mis hit or over water hazard a miss hit with a blade, its going to be penile. Hole a cb or gi on the green or just short. But it appears as though they would rather be short and not have a chance to have a birdie putt.
It sounds like I'm wrong but I would rather have a chance for birdie and a for sure par rather than a lost ball or an up and down for par
[/quote]

isaacbm and Mitchell have stated they are scratch players and have contributed to this thread.

I understand your other comments but there's some specific situations (and swing types/typical misses) where a blade is a better option. For example a shot off hardpan is easier with a low bounce blade than a higher bounce CB in that case I may wish I had a blade in my hand over a CB. This is just an example but there are other situations that have been discussed earlier. The point is that there's no absolute which is why you have a significant number of golfers at all levels that still believe a blade allows them to score the lowest or it doesn't matter.

[DeNinny]

[quote name='tembolo1284' timestamp='1399924261' post='9281039']
So in the end what happened?
[/quote]

It's not over yet (for most of us).

[golfwb]

This might have already been asked but have you tried a gi? Nothing rude just asking.

[DeNinny]

[quote name='Jackjv21' timestamp='1399920122' post='9280521']
I'm sorry, only made it through 5 pages and couldn't bite my tounge anymore. So if I missed anything pertinent to this discussion, please fill me in.

OP, I surely liked the write up. Anytime one can give their opinion in such a creative way, it definitely adds to the forum. I too have played all types of irons (never a super de duper game improver though) such as gi's, cb's, mb's and TRUE blades. All had different aspects in which I liked, and all with different aspects in which I did not like. That being said, there is a distinct difference between an x-14 and a prototype.

In my opinion if when starting to play I had started with a true blade or a sgi, the differences would not be detectable. In the beginning while learning the basics, the true capabilities of each would not be achievable. As progression moves forward, and a true swing has been carved out, that's when I have to start to disagree with the op.

Before I am labeled to one side or the other, please let me explain my opinion. And that's all it is, an opinion. First, I do not disagree that for the op, the difference between an mb a cb where not enough to warrant the use of one over the other. In the true sense of this trying (I say very loosely) to be a scientific experiment, I believe the parameters need to be changed. To say that a blade (really a mb) is no harder to hit than a cb can sound misleading. If I was doing my own test and pit an x forged 13 against a razr mb, the differences might not be detectable. And that would be testing a cb against a mb. But if I were to test an ap1 against an mb, the results would look quite a bit different. In that sense the experiment is flawed. But just the experiment, not the opinion. Maybe instead of stating that a cb gives no discernible advantage to a blade, it could have been worded no advantage in playing an mp60 vs a mp67.

Like always with these blade vs cb arguments, the train flew off the tracks very quickly. And again just my opinion, but the Fonz flew over that shark when the "True experiment" was revealed. How can the lab coat argue with the mice for not completing the maze? A poster disagrees with the op's opinion and then is confronted by another opinion. No true analytical data, just opinions. To be a true experiment op, test then record. Then test and record again. Not test then argue the analytics. I'm sorry to be so blunt, but the words scientific, experiment, data and results were thrown around quite loosely here. Before you ask, yes I am a chemical engineer and I work In a lab.

Op, I really did like the original post. I enjoyed hearing about your experiences with your two clubs. If you were to test a true blade vs a hardline sgi cb I would definitely read your post. I would like to hear the results you would get.
[/quote]

Thank you for the kind words and sharing your experience in the spirit of this thread. I will say that some of it is an entertaining read so you may want to go back where you left off at your leisure. Also I think the only pertinent point you may have missed is that this was a true experiment and that I was seeking input on the experiment itself. This isn't about my experiment, it's simply about what is your own real world experience as to why one type of club allows you to score better than another.

Lastly, had I really been intending to set up an experiment, I would have consulted you for sure on the Design of Experiments! I like how you were thinking about all the different clubs to test and also that real statistics were needed. I am a field and R&D engineer myself so your lab experience would help it stay scientific.

[DeNinny]

[quote name='golfwb' timestamp='1399943913' post='9283129']
This might have already been asked but have you tried a gi? Nothing rude just asking.
[/quote]

No rudeness taken! I've only tried GI at the ranges and demos for the most part. I did play a round with big bertha iron loaners once. I think I shot about my average that day.

[golfwb]

I might try buying a set of g25 and playing them for a month or so. I know they might look gross but you might find a winner. I know what you are saying about the bounce but if the leading edge is the only part of the club contacting the ground in hard conditions, would it not be the same amount of used bounce as a blade or cb?

[golfwb]

[color=#282828]I might try buying a set of g25 and playing them for a month or so. I know they might look gross but you might find a winner. I know what you are saying about the bounce but if the leading edge is the only part of the club contacting the ground in hard conditions, would it not be the same amount of used bounce as a blade or cb?[/color]

[Conrad1953]

[quote name='golfwb' timestamp='1399941865' post='9282871']
I just want one of these posts to be started by a golfer who is low single digits or scratch. All that I have seen are mid handicappers trying to rationalize there decision.
Front pin mis hit or over water hazard a miss hit with a blade, its going to be penile. Hole a cb or gi on the green or just short. But it appears as though they would rather be short and not have a chance to have a birdie putt.
It sounds like I'm wrong but I would rather have a chance for birdie and a for sure par rather than a lost ball or an up and down for par
[/quote]

I never have a penile mishit.