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Will catch up, signed me out and would not let me in again, no quote flag or likes, would not let me post, all good now I hope. See you have all been busy posting, busy day ahead DW is organising today’s jobs so I am in trouble.

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I haven't had any issues...............but, then again, I know the Powers That Be......and THEY........

or, rather...........they know ME.

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I watched the ZOZO last night. Wow, Tiger started with 3 straight bogies and then made 9

birdies to finish the round at 6 under and a 2 shot lead when he walked off 18. Fresh off

knee surgery and 2 months off this looked like the old Tiger to me; hitting precision

irons and making those birdie putts.

 

The funny thing is he was getting outdriven by Tommy Fleetwood all day but beat him

by 7 shots. I remember Hank Haney saying that Tiger was "distance obsessed" when he

was making his comeback in 2018. Perhaps he was, then, because he was so pleased

his club head speed had returned to what it was when he was in his prime.

 

Seems to me, though, that Tiger dialed the speed back in 2019 to hit more fairways

and his driver swing is much smoother now.......and he's not nearly as wild as he was

earlier in this comeback. I didn't know he was playing on a bad knee for most of

this year.........his knee seems fine now!

 

 

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All morning off to DWs cardiology appointment, 1 1/2 hour drive to the hospital, 10 min discussion, 1 1/2 drive home. Good news is all is well, no bad reaction from last years ablation, see him again in 12 months. The ablation and subsequent stopping of AF has transformed her life as it gave her confidence, she could not do anything that would cause stress as it triggered it very quickly, once it came on the next 24hrs was a wright off. Met Stu over on another site, was good to see a familiar face.

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> @tolmij said:

> All morning off to DWs cardiology appointment, 1 1/2 hour drive to the hospital, 10 min discussion, 1 1/2 drive home. Good news is all is well, no bad reaction from last years ablation, see him again in 12 months. The ablation and subsequent stopping of AF has transformed her life as it gave her confidence, she could not do anything that would cause stress as it triggered it very quickly, once it came on the next 24hrs was a wright off. Met Stu over on another site, was good to see a familiar fa

 

Glad it seems tom be all good news Tol !

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> @Conrad1953 said:

> I watched the ZOZO last night. Wow, Tiger started with 3 straight bogies and then made 9

> birdies to finish the round at 6 under and a 2 shot lead when he walked off 18. Fresh off

> knee surgery and 2 months off this looked like the old Tiger to me; hitting precision

> irons and making those birdie putts.

>

> The funny thing is he was getting outdriven by Tommy Fleetwood all day but beat him

> by 7 shots. I remember Hank Haney saying that Tiger was "distance obsessed" when he

> was making his comeback in 2018. Perhaps he was, then, because he was so pleased

> his club head speed had returned to what it was when he was in his prime.

>

> Seems to me, though, that Tiger dialed the speed back in 2019 to hit more fairways

> and his driver swing is much smoother now.......and he's not nearly as wild as he was

> earlier in this comeback. I didn't know he was playing on a bad knee for most of

> this year.........his knee seems fine now!

>

>

>

 

He was dialed in ! Like you ,I caught the first couple holes,and figured he had already shot himself out of it ! Good to see him with a smooth sub 300 swing ,instead of trying to out drive everyone. You do not have to be the longest ! I can say that ,since i seldom hit the ball far enough to lose it !

Sher and I are golfing today. She says she is ready to give it a try. Her last two times out were as a cart driver ! Heres hopin' !

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> @billh17 said:

> > @Conrad1953 said:

> > I watched the ZOZO last night. Wow, Tiger started with 3 straight bogies and then made 9

> > birdies to finish the round at 6 under and a 2 shot lead when he walked off 18. Fresh off

> > knee surgery and 2 months off this looked like the old Tiger to me; hitting precision

> > irons and making those birdie putts.

> >

> > The funny thing is he was getting outdriven by Tommy Fleetwood all day but beat him

> > by 7 shots. I remember Hank Haney saying that Tiger was "distance obsessed" when he

> > was making his comeback in 2018. Perhaps he was, then, because he was so pleased

> > his club head speed had returned to what it was when he was in his prime.

> >

> > Seems to me, though, that Tiger dialed the speed back in 2019 to hit more fairways

> > and his driver swing is much smoother now.......and he's not nearly as wild as he was

> > earlier in this comeback. I didn't know he was playing on a bad knee for most of

> > this year.........his knee seems fine now!

> >

> >

> >

>

> He was dialed in ! Like you ,I caught the first couple holes,and figured he had already shot himself out of it ! Good to see him with a smooth sub 300 swing ,instead of trying to out drive everyone. You do not have to be the longest ! I can say that ,since i seldom hit the ball far enough to lose it !

> Sher and I are golfing today. She says she is ready to give it a try. Her last two times out were as a cart driver ! Heres hopin' !

 

Have fun out there you two! Rain all day today and tomorrow here..........it's rain

we really need though so I don't mind. Inspired by Sco and Fella I'm gonna

make a batch of polska kielbasa, cabbage, red potatoes and onions and enjoy

some indoor activities the next few days.

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Ping Rapture V2 5W 19 w/TFC 939F

Ping G410 Hybrid 22 w/Accra FX 2.0 

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> @Conrad1953 said:

> I watched the ZOZO last night. Wow, Tiger started with 3 straight bogies and then made 9

> birdies to finish the round at 6 under and a 2 shot lead when he walked off 18. Fresh off

> knee surgery and 2 months off this looked like the old Tiger to me; hitting precision

> irons and making those birdie putts.

>

> The funny thing is he was getting outdriven by Tommy Fleetwood all day but beat him

> by 7 shots. I remember Hank Haney saying that Tiger was "distance obsessed" when he

> was making his comeback in 2018. Perhaps he was, then, because he was so pleased

> his club head speed had returned to what it was when he was in his prime.

>

> Seems to me, though, that Tiger dialed the speed back in 2019 to hit more fairways

> and his driver swing is much smoother now.......and he's not nearly as wild as he was

> earlier in this comeback. I didn't know he was playing on a bad knee for most of

> this year.........his knee seems fine now!

>

>

>

 

Watched the highlights, wow can he putt.

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Way down under in (not New Orleans) Australia.

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> @billh17 said:

> > @Conrad1953 said:

> > I watched the ZOZO last night. Wow, Tiger started with 3 straight bogies and then made 9

> > birdies to finish the round at 6 under and a 2 shot lead when he walked off 18. Fresh off

> > knee surgery and 2 months off this looked like the old Tiger to me; hitting precision

> > irons and making those birdie putts.

> >

> > The funny thing is he was getting outdriven by Tommy Fleetwood all day but beat him

> > by 7 shots. I remember Hank Haney saying that Tiger was "distance obsessed" when he

> > was making his comeback in 2018. Perhaps he was, then, because he was so pleased

> > his club head speed had returned to what it was when he was in his prime.

> >

> > Seems to me, though, that Tiger dialed the speed back in 2019 to hit more fairways

> > and his driver swing is much smoother now.......and he's not nearly as wild as he was

> > earlier in this comeback. I didn't know he was playing on a bad knee for most of

> > this year.........his knee seems fine now!

> >

> >

> >

>

> He was dialed in ! Like you ,I caught the first couple holes,and figured he had already shot himself out of it ! Good to see him with a smooth sub 300 swing ,instead of trying to out drive everyone. You do not have to be the longest ! I can say that ,since i seldom hit the ball far enough to lose it !

> Sher and I are golfing today. She says she is ready to give it a try. Her last two times out were as a cart driver ! Heres hopin' !

 

DW takes that job when she comes to the course with me, also keeps me in check, no temper tantrums or she penalises me a stroke every time.

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Way down under in (not New Orleans) Australia.

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@ RAD: That sounds like a meal ! You can have my share !

We played 9 holes today. I hit every green in regulation, and 3 putted every one...It was soo bad that i started laughing after the third !

Drives in the short grass,with good irons, but i put on a perfect disaster putting exhibition ! Some days you get the fish,and some days the fish gets you !

Sher played three holes,and tired out. Thats a good start ! Glad to see it.

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Went shopping today and decided to have lunch out. Meal was well over 30mins and then DWs was inedible so it was sent back, made several comments about other dishes as they were really under par. Will not be going back again, this is why we usually eat at home.

 

Apart from that our IKEA shopping went well, DW excelled herself with the disposal of our funds. ?

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Way down under in (not New Orleans) Australia.

Living the dream.

OGA Member no #8

Kindly donated by mdgboxx and worn with pride


A definite geezer of some repute, ( I think ).

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> @billh17 said:

> @ RAD: That sounds like a meal ! You can have my share !

> We played 9 holes today. I hit every green in regulation, and 3 putted every one...It was soo bad that i started laughing after the third !

> Drives in the short grass,with good irons, but i put on a perfect disaster putting exhibition ! Some days you get the fish,and some days the fish gets you !

> Sher played three holes,and tired out. Thats a good start ! Glad to see it.

 

At least you were consistent. ??????????

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Way down under in (not New Orleans) Australia.

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Kindly donated by mdgboxx and worn with pride


A definite geezer of some repute, ( I think ).

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> @Conrad1953 said:

> > @billh17 said:

> > > @Conrad1953 said:

> > > I watched the ZOZO last night. Wow, Tiger started with 3 straight bogies and then made 9

> > > birdies to finish the round at 6 under and a 2 shot lead when he walked off 18. Fresh off

> > > knee surgery and 2 months off this looked like the old Tiger to me; hitting precision

> > > irons and making those birdie putts.

> > >

> > > The funny thing is he was getting outdriven by Tommy Fleetwood all day but beat him

> > > by 7 shots. I remember Hank Haney saying that Tiger was "distance obsessed" when he

> > > was making his comeback in 2018. Perhaps he was, then, because he was so pleased

> > > his club head speed had returned to what it was when he was in his prime.

> > >

> > > Seems to me, though, that Tiger dialed the speed back in 2019 to hit more fairways

> > > and his driver swing is much smoother now.......and he's not nearly as wild as he was

> > > earlier in this comeback. I didn't know he was playing on a bad knee for most of

> > > this year.........his knee seems fine now!

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> > He was dialed in ! Like you ,I caught the first couple holes,and figured he had already shot himself out of it ! Good to see him with a smooth sub 300 swing ,instead of trying to out drive everyone. You do not have to be the longest ! I can say that ,since i seldom hit the ball far enough to lose it !

> > Sher and I are golfing today. She says she is ready to give it a try. Her last two times out were as a cart driver ! Heres hopin' !

>

> Have fun out there you two! Rain all day today and tomorrow here..........it's rain

> we really need though so I don't mind. Inspired by Sco and Fella I'm gonna

> make a batch of polska kielbasa, cabbage, red potatoes and onions and enjoy

> some indoor activities the next few days.

 

LOL We had kielbasa last night with Waffle House style shredded hash browns. We used the frozen ones in a bag from Kroger--- Sometimes I make my own but was too tired to hand crank that potato shredder---- Have not ran a road trip this month--- Scrap prices are down and he is not selling. Been running the container trucks around town and have been on a demolition job with my truck and demo trailer. Also have did a couple of things with the beaver tailed step deck---- My brand new 2020 E-Pack dump came in Monday and has yet to run a load. I did dry dump it some and took it up hwy 31 ( limited access highway) for a 20 mile test run---- Yep local work is harder than the road work IMHO

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> @billh17 said:

> @ RAD: That sounds like a meal ! You can have my share !

> We played 9 holes today. I hit every green in regulation, and 3 putted every one...It was soo bad that i started laughing after the third !

> Drives in the short grass,with good irons, but i put on a perfect disaster putting exhibition ! Some days you get the fish,and some days the fish gets you !

> Sher played three holes,and tired out. Thats a good start ! Glad to see it.

 

Sounds like my putting lately------ What really kills me is the fact that putting especially 6 feet in was the strongest part of my game----- I absolutely can not hit a washtub with a putt now

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9W--- TM V Steel Stock V Steel R flex shaft

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SW -- Cleveland 588 56* Shaft Unknown

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Putter -- Cleveland Designed By 8802 style

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> @"BIG STU" said:

> > @billh17 said:

> > @ RAD: That sounds like a meal ! You can have my share !

> > We played 9 holes today. I hit every green in regulation, and 3 putted every one...It was soo bad that i started laughing after the third !

> > Drives in the short grass,with good irons, but i put on a perfect disaster putting exhibition ! Some days you get the fish,and some days the fish gets you !

> > Sher played three holes,and tired out. Thats a good start ! Glad to see it.

>

> Sounds like my putting lately------ What really kills me is the fact that putting especially 6 feet in was the strongest part of my game----- I absolutely can not hit a washtub with a putt now

 

I had that this year too. Then towards the end of the season for the golf league one of my team partners asked why I always put a washtub between me and the hole. Heck, if I couldn't hit the green on some approach shots isn't that about the same thing? :D

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Curled last night for the first time in a year and a half. Everything went fine or at least as fine as could be expected for that sort of a layoff. They had me throwing lead stones and I even managed to put the perfect set-up on the second end with a rock on the button and then the low guard on the centre line. Looked really pretty for about two minutes until the opponents started moving things around.

 

I was surprised that I was able to start calling weight after about three ends, so I had the others following my lead. It was a bit humorus as the skip started talking to me like I actually knew what I was doing and I was part of his thought process in his shot calling. It's a rec league so the players are mostly beginners or once a week curlers that are out for fun. DW and I are clearly at a higher level than many although the skips all look capable. It's often the plight of new members until the powers that be figure out who and what they have on their hands you play out of position. It's fine because I need the practice of getting my draw weight down. In the meantime I know that we will effect games because if we get the ends set up properly and call the sweeping correctly we will win lots of games because we have an advantage. And no, in case you wondered I'm not competitive. :wink:

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My problem is LOFT -- Lack of friggin' talent

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Yes I agree it is a good job you are not competitive or you would find yourself banned from the competition. Some people are naturally trying to win every time and I suspect you could possibly sometimes occasionally marginally be one of those.

 

Good to see you back in the fray, I am hoping to be back at golf soon but my shoulder is not healing, good most times during the day but disturbs my sleep as I find it difficult to find a suitable sleeping position, results in me being constantly tired.

 

Quiet day today after our Good IKEA shopping and the abortion of a dining experience, as usual with the IKEA purchases I am always in awe of the design and thought that has been put into the items, assembled and in place. The other thing that gets me with IKEA is the way they set out their showroom, we have taken several ideas and incorporated them in our house, the thought and effort put into their stores is reflected by the amount of people walking round them.

 

Have a good day Grillers, just finished a glass of expensive red, pity we cannot afford to buy it regularly, was heaven to drink.

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Way down under in (not New Orleans) Australia.

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> @tolmij said:

> **Yes I agree it is a good job you are not competitive or you would find yourself banned from the competition. Some people are naturally trying to win every time and I suspect you could possibly sometimes occasionally marginally be one of those.**

>

> Good to see you back in the fray, I am hoping to be back at golf soon but my shoulder is not healing, good most times during the day but disturbs my sleep as I find it difficult to find a suitable sleeping position, results in me being constantly tired.

>

> Quiet day today after our Good IKEA shopping and the abortion of a dining experience, as usual with the IKEA purchases I am always in awe of the design and thought that has been put into the items, assembled and in place. The other thing that gets me with IKEA is the way they set out their showroom, we have taken several ideas and incorporated them in our house, the thought and effort put into their stores is reflected by the amount of people walking round them.

>

> Have a good day Grillers, just finished a glass of expensive red, pity we cannot afford to buy it regularly, was heaven to drink.

 

:lol:

 

Yes, I always play to win. Isn't that the whole point? That said, I don't dwell on the result and accept the good with the bad as it's all part of playing at anything really. It was a fun evening that appropriately ended in a draw.

 

I found myself being dragged out for a shopping excursion yesterday of the same sort as @tolmij . I've always enjoyed our forays to IKEA, but yesterday we were headed for a small chain store called [structube](http://https://www.structube.com/en/ "Structube"). It's a sort of Canadian version of IKEA that I didn't even know existed until about a week or so go despite being around for 40 odd years! Very cool designs and the furniture is comfortable and well made. We were shopping for chairs for a dining table that I picked up locally in a second hand shop with the plan of using it as a games table. The best part was that the prices are very reasonable. You take it home and put them together much like IKEA. I know that I'll be going back there in the future.

 

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My problem is LOFT -- Lack of friggin' talent

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I agree if you lose accept it and try harder next time. I ha a friend in a England that used to sulk for days if he lost in any competitive situation, we always thought it was amusing and this also made him sulk for longer.

 

We change bits of furniture on a regular basis and donate to our local charity shop, cost us a fortune but it keeps DW happy and after all is that not my role in life ?

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I wonder how the Judge is doing these days? I wonder if a few more of our Grille regulars will find their way back here as the season winds to a close or slows to winter rounds for our friends in the south?

 

It's looking like this week may well be it for the season up here. I'm playing today which could well be my last round unless the weather improves over what is forecast. The club will be closing on or about the 15th of November.

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My problem is LOFT -- Lack of friggin' talent

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Played last Wednesday, decent day, sunny but cool. We played a two team, four man scramble. Per the consensus. I contributed with some good drives, a stiffed SW from ~ 60 yards to 6" for a gimme birdie. A couple good lag putts. But don't recall having any good iron shots. Continuing to struggle in that area as the season winds down. Sorta have improved in the short same (chipping, pitching), putting has been decent, off the tee with a D has been good all year. But iron play has regressed. It's always something. Improve in one area, another portion of the game goes south.

 

Would like to play at golf today as well. Splendid afternoon, temps around 60 and sunny. Alas, this may be the last good day for getting the wrap up yard work done. Final mowing, store the deck furniture, etc. The forecast for the days following is dismal. Procrastination is not an option. May sneak in another round sometime in November if we get a decent day. Never know. The buds any I are on a "play at a moments notice" position. The clubs have not been cleaned up and stored away just yet.

 

For those still getting out, have fun.

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A decent sort of game today in absolutely glorious conditions. You couldn't ask for better golf weather at any time of year! Nothing spectacular in terms of play, but nothing really awful either, however one of my group had the round of the year with three birdies in the last four holes to close out at 37 net 26 for his nine holes, Needless to say he was the winner of both sides of the friendly, pocketing $10 on the Nassau and $2.50 on the closest to the pin. Don't spend it all in one place, Jim!

 

Tomorrow is supposed to be even better with high forecast of 66°. I would love to slip out for another nine, but have a bunch of things to get put away before the rains hit, most notably the patio furniture. There will probably be another cut or two of grass to do and we have just begun to get leaf drop so that's another couple of weeks away yet before I have to worry about that. Enjoying the extended season here in the Peninsula. :smiley:

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My problem is LOFT -- Lack of friggin' talent

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One of the reasons I like where we live is golf can be played year round, summer sometimes gets a little hot but winter is fantastic golfing weather, always dry and not too cold.

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Played again yesterday. That's the first back-to-back this season. Probably the first back-to-back in a few years if i think about it. Kinda sore this morning, but to be expected I think.

 

Pretty much the same sort of game as the day before. I had some nice iron/wedge shots and made a few putts. Not the best off the tee and my short game was frustrating. Even though the score was about the same, the way I got there was totally different as the day before it was about fairway wood play and short game. Funny how aspects of your game can come and go at a moment's notice...

 

Lots of guys said that they were done for the season after yesterday's unseasonally warm day. It's fairly universal that no one really wants to play when it's cold and damp, certainly not when you're in your senior years, mind you, the two boys I played with yesterday, both 80 I would think will be out as long as the course is open. Bob exclaimed: We haven't even had Indian Summer yet! :smirk:

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My problem is LOFT -- Lack of friggin' talent

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> @scomac2002 said:

> Played again yesterday. That's the first back-to-back this season. Probably the first back-to-back in a few years if i think about it. Kinda sore this morning, but to be expected I think.

>

> Pretty much the same sort of game as the day before. I had some nice iron/wedge shots and made a few putts. Not the best off the tee and my short game was frustrating. Even though the score was about the same, the way I got there was totally different as the day before it was about fairway wood play and short game. Funny how aspects of your game can come and go at a moment's notice...

>

> Lots of guys said that they were done for the season after yesterday's unseasonably warm day. It's fairly universal that no one really wants to play when it's cold and damp, certainly not when you're in your senior years, mind you, the two boys I played with yesterday, both 80 I would think will be out as long as the course is open. Bob exclaimed: We haven't even had Indian Summer yet! :smirk:

 

Looks like our Indian Summer ends tomorrow however with rain both days. Then it cuts off precisely with November 1st and the weather drops off according to the extended weather forecast, which is the like the suggested retail forecast. So I cleaned up the clubs and charged up the GPS in case some 75* days pop up during the winter like those groundhogs at Chucky Cheese...

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> @SixtySomePing said:

> > @scomac2002 said:

> > Played again yesterday. That's the first back-to-back this season. Probably the first back-to-back in a few years if i think about it. Kinda sore this morning, but to be expected I think.

> >

> > Pretty much the same sort of game as the day before. I had some nice iron/wedge shots and made a few putts. Not the best off the tee and my short game was frustrating. Even though the score was about the same, the way I got there was totally different as the day before it was about fairway wood play and short game. Funny how aspects of your game can come and go at a moment's notice...

> >

> > Lots of guys said that they were done for the season after yesterday's unseasonably warm day. It's fairly universal that no one really wants to play when it's cold and damp, certainly not when you're in your senior years, mind you, the two boys I played with yesterday, both 80 I would think will be out as long as the course is open. Bob exclaimed: We haven't even had Indian Summer yet! :smirk:

>

> Looks like our Indian Summer ends tomorrow however with rain both days. Then it cuts off precisely with November 1st and the weather drops off according to the extended weather forecast, which is the like the suggested retail forecast. So I cleaned up the clubs and charged up the GPS in case some 75* days pop up during the winter like those groundhogs at Chucky Cheese...

 

Going to try one more time here today. Supposed to be cloudy but low 60's, with the rain holding off until late afternoon.

The trees are in full bloom.with half of the leaves on the ground. The next rain will bring the big part of them down.

I will maybe get out one day next week. I have just about chosen to be a 50 guy.

Will probably bring everything in from the garage after today. Wont leave the clubs out when the temps start to get that 30 degrees seesaw going on.

I took a walk in the woods yesterday afternoon. I can really say the trees are LOADED with food for the critters this year !

Whether we humans want to acknowledge it or not, mother nature and her other living things say it will be a cold winter and it is on the way !

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75 degrees and rain today and tomorrow...............then...........................36 tomorrow night as

Canadian air creeps all the way down here.......but don't blame the fan operators. They're

just following orders.

 

Ping Rapture V2 50th Anniversary Edition Driver 10.5 w/TFC 50D

Ping Rapture V2 50th Anniversary Edition 3W 16 w/TFC 50F

Ping Rapture V2 5W 19 w/TFC 939F

Ping G410 Hybrid 22 w/Accra FX 2.0 

Callaway RAZR X 5-SW w/Callaway Steel Uniflex

Ping Gorge Tour 60 Lob Wedge w/KBS Wedge

SLED Gemini

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@scomac2002. Way to go on the back-to-back. Better late than never. A little stiffness per your post, but hopefully manageable and not out of the norm. The most consecutive days playing at golf this year was 3, followed by a day off, then another (an outing scramble) the day after. All were 18. The third day straight round was not all that enjoyable tbh. Was more mental fatigue than physical. Trying to keep your head in the game, when you're playing poorly, is a challenge. And when the round turns lousy after about the 4th hole, the endeavor becomes a slog. Exacerbated by the fact that the rest of the group was playing pretty well on the day. "Another good shot. Great. Harrumph!". A test to keep my usually sunny disposition intact.

 

Talking about the weather, as old guys often do. Pitifully miserable day today. Raining, cloudy, 39* cold. Maybe even some mixed rain/snow tomorrow. And nothing on the horizon that remotely resembles playing golf weather. Barely getting into the 40's, if that. My go/no go threshold is usually around 50*. Will venture out if the day is sunny, no wind, upper 40's........maybe. Although none of the buds will play when it's below 50*. So usually a solo, shoot and scoot 9. Don't know if one more opportunity will present itself this year. Got a feeling the 60*+ weather may be over.

 

@billh17. Being that you mentioned forest food. Noted the same thing here the other day. Lot of oak trees in the way back part of the property that is adjacent to a wooded area. And there were acorns everywhere! Squirrels were busy gathering and scurrying about as I interrupted there activity by my intrusion. Thought to myself...."Oh Oh"....."Does this mean a cold winter?" Well at least I'm ready. The snowblower has been refueled with fresh gas, started and run. The generator as well. Everything is stored away. All the yard work is completed. I'm ready.

 

 

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Laissez les bons temps rouler!

OGA - Mitglied Nummer Sechs

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@ Fella: The biggest amazement to me is the huge number and size of the walnuts,and hickory nuts. Dont remember the walnuts ever being

this size. The bushy-tailed rats are busy all day here. Wherever they are storing them has to be getting full. These are gonna be some kind

of fat come spring !

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  • GwrxMod changed the title to Clubhouse Grille (*** NO LIV DISCUSSIONS ***) (*** NO POLITICS/RELIGION ***)

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