Monte's new No Turn - Cast

[yeee707]

Just picked up the no turn cast series and making my way thru the videos. For the backswing, going from 7 o clock to 8 o clock, is that mean to be done during the actual swing, or is it a progression drill to eventually reach that 8 o clock depth in your full swing?

[mrjrogolfer]

The former, I believe. You go to 7 then 8 in the same swing--7 at around P3 (left arm parallel) and 8 at P4 (top of backswing).

[Sp4zRX]

On 1/11/2024 at 1:31 PM, yeee707 said:

Just picked up the no turn cast series and making my way thru the videos. For the backswing, going from 7 o clock to 8 o clock, is that mean to be done during the actual swing, or is it a progression drill to eventually reach that 8 o clock depth in your full swing?

I think it’s both. You can do it in pieces to understand the sequence. I believe the goal is to eventually have it all blended into one motion but if your getting out of position in your full swing, then breaking it down in pieces may be necessary. 

[vandyfan]

6 minute mark…”re-widening” seems like code for early cast…

 

[MrHateCoffee]

You know it’s crazy how you’ll have to watch something dozens of times to actually make the concept stick. So I bought no turn cast a few years ago and I always heard about the Justin Rose drill, but it wasn’t until I watched the IG Live q&a that @MonteScheinblum uploaded on YouTube recently that something clicked.
 

He made one comment about the Justin Rose drill that really stuck with me. He said that pumping the arms is cheating the drill and you just have to use your lower body to turn into hitting the shot. And boy did that make a difference in the drill! I realized I don’t use my lower body at all, or I don’t use it enough. And I realize it’s very hard for me to hit the ball using this drill so now I have something I can work on.  Carrying that intent into my full swing is already doing wonders. 
 

[MonteScheinblum]

1 minute ago, MrHateCoffee said:

You know it’s crazy how you’ll have to watch something dozens of times to actually make the concept stick. So I bought no turn cast a few years ago and I always heard about the Justin Rose drill, but it wasn’t until I watched the IG Live q&a that @MonteScheinblum uploaded on YouTube recently that something clicked.
 

He made one comment about the Justin Rose drill that really stuck with me. He said that pumping the arms is cheating the drill and you just have to use your lower body to turn into hitting the shot. And boy did that make a difference in the drill! I realized I don’t use my lower body at all, or I don’t use it enough. And I realize it’s very hard for me to hit the ball using this drill so now I have something I can work on.  Carrying that intent into my full swing is already doing wonders. 
 

Everyone does it the way you describe.  It’s cheating to create power, but negates the drill and renders it useless. The object is nit to hit the ball far, it’s to show your body how to sequence properly.

 

People will go down to p6, c0ck their arms back to p5 and fire.  Basically making their old swing.

[mitchdoc]

On 2/8/2024 at 9:14 PM, MonteScheinblum said:

Everyone does it the way you describe.  It’s cheating to create power, but negates the drill and renders it useless. The object is nit to hit the ball far, it’s to show your body how to sequence properly.

 

People will go down to p6, c0ck their arms back to p5 and fire.  Basically making their old swing.

Maybe I'm confused Monty but I thought the actual Justin Rose drill was to to the dropping of the arms while keeping the back to the target as sort of a practice shallowing move knowing that when you do your real swing your body will naturally rotate in sequence with it.

[MonteScheinblum]

5 hours ago, mitchdoc said:

Maybe I'm confused Monty but I thought the actual Justin Rose drill was to to the dropping of the arms while keeping the back to the target as sort of a practice shallowing move knowing that when you do your real swing your body will naturally rotate in sequence with it.

Correct.  I’m saying how people do it wrong 

[And0o38]

Looking for some insight, I practice at home in the garage and finally setup my mevo+ to see how everything is actually translating because the strike feels really good.

 

As a lefty, I noticed utilizing Cast B drill, I had some pretty surprising numbers. My path was hovering between 5-9 right with a face that was open 4-5. 
 

I know it's tough to gauge without video, but what could this be caused by? 
 

These numbers are pretty consistent then when I try and begin implementation into a normal swing.

 

I’m assuming that I am releasing too early, because my dynamic loft with an 8 iron was hovering around 28-32?

Edited February 11 by And0o38

[berndgeurts]

Face open to path or target?

[And0o38]

4 hours ago, berndgeurts said:

Face open to path or target?

Open to target and path

[medv]

On 10/17/2022 at 3:55 AM, Trippels said:

Many reps very often at a swing length and speed where you can actually perform the movement. And getting rid of other swing/set-up faults that prevents you from doing it, if any.

Took a long time for me to get it into the swing, but now I think I can do it in a dynamic/legato motion above what you could call "steering speed". And it seems to have fixed my decade long steepening motion.

Although correct me if I'm doing it wrong @MonteScheinblum

 

 

 

 

Now:

Before:

Nice swing man. How did you progress using the NTC drills? I feel that Montes video lack a form of "step-by-step" on the drill. It usually ends up with going 0-100 for me. How did you do it

[Djmc25]

I have a couple general NTC video series questions for the group after purchasing the full series recently. 
 

as someone who has tried many variations of a swing, and not realized until recently I was turning my entire body too soon, causing the hips and shoulders to be done rotating way too soon in the BS, which caused me to over rotate the arms back and get into a tough position, working the NTC feels has been great. 
 

this is how I’ve been feeling it, just want to make sure I’m not misinterpreting anything. 
 

1. hinge the club back, but not a full wrist c0ck, more of a lateral hinge (I feel this with my right hand bending back forcing the right wrist into extension) 

 

2. start this hinge towards 7 and then turn slightly to 8

 

3. Add left knee flex from this 8 o clock position 

 

4. Cast A (I feel like my hands go down and in, as my tendency has been to go out then down, steep AF). This also feels like I stay in left side bend much longer.  As someone who habitually shallowed with too much right side bend too early this is a feel I need to continue to work on. 
 

is any of this grossly incorrect? I’ll get some face on and DTL videos soon, but these are the feels I’m working on at the moment. 

 

 

 

[mrjrogolfer]

Well, you had me in agreement until you got to 4. (Cast A). I'll let others chime in, but my interpretation of Cast A is that the hands and arms do indeed go more "out then down" rather than down and in. It's a "throw" to about 8 o'clock (some may feel it more to 7 or 7:30), which gets the clubhead out and away from the right shoulder at first. Anologies: a karate chop with the right arm/hand, or pulling an arrow from the quiver, or uncurling the biceps, or "losing the arm wrestle" with the right arm. All of those moves, IMO, are shallowing moves that have the club initially going more out away from the body at first before starting back down, whereas "down and in" sounds more OTT--the very thing Cast A is trying to cure.

[mrjrogolfer]

Here's Jake Hutt's interpretation of Cast A (Monte like's Jake): https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=676927339863052

[mrjrogolfer]

In Jake's video, the first throw he demonstrates, which he says is bad and OTT, sounds like your "down and in." The second "good" throw (Cast A) is out and away then down.

[mrjrogolfer]

 

[Nels55]

1 hour ago, mrjrogolfer said:

 

Interesting video.  Especially at 4:42 where Mike Austin says; "the hands try to work faster then the arms".  

 

Looks like Mike Austin and Monte shared the same secret of throwing the 'lag' away early. 

[mrjrogolfer]

Definitely. And both long drivers. No coincidence . . . 

[Djmc25]

10 hours ago, mrjrogolfer said:

 

excellent video. That makes total sense. So the cast is basically straightening the trail arm out towards 8 o clock right after I add flex and keep my back to the target in transition?

[mrjrogolfer]

I think that's right. Keep in mind that Monte stresses it more as a wrist move (left wrist flexing and ulnar deviating). Either way, it's an outward "throw".

[iacas]

12 hours ago, Djmc25 said:

1. hinge the club back, but not a full wrist c0ck, more of a lateral hinge (I feel this with my right hand bending back forcing the right wrist into extension) 

 

I'd be careful with that part. I don't love a ton of right wrist (trail wrist) extension in the backswing. It tends to pull the club too far around people, and gives you "nowhere to go" to add extension in the downswing. Not all the time… but often. I view the wrist motion on the backswing as more vertical hinging, less of an "around" motion.

 

Your #4 part was already discussed.

[scopek]

2 hours ago, iacas said:

 

I'd be careful with that part. I don't love a ton of right wrist (trail wrist) extension in the backswing. It tends to pull the club too far around people, and gives you "nowhere to go" to add extension in the downswing. Not all the time… but often. I view the wrist motion on the backswing as more vertical hinging, less of an "around" motion.

 

Your #4 part was already discussed.

@iacas As you're (I believe) a professional teacher and pro...I'm curious, do you use the No Turn Cast concepts in your swing and teaching? 

Edited February 20 by scopek

[Nels55]

never mind...

Edited February 20 by Nels55

[iacas]

8 hours ago, scopek said:

@iacas As you're (I believe) a professional teacher and pro...I'm curious, do you use the No Turn Cast concepts in your swing and teaching? 

 

Yes. Like a bunch of people, I've been teaching it for years, well before I had any clue that @MonteScheinblum had called it that or had made some videos on it. I've always taught more "active" arms than a lot of people (and never really liked the idea that the arms ARE "passive" on the downswing) (#FeelAintReal).

 

I've always taught it a bit differently (I often call it "throwing"), and whether or not I talk about the palmar flexion depends on whether the student needs that. I generally also avoid the "cast" part from the wrists, too, but I let some of it happen and I'm definitely not saying "keep your wrists hinged 90°" or anything.

 

The end result is similar, but I talk about it differently… because my demonstrations, their rehearsals, etc. allow me to fine-tune what they're doing.

[dminn23]

I need to write "Cast B" on the back of my golf glove as a constant reminder.  When I fall back into my handle dragging ways, its probably the single most important thought/drill that can make a difference.  Its 100% counter intuitive based upon what I perceived as "correct" for most of my golfing life, but once that feeling is there with the pivot, things start falling into place.  

 

 

[5pike]

Hi I recently got the video series for this and been hitting the ball well when all falls into place. Much more solid and consistent than last season.  However I also seem to hit behind the ball often now.  I presume this is something to do with me not sequencing everything correctly and turning too slow? Any advice or tips appreciated to figure out this last issue and make things much more consistent.

[berndgeurts]

On 3/8/2024 at 5:30 PM, 5pike said:

Hi I recently got the video series for this and been hitting the ball well when all falls into place. Much more solid and consistent than last season.  However I also seem to hit behind the ball often now.  I presume this is something to do with me not sequencing everything correctly and turning too slow? Any advice or tips appreciated to figure out this last issue and make things much more consistent.

Do you forget the bump?

[Ztl]

I bought NTC about a month ago, worked through the drills on camera until I could consistently replicate them, then added them into them into a full swing, pausing at backswing b, cast a, and then hitting a ball. I finally got to the point today where I can complete a slow swing with just a small pause at cast a. It's still not showing up at all in my full swing, is there anything I'm missing or do I just need to keep practicing slow swings until I can do cast a with no pause? 

[Hilts1969]

I feel your pain I'm still trying to find a way to do cast A at full tilt. It seems so ridiculously hard. I gave up for a while but am back trying it.  

 

On your practice/drill swing try not pausing after the cast A just continue slowly in that direction all the way to the ball.

 

I have a feeling if you or I swing without pausing panic to hit the ball in the easiest manner ie a straight line approach takes over.

 

I think the secret is cast A and keep going. The club would touch the ground somewhere around your right foot. Mentally you have to trust that's its the bodies responsibility to bring it round.

 

BTW the first swing is much better than the normal one. It must be very frustrating knowing that. It annoys the hell out of me I can't do it at speed. 

Edited March 14 by Hilts1969