Colorado WRX 2023

[Joelness]

3 hours ago, TheKrushh said:

Golf is in a weird spot with how busy it is. I know on the grand scheme with generational turnover and all that stuff how things work but it is amazing the people that have been attracted to the game the last few years. 

 

I've been mostly playing out of Highlands ranch the last 12 or so years and the changeover from who you would think of as the traditional golfer to the modern, expansive, inclusive group that's playing these days is very distinct. 

The most interesting thing is the lack of respect and the entitlement that has come in to the game. I have many, many examples that I could share but it's really fascinating to me that as golf has changed so has the "rules" we play by. I'm not saying it's more or worse than it used to be but it's very different now.

 

I'm curious to hear you elaborate a bit on this. Especially in regards to the entitlement that has come in as golf has always been thought of as an entitled sport historically, not typically with the newer golfers. I'm also curious about the "rules" you mention as well. 

 

Personally, I would love a certification for the unspoken rules of golf. i.e. How to fix a pitch mark, how to fix a divot, avoid walking on someone's line, etc.

[pseudoswede]

1 hour ago, Joelness said:

Personally, I would love a certification for the unspoken rules of golf. i.e. How to fix a pitch mark, how to fix a divot, avoid walking on someone's line, etc.

 

In Sweden, you have to take etiquette classes and pass a test before you can even apply to get a handicap card (known as "green card"). There are very few courses in the country that allow people without a handicap to play (typically where you learn to play golf before you start playing on real courses).

Edited April 18, 2023 by pseudoswede

[TheKrushh]

1 hour ago, Joelness said:

 

I'm curious to hear you elaborate a bit on this. Especially in regards to the entitlement that has come in as golf has always been thought of as an entitled sport historically, not typically with the newer golfers. I'm also curious about the "rules" you mention as well. 

 

Personally, I would love a certification for the unspoken rules of golf. i.e. How to fix a pitch mark, how to fix a divot, avoid walking on someone's line, etc.

 

It feels like a lot of people are there to get theirs and don't care about the whole course and everyone out there. 

-I paid my fees so I can take as long as I want

-not fixing ball marks and driving carts anywhere. I live on the 10th green at HR and every day I see people literally drive on the green on the lake side which is insane to even think about attempting. 

-Not ready to play, has to start a whole Patrick Cantlay process when it's their turn to hit.

-Even little stuff as simple as shotgun divots on the driving range. Our course literally has to force people to mats at different times of the year because of this. I had an interaction with an older guy last year on the range where he was taking each divot by itself and destroying a huge area. I asked him if he had ever heard of taking the next ball from the back of the previous divot to save the turf. He replied "its a f****** driving range, I can hit wherever I want." (Later found out he was on the membership waitlist but different story for a different day)

 

 

I think the entitlement has shifted quite a bit in my eyes in the last 20 years. I would say it shifted from a you're not in the club and you don't belong here attitude of entitlement to more of a I can do whatever I want because I paid my fee entitlement. I know a lot of the things I'm talking about are much more prevalent at a public course.

 

I would LOVE a certification kind of like they do in Germany and some of the European countries!

 

[Dancin]

The I paid for the membership, I can do whatever I want attitude runs rampant through a lot of private clubs. So many private clubs where I see the members not fixing any divots or ball marks or even raking bunkers. "We pay people for that"  I've been noticing that for awhile. Definitely more prevalent in the member run clubs vs those run by a benevolent dictator.

[Joelness]

8 hours ago, TheKrushh said:

 

It feels like a lot of people are there to get theirs and don't care about the whole course and everyone out there. 

-I paid my fees so I can take as long as I want

-not fixing ball marks and driving carts anywhere. I live on the 10th green at HR and every day I see people literally drive on the green on the lake side which is insane to even think about attempting. 

-Not ready to play, has to start a whole Patrick Cantlay process when it's their turn to hit.

-Even little stuff as simple as shotgun divots on the driving range. Our course literally has to force people to mats at different times of the year because of this. I had an interaction with an older guy last year on the range where he was taking each divot by itself and destroying a huge area. I asked him if he had ever heard of taking the next ball from the back of the previous divot to save the turf. He replied "its a f****** driving range, I can hit wherever I want." (Later found out he was on the membership waitlist but different story for a different day)

 

 

I think the entitlement has shifted quite a bit in my eyes in the last 20 years. I would say it shifted from a you're not in the club and you don't belong here attitude of entitlement to more of a I can do whatever I want because I paid my fee entitlement. I know a lot of the things I'm talking about are much more prevalent at a public course.

 

I would LOVE a certification kind of like they do in Germany and some of the European countries!

 

 

Oooof, thanks for the report. It's sad to hear.

 

All I can report on is my own and I can at least say that most people here care enough about the course to help take care of it. That being said, I still fix 2-4 pitch marks on every green and most of the time I rake some "extra" footprints. I can honestly say that it's nowhere near perfect here, but in the end I see about half of these issues as when I played public courses all the time.

[thaar]

On 4/18/2023 at 10:16 AM, TheKrushh said:

Golf is in a weird spot with how busy it is. I know on the grand scheme with generational turnover and all that stuff how things work but it is amazing the people that have been attracted to the game the last few years. 

 

I've been mostly playing out of Highlands ranch the last 12 or so years and the changeover from who you would think of as the traditional golfer to the modern, expansive, inclusive group that's playing these days is very distinct. 

The most interesting thing is the lack of respect and the entitlement that has come in to the game. I have many, many examples that I could share but it's really fascinating to me that as golf has changed so has the "rules" we play by. I'm not saying it's more or worse than it used to be but it's very different now.

I get frustrated with it for sure. There isn't much respect for pace of play whatsoever, which I let get to me unfortunately. I played 9 a few weeks ago at the Burb, and that round took over 2:45. That's worse than men's club, which is painful in itself lol. I really would like to join a club like Meridian or Valley, but that excludes the people I enjoy playing with, not to mention the convenience factor I'd give up since the Burb is less than 5min from me. I also have a hard time with the steep initiation fees. 

[thaar]

On 4/14/2023 at 8:29 PM, ztull said:

I just joined Meridian (based on some advice I got in this forum!!) and wrote a blog about it.

https://straightgross.com/2023/04/15/folding-it-up/

DM if you want to get out this summer, I'd like to meet more of you...

 

Enjoyed the read. I laughed at not wanting to f up Brooks. I've always said your goal as a parent is to f up your kids as little as possible (cause it's pretty much inevitable lol) and minimize the amount of counseling they'll need! 😂

[CDM]

On 4/14/2023 at 8:29 PM, ztull said:

I just joined Meridian (based on some advice I got in this forum!!) and wrote a blog about it.

https://straightgross.com/2023/04/15/folding-it-up/

DM if you want to get out this summer, I'd like to meet more of you...

 

Nice.  I played CCCC a bunch.  It seemed like I played CCCC weekly at times but for sure every 2 weeks.  "Work" meetings.  Probaly going on 2 years now though. 

 

I did a lot of works with Harts (Local/National) and another long time client/friend of 20+ years lived in the first house on left side of hole 1.  *Granted he retired to Phx a few years back.

 

*Honestly CCCC and a few other Jack courses I have played is probably where I got my dis-like for his designs 😃 

[CDM]

On 4/18/2023 at 10:16 AM, TheKrushh said:

Golf is in a weird spot with how busy it is. I know on the grand scheme with generational turnover and all that stuff how things work but it is amazing the people that have been attracted to the game the last few years. 

 

I've been mostly playing out of Highlands ranch the last 12 or so years and the changeover from who you would think of as the traditional golfer to the modern, expansive, inclusive group that's playing these days is very distinct. 

The most interesting thing is the lack of respect and the entitlement that has come in to the game. I have many, many examples that I could share but it's really fascinating to me that as golf has changed so has the "rules" we play by. I'm not saying it's more or worse than it used to be but it's very different now.

 

Generational is a great statement.  We have a number of employees that are 2 years or so out of college and they are into golf, heck even the significant others it seems.  (Mid 20's age range)   Even today at lunch they were talking about getting tee time's and what a b*tch it is or tryin out new drivers, irons, etc. 

 

Then we have that  mid 30's and up group and most think golf takes way to long, is boring and they have better things to do with there time.  

 

The think the real difference I have noticed is how people track others HDCP  🙄 🤣

[CDM]

On 4/18/2023 at 1:42 PM, Joelness said:

 

I'm curious to hear you elaborate a bit on this. Especially in regards to the entitlement that has come in as golf has always been thought of as an entitled sport historically, not typically with the newer golfers. I'm also curious about the "rules" you mention as well. 

 

Personally, I would love a certification for the unspoken rules of golf. i.e. How to fix a pitch mark, how to fix a divot, avoid walking on someone's line, etc.

 

Sounds like a "a good drink, cigar around a fire pit" topic.   

 

Maybe @Dancin can suck down a few "gunch" punches and not be so "spicey"  😃 

[ASak10]

I've been taking my kids out to the range and course since they've been like 3, it was definitely a little nerve wracking at first.  Thankfully mine are now getting old enough where they can play better than many of the people we get paired with, so whatever issues the other people have when they see me roll up with my kids usually go away quickly 😝 

 

I only really had one bad interaction on the course with my kids and it was on the practice chipping green at CG.  Some older jackhole was standing on the middle of the practice green just chatting it up with someone.  My son hit a chip a little thin and it rolled up on him (like literally stopped a few inches before getting to him).  He tried to yell at my kid and I immediately told him to shut the f up and stop standing in the middle practice green chatting it up while people are practicing.  He had given my kids the stink eye before so I knew he was just ready to find any reason to yell at them.  He stormed off after I had a few more choice words for him.  His buddy he was talking to came up to me later and apologized for his friend. 

 

Other than that though, I've had nothing but really good experiences with the kids when we play together, especially out at CG.   

[pseudoswede]

I suppose that was one of the perks of learning to play golf at a country club in very rural Kentucky. The tee sheet was rarely full, and my parents would take my sister and I out on the course in the late afternoons. Otherwise, if I wasn't at the swimming pool, I would just spend a ton of time on the range (sometimes getting paid to pick up range balls) or practice green. My buddies and I would just ask the pro shop for an open time, and they made sure put us in slots where we wouldn't annoy the members.

[ztull]

On 4/19/2023 at 1:37 PM, CDM said:

 

Nice.  I played CCCC a bunch.  It seemed like I played CCCC weekly at times but for sure every 2 weeks.  "Work" meetings.  Probaly going on 2 years now though. 

 

I did a lot of works with Harts (Local/National) and another long time client/friend of 20+ years lived in the first house on left side of hole 1.  *Granted he retired to Phx a few years back.

 

*Honestly CCCC and a few other Jack courses I have played is probably where I got my dis-like for his designs 😃 

if you can forgive the crossover between 11 and 12, CCCC is one of Jack’s better efforts. Hole two is my favorite hole that he has designed. It’s probably my favorite hole, period.

 

If we’re looking just in Colorado I think CCCC is his second best course (behind Roaring Fork Club).

 

I’ll also stick my hand up for Meridian, Jack did more with less early in his career.

Edited April 21, 2023 by ztull

[CDM]

22 hours ago, pseudoswede said:

I suppose that was one of the perks of learning to play golf at a country club in very rural Kentucky. The tee sheet was rarely full, and my parents would take my sister and I out on the course in the late afternoons. Otherwise, if I wasn't at the swimming pool, I would just spend a ton of time on the range (sometimes getting paid to pick up range balls) or practice green. My buddies and I would just ask the pro shop for an open time, and they made sure put us in slots where we wouldn't annoy the members.

 

...no one has ever said your annoying 🤣

[Dancin]

deleted

 

Edited April 22, 2023 by Dancin

[smoova]

On 4/15/2023 at 10:57 AM, ztull said:

Yeah let’s play!!

 

I’m 11 on the waitlist, Tim told me May 1 - June 1.

Just got around to signing up yesterday.  Tim said I am 9, so you are closer than 11 now.  I will send you a DM when I get in.

[golf4pj]

On 4/19/2023 at 11:51 AM, thaar said:

I get frustrated with it for sure. There isn't much respect for pace of play whatsoever, which I let get to me unfortunately. I played 9 a few weeks ago at the Burb, and that round took over 2:45. That's worse than men's club, which is painful in itself lol. I really would like to join a club like Meridian or Valley, but that excludes the people I enjoy playing with, not to mention the convenience factor I'd give up since the Burb is less than 5min from me. I also have a hard time with the steep initiation fees. 

One of my really good friends is a member at Meridian.  He's tried to talk me into joining several times, while it's tempting - I feel like if I join there, then I will likely only play there.  Their limited guest policy (and cost for them to play there) would exclude a large portion of my golfing friends.  I'm sure there are great guys at Meridian too, but I've been playing with my other buddies for almost 20 years and would hate to abandon them.  So, playing only one club and not playing with most of my current friends is enough rationale to pass on a private membership. 

Like everyone else on the planet, I too fight for tee times.  I played South Suburban today, I went off the back-9, flew through holes 10-18, made the turn and it was around 2 hrs and 30 minutes for 1-9.  Way too slow...at least it was a nice day out.  The 4-some in front of us had no clue about ready golf, nor concerned the course was backed up behind them.  No marshal in sight...

 

When I played in Florida with a gaggle on Saturday mornings, several of the men were older, retired military folks.  Almost everyone there rode in carts.  After I'd hit my shot, I'd wipe my club off and put it back in the bag.  They chastised me for that - asking what I was doing.  'Cleaning my club and putting it away', I'd respond.  They said - 'hey rookie, if you're the last person to the cart, hang on to your club, you can clean it and put it away when we stop and I'm getting my club out'.  To be honest, it makes sense!  I asked them, why are they in such a hurry - they said they're not in a hurry, but it's about being ready to play and not wasting time so people are crawling up our backs and making us feel like we have to rush.  The best quote was 'at our age, we never know when the last shot is going to happen, so we're always trying to get in "one more hole" before we die.

-- P.J.

[pseudoswede]

On 4/21/2023 at 10:43 PM, Dancin said:

deleted

 

 

Definitely picked the wrong year to not renew my season pass. Not that I would have time right now to head up to the mountains--way too busy getting the house ready for in-laws flying in from Sweden for my daughter's graduation. One perk of my company is that, even though they're HQ'd in Kentucky, and all of us Denver folks are now 100% remote, they still gave us a boatload of money to fund a mid-week ski trip up to the mountain of our choice.

 

My kid officially declared for CU-Boulder yesterday, and they have a $20 bus that takes them to a different Ikon Pass resort every Saturday during ski season. First time in 20 years I won't have an Epic Pass.

[ztull]

5 minutes ago, pseudoswede said:

 

Definitely picked the wrong year to not renew my season pass. Not that I would have time right now to head up to the mountains--way too busy getting the house ready for in-laws flying in from Sweden for my daughter's graduation. One perk of my company is that, even though they're HQ'd in Kentucky, and all of us Denver folks are now 100% remote, they still gave us a boatload of money to fund a mid-week ski trip up to the mountain of our choice.

 

My kid officially declared for CU-Boulder yesterday, and they have a $20 bus that takes them to a different Ikon Pass resort every Saturday during ski season. First time in 20 years I won't have an Epic Pass.

I went Ikon this year. It’s a better pass for metro day trips, nice to have eldo, and winter park is 1,000,000 times better than Keystone.

 

The argument for Epic involves using all 7 days at Telluride tough to get there with a two year old. 

[pseudoswede]

9 minutes ago, ztull said:

I went Ikon this year. It’s a better pass for metro day trips, nice to have eldo, and winter park is 1,000,000 times better than Keystone.

 

The argument for Epic involves using all 7 days at Telluride tough to get there with a two year old. 

 

I've been skiing Keystone since 1979, so that mountain has a special place in my heart.

 

We did Winter Park for the work ski trip this year. I hadn't been there in probably 35 years. Too many catwalks.

[Dancin]

1 hour ago, pseudoswede said:

 

Definitely picked the wrong year to not renew my season pass.

There weren't a lot of powder hits on weekends. It wasn't really that great of a year unless you could get up during the week. I think I'm done after this season. The last couple years by the time I start going it's warm enough to golf and I'd rather be doing that.

[thaar]

3 hours ago, ztull said:

I went Ikon this year. It’s a better pass for metro day trips, nice to have eldo, and winter park is 1,000,000 times better than Keystone.

 

The argument for Epic involves using all 7 days at Telluride tough to get there with a two year old. 

 

One of these days I'll get down to T-ride - it's quite the haul. I love CB, so we do a 4-5 day trip there every year. I love the mountain and town. Breck is my favorite mountain in Summit and Eagle county, but the crowds are stupid now, so I rarely go anymore. Beaver Creek is a close second due to the awesome glade skiing, stone creek chutes and minimal crowds.

 

I rarely do weekend day trips anymore though. I have a hard time justifying getting up that early and fight traffic coming home. It definitely sucks cause I remember being able to meet friends in the Morrison Dino lots at 645 and being able to get to the mountain with no issue for opening. I really need to stop with the "back in my day/I remember when" type quotes - definitely a sign that I'm officially old. 😂

 

I have a credit from Ikon from the covid settlement that I'll use in the following season though. Aspen Highlands is one of my favorite mountains in CO, and Jackson Hole and Alta are on my bucket list, so I'm excited to go back. 

[ztull]

17 hours ago, thaar said:

 

One of these days I'll get down to T-ride - it's quite the haul. I love CB, so we do a 4-5 day trip there every year. I love the mountain and town. Breck is my favorite mountain in Summit and Eagle county, but the crowds are stupid now, so I rarely go anymore. Beaver Creek is a close second due to the awesome glade skiing, stone creek chutes and minimal crowds.

 

I rarely do weekend day trips anymore though. I have a hard time justifying getting up that early and fight traffic coming home. It definitely sucks cause I remember being able to meet friends in the Morrison Dino lots at 645 and being able to get to the mountain with no issue for opening. I really need to stop with the "back in my day/I remember when" type quotes - definitely a sign that I'm officially old. 😂

 

I have a credit from Ikon from the covid settlement that I'll use in the following season though. Aspen Highlands is one of my favorite mountains in CO, and Jackson Hole and Alta are on my bucket list, so I'm excited to go back. 

Crested Butte is KILLER. Very very hard to justify going 90 minutes down the road to Telluride, but I'd recommend you try it at least once. In a vacuum,  Telluride is better. One of the world's great ski resorts.

[ztull]

21 hours ago, pseudoswede said:

 

I've been skiing Keystone since 1979, so that mountain has a special place in my heart.

 

We did Winter Park for the work ski trip this year. I hadn't been there in probably 35 years. Too many catwalks.

Gotta stay on the Jane side 😉 

[ztull]

I'm launching a golf travel business and a small, hyperlocal golf society for the front range:

https://greatwestgolf.com/

I've been involved with some other golf societies, they've scaled beyond their ability to serve golfers in Denver. And obviously please hit me up if you want to outsource the planning of your next golf trip...

Edited April 25, 2023 by ztull

[smoova]

4 hours ago, ztull said:

Gotta stay on the Jane side 😉 

 

Change for a nickel?

[Joelness]

On 4/24/2023 at 10:39 AM, Dancin said:

There weren't a lot of powder hits on weekends. It wasn't really that great of a year unless you could get up during the week. I think I'm done after this season. The last couple years by the time I start going it's warm enough to golf and I'd rather be doing that.

 

Me too. The wife and I were looking at passes for next year and the IKON is already in the 900's, in APRIL.

 

7 hours ago, ztull said:

Crested Butte is KILLER. Very very hard to justify going 90 minutes down the road to Telluride, but I'd recommend you try it at least once. In a vacuum,  Telluride is better. One of the world's great ski resorts.

 

The only time I've gone I had one of the best runs of all time between the mountains. At least until I got to the bottom and spent the next 2h hiking out.

[Joelness]

7 hours ago, ztull said:

Gotta stay on the Jane side 😉 

 

ALWAYS!!! The WP side is sooooooooooooooo flat

[ztull]

1 hour ago, Joelness said:

 

Me too. The wife and I were looking at passes for next year and the IKON is already in the 900's, in APRIL.

 

 

The only time I've gone I had one of the best runs of all time between the mountains. At least until I got to the bottom and spent the next 2h hiking out.

Lolllllll there area absolutely some opportunities to hike at Telluride.

[pseudoswede]

2 hours ago, ztull said:

Lolllllll there area absolutely some opportunities to hike at Telluride.

 

I love skiing, I love hiking, but combined is a hard pass for me.

 

My kids and I did the Telluride Via Ferrata back in 2020. One of coolest things we've ever done (and a huge nope for my wife).

 

Edited April 25, 2023 by pseudoswede