Can someone help explain iron head weight to me?

[Stuart_G]

30 minutes ago, JLP_GOLF said:

It seems like Srixon tip weights more than most brands?  I’m reading a lot on other threads how standard length shafts still get tip weighted

 

All OEM's have methods to adjust for variations due to manufacturing tolerances.  A few have come up with alternative methods but I would say the majority use tip weights.

[JLP_GOLF]

Just now, Stuart_G said:

 

All OEM's have methods to adjust for variations due to manufacturing tolerances.  A few have come up with alternative methods but I would say the majority use tip weights.

Maybe I’ve just been coincidentally fortunate then.  Probably had 8-10 iron head sets across most OEMs over the last 5 years split between graphite and steel.  I’ve never seen any tip weights when pulling but more importantly, never had any trouble getting to D2/D3 with just a fraction of lead tape.  That’s what made me draw the assumption

[Cwebb]

4 hours ago, JLP_GOLF said:

Mcc plus 4

 

So in midsize that's a 66g grip.  14-16g heavier than should be used on a swing-weight scale

[PNW]

5 hours ago, JLP_GOLF said:

My axioms are already cut so no room there and yes I play midsize.  The 6 iron I recall him saying was 242 grams 

Interesting and really surprising. That would be REALLY light. My ZX7 6 iron was 258 when I pulled them which is right in line with what Golfworks/Maltby measured at 257. I honestly think that number can't be right. 

 

Srixon head weights are a little on the lighter side but only a couple grams. They use tip weights like every other OEM depending on the build. This has measured 6 iron head weights for just about every OEM. Head MPF Ratings | The GolfWorks

 

My guess is a big part of this is the midsize grip 'tricking' the scale to look lighter SW and possibly the build is a quarter inch shorter than Srixon standard. Try to double check the head weights again. A 242g ZX7 6 iron head would look really weird and small. That's a lot of weight to lose from where it should be.

[Stuart_G]

10 minutes ago, PNW said:

Interesting and really surprising. That would be REALLY light.

 

Yes, very surprising.   Usually the 3 iron is ~240.  So that would be almost 20 gm light.

[JLP_GOLF]

1 hour ago, PNW said:

Interesting and really surprising. That would be REALLY light. My ZX7 6 iron was 258 when I pulled them which is right in line with what Golfworks/Maltby measured at 257. I honestly think that number can't be right. 

 

Srixon head weights are a little on the lighter side but only a couple grams. They use tip weights like every other OEM depending on the build. This has measured 6 iron head weights for just about every OEM. Head MPF Ratings | The GolfWorks

 

My guess is a big part of this is the midsize grip 'tricking' the scale to look lighter SW and possibly the build is a quarter inch shorter than Srixon standard. Try to double check the head weights again. A 242g ZX7 6 iron head would look really weird and small. That's a lot of weight to lose from where it should be.

I can confirm today, i may have misheard.  when i go pick them up, he's giving me all the weights

[Ger21]

17 hours ago, JLP_GOLF said:

So what do you suggest I do here?

Weigh the heads, and post the weights here.

[JLP_GOLF]

@Ger21 got the weights back - thoughts?

 

He did elaborate some more when I spoke to him today he said that this head is just not a good fit specifically for the Axiom shaft and in steel it would be no problem.  Also said the hosel is shorter than most OEMs adding to the swing weight dilemma.  really want to make this combo work, as I've seen others with this set up so Im not really grasping why we can't do it

 

4- 244g

5-253 g

6- 259.5

7 - 265 g

8 - 273.5 g

9 - 282.5 g

pw 288.5 g

[Ri_Redneck]

On 2/27/2024 at 6:08 PM, JLP_GOLF said:

Recently purchased a set of zx7 heads to pair with my axiom 125’s.  My fitter just called and said the heads are super light and likely Srixon used tip weighting to make them playable.  He said without tip weights, the heaviest he could get them was c5 and recommended I pass on these. 
 

He didn’t explain why, but did say he couldn’t tip weight a graphite shaft.  Is that possible?  What are the implications of doing that. 
 

he said srixon is known for tip weighting and unless I know the specific weight of the heads I purchase, there’s a chance this will happen again.  He advised looking for pulled heads that were made for shorter length irons, thus heavier.  Thanks in advance 

Couple of things to note here.

 

1. " My fitter just called and said the heads are super light and likely Srixon used tip weighting to make them playable." Likely? Did he not look at the shaft tip to SEE if they used tip weights? It's pretty obvious if they did.

2. "He said without tip weights, the heaviest he could get them was c5 and recommended I pass on these." Has he even dry-fitted them? These shafts weigh around 130g raw and there is NO INFO anywhere saying they are counterbalanced. Most of the build reviews I have read say they SW pretty normal. So I'm wondering if a dry fitting has even been done. All his comments seem like speculation at most.

 

I would ask for them to be dry-fitted and SW'd with a split grip, while I watched, just to see where they fall. I personally use the rubber tungsten tip weights from Golfworks with all my builds and have no issues with them at all. You can also trim the head down so they don't affect shaft insertion as much.

 

EDIT: Just saw the last post and those weights look fine. Using mid-size grips makes clubs LOOK light on the scales, but when you swing them, they typically feel fine. I use Midsize grips and use MOI matching instead of SW because the antiquated scale isn't really designed to work with heavier grips AND/OR graphite shafts.

 

BT 

Edited February 29 by Ri_Redneck

[bekgolf]

9 minutes ago, JLP_GOLF said:

@Ger21 got the weights back - thoughts?

 

He did elaborate some more when I spoke to him today he said that this head is just not a good fit specifically for the Axiom shaft and in steel it would be no problem.  Also said the hosel is shorter than most OEMs adding to the swing weight dilemma.  really want to make this combo work, as I've seen others with this set up so Im not really grasping why we can't do it

 

4- 244g

5-253 g

6- 259.5

7 - 265 g

8 - 273.5 g

9 - 282.5 g

pw 288.5 g

 

I'm just a hobbyist with only a few iron builds under my belt but I have to say that those weights look fairly normal to me.  Have you thought about purchasing a sw scale and some basic tools and doing this yourself?  The people on this forum are a great help.

[Golfrnut]

Those weights looks relatively normal to me...nothing abnormal about them.  Only guessing there is some counterbalancing involved with those shafts?  No idea as I have zero experience with them.  Looks like they are also .370s which means hand tapering or reaming hosels.

 

I can see a number of spots where some extra effort needs to be made to assemble these....but I'm kinda getting the vibe that the builder just doesn't wanna undertake the job....for whatever reason that might be.  Building to a specific SW might be above the task, but building to a spec ignoring the grip influence probably is.  I just get the feeling that the combination of the build and the builder is not going to work in this case.

Edited February 29 by Golfrnut

[PNW]

Find a new builder. The head weights are spot on with ZX7s and any forged head for that matter. There's no reason these can't be built to your spec. It's just tapering the tips and adding 2g tip weights where necessary (Axioms accept graphite shaft tip weights, no problem). 

 

The one complexity you will want to check is shaft length and if they were pre-cut already a little too short. 

 

If he proceeds with building them, screws it up, then pulls the I-told-you-so then you're SOL. This is not a cheap build with those shafts. 

Edited February 29 by PNW

[JLP_GOLF]

definitely agree - a called another builder for a second opinion and I'm now leaning more so on the side of he just didn't want to take the task on.  what a shame

[jt2gt]

Poor B weight heads always the scapegoat in these swingweight threads.  Can we put the ole B weight heads urban legend to bed yet. It’s rarely the case for modern iron heads. Most manufacturers aren’t spending the time and money to make a lighter head just for rare builds. 
The real issue is when you start tearing irons apart and building with different shafts and other parts  the swingweights are going to be off. Sometimes by a lot and sometimes a little. There are only so many really good builders that can handle it and even sometimes they just can’t get to the exact swingweight a customer wants. 

 

 

[Bad9]

Agree wit the others that these head weights are pretty standard and a competent builder should be able to hit your specs without any drastic measures. I would suggest building to a sw value of the club that you determine is best for you with the grip you prefer. Then build out your set by matching the un gripped swing weight of that club and ignoring what the gripped value ends up being.

[Stuart_G]

15 hours ago, JLP_GOLF said:

@Ger21 got the weights back - thoughts?

 

He did elaborate some more when I spoke to him today he said that this head is just not a good fit specifically for the Axiom shaft and in steel it would be no problem. 

 

He wrong.  Likely just doesn't have a lot of experience with graphite shafts to be comfortable using tip weights in them.  

 

But there is something else going on here if the swing weights were really as low as he was first saying.  Those head weights are perfectly fine.

 

You said the shafts were already cut, did you buy the shafts used?

 

If so, were they inspected for extensions or butt weights under the grips?

 

Even if they were not used but pre-cut - did the builder verify that you'd be getting the correct playing length with them in the new head?    They may have ended up being shorter than standard length.

Edited March 1 by Stuart_G

[JLP_GOLF]

2 hours ago, Stuart_G said:

 

He wrong.  Likely just doesn't have a lot of experience with graphite shafts to be comfortable using tip weights in them.  

 

But there is something else going on here if the swing weights were really as low as he was first saying.  Those head weights are perfectly fine.

 

You said the shafts were already cut, did you buy the shafts used?

 

If so, were they inspected for extensions or butt weights under the grips?

 

Even if they were not used but pre-cut - did the builder verify that you'd be getting the correct playing length with them in the new head?    They may have ended up being shorter than standard length.

I order the shafts from grip for less and they were uncut.  My fitter matched them to my set at the time for length.  If anything I think they were standard or a hair longer.  I can measure the 6 iron today tho