Swing weight factors in relation to parts

[zeke66]

On 2/7/2023 at 6:46 AM, thedoorman02 said:

This place is a wealth of knowledge and hopefully can help me with a swing weight question that is stumping me. I recently made a switch from Ventus Black 6x to Tensei 1K White 6x. When I changed to 1K White, I added a MCC+4 Midsize grip and cut the grip end down 0.5", which I thought would take the swing weight down.

 

I went to get the swing weight to see what weight I had to add to the head to get back to ~D6 and the scale said E3! Is there that much of a difference between Ventus and Tensei?

 

Head: Standard TSR3 weight (196g)

MCC Midsize Grip: 66g

Playing Length: 45"

I would either calibrate that swing weight machine again or find a new swing weight scale to check. You’d be d0 with those components. 

[petep1980]

Do club OEMs add different inserts from club to club to keep swingweights similar?  I.e. do they add more weight to the inside of the shaft on a PW iron than they do on a 4 iron? 

[petep1980]

I am replacing some S300s in Z765s with Modus 105 regulars.  I want to keep somewhat similar.  I realize this is a huge difference.

 

The new grip is 5 grams heavier and the new shaft is 30 grams lighter.  So I think the rule of thumb is the swing weight is down 4 points.  So then I need to add 8 grams to each club in the shaft just above the hosel?

[Stuart_G]

8 hours ago, petep1980 said:

I am replacing some S300s in Z765s with Modus 105 regulars.  I want to keep somewhat similar.  I realize this is a huge difference.

 

The new grip is 5 grams heavier and the new shaft is 30 grams lighter.  So I think the rule of thumb is the swing weight is down 4 points.  So then I need to add 8 grams to each club in the shaft just above the hosel?

 

the "rule of thumb" for shaft weight is useless since most iron shaft designers alter the shaft balance point so that the swing weight generally wont change much when the shaft weights change.   And in general the grip weight change should be ignored.    Chances are you may not need to do much at all other than reuse any tip weights that were used in the initial build.  But you really should measure it out with the head dry fit to the shaft (use the online sw calculators like the one on leaderboard.com).    With the grip off shoot for a value 9 pts higher than what you want.

[Howard_Jones]

On 2/18/2023 at 2:31 AM, petep1980 said:

I am replacing some S300s in Z765s with Modus 105 regulars.  I want to keep somewhat similar.  I realize this is a huge difference.

 

The new grip is 5 grams heavier and the new shaft is 30 grams lighter.  So I think the rule of thumb is the swing weight is down 4 points.  So then I need to add 8 grams to each club in the shaft just above the hosel?

DONT do it like that
- Here is how you should do it

Whats normally your favorite iron? maybe the #8 or #9?
Now build that club, and dont even think of, or look at SW values.

Bring that club and a roll of lead tape to the range
Try the club, and add head wgt until its "over and beyond"...dial back.

When done, go home, pull the head and put it on the gram scale with the lead tape on....
Now draw a slope of 7 grams minus for each club longer, and 7 grams up for each club shorter.

Example with the #8 as favorite club - after tune up.
- #3 = #8 iron wgt minus 35 grams
- #4 = #8 iron wgt minus 28 grams
 - #5 = #8 iron wgt minus 21 grams
 - #6 = #8 iron wgt minus 14 grams
 - #7 = #8 iron wgt minus 7 grams
- #8 = as it is with lead tape
- #9 = #8 iron wgt plus 7 grams
- PW = #8 iron wgt plus 14 grams

Now you can build a set that works for YOU, using this dry fit values for head wgt,

Thats the only way to make it right, and you dont need a SW scale, or values, unless you want all dead on. This is the only safe short cut there is, so forget SW values.

ADVANCED OPTIONS - MOI MATCHING
- Many players wants to use the same power on all clubs instead of progressive more power like the SW system is based on. If you wants to try MOI matching, this is your big chance to do that, since you will most likely need to add wgt to most heads...

Simplified, a standard 4/8" set has average 8 grams head wgt progression, instead of 7, so if your longest club is a #3 iron, and 5 grams "happens" to work the best as added wgt for the #8 iron, the head wgt slope brings us DOWN to the #3 iron head wgt you have now (included the tip wgt that belonged to that head).

That means if you still have it '(the tip wgt), you can build the longest club at the same time, and simply wait until you are done with the tuning of the #8 iron.

If you took notes of head wgt of the longest, you can now do the math to see if that iron is "above or below" head wgt target for a MOI match, and adjust with lead tape if wanted.

IDEAL METHOD
The BEST is actually to build the SHORTEST and the LONGEST clubs
Tune both up, and draw YOUR PERSONAL slope for head wgt between those points.

NO short cut, chart or tools is better the last option

Edited February 20, 2023 by Howard_Jones

[AThompson_3]

I have a G430 LST. With one shaft it is measuring at d5 and with another it is at D1.5. I’d like to get both of them to d4 by getting the different weights. The stock weight is 22 grams. What weight should I use for each to get them to d4? 

[Stuart_G]

8 hours ago, AThompson_3 said:

I have a G430 LST. With one shaft it is measuring at d5 and with another it is at D1.5. I’d like to get both of them to d4 by getting the different weights. The stock weight is 22 grams. What weight should I use for each to get them to d4? 

 

If you add weight to the head - the sw for both shafts will increase.   If you want both to swing weight the same you need to add the weight to the shaft that's giving the lighter swing weight (not the head).   e.g.   add tip weight or I just wrap lead tape around the hosel above the ferrule.   You might start with around 5-6 gm and recheck.

[Pleasedwith3putts]

9 hours ago, AThompson_3 said:

I have a G430 LST. With one shaft it is measuring at d5 and with another it is at D1.5. I’d like to get both of them to d4 by getting the different weights. The stock weight is 22 grams. What weight should I use for each to get them to d4? 

Typically around 2g per swingweight so 20 and 27 would the most likely to pair up.

[ANimz]

Ok, so I am stumbling into swing weight.  I honestly have no clue what swing weight I have even been playing or prefer.  Aggressive transition, and I was fit into a HZRDUS black RDX.  I recently purchased a Ventus 6X that had been butt cut 2 inches to 44".  I prefer 45" playing length.  

 

I have and LTDX head with a 10g weight.  From what I have read, I will need to increase the headweight to get to a more standard swing weight.  Anyone have a ballpark of the weight I will need to add to the head?  I can get an extra 8g from an aftermarket LTDX head weight, and I can reduce weight at the butt by changing grips.  I have a CP2 midsize that is 57g.  Just looking for recommendations from more experienced WRXers.

[Howard_Jones]

6 hours ago, ANimz said:

Ok, so I am stumbling into swing weight.  I honestly have no clue what swing weight I have even been playing or prefer.  Aggressive transition, and I was fit into a HZRDUS black RDX.  I recently purchased a Ventus 6X that had been butt cut 2 inches to 44".  I prefer 45" playing length.  

 

I have and LTDX head with a 10g weight.  From what I have read, I will need to increase the headweight to get to a more standard swing weight.  Anyone have a ballpark of the weight I will need to add to the head?  I can get an extra 8g from an aftermarket LTDX head weight, and I can reduce weight at the butt by changing grips.  I have a CP2 midsize that is 57g.  Just looking for recommendations from more experienced WRXers.

Dont think of SW values at all

Get a roll of lead tape, add weight untill it feels right and work as it should
Rip off that lead tape and put it on a gram scale, and you will know what screw weight you need to get there.

Its absolutly no reason to reset a standard SW value, you was never fit to play that, and as example D3 at 45 and D3 at 44 is NOT the same feel, so forget averything about SW values, its NOT what most think they are

[Edwijn]

I just ordered a TSR3 5-wood, Titleist swingweight says that my 5 wood comes in at D3 with no extra weight. But the shaft is -0.75” shorter. 
 

specs: tsr 3 5wood

41.25”, C1 setting

AD IZ 83 gram shaft X-Stiff tipped normal

Grip golfpride light 360 46 grams

3 wraps

standard weight

 

must be wrong, thats more then 4 swingweights by shortening the shaft, this kind of specs get me maybe 1 swingweight point extra with the shaft and grip. Should i change the order to +2 grams or more? Thoughts?

 

[Stuart_G]

14 hours ago, Edwijn said:

I just ordered a TSR3 5-wood, Titleist swingweight says that my 5 wood comes in at D3 with no extra weight. But the shaft is -0.75” shorter. 
 

specs: tsr 3 5wood

41.25”, C1 setting

AD IZ 83 gram shaft X-Stiff tipped normal

Grip golfpride light 360 46 grams

3 wraps

standard weight

 

must be wrong, thats more then 4 swingweights by shortening the shaft, this kind of specs get me maybe 1 swingweight point extra with the shaft and grip. Should i change the order to +2 grams or more? Thoughts?

 

 

It's because of the heavy shaft with a more standard balance point instead of most of the stock shafts which are higher balance point shafts.

 

What to do?   Depends on

1) what's your target swing weight is and how did you come up with the that target.

2) whether or not Titleist's value is based on actual grip weight or standard 50 gm grip weight.  

 

If you're replacing a club with the exact same specs (playing length, shaft model, grip config) - then you can use that target for the new club and how much the head weight needs to be adjusted can be calculated.   If not, you should really throw out any old swing weight values, just get the club and fit yourself using lead tape first to figure out what you need for a replacement weight.

 

[Auleran87]

Would love some help on this -- I just put my 46 inch Ventus Black 6x into a ping G430 LST head. Since the standard spec for pings is 45 1/4 inches, it's currently swing-weight at E1.5 with the 46 inch shaft. 

Looking at this I could cut 1 inch off the shaft to drop the swingweight ~ 6 points and have it play at ~D5, or I would need to swap out the back weight from the 22g standard to an 11g and have it swingweight ~D6. 

I'm trying to maximize clubhead speed (hence the 46 inch shaft) but would putting the 11g weight in the back sacrifice forgiveness or efficiency too much in the head? is cutting the shaft and keeping the weight in back heavy better?

[Howard_Jones]

On 4/14/2023 at 8:26 PM, Auleran87 said:

Would love some help on this -- I just put my 46 inch Ventus Black 6x into a ping G430 LST head. Since the standard spec for pings is 45 1/4 inches, it's currently swing-weight at E1.5 with the 46 inch shaft. 

Looking at this I could cut 1 inch off the shaft to drop the swingweight ~ 6 points and have it play at ~D5, or I would need to swap out the back weight from the 22g standard to an 11g and have it swingweight ~D6. 

I'm trying to maximize clubhead speed (hence the 46 inch shaft) but would putting the 11g weight in the back sacrifice forgiveness or efficiency too much in the head? is cutting the shaft and keeping the weight in back heavy better?

I think your should read this, and simply follow he steps if you wants to optimize your driver.

 

[Poor Mans Ty Webb]

Sorry if this has been addressed already (we're 26 pages deep at this point!).

 

I have two 6 irons.  Both are shafted with DGX100s, although the Hogan has a Tour Issue and the Mizuno has a regular DG (I don't think this should matter?).

 

There is a 5g difference between the two heads (the Hogan head is heavier at 262g vs 257g for the Mizuno), and I assume this is because the Hogan was meant for a 115g Apex shaft, while the old Mizunos were often fitted with DG shafts in mind.

 

I was "told" by the guy who built up both sets that both irons SW at D3, but the Hogans feel heavier to me (and thus harder to swing efficiently) than the Mizunos.  I also believe that the builder did not put any tip weights in either club.

 

Is 5g (2.5 SW points?) enough to make a considerable difference in feel between two irons?  If so, should I go about adding some weight at the butt-end of the Hogans to address this?  Alternatively, could I take off 0.5" from the butt end of the shaft to address it (been thinking about going 1/2" shorter anyway)?

 

Thanks.

Edited April 26, 2023 by Poor Mans Ty Webb

[Stuart_G]

1 hour ago, Poor Mans Ty Webb said:

Sorry if this has been addressed already (we're 26 pages deep at this point!).

 

I have two 6 irons.  Both are shafted with DGX100s, although the Hogan has a Tour Issue and the Mizuno has a regular DG (I don't think this should matter?).

 

Assuming both are taper tip  - just means the static weight might be a gram or two different.  Negligible effect on the swing weight.

 

1 hour ago, Poor Mans Ty Webb said:

There is a 5g difference between the two heads (the Hogan head is heavier at 262g vs 257g for the Mizuno), and I assume this is because the Hogan was meant for a 115g Apex shaft, while the old Mizunos were often fitted with DG shafts in mind.

 

Unlikely.  Just different ideas of what the head weight should be - or variations due to manufacturing tolerances.

 

1 hour ago, Poor Mans Ty Webb said:

I was "told" by the guy who built up both sets that both irons SW at D3, but the Hogans feel heavier to me (and thus harder to swing efficiently) than the Mizunos.  I also believe that the builder did not put any tip weights in either club.

 

Not uncommon - the swing weight scale is far from an ideal representation of the weight feel of a club.    Plus the head weight/MOI is only one part of what gives us the overall weight feel of a club.  Static club weight plays a part as well.

 

Same length?  Same grip?    Something must be different if the head weights are different but the swing weight is the same (and no tip weights used).   Check for any differences in the static weight of the two club.

 

 

1 hour ago, Poor Mans Ty Webb said:

Is 5g (2.5 SW points?) enough to make a considerable difference in feel between two irons?

 

5 gm might make a VERY subtle difference in the stiffness feel - and sometimes stiffness feel can effect the weight feel - but one would have to be very sensitive to notice that much of a difference.

 

 

1 hour ago, Poor Mans Ty Webb said:

 If so, should I go about adding some weight at the butt-end of the Hogans to address this?  Alternatively, could I take off 0.5" from the butt end of the shaft to address it (been thinking about going 1/2" shorter anyway)?

 

Thanks.

 

Adding butt weight usually doesn't work to reduce head weight feel - but everyone is different you never know til you try.

Going shorter can help if the problem really is the swing weight (as opposed to static weight).

 

[redlegged]

This may be a dumb question, but can anyone tell me if there is any way to determine how much weight would be removed from a shaft if it were butt trimmed? I am wanting to shorten my driver from 46" to 44" and I am trying to determine whether I should move up in shaft weight before trimming or if I should just use the same weight I have been using. 

[Stuart_G]

11 hours ago, redlegged said:

This may be a dumb question, but can anyone tell me if there is any way to determine how much weight would be removed from a shaft if it were butt trimmed? I am wanting to shorten my driver from 46" to 44" and I am trying to determine whether I should move up in shaft weight before trimming or if I should just use the same weight I have been using. 

 

 

 

It's not hard to estimate - but that's not the best way to determine if you need to change shaft weight.   it will depend on the shaft.   Look at the specs.  Divide the uncut weight by the uncut length and that will give you the grams you'd loose per inch the shaft is shortened.

 

But to be honest, that type of weight loss when shortening the shaft is generally pretty negligible.   Generally it can be ignored but if there is any concern - the best way to check for - or really refit for shaft weight when chaning length is follow the tutorial here.  Actually use some lead tape on the range while you are doing some testing (for both shaft weight and head weight).

 

 

[Rvp]

What is the best way to reduce the sw by 3 points on my tsr3 driver

[Stuart_G]

9 hours ago, Rvp said:

What is the best way to reduce the sw by 3 points on my tsr3 driver

 

Really only two decent options.   Either:

1) shorten the playing length by 1/2" (choking up might be good enough).

or

2) get a weight that's about ~5 gm lighter than the one you have in the head now

https://billybobsgolf.com/product/titleist-tsr-2-3-4-headweights-driver-and-fairway-new-2022/

Edited May 7, 2023 by Stuart_G

[tylervond]

Could use some insight on if I am off base with this.  I am thinking my overall weight is slightly too heavy in my irons. 

Current set up is Sub 70 659cb with DG X100 shafts +1/2" with a lamkin crossline grip. 

 

Total weight of 8 iron is 483 grams (playing at D6 sw) which is 33 grams heavier then my previous set up..... that was 450 grams playing at D3 sw. I demoed the 659s with the x100 and they felt great, but they were standard length not plus 1/2". I also didn't play an entire round with them.

I have noticed thought that getting towards the end of the round, I can start to feel the weight of these. I love the stiffness and how they preform when I am fresh, but I am hypothesizing on how to lower the total weight of the clubs without drastically changing the sw. 

 

My thought was to possibly switch to a kbs c-taper lite or $-taper lite (go swing both in a similar set up) which would decrease the total iron weight by 15 or 25 grams.  Is there any way to know what kind of effect that would have on the SW going with that much of a lighter shaft? I am thinking if I make the change and I can feel the SW change enough to effect me I could always add a little weight in the butt section with weights or lead tape to offset it slightly. Just seeing if my line of thinking is accurate. 

[Stuart_G]

16 hours ago, tylervond said:

but I am hypothesizing on how to lower the total weight of the clubs without drastically changing the sw. 

 

Depends on which specific model shaft you choose.   But in most cases it wont change very much at all.  Most shaft designers adjust the balance point to compensate for the shaft weight influence on the swing weight.  So it's very common to go from say a 130 gm DG to a 100 or even 95 gm shaft with no change in swing weight.  Or maybe small change of a pt or two that's easy to compensate for with tip weights.

 

However, with a change in total weight - it's not a good idea to think that you should keep the swing weight the same to maintain a good fit.   After such a shaft change, you should always go through the process of refitting yourself to find the best head weight (using lead tape at the range).

 

 

16 hours ago, tylervond said:

I am thinking if I make the change and I can feel the SW change enough to effect me I could always add a little weight in the butt section with weights or lead tape to offset it slightly. Just seeing if my line of thinking is accurate. 

 

How much of this thread did you read before posting? No one expects you to read all 26 pages but you should really take look at the first page.  This is completely backwards.

 

Shaft weight contributes to swing weight in a positive manner.   If there were no adjustment to the shaft balance point, a lighter shaft weight would mean a lighter swing weight and the need to add weight to the head - not the butt.   And that's even if one did agree with the idea of using butt weight to change swing weight - which many know is a bad idea.

 

Edited June 26, 2023 by Stuart_G

[tylervond]

Thanks for the reply. I did search quite a bit on here and google, but to be clear I was unaware of the total weight of the shaft not effecting sw even when drastically dropping in weight. My line of thinking was starting there, so once that was clarified the rest is clearer. 
 

2 hours ago, Stuart_G said:

 

How much of this thread did you read before posting? No one expects you to read all 26 pages but you should really take look at the first page.  This is completely backwards.

 

Yes, I tried reading the first page but it is from 2011 and the website formatting has apparently drastically changed since then. On a phone it is very difficult to actually follow anything due to the formatting. 
Things appear like this 

 

 

“[quote name='acquadiice' timestamp='1307369271' post='3287697']
Joe, removing paintfill change the swing weight?
[/quote]
Paint weight in the paintfill is not heavy enough to change the SW.

[quote name='Jscopus' timestamp='1311127512' post='3406182']”

 

 

No clue who has control over that, but fixing the formatting of the first few pages would make the information more usable. 

[Stuart_G]

46 minutes ago, tylervond said:

No clue who has control over that, but fixing the formatting of the first few pages would make the information more usable. 

 

Unfortunately there were some some major changes to the server software and that was a result of porting the old messages to the new server.   Unfortunately there is no responsibility for going back and fixing all the old posts from the previous server software.

[Stuart_G]

19 minutes ago, GolfisHard93 said:

Alright here is a doozie of a swing weight problem:

 

Just had a set of Miura CB302's built with Oban CT 125S+ pulls that I bought. I have added lead tape as follows, and the corrosponding swing weights:
Iron      Swingweight       Lead Tape 
 5i             D2.8                      1g

 6i             D2.5                      2g

 7i             D2.2                      2g 

 8i             D2.6                      2g

 9i             D3.9                      0g 

 PW          D6.5                      0g

 

 

So several questions here:

 

• Why is there such disparity between the 5-8 and the 9 and pw?
• Is this a club building issue? The pulls were cleaned and prepped, and we even cleaned out the PW and tried to pull the swingweight down with 4g of lead tape at the butt of the shaft but that did not really do anything. What am I missing here?
• Why is the PW so much heavier? I get it being 1 swing point higher, but a full 4 points higher seems crazy. 
• How do I get everything to play at D2-D3 and the PW at D4?

 

 

 

We'd need the measured playing lengths (after the build) of each club and the raw head weights to really answer the question with any certainty.

 

But assuming:

1) all the shafts were new/uncut before the install (no possible hidden weight in any of the shafts).

2) the same grip's were used

3) and the length was the typical 1/2" or 1/4" increment between the 9i and PW and there were no errors in cutting the shafts or installing grip to get the desired playing length (hence the request for the measured playing length after the build).    Swing weight is very sensitive to length.  So something as basic as the grip not going on all the way (and leaving the club longer than intended) is enough to push the swing weight up a couple pts.

 

That means the raw weight for the PW head was the most likely reason.  Whether it really was the raw head weight was that much higher - or some tip weight was left in the hosel is impossible to say (some heads use recessed weights in the bottom of the hosel). 

 

Was the shaft insertion depth the same with the PW as with the other heads?

Edited June 26, 2023 by Stuart_G

[Stuart_G]

13 hours ago, GolfisHard93 said:

This is what I was able to gather from the Miura website.

 

As I mentioned before.  If you're not doing the measuring yourself, it's not really helpful information.

 

Obviously if the clubs have already been built, you can no longer get the raw head weights.   But you can measure the lengths yourself, it's not hard at all.  Do a search here for a "DIY club ruler."

 

 

[charliebrown]

On 2/18/2023 at 1:43 AM, Stuart_G said:

 

the "rule of thumb" for shaft weight is useless since most iron shaft designers alter the shaft balance point so that the swing weight generally wont change much when the shaft weights change.   And in general the grip weight change should be ignored.    Chances are you may not need to do much at all other than reuse any tip weights that were used in the initial build.  But you really should measure it out with the head dry fit to the shaft (use the online sw calculators like the one on leaderboard.com).    With the grip off shoot for a value 9 pts higher than what you want.

"And in general the grip weight change should be ignored."

Amen to that 1000 times. 

[quizzylish]

I'm sorry but I'm just confused by all this and don't mean to sound ignorant.  I thought I understood but then I went through this thread and I am now left even more confused.  I am planning to build a set of Miura Giken's.  I have a 3 iron and 5 - PW.  The lofts are according to the chart below.  Since the loft progression is so close for the 3 iron to 5 iron my plan was to make the 3 iron 1 degree weaker (for use as 4 iron loft and length) and make 5-pw 1 degree stronger.  I was going to build the set to match my current srixon's which are about D2 for 4 iron and move to D3-3.5 to the shorter irons.  But now reading some of the comments about a 7 gram head weight progression and doing a dry build, I found I need about 8 gram tip weight for the 8 iron (which is what I was going to build first to test).  However, I like the idea of building it stock and adding lead tape for feel and moving to the 7 gram progression.  I wanted to do all this because the heads are raw and didn't want lead tape all over them, so I ordered a bunch of tip weights to get things dialed in.  Now seeing how much lower weight the 3 iron head is, I think I'm going to have to use a tip weight and lead tape since I was going to build the 3 iron head to 4 iron loft and length.  I bought the economy swing weight scale from golf works and was excited to use it insead of using an online calculator, but now using stuarts head progression I feel maybe I didn't need to buy a scale.  I am super confused on why it appears swing weight doesn't matter as a measurement and really confused how grip weight doesn't matter when it is listed as 5 gram difference changes swing weight by 1 point.  

[Stuart_G]

17 minutes ago, quizzylish said:

I bought the economy swing weight scale from golf works and was excited to use it insead of using an online calculator, but now using stuarts head progression I feel maybe I didn't need to buy a scale.

 

Swing weight is generally better since you can properly compensate for less than perfect length cuts.  Even being off a 1/8" for the playing length can throw off that 7 gm increment.   It also can help deal with manufacturing tolerance variations in the shafts.  The 7 gm head weight increment only really addresses those variations in the head weight, nothing else.

 

19 minutes ago, quizzylish said:

I am super confused on why it appears swing weight doesn't matter as a measurement and really confused how grip weight doesn't matter when it is listed as 5 gram difference changes swing weight by 1 point. 

 

The swing weight concept was developed and tested/validated at a time when there were no different options in terms of either grips - or shafts for that matter.   The use of balance to help match heft is really a short cut - matching balance is not really the purpose of getting a swing weight match.  It was really more about finding a simple, easy to use way to match the MOI of the club.   So the swing weight scale really doesn't handle very well any other changes besides playing length and head weight.   It was never designed or intended to handle those changes.

 

So the real key is that you don't need to adjust - as long as you fit the swing weight with the same grip and grip weight you want to build with.   If you change grip weight, then refit for swing weight with the new grip weight on the range and then use the new value to build to.

[quizzylish]

1 hour ago, Stuart_G said:

 

Swing weight is generally better since you can properly compensate for less than perfect length cuts.  Even being off a 1/8" for the playing length can throw off that 7 gm increment.   It also can help deal with manufacturing tolerance variations in the shafts.  The 7 gm head weight increment only really addresses those variations in the head weight, nothing else.

 

 

The swing weight concept was developed and tested/validated at a time when there were no different options in terms of either grips - or shafts for that matter.   The use of balance to help match heft is really a short cut - matching balance is not really the purpose of getting a swing weight match.  It was really more about finding a simple, easy to use way to match the MOI of the club.   So the swing weight scale really doesn't handle very well any other changes besides playing length and head weight.   It was never designed or intended to handle those changes.

 

So the real key is that you don't need to adjust - as long as you fit the swing weight with the same grip and grip weight you want to build with.   If you change grip weight, then refit for swing weight with the new grip weight on the range and then use the new value to build to.

Thank you for that.  That does help my understanding the topic better about how the swingweight scale was designed and meant to be used.  Now I understand what people meant that the swingweight scale can't read correctly when you use a larger grip.  It's been calibrated to expect a 50 gram grip on the one end of the balance point and then you are really measuring headweight and length away from the fulcrum, this is why the reading will be false when you use it with a heavier or lighter grip? 

 

   I am confused though about the part at the end about not needing to adjust?  When you say fit the swingweight, you mean with feel and lead tape on the range, not on the scale, correct? Do you have any insight on what I'll need to do with the 3 iron built to 4 iron length and loft?  I have a 10 gram tip weight, I assume I'll need more weight (lead tape) to make this much lighter head work at a shorter length.  Thanks!!!

Edited September 8, 2023 by quizzylish