Mizuno shaft optimizer. I forgot my recommendations. Can anyone check my numbers?

Bill Guy · November 5, 2016

Davemac thanks a million for the reply... really interesting. Something is not right. I do like to "attack" the ball but would not think I have a brisk aggressive swing. I have used firm Callaway graphite shafts for years. The Mizuno fitter gave me Recoil F3's (regualr) to try straight away and then said my numbers were better with the F4 (stiff) so recommended them. On that recommendation I went for 900F's with F4 Recoils.

I guess there might have been a fault on the second optimiser test club that produced what is a very unusual DNA. Hope you enjoy the new clubs. I have a split set of 900 Hot metal and 900 Forged with Mitsubishi Rayon Ot graphite iron shafts on order.

Cheers. What split did you go for? I was thinking of doing that

DaveMac · November 5, 2016

Cheers. What split did you go for? I was thinking of doing that

I only have wimpy swing speed, so with today's strong lofts my irons sets start at a 6 iron these days. I went 6-8 hot metals, 9-GW in the forged. I put 85 gram shafts in everything except the GW which has a 95 gram OT shaft.

I will probably go with a couple of S5's to finish things off

Bill Guy · November 6, 2016

Cheers. What split did you go for? I was thinking of doing that

I only have wimpy swing speed, so with today's strong lofts my irons sets start at a 6 iron these days. I went 6-8 hot metals, 9-GW in the forged. I put 85 gram shafts in everything except the GW which has a 95 gram OT shaft.

I will probably go with a couple of S5's to finish things off

At 8 handicap your swing can't be too bad!! Good luck with your new clubs. I'm in my mid 60's now off 12 and a driver swing speed now down to 90ish. I went for full set 900 forged 4-PW, GW and S5 SW (55/13) + LW (60/10). with the Recoil F4's. I now have them and they have had a couple of outings. First thoughts are they are so different to the Cally X14's I have been using for years and will take a bit of getting used to. I should have seen that the 4 iron is very similar to the 3 iron in my old set which I dropped last year in favour of a 21* Titleist rescue so have taken the 4 out of the bag. The 5 is a bit like my old 4 and works pretty well. While the lofts are supposed to be similar with my old set I am not getting the same distances yet and they are going a bit right of where I think I am aiming. The S5 wedges are lovely with a nice feel. SW wedge is working well though I am thinking of grinding a little off the heal as I did with my old SW so I can lay it a bit more open from tight lies... the reason really why I got the LW but it is not behaving for me and I have taken it out of the bag for the moment.

jasonp87 · November 21, 2016

can anyone run my #s

88mph 5 5 4 6

pd1775 · November 21, 2016

can anyone run my #s

88mph 5 5 4 6

KBS Tour S 120g

Dynamic Gold XP 115 S 117g

KBS C-Taper Lite X 115g

npham · December 28, 2016

Could someone please let me know the shaft recommendations for:

90 3428

Thanks!

jrwingate6 · December 28, 2016

I am also a believer in the Mizuno optimizer.

I've been playing X100's for 7 years and it told me to try the Modus X105. These shafts made such a big difference for me.

pd1775 · December 28, 2016

Could someone please let me know the shaft recommendations for:
90 3428

Thanks!

NS Pro Modus X 105 112g, C Taper Lite S 110g, XP 115 S 117g

jrwingate6 · December 29, 2016

Could someone please let me know the shaft recommendations for:
90 3428

Thanks!
NS Pro Modus X 105 112g, C Taper Lite S 110g, XP 115 S 117g

Do the X Stiff 105's have a similar flex profile to the stiff Taper Lites and the stiff XP 115? I'm just wondering why it would recommend extra stiff in the 105 and stiff in the others.

I only ask because for me personally, I think the X 105's felt closer to a stiff shaft. They felt much more flexible than the DG X100's I've been playing for 7 years.

DaveMac · December 29, 2016

According to Mizuno's EI profiling the Modus 3 X is close to the XP 115 S300, the Modus is a smidgen softer in the butt, which probably contributes to its smooth feel. The C Taper lite is the strongest profile of these 3 recommendations, the difference is mainly in the mid section of the shafts.

jrwingate6 · December 29, 2016

According to Mizuno's EI profiling the Modus 3 X is close to the XP 115 S300, the Modus is a smidgen softer in the butt, which probably contributes to its smooth feel. The C Taper lite is the strongest profile of these 3 recommendations, the difference is mainly in the mid section of the shafts.

Thanks for the info. That makes sense. I personally felt like the X105 felt closer to a stiff shaft than an X stiff

Armour248 · January 2, 2017

I took 10 swings and got the following...any insight would be appreciated. Not sure if the half numbers will make a difference either way

86.6 ss

4

1.5

3.1

3.5

DaveMac · January 2, 2017

I took 10 swings and got the following...any insight would be appreciated. Not sure if the half numbers will make a difference either way

86.6 ss, 4, 1.5, 3.1, 3.5

The shaft recommendations are

KBS CTaper Lite X

Project X 5.5

Project X LZ 5.5

Tempo is on the smooth side, suggesting a little less shaft weight, release is reasonably late, suggesting shafts with a degree of additional tip strength.

Modus 105 X is next recommendations on the list, don't forget to test the recommendations.

Armour248 · January 2, 2017

I took 10 swings and got the following...any insight would be appreciated. Not sure if the half numbers will make a difference either way

86.6 ss, 4, 1.5, 3.1, 3.5

The shaft recommendations are

KBS CTaper Lite X
Project X 5.5
Project X LZ 5.5

Tempo is on the smooth side, suggesting a little less shaft weight, release is reasonably late, suggesting shafts with a degree of additional tip strength.

Modus 105 X is next recommendations on the list, don't forget to test the recommendations.

Thank you! Much appreciated. I've been playing with DG S300s just because they were what came on my AP2s. I bought an indoor range membership this year so I'll hit each of the shafts you mentioned over the next week or so. Having this indoor membership is great because it'll allow me to collect a lot of data over time and then make a purchase decision rather than hitting a club/shaft once or twice and making a decision like I would in the past. My only problem so far is deciding between iron heads themselves...JPX 900 tour, forged, Srixon 765, MP models, etc. So many good iron models these days.

DaveMac · January 2, 2017

Thank you! Much appreciated. I've been playing with DG S300s just because they were what came on my AP2s. I bought an indoor range membership this year so I'll hit each of the shafts you mentioned over the next week or so. Having this indoor membership is great because it'll allow me to collect a lot of data over time and then make a purchase decision rather than hitting a club/shaft once or twice and making a decision like I would in the past. My only problem so far is deciding between iron heads themselves...JPX 900 tour, forged, Srixon 765, MP models, etc. So many good iron models these days.

The only thing keeping DG S300 of your recommendations is your tempo factor, so don't be surprised if they turn out to be your favourite.

Buying new clubs is easy, buying better clubs is much more difficult.

Armour248 · January 3, 2017

The only thing keeping DG S300 of your recommendations is your tempo factor, so don't be surprised if they turn out to be your favourite.

Buying new clubs is easy, buying better clubs is much more difficult.

Interesting on the S300s. I probably wouldn't have even tried the 5.5s since they are tilted toward the "regular" flex area. Will be interesting to see how I like them. I could see the C Taper Lites making sense.

DaveMac · January 3, 2017

The only thing keeping DG S300 of your recommendations is your tempo factor, so don't be surprised if they turn out to be your favourite.

Buying new clubs is easy, buying better clubs is much more difficult.

Interesting on the S300s. I probably wouldn't have even tried the 5.5s since they are tilted toward the "regular" flex area. Will be interesting to see how I like them. I could see the C Taper Lites making sense.

The PX 5.5 is a strong shaft, more than an equal for DG S300, the LZ is a bit softer, this is deliberate to help give it a smoother feel.

Armour248 · January 3, 2017

The PX 5.5 is a strong shaft, more than an equal for DG S300, the LZ is a bit softer, this is deliberate to help give it a smoother feel.

Interesting. Thanks again for the info. Does the Mizuno app consider the new DG AMT shafts?

DaveMac · January 3, 2017

The PX 5.5 is a strong shaft, more than an equal for DG S300, the LZ is a bit softer, this is deliberate to help give it a smoother feel.

Interesting. Thanks again for the info. Does the Mizuno app consider the new DG AMT shafts?

Yes it is in the custom fit cart and so part of the software. It doesn't appear in your top three simply because of the Tempo factor suggesting a little less weight but the S300 is 5th or so in the list. Interestingly Mizuno see the AMT profile as being a little softer than the classic Dynamic Gold.

Armour248 · January 4, 2017

Yes it is in the custom fit cart and so part of the software. It doesn't appear in your top three simply because of the Tempo factor suggesting a little less weight but the S300 is 5th or so in the list. Interestingly Mizuno see the AMT profile as being a little softer than the classic Dynamic Gold.

Awesome thanks. That is interesting on the AMT being a bit softer than the regular DG. Just out of curiosity...is there any data from this that could be translated to driver shafts or is the swing so different that it is completely independent? I would think there may be some crossover but probably not enough to make major conclusions. I'm hoping to try at least one of the shafts that the data gave me later today...hopefully I'll hit all 3 of them by the end of the week.

Armour248 · January 4, 2017

Hit the CTaper Lite X and the LZ 5.5 today with a JPX 900 Tour 6 iron. I was amazed how similar the results were.

CTaper Lite X

LZ 5.5

The CTaper Lite X was launching about 0.8 degrees higher which is good (although I had a stinker of 10.8 mixed in with the LZ 5.5 numbers)...but the dispersion of the LZ 5.5 was more consistent. The LZ 5.5 averaged 1 yard right of center with a standard deviation of 7 yards. The CTL X was 2 yards right of center with a standard deviation of 9 yards. Some of that could've just been my ball striking. I think I liked the feel of the CTL X slightly better than the LZ 5.5. It seemed a bit smoother but really I thought both of them performed amazingly for my swing.

DaveMac · January 5, 2017

@armour248

Good to know you were happy with the feel of two of your recommendations. I am not fimillar with the About Golf system but your launch angle and spin are a touch on the low side, the peak height looks a little low (fine if you play in the wind a lot).

Next time you are testing, take a sleeve of your gamer ball and get a set of base numbers from your current irons, you can use the information to predict the on course flight of the new irons.

Since you like the CTaper feel, the KBS Tour S is worth a try to see if launch and spin comes up a little, it's a much stronger shaft even in S so soft stepping it is not out of the question. The other possibility is the Nippon Modus 105 X. You could also try the C Taper lite S, to see if it feels / performs better than the X, it can be used to see if soft stepping the C Taper lite X is a possibility.

Don't be afraid to drift a little from the recommendations to get the feel / flight / performance you are looking for.

In answer to you earlier question, I don't believe it is possible to use the Optimisers iron shaft profile recommendations to predict a driver shaft. Your current test shows you are getting similar performance from two very different bend profiles. Driver delivery is also different than an iron strike.

It would be reasonable to infer potential starting point shafts from a player's DNA based on previous experience though.

Ping have tried a similar thing using the Skypro swing analyser in the nFlight system to predict driver shafts but I don't think it has been much of a success because it is never discussed on any of the golf forums.

Armour248 · January 5, 2017

Yeah the AboutGolf system is what all of the PGA Tour Superstores have in them. I can't say much for how accurate they are but they seem decent. The golf balls are range quality so the spin/launch numbers could certainly be affected. I've probably hit 10+ shaft/head combinations and I've been keep track of all my stats like the ones I listed above. My average launch angle with a 6 iron (lofts may vary) is only in the mid 13s...so the CTL X was actually pretty good for me. I'll take some better golf balls over today and see if I notice a difference in the results.

You're a fountain of knowledge on this stuff and I appreciate all the help.

Armour248 · January 5, 2017

Hit the PX 5.5 and Pro Modus 105 X today.

PX 5.5...average offline was 5 yards right and the standard deviation was 10 yards

Nippon Pro Modus 105 X...average offline 2 yards left with a standard deviation of 12 yards (no good). Much higher launch though that's for sure.

DaveMac · January 5, 2017

Interesting change with the Modus, I understand the horizontal deviation increased but your flight consistency improved, along with more launch and a little more club head speed. Might be a touch, too soft / tip soft / light.

Certainly worth trying the KBS Tour S, it is pretty much the same as the Project X 5.5 butt, through mid but a bit softer in the tip. It is also a little heavier a 120 grams.

Don't forget it is not just a numbers game, so try hitting alternative shots, with the test club and say a 9 iron, it might help you find the shaft you feel most confortable with easier. We don't hit 10 shots in a row on the course. Throw in a few 3/4, high / low, fades / draw shots into the test if you have the time.

Armour248 · January 5, 2017

I appreciate all the help and insight. Don't you think that 16.3 launch angle with the Modus is a bit too much for a 6i though? I was thinking something between 14-15 would be ideal although I could be wrong. I noticed that the vertical launch and distance was much more consistent with the Modus...but I do think it might have been a bit too soft or light because it seemed harder to control left to right. These are relatively small sample sizes but I think they're at least providing some good data to help in the decision process.

I'll definitely give the KBS Tour S some swings and narrow it down. Never knew finding the right shaft could be so difficult but it's fun and hopefully worth the time.

jrwingate6 · January 5, 2017

All to often with today's technology, I think we sometimes forget about the feel of the shaft while in search for perfect numbers. Yes, obviously you want to game a shaft that gives you great numbers. Just don't be afraid to go with a shaft you think feels the best just because it's launch monitor numbers aren't perfect. If the shaft feels right, you'll adjust to it as long as it fits your swing profile.

Armour248 · January 6, 2017

All to often with today's technology, I think we sometimes forget about the feel of the shaft while in search for perfect numbers. Yes, obviously you want to game a shaft that gives you great numbers. Just don't be afraid to go with a shaft you think feels the best just because it's launch monitor numbers aren't perfect. If the shaft feels right, you'll adjust to it as long as it fits your swing profile.

Yeah it's a good point to make. I'm on the verge of information overload and picking strictly on some launch monitor numbers may not work out for an amateur golfer. I'm hoping to use the numbers to narrow it down to 2-3 options and then pick the one that feels best. It is fun and sort of addicting once you start testing out all sorts of equipment though which can be a problem

DaveMac · January 6, 2017

All to often with today's technology, I think we sometimes forget about the feel of the shaft while in search for perfect numbers. Yes, obviously you want to game a shaft that gives you great numbers. Just don't be afraid to go with a shaft you think feels the best just because it's launch monitor numbers aren't perfect. If the shaft feels right, you'll adjust to it as long as it fits your swing profile.

Yeah it's a good point to make. I'm on the verge of information overload and picking strictly on some launch monitor numbers may not work out for an amateur golfer. I'm hoping to use the numbers to narrow it down to 2-3 options and then pick the one that feels best. It is fun and sort of addicting once you start testing out all sorts of equipment though which can be a problem

100% agree, the shaft feel comes before perfect numbers, that's why I suggested you mix the test up a bit when you get down to a short list.

In answer to your launch question, 14 - 15 would be perfect. The spin numbers are still a little low, given your ball speed, but this might just be down to the simulator. Looking at the bend profiles, the Modus matches the C Taper lite butt to mid then get softer in the tip. The KBS tour is a bit stronger than the C Taper lite butt to lower mid, then softer in the tip. There is nothing that matches the Modus profile with a step increase in overall stiffness, the Dynamic Gold AMT is probably closest, although a little stronger in butt and tip. If the Modus turned out to be the winner in terms of feel, you could hard step it, which would make a subtle difference to the overall strength.

Don't forget to get a set of comparison numbers from your gamers, so you can predict the on course flight you can expect from the new set up, plus see what you are actually gaining from the change.