Tour players who smoke

[TheDarkOne]

[quote name='WilCox' timestamp='1350920005' post='5827603']


Sorry, I just don't see that happening. Can you really see a police car rolling up to the local muni and hauling someone off for smoking on the course? The police have far bigger issues to deal with than that.

We have to agree to disagree.
[/quote]


I've [size=4]seen police, not security, take people out of both Comerica Park and Ford Field when the ban fist went in. You only have to do it a few times and suddenly people start adhering to the law very well. I've also seen the police not only be called to local bars, but actively "visit" them to make sure no one is smoking. Again in the beginning a lot of establishments decided they weren't going to comply, once the person gets taken away and the establishment gets a fine, suddenly it stops.[/size]
[size=4] [/size]
[size=4]Hogan,[/size]
[size=4]This would create an entirely new revenue stream for local police. Trust me if it's a $500-1000 fine, the police will have no problem hauling people away as it makes money for the department. We have already bridged these issues in the ANR and have several legal and social strategies to get new laws in place to regulate. Once we get enough support from our members, we WILL be talking to the PGA tour and more importantly their sponsors very soon. [/size]

[fore_life]

Oh thedarkone, come on man.

[Vindog]

There will be the obvious problem of burden of proof, when dealing with a large expanse of land, such as an 18 hole golf course.

Wanna give me a ticket for smoking? You had better have it on video, or my lawyer will be calling you for harassment.

[ej002]

I live in Chicago. This ban has been in effect for a long time. Go into any one of 10 bars in my neighborhood and there is smoking going on. In some places in Chicago it is enforced, in others, the cops just have waay too much to do. I suspect it is the same way in Detroit. And nobody gets arrested, they get a "citation". The odds of a smoker getting busted on a course would be nil, I would be most smokers are going to "risk" it.

And why in the world would you call the cops on a guy smoking on a course? If he is in your group, avoid him. If he is in your cart, politely ask him to smoke where you are not. If is in another group you just became the world's largest d-bag. This will never ever be enforced. The whole purpose for the restaurants and stadiums is because the close proximity of crowds. There is a person seated right next to you. It is a balance of rights. One guy's right to smoke v. the MANY people around him who do not smoke. In that case, the many win. On a golf course? The individual loses this balance test, b/c there is a less drastic means of addressing the situation. I will also take money on this, me and Hogans71 can play a round on you in 5 years. [However, I can see a ban at PGA tour events, that makes some sense in the scheme of balancing, but there will be dedicated areas at the least.]

Besides what are the cops going to do? Drive out in a police golf cart and ticket you? LMFAO... They have to catch you in the act or on video (like at the stadiums). NEVER EVER going to happen.

[Vindog]

State parks in many states are smoke free, and this (probably, because I don't know for sure) includes municipal golf courses such as Torrey Pines and Bethpage.

However I don't see privately run courses forced into banning smoking.

[DrunkenTiger]

I can't stand the smell. smoking should be completely banned on the planet.

[Seth Pistol]

i don't like the smell of soda. so lets ban it everywhere on the planet as well (clearly this is a dramatization of the above post but you get my point).

i understand the ban of cigarettes or the partitioning of cigarette smokers from the general public in public venues where there are large crowds (airports, baseball games, etc). golf tournaments fall under this same umbrella since there are large crowds and stepping away from the cigarette smoke is virtually impossible. i also would be in favor of the PGA Tour banning cigarettes from the tour. professional athletes should be held to a higher standard since they serve as role models to young, impressionable children (though I also believe it is the duty of a parent to also educate their child since it's impossible to shield a child's eye from all evil).

however, when it comes to smoking on a golf course for a casual golfer, i don't believe that cigarettes should be banned. not because it might alienate consumers in a sport that is undoubtedly struggling, but because its just a fundamental right that a person should have the choice to smoke or not smoke. who has the right to make a choice for someone else based on their health? if someone wants to kill their lungs via cigarette smoke, so be it. starting a ban like this is a slippery slope. where does it end? soda? pork fat? candy? the list goes on and on. eventually free will is no longer our right. i understand if you're sharing a cart with someone who is smoking and you don't appreciate it that you say something. its 100% within the rights of a non-smoker to ask the smoker to stop. but how does that same cigarette smoke effect you when you're 50 yards down the fairway? or even 20 yards down the fairway? you're not going to be effected by second-hand smoke from that distance. you might smell it when you're near that player on the green, however that doesn't give you the right to force them not to smoke. i don't like the smell of people who don't shower, but i can't force them to bathe. i simply avoid those people. and on a golf course, its pretty easy to do the same.

i honestly don't think banning cigarette smoke on golf courses will ever happen. there are already certain private courses that ban smoking, and that is their prerogative as the course is privately owned property. however, i just don't see it happening country and especially worldwide.

ps: nevermind the issues of free will, i don't see cigarettes disappearing anytime soon simply bc of big tobacco and their deep pockets. until cigarettes because an unprofitable business, big tobacco will continue to spend millions to pay lobbyist and to contribute to political campaigns to ensure tobacco is here to stay.

[nfinch10]

Thedarkone- Those policeman you are refering to that kicked the people out of the Tiger's game [b]were hired to be working at the game[/b]. It wasn't like they were on patrol in the city, someone called the cops and they then entered the stadium. They were working at the stadium and got a report from someone, or saw them themselves. Not very pratical to expect a course to hire the same type of security.

[nbg352]

[quote name='TheDarkOne' timestamp='1350917167' post='5827399']
[quote name='WilCox' timestamp='1350916376' post='5827359']
[quote name='TheDarkOne' timestamp='1350914643' post='5827239']
[quote name='WilCox' timestamp='1350912643' post='5827137']
[quote name='TheDarkOne' timestamp='1350909334' post='5826975']
The day is coming, and it isn't that far off, that smoking will be banned at most golf courses in the US. Hopefully we will see the PGA make a move to make this mandatory at all its tour events and for all the players and staff.
[/quote]

I don't see that happening outside of PGA events. For one thing, it's not realistically enforceable. For another, golf courses can't afford to alienate players in the current economy. Just my 2 cents.
[/quote]

[size=4]Would you think it ever would have been banned at outdoor stadiums, concerts, air shows etc. etc.? [/size]
[/quote]

I hear what you're saying, but those places employ a small army of security people, marshalls, etc to enforce the restriction as part of their assigned duties. That's just not economically feasible at most golf courses.
[/quote]

[size=4]Again, look at the places the ban is already in effect. When it’s made a law it becomes very simple, if people do it you call the police. Are there enough police to enforce the speed limit on every piece of road? Of course not, but sooner or later if you break the law it catches up with you. If they ban smoking at a golf course, you revoke a member’s membership if they are caught, with no refund. If a guest does it, it then reflects on the member. If it’s a public course, and a law was put into place, you would simply call the police and have the person arrested. It’s no different than what you see at bars now in Michigan. Last time I was at a Tiger’s game I saw a man removed because he was smoking in the stadium. This was done by the police, not security.[/size]

[size=4]Trust me, this is coming, and it’s only a matter of time. My group is in no way the only one pushing for this. There are several organizations lobbying the PGA tour as we speak to do something about this. Smokeless is a harder fight to make, but for cigarettes it’s an easy argument and I would guess in 5 years or less it will be gone from most golf courses. Is anyone really seeing smokers’ rights extended anywhere? Most people have had enough of their lives being affected by tobacco addicts.[/size]
[/quote]
Fanaticism at it's worst!
I sure hope you don't have any bad habits we can turn into someone's pet social issue.

[ej002]

[quote name='Seth Pistol' timestamp='1350924773' post='5827917']
i don't like the smell of soda. so lets ban it everywhere on the planet as well (clearly this is a dramatization of the above post but you get my point).

i understand the ban of cigarettes or the partitioning of cigarette smokers from the general public in public venues where there are large crowds (airports, baseball games, etc). golf tournaments fall under this same umbrella since there are large crowds and stepping away from the cigarette smoke is virtually impossible. i[b] also would be in favor of the PGA Tour banning cigarettes from the tour. professional athletes should be held to a higher standard since they serve as role models to young, impressionable children (though I also believe it is the duty of a parent to also educate their child since it's impossible to shield a child's eye from all evil).[/b]

however, when it comes to smoking on a golf course for a casual golfer, i don't believe that cigarettes should be banned. not because it might alienate consumers in a sport that is undoubtedly struggling, but because its just a fundamental right that a person should have the choice to smoke or not smoke. who has the right to make a choice for someone else based on their health? if someone wants to kill their lungs via cigarette smoke, so be it. starting a ban like this is a slippery slope. where does it end? soda? pork fat? candy? the list goes on and on. eventually free will is no longer our right. i understand if you're sharing a cart with someone who is smoking and you don't appreciate it that you say something. its 100% within the rights of a non-smoker to ask the smoker to stop. but how does that same cigarette smoke effect you when you're 50 yards down the fairway? or even 20 yards down the fairway? you're not going to be effected by second-hand smoke from that distance. you might smell it when you're near that player on the green, however that doesn't give you the right to force them not to smoke. i don't like the smell of people who don't shower, but i can't force them to bathe. i simply avoid those people. and on a golf course, its pretty easy to do the same.

i honestly don't think banning cigarette smoke on golf courses will ever happen. there are already certain private courses that ban smoking, and that is their prerogative as the course is privately owned property. however, i just don't see it happening country and especially worldwide.

ps: nevermind the issues of free will, i don't see cigarettes disappearing anytime soon simply bc of big tobacco and their deep pockets. until cigarettes because an unprofitable business, big tobacco will continue to spend millions to pay lobbyist and to contribute to political campaigns to ensure tobacco is here to stay.
[/quote]

Otherwise good post, but I don't agree with banning it for the actual pga player. They are not roll models and that is not their responsibilty. That is a parent's responsibility.

[Vindog]

[quote name='ej002' timestamp='1350927348' post='5828097']Otherwise good post, but I don't agree with banning it for the actual pga player. They are not roll models and that is not their responsibilty. That is a parent's responsibility.
[/quote]

I mostly agree. I think it's a great idea for them to try and keep it off of the TV as much as they can. And generally, most players are pretty cognizant of that.

I don't see the need to ban on tour for appearances sake, but if they somehow "decide" that using tobacco somehow relaxes you and creates an "unfair advantage", then that would be the way it goes...

[Swingem]

[quote name='nbg352' timestamp='1350925517' post='5827955']
[quote name='TheDarkOne' timestamp='1350917167' post='5827399']
[quote name='WilCox' timestamp='1350916376' post='5827359']
[quote name='TheDarkOne' timestamp='1350914643' post='5827239']
[quote name='WilCox' timestamp='1350912643' post='5827137']
[quote name='TheDarkOne' timestamp='1350909334' post='5826975']
The day is coming, and it isn't that far off, that smoking will be banned at most golf courses in the US. Hopefully we will see the PGA make a move to make this mandatory at all its tour events and for all the players and staff.
[/quote]

I don't see that happening outside of PGA events. For one thing, it's not realistically enforceable. For another, golf courses can't afford to alienate players in the current economy. Just my 2 cents.
[/quote]

[size=4]Would you think it ever would have been banned at outdoor stadiums, concerts, air shows etc. etc.? [/size]
[/quote]

I hear what you're saying, but those places employ a small army of security people, marshalls, etc to enforce the restriction as part of their assigned duties. That's just not economically feasible at most golf courses.
[/quote]

[size=4]Again, look at the places the ban is already in effect. When it’s made a law it becomes very simple, if people do it you call the police. Are there enough police to enforce the speed limit on every piece of road? Of course not, but sooner or later if you break the law it catches up with you. If they ban smoking at a golf course, you revoke a member’s membership if they are caught, with no refund. If a guest does it, it then reflects on the member. If it’s a public course, and a law was put into place, you would simply call the police and have the person arrested. It’s no different than what you see at bars now in Michigan. Last time I was at a Tiger’s game I saw a man removed because he was smoking in the stadium. This was done by the police, not security.[/size]

[size=4]Trust me, this is coming, and it’s only a matter of time. My group is in no way the only one pushing for this. There are several organizations lobbying the PGA tour as we speak to do something about this. Smokeless is a harder fight to make, but for cigarettes it’s an easy argument and I would guess in 5 years or less it will be gone from most golf courses. Is anyone really seeing smokers’ rights extended anywhere? Most people have had enough of their lives being affected by tobacco addicts.[/size]
[/quote]
Fanaticism at it's worst!
I sure hope you don't have any bad habits we can turn into someone's pet social issue.
[/quote]

LOL! The Tobacco Taliban.

[hogans71]

[quote name='Vindog' timestamp='1350921136' post='5827677']

Wanna give me a ticket for smoking? You had better have it on video, or my lawyer will be calling you for harassment.
[/quote]

Herein lies just the beginning of problems. And with TDO'a suggestion of $1000 fines you'll see many deciding to take this thing to court. Which clogs up our already overrun court systems as well as taking those officers off their duties to attend court themselves.

I see a few similarities with this and driving and the use of cell phones. That practice is against the law in Chicago yet its broken with unbelievable regularity and rarely, if ever, enforced. I know of no one who doesn't violate it multiple times per day and has yet to be issued a citation . The fines aren't high enough and odds are, if you are caught and decide to drain the three hours out of your day to fight it, you will win. It'll be even easier this smoking nonsense...

As far as smoking on Tour us concerned- does anybody really care that a half dozen or so guys light up? Does anybody feel that sponsors may drop if some sort of pressure is exerted because of a great minority of players? I highly doubt it. In the last few seasons i've seen THREE shots of players smoking on TV- once by Daly, twice by Spencer Levin. Quite frankly, I was unaware of many of the others mentioned were smokers...

[smoothie4896]

[quote name='TheDarkOne' timestamp='1350914643' post='5827239']
[quote name='WilCox' timestamp='1350912643' post='5827137']
[quote name='TheDarkOne' timestamp='1350909334' post='5826975']
The day is coming, and it isn't that far off, that smoking will be banned at most golf courses in the US. Hopefully we will see the PGA make a move to make this mandatory at all its tour events and for all the players and staff.
[/quote]

I don't see that happening outside of PGA events. For one thing, it's not realistically enforceable. For another, golf courses can't afford to alienate players in the current economy. Just my 2 cents.
[/quote]

[size=4]Would you think it ever would have been banned at outdoor stadiums, concerts, air shows etc. etc.? At Comerica Park for example, tobacco addicts still have a few designated places they can indulge in, but other than that you can't. Attendance doesn't seem to have went down, and as a non smoker it's great again to go to the games and not have to be by a chimney. Rumor is Leyland is going to quit after this season if they win the WS, or should I say when [/size]
[size=4]Look, if Pro Golfers are stupid enough to invite cancer, so be it. But I absolutely cringe whenever I see it on television. It would be nice if at a minimum the golf courses set up a place that tobacco addicts could go to handle there addiction out of the public eye until they can get past it. Kids are impressionable and seeing a pro golfer doing something like that can be enough for some to think it's ok. The sad thing is, smoking is designed to addict people instantly so many times before parents, friends, or anyone else can help them they already are addicted.[/size]

[size=4]If anyone else is interested in learning more, I'm part of an organization called XXX. I have been involved since the 80s. They have been tremendously helpful for myself and a handful of other members at a local course that we pushing to make the change to be a tobacco free environment.[/size]

[size=4]If any of you are interested in helping expand the boundaries for a smoke free America please check it out. Myself and others have been lobbying them vary hard to atr a minimum inter act and get some talks going with the PGA tour and see what can be done. I guarantee if we start talking to tour sponsors and get them to buy in, they will take notice very fast.[/size]
[/quote]

[size=3][color=#000000]You know what’s even worse than kids possibly seeing their favorite athlete smoking? The possibility of some of the young kids on this site possibly reading your post filled with your liberal indoctrination. Nothing says AMERICA like forcing your views on your fellow man, huh?[/color][/size]
[size=3][color=#000000]Hey Professor, keep your liberal progressive website off the WRX. [/color][/size]

[Thrillhouse]

SMOKING FIIIIIGGGGGHHHHTTTTTT!!!!!!!

[geesecougar2]

I'm sorry but I can't help but thinking about that South Park where Rob Reiner admonishes smokers whilst stuffing his obese face.

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6THpqoPjong&feature=related"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6THpqoPjong&feature=related[/url]

[Vindog]

How about a clip from the Museum of Tolerance LOL



http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&v=gUEjnoWpdao&NR=1

[Arizonalefty59]

[quote name='Vindog' timestamp='1350921732' post='5827717']
State parks in many states are smoke free, and this (probably, because I don't know for sure) includes municipal golf courses such as Torrey Pines and Bethpage.

However I don't see privately run courses forced into banning smoking.
[/quote]
I don't know about Torrey Pines, I played with a kid a few years older than me on the North Course he was about 22 and he lit up a cig every hole and smoked in front of the ranger when he came up to us and he didn't say anything. I was talkin to one of the rangers as well and I had a flippin boulder in my lip and I didn't get asked to throw it out.

I usually only dip on the course because it calms me down. I DO NOT EVER SPIT ON THE GREENS, and will never ever do that either, it's a gross habit I do admit and I will quit but if its true that the world is ending in December I want to go through as many cans as possible haha.

[Vindog]

[quote name='Arizonalefty59' timestamp='1350948249' post='5829967']
[quote name='Vindog' timestamp='1350921732' post='5827717']
State parks in many states are smoke free, and this (probably, because I don't know for sure) includes municipal golf courses such as Torrey Pines and Bethpage.

However I don't see privately run courses forced into banning smoking.
[/quote]
I don't know about Torrey Pines, I played with a kid a few years older than me on the North Course he was about 22 and he lit up a cig every hole and smoked in front of the ranger when he came up to us and he didn't say anything. I was talkin to one of the rangers as well and I had a flippin boulder in my lip and I didn't get asked to throw it out.

I usually only dip on the course because it calms me down. I DO NOT EVER SPIT ON THE GREENS, and will never ever do that either, it's a gross habit I do admit and I will quit but if its true that the world is ending in December I want to go through as many cans as possible haha.
[/quote]

It has been the Policy of the city of Can Diego since 2006 that smoking is prohibited at its parks, courses and beaches. Whether or not they enforce it is another matter.

They made an exception in 2008 for players and caddies at the US Open...

[profsmitty]

[quote name='TheDarkOne' timestamp='1350914643' post='5827239']
[quote name='WilCox' timestamp='1350912643' post='5827137']
[quote name='TheDarkOne' timestamp='1350909334' post='5826975']
The day is coming, and it isn't that far off, that smoking will be banned at most golf courses in the US. Hopefully we will see the PGA make a move to make this mandatory at all its tour events and for all the players and staff.
[/quote]

I don't see that happening outside of PGA events. For one thing, it's not realistically enforceable. For another, golf courses can't afford to alienate players in the current economy. Just my 2 cents.
[/quote]

Would you think it ever would have been banned at outdoor stadiums, concerts, air shows etc. etc.? At Comerica Park for example, tobacco addicts still have a few designated places they can indulge in, but other than that you can't. Attendance doesn't seem to have went down, and as a non smoker it's great again to go to the games and not have to be by a chimney. Rumor is Leyland is going to quit after this season if they win the WS, or should I say when
Look, if Pro Golfers are stupid enough to invite cancer, so be it. But I absolutely cringe whenever I see it on television. It would be nice if at a minimum the golf courses set up a place that tobacco addicts could go to handle there addiction out of the public eye until they can get past it. Kids are impressionable and seeing a pro golfer doing something like that can be enough for some to think it's ok. The sad thing is, smoking is designed to addict people instantly so many times before parents, friends, or anyone else can help them they already are addicted.

If anyone else is interested in learning more, I'm part of an organization called XXX They have been tremendously helpful for myself and a handful of other members at a local course that we pushing to make the change to be a tobacco free environment.

If any of you are interested in helping expand the boundaries for a smoke free America please check it out. Myself and others have been lobbying them vary hard to atr a minimum inter act and get some talks going with the PGA tour and see what can be done. I guarantee if we start talking to tour sponsors and get them to buy in, they will take notice very fast.
[/quote]
This reply presented a very difficult moderating situation. The organization mentioned by the member and its website could be considered a violation of our long-standing prohibition against political posts. I firmly believe that was not the member's intent. Therefore, I have decided to delete the part of the post that would identify the group and the website. I would suggest that anyone who might be interested in the group described in the post could either use Google to find the name of the organization from the description of their mission or use your imagination about another fairly obvious way you could find out the name of the group mentioned by the member.

[CCUgolfer23]

[quote name='TheDarkOne' timestamp='1350920565' post='5827649']
[quote name='WilCox' timestamp='1350920005' post='5827603']
Sorry, I just don't see that happening. Can you really see a police car rolling up to the local muni and hauling someone off for smoking on the course? The police have far bigger issues to deal with than that.

We have to agree to disagree.
[/quote]


I've [size=4]seen police, not security, take people out of both Comerica Park and Ford Field when the ban fist went in. You only have to do it a few times and suddenly people start adhering to the law very well. I've also seen the police not only be called to local bars, but actively "visit" them to make sure no one is smoking. Again in the beginning a lot of establishments decided they weren't going to comply, once the person gets taken away and the establishment gets a fine, suddenly it stops.[/size]

[size=4]Hogan,[/size]
[size=4]This would create an entirely new revenue stream for local police. Trust me if it's a $500-1000 fine, [b]the police will have no problem hauling people away as it makes money for the [/b]department. We have already bridged these issues in the ANR and have several legal and social strategies to get new laws in place to regulate. Once we get enough support from our members, we WILL be talking to the PGA tour and more importantly their sponsors very soon. [/size]
[/quote]

Once again Comerica Park has PAID EMPLOYEES to do this job. They have security personal to handle this job. Tell me one golf course that has security and paid employees to make sure everyone who comes into a golf course dosent have a pack on them? I like how you dont want to surround youself with people who smoke but you are way too unrealistic. And the fact you think police will arrest people who smoke is absurd. You live in Detroit one of the toughest cities in America where crime runs rampant, do you honestly want police to worry about smokers? They have murders, rapes, assults and other real crimes to worry about. Go to you local police department "if" the PGA bans smoking and tell them that cops should be at a local muni arresting smokers they will laugh in you face, and aswell as the PGA. They dont really care about a small anti smoking group, they also have bigger and better things to worry about then somebody who is doing something he as an American is entitled to do. Its a persons right that they can smoke as long as they are 18.

[profsmitty]

I'm afraid we are wandering very far away from OPs original question. The direction the thread has veered towards is interesting and worthy of its own thread (which It has been before, by the way) and I would ask anyone who is interested in pursuing the issue of tobacco use and the PGA tour, etc to start their own thread. I will do my best to make sure that posters stay to the topic you start.

Until then, let's respect the topic the OP started. Thank you.

[geesecougar2]

FWIW I believe Tiger still dips, as I've seen him with a lump in his mouth a few times during the Fedex Cup playoffs.

IIRC he is partial to snus, which he was introduced to by his (former) Swedish kinfolk.

[jons1]

the PGA should ban smoking, dip, and any other performance enhancement drugs (as well as the USGA for that matter). Yes, it's a drug, and for one, it alters the mood and mindset of the player, giving the player an edge during competition. Any smoker or dipper keeping it real will say it helps them cope with stress and pressure better, and even relaxes.... otherwise they wouldn't do it. It's a crutch, and crutches are cheating in golf (see anchoring your putter). And second, it's irresponsible to allow it for a public image of life on tour and general health. Even when smoking was popular, Jack Nicklaus had enough sense to realize he looked like a jack a** doing it. Players in 2012 have no excuse. If they want to go to the bar and drink and smoke themselves to death, go for it, but not on the course. Flame away but that's my opinion.

[geesecougar2]

[quote name='golfpros1' timestamp='1350965103' post='5831393']
the PGA should ban smoking, dip, and any other performance enhancement drugs (as well as the USGA for that matter). Yes, it's a drug, and for one, it alters the mood and mindset of the player, giving the player an edge during competition. Any smoker or dipper keeping it real will say it helps them cope with stress and pressure better, and even relaxes.... otherwise they wouldn't do it. It's a crutch, and crutches are cheating in golf (see anchoring your putter). And second, it's irresponsible to allow it for a public image of life on tour and general health. Even when smoking was popular, Jack Nicklaus had enough sense to realize he looked like a jack a** doing it. Players in 2012 have no excuse. If they want to go to the bar and drink and smoke themselves to death, go for it, but not on the course. Flame away but that's my opinion.
[/quote]

I can respect that you think it should be banned for image's sake, as there is precedent in other sports which I don't necessarily disagree with. And you are right about Jack quitting.

But it is not a performance enhancer. Smoking doesn't enable someone to handle pressure and stress to a greater degree than a non-smoker. Smokers need the nicotine to be able to cope with the stress and pressure to the same degree as a non-smoker.

[hogans71]

[quote name='golfpros1' timestamp='1350965103' post='5831393']
the PGA should ban smoking, dip, and any other performance enhancement drugs (as well as the USGA for that matter). Yes, it's a drug, and for one, it alters the mood and mindset of the player, giving the player an edge during competition. Any smoker or dipper keeping it real will say it helps them cope with stress and pressure better, and even relaxes.... otherwise they wouldn't do it. It's a crutch, and crutches are cheating in golf (see anchoring your putter). And second, it's irresponsible to allow it for a public image of life on tour and general health. Even when smoking was popular, Jack Nicklaus had enough sense to realize he looked like a jack a** doing it. Players in 2012 have no excuse. If they want to go to the bar and drink and smoke themselves to death, go for it, but not on the course. Flame away but that's my opinion.
[/quote]

post of the year!

I'm with you! Ban it- but don't stop there! Ban pb&j sandwiches! Too many kids are allergic to nuts these days! Ban Camillo's red bull! Furyk's eight hour energy drink! Don't let those coffee drinkers slip through the cracks- such a stimulant should be against the law!

[jons1]

[quote name='hogans71' timestamp='1350968870' post='5831609']
[quote name='golfpros1' timestamp='1350965103' post='5831393']
the PGA should ban smoking, dip, and any other performance enhancement drugs (as well as the USGA for that matter). Yes, it's a drug, and for one, it alters the mood and mindset of the player, giving the player an edge during competition. Any smoker or dipper keeping it real will say it helps them cope with stress and pressure better, and even relaxes.... otherwise they wouldn't do it. It's a crutch, and crutches are cheating in golf (see anchoring your putter). And second, it's irresponsible to allow it for a public image of life on tour and general health. Even when smoking was popular, Jack Nicklaus had enough sense to realize he looked like a jack a** doing it. Players in 2012 have no excuse. If they want to go to the bar and drink and smoke themselves to death, go for it, but not on the course. Flame away but that's my opinion.
[/quote]

post of the year!

I'm with you! Ban it- but don't stop there! Ban pb&j sandwiches! Too many kids are allergic to nuts these days! Ban Camillo's red bull! Furyk's eight hour energy drink! Don't let those coffee drinkers slip through the cracks- such a stimulant should be against the law!
[/quote]

it's as addictive as heroin for 1, and more deaths are caused each year by tobacco use than by all deaths from HIV, illegal drug use, alcohol use, motor vehicle injuries, suicides, and murders combined. Yeah, it's just like peanut butter and jelly sandwiches and caffeine... I see your point. Frankly, the PGA Tour should fine players that are caught doing any version of it during events.

[Thrillhouse]

[quote name='golfpros1' timestamp='1350970717' post='5831695']
[quote name='hogans71' timestamp='1350968870' post='5831609']
[quote name='golfpros1' timestamp='1350965103' post='5831393']
the PGA should ban smoking, dip, and any other performance enhancement drugs (as well as the USGA for that matter). Yes, it's a drug, and for one, it alters the mood and mindset of the player, giving the player an edge during competition. Any smoker or dipper keeping it real will say it helps them cope with stress and pressure better, and even relaxes.... otherwise they wouldn't do it. It's a crutch, and crutches are cheating in golf (see anchoring your putter). And second, it's irresponsible to allow it for a public image of life on tour and general health. Even when smoking was popular, Jack Nicklaus had enough sense to realize he looked like a jack a** doing it. Players in 2012 have no excuse. If they want to go to the bar and drink and smoke themselves to death, go for it, but not on the course. Flame away but that's my opinion.
[/quote]

post of the year!

I'm with you! Ban it- but don't stop there! Ban pb&j sandwiches! Too many kids are allergic to nuts these days! Ban Camillo's red bull! Furyk's eight hour energy drink! Don't let those coffee drinkers slip through the cracks- such a stimulant should be against the law!
[/quote]

it's as addictive as heroin for 1, and more deaths are caused each year by tobacco use than by all deaths from HIV, illegal drug use, alcohol use, motor vehicle injuries, suicides, and murders combined. Yeah, it's just like peanut butter and jelly sandwiches and caffeine... I see your point. Frankly, the PGA Tour should fine players that are caught doing any version of it during events.
[/quote]

Someone's been to the CDC website!

Were you going to plagiarize the whole thing for us? Do you have any thoughts of your own on this matter? Or do you, is that you thing, you come into a bar, you read some obscure passage, and then pretend, you pawn it off as your own, as your own idea just to impress some girl and embarrass my friend? You see, the sad thing about a guy like you is that in 50 years, you're gonna start doing some thinking on your own and you're gonna come up with the fact that there are two certainties in life. One: don't do that. And two: you dropped a 150 grand on a ****** education you could have gotten for a dollar fifty in late charges at the public library.

[nightwalker]

The Huxley's, Orwell's, and others were right... We are not going to have Fascism forced down out throats, on the contrary, the emotion driven public will instead demand it.

[iBanesto]

 

Too hardcore.