What do you think?

[Gxgolfer]

Because of the machining used, you will probably never see this on a retail putter. The profit margins are much higher though.

 

Unless somebody wins a tour event with a spider web faced putter it ain't gonna matter.

 

When RJB gets a call from Mizuno that there's a rush for spider putters, that's when he gets concerned. There's no money in it.

[drewspin]

Great post, Dave!

[gticlay]

I say who gives a crap? It's a one off for a customer who requested it. I wouldn't want it but I hope that Toby Tan or whomever it was enjoys the heck outta that thing.

 

I REALLY am feigning for the cool Portland with the soundslot. Slighters are just uber expensive!

[Seve424]

Slighters are just uber expensive!

 

Actually they're not much more than a retail Cameron, although the OTR Cameron has better resale value.

[choeppner]

Dang...I really thought this would be dead by now.

 

Great post Dave. :)

 

-CHRIS-

[glenwayputters]

I agree somewhat stage1350, but what prevents Tom from coming up with his own "collectible design". Something that may be worth $$$ down the road, instead of a reminder of him copying another puttermaker... again "customer service"? When do you say no?

 

Open question to JGalls, Glenwayputters, Xtrastiff (yes I see you all in here)....would your putter guys do a "dreamweaver" on their putters knowing Bett has made one?

 

 

I don't speak for David unless I know his stance and I am pretty sure I know his stance on an issue like this.

 

He wouldn't do something like the "dreamweaver" (is that what it is called?).

 

He has his own line of putters and is developing some tweaks to that line, as we speak.

 

He will do what a customer asks for, but if someone asked him to do that, he would probably ask them to go to the original maker of the design to have it made.

 

Jay

[cbae]

[JGalls]

I agree somewhat stage1350, but what prevents Tom from coming up with his own "collectible design". Something that may be worth $$$ down the road, instead of a reminder of him copying another puttermaker... again "customer service"? When do you say no?

 

Open question to JGalls, Glenwayputters, Xtrastiff (yes I see you all in here)....would your putter guys do a "dreamweaver" on their putters knowing Bett has made one?

 

 

I don't speak for David unless I know his stance and I am pretty sure I know his stance on an issue like this.

 

He wouldn't do something like the "dreamweaver" (is that what it is called?).

 

He has his own line of putters and is developing some tweaks to that line, as we speak.

 

He will do what a customer asks for, but if someone asked him to do that, he would probably ask them to go to the original maker of the design to have it made.

 

Jay

 

I fault the person who placed the order and not the putter maker. If you like the style, stamp, design, etc. of a certain putter putter maker that get a putter from that person. I personally would get it right from the source instead of "outsourcing" the work to another maker. In these situations I don't blame Slighter, but instead I blame the person that PAID Slighter to do the work. Get an original...not something close.

 

Would I pay David Mills to make a Cameron 009 style? No

 

Would I buy a Cameron Circa when I can get the original with a T.P. Mills? No

 

Would I commission Slighter to make me a dreamweaver design, when I can get the original in a Betty? No.

 

Basically, enjoy the designs that each maker contributes and leave their designs to them... I have purchased putters from Tom and they're an excellent product, but I've always asked him to add his own personal touches to each of HIS custom models. When I've ordered customs from David I've always asked him to do as he wishes with the stampings and such. I strongly believe in letting the artist do as they wish...

[mhighman]

Ok... I haven't read pages 2 or 3 yet.. so if i missed anything sorry.

 

XXIO,

 

no hard feelings... I as just stating my opinion and I could see where you stood on this topic.

 

 

as for the nano mill... I don't believe Tom can afford one of these.

 

 

Chris,

 

I can't believe you can say that about Tom. You think he wants to make a quick buck! I guess he could charge $1500 or more for his custom putters huh?

 

I talk to Tom constantly! He recognizes that Bettinardi did it. He said basically the same thing... it is flattery that we would want to try something out like this. Tom wanted to take on the challenge. he did and he delivered. Quite well by the way!

 

I am so glad alot of you are seeing the positive in this and that is why Golfwrx is a great forum. Open minds are great in the world of putters.

 

If any of you have any questions... PM me. If you want to rant about something... speak with me.

 

I can assure you... Tom doesn't do this to make a quick buck, he doesn't do it to steal designs. He does it because he comes home from his other job and starts up on his putters because he loves it. Thus why he doesn't charge outragous prices for his putters. Every single putter he makes... he hits a ball with before it gets packed up. Cause he feels that each creation is something spectacular.

 

again... PM me or email me if you have any comments or questions.

 

and also... Thank you to the Golfwrx Community.

[jaw2000]

While I can't really agree or disagree with too much that has been said here.....

 

1. I would assume that if Mills, Cameron, Bettinardi, or any other name maker read this thread they'd laugh.

 

2. No excuse for making a regular putter into a fake tour putter.

 

3. Copying a spiderweb is like copying a snowflake.

 

I for one think there are PLENTY of differences in the 2 putters, enough such that it's more than clear that one is a Bettinardi and the other isn't.

 

For anyone who cannot tell the differences - well it just doesn't matter as they'd not really care one way or another.

 

I am not trying to pick any fights, nor say one side is right and another is wrong. I am saying that this seems to be getting much more play than it's worth. It's not a clone, not a fake, and not a copy, there are a heap of other identifying characteristics on the 2 (TOTALLY DIFFERENT) model putters.

 

Did the buyer see the other design - maybe, so what?

 

Does this mean that anyone who puts a US flag on the face of a putter is stealiing from Bettinardi?

 

I mean, c'mom - the flag is not copywritten, nor is engraving things on putter faces.

 

As I said in item 2, if the owner said, here's a stock Bettinardi can you make it look like this - THAT would be a different story, as this is not the case - I say this is no more than simple flattery - and I suspect that Bettinardi would feel the same.

[lumbee1977]

jaw2000....well said.

[MikeJohnson]

M.P.H,

Do you really think anybody would buy a Slighter if they were $1500.00? They are priced the way they are because IMO not many people would pay more than that for his work. He makes an excellent product but most people who collect putters only spend $1500.00 on something they know is worth the money. Slighter worth $1500.00? I don't think so!

Mike

[JGalls]

M.P.H,

Do you really think anybody would buy a Slighter if they were $1500.00? They are priced the way they are because IMO not many people would pay more than that for his work. He makes an excellent product but most people who collect putters only spend $1500.00 on something they know is worth the money. Slighter worth $1500.00? I don't think so!

Mike

 

 

MPH can correct me if I'm wrong, but he wasn't saying that Tom would/could charge $1500, instead I believe he was hinting at how reasonable he prices his customs versus other makers.

[choeppner]

Hey Guys,

 

I'm the one that threw the gas in the fire. Now I am the one that is saying let's just give it a rest. I really don't think there is to much more that can be said that hasn't been said already. Each of us has our own opinions and own beliefs. That's what makes each of us Unique and what makes this site great.

 

I really didn't think this thing would grow to be this long. Let's find something niftier totalk about....LIke designs we WOULD like to see or Markings that we would like to see on a putter.

 

Past is past done is done.

 

-CHRIS-

[cbae]

M.P.H,

Do you really think anybody would buy a Slighter if they were $1500.00? They are priced the way they are because IMO not many people would pay more than that for his work. He makes an excellent product but most people who collect putters only spend $1500.00 on something they know is worth the money. Slighter worth $1500.00? I don't think so!

Mike

 

What makes any putter "worth" $1500?

[jcigars]

M.P.H,

Do you really think anybody would buy a Slighter if they were $1500.00? They are priced the way they are because IMO not many people would pay more than that for his work. He makes an excellent product but most people who collect putters only spend $1500.00 on something they know is worth the money. Slighter worth $1500.00? I don't think so!

Mike

 

What makes any putter "worth" $1500?

 

someone who is willing to pay for it :)

[choeppner]

What makes any putter "worth" $1500?

 

A good friend once told me that a putter is only worth what someone is willing to pay. If to that person it is worth $1500.00 then it is a $1500 dollar putter. Heck, I've sold some things on ebay in the past that I could't believe what people were willing to pay. LOL

 

-CHRIS-

 

Dang. We tied in the response Jimmy. LOL

 

-CHRIS-

[mhighman]

What the heck keep this MoFo open.

 

It is a slow day at work for me.

 

It would be great though if we can ask Mitch/MPH and Todd/TKSputters if they can ask their respective puttermakers what they think of a situation like this, putting them in each other's shoes.

 

Would Slighter be "slighted" if someone started taking his logo and putting it on other putters?

M.P.H,

Do you really think anybody would buy a Slighter if they were $1500.00? They are priced the way they are because IMO not many people would pay more than that for his work. He makes an excellent product but most people who collect putters only spend $1500.00 on something they know is worth the money. Slighter worth $1500.00? I don't think so!

Mike

 

 

MPH can correct me if I'm wrong, but he wasn't saying that Tom would/could charge $1500, instead I believe he was hinting at how reasonable he prices his customs versus other makers.

 

 

Thank you... that is what I mean. Tom doesn't want to charge that much for a putter.

[MikeJohnson]

I wasnt saying he would charge that much for a putter. Just sayin' that if he did he would go out of business because people wouldnt pay that much for a Slighter.

[JGalls]

I wasnt saying he would charge that much for a putter. Just sayin' that if he did he would go out of business because people wouldnt pay that much for a Slighter.

 

Most putter makers would... No reason to single out Slighter :)

[mhighman]

Thats what I was thinking.

 

I know it would be extremely hard for MYSELF to pay that much for any putter. Tom realizes the same thing. So he tries to keep his prices down.

 

I am glad David and John and other putter makers have kept their prices relatively low as well. Scotty makes a great production putter as well to have his lower priced putters.

 

Tom is going to hopefully be releasing a production line as well so we can have an even lower priced putter for people to put in the bag.

[xxio]

So far this thread is starting to calm down. Like I told LaMont debate is good as long as there are no personal attacks. It lets us examine other viewpoints we otherwise would not have considered.

 

Question to all the ones that said that since it is trademarked it shouldn't be an issue. Don't you think that Tom should have/could have put his own spin on the web design? From the looks of it it is an exact copy.

 

Just like we see American flag designs on a lot of things, a lot of them are different styles. Why the need to do the exact same "font/design"(???). I'm sure a little brainstorming with the customer and they can come up with their own "spidey" that the customer can be happy with. That for me would be a better show of customer service

[mhighman]

XXIO,

 

I can tell you right now it was not copied off of the bettinardi design! It was programmed into the mill that Tom bought Dean(our machinest). Dean runs his machining business and doesn't do much with putters and doubt he has even seen the Dreamweaver.

 

It is a beautiful putter, however it was not used in the design of the webbing on Toby Tan's Putter.

 

So that subject can be dropped.

 

I am glad this topic simmered down! It wasn't going anywhere good before. I appreciate everyones opinion and agree with some.

 

I hope the new year goes well for all of you.

[AcesAZ]

My beef with Slighter putters is his unoriginality. I haven't owned one but from what I've seen and heard they are very good/great putters. But to make putters to resemble Scotty's (Dancing letters, Stamps, etc.) is bad taste IMO. Re-stamping other peoples putters (Scotty's) with similar stamps is really in bad taste as well. He would be wise to try and stick to his own ideas and style so he can create a much better name and reputation for himself that way.

 

Betty and Mills have created their own style and I like that much more when looking at purchasing/owning putters.

[TM golf guy]

Let it die people.

[xxio]

MPH,

 

Maybe my eyes are not "pro" enough to see the differences. I am near sighted in my right eye and far sighted in my left.

 

From pics they look very similar, the actual machines and programs used may have been different but the results based on pics could've fooled me.

 

Who made the actual design then of the spider web? Tom or Dean?

 

Edit to add. I took a longer look this time. The webbing on the Bett does seem to be more and lesser gaps than the Slighter. But you do have to admit having the center of the web toward the toe and spreading out from there is kind of "copycattish".

[SwingMan]

My beef with Slighter putters is his unoriginality. I haven't owned one but from what I've seen and heard they are very good/great putters. But to make putters to resemble Scotty's (Dancing letters, Stamps, etc.) is bad taste IMO. Re-stamping other peoples putters (Scotty's) with similar stamps is really in bad taste as well. He would be wise to try and stick to his own ideas and style so he can create a much better name and reputation for himself that way.

 

Betty and Mills have created their own style and I like that much more when looking at purchasing/owning putters.

 

 

A Scotty Man complaining about someone else's lack of originality.

 

Who'd have thunk it? :cheesy:

 

Now we know that everything that has been said, has been said. The thread is dead. Long live the thread! :)

[ChampionsTourIn10]

I really love this topic. And I as well find it funny that a Cameron Guy is crying foul :cheesy: !!! Just think back to when Cameron went to Titleist and put out some of these Cameron Creation's (pardon the pun it was as well intended). To think if we had a forum back then such as this one, how many Ping fans would have been burning up the keyboard about Cameron ripping off Karsten. :cheesy: :)

[mhighman]

Let this topic die... it is not going anywhere...

 

I appreciate the backers of Tom, This is my last post on this thread!

 

 

Lets not turn this into the great debate over copying! We all know about head shapes etc...

 

Leave it at that and hopefully this doesn't get brought up again.

 

Let them do what their customers want. If Tom can do something for someone that challenges him and Dean... so be it.

 

We can't please everyone out there... although we try and try. It wont' happen... so we try to please the customers we have and the customers that want to give us a try!

 

have a great day!