The Arm Swing Illusion / Jim Waldron's Swing Philosophy

[Jim Waldron]

Jim, or anyone else, could you tell me where to find the section on postural braces? I was looking through my videos with no success.

 

Funny you mention firing your core and shoulder girdle just now. That's been my focus lately.

 

Thanks in advance

 

Module One Part D video covers the three Postural Braces, which is one of the truly essential parts of a proper Setup. The braces are part of what the bulk of Part D covers - "Advanced Setup".

[Jim Waldron]

Some folks have been asking for me to list some of the benefits one can achieve from a complete understanding of the arm swing illusion and it's ramifications. There are many!

 

1. combats casting and early release of wrist angles

 

2. helps you understand how super essential a proper Pivot is, once you realize how little role the arms actually play in a good golf swing, and how much a role the Pivot needs to play.l

 

3. is the cure for "disconnection" of arms from body during Release.

 

4. is the cure for the universal plague of an inside takeaway.

 

5. helps you understand how tempo and rhythm has everything to do with the speed of the pivot in RPM's, and nothing to do with arm speed or clubhead speed in MPH.

 

6. the most essential concept to grasp in order to sync up the arm motion with the pivot.

[Ezgolfer]

Agree with what Jim said in above post .

 

Also 45 degre takeaway will keep you on plane almost all the time .

Easy cure for Overswing if you do the takeaway correctly

 

It feels to me like my club face opens a bit during the 45 degree takeaway. Any suggestions or is it just a feel .

[Jim Waldron]

Agree with what Jim said in above post .

 

Also 45 degre takeaway will keep you on plane almost all the time .

Easy cure for Overswing if you do the takeaway correctly

 

It feels to me like my club face opens a bit during the 45 degree takeaway. Any suggestions or is it just a feel .

 

No way to know the answer to your question without doing an actual lesson.

 

As we all know, feel can (especially un-trained feel) lead to false conclusions.

 

Almost no one gets the 45 angle pushaway move correct. New ASI students will invariably start the takeaway with the arm pushaway and no pivot, and so are outside the plane. Need to pivot while you pushaway simultaneously.

 

Face angle should stay neutral to the clubhead path or slightly close - the latter especially if you tend to slice the ball.

 

Neutral means the toe stays pointing up vertically during the takeaway - no rolling the face open or shut.

[starsail85]

Agree with what Jim said in above post .

 

Also 45 degre takeaway will keep you on plane almost all the time .

Easy cure for Overswing if you do the takeaway correctly

 

It feels to me like my club face opens a bit during the 45 degree takeaway. Any suggestions or is it just a feel .

 

No way to know the answer to your question without doing an actual lesson.

 

As we all know, feel can (especially un-trained feel) lead to false conclusions.

 

Almost no one gets the 45 angle pushaway move correct. New ASI students will invariably start the takeaway with the arm pushaway and no pivot, and so are outside the plane. Need to pivot while you pushaway simultaneously.

 

Face angle should stay neutral to the clubhead path or slightly close - the latter especially if you tend to slice the ball.

 

Neutral means the toe stays pointing up vertically during the takeaway - no rolling the face open or shut.

 

Jim

 

What is your opinion of the methods that advocate the leading edge to match the spine angle at p2?

[Jim Waldron]

Agree with what Jim said in above post .

 

Also 45 degre takeaway will keep you on plane almost all the time .

Easy cure for Overswing if you do the takeaway correctly

 

It feels to me like my club face opens a bit during the 45 degree takeaway. Any suggestions or is it just a feel .

 

No way to know the answer to your question without doing an actual lesson.

 

As we all know, feel can (especially un-trained feel) lead to false conclusions.

 

Almost no one gets the 45 angle pushaway move correct. New ASI students will invariably start the takeaway with the arm pushaway and no pivot, and so are outside the plane. Need to pivot while you pushaway simultaneously.

 

Face angle should stay neutral to the clubhead path or slightly close - the latter especially if you tend to slice the ball.

 

Neutral means the toe stays pointing up vertically during the takeaway - no rolling the face open or shut.

 

Jim

 

What is your opinion of the methods that advocate the leading edge to match the spine angle at p2?

 

Not a fan of that concept. I just don't see the logic behind it.

 

My view is why make the swing more complicated than it needs to be by introducing another variable? Why not just learn to do nothing with the "twisty" muscles in your wrists and forearms during the backswing and thus keep the face angle neutral relative to the path. Probably the best way for most golfers. And that means toe up.

 

You can also match this to your shot shape and Release type. If you know you have trouble squaring the face during Release, you could err on having the face closed a little bit during takeaway, and vice versa.

[Jim Waldron]

One I neglected to mention is the all important Triangle moving in a V shape up and down in front of your rotating/tilting chest.

 

Think of the Pivot as your body moving inside a spiral staircase as the arms, the sides of the Triangle, move up and down in front of that chest moving in a spiral shape.

 

Add the wrists moving mainly up and down from the c0cking aspect and you will complete the picture.

[ofortuna]

Hi Jim, I re-watched Module 2 on the arm swing illusion recently. In the section on the Jug McSpaden drills, you talk about the arms coming back towards the body due to pivot forces if done correctly. So if you don't have too much tension in your arms, the push-away on the backswing is "undone" on the downswing.

 

I've been doing this drill with varying degrees of pushaway and can even occasionally hit really good shots with the full version but the consistency isn't there. I really like these drills because it doesn't focus on theory or static positions. When I hit bad shots, I think I have too much tension in my arms or hands and my hands are still too far from my body approaching impact. This sometimes results in a pull or just poor contact.

 

So my question is, other than doing a lot more of these drills, which I plan on focusing on, are there any other drills you could recommend to focus on this arm drop using the pivot? It seems like something very important but you only mention in passing that the pivot makes this happen and not conscious arm movement.

[Jim Waldron]

Hi Jim, I re-watched Module 2 on the arm swing illusion recently. In the section on the Jug McSpaden drills, you talk about the arms coming back towards the body due to pivot forces if done correctly. So if you don't have too much tension in your arms, the push-away on the backswing is "undone" on the downswing.

 

I've been doing this drill with varying degrees of pushaway and can even occasionally hit really good shots with the full version but the consistency isn't there. I really like these drills because it doesn't focus on theory or static positions. When I hit bad shots, I think I have too much tension in my arms or hands and my hands are still too far from my body approaching impact. This sometimes results in a pull or just poor contact.

 

So my question is, other than doing a lot more of these drills, which I plan on focusing on, are there any other drills you could recommend to focus on this arm drop using the pivot? It seems like something very important but you only mention in passing that the pivot makes this happen and not conscious arm movement.

 

I cover this Transition move in much more detail in Module Four on the Pivot and also in Module Five at the end of Part A. Also is talked about some in Module Three on Advanced Arm Mechanics.

 

The concept of "what do the arms do in Transition?" is a hugely important one, and one that so many golfers struggle with due to mis-conceptions that are quite common. Just look at all the threads in the main section of this subforum on this very topic!

 

Not really drills per se - just need to understand what the movement pattern is all about.

 

Lateral hip shift and rotation starts the chain reaction from the ground up, and then Tilt Switch turns it into a higher gear. Not an arm drop really - that is only a tiny part of it. The pivot pulls your arms back down to your body. Has to since your upper arms are connected to your torso at the shoulder sockets.

[guzz226]

I played golf lots as a teenager/early 20s and after a 20 year absence jumped back in a few months ago as my teenager was keen to go for a hit. Already down to 19 - I think my best hcp was ever around 16-17 but need to work on my game especially before the rot sets in too much (again)! which brought me here.

 

wow...what a thread.

 

Finally read it from start to finish over the last week or two making notes as I went to reference later.

 

Now for the eBook and the videos.

 

Lots to learn and practice.

[PureStrikes54]

Jim, apologies if you've covered this but I've heard you talk about the brain/body being lazy in a golf swing and not "naturally" wanting to move or turn the core idependently of the ASI like the rub your stomach pat your head example. Can you expand on the core pivot in the backswing? Does it feel like you are turning your belly button to the right in the backswing then moving it back left in the downswing ahead of any arm hit impulse?

 

And if this is the case how far certain parts of the core need to move...(max range of motion, 3/4 of max, etc). I feel like in levels of ball striking this understanding and implementation is what takes you out of being someone that "scrapes" it around to hitting the ball with serious authority and control. Thanks in advance.

[Jim Waldron]

Jim, apologies if you've covered this but I've heard you talk about the brain/body being lazy in a golf swing and not "naturally" wanting to move or turn the core idependently of the ASI like the rub your stomach pat your head example. Can you expand on the core pivot in the backswing? Does it feel like you are turning your belly button to the right in the backswing then moving it back left in the downswing ahead of any arm hit impulse?

 

And if this is the case how far certain parts of the core need to move...(max range of motion, 3/4 of max, etc). I feel like in levels of ball striking this understanding and implementation is what takes you out of being someone that "scrapes" it around to hitting the ball with serious authority and control. Thanks in advance.

 

Yes, the ASI makes one "lazy" with the Core and Pivot. If you are actively using your upper arm muscles moving the arms as the primary source of both accuracy/solid impact and power in the golf swing - and clearly 99% of golfers are doing exactly that - then you are never going to engage your core/Pivot fully.

 

Switching to a core/Pivot method as the "primary mover" is a big part of understanding my swing model and the ASI.

 

Yes, belly button moves in a tiny circle to the right on the backswing and to the left on the forward swing. To full range of motion.

 

Steve Elkington described it best, "move my belly until it crashes into my lower rib cage" as I recall.

[PureStrikes54]

Thanks very much. You're in good company too. I think Pete Cowen has said that any impulse to initiate the swing with the arms (as 99% of the masses naturally do) needs to be avoided.

[Jim Waldron]

Thanks very much. You're in good company too. I think Pete Cowen has said that any impulse to initiate the swing with the arms (as 99% of the masses naturally do) needs to be avoided.

Thanks very much. You're in good company too. I think Pete Cowen has said that any impulse to initiate the swing with the arms (as 99% of the masses naturally do) needs to be avoided.

 

Yeah, I could not agree more with Cowen. I seldom get a new student who is engaging their Core even a little bit. I do a test with the student sitting in good posture in a chair, and ask them to fire their Core, with their hips locked in place on the chair, so that their Core moves their Torso/Shoulder Girdle. Most look at me like I am crazy...."what does that mean?" I then show them how to feel/be aware of their Core muscles and shift their belly button right and left. This really should be called the Universal Primary Mover in sports, dance and martial arts, because that is precisely what the Core function truly is....

 

The problem from a mind-brain/body connection standpoint is this: that tiny golf ball way down there on the ground, several feet away from your eyes and the associated hand-eye coordination part of your brain, and the nearly 4 foot long tool in your hand (the golf club), with a tiny clubhead at the end of it, those two things induce in the mind-brain of the golfer an incredibly strong Impulse to try to steer the clubhead into the back of the ball using hand-eye manipulation. It would never occur to the golfer that using those deep and very strong inside Core muscles as the main mover of the club into the ball! Add the ASI to that Impulse and you have a recipe for disaster - which is the ballstriking game of 99% of golfers.

[ofortuna]

Great topic Jim! I appreciate your continued guidance.

 

In the checkpoints for the mini-swing in your ebook, you say that the shoulders and hips should be parallel left of the target when the clubhead gets over your toeline in the followthrough. So is it accurate to say that the scissors action of your inner legs following the pivot thrust should give your lower body stability but not restrict a full hip turn into the followthrough?

 

I don't think my hips don't turn fully or early enough in the downswing.

[Jim Waldron]

Great topic Jim! I appreciate your continued guidance.

 

In the checkpoints for the mini-swing in your ebook, you say that the shoulders and hips should be parallel left of the target when the clubhead gets over your toeline in the followthrough. So is it accurate to say that the scissors action of your inner legs following the pivot thrust should give your lower body stability but not restrict a full hip turn into the followthrough?

 

I don't think my hips don't turn fully or early enough in the downswing.

 

Scissors action is an integral part of Pivot Thrust, does not occur "after" - rather during. Yes - scissors action along with the Three braces creates stability so that you can pivot freely through impact to the finish.

 

Hips and shoulder girdle should be open to the target line (left for a righty) at impact and more open into Followthrough and Finish.

 

In the mini-swing your Finish is the normal full swing Followthrough position of hands at waist height on the left side of your body,.

 

Hips should be 90 degrees open at this point or very close to that much open .

[Silky]

Jim, apologies if you've covered this but I've heard you talk about the brain/body being lazy in a golf swing and not "naturally" wanting to move or turn the core idependently of the ASI like the rub your stomach pat your head example. Can you expand on the core pivot in the backswing? Does it feel like you are turning your belly button to the right in the backswing then moving it back left in the downswing ahead of any arm hit impulse?

 

And if this is the case how far certain parts of the core need to move...(max range of motion, 3/4 of max, etc). I feel like in levels of ball striking this understanding and implementation is what takes you out of being someone that "scrapes" it around to hitting the ball with serious authority and control. Thanks in advance.

 

Yes, the ASI makes one "lazy" with the Core and Pivot. If you are actively using your upper arm muscles moving the arms as the primary source of both accuracy/solid impact and power in the golf swing - and clearly 99% of golfers are doing exactly that - then you are never going to engage your core/Pivot fully.

 

Switching to a core/Pivot method as the "primary mover" is a big part of understanding my swing model and the ASI.

 

Yes, belly button moves in a tiny circle to the right on the backswing and to the left on the forward swing. To full range of motion.

 

Steve Elkington described it best, "move my belly until it crashes into my lower rib cage" as I recall.

 

Jim,

 

Please clarify the tiny circle movement of the belly button, that tiny circle is relative to the spine, the pelvis, of the ground?

 

I learnt the essential of the core muscles from you and had use that knowledge in putting, chipping, through full swing. And, I thought that I had already used my core muscles!? I started to monitor the motion of my belly button during the backswing and downswing after reading this post. Well, the belly button does not lie.

 

If I intended to really move my belly button in my backswing, I rediscovered the feeling of a braced right leg that I had lost sometime ago.

 

If I pretended that there was a camera embedded in my belly button and have that camera aim directly and follow the target line to the target as the pivot tilts and turns from the top of swing to the finish, I could achieve better and more consistent impact.

 

I guess that is one way of energizing those lazy core muscles, dormant from decades of desk job, with the belly button as an indicator.

 

Thank you.

[Jim Waldron]

Hi Silky - the concept of turning the belly button is just a starting point to get my students to activate the core muscles. Not to be taken too literally.

 

What actually happens is that folks start to "turn on" the oblique abs which creates a twisting motion in the belly/low back region.

 

I also have them lie down on a blanket on the ground and have them do oblique crunches.

 

Actually two steps - press the belly button inwards toward the spine an inch or two (activates the transverse ab and rectus) and then the "twist" to the right as backswing pivot trigger.

 

When adding the Start Up Motion to this the sequence is: twist/shift the belly button to the left as the first Trigger (like turning the key in your car ignition) and then quickly rebound to the right with the twisting motion. Reverses on Transition, ie twists to the left.

[markfardon]

Hi Jim I'm having good progress following your advice and training manual, my question here is more around mental approach to practice. For example I'm practicing a lot of 45-60 yard lob wedges to really groove the elements you teach. This is shot-making practice at a defined target flag stick on a green. I can maybe hit sometimes up to 40 or more balls and get a nice rhythm going, and analyzing each and every swing for feedback and learning. a few actually hole out or hit the flag and the majority would be a good chance of an up and down. Then out of the blue I'll hit one of the hosel and then maybe another. I'll work out what I did or didn't do to miss the center of the club and can usually get it back on track but I can never seem to mentally eradicate the "fear" of it happening again. On the course it rarely if ever happens although I may mishit some left/right/long/short etc but not off the hosel (although some look very close from the face marks) So is it a case of more practice so the 1 in 40 off the hosel become one in 100 then one in 1000 etc or do I just accept some i'll not hit flush and get on with it ?

[Jim Waldron]

Hi Jim I'm having good progress following your advice and training manual, my question here is more around mental approach to practice. For example I'm practicing a lot of 45-60 yard lob wedges to really groove the elements you teach. This is shot-making practice at a defined target flag stick on a green. I can maybe hit sometimes up to 40 or more balls and get a nice rhythm going, and analyzing each and every swing for feedback and learning. a few actually hole out or hit the flag and the majority would be a good chance of an up and down. Then out of the blue I'll hit one of the hosel and then maybe another. I'll work out what I did or didn't do to miss the center of the club and can usually get it back on track but I can never seem to mentally eradicate the "fear" of it happening again. On the course it rarely if ever happens although I may mishit some left/right/long/short etc but not off the hosel (although some look very close from the face marks) So is it a case of more practice so the 1 in 40 off the hosel become one in 100 then one in 1000 etc or do I just accept some i'll not hit flush and get on with it ?

 

Hi M - the short answer to your question is, like most of the time here, "it depends, and no way to know for sure without doing a lesson with you." (including Remote Lessons via webcam, which are becoming more and more popular).

 

For example, it could be that you have a mechanical flaw, something very simple like weight too much toward your toes at Setup, that most of the time you are able to compensate for and hit the sweetspot, but 10% of the time your brain "forgets" to compensate, and so your balance point shifts more toward your toes, which causes the shank to happen.

 

Could also be purely mental, ie you lose your focus somewhere mid-swing, which causes your body to flinch, which causes the shank.

 

Do you notice any difference in the quality off your Meta-Awareness/focus during the shank swings vs the good shot swings?

[markfardon]

Hi Jim I'm having good progress following your advice and training manual, my question here is more around mental approach to practice. For example I'm practicing a lot of 45-60 yard lob wedges to really groove the elements you teach. This is shot-making practice at a defined target flag stick on a green. I can maybe hit sometimes up to 40 or more balls and get a nice rhythm going, and analyzing each and every swing for feedback and learning. a few actually hole out or hit the flag and the majority would be a good chance of an up and down. Then out of the blue I'll hit one of the hosel and then maybe another. I'll work out what I did or didn't do to miss the center of the club and can usually get it back on track but I can never seem to mentally eradicate the "fear" of it happening again. On the course it rarely if ever happens although I may mishit some left/right/long/short etc but not off the hosel (although some look very close from the face marks) So is it a case of more practice so the 1 in 40 off the hosel become one in 100 then one in 1000 etc or do I just accept some i'll not hit flush and get on with it ?

 

Hi M - the short answer to your question is, like most of the time here, "it depends, and no way to know for sure without doing a lesson with you." (including Remote Lessons via webcam, which are becoming more and more popular).

 

For example, it could be that you have a mechanical flaw, something very simple like weight too much toward your toes at Setup, that most of the time you are able to compensate for and hit the sweetspot, but 10% of the time your brain "forgets" to compensate, and so your balance point shifts more toward your toes, which causes the shank to happen.

 

Could also be purely mental, ie you lose your focus somewhere mid-swing, which causes your body to flinch, which causes the shank.

 

Do you notice any difference in the quality off your Meta-Awareness/focus during the shank swings vs the good shot swings?

 

Hi Jim thanks for taking time to answer. Since the vast majority of golfers, tour player included do not have "perfect" mechanics in their swing surely every golfer has to make compensations big or small to hit the sweet spot so the more they practice the more often they can hit the sweetspot ?

 

In my case I think its purely mental as its more like a 2% occurrence and only in practice. I can see your point that if it was a big/obvious mechanical flaw I'd be fighting it for ever and never lose the fear of it happening. In terms of meta-awareness on the bad shots I believe I have lost, or not focused on, the target picture and desired clubhead path (i have tendency to hit too "in to out")

Also I think its where I didnt time the shot and spun the hips back before the arms and torso completed the backswing. So i then focus almost on the opposite - that the club/arm unit start first and pull the lower body round.

 

Its usually after a number of really good shots so perhaps get mentally lazy or tired and concentration slips. I find if I think think "OK this one needs to come slightly off the toe as I heeled the last one", I can make it happen so, or at least its back on the center of the face.

 

I obviously need you to see my grip, posture, swing for you to know one way or the other - mental or mechanical so will look on your website for lesson options, Cheers, Mark

[Jim Waldron]

Hi Jim I'm having good progress following your advice and training manual, my question here is more around mental approach to practice. For example I'm practicing a lot of 45-60 yard lob wedges to really groove the elements you teach. This is shot-making practice at a defined target flag stick on a green. I can maybe hit sometimes up to 40 or more balls and get a nice rhythm going, and analyzing each and every swing for feedback and learning. a few actually hole out or hit the flag and the majority would be a good chance of an up and down. Then out of the blue I'll hit one of the hosel and then maybe another. I'll work out what I did or didn't do to miss the center of the club and can usually get it back on track but I can never seem to mentally eradicate the "fear" of it happening again. On the course it rarely if ever happens although I may mishit some left/right/long/short etc but not off the hosel (although some look very close from the face marks) So is it a case of more practice so the 1 in 40 off the hosel become one in 100 then one in 1000 etc or do I just accept some i'll not hit flush and get on with it ?

 

Hi M - the short answer to your question is, like most of the time here, "it depends, and no way to know for sure without doing a lesson with you." (including Remote Lessons via webcam, which are becoming more and more popular).

 

For example, it could be that you have a mechanical flaw, something very simple like weight too much toward your toes at Setup, that most of the time you are able to compensate for and hit the sweetspot, but 10% of the time your brain "forgets" to compensate, and so your balance point shifts more toward your toes, which causes the shank to happen.

 

Could also be purely mental, ie you lose your focus somewhere mid-swing, which causes your body to flinch, which causes the shank.

 

Do you notice any difference in the quality off your Meta-Awareness/focus during the shank swings vs the good shot swings?

 

Hi Jim thanks for taking time to answer. Since the vast majority of golfers, tour player included do not have "perfect" mechanics in their swing surely every golfer has to make compensations big or small to hit the sweet spot so the more they practice the more often they can hit the sweetspot ?

 

In my case I think its purely mental as its more like a 2% occurrence and only in practice. I can see your point that if it was a big/obvious mechanical flaw I'd be fighting it for ever and never lose the fear of it happening. In terms of meta-awareness on the bad shots I believe I have lost, or not focused on, the target picture and desired clubhead path (i have tendency to hit too "in to out")

Also I think its where I didnt time the shot and spun the hips back before the arms and torso completed the backswing. So i then focus almost on the opposite - that the club/arm unit start first and pull the lower body round.

 

Its usually after a number of really good shots so perhaps get mentally lazy or tired and concentration slips. I find if I think think "OK this one needs to come slightly off the toe as I heeled the last one", I can make it happen so, or at least its back on the center of the face.

 

I obviously need you to see my grip, posture, swing for you to know one way or the other - mental or mechanical so will look on your website for lesson options, Cheers, Mark

 

Hi Mark - yes, more practice is key.

 

The compensations are in every swing, as you said, but the more compensations and the "bigger" the compensations, the more you are depending on random luck, to some degree, to not hit a bad shot. You can also think of it like this: you only have so much "bandwidth" in your mind-brain/body connection. It takes close to 100% of that potential bandwidth to compensate for the really big hidden mechanical flaws. When your swing is more sound mechanically, you have bandwidth to spare, so your focus can be a little off and you still will hit a good shot, ie no flinch.

 

I agree, based on your reporting here, that in your case it is likely mental.

[tt100]

Mr. Waldron,

I'm only on page two of this thread. I'm trying to read through it so I don't end up asking any stupid questions that others may have already asked. I agree with the perosn who said they feel like Penny from Big Bang Theory. I'm having a hard time following. I did watch this video though and it helped IMMENSELY;

 

 

I went and hit my new driver tonight and for the first time I started to "get it". By the end of the session I was hitting a much higher percentage of shots straight and at the proper place on the club face. I just wanted to say thank you for sharing your knowledge on the forum. I know we can't all afford to fly to Portland (or HI) so this is MUCH appreciated. Thank you for taking the time to share,

 

Pete

[Jim Waldron]

Mr. Waldron,

I'm only on page two of this thread. I'm trying to read through it so I don't end up asking any stupid questions that others may have already asked. I agree with the perosn who said they feel like Penny from Big Bang Theory. I'm having a hard time following. I did watch this video though and it helped IMMENSELY;

 

 

I went and hit my new driver tonight and for the first time I started to "get it". By the end of the session I was hitting a much higher percentage of shots straight and at the proper place on the club face. I just wanted to say thank you for sharing your knowledge on the forum. I know we can't all afford to fly to Portland (or HI) so this is MUCH appreciated. Thank you for taking the time to share,

 

Pete

 

Hi Pete - thanks for your feedback and great to know you are starting to see some improvement!

 

I love that "Penny from Big Bang" comment...lots of my students feel that way when making the dramatic shift from a mostly 2D view of the golf swing to a true 3D view when breaking through the arm swing illusion. At first it can be challenging because your old golf swing concept is changing so quickly.

 

That video from Module 3 is mainly about the right arm function, but also covers the ASI aspect as well.

[Golfjack]

I just want to thank Jim for his ASI revelation. It's one of the most important parts of the swing that I keep coming back to make sure it's enforced as I improve my swing. Getting the ASI correct has straightened out my swing path. I've always been inside out, and tended to keep it that way cuz I was afraid to go OTT. But the ASI gives a proper guidance to how the arm should move, and I can now hit straight shots without having to manipulate the clubface. Lots of other things go into the swing of course, but the ASI is a crucial fundamental!!! It just makes everything else so much easier. Not only does it correct my bad tendencies with my shoulders and arms, it also now allows me to add a little clubhead speed just by employing the ASI and also now allows me to concentrate on using my lower body for even more speed gains.

 

Also, from working on my swing, I've realized that taking things slow initially (easy swing, quarter and half swings) is crucial, but one must graduate to full swings and faster full swings while still employing the same principles. Have to see how fast you can go to really learn how to properly engage parts of your pivot to maximize speed. If you go slow and easy all the time, you have set the ceiling really low.

[lafromage]

To say this is how Tiger Woods, Adam Scott, and Justin Rose swing is misleading.

 

I have spoken with Rosey (and Foley) a few times and I know for a fact he doesn't push his arms away from him, or do any kind of scooping action; I have also read Tiger's books and also not the case. Same with Rory - who pushes his hands way from his head as far as he can along the target line - just like Jason Day and adam scott.

 

I am not saying you can't swing the club this way, there are many patterns and possibilities, but this is not how most professionals do it - most control the swing with the pivot in the first 6ft, and use the folding of the right arm & cocking of the wrists to bring the club up in the vertical dimension.

 

There really is no illusion. Calling it am illusion is deceitful and sounds more like sales patter.

 

If you place a rock on the end of a string and push it along it's horizontal axis, it will act much like a pendulum and the weight (mass) will rise up due to inertia and back down due to gravity - there is no vertical force applied yet it moves up in the vertical dimension.

 

This seems more a compensatory move for people who are sucking the club inside due to a poor pivot.

 

As Monte Scheinblum says, pushing your arms away from your chest is cheating the backswing.

[Jim Waldron]

I just want to thank Jim for his ASI revelation. It's one of the most important parts of the swing that I keep coming back to make sure it's enforced as I improve my swing. Getting the ASI correct has straightened out my swing path. I've always been inside out, and tended to keep it that way cuz I was afraid to go OTT. But the ASI gives a proper guidance to how the arm should move, and I can now hit straight shots without having to manipulate the clubface. Lots of other things go into the swing of course, but the ASI is a crucial fundamental!!! It just makes everything else so much easier. Not only does it correct my bad tendencies with my shoulders and arms, it also now allows me to add a little clubhead speed just by employing the ASI and also now allows me to concentrate on using my lower body for even more speed gains.

 

Also, from working on my swing, I've realized that taking things slow initially (easy swing, quarter and half swings) is crucial, but one must graduate to full swings and faster full swings while still employing the same principles. Have to see how fast you can go to really learn how to properly engage parts of your pivot to maximize speed. If you go slow and easy all the time, you have set the ceiling really low.

 

Hi G - thank you for your feedback, and good to hear the ASI concept is helping you so much!

 

I agree - vitally important to start at slow motion speed, then half speed, then full speed. Once your mechanics are correct at half speed, the challenge is to maintain those correct mechanics while swinging at normal full speed tempo. It is natural for mechanics to break down or revert to your old pattern at full speed, in the early stages. It just means you need more reps and/or more Feel Channel Awareness.

 

The feeling will change - sometimes dramatically, sometimes subtly - between a half or 3/4 speed swing and a full swing. Once you identify the feel of proper mechanics at full speed, you need to remember vividly what that "feel" is all about so that you can repeat those good mechanics. Video will show you if the mechanics are good. Do not go solely on the ball flight result - too many variables there to rely on when making a change, including pure random luck.

[Jim Waldron]

I have been getting a lot of questions about Module Five videos on the Levers (wrists, forearms, right elbow) and Release.

 

Basically, if you can afford it, certainly buy both Part A and Part B. But if you had to choose, go with A, it is 4 hours long and chock full of information on the detailed mechanics of the Levers and how to Release them into Impact with good timing.

 

Part B is my take on the kinetic chain theory - both the pros and the cons. And yes - there are indeed some major "cons" in the way that theory has been discussed the past few years in Internet golf land.

 

A really important aspect of Part A is all about the two forms of Release: active vs passive, and why the passive way is a much better option for 99% of golfers.

[Jim Waldron]

Some very common mis-conceptions about the ASI material from folks new to the concept.

 

1. the clubhead moves straight back along the target line or even outside the target line during the first half off the takeaway. Not correct - the clubhead moves inside the target line in a slight eliptical shape arc right away. This mis-conception is due to folks thinking that the arm pushaway happens first and then the pivot. In the move that I teach, the pivot and pushaway happen simultaneously, or even the pivot starts a fraction of a second earlier than the pushaway.

 

2. the shaft plane angle during takeaway is outside and higher than the Address shaft plane. Similar to #1. Wrong - the proper blend of the pivot and pushaway results in a perfectly on plane shaft during the takeaway, ie same plane as at Setup.

 

3. the arm pushaway is a "Big Move". Also incorrect. The pushaway is tiny - only 4 to 8 inches. Four inches for shorter stature and/or inflexbile golfers, 8 inches for very tall and/or flexible golfers. Five to six inches is about right for most golfers.

 

4. the pushaway is the same thing as the oft-qouted advice to "keep your arms in front of the center of your chest". Incorrect - the pushaway is on a 45 degree angle to your chest toward your right.

 

5. the arms actively "lift" upward into the vertical dimension. No - there is no active lift of the arms in the model backswing. The pushaway happens in the width dimension, and that plus the pivot combine to create a force that bends the right elbow, which then lifts the arms, mainly the left arm, into the vertical dimension.

[borker]

 

5. the arms actively "lift" upward into the vertical dimension. No - there is no active lift of the arms in the model backswing. The pushaway happens in the width dimension, and that plus the pivot combine to create a force that bends the right elbow, which then lifts the arms, mainly the left arm, into the vertical dimension.

 

You mentioned above in thread to think of the arms also moving up/down in front of you in a "V" motion. The sides of the triangle moving up/down in front of the rotating chest (sides I take it as your upper arms, ie. elbow to shoulder socket). In my pedantic opinion, this doesn't fit with what you are stating in in the quote.

 

If one doesn't lift you end up with very flat backswing with left arm at should line from DTL like Rory (or even below like Kuchar if one really takes it too literally). I can easily keep my right upper arm from lifting very little and I look like Kuchar and hook it off the planet.

 

To get to your neutral top of backswing position, the "V" motion of raising arms up in front of you (hard to describe because you are bent over , but rotate chest while standing straight up and I take it the "V" motion means lifting arms using shoulder muscles a but as you pivot). As I mentioned you can tell who used the V motion and by how much. Kuchar did very little, Rory a bit more, DJ even more and Bubba has his upper arms way off his torso .

 

Or am I way off base?