Erin Hills too Easy?

[Shilgy]

Playing a US Open course that depends on wind isn't a good idea. Wind lays down and mid 60's abound. Maybe even a record setting score.

 

This "it would have been tough if it was windier" argument from these guys is just beyond hilarious. They actually believe that no golf course can be tough to pros if there's calm winds? Mind boggling.

I'm glad we've boggled your mind. Of course a course can be tough with no wind. Look at Shinnecock a few years ago. Or Merion recently. If you like over the top conditions, which you clearly do, yes. By that token almost any course could be made tough enough to please you. Just keep narrowing the fairways and grow rough until no one can shoot par. It's really not golf anymore but you get the score you want.

Mind boggling is right.

[hardcaliber]

To me, there seemed like a total lack of drama coming down the stretch. Its possible that koepka was just too good and made it look easy. To me, it seemed like there just wasn't enough going on with the course to make him sweat coming down the stretch. It's not like he had a massive lead. It's was just 3.strokes or so on 15 if I remember correctly. It's seemed like there wasn't the threat of total disaster, with the exception of the long grass of the tee. With most major venues I remember recently, you can put it down the middle of the fairway on your tee shot and a bad approach shot or even a bad putt can still lead to a huge number. At Erin hills, it was like if you hit the fairway you were almost guaranteed a par at least. I don't really care about how score relative to par but I think the leader needs to be under constant threat of disaster on Sunday to keep things interesting. It certainly didn't help that no one really made a run at him.

[Jasonic]

Not for 8 of the top 10 in the world who got cut ; )

 

Nice post. Should have been EOT.

 

I wonder, how many events are there where 8 of the top 10 golfers in the world miss the cut? I'd guess it is the easy courses where shootouts happen by regular people, not the super tough tracks where the best in the world rise to the top. Any stats gurus follow such trends?

 

Yea, I seriously doubt they missed the cut because of how tough the course was. Pretty sure it was more of how bad they were swinging the club.

 

But the toughness of the course made those mistake more penal.

 

Justin Thomas +3..

Bubba Watson +5.

 

What a tough Travellers Championship. Do you even read your posts back to you before you click Post? Do you know how silly you sound?

 

Hey kettle.....

 

Coming from the guy who hasn't made a single point stick even after 1,000 posts with the same silly opinion. Keep trying kid

[sekrah]

Playing a US Open course that depends on wind isn't a good idea. Wind lays down and mid 60's abound. Maybe even a record setting score.

 

This "it would have been tough if it was windier" argument from these guys is just beyond hilarious. They actually believe that no golf course can be tough to pros if there's calm winds? Mind boggling.

I'm glad we've boggled your mind. Of course a course can be tough with no wind. Look at Shinnecock a few years ago. Or Merion recently. If you like over the top conditions, which you clearly do, yes. By that token almost any course could be made tough enough to please you. Just keep narrowing the fairways and grow rough until no one can shoot par. It's really not golf anymore but you get the score you want.

Mind boggling is right.

 

Hitting fairways and greens is not golf anymore. Got it. What a world.

[sekrah]

 

Hey kettle.....

 

Coming from the guy who hasn't made a single point stick even after 1,000 posts with the same silly opinion. Keep trying kid

 

We got your point. You enjoy kiddie putt-putt golf. Some of prefer seeing the best of the best do actual difficult golfing skills. Not for you? Hey, that's okay.

[North Texas]

Playing a US Open course that depends on wind isn't a good idea. Wind lays down and mid 60's abound. Maybe even a record setting score.

 

This "it would have been tough if it was windier" argument from these guys is just beyond hilarious. They actually believe that no golf course can be tough to pros if there's calm winds? Mind boggling.

I'm glad we've boggled your mind. Of course a course can be tough with no wind. Look at Shinnecock a few years ago. Or Merion recently. If you like over the top conditions, which you clearly do, yes. By that token almost any course could be made tough enough to please you. Just keep narrowing the fairways and grow rough until no one can shoot par. It's really not golf anymore but you get the score you want.

Mind boggling is right.

 

Hitting fairways and greens is not golf anymore. Got it. What a world.

 

This is what it has come to. The standard has been lowered so much that any course where even par would be a good score is a farce and over the top. Sad but true.

[UncleJohn’sBand]

This year was the last of these "new" courses for a few years, so if next year they do the same, and the year after, and the year after that then blame the setup, the tournament committee or the players being too damn good.

 

But I hightly doubt afte the last 3 opens than next year will be easy. I think the USGA after this one understands that the public want carnage, and Shinnecock is the perfect place to deliver.

[Jasonic]

 

Hey kettle.....

 

Coming from the guy who hasn't made a single point stick even after 1,000 posts with the same silly opinion. Keep trying kid

 

We got your point. You enjoy kiddie putt-putt golf. Some of prefer seeing the best of the best do actual difficult golfing skills. Not for you? Hey, that's okay.

 

Who's we? I doubt you speak for the whole board and your whole putting contest analogy is off base and stupid and relentless. Sorry I didn't realize you govern what is and what isn't golf. The world is full of different opinions than yours.

[bscinstnct]

To me, there seemed like a total lack of drama coming down the stretch. Its possible that koepka was just too good and made it look easy. To me, it seemed like there just wasn't enough going on with the course to make him sweat coming down the stretch. It's not like he had a massive lead. It's was just 3.strokes or so on 15 if I remember correctly. It's seemed like there wasn't the threat of total disaster, with the exception of the long grass of the tee. With most major venues I remember recently, you can put it down the middle of the fairway on your tee shot and a bad approach shot or even a bad putt can still lead to a huge number. At Erin hills, it was like if you hit the fairway you were almost guaranteed a par at least. I don't really care about how score relative to par but I think the leader needs to be under constant threat of disaster on Sunday to keep things interesting. It certainly didn't help that no one really made a run at him.

 

"At Erin hills, it was like if you hit the fairway you were almost guaranteed a par at least"

 

 

Due respect.

 

But this misunderstanding is what so many did not get about this course.

 

The 8 out of 12 top ten in the world who missed the cut are clear proof of that.

[Jasonic]

Playing a US Open course that depends on wind isn't a good idea. Wind lays down and mid 60's abound. Maybe even a record setting score.

 

This "it would have been tough if it was windier" argument from these guys is just beyond hilarious. They actually believe that no golf course can be tough to pros if there's calm winds? Mind boggling.

I'm glad we've boggled your mind. Of course a course can be tough with no wind. Look at Shinnecock a few years ago. Or Merion recently. If you like over the top conditions, which you clearly do, yes. By that token almost any course could be made tough enough to please you. Just keep narrowing the fairways and grow rough until no one can shoot par. It's really not golf anymore but you get the score you want.

Mind boggling is right.

 

Hitting fairways and greens is not golf anymore. Got it. What a world.

 

This is what I don't get. Do you think hitting fairways and greens isn't golf? And also obviously you don't think putting is important to be a winner. You want the winner to miss the fairways and greens so the best player is determined by short game and escape shots? You keep harping how it sucked and everyone wants carnage but don't say what determines a good winner to you. Koepka was 2nd in fairways and 1st in greens hit. That's why he won, not sure why you don't understand that unless you haven't been watching golf for very long. The people that missed the fairways and then the greens and the cut are the carnage. When hogan hits every green and fairway it's legendary. Am I missing something?

[Shilgy]

 

This is what I don't get. Do you think hitting fairways and greens isn't golf? And also obviously you don't think putting is important to be a winner. You want the winner to miss the fairways and greens so the best player is determined by short game and escape shots? You keep harping how it sucked and everyone wants carnage but don't say what determines a good winner to you. Koepka was 2nd in fairways and 1st in greens hit. That's why he won, not sure why you don't understand that unless you haven't been watching golf for very long. The people that missed the fairways and then the greens and the cut are the carnage. When hogan hits every green and fairway it's legendary. Am I missing something?

-16 fairways too wide.

[grm24]

But I hightly doubt afte the last 3 opens than next year will be easy. I think the USGA after this one understands that the public want carnage, and Shinnecock is the perfect place to deliver.

Just curious outside of the rules issue with DJ what was your issue with Oakmont? The course got drenched with rain on Wednesday and Thursday (over 3 inches) and 4 under was the winning score with 1 under in second place. Oakmont was less than 7,300 yards, had soft greens with average rough. When weather was not a factor in 2007 the winning score was +5 without overly tricking the course up with deep rough at the same length. If Oakmont was a par 72 DJ would have won at 12 under.

[glk]

But I hightly doubt afte the last 3 opens than next year will be easy. I think the USGA after this one understands that the public want carnage, and Shinnecock is the perfect place to deliver.

Just curious outside of the rules issue with DJ what was your issue with Oakmont? The course got drenched with rain on Wednesday and Thursday (over 3 inches) and 4 under was the winning score with 1 under in second place. Oakmont was less than 7,300 yards, had soft greens with average rough. When weather was not a factor in 2007 the winning score was +5 without overly tricking the course up with deep rough at the same length. If Oakmont was a par 72 DJ would have won at 12 under.

 

DJ played the existing 2 par 5's at Oakmont in -1 with only 1 birdie and 7 pars. If Oakmont added 2 more par 5's, I would lean toward them being as difficult as the current. The 2 par 5's played as the 17th and 10th hardest with net scores of 4.97 and 5.14.

 

DJ won like most US Open champs, he made fewer mistakes. His 11 birdies were 29th in the field but he made only 5 bogeys and 1 double. He basically parred the place to death.

[sekrah]

Playing a US Open course that depends on wind isn't a good idea. Wind lays down and mid 60's abound. Maybe even a record setting score.

 

This "it would have been tough if it was windier" argument from these guys is just beyond hilarious. They actually believe that no golf course can be tough to pros if there's calm winds? Mind boggling.

I'm glad we've boggled your mind. Of course a course can be tough with no wind. Look at Shinnecock a few years ago. Or Merion recently. If you like over the top conditions, which you clearly do, yes. By that token almost any course could be made tough enough to please you. Just keep narrowing the fairways and grow rough until no one can shoot par. It's really not golf anymore but you get the score you want.

Mind boggling is right.

 

Hitting fairways and greens is not golf anymore. Got it. What a world.

 

This is what I don't get. Do you think hitting fairways and greens isn't golf? And also obviously you don't think putting is important to be a winner. You want the winner to miss the fairways and greens so the best player is determined by short game and escape shots? You keep harping how it sucked and everyone wants carnage but don't say what determines a good winner to you. Koepka was 2nd in fairways and 1st in greens hit. That's why he won, not sure why you don't understand that unless you haven't been watching golf for very long. The people that missed the fairways and then the greens and the cut are the carnage. When hogan hits every green and fairway it's legendary. Am I missing something?

 

 

No, it's apparently you that doesn't think fairways should be important. You want them a mile wide so all of these guys can throw darts into unprotected greens. I get it, when you watch the pros get challenged it makes you a little queasy. It's not for everyone I guess.

[UncleJohn’sBand]

But I hightly doubt afte the last 3 opens than next year will be easy. I think the USGA after this one understands that the public want carnage, and Shinnecock is the perfect place to deliver.

Just curious outside of the rules issue with DJ what was your issue with Oakmont? The course got drenched with rain on Wednesday and Thursday (over 3 inches) and 4 under was the winning score with 1 under in second place. Oakmont was less than 7,300 yards, had soft greens with average rough. When weather was not a factor in 2007 the winning score was +5 without overly tricking the course up with deep rough at the same length. If Oakmont was a par 72 DJ would have won at 12 under.

 

Basically the setup on a few holes was a touch suspect (see no.2 final day). I think the real crux to all the issues the USGA is having is the weather. They need firm and fast to get the course to the brink or unplayable. That's where they want it, and since Pinehurst, it seems every year it rains on Tuesday or Wednesday.

 

 

[beckk10]

I think Erin Hills would have been difficult had it not been for the rain and lack of wind this week. Almost any course the USGA could've gone to would have been hit by low scores like EH if they had the same weather conditions

 

not merion

[Jasonic]

 

This is what I don't get. Do you think hitting fairways and greens isn't golf? And also obviously you don't think putting is important to be a winner. You want the winner to miss the fairways and greens so the best player is determined by short game and escape shots? You keep harping how it sucked and everyone wants carnage but don't say what determines a good winner to you. Koepka was 2nd in fairways and 1st in greens hit. That's why he won, not sure why you don't understand that unless you haven't been watching golf for very long. The people that missed the fairways and then the greens and the cut are the carnage. When hogan hits every green and fairway it's legendary. Am I missing something?

-16 fairways too wide.

 

Ok that's fair and I thought the rough around the greens wasn't penal enough. But IMO it doesn't deserve the kind of hyperbole of being THE WORST EVER AAARRGH. don't freaking watch it then. Especially since it's just a vehicle to complain about. Also considering if it was a normal open par of 70 the final score would've been -8 which isn't crazy low comparatively. Just seems some people like to fee better about themselves by bitching a lot :)

[Jasonic]

Playing a US Open course that depends on wind isn't a good idea. Wind lays down and mid 60's abound. Maybe even a record setting score.

 

This "it would have been tough if it was windier" argument from these guys is just beyond hilarious. They actually believe that no golf course can be tough to pros if there's calm winds? Mind boggling.

I'm glad we've boggled your mind. Of course a course can be tough with no wind. Look at Shinnecock a few years ago. Or Merion recently. If you like over the top conditions, which you clearly do, yes. By that token almost any course could be made tough enough to please you. Just keep narrowing the fairways and grow rough until no one can shoot par. It's really not golf anymore but you get the score you want.

Mind boggling is right.

 

Hitting fairways and greens is not golf anymore. Got it. What a world.

 

This is what I don't get. Do you think hitting fairways and greens isn't golf? And also obviously you don't think putting is important to be a winner. You want the winner to miss the fairways and greens so the best player is determined by short game and escape shots? You keep harping how it sucked and everyone wants carnage but don't say what determines a good winner to you. Koepka was 2nd in fairways and 1st in greens hit. That's why he won, not sure why you don't understand that unless you haven't been watching golf for very long. The people that missed the fairways and then the greens and the cut are the carnage. When hogan hits every green and fairway it's legendary. Am I missing something?

 

 

No, it's apparently you that doesn't think fairways should be important. You want them a mile wide so all of these guys can throw darts into unprotected greens. I get it, when you watch the pros get challenged it makes you a little queasy. It's not for everyone I guess.

 

Please point out where I said I like "kiddie putt putt" and "mile wide fairways" you can't because I didn't. Dude give it a rest while adults are having a conversation. Thanks.

[games]

I think the URL says it all, but listen to the last minute of the Jordan Spieth interview. Very telling what he saw as a player:

http://golfweek.com/2017/06/18/us-open-golfers-give-erin-hills-rave-reviews/

[Shilgy]

 

This is what I don't get. Do you think hitting fairways and greens isn't golf? And also obviously you don't think putting is important to be a winner. You want the winner to miss the fairways and greens so the best player is determined by short game and escape shots? You keep harping how it sucked and everyone wants carnage but don't say what determines a good winner to you. Koepka was 2nd in fairways and 1st in greens hit. That's why he won, not sure why you don't understand that unless you haven't been watching golf for very long. The people that missed the fairways and then the greens and the cut are the carnage. When hogan hits every green and fairway it's legendary. Am I missing something?

-16 fairways too wide.

 

Ok that's fair and I thought the rough around the greens wasn't penal enough. But IMO it doesn't deserve the kind of hyperbole of being THE WORST EVER AAARRGH. don't freaking watch it then. Especially since it's just a vehicle to complain about. Also considering if it was a normal open par of 70 the final score would've been -8 which isn't crazy low comparatively. Just seems some people like to fee better about themselves by bitching a lot :)

For years we have listened to player after player talk about how the old setup of y'all rough around the greens is not a test of skill and yet we have posts wanting it. I presume because it drives up scores. If the only play is to gouged it out with a hack and hope that it gets close enough to make the putt how is that a test? Most courses today are designed with runoff areas around the greens. When cut tightly the resulting chips and pitches are more a test of players skills than a gouge and hope.

[McCann1]

I think Erin Hills would have been difficult had it not been for the rain and lack of wind this week. Almost any course the USGA could've gone to would have been hit by low scores like EH if they had the same weather conditions

 

not merion

you are right. Almost any course

[Jasonic]

 

This is what I don't get. Do you think hitting fairways and greens isn't golf? And also obviously you don't think putting is important to be a winner. You want the winner to miss the fairways and greens so the best player is determined by short game and escape shots? You keep harping how it sucked and everyone wants carnage but don't say what determines a good winner to you. Koepka was 2nd in fairways and 1st in greens hit. That's why he won, not sure why you don't understand that unless you haven't been watching golf for very long. The people that missed the fairways and then the greens and the cut are the carnage. When hogan hits every green and fairway it's legendary. Am I missing something?

-16 fairways too wide.

 

Ok that's fair and I thought the rough around the greens wasn't penal enough. But IMO it doesn't deserve the kind of hyperbole of being THE WORST EVER AAARRGH. don't freaking watch it then. Especially since it's just a vehicle to complain about. Also considering if it was a normal open par of 70 the final score would've been -8 which isn't crazy low comparatively. Just seems some people like to fee better about themselves by bitching a lot :)

For years we have listened to player after player talk about how the old setup of y'all rough around the greens is not a test of skill and yet we have posts wanting it. I presume because it drives up scores. If the only play is to gouged it out with a hack and hope that it gets close enough to make the putt how is that a test? Most courses today are designed with runoff areas around the greens. When cut tightly the resulting chips and pitches are more a test of players skills than a gouge and hope.

 

I totally agree. I don't mean pebble tom Watson thickness just some because then it's more about luck of the lie than skill. Tight lies are a good test of skill although moreso if the greens were faster.

[sekrah]

Don't want to chip out of deep rough? Hit the green.

 

Don't want to hit approach shots from the thick stuff? Don't hit into it.

 

Going by USGA's own standards, this was the worst Open in history. You can yip and spin until you are blue in the face, but based on the scoring it is a fact, not an opinion.

[Jasonic]

Don't want to chip out of deep rough? Hit the green.

 

Don't want to hit approach shots from the thick stuff? Don't hit into it.

 

Going by USGA's own standards, this was the worst Open in history. You can yip and spin until you are blue in the face, but based on the scoring it is a fact, not an opinion.

 

This is where you don't make any sense. The guy that did what you say won yet was the worst open in history. Make up your mind. And actually based on the scoring (dumb criteria), it wasn't congressional would be. I'm done, enjoy talking to yourself i.e. A brick wall

[sekrah]

Don't want to chip out of deep rough? Hit the green.

 

Don't want to hit approach shots from the thick stuff? Don't hit into it.

 

Going by USGA's own standards, this was the worst Open in history. You can yip and spin until you are blue in the face, but based on the scoring it is a fact, not an opinion.

 

This is where you don't make any sense. The guy that did what you say won yet was the worst open in history. Make up your mind. And actually based on the scoring (dumb criteria), it wasn't congressional would be. I'm done, enjoy talking to yourself i.e. A brick wall

 

Overall scoring, genius. This was the easiest Open ever. You should give up because facts are not debatable. For USGA standards, Erin Hills was a clown show.

[games]

Don't want to chip out of deep rough? Hit the green.

 

Don't want to hit approach shots from the thick stuff? Don't hit into it.

 

Going by USGA's own standards, this was the worst Open in history. You can yip and spin until you are blue in the face, but based on the scoring it is a fact, not an opinion.

 

This is where you don't make any sense. The guy that did what you say won yet was the worst open in history. Make up your mind. And actually based on the scoring (dumb criteria), it wasn't congressional would be. I'm done, enjoy talking to yourself i.e. A brick wall

 

Overall scoring, genius. This was the easiest Open ever. You should give up because facts are not debatable. For USGA standards, Erin Hills was a clown show.

 

Jordan Spieth ended tied for 35th in the US Open. LISTEN to his comments. Read the linked article for other player comments. The players thought it was a fair test.

 

I choose to believe them. Not you. No offense...

[Jasonic]

Don't want to chip out of deep rough? Hit the green.

 

Don't want to hit approach shots from the thick stuff? Don't hit into it.

 

Going by USGA's own standards, this was the worst Open in history. You can yip and spin until you are blue in the face, but based on the scoring it is a fact, not an opinion.

 

This is where you don't make any sense. The guy that did what you say won yet was the worst open in history. Make up your mind. And actually based on the scoring (dumb criteria), it wasn't congressional would be. I'm done, enjoy talking to yourself i.e. A brick wall

 

Overall scoring, genius. This was the easiest Open ever. You should give up because facts are not debatable. For USGA standards, Erin Hills was a clown show.

 

Rory had the same score of -16 did he not? And that was on a par 70 so had a lower aggregate score. That's a fact, right?? Before you resort to personal attacks please checks your facts. Lol

[North Texas]

The most interesting stat to me is the fact that it was 20% easier to hit the fairway at Erin Hills than it is at the average tour stop. Not only that, the average driving distance was 17 yards longer than the average tour stop.

 

What I also found interesting is the greens in regulation stat was the same as the average tour stop.

[North Texas]

Don't want to chip out of deep rough? Hit the green.

 

Don't want to hit approach shots from the thick stuff? Don't hit into it.

 

Going by USGA's own standards, this was the worst Open in history. You can yip and spin until you are blue in the face, but based on the scoring it is a fact, not an opinion.

 

This is where you don't make any sense. The guy that did what you say won yet was the worst open in history. Make up your mind. And actually based on the scoring (dumb criteria), it wasn't congressional would be. I'm done, enjoy talking to yourself i.e. A brick wall

 

Overall scoring, genius. This was the easiest Open ever. You should give up because facts are not debatable. For USGA standards, Erin Hills was a clown show.

 

Jordan Spieth ended tied for 35th in the US Open. LISTEN to his comments. Read the linked article for other player comments. The players thought it was a fair test.

 

I choose to believe them. Not you. No offense...

 

So the players gave rave reviews to a course where they could make lots of birdies. That's absolutely shocking :swoon: