Illegal/Hot Golf Balls and Clubs

[jokerusn]

I'd probably buy the balls for fun scrambles and the like but none of the clubs. A hotter driver usually means thinner an more likely to break. I don't want any more distance than what I have with my current 3 wood. And I was one of the few people who probably needs less spin from their wedges.

[Agent Jim]

I need a lot and i mean A LOT more help on the archer and not the arrow. Equipment is not holding me back. So I voted no across the board

[MtlJeff]

no to all 4. I want to play by the rules....it would be like playing basketball with trampoline shoes , it's not the same thing

[PhilsFanDrew]

[quote name='Agent Jim' timestamp='1332289102' post='4546364']
I need a lot and i mean A LOT more help on the archer and not the arrow. Equipment is not holding me back. So I voted no across the board
[/quote]


Agreed.

One thing that would help amateurs enjoy the game without the use of illegal equipment would be to play from the proper tee box given their ability. Last week me and a buddy were paired with a father and son and the kid (maybe 14/15) insisted on playing from the middle tees even though he had to hit driver on a 170 yard par 3. The father told him to play from the senior tees but he didn't want to hear it. I guess machismo and naivete are going to beat out elderly wisdom everyday of the week.

[PhilsFanDrew]

[quote name='Hacker#5252' timestamp='1332272180' post='4544570']
I voted no to all 4s.

Although I understand it's cheating, I still have a couple non-confrming wedges. The reasons being I already had them when the rules changed, I don't do any comptetition or betting of any kind, because I suck too much, and I simply don't have the money to buy new wedges when my old ones are still good.

I will say this though. When I made the decision I needed a 52* to fill the PW-SW gap, I had the option to get the non-conforming one, but I decided to get the legit one instead.

Equipment aside, interestingly enough, most of the people I've played with do not follow the rules, usually by not playing the ball as it lies. Most pick it up to see if it's really theirs, or just refuse to play out of "divots" or out of "crappy lies". To those people, I would suggest they buy Adams clubs

EDIT: Basing my opinion on pure logic, I would say that a man playing from the reds is cheating (unless the reds are also senior tees, in which case this applies to men under 50(?)) because the slope and rating are clearly adjusted for women/seniors (i.e. higher values than whites or yellows where I play)
[/quote]

I wouldn't look at a man playing from the red or a younger guy playing from the senior tees as cheating. Last season was my first season playing golf. The first 3 months I played I was hitting from the senior tees and that was plenty challenging given my inexperience. I would occasionally get the snickers or looks from other twosomes playing with me but these were also the chaps taking mulligans and claiming they got a 5 on a par 4 when in reality it was a snowman. It was more embarrassing to me to pretend to be something I am not rather than swallowing my pride and accepting my limitations. It also made my rounds more enjoyable and less frustrating which is why we should be playing the game in the first place.

[Guia]

If you use an illegal ball, driver, FW, or wedge you are a cheating B*****D. I would bet money that those that would use these illegal implements also move the ball, and don't count all of their strokes. Scumbags.

[FuryofRich]

The wedge would be cool once in awhile, be able to spin the ball so much that you can pull it from the back of the green to the front at a 9 hole par three.

[jwash112]

[quote name='Sooner7x' timestamp='1331768110' post='4509339']
Most times the Reds have no posted Mens slope and course rating.
I don't know if you can get one from the pro shop or calculate it based on the Womens or not.

I wouldn't consider it cheating. If you want to break par why not try it. You may or may be able to post is as a handicap round. But practice rounds are permitted under the rules.

A high school in my home town sends many players D1. In fact a few years ago 5 seniors went D1 the same year. Several to one of the most prestigious golf schools in the country. Anyway the golf coach has a rule for team players that they must play the Red tees each year until they shoot under. Then the whites until they shoot under and so on until they reach the back tees.

Might be fun to try in the spring. Depending on your skill level you might want to move back when you break 40.
[/quote]

That's a great idea.

[dunn]

[quote name='Rohlio' timestamp='1331760924' post='4508643']
[quote name='omahasker' timestamp='1331760699' post='4508623']
[quote name='caller' timestamp='1331760010' post='4508561']
Sometimes I move from the tip to blue or white when I am in slump

[/quote]

That's not cheating though. A better comparison would've been that you move from either the blues or whites to the reds.
[/quote]

That isn't cheating either...and in fact most golfers should probably move up to the reds seeing as how most people can't even break 80 let alone par.

To the point of the poll, cheating is cheating. Even though most may not care about "following the rules to the T" most people also play in scrambles/tournaments or small money games in which case their lackadaisical attitude towards the rules really does screw those of us who do follow them.

Also most of us still using non-conforming grooves has nothing to do with not following the rule to the letter. The rule explicitly states that we are still within the rules to be using them until they become illegal for the level at which we are playing.
[/quote]
Bingo!!!!!!!......... 90% or more of golfers I see have no business at the blue tees, most either have no control over there driver cause they are swinging out of their shoes, or are 200-230 off the tee which leaves long irons to hybrids on almost every par 4

It is really amazing the ego's that people have, even taking severe humiliation ( hitting a tee shot 210 off tee then waiting for the green to clear while they are 250 out!) on to skull slice and never coming close to green distance wise

I shoot pretty decent golf and I always try to get my partners to play white tees and they aren't having it........ If you cant shoot par from blue tees you have no business being there...... The game would move much quicker too if people would move up

Alone I will play from ladies tees at times just to see and practice my short irons more and see how many birdies ( I am 5-7 hdcp)

I myself don't really feel I should be playing blue tees.... My drive is 260-280 but also 230-240 on some shots, but I play with some college kids and a few guys on small tours, they are big hitters and shoot under par so I am minority

By myself I play whites minimum.... I also use reg shafts!!!!.... Lol

[goliath23]

I was paired up with a guy at my club last year who was using an illegal wedge. It was ridiculous. He was spinning back everything. I don't really know what to think. In theory hes just playing for fun.

[dunn]

[quote name='Agent Jim' timestamp='1332289102' post='4546364']
I need a lot and i mean A LOT more help on the archer and not the arrow. Equipment is not holding me back. So I voted no across the board
[/quote]
Lol..... Equipment changes only help the talented, for 99% of the golfers it wouldn't matter your score would remain the same

People will fight their consistency and swing far more than illegal equipment can overcome!!!!...... Farther you hit it the leas accurate you will become, longer ball equals less spin and more spin on wedges makes it harder to control it's reaction

People that suck will still suck!!!!!.... It's only an advantage for good players who have serious control of their game

[timehoc]

I voted no but I wouldn't care less if they were created. If someone is out their playing for fun, who am I to care what equipment they're using. It'd be like a rec softball player with a hot softball bat.

[Mschumacher]

If anyone chooses 'yes' all power to them. We all play the game for fun.
I voted 4x No. Its fun being able play the same stuff pros play (relatively speaking).

[RichardH]

If I could pick up a ball that went 30% further with no side spin but loads of spin off wedges etc but was conventional looking (to fool them) then I'd play it as a one off for a laugh against my mates when away for a lads golf weekend (but would tell them in the bar that night that my miracle round and super long drives were through cheating), I would never spend top money on anything and would never play with illegal equipment on an on-going basis.

[Hacker#5252]

[quote name='PhilsFanDrew' timestamp='1332302879' post='4548076']
[quote name='Hacker#5252' timestamp='1332272180' post='4544570']
I voted no to all 4s.

Although I understand it's cheating, I still have a couple non-confrming wedges. The reasons being I already had them when the rules changed, I don't do any comptetition or betting of any kind, because I suck too much, and I simply don't have the money to buy new wedges when my old ones are still good.

I will say this though. When I made the decision I needed a 52* to fill the PW-SW gap, I had the option to get the non-conforming one, but I decided to get the legit one instead.

Equipment aside, interestingly enough, most of the people I've played with do not follow the rules, usually by not playing the ball as it lies. Most pick it up to see if it's really theirs, or just refuse to play out of "divots" or out of "crappy lies". To those people, I would suggest they buy Adams clubs

EDIT: Basing my opinion on pure logic, I would say that a man playing from the reds is cheating (unless the reds are also senior tees, in which case this applies to men under 50(?)) because the slope and rating are clearly adjusted for women/seniors (i.e. higher values than whites or yellows where I play)
[/quote]

I wouldn't look at a man playing from the red or a younger guy playing from the senior tees as cheating. Last season was my first season playing golf. The first 3 months I played I was hitting from the senior tees and that was plenty challenging given my inexperience. I would occasionally get the snickers or looks from other twosomes playing with me but these were also the chaps taking mulligans and claiming they got a 5 on a par 4 when in reality it was a snowman. It was more embarrassing to me to pretend to be something I am not rather than swallowing my pride and accepting my limitations. It also made my rounds more enjoyable and less frustrating which is why we should be playing the game in the first place.



[/quote]

For the record, I do agree that the main reason we should all play the game is for fun. Also, sometimes, rules and logic are two different things, and perhaps my logic is flawed too.

I have to say that during my first season, I should have probably played from the reds.

Funny thing though, I've heard people say they'd rather play from the yellows (a notch longer than whites where I play) not because whites are too short, but because the obstacles from the yellows are unreachable for them, which makes the game easier in a sense. I don't do it, since I don't want to have 200 yards to every green.

[Guia]

There is no such thing a "Women's Tees".

[Redhill]

As I went through the poll questions I was thinking about how they would make such an item illegal.

Driver - shave the face to up the COR, lengthen beyond 46" - - The driver face would probably cave in and the extra length for most of us would be harder to control. - - Nope

Ball - make that sucker harder than deplete uranium - - Probably wouldn't have much feel on irons, spinning and putting - - NOPE

Wedge - make the grooves so deep they could peel an orange with 3 swings - - tough on balls and hard to gauge spin - - NOPE

Fairway - ?????? How do you make a fairway wood illegal??? There isn't a COR restriction or shaft length limit?? No limitations on the kind of metal that could be used.

Question remains: How do you make a fairway wood illegal?

[jmvargas]

i am assuming that using it means in competition either friendly or in a tournament..

if so this poll is ridiculous!!

[jmvargas]

i am assuming that using it means in competition either friendly or in a tournament..

if so this poll is ridiculous!!

[redhawkgolf]

From what I read non-conforming balls and clubs do not help. So why bother to make them non-conforming?

[Hacker#5252]

[quote name='Guia' timestamp='1332556830' post='4567410']
There is no such thing a "Women's Tees".
[/quote]

http://www.parcoursducerf.com/fr/parcours/index.php

OK if you look at this, you'll see that there are women tees.

Femme = woman, btw.

Black and yellow designed for men. White designed for both but harder for women, and red designed for women.

I guess I can't be accused of pulling things out of my a** for this one ! In any case, I have nothing else to contribute to this thread. Enjoy the rest of the discussion.

[Bodee]

[quote name='jol' timestamp='1331762599' post='4508789']
I don't understand why anyone would want to play with equipment that isn't legal.
What would you gain from it other than massaging your own ego?
[/quote]

I would have voted a big fat NO to all four questions, but part of me thinks that I would to give my boss a good thrashing (he's a miserable SOB...lol). I know that I could beat him without them, but seeing him 50 yards back off the tee might knock his ego down a bit( and he has a huge arrogant one that drives me nuts). Would never use anything illegal for rounds or tourneys, just in this one instance.

[epi]

there's a different between illegal and non-conforming, non conforming wedge still legal for amateur play, but not on tournament. That's ok for me, but voted no for all illegal ball and equipment.

[Guia]

My High School French came in useful in reading your post. The score card certainly says handicap for women.

However under the USGA Rules of Golf there is no mention of Women/Ladies Tees. They address only the Teeing Ground that I can find.

[Mr. Herbert]

[quote name='Hacker#5252' timestamp='1332598243' post='4569570']
[quote name='Guia' timestamp='1332556830' post='4567410']
There is no such thing a "Women's Tees".
[/quote]

http://www.parcoursducerf.com/fr/parcours/index.php

OK if you look at this, you'll see that there are women tees.

Femme = woman, btw.

Black and yellow designed for men. White designed for both but harder for women, and red designed for women.

I guess I can't be accused of pulling things out of my a** for this one ! In any case, I have nothing else to contribute to this thread. Enjoy the rest of the discussion.
[/quote]

Actually no where on that page does it refer to women's tees. The tees are called Borgogne. They list men's and women's handicap holes and the ratings for men and women because these are different. But just because a set of tees is only rated for women doesn't mean a man can't play from there and post a score. Just as a woman can play the back tees and post a score as well.

Please refer to section 5 of the USGA Handicap Manual for a description of how to post a score from an unrated set of tees.

[mem16]

[quote name='omahasker' timestamp='1331761841' post='4508725']
[quote name='Rohlio' timestamp='1331760924' post='4508643']
[quote name='omahasker' timestamp='1331760699' post='4508623']
[quote name='caller' timestamp='1331760010' post='4508561']
Sometimes I move from the tip to blue or white when I am in slump

[/quote]

That's not cheating though. A better comparison would've been that you move from either the blues or whites to the reds.
[/quote]

That isn't cheating either...and in fact most golfers should probably move up to the reds seeing as how most people can't even break 80 let alone par.
[/quote]
Dude...playing from the women's tees is cheating. If you have testicles then you should not consider that legal.
[/quote]

WRONG! If your drives only go 215 yards due to age or disability, the forward tees are not the "Ladies tees"! They could also be referred to as the"Senior" tees! No one should have to hit a 230 yard 3 wood 2nd shot to a par 4 green....come on, let's be fair!

Haven't you heard Jack and Arnie about "Teeing it forward". This is just to get older golfers to be able to reach par 4's with an iron - pure and simple!!!!

[oregongolf]

[quote name='mem16' timestamp='1391756158' post='8614621']
[quote name='omahasker' timestamp='1331761841' post='4508725']
[quote name='Rohlio' timestamp='1331760924' post='4508643']
[quote name='omahasker' timestamp='1331760699' post='4508623']
[quote name='caller' timestamp='1331760010' post='4508561']
Sometimes I move from the tip to blue or white when I am in slump

[/quote]

That's not cheating though. A better comparison would've been that you move from either the blues or whites to the reds.
[/quote]

That isn't cheating either...and in fact most golfers should probably move up to the reds seeing as how most people can't even break 80 let alone par.
[/quote]
Dude...playing from the women's tees is cheating. If you have testicles then you should not consider that legal.
[/quote]

WRONG! If your drives only go 215 yards due to age or disability, the forward tees are not the "Ladies tees"! They could also be referred to as the"Senior" tees! No one should have to hit a 230 yard 3 wood 2nd shot to a par 4 green....come on, let's be fair!

Haven't you heard Jack and Arnie about "Teeing it forward". This is just to get older golfers to be able to reach par 4's with an iron - pure and simple!!!!
[/quote]

As much as I admire the spirit of your post and agree, you just bumped a thread that is nearly two years old.

It's very easy to calculate it afterwards, but I wish every course would list the course rating and slope adjustments for each tee.