Calling Green Grass Evaluations: Please Respond

[Its_KBO.]

Dispute has been filed. At this point I would prefer to just get my money back and move on. 

[blink3665]

2 hours ago, Philomathesq said:

You'll need to dispute. I emailed the owner multiple times, tagged them in this thread, and still no response. It sucks, but a PayPal dispute is the only way to go. For the record, Green Grass never actually responded to my PayPal dispute, so I had the option of seeking a refund. However, I did finally receive the shaft and, although they installed the adapter wrong and tipped it incorrectly, I was able to fix their mistakes and the shaft is fine.

 

Sorry this happened to you and good luck.

 

Oh man. So I take it you got communication back from MCA and GGE didnt tip it correctly?!?!?!

 

Screw that. Get a refund.

[Philomathesq]

40 minutes ago, blink3665 said:

 

Oh man. So I take it you got communication back from MCA and GGE didnt tip it correctly?!?!?!

 

Screw that. Get a refund.

Yes, MCA did respond (the next day... go figure... a company that responds in a timely manner) and confirmed that the measurements for my shaft from tip to graphics indicated it was not tipped correctly. Such a poop show.

 

To be perfectly honest, I would return the shaft and demand a full refund, but given how difficult these clowns are to work with, it is literally not with my time and effort. To be fair, I have installed the shaft and hit it and I like it so far, so that also plays a part in my decision. It seems I needed it to be tipped more than I requested and they just lucked into tipping it more than I asked.

 

I will note that my contact at MCA said that they are well aware of the tactics used by Green Grass and that they (MCA) would be looking into the issue more and that I'm not the first person to have reached out to them about issues. I will further mention that, as a result of this thread, I've received many PM's from others who have also had horrific experiences with Green Grass, and I'll be elevating those issues to site management. I've heard many stories from others, but the one I find worst (which was substantiated via email), and one that is clearly against the rules of this site, is that JT tried to get a member of this site to pay him via PayPal using the "friends and family" because JT didn't want to pay the fee that is charged to businesses making transactions via PayPal; note that paying via "friends and family" also removes the protections of the buyer to dispute the purchase and have PayPal take action. Not only is this against the rules of the site, but it is also a clearly underhanded move and, honestly, outright fraudulent. If this doesn't get the site to take action, I don't know what will.

[sailfishchris]

Wow! I'm glad I deal with Will and Pro Clubs for equipment. I guess I had a blind eye for this stuff. I enjoy JT's shaft comparisons. But, always looked at them like a sales pitch. 

[Philomathesq]

28 minutes ago, sailfishchris said:

Wow! I'm glad I deal with Will and Pro Clubs for equipment. I guess I had a blind eye for this stuff. I enjoy JT's shaft comparisons. But, always looked at them like a sales pitch. 

That Sir, is because you are smarter than I. ? I am now a much more learned consumer and will be sure to avoid them in the future.

[Enrico_Palazzo81]

I have the same experience with Green Grass Evaluations. I ordered and paid a Tensei Pro White 2.0 on May 22.

Communication was fast and great till everything was paid.

I didn’t receive anything till now. JT only had excuses first. Then he told me last month the shaft is on its way. I had no problem with longer shipping, because I live in Germany.

I don’t have a trackingnumber till now although I asked many times.

The last weeks he doesn’t even respond to my messages about the order.

I tried to test him and emailed him to order something else and he answered in two hours.

Today I open a PayPal dispute and will see how it goes.

 

[Valtiel]

1 hour ago, Philomathesq said:

Yes, MCA did respond (the next day... go figure... a company that responds in a timely manner) and confirmed that the measurements for my shaft from tip to graphics indicated it was not tipped correctly. Such a poop show.

 

To be perfectly honest, I would return the shaft and demand a full refund, but given how difficult these clowns are to work with, it is literally not with my time and effort. To be fair, I have installed the shaft and hit it and I like it so far, so that also plays a part in my decision. It seems I needed it to be tipped more than I requested and they just lucked into tipping it more than I asked.

 

I will note that my contact at MCA said that they are well aware of the tactics used by Green Grass and that they (MCA) would be looking into the issue more and that I'm not the first person to have reached out to them about issues. I will further mention that, as a result of this thread, I've received many PM's from others who have also had horrific experiences with Green Grass, and I'll be elevating those issues to site management. I've heard many stories from others, but the one I find worst (which was substantiated via email), and one that is clearly against the rules of this site, is that JT tried to get a member of this site to pay him via PayPal using the "friends and family" because JT didn't want to pay the fee that is charged to businesses making transactions via PayPal; note that paying via "friends and family" also removes the protections of the buyer to dispute the purchase and have PayPal take action. Not only is this against the rules of the site, but it is also a clearly underhanded move and, honestly, outright fraudulent. If this doesn't get the site to take action, I don't know what will.

More fuel for the fire I suppose, and I think I can speak for most of us in that we appreciate your efforts and the reaching out you have done. 

The fact that they OVER tipped your shaft is even worse IMO, especially since TollBros tries to get to people into private conversations to "fit" them since apparently everything they try to sell is "super sensitive to tipping" and requires consultation. Not only is it just another sales tactic, but it is also completely useless if they can't even manage to relay the information from these "fittings" correctly. At least under tipping has a certain amount of recourse in terms of correction. 

They need to be off this site, and it is not even a tough call at this point IMO. It would be bittersweet if they contributed to the community or were a positive presence outside the sales threads and simply screwed up orders a bunch, but the outright abusiveness towards customers in the past combined with attempts at circumventing PayPal protection via coercion into using Friends & Family makes it open and shut. Please keep us posted to whatever extent you can regarding these escalations, and thank you. 

[Philomathesq]

1 hour ago, Enrico_Palazzo81 said:

I have the same experience with Green Grass Evaluations. I ordered and paid a Tensei Pro White 2.0 on May 22.

Communication was fast and great till everything was paid.

I didn’t receive anything till now. JT only had excuses first. Then he told me last month the shaft is on its way. I had no problem with longer shipping, because I live in Germany.

I don’t have a trackingnumber till now although I asked many times.

The last weeks he doesn’t even respond to my messages about the order.

I tried to test him and emailed him to order something else and he answered in two hours.

Today I open a PayPal dispute and will see how it goes.

 

Holy schnitzel! Are you serious that you ordered on May 22nd and still don't have the shaft?!? The fact that you are in Germany (sehr erfreut) could cause a short delay, but 3 months? Unbelievable.

[SubaruWRX]

[TheSphynx]

It’s crazy that I get a two year warning for telling a guy his beat up VR pro blades  weren’t “mint” in his BST ad, but these dudes can stiff paying customers left and right on here... 

Edited August 20, 2020 by TheSphynx

[Enrico_Palazzo81]

8 hours ago, Philomathesq said:

Holy schnitzel! Are you serious that you ordered on May 22nd and still don't have the shaft?!? The fact that you are in Germany (sehr erfreut) could cause a short delay, but 3 months? Unbelievable.

I already ordered  two shafts In December last year and they arrived in February. 
I expected waiting time and had no problem with it. But three month and the lack of communication after they received the money is a joke.

[12aces]

@golfwrx do your job instead of censoring my posts. insane

Edited August 21, 2020 by 12aces

[Philomathesq]

26 minutes ago, 12aces said:

@golfwrx do your job instead of censoring my posts. insane

I'm not 100% sure at this point, but I have it on good authority that TollBros and Green Grass are gone. They have been removed as a listed sponsor in the forum, and many of TollBros' posts now simply show as "Deleted." I have also been told, but have not independently confirmed, that TollBros made a post stating that he was leaving this site and would be taking his borderline fraudulent business tactics talents to South Beach some other forum.

 

While I'm never rooting for businesses to fail or get banned, I believe that Green Grass dug its own grave. I also applaud the site ownership for handling the issue appropriately, as it could not have been an easy decision to ask Green Grass to leave and lose out on that income, especially with everything going on in the world and the transitions in the site back to the old platform.

Edited August 21, 2020 by Philomathesq

[storm319]

1 hour ago, Philomathesq said:

I'm not 100% sure at this point, but I have it on good authority that TollBros and Green Grass are gone. They have been removed as a listed sponsor in the forum, and many of TollBros' posts now simply show as "Deleted." I have also been told, but have not independently confirmed, that TollBros made a post stating that he was leaving this site and would be taking his borderline fraudulent business tactics talents to South Beach some other forum.

 

While I'm never rooting for businesses to fail or get banned, I believe that Green Grass dug its own grave. I also applaud the site ownership for handling the issue appropriately, as it could not have been an easy decision to ask Green Grass to leave and lose out on that income, especially with everything going on in the world and the transitions in the site back to the old platform.

Profiles still look to be active and still listed as sponsors (search difficulty may be due to ongoing indexing). Their sponsor sub forum does appear to be gone though.

 

https://forums.golfwrx.com/profile/456862-tollbros/

 

https://forums.golfwrx.com/profile/485782-greengrassevaluations/

[Philomathesq]

1 minute ago, storm319 said:

Profiles still look to be active and still listed as sponsors (search difficulty may be due to ongoing indexing). Their sponsor sub forum does appear to be gone though.

 

https://forums.golfwrx.com/profile/456862-tollbros/

 

https://forums.golfwrx.com/profile/485782-greengrassevaluations/

My post was clearly worded poorly. I don’t think they have been banned, per se, I do believe their sponsor status has been removed. My guess is that their profiles will soon show they are no longer sponsors, but with everything going on with the site upgrades, it may take some time. The fact that their sub-forum has been removed is a step in the right direction.

[pinhigh27]

11 hours ago, Philomathesq said:

I'm not 100% sure at this point, but I have it on good authority that TollBros and Green Grass are gone. They have been removed as a listed sponsor in the forum, and many of TollBros' posts now simply show as "Deleted." I have also been told, but have not independently confirmed, that TollBros made a post stating that he was leaving this site and would be taking his borderline fraudulent business tactics talents to South Beach some other forum.

 

While I'm never rooting for businesses to fail or get banned, I believe that Green Grass dug its own grave. I also applaud the site ownership for handling the issue appropriately, as it could not have been an easy decision to ask Green Grass to leave and lose out on that income, especially with everything going on in the world and the transitions in the site back to the old platform.

Oh darn who is going to stoke the egos of all the guys with crap swings who spin their driver 4000 rpm and think they need rebar to have a normal ball flight 

 

who is going to hype new shafts that are 99.99% similar to shafts currently on the market 

[Bad9]

Honest question, does anyone take their threads/posts as nothing more than marketing spiel. The few things I read came across as nothing more than pushing their latest exclusive/expensive shaft. They also seem to push(as do most of those hyping expensive shafts) "they feel so much better than x" when the numbers don't reflect. As we know feel is very subjective and I don't find it a particularly enlightening in a review. I'll admit my bias is not very positive after reading so many of these threads about TB/GGE the last few years.

[Philomathesq]

28 minutes ago, Bad9 said:

Honest question, does anyone take their threads/posts as nothing more than marketing spiel. The few things I read came across as nothing more than pushing their latest exclusive/expensive shaft. They also seem to push(as do most of those hyping expensive shafts) "they feel so much better than x" when the numbers don't reflect. As we know feel is very subjective and I don't find it a particularly enlightening in a review. I'll admit my bias is not very positive after reading so many of these threads about TB/GGE the last few years.

I can answer for me and say that I agree, their posts do come off as marketing hype. In my case, I already knew which shaft I wanted and what specs I wanted, and I just happened to stumble across his thread and saw that he had them in stock. That's why I purchased from him. I should have done a quick search on the site to see if ordering from Green Grass was a good decision, but I didn't, in part because they were listed as a Sponsor and I assumed that meant at least some minimum amount of vetting had been done. Ultimately, I should have known better, and at least I've learned something.

[Valtiel]

7 hours ago, Bad9 said:

Honest question, does anyone take their threads/posts as nothing more than marketing spiel. The few things I read came across as nothing more than pushing their latest exclusive/expensive shaft. They also seem to push(as do most of those hyping expensive shafts) "they feel so much better than x" when the numbers don't reflect. As we know feel is very subjective and I don't find it a particularly enlightening in a review. I'll admit my bias is not very positive after reading so many of these threads about TB/GGE the last few years.

The initial "Big bad low spin shaft thread" had a lot of written feedback from a variety of players with different speeds and deliveries on a wide range of shafts, and I think many people (including myself) found that to be interesting and useful. Although subjective, it is nice to hear what a bunch of other qualified people think about different types of shafts. That initial thread read a lot less like a sales thread than the handful of recent ones which seem to have a fraction of the effort put into them and as you said, read as pure hype to generate sales. 

Based on the number of views, that thread generated a ton of business for them, and i'd bet that they did not scale to match the increased business and/or already had an unreliable system in place to begin with that crumpled under the increased attention. Screwed up orders and bad communication followed combined with some very public mishandling of a few customers they had let down and nothing was done to repair the damage, so here we are. As @Philomathesq said, they dug their grave on this one and it is a shame because with the right people, they could have had a really cool little niche here. Thank you @Philomathesq for the follow up though. If they truly are going to "some other forum" then I doubt it will go any better if they don't fix their lazy excuse for a business model. 

[GoTime]

They would post testing numbers, but if you asked what the tipping/measurements were for the testers they tried to get you to PM them and they paypal them $40 for a consultation. LMAO.

[Tarheels308]

I haven’t been on this site in awhile, so clearly missed the problems with GGE but bought some shafts from them multiple times in 2018 and had no issues and it didn’t seem like others had issues back then either, although I’m not very active on here so coulda missed it. It’s a shame their business practices seem to have gone downhill, offered some shafts that were hard to find. Like Valtiel said, they could of had a cool little niche. Thanks to everyone in this thread for sharing their stories.

[pinhigh27]

7 hours ago, Go_Time said:

They would post testing numbers, but if you asked what the tipping/measurements were for the testers they tried to get you to PM them and they paypal them $40 for a consultation. LMAO.

I would bet any amount of money that their "testing numbers" are cherry picked to support the shaft they are pimping at the time. 

 

Unless it was just magic that the shaft they were pimping had the most ball speed and the lowest spin. Every.Single. Time

Edited August 22, 2020 by pinhigh27