Equipment rule changes...

[Robert Brown]

more in 2010?

I have never seen so much confusion and anger over a rule change (new grooves) before...what do you think the odds are of another rule change on this happening this year or even next year? Does anyone think they will dial things back to 2009 rules or change the rules on the ball or ??????

[jaskanski]

Shafts. The will be a standardized flex profile and weight. The USGA will outlaw XX flex or 'tour stiff' and overall length will be limited to 44.75". All shafts will be submitted to the USGA for approval and a conforming list will be produced in due course. Steel shafts made on or before 1977 will be 'grandfathered'. Sounds daft? Can't be any worse than the grooves fiasco. Now that the powers that be have got a taste for it, be prepared for lots more rules changes. No more plastic tee pegs, limit to carbon content of irons, relative durability of balls and maximum combined sole width of all 14 clubs. Heaven help us.

[oldcarl]

Enough Already! It's high time that the Blue Coats get out of the equipment designing business, beyond that which has been specified in the rules of golf since the late 50's.

I don't care who therir technicial guru may be, it is not their job to limit innovation in materials and processes used in the manufacture of

equipment. or for that matter, the design or alteration of golf courses. Witness some of the US open disasters in the last 25 years. IMO.

[Robert Brown]

Very good thoughts!!

[Chicago Mac]

Hi, I like their involment as they are tryin to keep the Pro game fun to watch for the viewer. I'm getting tired of the drive 9 iron type golf to the point I've starting watching more LPGA as you see more mid and long irons on par fours and it's a big deal when you hit a par five in two. Par fives are really par fours now on the PGA tour. At least they are doing something to help the game befor it's too late and I hope they continue. Even with their equipment changes, the equipment for the average weekend golfer has come such a long way that the game is fun for all and they are not trying to hurt the average golfer. You can still get a full set of irons that are preety much all hybirds and slice proof heads. Mac

[Sawgrass]

Whether their intentions were right or wrong, the USGA has certainly caused a lot of upset with golfers, both pro and amateur, by making changes to equipment rules this year.

I wonder if there will be a backlash in the numbers of people joining the association? I wonder how much of their revenue is dependant on membership fees vs. US Open TV rights and merchandise? Does anyone know, because this could be central to their behavior regarding rules changes going forward.

[dlygrisse]

I wouldnt be suprised if they outlawed the high lofted wedges
limited the number of clubs carried to 12
rolled back COR
rolled back max size on drivers

Then again I wouldnt be suprised if nothing else changed.

[Newby]

[quote name='Sawgrass' date='31 January 2010 - 03:41 PM' timestamp='1264952466' post='2216511']
Whether their intentions were right or wrong, the USGA has certainly caused a lot of upset with golfers, both pro and amateur, by making changes to equipment rules this year.
[/quote]

The pros aren't that bothered. As long as it's a level playing field they'll go along with anything.

But more significantly how will it affect the massive majority of amateur subscribers to the USGA who won't see any change until 2024?

[Sawgrass]

[quote name='Newby' date='31 January 2010 - 12:26 PM' timestamp='1264958811' post='2216728']
[quote name='Sawgrass' date='31 January 2010 - 03:41 PM' timestamp='1264952466' post='2216511']
Whether their intentions were right or wrong, the USGA has certainly caused a lot of upset with golfers, both pro and amateur, by making changes to equipment rules this year.
[/quote]

The pros aren't that bothered. As long as it's a level playing field they'll go along with anything.

But more significantly how will it affect the massive majority of amateur subscribers to the USGA who won't see any change until 2024?
[/quote]

Well, Phil and Scott are certainly bothered.

But yes, I was basing my concern on amateurs, who clearly make up the greatest number of USGA members and therefore the most important revenue-providers.

While my clubs won't be at issue until 2024, the contorversy has annoyed me and caused me to loose some respect for the USGA.

[phil75070]

This groove rule affects, what, 1% or less of all golfers today? The USGA's power comes from the people they govern, us, the other 99%+. If they continue to make stupid changes to equipment requirements and continue to make Rules that take some of the fun out of the game, more and more people will start ignoring them, ultimately making them irrelevant. Another example are electronic devices. Come on, lasers with slope, even if turned off, can't be used for handicap rounds? Devices coming out, like the new SkyGolf SGX that will, if you go for the optional add-on, will be able to suggest a club to hit based on your average distance with that club, will probably be illegal as well. More and more people are already giving the literal finger to the USGA and doing what they want and not what the USGA says they can do/use.

It is one thing to set limits before the fact rather than go back and change things that were previously approved. You would have thought they learned their lessons with the Eyes's back in 1990.

[Robert Brown]

Sawgrass & Phil.... very well said!!

[grabthepin]

Good on the ruling bodies. Their job is to keep the integrity of the game and they should continue to do so. The groove change is simply the least they could without getting their butts sued by companies who care simply for their pockets.

I can imagine Phil (M) would be pissed off, his whole game is based on bombing the ball and gouge it from where ever it lands onto the green. 23 out of 56 fairways hit last tournament and he's number two in the world? I'm glad to hear he's happy with his game. I wouldn't be if I missed the fairway that much.

[Newby]

[quote name='jontyc' date='01 February 2010 - 04:57 AM' timestamp='1265000258' post='2218261']
Good on the ruling bodies. Their job is to keep the integrity of the game and they should continue to do so. The groove change is simply the least they could without getting their butts sued by companies who care simply for their pockets.

I can imagine Phil (M) would be pissed off, his whole game is based on bombing the ball and gouge it from where ever it lands onto the green. 23 out of 56 fairways hit last tournament and he's number two in the world? I'm glad to hear he's happy with his game. I wouldn't be if I missed the fairway that much.
[/quote]

[Sid Vicious]

Enough Already! It's high time that the Blue Coats get out of the equipment designing business, beyond that which has been specified in the rules of golf since the late 50's.

I don't care who therir technicial guru may be, it is not their job to limit innovation in materials and processes used in the manufacture of

equipment. or for that matter, the design or alteration of golf courses. Witness some of the US open disasters in the last 25 years. IMO.

 

The blue Coats need to get out of the golf business altogether. The USGA and R&A have outlived their usefulness. It's time to create a governing body that understands the modern game and isn't beholden to the manufacturers.

[DaveLeeNC]

Enough Already! It's high time that the Blue Coats get out of the equipment designing business, beyond that which has been specified in the rules of golf since the late 50's.

I don't care who therir technicial guru may be, it is not their job to limit innovation in materials and processes used in the manufacture of

equipment. or for that matter, the design or alteration of golf courses. Witness some of the US open disasters in the last 25 years. IMO.

 

The blue Coats need to get out of the golf business altogether. The USGA and R&A have outlived their usefulness. It's time to create a governing body that understands the modern game and isn't beholden to the manufacturers.

 

I can understand someone taking issue with the USGA and its various equipment rulings.

 

But what are they doing or talking about doing that would lead you to believe that they are "beholden to the manufacturers"?

 

dave

[stage1350]

New USGA rules for next year:

If your drive goes beyond 250 yards, drop it at a mark 250 yards from the tee and take a 1 stroke penalty. You're obviously doing something illegal even though we can't specify what it is.

If you have a graphite shaft and still hit the fairway, move your ball into the rough. Step on it so it's deep in the grass and take a 1 stroke penalty. Graphite shows you are considering bomb and gouge, even if you've never hit it more than 225 yards. Your thoughts are contrary to the spirit of the game.

If you carry the bunker of the dogleg, drop your ball in the sand and add 2 strokes. That's not the way the course designer intended you to play the hole and how dare you go against his wishes.

If you are in the rough and successfully escape it, drop another ball and keep hitting until you only advance the ball 5 feet. Add as many strokes to the card as needed until you understand that we don't want you to show any level of skill.

If you sink the putt, congratulations. That's all we want you to excel at. Unless you are using a urethane ball. Then DQ yourself for using a ball that goes too far.

[Geo]

BRILLIANT!

 

[aussieb]

They tried to limit power in tennis a decade ago as it was going to ruin the game. Nothing was changed and the game has continued to grow in popularity and produce Federer for example. I think the USGA and R&A need to work on growing the game and worry less about hindering it's members and professionals. Talent and better course design will make the game more appealing and less controversial. Unfortunately, they will make changes to COR, the ball and anything they can get there hands on to.

[Sawgrass]

[quote name='stage1350' date='02 February 2010 - 09:06 AM' timestamp='1265119560' post='2221811']
Graphite shows you are considering bomb and gouge, even if you've never hit it more than 225 yards. [b]Your thoughts are contrary to the spirit of the game.
[/b]
[/quote]

I think you're really on to something here. The next move should be to change the USGA's name to The Ministry of Truth, and have George Orwell head it up. That guy Orwell really knew how to level a playing field!

[Pepperturbo]

It never fails, someone always complains about rules or leadership regardless. This thread happens to target the USGA, that which I support. NO, I don't like every rule; some I wonder about, but not one I feel the need to whine over or question the USGA leadership.

Rules are good for those of us that use them to raise our game and awareness. What brings about a chringe is thinking about a day where the USGA redefines the rules of the game of golf for internet whinners, couch potatoes and hacks; it would then be referred to as a game for lifes loosers...

[aussieb]

Kind of like the rules of English grammar and spelling huh Pep?

Just kidding around

[stage1350]

[quote] ...to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of government becomes destructive to these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shown that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. [b]But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such government, and to provide new guards for their future security. [/b][/quote]

While these words were speaking of something much more important than the game of golf, the ideals hold true.

The USGA continues to show itself to be of the opinion that no more progress can be made in the technology of golf equipment. They have capped specifications of many variables in the design of golf clubs over the last decade, much more so than ever before. Now, they have crossed a line by rolling back specifications to an earlier period, taking years of production and millions of dollars of equipment and rendered them illegal and worthless. This is unacceptable.

Imagine in 1975 if the USA had not simply removed lead from gasoline. Instead they OUTLAWED all cars prior to 1975 because they were designed for lead. They would give you 14 years, then you could never drive these vehicles on the street legally again. Who would want to buy a used car at that point? Who benefits from forcing the public to purchase new vehicles? This is the exact scenario that the USGA has proposed for golf clubs and they hope that 14 years is enough time for everyone to tolerate it.

The actions of the USGA have completely overstepped their self titled "protection of the game" ideals. They have allowed square grooves for over 25 years and NOW they are a problem? Too late. The genie is out of the bottle.

Cap the technology where it is if you must, but don't be a luddite. Mankind will continue to produce athletes that will be better year after year and records will continue to be broken. And engineers will continue to push the limits of technology within the scope of the rules.

When the USGA takes a wedge that meets the specifications they laid out and STILL won't approve it like the Callaway wedges, that ruling body has become corrupt and unable to abide by it's own rules. Ruggee should be dismissed immediately for these actions and replaced with people that can either write appropriate technical specifications, or can submit their ego to the fact that someone can always build a better mousetrap.

[D'KRUSHER]

[b]Carnack D'Krusher[/b] predicts that Tour Players, in their Star Chamber Meeting today, will vote today to petition/pressure all players to [b]voluntarily[/b] stop playing the Eye 2's - with an assist from Finchem.

===========
Callaway lost out on their new wedge giving the No go for play, but their hexagon dimple was previously banned by the USGA & R & A, and stopped the Royal Ball ( ?) from competing in the 50's (?).

[Pepperturbo]

Kind of like the rules of English grammar and spelling huh Pep?

 

Just kidding around

 

I love the rules of grammer about as much as writting and the rules of golf; only grammer is much harder for me even with my ED. I can always count on some DB person bringing it to my attention... As if I didn't know :D I've written three books; but the most difficult was twenty two chapter 400+ page instructional. They would not have come about if it weren't for the valued help from one special editor. One of the biggest keys in life is to know your own weaknesses and what to do to shore them up as we can't be experts in all areas; besides I'd rather put the time in on my golf game.

[martinez]

This rule change is fantastic. Rough might mean something meaningful again and if you want to play a distance ball then you have to give up some control.
The difference in the grooves is going to have very little effect on the average golfers' ability to get the ball in the hole.......IN 14 YEARS TIME!