Presidents Cup 2011 Discussion Thread (merged)

[tbowles411]

[quote name='sgniwder99' timestamp='1321534638' post='3812751']
[quote name='SteveL1' timestamp='1321508682' post='3812019']
Now that was a spank'n that Tiger & Stricker got! I bet Stevie is gloating just a little right now.

[b]On a side note, at a 8 hdcp, I wonder if I could break 120 there. Like putting on the concrete garage floor. Geez.[/b]
[/quote]

Man, I was thinking the exact same thing. After watching the first match on the first hole, where Els ran a wedge from the front of the green to nearly off the back, I was like, "holy crap!" Add some windy weather and this course is going to be BRUTAL.

Beautiful track, though.
[/quote]
That looked like a great course out there, but man! It's playing hard and VERY fast. I know I would have MAJOR issues out there!

I don't think anyone logically would have seen the butt kicking that Tiger and Stricker took. They didn't hit terrible shots, but they just weren't as good as Scott and Choi. The first bounce on many of those shots just dictated what happened with those concrete greens. If you were even just a "little" off, that was it. And what was up with the turf around the bunkers? They were literally shaved! But once they got down, that was it. Scott and Choi literally didn't let them back in the match. They played their butts off.

However, I was not surprised that the US came back to lead 4-2 after the 1st day. And how long is Bubba long?! Wow!

[Barto78]

[quote name='tbowles411' timestamp='1321535911' post='3812801']
[quote name='sgniwder99' timestamp='1321534638' post='3812751']
[quote name='SteveL1' timestamp='1321508682' post='3812019']
Now that was a spank'n that Tiger & Stricker got! I bet Stevie is gloating just a little right now.

[b]On a side note, at a 8 hdcp, I wonder if I could break 120 there. Like putting on the concrete garage floor. Geez.[/b]
[/quote]

Man, I was thinking the exact same thing. After watching the first match on the first hole, where Els ran a wedge from the front of the green to nearly off the back, I was like, "holy crap!" Add some windy weather and this course is going to be BRUTAL.

Beautiful track, though.
[/quote]

I don't think anyone logically would have seen the butt kicking that Tiger and Stricker took. They didn't hit terrible shots, but they just weren't as good as Scott and Choi.
[/quote]

I disagree. I don't know how anyone would have logically thought Stricker/Woods would have simply beaten Scott/Choi. Stricker hasn't played competitive golf in months and Tiger is still lacking a bit of confidence with his driver. Looking back, it was foolish for Couples to put Stricker & Woods together because both guys aren't at the top of their games like they were back in 2009. However, if you don't put the guys together on day 1, considering how they played in the Ryder Cup and Presidents cup the last 2 years, then Couples would have been setting himself up for failure if both guys would have lost their matches.

I think Fred probably wanted to separate the pair for 4somes and will likely do so on day 3 of the matches.

[tjumper78]

the scott/choi pairing was very impressive, especially k.j.
i become a bigger fan of him every time i watch him play.
so steady.

[youngwaldo]

[quote name='Green Valley' timestamp='1321511962' post='3812337']
4-2
[/quote]

That was my prediction yesterday morning.

Wk

[Llortamaisey]

[quote name='poizster' timestamp='1321514959' post='3812441']
[quote name='KYMAR' timestamp='1321514810' post='3812439']
Keegan at home on his couch talking to a buddy on the phone

"man in reality, i should be playing in this pairing TWICE. Whatever, I'm gonna go shine my trophys, hit a few putts, try to pull some chicks at the beach and if that doesn't happen Im gonna search the BST"
[/quote]

Does Keegan try and pull chicks? I thought he might go the other way.
[/quote]


Pretty sure he gets it in with chicks. He seemed to get rather friendly when he was hugging his sister after the PGA Championship. But back on topic.

If I were him, I'm not so sure I would be upset about not being picked after watching the matches last night. I don't think he is missing anything

[youngwaldo]

At the end of day 2 it will be

US 7
IN 5

Wk

[triplebogeyblues]

I don't think Tiger played as poorly as everybody is making it out to be. He and Stricker just didn't compliment each other whatsoever. Tiger hit a few shots that he looked like he was happy with, but just didn't work out. Just like that shot at the par 3 where he hit the ball one foot too far, which was the difference between a 5 footer for birdie and a hole concession.

They will be just fine.

[QuigleyDU]

Blame the match on stricker if you want but this was publicized as a tiger Scott match. I wonder what kind of a blow this was /is to tigers mind set.

Glad that the us team is leading but Aldo glad tiger lost. I just can't bring myself to cheer for him.

Ryo is really not very good outside of japan. Its very typical of stars from there jumbo comes to mind. Great against local competition nut bot good on a world stage.

Hr does have a pretty swing though.

[ej002]

I am really shocked at how poor Stricker looked. He had a number of chances, where he would normally be licking his chops and hit mediocre shots at best. The putter was cold, the wedges were cold, the short game was off. I thought he would be more prepared. Tiger wasn't terrible, but he wasn't great either. I think Stricker was much worse of the two. Tiger was placing the duece in perfect spots and Strick struggled to get inside 30 feet. Normally he would be tight. I don't think you can blame it on anyone. They ran into a HOT pairing and played poorly. I doubt this affects Tiger's phsyche at all.

I think these guys need to get split up, but how do you re-seed them? I really liked Bubba/Web and Toms/Mahan - these are solid pairings.

On the flip side. I was really surprised with Mickelson's play. I had a bad feeling he wasn't going to show up. But he brought his putter this week. Him and Furyk are going to be a nice compliment tonight. Furyk can grind out the conservaive play and Phil can go bananas with his driver. I love it. Hopefully Strick can wake up and allow Tiger to do something similar.

Overall I was really impressed with the our team. To come out 4-2 from some of those matches is great.

[triplebogeyblues]

[quote name='creeder06' timestamp='1321542764' post='3813129']
Blame the match on stricker if you want but this was publicized as a tiger Scott match. I wonder what kind of a blow this was /is to tigers mind set.

Glad that the us team is leading but Aldo glad tiger lost. I just can't bring myself to cheer for him.

Ryo is really not very good outside of japan. Its very typical of stars from there jumbo comes to mind. Great against local competition nut bot good on a world stage.

Hr does have a pretty swing though.
[/quote]

I don't understand what kind of blow to Tiger's mindset this could be? It isn't like they were playing head to head.

If anything, I'd look to the week before where Tiger beat Scott by 2 strokes in his native country's Open championship.

[MileHighClub]

[quote name='creeder06' timestamp='1321542764' post='3813129']
Blame the match on stricker if you want but this was publicized as a tiger Scott match.
[/quote]

It was. Golf Channel's promo spots said it was "Tiger versus Adam Scott". Well, Adam Scott gave Tiger a beat down. I am sure GC will blame it on Stricker today because they don't want to hurt Tiger's feelings. Tiger and Stricker played poorly, but at least Stricker earned his way onto the team.

[worldslasttwfan]

Was Pres. Cup always four days event? I for some reason thought it was same format as Ryder cup which i think is three days.

[Barto78]

[quote name='kjo257' timestamp='1321543758' post='3813183']
[quote name='creeder06' timestamp='1321542764' post='3813129']
Blame the match on stricker if you want but this was publicized as a tiger Scott match.
[/quote]

It was. Golf Channel's promo spots said it was "Tiger versus Adam Scott". Well, Adam Scott gave Tiger a beat down. I am sure GC will blame it on Stricker today because they don't want to hurt Tiger's feelings. Tiger and Stricker played poorly, but at least Stricker earned his way onto the team.
[/quote]

Just because a channel publicizes something as a Tiger vs. Scott match, doesn't make it so. I would understand it if it were a 4 ball or singles match, but a 4some match is certainly not a mano y mano match, no matter what Golf Channel or anyone else wants to make it out to be.

[AP2 712]

[quote name='creeder06' timestamp='1321542764' post='3813129']
Blame the match on stricker if you want but this was publicized as a tiger Scott match. [b]By the media and you...not those involved -recall -ALTERNATE SHOT FORMAT
[/b]I wonder what kind of a blow this was /is to tigers mind set. [b]Uhhhhh none nada zip zero zilch... Are you serious??? Can't be[/b]
Glad that the us team is leading but Aldo glad tiger lost. I just can't bring myself to cheer for him.[b] Nothing new here...there are a bunch of your like here...they usually pop up any week Tiger plays.[/b]

Ryo is really not very good outside of japan.[b]T20 @ the Master and T4 @ the Bridgestone as a 20 year old....A 20 YEAR OLD [/b]Its very typical of stars from there jumbo comes to mind. Great against local competition nut bot good on a world stage.

Hr does have a pretty swing though. [b]A bit pre-mature on this don't ya think??? [/b]
[/quote]

Ehhhhh...See the bold above
I am by no means a Ryo fan and I really didn't see where how and why he was compared to Ricky and Rory...but he is 20 years old and trending in the right direction.

[candess]

[quote name='Barto78' timestamp='1321544133' post='3813209']
[quote name='kjo257' timestamp='1321543758' post='3813183']
[quote name='creeder06' timestamp='1321542764' post='3813129']
Blame the match on stricker if you want but this was publicized as a tiger Scott match.
[/quote]

It was. Golf Channel's promo spots said it was "Tiger versus Adam Scott". Well, Adam Scott gave Tiger a beat down. I am sure GC will blame it on Stricker today because they don't want to hurt Tiger's feelings. Tiger and Stricker played poorly, but at least Stricker earned his way onto the team.
[/quote]

Just because a channel publicizes something as a Tiger vs. Scott match, doesn't make it so. I would understand it if it were a 4 ball or singles match, but a 4some match is certainly not a mano y mano match, no matter what Golf Channel or anyone else wants to make it out to be.
[/quote]

The sport of golf revolves around Tiger Woods. Anyone who tries to deny it is delusional.

[station2station]

[quote name='kjo257' timestamp='1321543758' post='3813183']
[quote name='creeder06' timestamp='1321542764' post='3813129']
Blame the match on stricker if you want but this was publicized as a tiger Scott match.
[/quote]

It was. Golf Channel's promo spots said it was "Tiger versus Adam Scott". Well, Adam Scott gave Tiger a beat down. I am sure GC will blame it on Stricker today because they don't want to hurt Tiger's feelings. Tiger and Stricker played poorly, but at least Stricker earned his way onto the team.
[/quote]


Stricker might have been rusty, and Tiger mediocre. But I lay the blame at the feet of Couples. While looking like a genius after pairing Watson and Simpson in round 1, he came off looking like a sellout for not picking Keegan Bradley instead of Woods. He had no choice on Stricker. We can't second guess a guy who earned his way on the team.

It WAS the most debatable captains pick and it didn't work out at all. Anxious to see round 2 Fourball. DJ and Woods. Wonder if this chemistry will work? I do like the Kuchar/Stricker change.

[Barto78]

[quote name='candess' timestamp='1321544393' post='3813235']
[quote name='Barto78' timestamp='1321544133' post='3813209']
[quote name='kjo257' timestamp='1321543758' post='3813183']
[quote name='creeder06' timestamp='1321542764' post='3813129']
Blame the match on stricker if you want but this was publicized as a tiger Scott match.
[/quote]

It was. Golf Channel's promo spots said it was "Tiger versus Adam Scott". Well, Adam Scott gave Tiger a beat down. I am sure GC will blame it on Stricker today because they don't want to hurt Tiger's feelings. Tiger and Stricker played poorly, but at least Stricker earned his way onto the team.
[/quote]

Just because a channel publicizes something as a Tiger vs. Scott match, doesn't make it so. I would understand it if it were a 4 ball or singles match, but a 4some match is certainly not a mano y mano match, no matter what Golf Channel or anyone else wants to make it out to be.
[/quote]

The sport of golf revolves around Tiger Woods. Anyone who tries to deny it is delusional.
[/quote]

I never denied it, so hopefully your post wasn't implying i thought otherwise. I still stand by my post. A 4some match is as pure as team golf gets. Tiger and Steve didn't help each other out at all and ran into a team who was 4 under on their ball through 13 holes. But to say TW was the reason they lost to Adam Scott (not saying you did) is simply not a fair assessment. Stricker was chunking chips, miss hitting wedges and overall playing poorly. Sure TW, hit a wayward drive and missed a couple greens, but i wouldn't say he was the reason his team lost. They lost because they never got it going and played a team who played flawlessly for the most part.

[MileHighClub]

[quote name='station2station' timestamp='1321544496' post='3813243']
[quote name='kjo257' timestamp='1321543758' post='3813183']
[quote name='creeder06' timestamp='1321542764' post='3813129']
Blame the match on stricker if you want but this was publicized as a tiger Scott match.
[/quote]

It was. Golf Channel's promo spots said it was "Tiger versus Adam Scott". Well, Adam Scott gave Tiger a beat down. I am sure GC will blame it on Stricker today because they don't want to hurt Tiger's feelings. Tiger and Stricker played poorly, but at least Stricker earned his way onto the team.
[/quote]


Stricker might have been rusty, and Tiger mediocre. But I lay the blame at the feet of Couples. While looking like a genius after pairing Watson and Simpson in round 1, he came off looking like a sellout for not picking Keegan Bradley instead of Woods. He had no choice on Stricker. We can't second guess a guy who earned his way on the team.

It WAS the most debatable captains pick and it didn't work out at all. Anxious to see round 2 Fourball. DJ and Woods. Wonder if this chemistry will work? I do like the Kuchar/Stricker change.
[/quote]

I doubt Keegan would have made a difference in that match. Freddie's error was pairing a struggling player with a rusty player.

[ej002]

[quote name='station2station' timestamp='1321544496' post='3813243']
Stricker might have been rusty, and Tiger mediocre. But I lay the blame at the feet of Couples. While looking like a genius after pairing Watson and Simpson in round 1, he came off looking like a sellout for not picking Keegan Bradley instead of Woods. He had no choice on Stricker. We can't second guess a guy who earned his way on the team.

It WAS the most debatable captains pick and it didn't work out at all. Anxious to see round 2 Fourball. DJ and Woods. Wonder if this chemistry will work? I do like the Kuchar/Stricker change.
[/quote]

There are a lot of matches left, it is too early to judge the Tiger pick.

I def. do not like the Tiger/DJ pairing. I actually hate the Kuchar / Stricker pairing. I thought a change was needed, but I think this is worse.

And why split Choi/Scott? I am not seeing the logic on this one.

Yesterday's pairing actually worked in the US's favor. Although not the intent, the Int team's best pairing went up against the our worst. Had Striker/Woods played soemone else, they would have lost. Scott/Choi were beating anybody they faced yesterday. But who would have known. So you cant say that it was Freddie's error in pairing them, because even Norman respected the pairing enough to put his big guns against them.

[station2station]

[quote name='kjo257' timestamp='1321544962' post='3813277']
[quote name='station2station' timestamp='1321544496' post='3813243']
[quote name='kjo257' timestamp='1321543758' post='3813183']
[quote name='creeder06' timestamp='1321542764' post='3813129']
Blame the match on stricker if you want but this was publicized as a tiger Scott match.
[/quote]

It was. Golf Channel's promo spots said it was "Tiger versus Adam Scott". Well, Adam Scott gave Tiger a beat down. I am sure GC will blame it on Stricker today because they don't want to hurt Tiger's feelings. Tiger and Stricker played poorly, but at least Stricker earned his way onto the team.
[/quote]


Stricker might have been rusty, and Tiger mediocre. But I lay the blame at the feet of Couples. While looking like a genius after pairing Watson and Simpson in round 1, he came off looking like a sellout for not picking Keegan Bradley instead of Woods. He had no choice on Stricker. We can't second guess a guy who earned his way on the team.

It WAS the most debatable captains pick and it didn't work out at all. Anxious to see round 2 Fourball. DJ and Woods. Wonder if this chemistry will work? I do like the Kuchar/Stricker change.
[/quote]

I doubt Keegan would have made a difference in that match. Freddie's error was pairing a struggling player with a rusty player.
[/quote]

Well they did play together well 2 yrs ago (woods/stricker). Couples was looking to conjure up some intangible chemistry. All will be forgiven is DJ and Woods beat Badds and Day - another brutal match.

I agree with ej002 above when he says that Kuchar/Stricker is a bad combo. Seems very blasé and mamby pamby. But look who they are playing (yang/allenby)

[Vindog]

[quote name='Barto78' timestamp='1321544133' post='3813209']Just because a channel publicizes something as a Tiger vs. Scott match, doesn't make it so. I would understand it if it were a 4 ball or singles match, but a 4some match is certainly not a mano y mano match, no matter what Golf Channel or anyone else wants to make it out to be.
[/quote]

Mano y Mano? no. But last event's undefeateds got trounced by the a team that included the player that EVERYONE wanted to see go up against Tiger. Fact

So...maybe, just maybe, instead of motivating Tiger, this really motivated Adam Scott? we'll see.

[sgniwder99]

[quote name='kjo257' timestamp='1321544962' post='3813277']
[quote name='station2station' timestamp='1321544496' post='3813243']
[quote name='kjo257' timestamp='1321543758' post='3813183']
[quote name='creeder06' timestamp='1321542764' post='3813129']
Blame the match on stricker if you want but this was publicized as a tiger Scott match.
[/quote]

It was. Golf Channel's promo spots said it was "Tiger versus Adam Scott". Well, Adam Scott gave Tiger a beat down. I am sure GC will blame it on Stricker today because they don't want to hurt Tiger's feelings. Tiger and Stricker played poorly, but at least Stricker earned his way onto the team.
[/quote]


Stricker might have been rusty, and Tiger mediocre. But I lay the blame at the feet of Couples. While looking like a genius after pairing Watson and Simpson in round 1, he came off looking like a sellout for not picking Keegan Bradley instead of Woods. He had no choice on Stricker. We can't second guess a guy who earned his way on the team.

It WAS the most debatable captains pick and it didn't work out at all. Anxious to see round 2 Fourball. DJ and Woods. Wonder if this chemistry will work? I do like the Kuchar/Stricker change.
[/quote]

I doubt Keegan would have made a difference in that match. [b]Freddie's error was pairing a struggling player with a rusty player.[/b]
[/quote]

Well, you could also say it was his smartest decision. Limiting the damage to one match, and all.

Not that I think this is what he had in mind...

I will personally reserve judgment on the pick of Tiger until the end. Whether you lose 1-up or 7-and-6, the point value is the same. And with a competitor like Tiger, I doubt one loss, now matter how decisive, would really have much of any impact on his confidence. If he doesn't pick it up, it will have turned out to be a poor pick. But he could still very well have a good week in the end. 1 day is 1 day, and he did play very well last week.

I'm actually more concerned about Stricker's overall impact. You may not be able to second-guess a guy who earned his spot, but he sure didn't play like the guy who'd earned his place on the team yesterday. I thought he looked worse than Tiger.

[502 to Right]

[quote name='kjo257' timestamp='1321544962' post='3813277']
Freddie's error was pairing a struggling player with a rusty player.
[/quote]


I disagree. By pairing a struggling player with a rusty player Fred Couples minimized the damage either of these guys could do to one match. If he had matched them with 2 other players Tiger and Stricker could have been responsible for losing two matches instead of one. I would just keep them paired up and concede they might well lose every match.

[golfcarte]

[quote name='station2station' timestamp='1321544496' post='3813243']
But I lay the blame at the feet of Couples. While looking like a genius after pairing Watson and Simpson in round 1, he came off looking like a sellout for not picking Keegan Bradley instead of Woods. He had no choice on Stricker. We can't second guess a guy who earned his way on the team.

It WAS the most debatable captains pick and it didn't work out at all. Anxious to see round 2 Fourball. DJ and Woods. Wonder if this chemistry will work? I do like the Kuchar/Stricker change.
[/quote]

it wasn't the captains pick it was the pairing. had tiger and stricker had gone off against baddeley and day, two guys tiger just played with last week, the outcome would've been different. any advantage you would've had playing the aussies cold is lost now that there's one match under their belt, and are now looking for redemption.

[Vindog]

[quote name='ej002' timestamp='1321545455' post='3813315']
There are a lot of matches left, it is too early to judge the Tiger pick.

I def. do not like the Tiger/DJ pairing. I actually hate the Kuchar / Stricker pairing. I thought a change was needed, but I think this is worse.

And why split Choi/Scott? I am not seeing the logic on this one.

[b]Yesterday's pairing actually worked in the US's favor. Although not the intent, the Int team's best pairing went up against the our worst. Had Striker/Woods played soemone else, they would have lost. Scott/Choi were beating anybody they faced yesterday. But who would have known. So you cant say that it was Freddie's error in pairing them, because even Norman respected the pairing enough to put his big guns against them.[/b]
[/quote]
Absolutely agree with this... all of it ...particularly the last sentence. One of the reasons Tiger was picked was so the he would go with Strick. Sometimes in sports things just happen.

[golfcarte]

[quote name='502 to Right' timestamp='1321545772' post='3813339']
[quote name='kjo257' timestamp='1321544962' post='3813277']
Freddie's error was pairing a struggling player with a rusty player.
[/quote]


I disagree. By pairing a struggling player with a rusty player Fred Couples minimized the damage either of these guys could do to one match. If he had matched them with 2 other players Tiger and Stricker could have been responsible for losing two matches instead of one. I would just keep them paired up and concede they might well lose every match.
[/quote]

freddie's error, imo, was missing the opportunity to pit tiger and stricker against baddeley and day.

[Vindog]

holy moly folks. They lost because they played poorly as a team and went up against a motivated team, that played well together.

The blame doesn't go on Freddie, they just underperformed. The US is still up by 2

[AP2 712]

It's amazing how many conspiracy theories can be found on the internet

[ej002]

I would actually like to see Phil and Stricker
Tiger and Furyk


I was so impressed with Phil yesterday, that par shooting Strick could allow Phil to just go nuts. (Which is what Furyk will do for him anyways), but I guess why not gamble that Phil can take the torch on a Phil/Strick pairing.

Furyk seemed to have a little more fire power in the tank that I would have guessed. So I think that would help crutch Tiger a bit.

Just thinkin out loud...

[scratchswinger]

[quote name='502 to Right' timestamp='1321545772' post='3813339']

I disagree. By pairing a struggling player with a rusty player Fred Couples minimized the damage either of these guys could do to one match. If he had matched them with 2 other players Tiger and Stricker could have been responsible for losing two matches instead of one. I would just keep them paired up and concede they might well lose every match.
[/quote]
Do you think Baddely is still haunted by Oakmont? How else can you explain the way he finished? I felt bad for the guy.