Rounds with a Vintage Bag

[Nomad Golfer]

Yes, Rex, you're right. Do you know who was still using 10 and 11 iron designation in the 90's?

 

Added: The R1 is the flex - it's a probably close to a senior flex. The S label is not the flex.

 

How many stars are on the shaft? That tells you the value and the level of employee who wound and painted them.

There are 2 stars on the shaft :(

I'm a senior but R is my fit - but I will manage. Do you know what the big S sticker represents?

cheers

[Nomad Golfer]

Interesting about the 10 and 11 numbered irons, I kinda like the idea of someone looking in my bag and saying "wow what are those!"

Back in the dark ages of the 60's average priced irons came as 2-9 and if you wanted a PW or SW you bought those separately.

Until you did, getting out of a steep bunker was a lot of fun. If the 11 was 50* way back then, they predate the modern designation GW by a lot of years !. Shades of back to the future. Thanks Honma for carrying on the tradition.

[Soloman1]

2 star is ok. They go 1-5. 1 star are made by an apprentice, 5 are made by the best person in the factory. 2 is someone who has enough experience to not be a 1!

 

Painting the shaft is parts of the skill set, so the 2 person may be great a winding but not an expert at painting the shaft yet. At Honma, the same person made the shaft from start to finish. I don't know if that's true today.

 

All graphite shafts are wound by hand. That shaft was super high tech then and still is now, being layered with a variety of pre-preg (pre impregnated) fibers of different materials.

 

The S for sure doesn't mean Stiff. If I remember right, it is a pictorial representation of layers of wound material to designate it is wound and not a first generation extruded type graphite shaft. It on graphite shafts only.

[Nomad Golfer]

Honma certainly didn't spare the labor intensive.

I thought the S might have stood for "SOLD!" there ya go.

Will keep an eye out for any woods around that era (and maybe a bag and putter and ......)

cheers

[Soloman1]

I see the persimmon woods all the time in Japan. Great combination with that shaft.

 

 

[scomac2002]

Those are beauties! I sometimes wonder how the heck we ever ended up with metal woods in the first place? I guess we were told it was something that we needed and the rest as they say is history...

[scomac2002]

I've been hankering for a while to have a game with blades and lumber, so I set a short bag up a bit ago consisting of PowerBilt Citation 2, 4, 5 laminate woods; Golden Ram Axial Tour Grind 3, 5, 7, 9; RAM Tom Watson Scoring System SW and Ping Zing Mn Br putter.

 

 

 

I've been to the range with them a time or two. After hitting a few balls at home yesterday decided to take them out for a run this afternoon for a quick nine. Hooked up with one of the guys from my men's league and away we went.

 

I had an absolute blast playing these as I could do no wrong ballstriking wise for the first 8 holes. Had a complete meltdown on nine with my SW resulting in a triple to spoil an incredible round that I had going. I was striping these things, both woods and irons. If I had putted better I would have been no worse than par after 8. Finished with a 40, but the score was really secondary. I still can't believe how well I hit these clubs!

 

I was hitting a Bridgestone E6 and that ball worked flawlessly with the old clubs. Felt sublime too on centered contact!

[oldschoolrocker]

the Watson wedge, was that part of the ones put out by Adams? The e6 is a very good.ball.

[GolfNutRiblick]

Sweet set up. Especially the Axials. I have 2-Pw but not the game to play them. But I like to look at them. ?

[oldschoolrocker]

Humble, if you play golf, you have the game to play them, as long as the shaft works for you. Take them to the range and get used to them. Don't let all that gibberish about blades being evil keep you from enjoying the experience.

[GolfNutRiblick]

Great advice OSR. Hogans and Haigs seem a bit easier for me but the Axials seem to find a way back in the bag. They're just too darned good looking and when hit in the sweet spot they're too darned...well, sweet...to abandon. I do tend to ignore the blade naysayers. Thanks much for the encouragement!

[scomac2002]

the Watson wedge, was that part of the ones put out by Adams? The e6 is a very good.ball.

 

No. These were from RAM in the early 1980's I believe. I have a couple of them, a 53° in BeCu that I have in the bag with my Eye 2 clones and the 55° I was playing today. The scoring system consisted of 50, 53, 55, 58, 60° lofts. Mine have the original TT Dynamic shafts. If you search for Tom Watson Scoring System you'll find a couple of threads in the Classics section with some advertising material posted. Here's a photo I have on file of the 53° BeCu:

 

 

[NRJyzr]

Watson Scoring System... 1984 to 1996 or 97.

 

This has been a Public Service Announcement from the Ram Broadcasting System.

[scomac2002]

Sweet set up. Especially the Axials. I have 2-Pw but not the game to play them. But I like to look at them.

 

I'm just a midcapper and I can hit these things just fine myself. Oh sure, if your swing is off they will punish you, but it's not as if modern game improvement irons work on autopilot either.

 

Whenever I get into a funk hitting the modern stuff I have found that some time spent with classic clubs can actually help me get my swing grooved again. They have more weight, better balance and shorter shafts that can really help you stay within yourself. I find that they're easier to swing easy rather than trying to wail away at the ball. The funny part about it all is that despite the weaker lofts and shorter shafts I can actually hit those blades further when my swing is on than I hit my i25's. I hit a couple of 5 irons today where I would typically hit my 5 hybrid!

[GolfNutRiblick]

Thanks for the encouragement. I put the Axials in the bag in anticipation of walking 9 tomorrow night. At the very least they'll get a concentrated effort on the range. I'll post results tomorrow.

[Nomad Golfer]

I see the persimmon woods all the time in Japan. Great combination with that shaft.

 

 

Now why haven't I got those to go with my LB-708's ?

[BIG STU]

Sweet set up. Especially the Axials. I have 2-Pw but not the game to play them. But I like to look at them. ��

 

I'm just a midcapper and I can hit these things just fine myself. Oh sure, if your swing is off they will punish you, but it's not as if modern game improvement irons work on autopilot either.

 

Whenever I get into a funk hitting the modern stuff I have found that some time spent with classic clubs can actually help me get my swing grooved again. They have more weight, better balance and shorter shafts that can really help you stay within yourself. I find that they're easier to swing easy rather than trying to wail away at the ball. The funny part about it all is that despite the weaker lofts and shorter shafts I can actually hit those blades further when my swing is on than I hit my i25's. I hit a couple of 5 irons today where I would typically hit my 5 hybrid!

Actually when practicing seriously or working on the swing or what ever even if I have my moderns I will have one or 2 blades and a persimmon driver in the bag.

[BIG STU]

Watson Scoring System... 1984 to 1996 or 97.

 

This has been a Public Service Announcement from the Ram Broadcasting System.

Ram Broadcasting System------- Gotta love it!!!! :taunt:

[NRJyzr]

Watson Scoring System... 1984 to 1996 or 97.

 

This has been a Public Service Announcement from the Ram Broadcasting System.

Ram Broadcasting System------- Gotta love it!!!! :taunt:

 

I'll add a couple tidbits...

 

Watson Scoring System wedges indeed ran thru 97.

BeCu started in 88.

Troon Grinds started in 91, the 55* being the only Troon wedge in 91. The others showed up the next year.

The flange wedges (958, etc) first appeared in 90

The Rake stamping showed up first in 90, also. Apparently was not on all Watson wedges, though.

 

I still use my Watson wedges fairly often. They perform pretty well, in spite of being roughly 25 to 30 years old.

[HoldenCornfield]

I've been hankering for a while to have a game with blades and lumber, so I set a short bag up a bit ago consisting of PowerBilt Citation 2, 4, 5 laminate woods; Golden Ram Axial Tour Grind 3, 5, 7, 9; RAM Tom Watson Scoring System SW and Ping Zing Mn Br putter.

 

 

 

I've been to the range with them a time or two. After hitting a few balls at home yesterday decided to take them out for a run this afternoon for a quick nine. Hooked up with one of the guys from my men's league and away we went.

 

I had an absolute blast playing these as I could do no wrong ballstriking wise for the first 8 holes. Had a complete meltdown on nine with my SW resulting in a triple to spoil an incredible round that I had going. I was striping these things, both woods and irons. If I had putted better I would have been no worse than par after 8. Finished with a 40, but the score was really secondary. I still can't believe how well I hit these clubs!

 

I was hitting a Bridgestone E6 and that ball worked flawlessly with the old clubs. Felt sublime too on centered contact!

 

Love the 2-4-5 wood setup. Maybe the perfect setup for most of us vintage golfers.

[BIG STU]

Watson Scoring System... 1984 to 1996 or 97.

 

This has been a Public Service Announcement from the Ram Broadcasting System.

Ram Broadcasting System------- Gotta love it!!!! :taunt:

 

I'll add a couple tidbits...

 

Watson Scoring System wedges indeed ran thru 97.

BeCu started in 88.

Troon Grinds started in 91, the 55* being the only Troon wedge in 91. The others showed up the next year.

The flange wedges (958, etc) first appeared in 90

The Rake stamping showed up first in 90, also. Apparently was not on all Watson wedges, though.

 

I still use my Watson wedges fairly often. They perform pretty well, in spite of being roughly 25 to 30 years old.

I had a 55* Troon wedge it reminded me a lot of the old Wilson R-90. I gave that wedge to one of the guys over at Wachaesaw East and he still plays it along with his Eye2s and R-7 driver and V-Steels

[scomac2002]

I've been hankering for a while to have a game with blades and lumber, so I set a short bag up a bit ago consisting of PowerBilt Citation 2, 4, 5 laminate woods; Golden Ram Axial Tour Grind 3, 5, 7, 9; RAM Tom Watson Scoring System SW and Ping Zing Mn Br putter.

 

 

 

I've been to the range with them a time or two. After hitting a few balls at home yesterday decided to take them out for a run this afternoon for a quick nine. Hooked up with one of the guys from my men's league and away we went.

 

I had an absolute blast playing these as I could do no wrong ballstriking wise for the first 8 holes. Had a complete meltdown on nine with my SW resulting in a triple to spoil an incredible round that I had going. I was striping these things, both woods and irons. If I had putted better I would have been no worse than par after 8. Finished with a 40, but the score was really secondary. I still can't believe how well I hit these clubs!

 

I was hitting a Bridgestone E6 and that ball worked flawlessly with the old clubs. Felt sublime too on centered contact!

 

Love the 2-4-5 wood setup. Maybe the perfect setup for most of us vintage golfers.

 

No argument from me. Played the same set-up today. Didn't score as well, but that was all my fault around and on the greens rather than anything to do with ball striking.

 

The 5W is quickly becoming a favourite of mine both off the tee and from the deck. Launches high and lands soft. If anything the 4W maybe a bit redundant as I can always use the 2W or 3i off the deck for a low running approach and the 4W isn't appreciably longer than the 5W from the tee. At least that has been my experience over a couple of rounds. Best of all is enjoying playing from the short grass versus the struggles I had been experiencing recently with my modern driver.

[GolfNutRiblick]

Okay gotta eat crow tonight. The Axials rock! Not sure where that swing came from but gotta put it in a bottle! Six bogies (can't putt), two pars and a birdie. Hit 2 beautiful 2 iron tee balls (who was THAT guy?!!). Great West Michigan evening for golf.

[scomac2002]

Yah, they're pretty darned sweet! The last three times I've had them out I've smoked the 3 iron, once from the fairway and twice from the tee. I really have to wonder about this constant drone from the masses that you have to play the clubs that are easiest to hit and blades are only for pros. At one time blades were the only choice. I'm still left wondering why is it that I hit these things straighter? The mishits result in a loss of distance, not directional control.

 

I've got work to do with scoring, but that seems to be more about short game and putting than it is about hitting the ball poorly. It's the exact opposite of my recent experiences with my modern clubs!

 

I've seen enough to convince me to play these things the rest of the way. I like the idea of being controversial! When I get the short game and putting sorted I expect to shoot the best scores I've had this season and that will be using 30, 40 and 50 year old clubs! What do you think the talking heads will be saying then? I know; they'll say I'm eccentric... :to_become_senile:

[GolfNutRiblick]

Eccentric rocks as well!

[Blade Junkie]

The irons are the LB-708 cavity back model which I think dates them back to the mid-late 90's.

Heads have a bit of wear and tear, I cleaned them with a fine wire wool soap pad and they came up alright, I don't want them looking like brand new. Grips are Lamkin Crossline and the shafts are Super Lite Titanium Carbon 'cavity special' High Trajectory Club R-1 and not sure of the flex (R-1 on the shaft and large S on the label near the grip). Looking forward to trying them out.

 

For future reference on Honma shafts:

 

 

 

So the good news is that your iron set have your preferred Regular shafts in them :)

 

LB-708 specs:

 

 

[jonnygrouville]

Nice set and well played. Definite Axial envy.

 

[NRJyzr]

I really have to wonder about this constant drone from the masses that you have to play the clubs that are easiest to hit and blades are only for pros. At one time blades were the only choice. I'm still left wondering why is it that I hit these things straighter? The mishits result in a loss of distance, not directional control.

 

I'm sure you know this, but it's a lot of marketing.

 

There *is* valid science behind the idea of perimeter weighting. But, for someone who hits the center of the clubface fairly often, it doesn't do much. And, while you may not lose as much distance, my experience has shown what you describe, a loss of direction on mishits, while still losing a bit of distance. Then marketers got hold of it, advertising blitzes kicked in, and a couple decades later, here we are.

 

There are some folks who absolutely need those sort of irons, I'm acquainted with a few guys who couldn't get away without them. Including a couple single digit hdcp guys.

 

That said, my experience has suggested the number of folks who need them is overblown. Hell, I was a 20 hdcp when I switched to Golden Rams. I've also played Eye2+ for a full year, insert more verbiage here. :)

 

Up through 2000, the average USGA handicap had remained largely unchanged over the decades. Perimeter weighting didn't do much of anything to help that, so it seems. I've seen something that suggests it may have come down a bit since then, but there was another certain advancement that may have helped, the appearance of the modern jumbo driver clubhead. ;)

 

Fly the flag, Sco!

[Shotts]

As a rookie on the forum I've gone through this thread in a hit and miss fashion. My question is, where's the cut off for vintage gear? Pre over-sized woods like GBB's 1st generation or other. Or is it an era of some date.

 

Reason for asking is a bunch of us older types my way have older gear and we're thinking a fall season two day shootout with such sticks of old.

 

I myself have numerous persimmon in great gaming shape still up too TM Burners/Bridgestone J's etc.

 

Any input is much appreciated, thanks. :)

[oldschoolrocker]

Most ways of thinking mark 1981 as the cutoff date for strickly blades and persimmon, so the fg-17's can be included. Otherwise no hard and fast rules. Personally, I think any of the iconic clubs, Big Bertha, eye2, zing, 845's would qualify for vintage also. Would open up the gates to allow for more participation.