Choosing iron shafts

wmblake2000wmblake2000 Los AngelesMembers Posts: 5,905 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
I am about to buy some Maltby iron heads. It will be impossible to test them with different shafts as I don’t know any who fit his stuff in socal.



How would you evaluate matching shafts? I could test against similar head and use the same shaft. I could use Maltby’s system. I could buy a test club and try out various shafts. I could just use what I’ve been using.



I’d really like to be thorough in evaluating this but the lack of a fitting process makes it hard.



I tend to think testing a similar head in multiple shafts is the best way to do this (P790 Vs Maltby ts-2).



Suggestions? Thx...
Ping GMax 400 10.5 TPT 17 LKP
Callawy Epic 5W 
Callaway X-hot pro 3,4 h
Mizuno MP4 4-W, KBS tour-v, 110 S
Mizuno MP-64 4-W, c-taper lite, 105 R
Fourteen mt28v3 50, 54, 58
Cameron Futura 5W


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Comments

  • Stuart_GStuart_G New HampshireMembers Posts: 23,825 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    edited Oct 26, 2018 #2
    Picking a shaft based on a fitting (self or otherwise) in different heads should work out fine. In my opinion, they don't even have to be all that similar - except maybe the amount of offset IF one is visually sensitive to the amount of offset. Just focus more on how the club is delivered into impact than the actual launch numbers (e.g. club head speed, path, face to path, dynamic loft or shaft lean, AoA, etc..). Finding the best shaft weight, the loading feel, delivery, path and release, consistency, etc.. will generally all translate fairly well between different heads as long as the other specs stay the same - playing length, grip size, swing weight. Then when you get them in your chosen iron heads, you just may need some tweaking of the lofts to dial in the launch numbers and distances.
  • getitdailygetitdaily Members Posts: 2,443 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    Yeah, agree with stuart. Iron shaft fitting is more about the feel of the shaft than it is launch and spin like a driver. Find a comparable head and go to work.



    If mizuno has a comparable head then they might be the best option for shaft demo. Their shaft cart is extensive. Most retail stores have them.
  • wmblake2000wmblake2000 Los AngelesMembers Posts: 5,905 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    Great guys. Thx. Looking at delivery #’s makes total sense. I really do think I “swing to the shaft” and looking at delivery #’s is how to measure that!



    That plus the Mizuno steer ... great stuff.
    Ping GMax 400 10.5 TPT 17 LKP
    Callawy Epic 5W 
    Callaway X-hot pro 3,4 h
    Mizuno MP4 4-W, KBS tour-v, 110 S
    Mizuno MP-64 4-W, c-taper lite, 105 R
    Fourteen mt28v3 50, 54, 58
    Cameron Futura 5W


  • getitdailygetitdaily Members Posts: 2,443 ✭✭✭✭✭✭


    Great guys. Thx. Looking at delivery #’s makes total sense. I really do think I “swing to the shaft” and looking at delivery #’s is how to measure that!



    That plus the Mizuno steer ... great stuff.




    I wouldn't get too caught up in delivery numbers unless you know what you're doing...



    IMO, what you want is a launch monitor with flight tracking. Hit your current clubs as a baseline. Then work through the shafts you think are good for you and compare dispersion and general direction.



    Getting caught up in delivery numbers can be bad because of the head difference in whatever you find to demo. Mizuno has about 5 heads you can use to demo. A couple heads have strong lofts so you'll likely see greater carry numbers that aren't a result of the shaft.



    Find the shaft that feels best and gives you solid dispersion and then order them.



    Mizuno has Dynamic gold in several flexes, modus in several flexes, 2 or 3 kbs models in various flexes, project x in various flexes. You'll be there a while. I suggest you have a foundational idea of what flex you think you need and start with each model shaft in that flex. That way you can get an idea of the feel of each shaft. Once you find the shaft that feels the best you can try different flexes of that shaft to see if dispersion improves or not.
  • wmblake2000wmblake2000 Los AngelesMembers Posts: 5,905 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    After I wrote my response I also wondered where I’d get club data - retail monitors usually track ball flight not clubhead data.



    I might do two sessions. But I’d keep the head constant to eliminate the variance you describe. One like you’re suggesting to narrow the field and then with these finalists look at club behavior too with a someone who has the tools and skills to do that.



    The reason is I really do think I swing to the shaft and I want to get clearer about how the weight and flex impact how I feel and what the club does, if I can.
    Ping GMax 400 10.5 TPT 17 LKP
    Callawy Epic 5W 
    Callaway X-hot pro 3,4 h
    Mizuno MP4 4-W, KBS tour-v, 110 S
    Mizuno MP-64 4-W, c-taper lite, 105 R
    Fourteen mt28v3 50, 54, 58
    Cameron Futura 5W


  • getitdailygetitdaily Members Posts: 2,443 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    edited Oct 26, 2018 #7
    I think you're over thinking it here. Whether you "swing to the shaft" or not, you will still see results as a function of dispersion.



    I hit s300, s300 amt, x100, Px lz, modus, kbs tour, and kbs ctaper in the same head and guess what...they all went the same distance and generally had the same dispersion....except the ctaper. I saw 3-4 mph better ball speed and a bit tighter dispersion witb that shaft. It also happened to be the shaft that felt the best. Peak height, spin, launch angle, etc were all well within each other. Now, a caveat, I'm a scratch so 6iron strike consistency is pretty solid for me. But you should still be able to find a shaft that works in relatively short order.



    I personally think you should just pay for an iron shaft fitting and let someone who does this for a living give you professional advice.



    Otherwise, it seems, you're going to question your choice and never be confident in the shaft you select.
  • wmblake2000wmblake2000 Los AngelesMembers Posts: 5,905 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    edited Oct 26, 2018 #8
    I may be but I need to answer a question that I’ll need to just go ahead and overthink.



    Edit. First, thx for the input. I knew you were a good player and your input re all the shafts was interesting. I’m a 7 so I will indeed have more variance than you.



    It’s just that I’ve been fitted a few times and never ended up understanding how the recommendations were reached. So now I need to be much more involved in the analysis. I want to tie what a shaft feels like to me (and especially different weights create a different mindset for me) with what the head and the ball do.



    You’re right - the goal is some sense of certainty. My reply that I might need to overthink this is based on a history (as a pretty knowledgeable amateur golf nerd) that’s left me confused as to how to recognize optimal (or even in concluding there isn’t much between optimal and good enough). It’s a question I have wrestled with for a while... now I need a process where I end up knowing why I chose shaft a over shaft b, c or d...







    Post edited by Unknown User on
    Ping GMax 400 10.5 TPT 17 LKP
    Callawy Epic 5W 
    Callaway X-hot pro 3,4 h
    Mizuno MP4 4-W, KBS tour-v, 110 S
    Mizuno MP-64 4-W, c-taper lite, 105 R
    Fourteen mt28v3 50, 54, 58
    Cameron Futura 5W


  • getitdailygetitdaily Members Posts: 2,443 ✭✭✭✭✭✭


    I may be but I need to answer a question that I’ll need to just go ahead and overthink.



    Edit. First, thx for the input. I knew you were a good player and your input re all the shafts was interesting. I’m a 7 so I will indeed have more variance than you.



    It’s just that I’ve been fitted a few times and never ended up understanding how the recommendations were reached. So now I need to be much more involved in the analysis. I want to tie what a shaft feels like to me (and especially different weights create a different mindset for me) with what the head and the ball do.



    You’re right - the goal is some sense of certainty. My reply that I might need to overthink this is based on a history (as a pretty knowledgeable amateur golf nerd) that’s left me confused as to how to recognize optimal (or even in concluding there isn’t much between optimal and good enough). It’s a question I have wrestled with for a while... now I need a process where I end up knowing why I chose shaft a over shaft b, c or d...




    I get the overthinking part. I do it a lot myself. It's much easier to see overthinking in others than to see it in ourselves.



    You'll see tho, that the numbers from all shafts will be comparable. At a 7 you can still move the ball around well. Iron shafts are a lot more about feel than anything else, if you're within your appropriate flex range. The thing that will change the most is dispersion, followed by peak height.
  • PepperturboPepperturbo Midwest and SouthwestMembers Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    edited Oct 26, 2018 #10
    Even though Malty is known for making good heads, I would buy the head with the specs I know fit me and test it with various shafts.



    Because I accelerate my hands just before impact and nearly sweep the ball but add spin, narrow / flat soles with sharper leading edges, low bounce and less offset are pivotal to my ball-striking. Honestly, many years back tried three different fitters and gave up. None of them considered what I just said, then I met a club builder that worked a Titleist tour truck. He noticed what I said after watching me hit ten balls. Been fitting myself ever since. image/beach.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':beach:' />



    Good luck.
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  • Z1ggy16Z1ggy16 Members Posts: 7,630 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    Just me personally, but usually for irons... once you find "your" shaft, that's really it. Shaft is about weight and how you time it, and not spin and launch. Yes C Taper 130X's should launch and spin less than XP95s.... but the people playing those are two totally different players.



    If you have a shaft that you've been in for a while, then don't change it. If the flight seems a little spinny or not spinny enough... tweak lofts.



    If you're starting from square one or aren't happy with the shafts you've been using... well... that's a very different story.
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  • wmblake2000wmblake2000 Los AngelesMembers Posts: 5,905 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    Thx guys. I’m en route on big azz flight from half a world away and it’s a great to read this input en route! For some reason, getting irons right has been the hardest thing for me. I’m going to play competitively next year and really want to settle in my mind what I am doing and why.



    Ziggy here’s my dilemma: I can play anything (within reason). Maybe my swing will let me get basically the same results from a range of weight/flex. But that doesn’t make sense. There should be shafts that are better or less suited for me, but to date I haven’t figured out how to recognize these.
    Ping GMax 400 10.5 TPT 17 LKP
    Callawy Epic 5W 
    Callaway X-hot pro 3,4 h
    Mizuno MP4 4-W, KBS tour-v, 110 S
    Mizuno MP-64 4-W, c-taper lite, 105 R
    Fourteen mt28v3 50, 54, 58
    Cameron Futura 5W


  • Stuart_GStuart_G New HampshireMembers Posts: 23,825 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭


    There should be shafts that are better or less suited for me..




    Not necessarily. So be careful about wild goose chases. Or to put it another way, different individuals have different levels of sensitivity to different aspects of the shafts. It's not all that unusual for the stiffness or bend profile to have little effect on the swing or even the results for some individuals. I personally believe it's because those people tend to use more internal keys than external in the way they control their swing. In those cases, just make sure the weight (both shaft weight and swing weight) are a good match for your particular sense of tempo and rhythm and that there is nothing distasteful for the feel of the shaft loading/unloading.
  • MarkFromTheUKMarkFromTheUK Members Posts: 4,639 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    Personally, I think iron shaft numbers are very important. Case in point, my recent experience with getting my new PXG irons dialled in.



    If it had been all about feel, I’d be keeping my Modus3 105X. Sadly, I simply couldn’t ignore the fact that they were launching too high, peaking too high, spinning too much and descending too steeply. I also lost around 4mph club head speed, as they were already slowing down at impact. The net result of all this being a loss of around 15 yards, with dispersion all over the place. I tried maybe 7 or 8 shafts before deciding on DG X7, as the numbers they gave me were like nothing I had seen before (for years I had used C-Taper 130X, which it turns out, spun a little to high)



    Try as many shafts as you can, and look at the numbers. If you can access a Trackman, use it’s optimiser. It’s a remarkable piece of kit.
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  • getitdailygetitdaily Members Posts: 2,443 ✭✭✭✭✭✭


    Personally, I think iron shaft numbers are very important. Case in point, my recent experience with getting my new PXG irons dialled in.



    If it had been all about feel, I’d be keeping my Modus3 105X. Sadly, I simply couldn’t ignore the fact that they were launching too high, peaking too high, spinning too much and descending too steeply. I also lost around 4mph club head speed, as they were already slowing down at impact. The net result of all this being a loss of around 15 yards, with dispersion all over the place. I tried maybe 7 or 8 shafts before deciding on DG X7, as the numbers they gave me were like nothing I had seen before (for years I had used C-Taper 130X, which it turns out, spun a little to high)



    Try as many shafts as you can, and look at the numbers. If you can access a Trackman, use it’s optimiser. It’s a remarkable piece of kit.




    You said it yourself...dispersion was all over the place. I will stand by my statement that the irons that feel the best and give the best dispersion are the ones to go with.
  • wmblake2000wmblake2000 Los AngelesMembers Posts: 5,905 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    Personally, I think iron shaft numbers are very important. Case in point, my recent experience with getting my new PXG irons dialled in.



    If it had been all about feel, I’d be keeping my Modus3 105X. Sadly, I simply couldn’t ignore the fact that they were launching too high, peaking too high, spinning too much and descending too steeply. I also lost around 4mph club head speed, as they were already slowing down at impact. The net result of all this being a loss of around 15 yards, with dispersion all over the place. I tried maybe 7 or 8 shafts before deciding on DG X7, as the numbers they gave me were like nothing I had seen before (for years I had used C-Taper 130X, which it turns out, spun a little to high)



    Try as many shafts as you can, and look at the numbers. If you can access a Trackman, use it’s optimiser. It’s a remarkable piece of kit.




    Why does the shaft slow clubhead speed? Wrong weight for your tempo?



    Your results (one shaft clearly outperforming others) is what I want to see if it is possible for me - there is a real possibility that what Suart said will be true for me -for some many shafts will offer same ‘optimal’ performance - i think Tom Wishon said this is true is there isn’t a real late release. I don’t cast the club but I don’t know what a late release is and my clubhead speed is low 90’s.



    Anyway I have gotten back from a long trip and eager to do this process.



    Ping GMax 400 10.5 TPT 17 LKP
    Callawy Epic 5W 
    Callaway X-hot pro 3,4 h
    Mizuno MP4 4-W, KBS tour-v, 110 S
    Mizuno MP-64 4-W, c-taper lite, 105 R
    Fourteen mt28v3 50, 54, 58
    Cameron Futura 5W


  • MarkFromTheUKMarkFromTheUK Members Posts: 4,639 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭

    Personally, I think iron shaft numbers are very important. Case in point, my recent experience with getting my new PXG irons dialled in.



    If it had been all about feel, I’d be keeping my Modus3 105X. Sadly, I simply couldn’t ignore the fact that they were launching too high, peaking too high, spinning too much and descending too steeply. I also lost around 4mph club head speed, as they were already slowing down at impact. The net result of all this being a loss of around 15 yards, with dispersion all over the place. I tried maybe 7 or 8 shafts before deciding on DG X7, as the numbers they gave me were like nothing I had seen before (for years I had used C-Taper 130X, which it turns out, spun a little to high)



    Try as many shafts as you can, and look at the numbers. If you can access a Trackman, use it’s optimiser. It’s a remarkable piece of kit.




    Why does the shaft slow clubhead speed? Wrong weight for your tempo?



    Your results (one shaft clearly outperforming others) is what I want to see if it is possible for me - there is a real possibility that what Suart said will be true for me -for some many shafts will offer same ‘optimal’ performance - i think Tom Wishon said this is true is there isn’t a real late release. I don’t cast the club but I don’t know what a late release is and my clubhead speed is low 90’s.



    Anyway I have gotten back from a long trip and eager to do this process.




    Yes, too light for my tempo. I have a quick transition, and the fitter thinks the club head has already reached top speed and is starting to slow at impact.
    PXG 0811X Gen2 9deg Driver - AD-GP 7TX
    PXG 0341X Gen2 15deg Fairway - AD-GP 8TX
    PXG 0311X Gen2 1 DI - KBS Prototype Graphite 95X
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    PXG 0311T Gen2 4-PW - Dynamic Gold X7
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    PXG 0311T Sugar Daddy 56 - Dynamic Gold X7
    PXG 0311T Zulu 61 - Dynamic Gold X7
    PXG Brandon H - 34.5”
    PXG Operator H - 34.5”
    Toulon Indianapolis - 34.5”
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  • wmblake2000wmblake2000 Los AngelesMembers Posts: 5,905 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    getitdaily wrote:


    Personally, I think iron shaft numbers are very important. Case in point, my recent experience with getting my new PXG irons dialled in.



    If it had been all about feel, I’d be keeping my Modus3 105X. Sadly, I simply couldn’t ignore the fact that they were launching too high, peaking too high, spinning too much and descending too steeply. I also lost around 4mph club head speed, as they were already slowing down at impact. The net result of all this being a loss of around 15 yards, with dispersion all over the place. I tried maybe 7 or 8 shafts before deciding on DG X7, as the numbers they gave me were like nothing I had seen before (for years I had used C-Taper 130X, which it turns out, spun a little to high)



    Try as many shafts as you can, and look at the numbers. If you can access a Trackman, use it’s optimiser. It’s a remarkable piece of kit.




    You said it yourself...dispersion was all over the place. I will stand by my statement that the irons that feel the best and give the best dispersion are the ones to go with.




    I wonder how much dispersion in a modest ss is from the shaft... I don’t put the kind of forces on it that others do. My assumption is that things like weight impact my swing more than my swing stresses the shaft. But that’s just a guess.
    Ping GMax 400 10.5 TPT 17 LKP
    Callawy Epic 5W 
    Callaway X-hot pro 3,4 h
    Mizuno MP4 4-W, KBS tour-v, 110 S
    Mizuno MP-64 4-W, c-taper lite, 105 R
    Fourteen mt28v3 50, 54, 58
    Cameron Futura 5W


  • BuddhaBuddha Members Posts: 757
    edited Oct 28, 2018 #19
    https://www.hirekogo...tting_Guide.pdf



    This could be a start as to what shafts to at least consider trying, if you are going to order a couple. Find your tempo/speed, associate letter, then find them by weight/trajectory. It is not a complete list, and probably only contains shafts that Hireko probably either used to carry or still carries.



    Edited to add: https://www.hirekogolf.com/index.php/dynamic-shaft-fitting-addendum Another Hireko link
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  • NessismNessism To measure is to know... Members Posts: 18,714 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    edited Oct 28, 2018 #20
    I agree with Stuart: shaft weight and the feeling of flex through the hands is the main thing. Get that right and you are 85% of the way there. For you chuck (OP), since you have been hoing in a big way for some time I suspect you already have a pretty good idea what weight works best for you. I wouldn't stray too far from what you have been using. Get a few demo shafts and have at it. Let me know if you need any help. You know where I live.image/biggrin.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':D' />
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  • Howard JonesHoward Jones Members Posts: 9,132 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    edited Oct 28, 2018 #21
    Its not easy to make it right without the option to try it real life, but shafts is mostly about WEIGHT, next is feel and dispersion, and the FEEL aspect might change a bit if the heads used have different hosel specs, and Maltby is a bit outside the norm, be aware of that, so take a closer look on BBGM and insert on the head you can use as replacement for shaft testing.



    Maltby often uses a lower BBGM than whats the norm of today, so they need a longer net shaft and longer butt section to play length than others, and depending on shaft choice we go stronger vs a head with a higher BBGM. Example the TE forged has a BBGM of 1.0 vs 1.25 as the norm. Thats not much but enough to make a difference to feel if you are of the sensitive type of player, so look at those specs on the test clubs, and make sure non of them has a higher BBGM than 1.25" then you want be able to use them at all since they want feel the same. 1.25" as BBGM and insert (hosel total 2.5") is the norm of today for players irons, but some GI heads is up at 1.5 and then the difference to feel is large compared to a head with a BBGM of only 1.0. (lower BBGM = stronger feel of flex).



    Example if the shaft used is RIFLE FCM and the 2 heads we compare had a difference to BBGM of 0.5" the club with lowest BBGM would play like hard stepped once compared to the other
  • wmblake2000wmblake2000 Los AngelesMembers Posts: 5,905 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    BBGM means?
    Ping GMax 400 10.5 TPT 17 LKP
    Callawy Epic 5W 
    Callaway X-hot pro 3,4 h
    Mizuno MP4 4-W, KBS tour-v, 110 S
    Mizuno MP-64 4-W, c-taper lite, 105 R
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  • wmblake2000wmblake2000 Los AngelesMembers Posts: 5,905 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    Nessism wrote:
    I agree with Stuart: shaft weight and the feeling of flex through the hands is the main thing. Get that right and you are 85% of the way there. For you chuck (OP), since you have been hoing in a big way for some time I suspect you already have a pretty good idea what weight works best for you. I wouldn't stray too far from what you have been using. Get a few demo shafts and have at it. Let me know if you need any help. You know where I live.image/biggrin.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':D' />




    I have been playing 105-110 ish weight (I typically buy heads and put shafts I have in them) for a while but what I haven’t done is systematically compared weights or shafts. I can play anything by adapting to it - swing more or less aggressively. So you may be right but I have no way of knowing. I actually think Stuart’s comment that many people don’t see much difference among shafts may be true for me.



    I just want to confirm or disconfirm this. Put both my feel and analytical parts of my mind on the same page.



    Now just how to go about doing that isn’t clear. Fitters tend to hide the data and just give you their impression/conclusion and i don’t trust indoor fittings. It’s a different environment that I never feel like gets my typical swing.



    But outdoor ranges - my eyes are not great and I typically can’t see where a dingy ball lands so eyeball comparison outdoors is hard.



    What I really wish was possible would be the ability to swap shafts out of a head with a trackman outdoors and really look at the data carefully.



    Thanks for the (as usual) generous offer to help. I will reach out to you as I move thru this process. I’m going to play some gross score Sr tourneys next year and not just for the aesthetic fun of elegant irons. I haven’t played to score in a while - just been working on swing and goofing off with clubs. I told the guy I take lessons from I want to focus on scoring and we’re going to map out what I need to improve most (making 4 footers when under pressure, etc). It’s time to shoot sub-80 under tourney conditions. In local/regional super Sr trouneys this will get me in the game.



    So my purpose for how I choose clubs has changed. Ironically I got back from long vacation with no golf and went to range yesterday with my hardest to hit blades and just pured them swing after swing. Such a pleasure to compress a ball with a fine blade.



    But that won’t hold up over 2-3 day tournament. So...



    First tourney I am targeting is June.
    Ping GMax 400 10.5 TPT 17 LKP
    Callawy Epic 5W 
    Callaway X-hot pro 3,4 h
    Mizuno MP4 4-W, KBS tour-v, 110 S
    Mizuno MP-64 4-W, c-taper lite, 105 R
    Fourteen mt28v3 50, 54, 58
    Cameron Futura 5W


  • Stuart_GStuart_G New HampshireMembers Posts: 23,825 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭


    BBGM means?




    "Bottom of Bore to Ground Measurement". It's the difference between the playing length and the cut shaft length.
  • Stuart_GStuart_G New HampshireMembers Posts: 23,825 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭


    I actually think Stuart’s comment that many people don’t see much difference among shafts may be true for me.




    Just realize there is one potential caveat to that observation. While some can compensate for different shaft characteristics on the range or in a fitting where it's easy to groove a swing, yet it can be a bit more difficult to compensate under playing condition - especially when under pressure and it's harder to maintain tempo and rhythm. Unfortunately, not very many ways to really uncover this (as far as I know) w/o putting the clubs through the paces under such pressure.
  • wmblake2000wmblake2000 Los AngelesMembers Posts: 5,905 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    Stuart G. wrote:


    I actually think Stuart’s comment that many people don’t see much difference among shafts may be true for me.




    Just realize there is one potential caveat to that observation. While some can compensate for different shaft characteristics on the range or in a fitting where it's easy to groove a swing, yet it can be a bit more difficult to compensate under playing condition - especially when under pressure and it's harder to maintain tempo and rhythm. Unfortunately, not very many ways to really uncover this (as far as I know) w/o putting the clubs through the paces under such pressure.




    Yeah the real test comes when playing. But what’s lost there is the ability to compare.



    I think the best overall approach is outdoor fitting where the person really helps me understand the data and his analysis. Then test one club with this shaft on the course and see how it works



    Not sure how to use Howard’s suggestion. Whole new level of variables!
    Ping GMax 400 10.5 TPT 17 LKP
    Callawy Epic 5W 
    Callaway X-hot pro 3,4 h
    Mizuno MP4 4-W, KBS tour-v, 110 S
    Mizuno MP-64 4-W, c-taper lite, 105 R
    Fourteen mt28v3 50, 54, 58
    Cameron Futura 5W


  • Howard JonesHoward Jones Members Posts: 9,132 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    edited Oct 29, 2018 #27


    I am about to buy some Maltby iron heads. It will be impossible to test them with different shafts as I don’t know any who fit his stuff in socal.



    How would you evaluate matching shafts? I could test against similar head and use the same shaft. I could use Maltby’s system. I could buy a test club and try out various shafts. I could just use what I’ve been using.



    I’d really like to be thorough in evaluating this but the lack of a fitting process makes it hard.



    I tend to think testing a similar head in multiple shafts is the best way to do this (P790 Vs Maltby ts-2).



    Suggestions? Thx...




    Sorry i overlooked Maltby head model the first time, but when i see the specs that head got, what o wrote above becomes even more important.

    Hosel length is only 2.1 inch long or 3/8 lower than typical players heads

    Insert is deeper than standard with 1.355 or 1/8 deeper than the norm.



    This heads will play like Hard stepped once, so you seems forced to buy some shaft options and try them out yourself.(2-3 single shafts to build test clubs)

    You can add lead tape on the shafts balance point to simulate the same model in a higher weight (example using TT XP 95 and add the difference up to 105, or even 115, but be aware of that flex goes stronger with weight "on the real thing", so we cant make XP 95 R to feel like XP 115 R, but we can simulate the feel of weight it gives.



    Shaft weight is the most important, when found, its flex options in that wgt range, and with universal hosel you can use both tapers and parallels.
  • wmblake2000wmblake2000 Los AngelesMembers Posts: 5,905 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    So here's what's just confounding to me. I went to Roger Dunn, tested some Ping I210 mainly because there were two used sets, one with Recoil 660 F3 (71 gram) and one Pings AWT S, 104 gr. I thought hitting these very different shafts would give me a starting direction. I hit 7 iron with each shaft many times. After I got warmed up, the ball speed on the two was almost identical (within 0.5 MPH). The steel shaft launched a little higher and had a little more spin but the distance difference was about a yard. They had pretty similar dispersion although the Dunn monitors don't detail out that data. I was swinging pretty well once warmed up.



    These are two very different shafts, weight wise. They performed almost identically. That makes no **** sense to me. With the lighter shaft, it's easier to swing, no doubt. With the heavier shaft, I am more aggressive and when I get it going, that's maybe a better swing.



    I have no clue what to think. It kinda mind-fuggs me. If you made me pick, I think I'd say a lighter shaft might be more reliable because it takes less effort. At 66, although I am still pretty strong (thanks to pretty consistent gym workouts/stretching), my inclination is to go lighter. Maybe not all the way down to the 70's but maybe 90-95.



    Thanks to any of you willing to wade through these ramblings. It really helps me to talk this through with people.
    Ping GMax 400 10.5 TPT 17 LKP
    Callawy Epic 5W 
    Callaway X-hot pro 3,4 h
    Mizuno MP4 4-W, KBS tour-v, 110 S
    Mizuno MP-64 4-W, c-taper lite, 105 R
    Fourteen mt28v3 50, 54, 58
    Cameron Futura 5W


  • jvincentjvincent Members Posts: 732 ✭✭✭✭✭




    These are two very different shafts, weight wise. They performed almost identically. That makes no **** sense to me. With the lighter shaft, it's easier to swing, no doubt. With the heavier shaft, I am more aggressive and when I get it going, that's maybe a better swing.




    Full disclosure, I am a shaft hoe. I will try shafts just for the sake of trying them even though nothing is broken.



    In the end for me it really comes down to whether I like the flight and feel of a given shaft. I've played everything from the original satin PX to 85g graphites over the years. I'm currently playing Nippon Modus3 130-S which I really like.



    Before I switched I built an 8i with the Nippon so I could compare it to my current 8i (I had a spare head) back to back over a month or so of real play. This let me hit in different lies, wind conditions, etc. IMHO this is better than looking at a launch monitor because you get much better feedback on the course and when the ball hits a green.



    Ultimately I decided I really liked the Nippons and re-shafted the whole set.

    Cobra F9 9* : Tour AD TP 7-S
    Cobra LTD set at 16* : Tour AD TP 8-S
    Cobra 3U set at 19.5* : Nippon Modus3 130-S
    Wishon 565MC 4-PW : Nippon Modus3 130-S
    Cleveland RTX3 50, 54, 58 : Nippon Modus3 130-S
    Piretti Potenza 370g : Breakthrough Technology Stability Shaft - 34"

  • propmanpropman Members Posts: 1,774 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    jvincent wrote:



    These are two very different shafts, weight wise. They performed almost identically. That makes no **** sense to me. With the lighter shaft, it's easier to swing, no doubt. With the heavier shaft, I am more aggressive and when I get it going, that's maybe a better swing.




    Full disclosure, I am a shaft hoe. I will try shafts just for the sake of trying them even though nothing is broken.



    In the end for me it really comes down to whether I like the flight and feel of a given shaft. I've played everything from the original satin PX to 85g graphites over the years. I'm currently playing Nippon Modus3 130-S which I really like.



    Before I switched I built an 8i with the Nippon so I could compare it to my current 8i (I had a spare head) back to back over a month or so of real play. This let me hit in different lies, wind conditions, etc. IMHO this is better than looking at a launch monitor because you get much better feedback on the course and when the ball hits a green.



    Ultimately I decided I really liked the Nippons and re-shafted the whole set.






    I'm only a few years younger than you. I have a quick transition (aggressive) and when I'm not " on my game", it gets even quicker on the back nine. Therefore, I (personally) would always pick the shaft that can handle an aggressive pass. I am a 14 capper and need equipment which makes the mistakes more manageable. It is a game of misses.



    FWIW, I tried shafts as diverse as the KBS 90 tour (loved the feel of these but alot of pulled/hooked shots and the TT Dynamic Gold (felt dead to me). My sweet spot in shaft weight is 105 to 115 grams.





    YMMV.
    15 hcp
  • nsxguynsxguy Just anudder user FloridaMembers Posts: 5,943 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭


    So here's what's just confounding to me. I went to Roger Dunn, tested some Ping I210 mainly because there were two used sets, one with Recoil 660 F3 (71 gram) and one Pings AWT S, 104 gr. I thought hitting these very different shafts would give me a starting direction. I hit 7 iron with each shaft many times. After I got warmed up, the ball speed on the two was almost identical (within 0.5 MPH). The steel shaft launched a little higher and had a little more spin but the distance difference was about a yard. They had pretty similar dispersion although the Dunn monitors don't detail out that data. I was swinging pretty well once warmed up.



    These are two very different shafts, weight wise. They performed almost identically. That makes no **** sense to me. With the lighter shaft, it's easier to swing, no doubt. With the heavier shaft, I am more aggressive and when I get it going, that's maybe a better swing.



    I have no clue what to think. It kinda mind-fuggs me. If you made me pick, I think I'd say a lighter shaft might be more reliable because it takes less effort. At 66, although I am still pretty strong (thanks to pretty consistent gym workouts/stretching), my inclination is to go lighter. Maybe not all the way down to the 70's but maybe 90-95.



    Thanks to any of you willing to wade through these ramblings. It really helps me to talk this through with people.




    Couple of things.



    You mention a Roger Dunn. Pretty big retailer no ? Don't they have a demo Apex MB Pro and a barrel full of demo shafts ? It IS a 2018 model, no ?



    I know I've posted this before but I can't find it so you get the "short" (LOL) version. Lucky you. image/laugh.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':lol:' />



    I am older than you and in relatively good health & shape. I swing the driver 95 MAX, usually around 92-93. I play Dynamic Gold S300 in my new (to me) AP-1s, just changed to from my beloved G20s of 6+ years.



    Being a Sunday golfer during my working days I played everything off the rack. If it felt good and I hit it well and consistently I'd deal with any other issues on the golf course. image/rolleyes.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':rolleyes:' />



    6+ years ago, now retired, I fit myself for Ping G20s. Went to Golfsmith at least 5 different days (to account for day-to-day differences). I'd already settled on the G20 head and tried between 5 and 7 different shafts each session.



    I don't care much about spin rates, height or much of anything else other than consistency of distance & dispersion and feel (however one defines feel).



    All the other shafts gave me between 1-3 yards more carry than the DGS300. The dispersion of the DGS300 was CLEARLY much better than the others. At a distance "loss" or 1-3 yards at most the DGS300 was truly a no brainer.



    So recently, when I decided to try the AP-1 I, of course, tried to find a set with DGS300. Not easy as it's a very unusual combination. Found 'em, bought 'em and they've replaced my G20s.



    On a whim, a couple of years after getting the G20s I swapped in C-taper Stiff for about 6 months. Not bad, very comparable performance, but after a while I couldn't really get used to the "boardy" feel of the shafts. Possibly it was just a case of my simply not being able to load them as KBS intended. So back to the DGS300s for the last 4 years (until the AP-1s).



    I think if you find a shaft you absolutely get along with, sans the ability to really try others under mostly the same circumstances, you go with the shaft.



    Personally I think you really need to try the shafts with the same head you're playing. But if you absolutely can't, at least a very similar head. You're hitting a blade. I wouldn't want to go trying shafts with a GI. Just my opinion.



    I personally wouldn't go very light, or even lighter for that matter, unless you have some physical issues.



    Good luck. image/good.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':good:' />
    Callaway Epic 10.5 Project X Hzrdus Yellow 63 gr, 6.0
    Adams A12 Pro hybrids, 16*, Aldila VS Proto Stiff
    Ping G400 19* hybrid Stiff 70 Stock shaft

    Ping G20, 5-PW, DGS300
    Ping Glide Forged 48*, 52* 56*, 60* DGS300
    Taylormade Tour Spider Black (Today - always subject to change LOL)
    Titleist AVX

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