2015 ISPS Handa Women's Australian Open

[DavePelz4]

[quote name='PZero' timestamp='1424650703' post='11006681']
[quote name='DavePelz4' timestamp='1424650535' post='11006651']
High school junior Hannah O'Sullivan just won the first Symetra event of the year.

Amazing.
[/quote]

Hopefully that doesn't go under the radar. Very impressive.
[/quote]

She averaged 266 off the tee, hit 15 greens a round, averaged under 29 putts with just 2 bogies in 54 holes.

[vjswing]

[quote name='DavePelz4' timestamp='1424612122' post='11002893']
Lydia is 17 years old and has 6 victories on tour. How amazing is that.
[/quote]

At this rate, Lydia Ko may pass Sam Snead's wins total on tour before Tiger does!

[tbowles411]

[quote name='vjswing' timestamp='1424652192' post='11006905']
[quote name='DavePelz4' timestamp='1424612122' post='11002893']
Lydia is 17 years old and has 6 victories on tour. How amazing is that.
[/quote]

At this rate, Lydia Ko may pass Sam Snead's wins total on tour before Tiger does!
[/quote]
But she's going to retire at 30. So... LOL

Man, she's good. Holy cow. And my pick to win won. I was betting with house money. Why not?

[GameDayDog]

O'Sullivan - best sponsor exemption ever?

Wonder if someone will give her a chance on the LPGA during the summer?

[DavePelz4]

[quote name='GameDayDog' timestamp='1424653275' post='11007083']
O'Sullivan - best sponsor exemption ever?

Wonder if someone will give her a chance on the LPGA during the summer?
[/quote]
Going to guess she gets invited to the ANA/Dinah Shore.

[North Texas]

How about Ilhee Lee finishing T4 with an 82 in the 2nd round!

68-82-69-71 -2

-11 in 3 rounds and +9 in the other.

[MelloYello]

[quote name='legitimategolf' timestamp='1424641731' post='11005517']
[quote name='MelloYello' timestamp='1424637203' post='11005047']I think the warning that the LPGA needs to think about is that as good as Lydia is playing, she's only 17 and that if a 17 year old person can get to the top of your organization...what does that really say? After all, Lydia is not doing anything physically that the other girls aren't which means that again, somewhere down the line, you're going to get someone who's even younger coming along. After this has happened enough times people will realize that the game has nothing to do with shot-making and experience and it's everything to do with automation.[/quote]

Lydia Ko is a shot maker, ask anyone in the game. Also she is not a short hitter--maybe compared to you she is--but for an LPGA pro not a short hitter and hits the irons with a decent amount of spin. She's not like that 11-year old that qualified for the US Open if that is what you are imagining.

This game you describe, the one that has nothing to do with shot-making and experience--it does not exist, anywhere. What are you talking about man. I think what you are trying to say--that some of the courses the LPGA plays are not as difficult as you want to see--is fair enough, but the same could be said about the PGA Tour.
[/quote]

I'm not saying Lydia Ko isn't the best of what's out there--she very well may be. Please don't take this as an assault on Lydia's performance or on her in any way. To be honest, she seems more in control of her game than anyone else I see on the LPGA right now, but that's my point. The LPGA is so bereft of quality golfers that Lydia Ko--at 17 years of age--is schooling everyone.

I don't mean this to be insulting, but the LPGA on the whole should not be proud that a 17-year old (however consistent she may be) finds it so easy to win over and over. There's a lot to marvel at there but the LPGA is making it too easy (in my opinion) and that's where I have a bit of an issue.

This kind of thing would never happen on the PGA because you need a fully developed body capable of delivering the kind of consistent power that a 17-year old body simply doesn't, iron play and shot-making that 17-years olds simply don't have, incredible wedge technique, a marvelous short game and a hot putter to compete there. There's no way a 17-year old could take over the PGA the way that Lydia Ko has done the LPGA.

The fact that the LPGA isn't demanding a higher level of golf from its players means that there is a ton of turnover between these younger phenoms.

Lydia's great, I'm just saying that if you think you won't see it again within a few short years, you're crazy.

[DavePelz4]

I'm with you and said the PGA was bereft of talent when that AM Robert Jones kept winning the US Open and Open Championship. They put him in the HoF and he only won across 8 years.

[AKL Kiwi]

[quote name='MelloYello' timestamp='1424637203' post='11005047']

We should get something straight right off the bat, Lydia's consistency tee-to-green is what's putting her on top, not her creativity and shot-making ability throughout the bag. That's what's so different about watching PGA and LPGA coverage, I'm sad to say.
[/quote]

So Lydia approaching the 18th by going down the 1st fairway to approach the pin that got tucked away down the left side of the green is not being creative?? She was the first player to do that and then others followed. Did you watch this tournament? She did it again in the final round with great success. Golf is not a sport where you directly play an opponent you play to beat the par for the course by as many shots as you can and that is exactly what Ko goes out to achieve by shot-making and being creative.

[Leftagain]

[quote name='MelloYello' timestamp='1424655308' post='11007375']

Lydia's great, I'm just saying that if you think you won't see it again within a few short years, you're crazy.
[/quote]

I'm not so sure we will see this again for some time, could happen for sure but to repeat this at Lydia's age? Not so sure.

Bear in mind Lydia was the World #1 Am player at 14, she started playing in LPGA events at the same age and had played around 7 before she turned 16. She won one of them and never missed a cut. Two years later she still hasn't missed a cut.

Are there currently any 14-15 yr olds running around at the top of the Am rankings playing in LPGA events and not missing cuts? That's what you're going to have to see if someone is to equal or better what Lydia has done to date.

History would suggest it isn't going to happen either, there's only been 14 times where an LPGA winner was under 19. Lydia owns 6 of those, Lexi 3. It's just not a common happening.

Maybe it will become more common? Who knows but if you look at the current crop of Rookies, bar Charley Hull, they are all over 19 and as good as they are (and they are very good!) none of them are on the under 19 winners list.

Lydia promised to be something special way back when, the difference between her and most others is that she's actually delivered on that promise..

[AKL Kiwi]

[quote name='MelloYello' timestamp='1424655308' post='11007375']
[quote name='legitimategolf' timestamp='1424641731' post='11005517']
[quote name='MelloYello' timestamp='1424637203' post='11005047']I think the warning that the LPGA needs to think about is that as good as Lydia is playing, she's only 17 and that if a 17 year old person can get to the top of your organization...what does that really say? After all, Lydia is not doing anything physically that the other girls aren't which means that again, somewhere down the line, you're going to get someone who's even younger coming along. After this has happened enough times people will realize that the game has nothing to do with shot-making and experience and it's everything to do with automation.[/quote]

Lydia Ko is a shot maker, ask anyone in the game. Also she is not a short hitter--maybe compared to you she is--but for an LPGA pro not a short hitter and hits the irons with a decent amount of spin. She's not like that 11-year old that qualified for the US Open if that is what you are imagining.

This game you describe, the one that has nothing to do with shot-making and experience--it does not exist, anywhere. What are you talking about man. I think what you are trying to say--that some of the courses the LPGA plays are not as difficult as you want to see--is fair enough, but the same could be said about the PGA Tour.
[/quote]

I don't mean this to be insulting, but the LPGA on the whole should not be proud that a 17-year old (however consistent she may be) finds it so easy to win over and over. There's a lot to marvel at there but the LPGA is making it too easy (in my opinion) and that's where I have a bit of an issue.


The fact that the LPGA isn't demanding a higher level of golf from its players means that there is a ton of turnover between these younger phenoms.

Lydia's great, I'm just saying that if you think you won't see it again within a few short years, you're crazy.
[/quote]

I think the LPGA should be proud of the decision to waive the 18y old restriction for Ko or anyone who can first prove they have achieved a standard worthy of being accepted onto the tour whatever that age may be. I'm not saying they should encourage younger and younger players to try but I personally don't give a toss about age as long as they are not making it easier for younger players to get a card. If it was so easy for a 17y old or younger to win today we would see plenty more out of the hundreds around her age around the world that are out there right now trying to do what Ko has just done and I don't see a ton of 14y olds if any out there right now that look like they are going to be around at the highest level in a couple of years...
Please enlighten me with the names of the 100 (ton) young phenoms the LPGA has turned over....

[AKL Kiwi]

[quote name='Leftagain' timestamp='1424663059' post='11008293']
[quote name='MelloYello' timestamp='1424655308' post='11007375']
Lydia's great, I'm just saying that if you think you won't see it again within a few short years, you're crazy.
[/quote]

Lydia promised to be something special way back when, the difference between her and most others is that she's actually delivered on that promise..
[/quote]

I'm sure had Lydia not delivered last season commissioner Whan would have quickly sent Ms Ko to school... Brooke Henderson with her high list of achievements petitioned for an age waiver to participate in last year’s LPGA Q School but was denied so the LPGA does set a high standard for these youngsters....

[AKL Kiwi]

[quote name='DavePelz4' timestamp='1424650535' post='11006651']
High school junior Hannah O'Sullivan just won the first Symetra event of the year.

Amazing.
[/quote]

O'Sullivan replaces Cristie Kerr as the tour's youngest winner. Kerr was 17 when she won the 1995 Ironwood Futures Classic in Gainesville, Fla. She's the first amateur winner on the Symetra Tour since Kellee Booth took the 1999 Pacific Bell Futures Classic in Riverside, Calif.

Another age related record is rewritten this week....

[Mr22putt]

[quote name='AKL Kiwi' timestamp='1424630107' post='11004337']
I think we can now safely drop the reference to Ariya's injury she is well and truly over that and has been for a while and now looks to be a good chance to win ROY. It will be interesting to see how see lines up again Hyo Joo Kim in the Honda LPGA Thailand this week.
[/quote]
Over the long run...I think HJK is superior to Ariya.

Ariya is too stubborn with erratic course management.....I think if Ariya had a strong willed and strategic course mgmt caddie....it would go on deaf ears....I think Ariya will be a swash buckler for at least two year ....and then maybe she'll learn to finesse her game.
A powerful game was good enough to compete as an Am against weaker fields....but she needs a precise game to challenge the premier pros on the LPGA.

I'm not convinced they had the best instruction/coaching in the UK & Thailand....both have immense talent....but I think Charley & Ariya would be better golfers...especially on the mental side too...if they attended a top notch US golf academy in their young teens.

[Mr22putt]

[quote name='DavePelz4' timestamp='1424631026' post='11004433']
For a "National Championship," the event was played on one of, if not the, best course in Oz and was a true test of golf. Without creating 10 majors, it would seem like this event and also the CWO are more deserving of major status than the Evian.
[/quote]
Money talks and Evian held a gun to Whan's head before Golf Australia and Golf Canada could find sponsors with glocks and big wallets to lure Smiley Mike for major status.

The galleries were huge at the 2012 & 2013 CN CWO's.
If The Librarian, Wie, the Koreans and some of the popular US pros are playing well complemented with nice weather...watch for large galleries again in Van City in August at the CP CWO.

[Mr22putt]

Yes.....I like The Librarian and she is something special....a win is a win....but let's not forget that many of the top LPGA pros were absent this week.

[AKL Kiwi]

[quote name='Mr22putt' timestamp='1424672117' post='11008911']
[quote name='DavePelz4' timestamp='1424631026' post='11004433']
For a "National Championship," the event was played on one of, if not the, best course in Oz and was a true test of golf. Without creating 10 majors, it would seem like this event and also the CWO are more deserving of major status than the Evian.
[/quote]
Money talks and Evian held a gun to Whan's head before Golf Australia and Golf Canada could find sponsors with glocks and big wallets to lure Smiley Mike for major status.

The galleries were huge at the 2012 & 2013 CN CWO's.
If The Librarian, Wie, the Koreans and some of the popular US pros are playing well complemented with nice weather...watch for large galleries again in Van City in August at the CP CWO.
[/quote]

I liked seeing the Mounties around the course and at the presentation. I guess they have to leave the horses at home but that would be cool to see them in the gallery.. big hoof divots so I guess not...
I made a comment that I believe the CWO was a major at one time and had it still been so Ko would have won a major at the age of 15 years and four months and have 2 already. Do you know when they dropped it? I also think all National Championships should carry more weight in the LPGA points system.

[Mr22putt]

[quote name='DavePelz4' timestamp='1424632595' post='11004577']
Evian re-did the course and put up the 2nd most money, after the USWO. I think the major in Canada was the du Maurier which was in place until 2000. Putt would know better...he's the expert of everything Canada golf both men's and women's.
[/quote]
Yes, the du Maurier was a major.
Canada changed legislation that tobacco companies could no longer sponsor sporting events and the CWO couldn't find a sponsor quickly and lost their major status to the WBO.

If Golf Canada really wanted major status back for the CWO they could have done something.

If I was head of Golf Canada....I would have had private meetings with Hunter Harrison...CEO of CP and previously CN....Hunter is a HUGE advocate of women's golf.

I would also have meetings with the top premier Canadian golf courses.

Once I had all my ducks aligned....I would have met with Whan after the 2014 KNC.

"Hi Mike.....you don't have a sponsor for the KNC.....give the CWO major status and CP will increase the purse to $3.5M and the CWO will rotate throughout Canada...including the best courses that the are also included in the men's RBC Canadian Open."

How interested is the US for women's golf?
It took the LPGA 7 months after the now defunct 2014 KNC to announce a sponsor and that sponsor is not US based....it's ANA...a Japanese airline.
Galleries have also been minimal ay the KNC in recent years.

[Mr22putt]

[quote name='Chief Illiniwek' timestamp='1424636952' post='11005027']
I think the Evian gets too much grief. It's got a nice purse and almost every top player in the world goes and plays it. For whatever reason a lot of the girls don't go to the Aussie Open. [size=5][b]Anyone have the scoop on why[/b][/size]? It certainly seems like the most important tournament in Australia should be a bigger deal than the most important tournament in France.
[/quote]
Money...it talks.

Purse
Oz Open = $1.3M
Evian = $3.25M

[Mr22putt]

[quote name='Leftagain' timestamp='1424663059' post='11008293']
Maybe it will become more common?
Who knows but if you look at the current crop of Rookies, bar Charley Hull, they are all over 19 and as good as they are (and they are very good!) none of them are on the under 19 winners list.
[/quote]
Hyo Joo Kim won a major, Evian, at 18.
I think HJK has played 7 LPGA and not finished outside the top 10...I think....I'm not sure.
Unfortunately HJK is only expected to play 15 LPGA ..............and then 10 KLPGA events.

Minjee is a teen too.

[Mr22putt]

Let's face it...Lydia is a phenom freak.
It's crazy a 15 year old girl could win a LPGA event....and the 2012 CWO was not chopped liver....48 of the top ranked pros were playing...Se Ri Pak was injured.

I was fortunate to watch Lydia at this event for 4 days....I knew of her by watching (GC) that summer's USGA's Girls Jr, & women's Am.

Not many knew Lydia.
Late Saturday afternoon, Lydia, The Dragon Lady(Mom) and a relative/friend were outside the putting green fence sitting on the grass 5 feet from me eating gimbap, cherry tomatoes and watermelon.
Lydia will never be able to do this again outside the ropes in peace at a LPGA event.

[Leftagain]

[quote name='Mr22putt' timestamp='1424675141' post='11009015']
[quote name='Leftagain' timestamp='1424663059' post='11008293']
Maybe it will become more common?
Who knows but if you look at the current crop of Rookies, bar Charley Hull, they are all over 19 and as good as they are (and they are very good!) none of them are on the under 19 winners list.
[/quote]
Hyo Joo Kim won a major, Evian, at 18.
I think HJK has played 7 LPGA and not finished outside the top 10...I think....I'm not sure.
Unfortunately HJK is only expected to play 15 LPGA ..............and then 10 KLPGA events.

Minjee is a teen too.
[/quote]

Hyo Joo was 19 at Evian last year. DOB 14-07-1995. Hyo Joo also turned pro in 2012 so has an extra year as a pro under her belt. I'll give you that she is awesome though!

Minjee is still 18 true enough, missed her..

[MelloYello]

[quote name='DavePelz4' timestamp='1424657469' post='11007647']
I'm with you and said the PGA was bereft of talent when that AM Robert Jones kept winning the US Open and Open Championship. They put him in the HoF and he only won across 8 years.
[/quote]

Ok, good point. I'll give you credit on that. Lydia Ko could easily be the real deal and be an historic figure and wind up winning for 10 years and turn into a hall of fame player. Now personally, I wouldn't start comparing Lydia's wonderful race to the top over the last few years to Bobby Jones' entire career (be careful there) or victories that have been blown out of proportion with 100 years worth of mythology and lore attached, particularly given that recent history has provided for us a slew of LPGA players who reach the top, dominate for a short stretch, and who then fall away surprisingly quickly. Nobody thought Yani would disappear and yet she did. It was just a short time ago that Yani Tseng was being compared to Tiger Woods--and rightfully so!

Also, let me make one point for us all to think about because I don't want this to become you guys defending Lydia Ko in particular. We give credit to Tiger for doing the impossible at Augusta in 1997. However, when Tiger won the Masters in such a runaway performance it sent a warning shot to professional golf--you'd better toughen things up a bit or the next generation will start making the last look bad. Tiger might have been the first (and the best) but we've seen how the men's golf has changed.

Lydia isn't dominating because she's taking the LPGA to a new level of competition a la Tiger in the mid-90s. What Lydia's play is doing is saying...'if this is all you're going to ask of me, I'm going to fairway and green you all to the brink of exhaustion and my putter is going to be the final dagger.'

The LPGA seems set up right now for someone to start eating these courses alive. There's nothing wrong with what Lydia has done, but the style of simple, conservative golf she plays is shockingly dominant and that might not be a good thing if you're interested in the game as opposed to making a quick buck off the headlines of a 17-year old winning--which is quite a headline and I'm sure something the Golf Channel and the LPGA relish!

The question is whether, on the whole, we should be asking more of LPGA players in general by raising the standard of golf and make some attempt to try and get away from these young and inexperienced figures.

Maybe Michelle Wie was supposed to be the person that took the LPGA into a new age of athleticism and power. Maybe the fact she didn't turn her enormous length advantage into an historic career a la Tiger sent the wrong message--that it's okay to be a short plodder because you won't have to pay a penalty for it. Maybe that's why the LPGA looks so different than the PGA today--the LPGA being full of average length super-putters and the PGA being far more physically impressive.

My theory is that the PGA went through an evolution that the LPGA has not currently dealt with. With the crash of Michelle Wie, the LPGA never really went through that sort of hyper-inflation and growth the way the PGA Tour seemed to.

Again, not a knock on Lydia. I love watching her play but her game also makes me wonder just why someone who doesn't have such a physical advantage can dominate so readily? Also, how can we be so confident that Lydia will dominate in the long term when (1) the LPGA hasn't had a player like that since Annika and (2) Lydia doesn't posses the kind of physical advantage Tiger used to leverage himself against the fields week-in, week-out. What can Lydia really do to stay on top if her only advantage right now is consistency? That will ebb and flow. We know golf is like that. Her putter will at some point start acting up a bit and her iron play won't always be putting her 10' for birdie quite so often. How can she deal with the rough patches? I don't see her winning without her A game so-to-speak. You can't be dominant without an ability to outmatch the competition on bad days as well we both know.

What I'm saying is that in order to develop the quality of golf on the LPGA the game needs to be toughened up a bit. The winners are more and more conservative and as good as Lydia is, she's the prime example (or culprit) of that mentality. There's really no room for a Seve and a Phil Mickelson to emerge on the women's side--there never will be--because (1) the tour isn't challenging these girls power off the tee enough and (2) there isn't enough in place to challenge their short games and shot-making in general.


[quote name='Leftagain' timestamp='1424663059' post='11008293']
I'm not so sure we will see this again for some time, could happen for sure but to repeat this at Lydia's age? Not so sure.

Bear in mind Lydia was the World #1 Am player at 14, she started playing in LPGA events at the same age and had played around 7 before she turned 16. She won one of them and never missed a cut. Two years later she still hasn't missed a cut.

Are there currently any 14-15 yr olds running around at the top of the Am rankings playing in LPGA events and not missing cuts? That's what you're going to have to see if someone is to equal or better what Lydia has done to date.

History would suggest it isn't going to happen either, there's only been 14 times where an LPGA winner was under 19. Lydia owns 6 of those, Lexi 3. It's just not a common happening.

Maybe it will become more common? Who knows but if you look at the current crop of Rookies, bar Charley Hull, they are all over 19 and as good as they are (and they are very good!) none of them are on the under 19 winners list.

Lydia promised to be something special way back when, the difference between her and most others is that she's actually delivered on that promise..
[/quote]

Don't mistake my larger point though. This isn't about Lydia in particular. I recognize the fact that Lydia's great and I don't want to come off sounding like I don't believe in her because I do.

My curiosity is in regards to the trend in women's golf that seems to be favoring these very young girls who are winning so quickly. Maybe this is part of the marketing of the tour--younger, sexier figures are obviously easier to market versus the older, more experienced players.

What's happening to these girls after they reach 20? They are obviously gaining physical strength so why isn't that helping them? The maturation of young men between 15 and 18 is obviously a requirement for long-term stability on the PGA Tour in this modern era. Why is that not the case on the LPGA? Why aren't young women in their 20s, people who clearly have more physical potential and maturity I would think, doing anything with it?

Look at the PGA Tour and you'll find it's a stretch to say any of the top names are short hitters and even then it's a small minority. Yet on the women's side we don't see physical ability play such an integral role. It's not just in long drives. I'm talking about the ability to hit irons high and to move the ball around--to control trajectory and spin coming into greens. The LPGA isn't coming close to delivering the quality of golf that the PGA does.

I understand the physical differences that occur in women's basketball and women's tennis. Those are very physical sports. I'm wondering why there's so much of a disparity in golf though between the PGA and LPGA.

I think we'll see the game move up a level when a new generation of powerful-yet-precise hitters emerges, but the game needs to evolve for that to happen.

So my point is not to call out Lydia but to ask about how weak everyone who is between 20 and 35 must be.

How weak would the PGA tour be if somewhere who was 17 could walk right out and start winning over all the 20 and 25 and 30 year olds? The only time in recent memory that it happened was with Tiger and we all know how quickly golf changed. Courses quickly sharpened their teeth and added length.

All I'm saying is that the LPGA looks a bit like that right now.

[quote name='AKL Kiwi' timestamp='1424663338' post='11008317']
I think the LPGA should be proud of the decision to waive the 18y old restriction for Ko or anyone who can first prove they have achieved a standard worthy of being accepted onto the tour whatever that age may be. I'm not saying they should encourage younger and younger players to try but I personally don't give a toss about age as long as they are not making it easier for younger players to get a card. If it was so easy for a 17y old or younger to win today we would see plenty more out of the hundreds around her age around the world that are out there right now trying to do what Ko has just done and I don't see a ton of 14y olds if any out there right now that look like they are going to be around at the highest level in a couple of years...
Please enlighten me with the names of the 100 (ton) young phenoms the LPGA has turned over....
[/quote]

Again, this isn't about Lydia Ko or the privilege of playing. There shouldn't be an age restriction at all for the sake of equality--only for the protection of someone's youth if at all.

[Argonne69]

MelloYello, you keep referring to the PGA "power game", but I'm sitting here scratching my head trying to figure out what I've been watching for the past few years, cuz it sure ain't no power game. The consistent winners on the PGA Tour are not tearing up the courses with length off the tee. Currently, only 2 of the top 20 in driving distance are in the top 10 in FedEx points (Koepka, Watson). The players that are winning have combined driving accuracy, short game, and putting to win.

I think it more or less matches what I'm seeing in the LPGA. Length alone does not deliver results. There are plenty of women players in their teens and twenties that have plenty of length, but don't win on a regular basis.

Ms. Ko, Ms. Park, and Ms. Lewis accounted for 9 wins in 2014. Right now, they are in a class of their own. 'Tough to go out and win week in and week out when you have these three in the field. Each of them excel in driving accuracy, short game, and putting.

[Kaysquare]

I loved seeing Lydia win.....she's always so calm, cool & collected. She says she's not that calm inside though....she masks it very well. I think it's kind of funny that a 17-yr old is saying what she plans to do when she's 30 yrs old. Most 17-yrs old cannot even imagine being as "old" as 30, much less having a clue about what they plan to be doing then.

[Argonne69]

[quote name='Kaysquare' timestamp='1424706833' post='11010317']
I loved seeing Lydia win.....she's always so calm, cool & collected. She says she's not that calm inside though....she masks it very well. I think it's kind of funny that a 17-yr old is saying what she plans to do when she's 30 yrs old. Most 17-yrs old cannot even imagine being as "old" as 30, much less having a clue about what they plan to be doing then.
[/quote]

At the current rate, she'll have accumulated ~$20 million in earnings by the time she reaches 30. I think some of us could retire happily with a bit less.

She could have a great 2nd career as a sports psychologist.

[MelloYello]

[quote name='Argonne69' timestamp='1424706693' post='11010303']
MelloYello, you keep referring to the PGA "power game", but I'm sitting here scratching my head trying to figure out what I've been watching for the past few years, cuz it sure ain't no power game. The consistent winners on the PGA Tour are not tearing up the courses with length off the tee. Currently, only 2 of the top 20 in driving distance are in the top 10 in FedEx points (Koepka, Watson). The players that are winning have combined driving accuracy, short game, and putting to win.

I think it more or less matches what I'm seeing in the LPGA. Length alone does not deliver results. There are plenty of women players in their teens and twenties that have plenty of length, but don't win on a regular basis.

Ms. Ko, Ms. Park, and Ms. Lewis accounted for 9 wins in 2014. Right now, they are in a class of their own. 'Tough to go out and win week in and week out when you have these three in the field. Each of them excel in driving accuracy, short game, and putting.
[/quote]

They do what's asked of them very well. I think more emphasis should be placed on the long game though which would result (in the long term) with stronger players who are more physically capable.

I'm trying to say this without sounding like a total d by the way. I know it sounds sort of mean.

And I totally disagree with your assessment of the men's pro game. The best players pretty much all have very high ball speed off the tee and good physical strength to manage the rough and get the ball high up in the air (Rory, Stenson, Kaymer, etc.)

A lot of people are going to look at driving distance. That is totally beside the point. I'm talking more about physical strength and being able to play a greater variety of shots (particularly in scrambling).

Maybe the LPGA just won't ever produce the kind of shot-making we see on the men's side, but my point is that it's actually feeding the stereotype of being young and repeatable as opposed to being strong, versatile and robust.

[Shilgy]

It seems to me that since women develop at a younger age in all sports then what Ko is doing is roughly the equivalent of Spieth, Rory et al are doing on the PGA tour. The one thing I will add though is that the PGA tour is a bit deeper. If the LPGA did what Mello suggests with longer and more difficult courses then the top echelon would dominate even more so than they do now.

[MelloYello]

[quote name='Shilgy' timestamp='1424707948' post='11010449']
It seems to me that since women develop at a younger age in all sports then what Ko is doing is roughly the equivalent of Spieth, Rory et al are doing on the PGA tour. The one thing I will add though is that the PGA tour is a bit deeper. If the LPGA did what Mello suggests with longer and more difficult courses then the top echelon would dominate even more so than they do now.
[/quote]

I kind of agree with the Spieth, Fowler analogy to an extent. But it's not a question of when these people develop--the physical demands of golf on the LPGA Tour are just not that high. As a result the best player is 17 and we've seen lots of girls under the age of 20 compete.

While some are going to use that to write headlines, it's a pressing question as to whether or not it's a good thing for the level of competition and the overall quality of golf.

I agree that what you're saying would be the case in the short term but it would push girls to development more strength and 10-15 years down the line the average LPGA golfer would be bigger and stronger and the quality would have risen up the way the PGA and European tours have.

That's my point.

The LPGA is playing into the notion that younger winners = better for some reason (and I'm sure they have their reasons). Maybe it makes for better headlines or more marketing money but I don't think the quality of golf is #1 on their minds.

[Shilgy]

[quote name='MelloYello' timestamp='1424708207' post='11010473']
[quote name='Shilgy' timestamp='1424707948' post='11010449']
It seems to me that since women develop at a younger age in all sports then what Ko is doing is roughly the equivalent of Spieth, Rory et al are doing on the PGA tour. The one thing I will add though is that the PGA tour is a bit deeper. If the LPGA did what Mello suggests with longer and more difficult courses then the top echelon would dominate even more so than they do now.
[/quote]

I kind of agree with the Spieth, Fowler analogy to an extent. But it's not a question of when these people develop--the physical demands of golf on the LPGA Tour are just not that high. As a result the best player is 17 and we've seen lots of girls under the age of 20 compete.

I agree that would be the case in the short term but it would push girls to development more strength and 10-15 years down the line the average LPGA golfer would be bigger and stronger and the quality would have risen up the way the PGA and European tours have.

That's my point.
[/quote]But if bigger and stronger ruined Tiger...... The physical demands on the LPGA will never be the same as on the PGA. And if it ever got close no one would watch it as it would be like the East German powerlifting team. IMO the LPGA is not competing really with the PGA, it is a different game. Like the WNBA to the NBA. A lot of folks on this forum recall the old days of shotmaking on the PGA tour with the old equipment and wish it would go back to that instead of the bomb and gauge mentality. Perhaps that is the LPGA niche.