Biggest difference between PGA pro and a +6

[Kuuuch]

+6 might be a bad estimate, but what's the difference between a PGA touring pro and a guy who's good enough to make it on some mini tours, carries a great handicap but can't make the tour. Is it a combination of the below or is there one thing you think is the most common reason why they can't make it? Feel free to state something I haven't.

 

-distance

-ability to perform under high pressure or tournaments in general

-consistency to put up 4 great rounds

-short game

-money/time

-pure talent

-swing just isn't quite good enough

[Nessism]

+6 might be a bad estimate, but what's the difference between a PGA touring pro and a guy who's good enough to make it on some mini tours, carries a great handicap but can't make the tour. Is it a combination of the below or is there one thing you think is the most common reason why they can't make it? Feel free to state something I haven't.

 

-distance -YES

-ability to perform under high pressure or tournaments in general -YES

-consistency to put up 4 great rounds -YES

-short game -YES

-money/time -YES

-pure talent - YES

-swing just isn't quite good enough- YES

 

Any or all the above.

[PutterKilledTheDream]

The 4" between his ears

[Kuuuch]

+6 might be a bad estimate, but what's the difference between a PGA touring pro and a guy who's good enough to make it on some mini tours, carries a great handicap but can't make the tour. Is it a combination of the below or is there one thing you think is the most common reason why they can't make it? Feel free to state something I haven't.

 

-distance -YES

-ability to perform under high pressure or tournaments in general -YES

-consistency to put up 4 great rounds -YES

-short game -YES

-money/time -YES

-pure talent - YES

-swing just isn't quite good enough- YES

 

Any or all the above.

 

Haha good answer so you say just a little bit of all of it that makes all the difference?

 

The 4" between his ears

 

That's what I think as well. But I thought it would be interesting to see others opinions as well.

[MonteScheinblum]

Inward Confidence, ability to control emotions, intangible ability to shoot a score when you stink.

 

#3 Tiger was the best ever and the biggest issue that kept me from making it.

[b.helts]

Inward Confidence, ability to control emotions, intangible ability to shoot a score when you stink.

 

#3 Tiger was the best ever and the biggest issue that kept me from making it.

 

This is such a great post. Absolutely nailed it!

 

Only thing I'd add is the ability to step on a wounded kitten to put it out of its misery.

[nbg352]

A good +6 who isn't a PGA player probably doesn't really want to be one.

[iteachgolf]

A good +6 who isn't a PGA player probably doesn't really want to be one.

 

A couple thousand mini tour players, Web.com guys, Challenge Tour, Asian Tour, could go on and on would all disagree with you. Many are grinding their butts off, racking up massive debt, and are never home chasing the dream. Desire isn't the issue

[Kuuuch]

Inward Confidence, ability to control emotions, intangible ability to shoot a score when you stink.

 

#3 Tiger was the best ever and the biggest issue that kept me from making it.

 

Great points Monte. Not surprising we see more golfers taking bigger steps to manage their mental game.

[nbg352]

A good +6 who isn't a PGA player probably doesn't really want to be one.

 

A couple thousand mini tour players, Web.com guys, Challenge Tour, Asian Tour, could go on and on would all disagree with you. Many are grinding their butts off, racking up massive debt, and are never home chasing the dream. Desire isn't the issue

I meant no disrespect with that post. But I stand by it. I played hockey with a lot of guys who were definitely good enough to make it to the NHL. Like the +6, they were all missing an ingredient. Often they knew what the ingredient was....heart, killer instinct, whatever....but chose not to develop that inner part that was keeping them from what they thought they wanted more than anything. In the end, someone with good enough game to make the bigs but doesn't, really doesn't want to be there. For some, as an example, developing killer instinct is not inherent in their personality and it never will be because in their heart of hearts they don't want it as a part of their makeup. In the end, it is that choice that keeps them from moving forward.

I realize that this is my opinion, but it is one based on much experience, including my very own.

[MonteScheinblum]

A good +6 who isn't a PGA player probably doesn't really want to be one.

 

A couple thousand mini tour players, Web.com guys, Challenge Tour, Asian Tour, could go on and on would all disagree with you. Many are grinding their butts off, racking up massive debt, and are never home chasing the dream. Desire isn't the issue

I meant no disrespect with that post. But I stand by it. I played hockey with a lot of guys who were definitely good enough to make it to the NHL. Like the +6, they were all missing an ingredient. Often they knew what the ingredient was....heart, killer instinct, whatever....but chose not to develop that inner part that was keeping them from what they thought they wanted more than anything. In the end, someone with good enough game to make the bigs but doesn't, really doesn't want to be there. For some, as an example, developing killer instinct is not inherent in their personality and it never will be because in their heart of hearts they don't want it as a part of their makeup. In the end, it is that choice that keeps them from moving forward.

I realize that this is my opinion, but it is one based on much experience, including my very own.

 

Golf is different than any other sport for many reasons.

 

You aren't reacting to moving objects and people, so there is more thinking and less instinctual reaction in golf.

 

You're out there for 4 to 6 hours and only playing for 15 or so minutes. Way more time for the demons to creep in.,

[nbg352]

A good +6 who isn't a PGA player probably doesn't really want to be one.

 

A couple thousand mini tour players, Web.com guys, Challenge Tour, Asian Tour, could go on and on would all disagree with you. Many are grinding their butts off, racking up massive debt, and are never home chasing the dream. Desire isn't the issue

I meant no disrespect with that post. But I stand by it. I played hockey with a lot of guys who were definitely good enough to make it to the NHL. Like the +6, they were all missing an ingredient. Often they knew what the ingredient was....heart, killer instinct, whatever....but chose not to develop that inner part that was keeping them from what they thought they wanted more than anything. In the end, someone with good enough game to make the bigs but doesn't, really doesn't want to be there. For some, as an example, developing killer instinct is not inherent in their personality and it never will be because in their heart of hearts they don't want it as a part of their makeup. In the end, it is that choice that keeps them from moving forward.

I realize that this is my opinion, but it is one based on much experience, including my very own.

 

Golf is different than any other sport for many reasons.

 

You aren't reacting to moving objects and people, so there is more thinking and less instinctual reaction in golf.

 

You're out there for 4 to 6 hours and only playing for 15 or so minutes. Way more time for the demons to creep in.,

Is that it for all +6's then Monte? the demons? That happens in all sports too. But are you saying it's the biggest reason a +6 doesn't get there? A great goalie has demons too and sometimes they don't creep, they pounce. But, depending on what the demon is, that is something that one can learn to deal with, through recognition and experience and desire to better manage the demon. Sometimes, we can't banish the demon because we really don't want to make the necessary changes, either consciously or sub consciously.

[blehnhard]

There is also the element of "good fortune" and the ability to take advantage of it.

 

Jim Albus - excellent club professional player - qualified for some SR Tour Events in Florida in early 91. Made some decent money. Went back to his club job in the spring (NY Met Section). Did a Monday Q for the SR Tour event at Sleepy Hollow. Was 1st alternate. Someone got sick at last moment and WD. Jim gets in plays well and makes enough money to get in the Ford SR Players CH in Dearborn, MI. Shoots 279 and wins tournament - beating Lee Trevino.

 

Goes on to have a successful career on the SR PGA Tour with multiple wins.

 

Who knows what would have happened if he had not gotten in at Sleepy Hollow or made enough money to get in The FSP CH.

 

I think great short game and being a great putter can lead to success even if an average ball striker.

[iteachgolf]

A good +6 who isn't a PGA player probably doesn't really want to be one.

 

A couple thousand mini tour players, Web.com guys, Challenge Tour, Asian Tour, could go on and on would all disagree with you. Many are grinding their butts off, racking up massive debt, and are never home chasing the dream. Desire isn't the issue

I meant no disrespect with that post. But I stand by it. I played hockey with a lot of guys who were definitely good enough to make it to the NHL. Like the +6, they were all missing an ingredient. Often they knew what the ingredient was....heart, killer instinct, whatever....but chose not to develop that inner part that was keeping them from what they thought they wanted more than anything. In the end, someone with good enough game to make the bigs but doesn't, really doesn't want to be there. For some, as an example, developing killer instinct is not inherent in their personality and it never will be because in their heart of hearts they don't want it as a part of their makeup. In the end, it is that choice that keeps them from moving forward.

I realize that this is my opinion, but it is one based on much experience, including my very own.

 

And I'd argue being a +6 in and of itself isn't good enough. There are thousands of +6 level golfers and only 156 guys on the PGA Tour playing each week. A +6 is the bare minimum to have success on the Swingthought Tour (formerly Hooters/NGA), Canadian Tour and PGALA. Playing to a +6 a lot of weeks on the Web.Com tour will miss the cut. A handicap is only based on your best 50% of your round. In professional golf the 50% that aren't counted are more often than not more important than the ones that are. A players anti cap is as important or even more so to his success than what his handicap would be.

 

Your hockey analogy simply doesn't hold any water. It's not even close. The NHL allows 23 active players per team and 50 players under contract per team. That is 690 active players and 1500 players that are under NHL contracts. There are 60 NCAA Division 1 college hockey teams and almost half of those are DII or DIII schools "playing up". There are currently 1,172 D1 college hockey players.

 

Lets compare that to D1 college golf. There are 299 mens D1 college golf programs. Thats 5x as many golf programs as hockey programs. There are almost 3x as many college golfers as college hockey players yet the odds of a high school golfer playing college golf is about HALF the odds of a high school hockey player playing college golf. So the number of high school golfers in the US (152,647) dwarfs the number of high school hockey players (35,393) making the odds of making it to college golf let alone the PGA Tour is way lower. So you have 5x as many guys going after 10% of the available spots teams have in the NHL. The odds of making it on the PGA tour is literally 50x worse than making it in the NHL.

 

Golf has the worst ratio of highly skilled athletes vs available number of spots in all of professional sports.

[Kuuuch]

There is also the element of "good fortune" and the ability to take advantage of it.

 

Jim Albus - excellent club professional player - qualified for some SR Tour Events in Florida in early 91. Made some decent money. Went back to his club job in the spring (NY Met Section). Did a Monday Q for the SR Tour event at Sleepy Hollow. Was 1st alternate. Someone got sick at last moment and WD. Jim gets in plays well and makes enough money to get in the Ford SR Players CH in Dearborn, MI. Shoots 279 and wins tournament - beating Lee Trevino.

 

Goes on to have a successful career on the SR PGA Tour with multiple wins.

 

Who knows what would have happened if he had not gotten in at Sleepy Hollow or made enough money to get in The FSP CH.

 

I think great short game and being a great putter can lead to success even if an average ball striker.

 

Wow great story didn't know that. And yes short game and putting are to me what's toughest when the pressures on. I'd rather hit a drive that's 250 to carry water tight fairway then hit a short sided pitch tight lie any day when the pressures on!

[cehb]

intangible ability to shoot a score when you stink.

 

That's exactly it. I've seen it plenty of times where a very low handicap amateur (I'm talking well into the + range) and a tour pro play together and although they look like they have identical games, when the scores are added up the pro comes out 3-5 shots better off. I have no idea what "it" is, but they just know how to score better without being measurably different to the am in any part of their game. I've given up trying to figure out what this magical quality is, but they all have it!

[MonteScheinblum]

A good +6 who isn't a PGA player probably doesn't really want to be one.

 

A couple thousand mini tour players, Web.com guys, Challenge Tour, Asian Tour, could go on and on would all disagree with you. Many are grinding their butts off, racking up massive debt, and are never home chasing the dream. Desire isn't the issue

I meant no disrespect with that post. But I stand by it. I played hockey with a lot of guys who were definitely good enough to make it to the NHL. Like the +6, they were all missing an ingredient. Often they knew what the ingredient was....heart, killer instinct, whatever....but chose not to develop that inner part that was keeping them from what they thought they wanted more than anything. In the end, someone with good enough game to make the bigs but doesn't, really doesn't want to be there. For some, as an example, developing killer instinct is not inherent in their personality and it never will be because in their heart of hearts they don't want it as a part of their makeup. In the end, it is that choice that keeps them from moving forward.

I realize that this is my opinion, but it is one based on much experience, including my very own.

 

Golf is different than any other sport for many reasons.

 

You aren't reacting to moving objects and people, so there is more thinking and less instinctual reaction in golf.

 

You're out there for 4 to 6 hours and only playing for 15 or so minutes. Way more time for the demons to creep in.,

Is that it for all +6's then Monte? the demons? That happens in all sports too. But are you saying it's the biggest reason a +6 doesn't get there? A great goalie has demons too and sometimes they don't creep, they pounce. But, depending on what the demon is, that is something that one can learn to deal with, through recognition and experience and desire to better manage the demon. Sometimes, we can't banish the demon because we really don't want to make the necessary changes, either consciously or sub consciously.

 

Been around a bunch of +6's or better, I ncluding myself to didn't care what it took, we were going to do it. There was a stretch in 1992 I was a +10. For me, I couldn't throw 70-72 on the board when I was struggling. It was a swing issue and a mechanical issue with my putting. Went to the ends of the earth to find it, went to sports psychologists when people told me it was mental, took Ritalin because people said there was lack of focus, went to short game gurus, swing gurus, got hypnotized...wasn't cuz I didn't want to be there.

 

I had friends whose marriages broke up in the search.

 

You're making broad generalizations about a sport you're not as familiar with as the one where you excelled and being dismissive of myself and some good friends who were great players and didn't make it.

[GoldenBellGW]

Having been in the position for a couple years (although I never was a +6), I can say it could be anyone one of them. Played with one kid who had been playing for 3 years and never made a cut - came from money and that was his dream. Anyway, I knew a bunch of guys and for the best it was never a swing thing. I think the one thing I noticed was the ability for them to make their worst round or bad day still be a good day. In other words, when they were off, they still posted even and then usually back it up the next day with a great round. I would chalk it up to the mental game which translated to consistency. They went low low when they had it, but never went high on an off day.

[Ezgolfer]

Yeah..... you think Bubba has all the killer instinct , heart and all, but he cries like a baby after winning.....

 

Like Scheinblum said GRRRRRINDER..............

[MonteScheinblum]

Dan makes a great point about fewer spots. I have an additional point.

 

How many great streak hitters in baseball would have never made the bigs because being brought up was based on 3 random weeks that they couldn't be in a slump in any of them?

 

All other sports, the big leagues see a talented player who has spots of success and bring him up to see if he can do something.

 

If I was given a few 6-10 week stretches to prove I could play on the tour, I would have had a much better chance.

 

Some of my greatest weeks in golf I was winning big money in gambling matches.

[blehnhard]

In many ways "being consistent" is not the end all and be all. Better to miss 5 cuts in a row and win (or top 5) then to finish 35th for 5 straight weeks. If you can miss those 5 cuts and live thru the bad patches without losing your confidence and then take max advantage of your good weeks, you have a chance.

 

Q Schools are "crap shoots" - no matter how well you are playing, it has to be "your week".

 

I was successful in 2 Sr Q Schools back in the 90's (7th in 92 for full exem - 93 season. & 13th in 97 for a partial for 98). Was in 7th place going into last round in 98 Q School - played solid the last round - made no putts - 3 over 75 - top 20 but outside of 16th, so down the road. 94 thru 97, I did Monday spots and mini's.

 

I would have never put myself any better than a +2 or +3 at the peak of my game.

[Kuuuch]

Dan makes a great point about fewer spots. I have an additional point.

 

How many great streak hitters in baseball would have never made the bigs because being brought up was based on 3 random weeks that they couldn't be in a slump in any of them?

 

All other sports, the big leagues see a talented player who has spots of success and bring him up to see if he can do something.

 

If I was given a few 6-10 week stretches to prove I could play on the tour, I would have had a much better chance.

 

Some of my greatest weeks in golf I was winning big money in gambling matches.

 

That's a great point. Q-school, I can't recall how many stages it is, but my friend who just made it all the way through said every single stage you think more and more about what you're doing and you really can't afford any sign of a bad play. Because the one day you don't post a good score, the thoughts start pouring in your head and its that much harder to perform.

[MonteScheinblum]

Dan makes a great point about fewer spots. I have an additional point.

 

How many great streak hitters in baseball would have never made the bigs because being brought up was based on 3 random weeks that they couldn't be in a slump in any of them?

 

All other sports, the big leagues see a talented player who has spots of success and bring him up to see if he can do something.

 

If I was given a few 6-10 week stretches to prove I could play on the tour, I would have had a much better chance.

 

Some of my greatest weeks in golf I was winning big money in gambling matches.

 

That's a great point. Q-school, I can't recall how many stages it is, but my friend who just made it all the way through said every single stage you think more and more about what you're doing and you really can't afford any sign of a bad play. Because the one day you don't post a good score, the thoughts start pouring in your head and its that much harder to perform.

 

It's worse now. You need to get through 4 stages just to be in AAA.

 

One year, I was in the top 20 on the money list of the web.com thru 7-8 events. I had no status as I missed at second stage. I spent the next 10 weeks shooting 70-72 on Monday and didn't get in once. My friend who made it through 2nd stage the previous year, made 2 of 28 cuts, finished DFL those two times.

 

Difference was he beat me by 3 shots over 4 days in a week in November.

 

If I even had bottom status, I would have been in every event the rest of the year.

[Kuuuch]

Dan makes a great point about fewer spots. I have an additional point.

 

How many great streak hitters in baseball would have never made the bigs because being brought up was based on 3 random weeks that they couldn't be in a slump in any of them?

 

All other sports, the big leagues see a talented player who has spots of success and bring him up to see if he can do something.

 

If I was given a few 6-10 week stretches to prove I could play on the tour, I would have had a much better chance.

 

Some of my greatest weeks in golf I was winning big money in gambling matches.

 

That's a great point. Q-school, I can't recall how many stages it is, but my friend who just made it all the way through said every single stage you think more and more about what you're doing and you really can't afford any sign of a bad play. Because the one day you don't post a good score, the thoughts start pouring in your head and its that much harder to perform.

 

It's worse now. You need to get through 4 stages just to be in AAA.

 

One year, I was in the top 20 on the money list of the web.com thru 7-8 events. I had no status as I missed at second stage. I spent the next 10 weeks shooting 70-72 on Monday and didn't get in once. My friend who made it through 2nd stage the previous year, made 2 of 28 cuts, finished DFL those two times.

 

Difference was he beat me by 3 shots over 4 days in a week in November.

 

If I even had bottom status, I would have been in every event the rest of the year.

 

I can now see why many people have gave up golf after experiences like that. Such a tough thing to accomplish. All your cards have to be played just right with a lot of luck.

[MonteScheinblum]

Dan makes a great point about fewer spots. I have an additional point.

 

How many great streak hitters in baseball would have never made the bigs because being brought up was based on 3 random weeks that they couldn't be in a slump in any of them?

 

All other sports, the big leagues see a talented player who has spots of success and bring him up to see if he can do something.

 

If I was given a few 6-10 week stretches to prove I could play on the tour, I would have had a much better chance.

 

Some of my greatest weeks in golf I was winning big money in gambling matches.

 

That's a great point. Q-school, I can't recall how many stages it is, but my friend who just made it all the way through said every single stage you think more and more about what you're doing and you really can't afford any sign of a bad play. Because the one day you don't post a good score, the thoughts start pouring in your head and its that much harder to perform.

 

It's worse now. You need to get through 4 stages just to be in AAA.

 

One year, I was in the top 20 on the money list of the web.com thru 7-8 events. I had no status as I missed at second stage. I spent the next 10 weeks shooting 70-72 on Monday and didn't get in once. My friend who made it through 2nd stage the previous year, made 2 of 28 cuts, finished DFL those two times.

 

Difference was he beat me by 3 shots over 4 days in a week in November.

 

If I even had bottom status, I would have been in every event the rest of the year.

 

I can now see why many people have gave up golf after experiences like that. Such a tough thing to accomplish. All your cards have to be played just right with a lot of luck.

 

That year I finished top 25 the first event of the year. 18th, 20th? Anyway, the second week I led Sunday at once point. Famous airmailed the green on 13th story, ended up finishing 5th.

 

The following event was 3 weeks later. I was tearing it up. However, I got bumped out even after finishing 5th. A rash of tour players didn't get into the players and went to the web.com.

 

In those days Tour players had status over top 25 finishers the previous week.

 

Played in some mini tour event instead and shot nearly 20 under for 3 days and won by 10 or so.

 

What could have been.

 

 

[Llortamaisey]

Funding.

[Matt J]

Monte, what's the airmailed the green on 13 story? Jazzed up because you were in the lead?

 

I played one little fun tournament last year and was shocked what adrenaline did to my swing. Very old traditional layout with wicked greens that all slope back to front, so long is dead. I'm long all day and hence dead.

[zorro]

A good +6 who isn't a PGA player probably doesn't really want to be one.

 

A couple thousand mini tour players, Web.com guys, Challenge Tour, Asian Tour, could go on and on would all disagree with you. Many are grinding their butts off, racking up massive debt, and are never home chasing the dream. Desire isn't the issue

I meant no disrespect with that post. But I stand by it. I played hockey with a lot of guys who were definitely good enough to make it to the NHL. Like the +6, they were all missing an ingredient. Often they knew what the ingredient was....heart, killer instinct, whatever....but chose not to develop that inner part that was keeping them from what they thought they wanted more than anything. In the end, someone with good enough game to make the bigs but doesn't, really doesn't want to be there. For some, as an example, developing killer instinct is not inherent in their personality and it never will be because in their heart of hearts they don't want it as a part of their makeup. In the end, it is that choice that keeps them from moving forward.

I realize that this is my opinion, but it is one based on much experience, including my very own.

 

And I'd argue being a +6 in and of itself isn't good enough. There are thousands of +6 level golfers and only 156 guys on the PGA Tour playing each week. A +6 is the bare minimum to have success on the Swingthought Tour (formerly Hooters/NGA), Canadian Tour and PGALA. Playing to a +6 a lot of weeks on the Web.Com tour will miss the cut. A handicap is only based on your best 50% of your round. In professional golf the 50% that aren't counted are more often than not more important than the ones that are. A players anti cap is as important or even more so to his success than what his handicap would be.

 

Your hockey analogy simply doesn't hold any water. It's not even close. The NHL allows 23 active players per team and 50 players under contract per team. That is 690 active players and 1500 players that are under NHL contracts. There are 60 NCAA Division 1 college hockey teams and almost half of those are DII or DIII schools "playing up". There are currently 1,172 D1 college hockey players.

 

Lets compare that to D1 college golf. There are 299 mens D1 college golf programs. Thats 5x as many golf programs as hockey programs. There are almost 3x as many college golfers as college hockey players yet the odds of a high school golfer playing college golf is about HALF the odds of a high school hockey player playing college golf. So the number of high school golfers in the US (152,647) dwarfs the number of high school hockey players (35,393) making the odds of making it to college golf let alone the PGA Tour is way lower. So you have 5x as many guys going after 10% of the available spots teams have in the NHL. The odds of making it on the PGA tour is literally 50x worse than making it in the NHL.

 

Golf has the worst ratio of highly skilled athletes vs available number of spots in all of professional sports.

 

I don't want to disagree with the example of how difficult it is to get to the PGA tour, but re: the hockey stats, only 10% of NHL players actually come from the U.S. colleges. The primary supplier of talent is still Canadian major junior hockey (OHL, WCHL, and the QMJHL). Then you need to add in the Russians, Czechs, Finns, Swedes, and Germans, plus a few outliers. When you consider that, the odds of a kid from an NCAA program making it all the way to the NHL gets a lot closer to the golf numbers. Great topic...great comments!

[MonteScheinblum]

Monte, what's the airmailed the green on 13 story? Jazzed up because you were in the lead?

 

I played one little fun tournament last year and was shocked what adrenaline did to my swing. Very old traditional layout with wicked greens that all slope back to front, so long is dead. I'm long all day and hence dead.

 

Back 9 Sunday. Had an eagle putt on 10 to take the lead outright from about 8 feet. 360, so I'm tied.

 

Pared 11 and 12, one back.

 

13 was uphill into the wind and 200-210 to the hole. I was a little jacked up, so I hit 5. It was still going up when it was flying over the pin. It was right at it...lol. That is what too much shaft lean combined with speed gets you.

 

It was up against a tree, had to take an unplayable, pitched on and 2 putted for double. 4 back.

 

Only played 1 under (birdied 18) coming in. 5th.

[tatertot]

A good +6 who isn't a PGA player probably doesn't really want to be one.

 

A couple thousand mini tour players, Web.com guys, Challenge Tour, Asian Tour, could go on and on would all disagree with you. Many are grinding their butts off, racking up massive debt, and are never home chasing the dream. Desire isn't the issue

I meant no disrespect with that post. But I stand by it. I played hockey with a lot of guys who were definitely good enough to make it to the NHL. Like the +6, they were all missing an ingredient. Often they knew what the ingredient was....heart, killer instinct, whatever....but chose not to develop that inner part that was keeping them from what they thought they wanted more than anything. In the end, someone with good enough game to make the bigs but doesn't, really doesn't want to be there. For some, as an example, developing killer instinct is not inherent in their personality and it never will be because in their heart of hearts they don't want it as a part of their makeup. In the end, it is that choice that keeps them from moving forward.

I realize that this is my opinion, but it is one based on much experience, including my very own.

 

Where did you play with a lot of guys who were definitely good enough to be in the NHL? Not in college and not in the minors - those guys aren't good enough to make it. So where are all these players good enough to be in the NHL hanging out?