Favorite Tour Picture

[emncaity]

Not trying to get off the OP's topic but no matter how you slice it, Greg Norman choked. And he didn't choke a little bit, he choked big time.

 

Multiple times. On the biggest stage. In spectacular fashion.

 

Okay: Define "choking."

[emncaity]

The coolest era ever was the late 60s to late 70s...

 

Doug Sanders was designing his own shirts and cardigans...

 

He still dresses like a boss on and off the course!

 

The cardigan era was by far the best imho

 

-Chris

Saw old film of him just the other day close to his prime. Just no way you'd ever pick him out as a pro from a distance, based on the swing.

[emncaity]

Not trying to get off the OP's topic but no matter how you slice it, Greg Norman choked. And he didn't choke a little bit, he choked big time.

 

Actually it does "matter how you slice it." Otherwise you're reduced to saying that every player who loses a big lead is "choking," which is like saying nothing at all.

 

There's an argument to be made for the proposition that the definition of "choking" should include anything that makes a player get away from his normal swing, preparation, management, etc., as opposed to being limited to anything that happens because a player is nervous or feels too small for the occasion. You might be able to make a case for Norman fitting into that expanded definition, but IMHO it's more a matter of situations like this exposing the fundamental flaws that were there in the first place.

 

If you look at the U.S. Open in '84(?) and the Masters in '86, it was a technical flaw that came out at the worst times. Almost every pro has something he (or she) does when in try-harder or "this is really important" mode, which gets into that "variance under pressure not necessarily related to fear" thing. But in '96, it really was mismanagement. He just didn't have that gear that Nicklaus had that allows a person to recognize and adjust to the B game. That's more pride and bullheadedness than anything people commonly think of as "choking." The boldness that kept him rolling when it was really rolling was the same boldness that could be his undoing at times. So if you define "choking" as anything, whether prompted by fear or not, that results in altered performance under pressure at times, then I guess it's "choking." It just seems like not a very useful definition at that point.

 

Aside from that, six shots was never the insurmountable thing it was made out to be. You can play pretty well at Augusta as a pro and still shoot 72 if you don't make some putts. It was never impossible that Faldo would shoot 66 and catch him. Unlikely only in the sense that Norman didn't have five guys who could catch him with a good round if he shot around even par, but nowhere near impossible.

[Obee]

Not trying to get off the OP's topic but no matter how you slice it, Greg Norman choked. And he didn't choke a little bit, he choked big time.

 

Actually it does "matter how you slice it." Otherwise you're reduced to saying that every player who loses a big lead is "choking," which is like saying nothing at all.

 

There's an argument to be made for the proposition that the definition of "choking" should include anything that makes a player get away from his normal swing, preparation, management, etc., as opposed to being limited to anything that happens because a player is nervous or feels too small for the occasion. You might be able to make a case for Norman fitting into that expanded definition, but IMHO it's more a matter of situations like this exposing the fundamental flaws that were there in the first place.

 

If you look at the U.S. Open in '84(?) and the Masters in '86, it was a technical flaw that came out at the worst times. Almost every pro has something he (or she) does when in try-harder or "this is really important" mode, which gets into that "variance under pressure not necessarily related to fear" thing. But in '96, it really was mismanagement. He just didn't have that gear that Nicklaus had that allows a person to recognize and adjust to the B game. That's more pride and bullheadedness than anything people commonly think of as "choking." The boldness that kept him rolling when it was really rolling was the same boldness that could be his undoing at times. So if you define "choking" as anything, whether prompted by fear or not, that results in altered performance under pressure at times, then I guess it's "choking." It just seems like not a very useful definition at that point.

 

Aside from that, six shots was never the insurmountable thing it was made out to be. You can play pretty well at Augusta as a pro and still shoot 72 if you don't make some putts. It was never impossible that Faldo would shoot 66 and catch him. Unlikely only in the sense that Norman didn't have five guys who could catch him with a good round if he shot around even par, but nowhere near impossible.

 

Two things define choking for me:

 

1) Your "worst flaw coming out in 'try harder' mode"

 

2) Bad decision making under pressure

 

Those two things are literally the essence of choking. IMHO, of course.

[Obee]

 

 

...then Nike happened

 

When golf clothes were real golf clothes! (not that i was playing golf in them days!)

 

Anybody else here think that Weiskopf looks like James Caan???

[norge5]

Not trying to get off the OP's topic but no matter how you slice it, Greg Norman choked. And he didn't choke a little bit, he choked big time.

 

Actually it does "matter how you slice it." Otherwise you're reduced to saying that every player who loses a big lead is "choking," which is like saying nothing at all.

 

There's an argument to be made for the proposition that the definition of "choking" should include anything that makes a player get away from his normal swing, preparation, management, etc., as opposed to being limited to anything that happens because a player is nervous or feels too small for the occasion. You might be able to make a case for Norman fitting into that expanded definition, but IMHO it's more a matter of situations like this exposing the fundamental flaws that were there in the first place.

 

If you look at the U.S. Open in '84(?) and the Masters in '86, it was a technical flaw that came out at the worst times. Almost every pro has something he (or she) does when in try-harder or "this is really important" mode, which gets into that "variance under pressure not necessarily related to fear" thing. But in '96, it really was mismanagement. He just didn't have that gear that Nicklaus had that allows a person to recognize and adjust to the B game. That's more pride and bullheadedness than anything people commonly think of as "choking." The boldness that kept him rolling when it was really rolling was the same boldness that could be his undoing at times. So if you define "choking" as anything, whether prompted by fear or not, that results in altered performance under pressure at times, then I guess it's "choking." It just seems like not a very useful definition at that point.

 

Aside from that, six shots was never the insurmountable thing it was made out to be. You can play pretty well at Augusta as a pro and still shoot 72 if you don't make some putts. It was never impossible that Faldo would shoot 66 and catch him. Unlikely only in the sense that Norman didn't have five guys who could catch him with a good round if he shot around even par, but nowhere near impossible.

He didn't shoot a 72. He gagged.

[Obee]

Hale Irwin's vanilla swing.

 

 

One of the most repeatable swings ever. Hale was a ball striking machine.

 

And if I recall correctly, very short off the tee -- even for his time. Was like 250ish when the longest guys were hitting it 275 - 285. But that might have been in his mid 40's....

[bscinstnct]

 

 

...then Nike happened

 

When golf clothes were real golf clothes! (not that i was playing golf in them days!)

 

Anybody else here think that Weiskopf looks like James Caan???

 

Little bit, yeah.

 

Would love to see JM wear that hat now ; )

[Obee]

Hey conorgolf22,

 

 

No offense but I don't like anyone in your pictures. It's like you read my mind or know me personally. Weird.

If you would have put a picture of Phil in that post, it would have been icing (or frosting) on the cake.

 

 

 

I say frosting, typically.

 

Say it ain't so, Ferg! Jason Gore is an absolute class act great guy!!

[tiderider]

Not trying to get off the OP's topic but no matter how you slice it, Greg Norman choked. And he didn't choke a little bit, he choked big time.

 

Actually it does "matter how you slice it." Otherwise you're reduced to saying that every player who loses a big lead is "choking," which is like saying nothing at all.

 

There's an argument to be made for the proposition that the definition of "choking" should include anything that makes a player get away from his normal swing, preparation, management, etc., as opposed to being limited to anything that happens because a player is nervous or feels too small for the occasion. You might be able to make a case for Norman fitting into that expanded definition, but IMHO it's more a matter of situations like this exposing the fundamental flaws that were there in the first place.

 

If you look at the U.S. Open in '84(?) and the Masters in '86, it was a technical flaw that came out at the worst times. Almost every pro has something he (or she) does when in try-harder or "this is really important" mode, which gets into that "variance under pressure not necessarily related to fear" thing. But in '96, it really was mismanagement. He just didn't have that gear that Nicklaus had that allows a person to recognize and adjust to the B game. That's more pride and bullheadedness than anything people commonly think of as "choking." The boldness that kept him rolling when it was really rolling was the same boldness that could be his undoing at times. So if you define "choking" as anything, whether prompted by fear or not, that results in altered performance under pressure at times, then I guess it's "choking." It just seems like not a very useful definition at that point.

 

Aside from that, six shots was never the insurmountable thing it was made out to be. You can play pretty well at Augusta as a pro and still shoot 72 if you don't make some putts. It was never impossible that Faldo would shoot 66 and catch him. Unlikely only in the sense that Norman didn't have five guys who could catch him with a good round if he shot around even par, but nowhere near impossible.

 

he choked ... losing a 6 shot lead at augusta on saturday with the way he played prior to that is a choke ... could say he choked in '86 since he db the 10th and bogeyed the final hole ... probably can say he choked at '86 us open since the final day scoring was so low and he came in with a 75, then choked again at the pga with a final round of 76 ... he won a fair share, but he absolutely choked on those occassions ... it happens ...

[lowheel]

Hale Irwin's vanilla swing.

 

 

One of the most repeatable swings ever. Hale was a ball striking machine.

 

And if I recall correctly, very short off the tee -- even for his time. Was like 250ish when the longest guys were hitting it 275 - 285. But that might have been in his mid 40's....

 

He hit a high ball when needed on command as well.Probably one of the greatest fairway wood players out there ever.

[Christosterone]

The coolest era ever was the late 60s to late 70s...

 

Doug Sanders was designing his own shirts and cardigans...

 

He still dresses like a boss on and off the course!

 

The cardigan era was by far the best imho

 

-Chris

Saw old film of him just the other day close to his prime. Just no way you'd ever pick him out as a pro from a distance, based on the swing.

 

Go to ....Lee said his Saturday 5 birdie run was spurred by his desire not to play with someone so slow fidgety...totally bananas..

 

But, as Dave Stockton once said, Doug could chip and putt like no one else on tour (other than Trevino or Floyd)....HIGH praise

 

Go to 1:44...it’s unbeliveable....makes Keegan seem fast....Lees look at is priceless when he finally hits.....cost jacklin the next year imho

Because lee decided he would do anything not to put up with that again on every tee box

 

Seriously, go to 1:44.....makes me love Trevino even more

 

The fact sanders was a world beater for almost a decade with no distance and above average iron play speaks to his putting...

Ironic considering he is most remembered for a missed putt...

 

And if I don’t laugh at Trevino after the interminable time the u have no funny bone...still love sanders though in real life

1:44

 

Poor jacklin

 

 

PS: sanders died his bag, clubs, glove and clothes with the same dye for this round....from his mouth he said that

 

Jack was a badass to come back but sanders outplayed him that day...lee curb stomped jack and jacklin the next year and had( at the time) the greatest run of th era (us owpn, Canadian op, open championship)

 

-Chris

[Obee]

Wow, that is some serious Kevin Na take-away yips by Sanders. And his swing looked "off." Wonder if he always swung that flat-footed?

[iBanesto]

Tom Weiskopf - The Towering Inferno.

 

 

[Christosterone]

I realize this post is Tour photos....

 

So, in that vein....

 

Jan Stephenson had a badass reverse c....

 

-Chris

[iBanesto]

KJ Choi.

 

One of the nicest players out there.

 

[TerpFangolfer]

Steve Elkington - Nevertheless one of the best looking swings of all time.

 

 

Amazing...look at the line from his shoulder to the clubhead - absolutely straight as an arrow

[vleisman]

Nick Price

[vleisman]

Sally Little

[vleisman]

Possibly my least favourite tour picture. I really wanted Louis to win that Masters

[emncaity]

Not trying to get off the OP's topic but no matter how you slice it, Greg Norman choked. And he didn't choke a little bit, he choked big time.

 

Actually it does "matter how you slice it." Otherwise you're reduced to saying that every player who loses a big lead is "choking," which is like saying nothing at all.

 

There's an argument to be made for the proposition that the definition of "choking" should include anything that makes a player get away from his normal swing, preparation, management, etc., as opposed to being limited to anything that happens because a player is nervous or feels too small for the occasion. You might be able to make a case for Norman fitting into that expanded definition, but IMHO it's more a matter of situations like this exposing the fundamental flaws that were there in the first place.

 

If you look at the U.S. Open in '84(?) and the Masters in '86, it was a technical flaw that came out at the worst times. Almost every pro has something he (or she) does when in try-harder or "this is really important" mode, which gets into that "variance under pressure not necessarily related to fear" thing. But in '96, it really was mismanagement. He just didn't have that gear that Nicklaus had that allows a person to recognize and adjust to the B game. That's more pride and bullheadedness than anything people commonly think of as "choking." The boldness that kept him rolling when it was really rolling was the same boldness that could be his undoing at times. So if you define "choking" as anything, whether prompted by fear or not, that results in altered performance under pressure at times, then I guess it's "choking." It just seems like not a very useful definition at that point.

 

Aside from that, six shots was never the insurmountable thing it was made out to be. You can play pretty well at Augusta as a pro and still shoot 72 if you don't make some putts. It was never impossible that Faldo would shoot 66 and catch him. Unlikely only in the sense that Norman didn't have five guys who could catch him with a good round if he shot around even par, but nowhere near impossible.

 

he choked ... losing a 6 shot lead at augusta on saturday with the way he played prior to that is a choke ... could say he choked in '86 since he db the 10th and bogeyed the final hole ... probably can say he choked at '86 us open since the final day scoring was so low and he came in with a 75, then choked again at the pga with a final round of 76 ... he won a fair share, but he absolutely choked on those occassions ... it happens ...

 

How do you tell the difference between "choking" and simply having a mediocre version of your game on any given day, though?

 

Not sure about all these occasions, but I think there's more than a grain of truth here. I do, however, think he showed a lot of fortitude in putting himself back into those situations over and over, after getting stung by stuff like the Mize pitch, the Gamez second shot at the 72nd, the Tway hole-out from the bunker, etc. In fact, I've wondered whether expecting something bad to happen in the last round might have affected him not so much in producing fear, but in producing the attitude that he had to do something extra, and that "try too hard" thing is notable for how destructive it can be.

[emncaity]

I realize this post is Tour photos....

 

So, in that vein....

 

Jan Stephenson had a badass reverse c....

 

-Chris

 

Now we're talkin'.

 

I'm not a huge Dan Jenkins fan, but possibly the best thing he ever wrote was a description of Jan S as "best car date." Couldn't get away with it now, but whatever.

 

Possibly my least favourite tour picture. I really wanted Louis to win that Masters

 

I kinda root for that swing to win whenever it can. He's awfully long for his stature, too.

[emncaity]

The coolest era ever was the late 60s to late 70s...

 

Doug Sanders was designing his own shirts and cardigans...

 

He still dresses like a boss on and off the course!

 

The cardigan era was by far the best imho

 

-Chris

Saw old film of him just the other day close to his prime. Just no way you'd ever pick him out as a pro from a distance, based on the swing.

 

Go to ....Lee said his Saturday 5 birdie run was spurred by his desire not to play with someone so slow fidgety...totally bananas..

 

But, as Dave Stockton once said, Doug could chip and putt like no one else on tour (other than Trevino or Floyd)....HIGH praise

 

Go to 1:44...it's unbeliveable....makes Keegan seem fast....Lees look at is priceless when he finally hits.....cost jacklin the next year imho

Because lee decided he would do anything not to put up with that again on every tee box

 

Seriously, go to 1:44.....makes me love Trevino even more

 

The fact sanders was a world beater for almost a decade with no distance and above average iron play speaks to his putting...

Ironic considering he is most remembered for a missed putt...

 

And if I don't laugh at Trevino after the interminable time the u have no funny bone...still love sanders though in real life

1:44

 

Poor jacklin

 

[media=]

[/media]

 

PS: sanders died his bag, clubs, glove and clothes with the same dye for this round....from his mouth he said that

 

Jack was a badass to come back but sanders outplayed him that day...lee curb stomped jack and jacklin the next year and had( at the time) the greatest run of th era (us owpn, Canadian op, open championship)

 

-Chris

 

Oh, absolutely. Total respect for the guy. Perfect illustration of "not how, but how many." A lot of people today could take a lesson from that, with all the endless minutiae-ridden swing-theory discussions (from 15-cappers who would have no idea whether they are or aren't doing what they're talking about). Golf is about shooting the lowest score you can with what you have that day, and nobody exemplified that any better than Sanders.

[emncaity]

Hale Irwin's vanilla swing.

 

 

One of the most repeatable swings ever. Hale was a ball striking machine.

 

And if I recall correctly, very short off the tee -- even for his time. Was like 250ish when the longest guys were hitting it 275 - 285. But that might have been in his mid 40's....

 

He hit a high ball when needed on command as well.Probably one of the greatest fairway wood players out there ever.

 

Wasn't long on the PGA Tour, but the quality of his ballstriking held up well enough that he was generally top-half on the senior tour (in '02, for instance, when he was in his mid-50s and winning everything in sight, he was 39th). I saw him play at Austin that year, and boy, could he put the middle of the face on it. Had just a touch of steepness with that cut action his whole career, but he knew where it was going.

 

That '02 tournament in Austin was something. Friend of mine and I drove down to see them play -- tickets were pretty cheap -- and figured it was going to be mostly second-level players. First guy we see when we get off the parking-lot bridge is Gary Player on the practice green. Walked down the 18th to where drives were landing, Arnold Palmer hits it right at our feet, a little in the left rough. Followed him in, by that time Nicklaus is warming up. For 35 bucks. Watson was there, and totally crushing it (hard to describe just how good a ballstriker he was in his 40s and 50s), in the same group with Irwin. Several more Hall-of-Famers. Swear to God.

[emncaity]

I realize this post is Tour photos....

 

So, in that vein....

 

Jan Stephenson had a badass reverse c....

 

-Chris

 

I mean, if you're gonna start pulling out the Jan on us...

 

 

[emncaity]

Francis Ouimet and his daughters.

 

 

 

 

Not "tour," but this is what golf was always supposed to be.

[emncaity]

De Vicenzo, the most prolific professional tournament-winner of all time.

 

[emncaity]

Hey, it happened on tour.

 

[emncaity]

Nelson, in the middle of the greatest shortish run in history:

 

[emncaity]

One for one: Hogan at Carnoustie.