Lead Shoulder In Transition

[PJ1120]

Michael Breed had an article in GD this month. One of the things he said was critical was moving the lead shoulder towards the lead hip during transition for solid contact. I had stand up to see what I do. My lead shoulder wants to move up not down and I get a lot of early right side tilt. Is this a basic I've missed after playing all these years?

[Fort Worth Pro]

Michael Breed had an article in GD this month. One of the things he said was critical was moving the lead shoulder towards the lead hip during transition for solid contact. I had stand up to see what I do. My lead shoulder wants to move up not down and I get a lot of early right side tilt. Is this a basic I've missed after playing all these years?

 

Definitely needs to move down and forward. IMO this is absolutely imperative.

[PJ1120]

FWP.......it's pretty amazing to me that I've taken lessons from some of the best instructors out there and not one has told me this. Breed says you have to feel that the spine is tilted left. It's not an easy move. My # 1 problem is proper low point. If instead of my lead shoulder going down it raises and I go into too much secondary tilt I'm pretty much doomed to hit it fat no?

[jut111]

Nah just do what I used to do and pull your arms in and cup the heck out of your lead wrist to shorten the radius.

 

PS, that's not a good idea, but how I compensated for too much right tilt

[MonteScheinblum]

Michael Breed had an article in GD this month. One of the things he said was critical was moving the lead shoulder towards the lead hip during transition for solid contact. I had stand up to see what I do. My lead shoulder wants to move up not down and I get a lot of early right side tilt. Is this a basic I've missed after playing all these years?

 

I agree with FWP, but you can’t do this because you have too much lateral movement in the backswing. You have to slide to avoid hitting behind the ball or come way OTT and that’s why your left shoulder goes up.

 

If you brought your left shoulder down without a change in backswing, you’d likely Shank it.

[Fort Worth Pro]

FWP.......it's pretty amazing to me that I've taken lessons from some of the best instructors out there and not one has told me this. Breed says you have to feel that the spine is tilted left. It's not an easy move. My # 1 problem is proper low point. If instead of my lead shoulder going down it raises and I go into too much secondary tilt I'm pretty much doomed to hit it fat no?

 

Yes absolutely. Secondary too soon is not good for a number of reasons. Low point control chief among them

[CoiledUP]

My lead shoulder wants to move up not down and I get a lot of early right side tilt.

 

Sounds like someone from Bobby Lopez's camp.

[JamesBurg]

Michael Breed had an article in GD this month. One of the things he said was critical was moving the lead shoulder towards the lead hip during transition for solid contact. I had stand up to see what I do. My lead shoulder wants to move up not down and I get a lot of early right side tilt. Is this a basic I've missed after playing all these years?

 

Either Breed is full of it, or you misunderstood him. I'll vote for the first option.

[Millbrook]

Michael Breed had an article in GD this month. One of the things he said was critical was moving the lead shoulder towards the lead hip during transition for solid contact. I had stand up to see what I do. My lead shoulder wants to move up not down and I get a lot of early right side tilt. Is this a basic I've missed after playing all these years?

 

Definitely needs to move down and forward. IMO this is absolutely imperative.

 

Is there a video you can recommend which shows this please.

[RBImGuy]

FWP.......it's pretty amazing to me that I've taken lessons from some of the best instructors out there and not one has told me this.

 

Best?

Names mean nothing even if they are in media or popular in golf forums.

when you keep on disproving whats taught you know the difference

 

Just saying

 

Each advice should be taken lightly as it may not apply directly for you depending what else goes on.

[Dave D]

Michael Breed had an article in GD this month. One of the things he said was critical was moving the lead shoulder towards the lead hip during transition for solid contact. I had stand up to see what I do. My lead shoulder wants to move up not down and I get a lot of early right side tilt. Is this a basic I've missed after playing all these years?

 

Definitely needs to move down and forward. IMO this is absolutely imperative.

FWP.......it's pretty amazing to me that I've taken lessons from some of the best instructors out there and not one has told me this. Breed says you have to feel that the spine is tilted left. It's not an easy move. My # 1 problem is proper low point. If instead of my lead shoulder going down it raises and I go into too much secondary tilt I'm pretty much doomed to hit it fat no?

 

it was certainly a light bulb moment for me when I found this out

[glk]

Tyler has at least 3 video's on this on his subscription site - one is an 8 minute analysis of pros and ams including Rory from a target view.

 

His only youtube site video is this one:

 

Too me it's all feels like a downhill move to start the swing - lead hip, lead shoulder feel like they are dropping while chest is closed. You can see it also in Monte's zipper away video.

Add in the knee flex regained in transition and you have the classic drop move from Tiger, Rory, DJ, . . . It's a subtle move but if you haven't done it before it will feel like you are getting your chest, forehead, . . . much closer to the ground - steep arms in transition and you are dead with this move. Find it is an good move to do an early pressure shift, too.

 

Wayne D :

[Dave D]

Tyler has at least 3 video's on this on his subscription site - one is an 8 minute analysis of pros and ams including Rory from a target view.

 

His only youtube site video is this one:

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Too me it's all feels like a downhill move to start the swing - lead hip, lead shoulder feel like they are dropping while chest is closed. You can see it also in Monte's zipper away video.

Add in the knee flex regained in transition and you have the classic drop move from Tiger, Rory, DJ, . . . It's a subtle move but if you haven't done it before it will feel like you are getting your chest, forehead, . . . much closer to the ground - steep arms in transition and you are dead with this move. Find it is an good move to do an early pressure shift, too.

 

 

Interesting terminology as I've heard the AMG guys describe the transition move as if you are going downhill

[glk]

Tyler has at least 3 video's on this on his subscription site - one is an 8 minute analysis of pros and ams including Rory from a target view.

 

His only youtube site video is this one:

 

 

Too me it's all feels like a downhill move to start the swing - lead hip, lead shoulder feel like they are dropping while chest is closed. You can see it also in Monte's zipper away video.

Add in the knee flex regained in transition and you have the classic drop move from Tiger, Rory, DJ, . . . It's a subtle move but if you haven't done it before it will feel like you are getting your chest, forehead, . . . much closer to the ground - steep arms in transition and you are dead with this move. Find it is an good move to do an early pressure shift, too.

 

 

Interesting terminology as I've heard the AMG guys describe the transition move as if you are going downhill

 

Yes, me too. Actually, I have a few different feels depending on the day. One is the downhill feeling or a fall to the target. Another is the lower left ribcage crunch along with gained flexion in the hip. And yet another is my left butt cheek starting to rotate backwards along with increased pressure in my left heel. I sometimes also feel a slight push off the right foot while maintaing a closed chest. Oh so many feels. LOL.

 

One thing I found very educational is Tyler has a steep/shallow flow chart on his subscription site (on his steep/shallow video is a link) that has every body part and motion and whether it is a steepening or shallowing move. Left side bend is a steepening move while right shallows. Really is a great reference to see what are possible matching parts. He does 2 swings - one with all shallow and another with all steep - on the shallow he is so in-out that he would only hit the ball if it where off his trail foot and vice versa on the steep the ball would need to be off his lead foot.

[Millbrook]

Tyler has at least 3 video's on this on his subscription site - one is an 8 minute analysis of pros and ams including Rory from a target view.

 

His only youtube site video is this one:

 

 

Too me it's all feels like a downhill move to start the swing - lead hip, lead shoulder feel like they are dropping while chest is closed. You can see it also in Monte's zipper away video.

Add in the knee flex regained in transition and you have the classic drop move from Tiger, Rory, DJ, . . . It's a subtle move but if you haven't done it before it will feel like you are getting your chest, forehead, . . . much closer to the ground - steep arms in transition and you are dead with this move. Find it is an good move to do an early pressure shift, too.

 

 

Interesting terminology as I've heard the AMG guys describe the transition move as if you are going downhill

 

Yes, me too. Actually, I have a few different feels depending on the day. One is the downhill feeling or a fall to the target. Another is the lower left ribcage crunch along with gained flexion in the hip. And yet another is my left butt cheek starting to rotate backwards along with increased pressure in my left heel. I sometimes also feel a slight push off the right foot while maintaing a closed chest. Oh so many feels. LOL.

 

One thing I found very educational is Tyler has a steep/shallow flow chart on his subscription site (on his steep/shallow video is a link) that has every body part and motion and whether it is a steepening or shallowing move. Left side bend is a steepening move while right shallows. Really is a great reference to see what are possible matching parts. He does 2 swings - one with all shallow and another with all steep - on the shallow he is so in-out that he would only hit the ball if it where off his trail foot and vice versa on the steep the ball would need to be off his lead foot.

 

This is what I'm not getting - 'left side bend is a steepening move' - this is making me feel OTT. What am I missing?

[iteachgolf]

Tyler has at least 3 video's on this on his subscription site - one is an 8 minute analysis of pros and ams including Rory from a target view.

 

His only youtube site video is this one:

 

 

Too me it's all feels like a downhill move to start the swing - lead hip, lead shoulder feel like they are dropping while chest is closed. You can see it also in Monte's zipper away video.

Add in the knee flex regained in transition and you have the classic drop move from Tiger, Rory, DJ, . . . It's a subtle move but if you haven't done it before it will feel like you are getting your chest, forehead, . . . much closer to the ground - steep arms in transition and you are dead with this move. Find it is an good move to do an early pressure shift, too.

 

 

Interesting terminology as I've heard the AMG guys describe the transition move as if you are going downhill

 

Yes, me too. Actually, I have a few different feels depending on the day. One is the downhill feeling or a fall to the target. Another is the lower left ribcage crunch along with gained flexion in the hip. And yet another is my left butt cheek starting to rotate backwards along with increased pressure in my left heel. I sometimes also feel a slight push off the right foot while maintaing a closed chest. Oh so many feels. LOL.

 

One thing I found very educational is Tyler has a steep/shallow flow chart on his subscription site (on his steep/shallow video is a link) that has every body part and motion and whether it is a steepening or shallowing move. Left side bend is a steepening move while right shallows. Really is a great reference to see what are possible matching parts. He does 2 swings - one with all shallow and another with all steep - on the shallow he is so in-out that he would only hit the ball if it where off his trail foot and vice versa on the steep the ball would need to be off his lead foot.

 

This is what I'm not getting - 'left side bend is a steepening move' - this is making me feel OTT. What am I missing?

 

Left side bend allows you to flatten the shaft, and helps make it happen, while still allowing clubface and low point control. You need a steepening move with the pivot to offset a flattening of the shaft.

 

Why I have players hitting shots off downhill lies. If you tilt back too much too soon you can’t control low point and you can’t elevate the ball

 

https://instagram.com/p/BeI1CnilHvP/

[sethdavidsdad]

Gg has been doing this with students lately. Similar concept. Left shoulder low

 

 

Tyler has at least 3 video's on this on his subscription site - one is an 8 minute analysis of pros and ams including Rory from a target view.

 

His only youtube site video is this one:

 

 

Too me it's all feels like a downhill move to start the swing - lead hip, lead shoulder feel like they are dropping while chest is closed. You can see it also in Monte's zipper away video.

Add in the knee flex regained in transition and you have the classic drop move from Tiger, Rory, DJ, . . . It's a subtle move but if you haven't done it before it will feel like you are getting your chest, forehead, . . . much closer to the ground - steep arms in transition and you are dead with this move. Find it is an good move to do an early pressure shift, too.

 

 

Interesting terminology as I've heard the AMG guys describe the transition move as if you are going downhill

 

Yes, me too. Actually, I have a few different feels depending on the day. One is the downhill feeling or a fall to the target. Another is the lower left ribcage crunch along with gained flexion in the hip. And yet another is my left butt cheek starting to rotate backwards along with increased pressure in my left heel. I sometimes also feel a slight push off the right foot while maintaing a closed chest. Oh so many feels. LOL.

 

One thing I found very educational is Tyler has a steep/shallow flow chart on his subscription site (on his steep/shallow video is a link) that has every body part and motion and whether it is a steepening or shallowing move. Left side bend is a steepening move while right shallows. Really is a great reference to see what are possible matching parts. He does 2 swings - one with all shallow and another with all steep - on the shallow he is so in-out that he would only hit the ball if it where off his trail foot and vice versa on the steep the ball would need to be off his lead foot.

 

This is what I'm not getting - 'left side bend is a steepening move' - this is making me feel OTT. What am I missing?

 

Left side bend allows you to flatten the shaft, and helps make it happen, while still allowing clubface and low point control. You need a steepening move with the pivot to offset a flattening of the shaft.

 

Why I have players hitting shots off downhill lies. If you tilt back too much too soon you cant control low point and you cant elevate the ball

 

https://instagram.com/p/BeI1CnilHvP/

I like that hitting off down hill lie drill

[Nard_S]

Good stuff here.

 

I've tasted this in a "over my head" range sessions but never understood how or why of it. When it's right, you feel like your creating a window for your arms to rip through and the divot is a 4" pelt that flies a mile. The feeling of falling, crunching into the ball is there too. I think where I keep going wrong chasing this is I don't allow L. shoulder to drop and rotate freely, I weld it too my chin which screws it all to hell.

[MonteScheinblum]

Today’s Instagram post that I filmed a week or so ago was this.

 

His pressure trace was a bit off and keeping shoulder lower helped him slide less and thrust less, which improved his trace and got him to rotate more and get to left heel instead of left toes.

 

You’ll see his rehearsal move.

 

 

Should be up shortly.

[PJ1120]

Good stuff here.

 

I've tasted this in a "over my head" range sessions but never understood how or why of it. When it's right, you feel like your creating a window for your arms to rip through and the divot is a 4" pelt that flies a mile. The feeling of falling, crunching into the ball is there too. I think where I keep going wrong chasing this is I don't allow L. shoulder to drop and rotate freely, I weld it too my chin which screws it all to hell.

 

So you want your left shoulder to move forward and down while the head stays back? Seems like a difficult motion.

[glk]

Good stuff here.

 

I've tasted this in a "over my head" range sessions but never understood how or why of it. When it's right, you feel like your creating a window for your arms to rip through and the divot is a 4" pelt that flies a mile. The feeling of falling, crunching into the ball is there too. I think where I keep going wrong chasing this is I don't allow L. shoulder to drop and rotate freely, I weld it too my chin which screws it all to hell.

I don't have access to a angled hitting platform like iteach but I have found that the AMG guy's step drill give the feel. And also elevating the trail leg around 3 inches or so by standing on something - i use an old large, roll of industrial tape but you could use a small range bucket or impact bag or a bunch of towels - helps simulate the downhill lie - I like to just use it to take a few half speed swings - step off then recreate - I also like to stand on it and do rope swings with releasing the rope in front of the ball . My club's range is pretty flat except in the very front but then they don't really cut it - I think I might talk with the pro about what can be done now that I think about it.

[glk]

Good stuff here.

 

I've tasted this in a "over my head" range sessions but never understood how or why of it. When it's right, you feel like your creating a window for your arms to rip through and the divot is a 4" pelt that flies a mile. The feeling of falling, crunching into the ball is there too. I think where I keep going wrong chasing this is I don't allow L. shoulder to drop and rotate freely, I weld it too my chin which screws it all to hell.

 

So you want your left shoulder to move forward and down while the head stays back? Seems like a difficult motion.

yes an initial move would be to lunge the upper body but with time and reps and other drills to improve separation of lower/upper body it can happen - using an alignment stick with a pool noodle on it - have it aligned with your sternum and pointing at you - don't allow your head to pass it - helps with visually working on upper body location and stopping the sway back and lunge forward. Same position for iron or driver with usual ball position. On driver I like to feel as I'm actually working back from the noodle. Helps get the feel of a centered turn, too.

[MonteScheinblum]

His rehearsal move is a good way to feel it.

 

[TB07]

Same thing I’m working on that Dan gave me. Here is a drill hitting a wedge slow (like 50 yards).

 

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dHyZ-WJDQyM

[johnrobison]

His rehearsal move is a good way to feel it.

 

https://instagram.com/p/BgTyhevha2K/

Such a potty mouth!

[MonteScheinblum]

His rehearsal move is a good way to feel it.

 

https://instagram.com/p/BgTyhevha2K/

Such a potty mouth!

 

Had to listen to it again at full volume....lol

 

“I ******* pured it!!!!!”

[CoiledUP]

Pretty solid pass on the Instagram.

[Nard_S]

Good stuff here.

 

I've tasted this in a "over my head" range sessions but never understood how or why of it. When it's right, you feel like your creating a window for your arms to rip through and the divot is a 4" pelt that flies a mile. The feeling of falling, crunching into the ball is there too. I think where I keep going wrong chasing this is I don't allow L. shoulder to drop and rotate freely, I weld it too my chin which screws it all to hell.

 

So you want your left shoulder to move forward and down while the head stays back? Seems like a difficult motion.

 

Well, I did a video recently and yeah, looks like shoulder is glued to chin and I'm screwing up upper spine swing center. Getting lateral and dipping too much. Ideally I guess, torso crunches, head & butt might drop a bit but shoulders should freely rotate around a relatively stationary center of upper spine. So integrity of upper spine needs hold up throughout. Use shoulder girdle tilt and like the video pointed combine it with the lay down of shaft. Everything has to do it's job, lower body behavior is a major thing too. You know when it's right, ball explodes off of club. Been chasing this feel for months now, barely getting a handle on why I cannot duplicate it easily.

[JamesBurg]

Good stuff here.

 

I've tasted this in a "over my head" range sessions but never understood how or why of it. When it's right, you feel like your creating a window for your arms to rip through and the divot is a 4" pelt that flies a mile. The feeling of falling, crunching into the ball is there too. I think where I keep going wrong chasing this is I don't allow L. shoulder to drop and rotate freely, I weld it too my chin which screws it all to hell.

 

So you want your left shoulder to move forward and down while the head stays back? Seems like a difficult motion.

 

For the lead shoulder to move down from transition, the entire upper body must move down. To do that, the upper body must be high in transition. It's a squat move. Do you want another variable if you don't have time to practice like the pros.

[NikeGolferTX]

I've had to tackle this issue recently, especially getting early right bend.

 

The weight shift is just a 'Fall'.

 

What worked for me:

Lead hip low and feeling like I'm falling to my left side.

Make sure you keep width. Your lead shoulder will lower naturally.

 

Athletic motion golf after studying gears actually teaches the shift as a fall.

As a bonus you can push almost backwards with the left leg to get the hips opened up and the fall still keeps you going forward.

 

Check this out:

https://www.instagra...y=shaunwebbgolf