Lead Shoulder In Transition

[Nard_S]

^^^^ Great clip.

 

Put a mouse pointer on center of upper spine (logo), you see a lot fall and drop but when he's at impact (looks like Rory) the spine center is back at same point except shoulders are way more opened up. The left leg has a lot do with getting it back there.

 

Good stuff work with.

[NikeGolferTX]

^^^^ Great clip.

 

Put a mouse pointer on center of upper spine (logo), you see a lot fall and drop but when he's at impact (looks like Rory) the spine center is back at same point except shoulders are way more opened up. The left leg has a lot do with getting it back there.

 

Good stuff work with.

Glad you liked it! Yeah I actually saw Rory in a practice clip like actually pushing backwards with the left leg/heel to go in the reverse direction of the target. But when you add in the fall you naturally get pressure forward.

[GolfTurkey]

This is a good example of why golf is so hard. I don't get enough right side tilt but at the same time I have to ensure that I keep left tilt in transition and right tilt the correct amount at just the right time. Makes my head explode!

[TTGolf77]

This is a good example of why golf is so hard. I don't get enough right side tilt but at the same time I have to ensure that I keep left tilt in transition and right tilt the correct amount at just the right time. Makes my head explode!

 

It’s just a reaction to getting the left arm off the chest as fast as possible.

[JamesBurg]

This is a good example of why golf is so hard. I don't get enough right side tilt but at the same time I have to ensure that I keep left tilt in transition and right tilt the correct amount at just the right time. Makes my head explode!

 

Good post. You nailed it.

[GolfTurkey]

This is a good example of why golf is so hard. I don't get enough right side tilt but at the same time I have to ensure that I keep left tilt in transition and right tilt the correct amount at just the right time. Makes my head explode!

 

It’s just a reaction to getting the left arm off the chest as fast as possible.

 

What's the reaction, the right side tilt? I'm one of those special cases where if you get one thing correct, it doesn't lead to a chain reaction of correct things.

 

E.g. a lot of people may have the right leg and hip working out too much, blocking the right elbow which then causes OTT or swinging to right field or EE etc. Clean up the right hip and the other problems go away.

 

Not in my case; don't know whether it's extreme LOFT or lack of proprioception or what. Not complaining, I get some weird enjoyment out of how difficult the process is.

[GolfTurkey]

Do I have the following correct:

 

In transition, you should move down and forwards in left tilt, in such a way that if you carried on you would bury the club in the ground.

 

At some point (P6?) you right tilt hard and rip the handle up and to the left really hard, which flattens the bottom of the swing and provides parametric acceleration to the clubhead.

 

This is done via some combination of retracting and pulling up the left shoulder, extending the hips, straightening the left leg and bending the left elbow. Too much left dip and not enough rip upwards = fat, too little left dip and too much rip upwards = thin. *lies down for a nap*

[TTGolf77]

This is a good example of why golf is so hard. I don't get enough right side tilt but at the same time I have to ensure that I keep left tilt in transition and right tilt the correct amount at just the right time. Makes my head explode!

 

It’s just a reaction to getting the left arm off the chest as fast as possible.

 

What's the reaction, the right side tilt? I'm one of those special cases where if you get one thing correct, it doesn't lead to a chain reaction of correct things.

 

E.g. a lot of people may have the right leg and hip working out too much, blocking the right elbow which then causes OTT or swinging to right field or EE etc. Clean up the right hip and the other problems go away.

 

Not in my case; don't know whether it's extreme LOFT or lack of proprioception or what. Not complaining, I get some weird enjoyment out of how difficult the process is.

 

Yeah the tilt is a reaction to the left arm. It’s like throwing a frisbee.

[dap]

Whilst I agree the lead shoulder should not rise in the transition, not all good players lower the lead shoulder. It depends on the release of the player. Jason Day has a sweepy release and this dictates that his lead shoulder doesn't lower too much in the transition. If it did he would hit shots heavy or fat. In contrast players like Tiger and Sergio use a very late release. They have to drop their lead shoulder quite noticeably in the transition otherwise with their release the clubhead would pass above over the ball missing it completely.

[big truck]

Is there a risk of really leaning into the shot and causing other problems with the 'fall' onto the left side?

[Millbrook]

I don't think I'm athletic enough to do this move but the discussion has been very useful in getting me to think about avoiding trail side tilt being too early or too excessive.

[jerebear21]

this is what iteach got me working on the last 6 months;; my long iron game is a new beast

[Dave D]

Is there a risk of really leaning into the shot and causing other problems with the 'fall' onto the left side?

 

yes, like everything in the golf swing it can be overdone

[finleysg]

I haven't focused on the lead shoulder, but rather the "falling" into the left side earlier. I've seen an immediate 10 yd gain with irons and 20 with the driver. But it's a hard move for me so I can't focus on anything else. The club face has been all over the place.

[jerebear21]

I haven't focused on the lead shoulder, but rather the "falling" into the left side earlier. I've seen an immediate 10 yd gain with irons and 20 with the driver. But it's a hard move for me so I can't focus on anything else. The club face has been all over the place.

 

yeah, old holes where i had 6-7i in, i am getting 8-9i in; it definitely helps me with my driver and longer clubs.

[Kuuuch]

this is what iteach got me working on the last 6 months;; my long iron game is a new beast

 

Same here, iteach got me working on this about 4 months ago and it took me a little while to get it but once I did it transformed my iron game. I had always been a picker with the irons - miss hits were thin and low compression, not anymore.

 

For those asking about overdoing it, you definitely can like everything else in the golf swing and I experienced that. I got a little too steep, ball flight was too low and easier to pull a shot. Once I knew I was overdoing it I combined the move with a little shallowing move and boom. It allowed me to really find a good balance in the downswing and I no longer have fear of getting stuck underneath.

[MonteScheinblum]

For those saying they are not coordinated or athletic enough to make this move, I would contend it actually takes less coordination and athleticism to hit the ball doing this.

 

This reminds me of those who say they aren’t flexible enough to rotate their hips in the backswing. It takes more flexibility to make a backswing with less hip turn.

 

The action/reaction, often counterintuitive nature of the swing often foils improvement.

 

I will agree the move can be awkward if you don’t do it, but so is any motor function change. Learning to walk with my toes pointed forward instead of ducked out to protect my knees after my surgery has been super awkward, but it’s better.

 

Getting this move right eliminates some need for compensation, and more compensation requires more reaction, athleticism and coordination.

[Millbrook]

For those saying they are not coordinated or athletic enough to make this move, I would contend it actually takes less coordination and athleticism to hit the ball doing this.

 

This reminds me of those who say they aren’t flexible enough to rotate their hips in the backswing. It takes more flexibility to make a backswing with less hip turn.

 

The action/reaction, often counterintuitive nature of the swing often foils improvement.

 

I will agree the move can be awkward if you don’t do it, but so is any motor function change. Learning to walk with my toes pointed forward instead of ducked out to protect my knees after my surgery has been super awkward, but it’s better.

 

Getting this move right eliminates some need for compensation, and more compensation requires more reaction, athleticism and coordination.

 

Guilty your Honour for saying that. I've not seen one of your videos on this Monte, do you have one. Thanks.

[MonteScheinblum]

For those saying they are not coordinated or athletic enough to make this move, I would contend it actually takes less coordination and athleticism to hit the ball doing this.

 

This reminds me of those who say they aren’t flexible enough to rotate their hips in the backswing. It takes more flexibility to make a backswing with less hip turn.

 

The action/reaction, often counterintuitive nature of the swing often foils improvement.

 

I will agree the move can be awkward if you don’t do it, but so is any motor function change. Learning to walk with my toes pointed forward instead of ducked out to protect my knees after my surgery has been super awkward, but it’s better.

 

Getting this move right eliminates some need for compensation, and more compensation requires more reaction, athleticism and coordination.

 

Guilty your Honour for saying that. I've not seen one of your videos on this Monte, do you have one. Thanks.

 

See Instagram link I posted on page 1. You’ll see a good rehersel move.

[pwahmy]

It seems like to me if you were had the intent to lower the lead shoulder that your head would also move forward as a result? I’m sure this is incorrect. so could someone clarify that for me.

[glk]

It seems like to me if you were had the intent to lower the lead shoulder that your head would also move forward as a result? I'm sure this is incorrect. so could someone clarify that for me.

In transition both your upper and lower will move laterally some 3-6 inches depending. I think the instagram of rory from behind it a great example of both the upper and lower body slide in transition. Issue is direction of the left shoulder which should be going down along with the upper body and hips for this brief period of time as well as coming off the chin. And then from Tiger in more of a face on view.

 

http://www.instagram.com/p/BfzDkagHVJV/?taken-by=shaunwebbgolf

 

http://www.instagram.com/p/BgMbeUuHVZg/?taken-by=shaunwebbgolf

 

 

Issue can typically be that this is a steepening move so if you are person who pulls the handle or otherwise gets the club steep then you are doubling down - that's why in the Tyler Ferrell video I posted back on page 1 he advocates a combo of this left tilt move and arm shallowing.

[johnrobison]

It seems like to me if you were had the intent to lower the lead shoulder that your head would also move forward as a result? I'm sure this is incorrect. so could someone clarify that for me.

In transition both your upper and lower will move laterally some 3-6 inches depending. I think the instagram of rory from behind it a great example of both the upper and lower body slide in transition. Issue is direction of the left shoulder which should be going down along with the upper body and hips for this brief period of time as well as coming off the chin. And then from Tiger in more of a face on view.

 

http://www.instagram...y=shaunwebbgolf

 

http://www.instagram...y=shaunwebbgolf

 

 

Issue can typically be that this is a steepening move so if you are person who pulls the handle or otherwise gets the club steep then you are doubling down - that's why in the Tyler Ferrell video I posted back on page 1 he advocates a combo of this left tilt move and arm shallowing.

 

I agree. Sort of. For me (that's me in Monte's vid), that arm shallowing is an effect of restricting the right side. Sure, there's some proper arm movement that has to happen but it's hard to make the arms go steep if the other pieces are done correctly. In the rehearsal move that Monte mentioned, I'm also pushing my right hip away from the ball and my right knee feels like it's pushing away from the target. And it's the pressure in my right foot, around the inside of the ball of the foot or so, that feels to make that happen. Without that, my right leg internally rotates, my right shoulder goes down, and the club steepens.

[Krt22]

Is this a similar feel/intent but fixes a similar issue?

 

[gatorpedsMD]

Is this a similar feel/intent but fixes a similar issue?

 

https://www.instagra...n-by=shkeengolf

 

this is good but u have to have lead shoulder chin separation of u will drag ur upper body forward and shank it...

[Golfbeat]

Guys, just go back and look at these old Stack & Tilt videos again!

[sethdavidsdad]

Guys, just go back and look at these old Stack & Tilt videos again!

Your confusing staying on left side with left shoulder down. You have to make a full shoulder turn behind the ball then left shoulder goes down and towards the target while head stays back. Same move GG talks about when he says left hip stays low, just a differnet feel to get the same result

[Nard_S]

So I went to range in balmy 38* and I found I needed to "release from the top" and understand the "get left arm off chest" feel. Aside from a bit of dispersion issues made real good contact w/upper end pop.. When I incorporate fall & dip feel in modest dose, things get real good. Had decent success with short irons, sporadic up to 3W. Driver was a lot tougher, so I need to go to school with the whole thing. Lower body is a dunce. But feels like True North, and really like what came of it.

[jerebear21]

this is what iteach got me working on the last 6 months;; my long iron game is a new beast

 

Once I knew I was overdoing it I combined the move with a little shallowing move and boom.

 

^^^game changer

 

I’d add it forced me to shorten my back swing.

[deathbymuffin]

Lol. Wow. What a timely thread. It seems we are all discovering this at the same time.

 

I basically just "dug this out of the dirt" in the last few weeks on the range. I was hitting all my spots on my backswing but still had way too many fat shots and sweeping hooks. I knew I was too shallow and in-to-out but I couldn't figure out how to fix it. I thought I needed to open my shoulders, and I did, but I was missing the steepening move. At first I tried to steepening the shaft with more of a hand pulling down manipulation but my control was all over the place. So I sat and pondered a bit more when I finally came upon the left shoulder down and left feel. It felt insanely steep, but very first swing I hit my 7 iron flush with a healthy divot and a baby fade. It felt so good I could cry. I kept working on it and noticed I could still get dumped under if I let my arms run off inside on the backswing. Once I married the shoulder down and left move with a connected takeaway, I became a pure striking machine. It was amazing. Now I look forward to hitting my mid-to-long irons, and I've kissed the hooks with my driver goodbye too. This seems to be an absolutely essential component of a consistent transition but you almost never hear it discussed in videos or magazines.

 

Funny, my Dad had his first lesson this week and this is the exact thing the instructor had him working on. Dad said he gained two clubs back distance wise when he steepened the club.

[baudi]

Take a close look at the middle picture in the article: from my PoV this player lost of his spine angle.

If this article is all about prepping for the season GD better teaches to make a correct shoulder turn. eg Carl Lohren's concepts could help.

 

The offered sentences for the concept come with many degrees of freedom:

Drive your left shoulder closer to your left hip as you start the downswing (far right) andThat move—left shoulder toward left hip—

which is translated into:

I want you to shift toward the target and feel like your upper body is leaning that way, your spine tilting left—we call that side bend.

and finally into

Driving your left shoulder forward will prevent that and add compression to your strikes.

Please understand that my words are not a rant against Michael Breed nor GolfDigest. It is free content so I thank them both kindly.

I should settle to the point that this portion of instruction is not meant for me.