Thoughts on why people are walking away from the game...

[jut111]

Clubs being too expensive is just nonsense. Quaility used stuff has never been cheaper.

 

What world are you in, bro? Those who want to improve the most want the best equipment. So do those who are starting the game. Used stuff is used--worn grooves and grips, discarded for many negative reasons. New stuff high prices need to justify the expense and fittings, grips, etc. IMO used stuff has never been more expensive because of all that must come with it.

 

You probably should update your WIMB.

 

What? I get all my clubs with rare exception at Goodwill for 99 cents a club. I have many sets. I have a set of Ping G 25 irons I just gave to my son because they are crazy good and forgiving. Cost me $11. On ebay they go for over $280-300. My MP -53s cost $9. I play them because I am 69 and decided to play only what I love. On ebay that set sells for $200-450. Not listed prices, Sold. That IMO is high for and older used set. Not many people are as crazy as I have been at finding old sets. People with kids can't just cut down adult clubs anymore because it is considered child abuse, plus it is not informed--shafts too stiff and heavy, heads too heavy, grips wrong size. What do the do? New clus or a cheaper (and more popular) sport.

 

So eBay prices are higher then goodwill translates to equipment is too expensive?

[Tim Schoch]

Clubs being too expensive is just nonsense. Quaility used stuff has never been cheaper.

 

What world are you in, bro? Those who want to improve the most want the best equipment. So do those who are starting the game. Used stuff is used--worn grooves and grips, discarded for many negative reasons. New stuff high prices need to justify the expense and fittings, grips, etc. IMO used stuff has never been more expensive because of all that must come with it.

 

You probably should update your WIMB.

 

What? I get all my clubs with rare exception at Goodwill for 99 cents a club. I have many sets. I have a set of Ping G 25 irons I just gave to my son because they are crazy good and forgiving. Cost me $11. On ebay they go for over $280-300. My MP -53s cost $9. I play them because I am 69 and decided to play only what I love. On ebay that set sells for $200-450. Not listed prices, Sold. That IMO is high for and older used set. Not many people are as crazy as I have been at finding old sets. People with kids can't just cut down adult clubs anymore because it is considered child abuse, plus it is not informed--shafts too stiff and heavy, heads too heavy, grips wrong size. What do the do? New clus or a cheaper (and more popular) sport.

 

So eBay prices are higher then goodwill translates to equipment is too expensive?

 

So ebay prices set the market value. Goodwill prices explain my WITB. Nothing explains high new equipment prices, except there must be a big buyer base out there with money.

[4Putt4Practice]

What does "walk away" mean? Who's walking away? People that have played for 20+ years? People who started golf a year ago? I'm curious.

[bamagator]

As a guy getting back in.....why? Cost of gear can always be handled. Ebay, local second hand or new or component. Why?

 

- This is a hard sport, many young folks don't want to spend the time investment in learning the sport. It's a nut grinder

- Elitism? Yep. Sport has done a lot to be open to common dudes but come on, freaking media sells the "image" of elitism still.....freaking ridiculous.

- Lack of icon? None of the slingers have wooed the masses since Tigers' rise and fall

 

Worth 2 cents and pocket lint....my take

[cheers big ears]

Meh, people always walk away. The golfing life is.

1. Start young with cut down fathers clubs

2. Get decent set in teens

3. Leave, opposite sex, uni, job, family.

4. Start again when you have money and an afternoon to spare.

 

[Sixcat]

Speaking in terms of what I have seen throughout the region where I live, longtime avid golfers aren't walking away from the game. It's the guys who came to the game after Tiger made it cool who are walking away. Those guys were never going to be "lifers" anyway.

 

A lot of those guys who frequented my home club for a while move on to the latest fad time after time after time. A lot of those guys become "avid" skiers or swimmers about every 4 years. I wonder what could possibly cause that?!?!?

[Tim Schoch]

I think golf is like climate change. ANY change and we freak out and find something to blame. When I was a kid golf was cool... Arnie, celebrities, anyone who played golf was hip, it was the corporate thing to do. Now, the hipness is gone and being a golfer is nerdy (and, no, drunk Topgolf is not real golf....fun tho). In my day, climate change produced worldwide headlines that the next ice age was coming soon. Today, headlines scream that the oceans will dry up. Take a breath.

 

Truth is, change happens, things cycle back, life goes on...but even life doesnt stay the same.

 

Problem today is that ironically golf is killing itself with commercialism. IMO.

[4Putt4Practice]

I think golf is like climate change. ANY change and we freak out and find something to blame. When I was a kid golf was cool... Arnie, celebrities, anyone who played golf was hip, it was the corporate thing to do. Now, the hipness is gone and being a golfer is nerdy (and, no, drunk Topgolf is not real golf....fun tho). In my day, climate change produced worldwide headlines that the next ice age was coming soon. Today, headlines scream that the oceans will dry up. Take a breath.

 

Truth is, change happens, things cycle back, life goes on...but even life doesnt stay the same.

 

Problem today is that ironically golf is killing itself with commercialism. IMO.

 

The problem with golf is the OEM's are over-playing club "forgiveness". People think they can buy an SGI set and skip all the fundamentals straight to <10 hcp. Then when they find out after a few months the clubs have no "brains", they quickly become disappointed. The main thing OEMs have done is to make irons that mask bad hits very well....which makes folks think they are hitting better.

[Tim Schoch]

I think golf is like climate change. ANY change and we freak out and find something to blame. When I was a kid golf was cool... Arnie, celebrities, anyone who played golf was hip, it was the corporate thing to do. Now, the hipness is gone and being a golfer is nerdy (and, no, drunk Topgolf is not real golf....fun tho). In my day, climate change produced worldwide headlines that the next ice age was coming soon. Today, headlines scream that the oceans will dry up. Take a breath.

 

Truth is, change happens, things cycle back, life goes on...but even life doesnt stay the same.

 

Problem today is that ironically golf is killing itself with commercialism. IMO.

 

The problem with golf is the OEM's are over-playing club "forgiveness". People think they can buy an SGI set and skip all the fundamentals straight to <10 hcp. Then when they find out after a few months the clubs have no "brains", they quickly become disappointed. The main thing OEMs have done is to make irons that mask bad hits very well....which makes folks think they are hitting better.

 

Totally agree. All salespeople know that items sell a small percentage on value and the largest percentage on persuading the ignorant. Most buyers don't do their homework or even use common sense. They WANT to believe in miracles. Anyway, it is sad to see TV and radio shows become 50% repetitive content and 50% or more paid advertorials, phony interviews, and straight-out snake oil selling.

 

The mantra sweeping across the sales profession is that they don't sell anything, they help people or offer services. They create a story where someone is suffering and because of their presence and products, this person was helped/cured/found the girl/became famous/broke 60, etc. This approach is one of the oldest and found in the 1923 "bible" of sales, "Scientific Advertising" EVERYONE should read this book. After you do, you will see through sales pitches and advertising exaggerations and also recognize the truth, when it exists. (By the way, the book is now free, public domain, so look for a free version)

 

Link to free PDF of "Scientific Advertising"

[bigcountry1219]

Won't be long until XBox golfers outnumber real life golfers... same goes for other sports as well. Really a sad transition in my opinion.

 

A small number of high schools are forming "E-Sports" programs. Really crazy in my opinion.

[BrockPSU]

Won't be long until XBox golfers outnumber real life golfers... same goes for other sports as well. Really a sad transition in my opinion.

 

A small number of high schools are forming "E-Sports" programs. Really crazy in my opinion.

 

The difference is, E-Sports you can make money doing it, you can make money sitting at home. I am not saying its right or wrong but comparing golf to E-Sports isn't really relevant. I played a lot of the E-sports scene through high school and college, while also playing a lot of golf. The only thing that concerns me is what I said before, you can make money playing games daily compared to paying to play golf.

 

Which brings me to my concern, it is money and time. For younger people you are being forced to deal with college loans, and social lives etc. But college loans anymore are to the point to where I am looking at a brand new driver every month and snapping it over my leg for a piece of paper. That not only limits on what I can do with golf but also limits the time etc being put into golf.

 

Looking at my home course and the courses around us, golf is in serious trouble. The amount of high school kids not playing golf is really starting to show. You know the kids that will continue to play because they love the game, but they are very rare.

 

I don't think it has to do with manufactures though, I think it stems from where the money is going and the time, and its not going to golf for the younger generations.

[Matt J]

Won't be long until XBox golfers outnumber real life golfers... same goes for other sports as well. Really a sad transition in my opinion.

 

A small number of high schools are forming "E-Sports" programs. Really crazy in my opinion.

 

The difference is, E-Sports you can make money doing it, you can make money sitting at home. I am not saying its right or wrong but comparing golf to E-Sports isn't really relevant. I played a lot of the E-sports scene through high school and college, while also playing a lot of golf. The only thing that concerns me is what I said before, you can make money playing games daily compared to paying to play golf.

 

Which brings me to my concern, it is money and time. For younger people you are being forced to deal with college loans, and social lives etc. But college loans anymore are to the point to where I am looking at a brand new driver every month and snapping it over my leg for a piece of paper. That not only limits on what I can do with golf but also limits the time etc being put into golf.

 

Looking at my home course and the courses around us, golf is in serious trouble. The amount of high school kids not playing golf is really starting to show. You know the kids that will continue to play because they love the game, but they are very rare.

 

I don't think it has to do with manufactures though, I think it stems from where the money is going and the time, and its not going to golf for the younger generations.

 

If all your college degree resulted in was a piece of paper, you did it wrong. And, I don't mean that as if some kind of trade degree in Business or Accounting is the only reason to go to college. I left college a better person. Smarter, more well-rounded, more sensitive, more educated. I can understand the loan repayment being a bummer, but it shouldn't be all that resulted from 4 years of your life...

 

Who knew that kids make money playing video games? Live and learn. I thought they just got pale and skinny.

[fairways4life]

28 pages long and I am late to this party so forgive me if it's been mentioned.

 

Too much time, money, too difficult, too many other things like computers and internet, less leisure time --- those are all true and I'm sure have been discussed at length here.

 

But I'll throw one more in the hat --- caddies (and the decline of them).

 

How many baby boomers got hooked on golf as a kid because they got a summer job caddying? They got introduced to the game and got to go out and play one day a week on the caddie day or hit free balls on the range. It was the perfect way to introduce young people to the game.

 

But the days of young kids hauling bags around are pretty much done (if not done entirely). Places with caddie programs today (think Pinehurst, Pebble, Kiawah, Streamsong, etc.) all have caddies who are 18+ in age. It's no longer a "kids" thing. It's become more of a thing that you can actually make a decent living at.

 

Are there any courses that still employ 10 year old kids as caddies? I am not aware of any (though it's possible they do exist). I'm aware of the Evans Scholarship, but not sure how young those kids get started in it.

 

This is just one of the many reasons that are contributing to it. And obviously the golf cart and modern course design are largely rooted in the demise of caddie programs.

[GSDriver]

Less we forget the proliferation and preference of younger folks who prefer to button mash (rather play video games).

[4Putt4Practice]

Let's face it, it's not just golf. People quit all kinds of things in life for many reasons, but the primary one is lack of dedication, or, letting other people's opinions get in the way. People start, then quit a great idea for a small business, maybe writing a book, getting a contractors license, playing the guitar, etc. The trick is to NEVER quit whatever interests you.

[Matt J]

Let's face it, it's not just golf. People quit all kinds of things in life for many reasons, but the primary one is lack of dedication, or, letting other people's opinions get in the way. People start, then quit a great idea for a small business, maybe writing a book, getting a contractors license, playing the guitar, etc. The trick is to NEVER quit whatever interests you.

 

I have quit every single thing on that list. But, golf.

[Matt J]

28 pages long and I am late to this party so forgive me if it's been mentioned.

 

Too much time, money, too difficult, too many other things like computers and internet, less leisure time --- those are all true and I'm sure have been discussed at length here.

 

But I'll throw one more in the hat --- caddies (and the decline of them).

 

How many baby boomers got hooked on golf as a kid because they got a summer job caddying? They got introduced to the game and got to go out and play one day a week on the caddie day or hit free balls on the range. It was the perfect way to introduce young people to the game.

 

But the days of young kids hauling bags around are pretty much done (if not done entirely). Places with caddie programs today (think Pinehurst, Pebble, Kiawah, Streamsong, etc.) all have caddies who are 18+ in age. It's no longer a "kids" thing. It's become more of a thing that you can actually make a decent living at.

 

Are there any courses that still employ 10 year old kids as caddies? I am not aware of any (though it's possible they do exist). I'm aware of the Evans Scholarship, but not sure how young those kids get started in it.

 

This is just one of the many reasons that are contributing to it. And obviously the golf cart and modern course design are largely rooted in the demise of caddie programs.

 

Couldn't agree more. I envisioned bringing caddies back to our local club. Guess what? You can't leave all of your $s*** including your Fracking radio in a caddie. So, even though it makes so much sense, it also gets in the way of the boomer dream retirement which evidently includes getting in your ultra personal mini-ride to buzz around the club while listening to Hall & Oates.

[4Putt4Practice]

What will eventually happen is the USGA will open-up club restraints for easy 350 yard drives, and change the rules from a two club length drop to one soccer field closer to the green.

[Matt J]

What will eventually happen is the USGA will open-up club restraints for easy 350 yard drives, and change the rules from a two club length drop to one soccer field closer to the green.

 

Or, rather than actually have to carry the hazard or put a drive in play you just take a 3 stroke penalty and drop within a wedge of the green for a chance at a bogey. Oh yeah, they already did that, it will happen way in the future like in 14 days.

[ChronicSlicer]

The trick is to NEVER quit whatever interests you.

 

You sir would be a terrible,terrible friend to an alcoholic/drug addict/habitual gambler. :D

[hybrid25]

I copied and pasted this segment from an article written by The Golf Association of Michigan which indicates to me, at least in our area, golf is seeing some good youthful growth.

 

 

QUOTE

This past year, our Youth on Course initiative was a huge success. The number of Michigan participants jumped to more than 4,500 golfers, up more than 70 percent compared to 2017. And we’re making plans to increase Youth on Course participation even more in 2019.

UNQUOTE

[Ferguson]

Meh, people always walk away. The golfing life is.

1. Start young with cut down fathers clubs

2. Get decent set in teens

3. Leave, opposite sex, uni, job, family.

4. Start again when you have money and an afternoon to spare.

 

 

 

 

May I supplement your list?

1. Start young with cut down clubs and develop poor habits
   
2. As a teen, get a decent set of cubs and start acting like you know everything about golf and life
   
3. Leave and go to college, grow a beard and continue acting like you know everything, stop playing
   
4. Come home from college, dump your girlfriend who is pressing marriage, and start playing again
   
5. Get a real job and start understanding you don’t know everything, continue playing golf and actually start scoring well
   
6. Meet a great girl and try to get her into the game, get married, have kids, post on WRX “how can I play now that I have kids?”
   
7. Play in a scramble and lie about your score and have a guy throw ketchup packets at you
   
8. Take the pro shop gift certificate from the tournament you lied about and buy a new driver
   
9. Suddenly you start mishitting big pulls, go see an instructor who makes it even worse
   
10. Become a Tiger fan, but act like you’re not
    
11. Start having marital problems and limit play to once a week
    
12. Develop a terrible infection from the cut inflicted from the one of the ketchup packets that cut your skin
    
13. After it heals, start using moisturizer but don’t share that with other guys. Join a club but never get any better. Start a golf buying spree.
    
14. As you grow in age develop targets that you criticize - such as drive thru cashiers, farmers on large tractors and commercial fishermen.
    
15. Start playing again after you fix your marriage
    
16. Start heavy posting on WRX about the good old days and how you’re quitting the game
    

[bigcountry1219]

Won't be long until XBox golfers outnumber real life golfers... same goes for other sports as well. Really a sad transition in my opinion.

 

A small number of high schools are forming "E-Sports" programs. Really crazy in my opinion.

 

The difference is, E-Sports you can make money doing it, you can make money sitting at home. I am not saying its right or wrong but comparing golf to E-Sports isn't really relevant. I played a lot of the E-sports scene through high school and college, while also playing a lot of golf. The only thing that concerns me is what I said before, you can make money playing games daily compared to paying to play golf.

 

Which brings me to my concern, it is money and time. For younger people you are being forced to deal with college loans, and social lives etc. But college loans anymore are to the point to where I am looking at a brand new driver every month and snapping it over my leg for a piece of paper. That not only limits on what I can do with golf but also limits the time etc being put into golf.

 

Looking at my home course and the courses around us, golf is in serious trouble. The amount of high school kids not playing golf is really starting to show. You know the kids that will continue to play because they love the game, but they are very rare.

 

I don't think it has to do with manufactures though, I think it stems from where the money is going and the time, and its not going to golf for the younger generations.

 

The fact that we even label video games as E-Sports is insulting. And lets be honest, the average joe can't make money playing video games. Just like everything else online, you need to be in the top .1% to make anything.

[marmooskapaul]

IDK...high school golf seems well represented to me. I cringe every time I see one of those school buses at the golf course I'm going too...lol...but seriously high school golf is a great way to get kids involved. Most courses around me have a "home" team that plays matches and practices on that course. Think about that...privately owned course letting kids play for free...or almost free?? Who else does that ??

[mosesgolf]

Whatever is happening to golf overall it doesn't seem to be diminishing the level of talent that's up and coming.

[Bonneville85308]

I cringe every time I see one of those school buses at the golf course I'm going too...lol...

 

Hah...I thought I was the only grump who thought like that. There goes all hopes of getting in 9 holes in less than 3 hours lol.

[PappyVanWinkle53]

My thoughts on people walking away from the game.......more tee times open for me!

[4Putt4Practice]

Those who walk away never intended to commit to the journey.

[Rambler1277]

You either enjoy it or you don't, but it's all about time and money. People (men) start careers later, have kids later etc. You play when you're young, when you get your first job, and when the kids don't need you around all the time. Also, major dependence on how cool your wife is about you going out regularly and spending a few hundred bucks a month on it.

 

I'm playing more than ever (48), have multiple sets of clubs and really don't shoot much better on average. If anything makes me want to quit it's that. I'll shoot +2 on the front, +13 on the back. Maddening.

[4Putt4Practice]

You either enjoy it or you don't, but it's all about time and money. People (men) start careers later, have kids later etc. You play when you're young, when you get your first job, and when the kids don't need you around all the time. Also, major dependence on how cool your wife is about you going out regularly and spending a few hundred bucks a month on it.

 

I'm playing more than ever (48), have multiple sets of clubs and really don't shoot much better on average. If anything makes me want to quit it's that. I'll shoot +2 on the front, +13 on the back. Maddening.

 

The trick is to avoid the moving windmill on #18 to not go +13.