The 2018 Ryder Cup at Le Golf National (MERGED)

[Mcgeeno]

It won't change because this set-up is in the interests of the equipment manufacturers.....which is why the Tour and the Hoop-la exists in the first place.

 

Well a good boss of mine said "if you do what you always do you get what you always get"

 

I guess they will continue to get pounded every two years. I doubt they care enough as a whole to make wide sweeping changes anyways.

 

You ... And everybody else calling for sweeping changes ... realizes the USA won in 2016, right? And the country of "Europe" has a lot of really good golfers?

 

Thats a short sighted view.

 

They won in 16 yes. It was awesome. I loved it.

 

How did the 30 years before that go? I'm seeing 9 out of 12 for Europe after tomorrow? The US has 2 in this millenium...

 

If I told you that you were 2-7 in the last 20 years you would probably think to yourself: "OK ya thats pretty bad maybe there is an issue there?"

 

The first step in fixing a problem is recognizing there is one. The US is under performing at the Ryder Cup. Top to bottom.

[WidespreadPanic]

Something is off with Tiger. Maybe he’s really worn out. He had a long season. He sounded VERY strange in that post round interview, almost like he was slurring. He walked very slow all day and just seemed disinterested. He hit some wedges that were very uncharacteristic of how he’s beeb playing. I don’t know why or what all that means, but it threw me off a little.

[redfirebird08]

Regarding the FedEx Cup, I assume this year is the last time we will see it finish on the Sunday before the Ryder Cup. Now that they will be finishing the FedEx Cup before Labor Day, that will give the guys plenty of rest heading into the Ryder Cup.

 

2019 Tour Championship finishes August 25th and I assume that will be the target date every year. 2020 Ryder Cup starts September 25th. So that would pretty much be a month off for them.

[duffer987]

 

Euros setup the course up perfect. US open type rough and slower greens. The only Americans not afraid to run a putt 2-3 feet by are spite hand Thomas. The rest are playing scared. There are way too many Americans missing fairways with fairway woods and even irons for godsake. To make matters worse they all look gassed. Way too much golf played by them leading up to this event. Terrible lead up. I think a week off would have made a difference. Made them sharper. I’m just spitballing but man

 

The 6 Euro players in the Tour Championship played just as many (I think all the top players had almost identical scheds from the PGA to the Ryder Cup) events as the US Players and they might have added in a quick trip home across the pond in between as well.

[MattyO1984]

The most interesting thing I head all day was that prior to this week, the US team had played 8 competitive rounds over Le Golf National. The European team had played 230 something. That is a huge difference! Doesn't surprise me that the stand out player from the US team has been Justin Thomas. Credit to him, as a rookie, for having enough up there to come over at play the French Open earlier in the year.

[new2g0lf]

Something is off with Tiger. Maybe he's really worn out. He had a long season. He sounded VERY strange in that post round interview, almost like he was slurring. He walked very slow all day and just seemed disinterested. He hit some wedges that were very uncharacteristic of how he's beeb playing. I don't know why or what all that means, but it threw me off a little.

 

He sounded sick and annoyed. You can tell from the interview he's not a fan of match play or pairings for the reasons he gives. Let's see how he does 1 on 1.

[Mcgeeno]

Regarding the FedEx Cup, I assume this year is the last time we will see it finish on the Sunday before the Ryder Cup. Now that they will be finishing the FedEx Cup before Labor Day, that will give the guys plenty of rest heading into the Ryder Cup.

 

2019 Tour Championship finishes August 25th and I assume that will be the target date every year. 2020 Ryder Cup starts September 25th. So that would pretty much be a month off for them.

 

I was thinking maybe having 2-3 weeks in the future to get the guys and families together for the Ryder might not pay off year 1...But 5-8-12 years from now those guys are all friends who want to battle with each other, they become closer, they want to play hard and win. They get familiar with all their games, faces get recognizable in the team rooms and you gain comfort.

 

The whole thing seems uncomfortable and contrived for the US side whereas the Euros all want to win for each other and get into it.

[new2g0lf]

Euros setup the course up perfect. US open type rough and slower greens. The only Americans not afraid to run a putt 2-3 feet by are spite hand Thomas. The rest are playing scared. There are way too many Americans missing fairways with fairway woods and even irons for godsake. To make matters worse they all look gassed. Way too much golf played by them leading up to this event. Terrible lead up. I think a week off would have made a difference. Made them sharper. I’m just spitballing but man

 

The 6 Euro players in the Tour Championship played just as many (I think all the top players had almost identical scheds from the PGA to the Ryder Cup) events as the US Players and they might have added in a quick trip home across the pond in between as well.

 

Except most of the Euro's played those courses their entire lives until they were good enough to make it to the PGA Tour and the USA team (except for Reed) has almost zero experience on Euro courses.

[MattyO1984]

Something is off with Tiger. Maybe he's really worn out. He had a long season. He sounded VERY strange in that post round interview, almost like he was slurring. He walked very slow all day and just seemed disinterested. He hit some wedges that were very uncharacteristic of how he's beeb playing. I don't know why or what all that means, but it threw me off a little.

 

He sounded sick and annoyed. You can tell from the interview he's not a fan of match play or pairings for the reasons he gives. Let's see how he does 1 on 1.

 

The way he carried himself all day was, really, very weird. It was like everything he was doing was in slow motion. Couldn't work it out at all. Given the way that he has carried himself all weekend, I wouldn't be surprised if the private jet was heading back to Florida as soon as the closing ceremony is over tomorrow.

[SaltyJohnson]

Something is off with Tiger. Maybe he's really worn out. He had a long season. He sounded VERY strange in that post round interview, almost like he was slurring. He walked very slow all day and just seemed disinterested. He hit some wedges that were very uncharacteristic of how he's beeb playing. I don't know why or what all that means, but it threw me off a little.

 

He sounded sick and annoyed. You can tell from the interview he's not a fan of match play or pairings for the reasons he gives. Let's see how he does 1 on 1.

He has only lost once in the singles. 1997 his debut.

[new2g0lf]

Something is off with Tiger. Maybe he's really worn out. He had a long season. He sounded VERY strange in that post round interview, almost like he was slurring. He walked very slow all day and just seemed disinterested. He hit some wedges that were very uncharacteristic of how he's beeb playing. I don't know why or what all that means, but it threw me off a little.

 

He sounded sick and annoyed. You can tell from the interview he's not a fan of match play or pairings for the reasons he gives. Let's see how he does 1 on 1.

 

The way he carried himself all day was, really, very weird. It was like everything he was doing was in slow motion. Couldn't work it out at all. Given the way that he has carried himself all weekend, I wouldn't be surprised if the private jet was heading back to Florida as soon as the closing ceremony is over tomorrow.

 

He's played a lot of golf the last month and last week had to take it's toll on him and Bubba has been sick so he might have caught what Bubba had.

[duffer987]

Euros setup the course up perfect. US open type rough and slower greens. The only Americans not afraid to run a putt 2-3 feet by are spite hand Thomas. The rest are playing scared. There are way too many Americans missing fairways with fairway woods and even irons for godsake. To make matters worse they all look gassed. Way too much golf played by them leading up to this event. Terrible lead up. I think a week off would have made a difference. Made them sharper. I’m just spitballing but man

 

The 6 Euro players in the Tour Championship played just as many (I think all the top players had almost identical scheds from the PGA to the Ryder Cup) events as the US Players and they might have added in a quick trip home across the pond in between as well.

 

Except most of the Euro's played those courses their entire lives until they were good enough to make it to the PGA Tour and the USA team (except for Reed) has almost zero experience on Euro courses.

Erm what are you on about? I'm talking about the end of the PGA Tour season and who should/shouldn't be tired. Was pointing out 1/2 the European squad played that tiring post PGA Championship slog.

Slow greens, schmow greens.

[Londoner]

In UK/Europe we are brought up on tree lined (by trees I mean ball lost woods) fairways with no bale out either side.

If you always play open courses and are suddenly confronted with that voice in your head saying "dont go right, dont go left !" Its tough to hit straight.

When we complain about rough on our course were always told , " this is not America you know".

It must effect even these guys .

[new2g0lf]

Euros setup the course up perfect. US open type rough and slower greens. The only Americans not afraid to run a putt 2-3 feet by are spite hand Thomas. The rest are playing scared. There are way too many Americans missing fairways with fairway woods and even irons for godsake. To make matters worse they all look gassed. Way too much golf played by them leading up to this event. Terrible lead up. I think a week off would have made a difference. Made them sharper. I’m just spitballing but man

 

The 6 Euro players in the Tour Championship played just as many (I think all the top players had almost identical scheds from the PGA to the Ryder Cup) events as the US Players and they might have added in a quick trip home across the pond in between as well.

 

Except most of the Euro's played those courses their entire lives until they were good enough to make it to the PGA Tour and the USA team (except for Reed) has almost zero experience on Euro courses.

Erm what are you on about? I'm talking about the end of the PGA Tour season and who should/shouldn't be tired. Was pointing out 1/2 the European squad played that tiring post PGA Championship slog.

Slow greens, schmow greens.

 

The post you responded to was discussing the course setup and schedule. I was referring to the course.

[Londoner]

Something is off with Tiger. Maybe he's really worn out. He had a long season. He sounded VERY strange in that post round interview, almost like he was slurring. He walked very slow all day and just seemed disinterested. He hit some wedges that were very uncharacteristic of how he's beeb playing. I don't know why or what all that means, but it threw me off a little.

He appears to be walking with his shoulders hunched.

[Pent08]

When several of the US players were not in form leading up to the event, what do you expect? The best thing the US had going for it was the Reed/Spieth pairing, which apparently Reed crapped all over. Shocker

[Golfer4Life]

Euros setup the course up perfect. US open type rough and slower greens. The only Americans not afraid to run a putt 2-3 feet by are spite hand Thomas. The rest are playing scared. There are way too many Americans missing fairways with fairway woods and even irons for godsake. To make matters worse they all look gassed. Way too much golf played by them leading up to this event. Terrible lead up. I think a week off would have made a difference. Made them sharper. I’m just spitballing but man

 

The 6 Euro players in the Tour Championship played just as many (I think all the top players had almost identical scheds from the PGA to the Ryder Cup) events as the US Players and they might have added in a quick trip home across the pond in between as well.

 

Except most of the Euro's played those courses their entire lives until they were good enough to make it to the PGA Tour and the USA team (except for Reed) has almost zero experience on Euro courses.

 

Perhaps the Americans need to get out more.

[Darth Putter]

Perhaps it's time to acknowledge that the European tour produces the most complete players (and is underrated) and the PGA tour too much rewards 'bomb and gouge' golf to cater to spectators and confuses sponsorship dollars with quality level. Just a thought...

 

Why? Because they are winning on the second day of the Ryder Cup?

 

The PGA Tour clearly produces vastly better talent suited for all venues. Nice try though.

 

This Ryder is showing the lack of adaptation from PGA players to different courses. The moment they lack those 60 yard fairways and mild rough, they struggle big time.

 

Not saying the ET produces the best but PGA courses are pretty much the same during the season. The ET has more variety.

 

Not buying that. This course is much more like a typical US course than a typical EU course. In fact, it reminds me of TPC sawgrass.

 

And the PGA tour courses are definitely not "pretty much the same".

 

Correct, Harbor Town is tighter than any course on the European Tour.

 

This course is just a discount TPC Sawgrass. The US players have also played at places like Riviera, Colonial, Muirfield Village and Firestone. I said it in the other thread, the PGA Tour is every bit as diverse in course offerings as the European Tour.

[OrangeGravy]

Phil vs Molinari on Sunday. LOL The US clearly does not think they have anyone who can beat Molinari, so Phil is picked to be the sacrificial lamb instead of wasting him on someone who can otherwise be beaten.

 

I think it's an ok move. When you need as many points as they do, you need to get as many sure thing wins as possible ( relatively speaking sure thing ). If you feel the chances of Molinari getting beat are really low, why risk one of your players that is playing well? Better to give him Phil. If Phil gets hot and takes him out, it's on, if not no real blood lost.

[MattyO1984]

Paul McGinley made a really interesting point earlier on Sky. The course itself is not any tighter than what the US guys are used to playing on, it is actually that the playing area is much wider. What he meant when he said that is that fans are much further to the sides of the fairways than they would be at a PGA Tour event.

 

Essentially, 5-10 years off every fairway at a US tour event, the galleries will have been walking down the side. So if you miss the fairway by that much you are going to be going into pretty trampled down ground and the chances are you are going to get a half decent lie.

 

At Le Golf National, the crowds are 20-30 yards possibly even more to the side of the fairway so if you are missing the fairway by 5-10 yards, round there you are going into the really heavy stuff. Thought that was a very interesting point raised by him that I haven't heard anyone else mention at all.

[Darth Putter]

Euros setup the course up perfect. US open type rough and slower greens. The only Americans not afraid to run a putt 2-3 feet by are spite hand Thomas. The rest are playing scared. There are way too many Americans missing fairways with fairway woods and even irons for godsake. To make matters worse they all look gassed. Way too much golf played by them leading up to this event. Terrible lead up. I think a week off would have made a difference. Made them sharper. I’m just spitballing but man

 

The 6 Euro players in the Tour Championship played just as many (I think all the top players had almost identical scheds from the PGA to the Ryder Cup) events as the US Players and they might have added in a quick trip home across the pond in between as well.

 

Except most of the Euro's played those courses their entire lives until they were good enough to make it to the PGA Tour and the USA team (except for Reed) has almost zero experience on Euro courses.

 

The American with the most experience on European courses by far, Brooks Koepka, is 1-2.

[MattyO1984]

Phil vs Molinari on Sunday. LOL The US clearly does not think they have anyone who can beat Molinari, so Phil is picked to be the sacrificial lamb instead of wasting him on someone who can otherwise be beaten.

 

I think it's an ok move. When you need as many points as they do, you need to get as many sure thing wins as possible ( relatively speaking sure thing ). If you feel the chances of Molinari getting beat are really low, why risk one of your players that is playing well? Better to give him Phil. If Phil gets hot and takes him out, it's on, if not no real blood lost.

 

That would all be fine if the captains actually knew what order the other team were going out in. Phil was a sacrificial nothing.

[redfirebird08]

Paul McGinley made a really interesting point earlier on Sky. The course itself is not any tighter than what the US guys are used to playing on, it is actually that the playing area is much wider. What he meant when he said that is that fans are much further to the sides of the fairways than they would be at a PGA Tour event.

 

Essentially, 5-10 years off every fairway at a US tour event, the galleries will have been walking down the side. So if you miss the fairway by that much you are going to be going into pretty trampled down ground and the chances are you are going to get a half decent lie.

 

At Le Golf National, the crowds are 20-30 yards possibly even more to the side of the fairway so if you are missing the fairway by 5-10 yards, round there you are going into the really heavy stuff. Thought that was a very interesting point raised by him that I haven't heard anyone else mention at all.

 

Someone else mentioned it on this forum earlier and it's definitely a good point. This course reminds me of Sawgrass with thicker rough. Now Sawgrass is a very difficult course. Imagine anyone showing up to that place for a Ryder Cup with zero practice. That's pretty much what we are seeing here. Justin Thomas was the only guy from the American team to show up for the French Open. Meanwhile the European team has numerous players who have played many tournament rounds on this course.

[Darth Putter]

Regarding the FedEx Cup, I assume this year is the last time we will see it finish on the Sunday before the Ryder Cup. Now that they will be finishing the FedEx Cup before Labor Day, that will give the guys plenty of rest heading into the Ryder Cup.

 

2019 Tour Championship finishes August 25th and I assume that will be the target date every year. 2020 Ryder Cup starts September 25th. So that would pretty much be a month off for them.

 

I was thinking maybe having 2-3 weeks in the future to get the guys and families together for the Ryder might not pay off year 1...But 5-8-12 years from now those guys are all friends who want to battle with each other, they become closer, they want to play hard and win. They get familiar with all their games, faces get recognizable in the team rooms and you gain comfort.

 

The whole thing seems uncomfortable and contrived for the US side whereas the Euros all want to win for each other and get into it.

 

The US team will also be able to travel to Europe earlier and get acclimated to the time difference. I'd be more worried about a rusty American team with a month off. The Euros will play a big event the PGA Wentworth in September, so they may be sharper.

[MattyO1984]

Paul McGinley made a really interesting point earlier on Sky. The course itself is not any tighter than what the US guys are used to playing on, it is actually that the playing area is much wider. What he meant when he said that is that fans are much further to the sides of the fairways than they would be at a PGA Tour event.

 

Essentially, 5-10 years off every fairway at a US tour event, the galleries will have been walking down the side. So if you miss the fairway by that much you are going to be going into pretty trampled down ground and the chances are you are going to get a half decent lie.

 

At Le Golf National, the crowds are 20-30 yards possibly even more to the side of the fairway so if you are missing the fairway by 5-10 yards, round there you are going into the really heavy stuff. Thought that was a very interesting point raised by him that I haven't heard anyone else mention at all.

 

Someone else mentioned it on this forum earlier and it's definitely a good point. This course reminds me of Sawgrass with thicker rough. Now Sawgrass is a very difficult course. Imagine anyone showing up to that place for a Ryder Cup with zero practice. That's pretty much what we are seeing here. Justin Thomas was the only guy from the American team to show up for the French Open. Meanwhile the European team has numerous players who have played many tournament rounds on this course.

 

Ah cool, I haven't been on here the last couple of days so never had the chance to really take that much of a look back. It's no coincidence that Thomas has been the best US player so far. The stat I read earlier was that the US team had played 8 competitive rounds over Le Golf National before this week. The European Team had 230+. If the Ryder Cup was a big picture thing for the US team, that stat wouldn't be as skewed as it is.

[Mcgeeno]

Does Harbor Town have 5.5 inch rough though? A 3 yard intermediate cut before you hit the deep stuff?

 

I like Harbor Town but I don’t think it’s a real comparison to this one...

[redfirebird08]

It's no coincidence that Thomas has been the best US player so far. The stat I read earlier was that the US team had played 8 competitive rounds over Le Golf National before this week. The European Team had 230+. If the Ryder Cup was a big picture thing for the US team, that stat wouldn't be as skewed as it is.

 

Unfortunately from the American perspective I don't think the leaders will learn from that like they should. Even if the course is not a regular tour stop like this one, you can at least have plenty of practice sessions among the team members before the event. I get the sense they have never really done that on the U.S. side of it.

[Darth Putter]

Halved in triples...

 

Who said the RC brings out the best quality golf?

 

With freakin wedgesin their hands...

 

I won a high school match with a triple at the last. I had tree trouble and an unplayable lie but made a twenty footer for a 7. My opponent four putted from eighty feet.

[MattyO1984]

It's no coincidence that Thomas has been the best US player so far. The stat I read earlier was that the US team had played 8 competitive rounds over Le Golf National before this week. The European Team had 230+. If the Ryder Cup was a big picture thing for the US team, that stat wouldn't be as skewed as it is.

 

Unfortunately from the American perspective I don't think the leaders will learn from that like they should. Even if the course is not a regular tour stop like this one, you can at least have plenty of practice sessions among the team members before the event. I get the sense they have never really done that on the U.S. side of it.

 

Maybe it will come up in the next taskforce! Haha.

[duffer987]

Paul McGinley made a really interesting point earlier on Sky. The course itself is not any tighter than what the US guys are used to playing on, it is actually that the playing area is much wider. What he meant when he said that is that fans are much further to the sides of the fairways than they would be at a PGA Tour event.

 

Essentially, 5-10 years off every fairway at a US tour event, the galleries will have been walking down the side. So if you miss the fairway by that much you are going to be going into pretty trampled down ground and the chances are you are going to get a half decent lie.

 

At Le Golf National, the crowds are 20-30 yards possibly even more to the side of the fairway so if you are missing the fairway by 5-10 yards, round there you are going into the really heavy stuff. Thought that was a very interesting point raised by him that I haven't heard anyone else mention at all.

 

Someone else mentioned it on this forum earlier and it's definitely a good point. This course reminds me of Sawgrass with thicker rough. Now Sawgrass is a very difficult course. Imagine anyone showing up to that place for a Ryder Cup with zero practice. That's pretty much what we are seeing here. Justin Thomas was the only guy from the American team to show up for the French Open. Meanwhile the European team has numerous players who have played many tournament rounds on this course.

 

Ah cool, I haven't been on here the last couple of days so never had the chance to really take that much of a look back. It's no coincidence that Thomas has been the best US player so far. The stat I read earlier was that the US team had played 8 competitive rounds over Le Golf National before this week. The European Team had 230+. If the Ryder Cup was a big picture thing for the US team, that stat wouldn't be as skewed as it is.

So Torrey Pines or Hawaii then? ;)

Seriously though, with more European players coming to the States for big events, there are fewer and fewer places they could go that would give them a home field advantage from a course knowledge POV.

Except for the Tournament of Champions or some of the West Coast swing, as the Euro players typically give it a miss for Dubai/Quatar tournies.