Wie shoots 84 at KPMG states she might be done

[Titleist_PT23]

> @JaNelson38 said:

> Wouldn't shock me if Michelle Wie never plays another professional round of golf again.

She'll probably prove me wrong but I think that or the ceremonial victory lap through the majors and a few tournaments is most likely.

[legitimategolf]

> @agolf1 said:

> > @JaNelson38 said:

> > Wouldn't shock me if Michelle Wie never plays another professional round of golf again.

> She'll probably prove me wrong but I think that or the ceremonial victory lap through the majors and a few tournaments is most likely.

 

I also believe she will rally for at least one last go round. Golf is too important to her and she does not seem emotionally ready to to move on. Her parents just need to hide the clubs until her hand/wrist are well and truly healed.

[buckeyefl]

> @Shilgy said:

> > @GoGoErky said:

> > > @Shilgy said:

> > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > @"Chief Illiniwek" said:

> > > > > I'm going to strongly disagree, and actually probably with even some of my own statements. Yes Wie had potential to be the best ever, but it was MORE than just potential. At 14, she already HAD more raw talent and skill than most of the LPGA. She didn't look like maybe she'd develop into a big time golf talent. She already WAS! She was playing PGA tour events and holding her own! Does that register with you guys?!? A 14 year old girl barely missing the cut?!? This isn't prime Annika giving it a try. This isn't Lincicome with her length playing what was not much more than a web.com event at the Barbasol. This is a 14 year old girl hanging with the big boys at a decent PGA tour event. That's not potential which is a word tossed at Wie. She was there already. It just didn't last, or I truly think we'd be talking about one of the best ever, whether she'd learned to win at every level or not. Do any of you think prime Lydia or prime Inbee could've showed up at the Sony Open and beaten nearly half the field?

> > > >

> > > > Instead of playing some pga events and barely missing the cut she could have been playing amateur tournaments, going to college and learning the game and potentially dominating then go pro and be a force on lpga...or skip the amateur events and college and instead of playing pga events go right to the lpga and left that talent and skill win on lpga like Lydia was doing

> > > The LPGA has an age restriction on membership. It's not like she played a ton of pro events. And living in Hawaii did not help with travel costs. The family did what they thought best at the time. Did it really work out? Probably not.

> > >

> > > It's funny, in hindsight we look back and think she should have "learned how to win". But where? In Hawaii where she win the adult ladies amateur at she 13? She also win the USGA Publinks-another adult event at she 13. If she would have kept playing those events, and winning, posts would be saying she was learning nothing and proving nothing beating up on lesser players.

> > >

> > > As another post mentioned sometimes it just doesn't work out. Life and injuries can get in the way. Right now she's like Bryce Harper. He was on the cover of SI at 16 as the future of baseball. And he's been good, like Wie, but not special. The NBA draft is littered with #1 picks that didn't reach the heights expected. Most times it is just the simple fact that some players peak earlier than others. So what appears to be high potential is actually there players peak.

> > >

> > > Lastly the Nike contract. Professional athletes get paid endorsement money based on eyeballs, not wins. Even today if you go to an lpga event that Wie is playing in she will have the biggest gallery. And in her early days it was Tiger-esque the size of her galleries compared to other players. Call it unfair if you want but some players have "it" and others that may be better players don't.

> >

> > Like Lydia as an amateur she could have played lpga events as an amateur. It’s great that she got to play pga events and try to showcase her talent but I don’t think that helped her in any way. Her parents mismanaged her career. It wasn’t until about 4 years after she turned pro that she made her lpga debut.

>

> She did play some pro events, including majors, and did well. She is also getting slammed for playing said pro events and not beating up on amateurs and "learning how to win".

> I do not know the different financial status of the two families. Did Ko have assistance from the New Zealand golf association? I don't believe Wie did. It's certainly not cheap to travel to these events with no payoff.

 

Their financial status afforded them to travel to an awful lot of mainland events and to pay for the one of the two highest paid instructors of the time. It's not complicated, mommy and daddy saw fame and dollar signs and the child was catered to and led to believe their ridiculous opinions of how good she was and who she could compete with.

[legitimategolf]

I'm willing to compromise here. I'll concede that Michelle was the greatest pr*teen LPGA major championship golfer of all time (Lucy Li #2), and the greatest female teen PGA Tour player of all time. (Not the greatest female PGA Tour player though, still the one and only Babe Didrikson Zaharias.)

 

I still maintain however, that the potential to dominate was an illusion, and that her achievements on the LPGA are more or less on par with her ability.

 

(the word pr*teen being censored by Golfwrx says more about the censor than anything else IMO)

[Shilgy]

> @buckeyefl said:

> > @Shilgy said:

> > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > @Shilgy said:

> > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > @"Chief Illiniwek" said:

> > > > > > I'm going to strongly disagree, and actually probably with even some of my own statements. Yes Wie had potential to be the best ever, but it was MORE than just potential. At 14, she already HAD more raw talent and skill than most of the LPGA. She didn't look like maybe she'd develop into a big time golf talent. She already WAS! She was playing PGA tour events and holding her own! Does that register with you guys?!? A 14 year old girl barely missing the cut?!? This isn't prime Annika giving it a try. This isn't Lincicome with her length playing what was not much more than a web.com event at the Barbasol. This is a 14 year old girl hanging with the big boys at a decent PGA tour event. That's not potential which is a word tossed at Wie. She was there already. It just didn't last, or I truly think we'd be talking about one of the best ever, whether she'd learned to win at every level or not. Do any of you think prime Lydia or prime Inbee could've showed up at the Sony Open and beaten nearly half the field?

> > > > >

> > > > > Instead of playing some pga events and barely missing the cut she could have been playing amateur tournaments, going to college and learning the game and potentially dominating then go pro and be a force on lpga...or skip the amateur events and college and instead of playing pga events go right to the lpga and left that talent and skill win on lpga like Lydia was doing

> > > > The LPGA has an age restriction on membership. It's not like she played a ton of pro events. And living in Hawaii did not help with travel costs. The family did what they thought best at the time. Did it really work out? Probably not.

> > > >

> > > > It's funny, in hindsight we look back and think she should have "learned how to win". But where? In Hawaii where she win the adult ladies amateur at she 13? She also win the USGA Publinks-another adult event at she 13. If she would have kept playing those events, and winning, posts would be saying she was learning nothing and proving nothing beating up on lesser players.

> > > >

> > > > As another post mentioned sometimes it just doesn't work out. Life and injuries can get in the way. Right now she's like Bryce Harper. He was on the cover of SI at 16 as the future of baseball. And he's been good, like Wie, but not special. The NBA draft is littered with #1 picks that didn't reach the heights expected. Most times it is just the simple fact that some players peak earlier than others. So what appears to be high potential is actually there players peak.

> > > >

> > > > Lastly the Nike contract. Professional athletes get paid endorsement money based on eyeballs, not wins. Even today if you go to an lpga event that Wie is playing in she will have the biggest gallery. And in her early days it was Tiger-esque the size of her galleries compared to other players. Call it unfair if you want but some players have "it" and others that may be better players don't.

> > >

> > > Like Lydia as an amateur she could have played lpga events as an amateur. It’s great that she got to play pga events and try to showcase her talent but I don’t think that helped her in any way. Her parents mismanaged her career. It wasn’t until about 4 years after she turned pro that she made her lpga debut.

> >

> > She did play some pro events, including majors, and did well. She is also getting slammed for playing said pro events and not beating up on amateurs and "learning how to win".

> > I do not know the different financial status of the two families. Did Ko have assistance from the New Zealand golf association? I don't believe Wie did. It's certainly not cheap to travel to these events with no payoff.

>

> Their financial status afforded them to travel to an awful lot of mainland events and to pay for the one of the two highest paid instructors of the time. It's not complicated, mommy and daddy saw fame and dollar signs and the child was catered to and led to believe their ridiculous opinions of how good she was and who she could compete with.

 

You really think they were paying the normal market rate for lessons with Leadbetter?

And you may believe they were "ridiculous opinions" but she competed quite well.

[buckeyefl]

> @Shilgy said:

> > @buckeyefl said:

> > > @Shilgy said:

> > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > @Shilgy said:

> > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > @"Chief Illiniwek" said:

> > > > > > > I'm going to strongly disagree, and actually probably with even some of my own statements. Yes Wie had potential to be the best ever, but it was MORE than just potential. At 14, she already HAD more raw talent and skill than most of the LPGA. She didn't look like maybe she'd develop into a big time golf talent. She already WAS! She was playing PGA tour events and holding her own! Does that register with you guys?!? A 14 year old girl barely missing the cut?!? This isn't prime Annika giving it a try. This isn't Lincicome with her length playing what was not much more than a web.com event at the Barbasol. This is a 14 year old girl hanging with the big boys at a decent PGA tour event. That's not potential which is a word tossed at Wie. She was there already. It just didn't last, or I truly think we'd be talking about one of the best ever, whether she'd learned to win at every level or not. Do any of you think prime Lydia or prime Inbee could've showed up at the Sony Open and beaten nearly half the field?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Instead of playing some pga events and barely missing the cut she could have been playing amateur tournaments, going to college and learning the game and potentially dominating then go pro and be a force on lpga...or skip the amateur events and college and instead of playing pga events go right to the lpga and left that talent and skill win on lpga like Lydia was doing

> > > > > The LPGA has an age restriction on membership. It's not like she played a ton of pro events. And living in Hawaii did not help with travel costs. The family did what they thought best at the time. Did it really work out? Probably not.

> > > > >

> > > > > It's funny, in hindsight we look back and think she should have "learned how to win". But where? In Hawaii where she win the adult ladies amateur at she 13? She also win the USGA Publinks-another adult event at she 13. If she would have kept playing those events, and winning, posts would be saying she was learning nothing and proving nothing beating up on lesser players.

> > > > >

> > > > > As another post mentioned sometimes it just doesn't work out. Life and injuries can get in the way. Right now she's like Bryce Harper. He was on the cover of SI at 16 as the future of baseball. And he's been good, like Wie, but not special. The NBA draft is littered with #1 picks that didn't reach the heights expected. Most times it is just the simple fact that some players peak earlier than others. So what appears to be high potential is actually there players peak.

> > > > >

> > > > > Lastly the Nike contract. Professional athletes get paid endorsement money based on eyeballs, not wins. Even today if you go to an lpga event that Wie is playing in she will have the biggest gallery. And in her early days it was Tiger-esque the size of her galleries compared to other players. Call it unfair if you want but some players have "it" and others that may be better players don't.

> > > >

> > > > Like Lydia as an amateur she could have played lpga events as an amateur. It’s great that she got to play pga events and try to showcase her talent but I don’t think that helped her in any way. Her parents mismanaged her career. It wasn’t until about 4 years after she turned pro that she made her lpga debut.

> > >

> > > She did play some pro events, including majors, and did well. She is also getting slammed for playing said pro events and not beating up on amateurs and "learning how to win".

> > > I do not know the different financial status of the two families. Did Ko have assistance from the New Zealand golf association? I don't believe Wie did. It's certainly not cheap to travel to these events with no payoff.

> >

> > Their financial status afforded them to travel to an awful lot of mainland events and to pay for the one of the two highest paid instructors of the time. It's not complicated, mommy and daddy saw fame and dollar signs and the child was catered to and led to believe their ridiculous opinions of how good she was and who she could compete with.

>

> You really think they were paying the normal market rate for lessons with Leadbetter?

> And you may believe they were "ridiculous opinions" but she competed quite well.

 

Did she? How many victories did the child have as her parents played their games. As far as her and her instruction/ trainers/ parents, I was on the inside in that time period and am not speaking from reading fluff pieces or watching Golf Channel. Her parents were spending plenty of money and their thirst for fame and money cost their child's potential and physically hurt her for the rest of her career. The mental scar tissue she developed from not winning and the parents antics hau t her to this day.

 

They failed miserably but it's not a surprise given the culture. Maybe someday the truth will come out after a few of these female Korean players end it all because of the environment they are forced to live under.

[Shilgy]

> @buckeyefl said:

> > @Shilgy said:

> > > @buckeyefl said:

> > > > @Shilgy said:

> > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > @Shilgy said:

> > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > @"Chief Illiniwek" said:

> > > > > > > > I'm going to strongly disagree, and actually probably with even some of my own statements. Yes Wie had potential to be the best ever, but it was MORE than just potential. At 14, she already HAD more raw talent and skill than most of the LPGA. She didn't look like maybe she'd develop into a big time golf talent. She already WAS! She was playing PGA tour events and holding her own! Does that register with you guys?!? A 14 year old girl barely missing the cut?!? This isn't prime Annika giving it a try. This isn't Lincicome with her length playing what was not much more than a web.com event at the Barbasol. This is a 14 year old girl hanging with the big boys at a decent PGA tour event. That's not potential which is a word tossed at Wie. She was there already. It just didn't last, or I truly think we'd be talking about one of the best ever, whether she'd learned to win at every level or not. Do any of you think prime Lydia or prime Inbee could've showed up at the Sony Open and beaten nearly half the field?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Instead of playing some pga events and barely missing the cut she could have been playing amateur tournaments, going to college and learning the game and potentially dominating then go pro and be a force on lpga...or skip the amateur events and college and instead of playing pga events go right to the lpga and left that talent and skill win on lpga like Lydia was doing

> > > > > > The LPGA has an age restriction on membership. It's not like she played a ton of pro events. And living in Hawaii did not help with travel costs. The family did what they thought best at the time. Did it really work out? Probably not.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > It's funny, in hindsight we look back and think she should have "learned how to win". But where? In Hawaii where she win the adult ladies amateur at she 13? She also win the USGA Publinks-another adult event at she 13. If she would have kept playing those events, and winning, posts would be saying she was learning nothing and proving nothing beating up on lesser players.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > As another post mentioned sometimes it just doesn't work out. Life and injuries can get in the way. Right now she's like Bryce Harper. He was on the cover of SI at 16 as the future of baseball. And he's been good, like Wie, but not special. The NBA draft is littered with #1 picks that didn't reach the heights expected. Most times it is just the simple fact that some players peak earlier than others. So what appears to be high potential is actually there players peak.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Lastly the Nike contract. Professional athletes get paid endorsement money based on eyeballs, not wins. Even today if you go to an lpga event that Wie is playing in she will have the biggest gallery. And in her early days it was Tiger-esque the size of her galleries compared to other players. Call it unfair if you want but some players have "it" and others that may be better players don't.

> > > > >

> > > > > Like Lydia as an amateur she could have played lpga events as an amateur. It’s great that she got to play pga events and try to showcase her talent but I don’t think that helped her in any way. Her parents mismanaged her career. It wasn’t until about 4 years after she turned pro that she made her lpga debut.

> > > >

> > > > She did play some pro events, including majors, and did well. She is also getting slammed for playing said pro events and not beating up on amateurs and "learning how to win".

> > > > I do not know the different financial status of the two families. Did Ko have assistance from the New Zealand golf association? I don't believe Wie did. It's certainly not cheap to travel to these events with no payoff.

> > >

> > > Their financial status afforded them to travel to an awful lot of mainland events and to pay for the one of the two highest paid instructors of the time. It's not complicated, mommy and daddy saw fame and dollar signs and the child was catered to and led to believe their ridiculous opinions of how good she was and who she could compete with.

> >

> > You really think they were paying the normal market rate for lessons with Leadbetter?

> > And you may believe they were "ridiculous opinions" but she competed quite well.

>

> Did she? How many victories did the child have as her parents played their games. As far as her and her instruction/ trainers/ parents, I was on the inside in that time period and am not speaking from reading fluff pieces or watching Golf Channel. Her parents were spending plenty of money and their thirst for fame and money cost their child's potential and physically hurt her for the rest of her career. **The mental scar tissue she developed from not winning and the parents antics hau t her to this day**.

>

> They failed miserably but it's not a surprise given the culture. Maybe someday the truth will come out after a few of these female Korean players end it all because of the environment they are forced to live under.

 

Fine-she paid full boat to Lead and the parents messed up.

 

How much did she need to win to not be now messed up? How many LPGA wins would she need to have at this point for you to feel the parents did fine in that regard? She won adult events in Hawaii and the USGA Publinks at the age of what again? 13? Why would you not seek out higher competition? Plenty of young boys and girls dominated AJGA events. Did Morgan Pressel have a better career than Wie? Grace Park is second alltime on the AJGA win list and had a career very similar to Wie. Kellee Booth was #1 and basically had no pro career.

 

That said we have cultural differences when it comes to parenting compared to the Korean model. I agree with you that the parents are overbearing and have long been involved with the life of a young lady that should have been free of their meddling years ago.

[legitimategolf]

> @buckeyefl said:

> They failed miserably but it's not a surprise given the culture. Maybe someday the truth will come out after a few of these female Korean players end it all because of the environment they are forced to live under.

 

Yep, it's a real travesty what some of these hypothetical Korean parents might will have had done to their kids, in the future and stuff. Somebody ought to be arrested, like, pre-emptively.

[Ignatius Reilly]

Michelle's parents: Way too involved.

Lydia's parents: Way too involved.

Brooke's parents: Way too pushy....

 

I don't know about the rest of you, but as a parent, I KNOW that I would do everything possible to help my kids succeed. I'd hire the best coaches (Leadbetter had a stellar resume, reputation and clientele amongst the best in the world, if not WRX). I'd put them where they had the best chance to succeed, the highest levels of competition and challenge.

 

And, as a parent and a neophyte, I'd make some mistakes.

 

But here's the real question: When do the parents of the best in the world (young Lydia, Michelle, Brooke) go from being the people that got them to the very top, and change into huge liabilities?

 

Honest question, @buckeyefl do you have kids?

[wkuo3]

Not only did she go through injury , but her will to win has disappeared.

The top level golf is not all mechanics. What separate a champion from the runner up is the mind set. All of the professionals have the tools for the trade in their bag and know how to use them.

Same as all boxers know how to throw a punch, only the one wants to win will be standing.

She's financially secured, so maybe it's time to take a break away from competition golf. Who knows, she could decide to come back in when she is ready.

Golf from childhood had punished her body, life is not all competition golf. Sorenstam and Ochoa had made wise decision to leave more time for the other part of their life.

[GoGoErky]

> @"Ignatius Reilly" said:

> Michelle's parents: Way too involved.

> Lydia's parents: Way too involved.

> Brooke's parents: Way too pushy....

>

> I don't know about the rest of you, but as a parent, I KNOW that I would do everything possible to help my kids succeed. I'd hire the best coaches (Leadbetter had a stellar resume, reputation and clientele amongst the best in the world, if not WRX). I'd put them where they had the best chance to succeed, the highest levels of competition and challenge.

>

> And, as a parent and a neophyte, I'd make some mistakes.

>

> But here's the real question: When do the parents of the best in the world (young Lydia, Michelle, Brooke) go from being the people that got them to the very top, and change into huge liabilities?

>

> Honest question, @buckeyefl do you have kids?

 

Pga tour probably is out of reach for most 13-16 year olds. Going to route of lpga to start and if dominating the tour there then go to the pga tour.

 

As for liabilities it’s when the parents priorities, dreams, wants overshadow the childs

[buckeyefl]

> @"Ignatius Reilly" said:

> Michelle's parents: Way too involved.

> Lydia's parents: Way too involved.

> Brooke's parents: Way too pushy....

>

> I don't know about the rest of you, but as a parent, I KNOW that I would do everything possible to help my kids succeed. I'd hire the best coaches (Leadbetter had a stellar resume, reputation and clientele amongst the best in the world, if not WRX). I'd put them where they had the best chance to succeed, the highest levels of competition and challenge.

>

> And, as a parent and a neophyte, I'd make some mistakes.

>

> But here's the real question: When do the parents of the best in the world (young Lydia, Michelle, Brooke) go from being the people that got them to the very top, and change into huge liabilities?

>

> Honest question, @buckeyefl do you have kids?

 

Not that it's relevant but I do.

To answer your other question, sometimes less is more. What MW parents have done isn't a mistake or not knowing how to parent. It's built around arrogance, greed, irrational view of your child's ability and ego.

 

You would enjoy a talk with her team, minus mom and dad, back in the day. It would be quite revealing and you would see that magical line. David had commented openly at times.