Lets take a closer look at distance off the Tee....

Titleist99 · November 9, 2019

> @LICC said:

> > @GoGoErky said:

> > > @LICC said:

> > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > @butterysnaphook said:

> > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @mahonie said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Oh dear! That’s moving towards the game I call ‘American Golf’...it’s not golf but it seems that’s where the ‘fans’ of the modern game are pushing it. Now I’ve realised that you are not actually debating about the game I’m familiar with I’ll leave you to your long drive games and get on with the proper game...cheers ?

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > So wait, you move from being a fitness can increase distance is BS, to that's American golf and doesn't matter, then to those guys are not real golfers so its meaningless type stance? What are you smoking? Those guys prove a point, they are the extreme end of golfers who are trying to get distance. In order to compete at the highest level every single one of those guys have to push their bodies to the limit and beyond. They have to train to be stronger in ways that do several things, help them be faster, more accurate and prevent injury. All of those guys no doubt have innate talent or a head start with swing speed via sports they played growing up or what have you, but most if not all need to focus a great deal on fitness in order to achieve what they achieve.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Each one of us has a limit that we can get to just by swinging a club and practicing swinging fast. Doing so trains your body and muscles to sync everything together and also fire as fast as possible. Add swing efficiency and technique improvements to that and you can get a long ways. Some are going to get all the speed they care to have by doing this, I think Bubba Watson is a good example. Doesn't really work out to my knowledge but swings plenty fast. If he felt he needed to, he very well could add some speed via golf specific fitness. Explosive workouts are big helpers, overspeed training can be a big help, lifting heavy can be a big help. It has all been proven.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > This is all easy to see. I would ask you deniers to google it, open your eyes and understand the simple truth that you can indeed add significant speed and therefore distance via various forms of fitness regimens. It is a more common practice today and their is better understanding of what exercises work vs Jacks day for instance. It is one of the many reasons more and more players today are very long and it is a significant one at that.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Making a bunch of conclusory statements and speculations doesn’t make them any less ridiculous.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Read the studies. There are plenty more if you want them. I know you think you are incapable of being wrong but you are 100% incorrect. Science has proved you wrong 5+ times.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Phil Mickelson

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Jerry Kelly

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > David Duval

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > All stated in interviews that they gained distance due to fitness training and more swing speed. Duval took it to the extreme though.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > DL3 who stated in past interviews he needed to hit the gym and change his routine to keep up with the young guys on tour. Iirc it was on feherty where told a story of during a delay he saw the young guy us going to work out an instead of going to get lunch he went and got his gym clothes an hit the gym.

> > > > >

> > > > > DL3 is hitting it 10 yards shorter than he did 10 years ago and 6 yards shorter than 5 years ago

> > > >

> > > > DL3 is also 10 years older and 5 years older than what you are saying. But when he was playing in that time span he knew he needed to be in the gym to even be able to keep up. You continue to provide zero facts or studies for your point of view but that is just consistent with every thread you are in where you are proven wrong.

> > > > Like the scientific examples already provided

> > >

> > > I’m providing the best facts possible- the actual distances. And my point on DL is that his distances don’t support the argument that fitness training gave him greater length. It may have helped his game in other ways, but not added distance.

> >

> > Your facts don’t equal the truth. Facts have already been given that prove you wrong and you keep using your opinion as fact. Distances on tour have multiple variables to include limited to a couple holes each tourney and club choice not factored in or course conditions.

> >

> > In the meantime let’s see your scientific data that dispute ls the data given in the cited studies.

>

> Name three Tour players who increased distance after starting a fitness regimen they weren’t doing before. You can’t.

Phil Mickelson

Jerry Kelly

David Duval

Scott Mccarron

Titleist99 · November 9, 2019

> @oikos1 said:

> I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

Titleist99 · November 9, 2019

Swing speed is the holy grail for touring pros, it enables them to remain competitive while maxing out their careers. Training programs help these players make the golf swing very efficient......efficiency is the key to extra distance but you can't achieve efficiency without a training program.....That is one of the main reason why these guys are hitting it further now than the beginning of their careers......Just ask Phil Mickelson, he gained distance,, he just don't know where his golf ball is going..

LICC · November 9, 2019

> @Titleist99 said:

> > @LICC said:

> > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > @butterysnaphook said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > @mahonie said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh dear! That’s moving towards the game I call ‘American Golf’...it’s not golf but it seems that’s where the ‘fans’ of the modern game are pushing it. Now I’ve realised that you are not actually debating about the game I’m familiar with I’ll leave you to your long drive games and get on with the proper game...cheers ?

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > So wait, you move from being a fitness can increase distance is BS, to that's American golf and doesn't matter, then to those guys are not real golfers so its meaningless type stance? What are you smoking? Those guys prove a point, they are the extreme end of golfers who are trying to get distance. In order to compete at the highest level every single one of those guys have to push their bodies to the limit and beyond. They have to train to be stronger in ways that do several things, help them be faster, more accurate and prevent injury. All of those guys no doubt have innate talent or a head start with swing speed via sports they played growing up or what have you, but most if not all need to focus a great deal on fitness in order to achieve what they achieve.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Each one of us has a limit that we can get to just by swinging a club and practicing swinging fast. Doing so trains your body and muscles to sync everything together and also fire as fast as possible. Add swing efficiency and technique improvements to that and you can get a long ways. Some are going to get all the speed they care to have by doing this, I think Bubba Watson is a good example. Doesn't really work out to my knowledge but swings plenty fast. If he felt he needed to, he very well could add some speed via golf specific fitness. Explosive workouts are big helpers, overspeed training can be a big help, lifting heavy can be a big help. It has all been proven.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > This is all easy to see. I would ask you deniers to google it, open your eyes and understand the simple truth that you can indeed add significant speed and therefore distance via various forms of fitness regimens. It is a more common practice today and their is better understanding of what exercises work vs Jacks day for instance. It is one of the many reasons more and more players today are very long and it is a significant one at that.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Making a bunch of conclusory statements and speculations doesn’t make them any less ridiculous.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Read the studies. There are plenty more if you want them. I know you think you are incapable of being wrong but you are 100% incorrect. Science has proved you wrong 5+ times.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Phil Mickelson

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Jerry Kelly

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > David Duval

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > All stated in interviews that they gained distance due to fitness training and more swing speed. Duval took it to the extreme though.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > DL3 who stated in past interviews he needed to hit the gym and change his routine to keep up with the young guys on tour. Iirc it was on feherty where told a story of during a delay he saw the young guy us going to work out an instead of going to get lunch he went and got his gym clothes an hit the gym.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > DL3 is hitting it 10 yards shorter than he did 10 years ago and 6 yards shorter than 5 years ago

> > > > >

> > > > > DL3 is also 10 years older and 5 years older than what you are saying. But when he was playing in that time span he knew he needed to be in the gym to even be able to keep up. You continue to provide zero facts or studies for your point of view but that is just consistent with every thread you are in where you are proven wrong.

> > > > > Like the scientific examples already provided

> > > >

> > > > I’m providing the best facts possible- the actual distances. And my point on DL is that his distances don’t support the argument that fitness training gave him greater length. It may have helped his game in other ways, but not added distance.

> > >

> > > Your facts don’t equal the truth. Facts have already been given that prove you wrong and you keep using your opinion as fact. Distances on tour have multiple variables to include limited to a couple holes each tourney and club choice not factored in or course conditions.

> > >

> > > In the meantime let’s see your scientific data that dispute ls the data given in the cited studies.

> >

> > Name three Tour players who increased distance after starting a fitness regimen they weren’t doing before. You can’t.

>

> Phil Mickelson

>

> Jerry Kelly

>

> David Duval

>

> Scott Mccarron

It’s like talking to a wall. Mickelson- swing changes. Kelly- did not increase distance. Duval- admitted he doesn’t know if working out helped and his game fell apart right after. McCarron- his distance went up after recovering from injuries.

bladehunter · November 9, 2019

> @clevited said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @clevited said:

> > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > >

> > >

> > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> >

> > Using gorillas as an example isn’t really helping. When anyone here says distance they mean relative to accuracy. Those guys don’t hit a 150 yard runway more than once every 15 swings. So yes. To your point. If you want to swing off balance and never hit it in play , you can add speed to a already fast guy. But what are yo I going to use it for ?

>

> What are you smoking? They are simply examples that prove distance can be increased (accurate or not, comon with this accuracy twist, seriously adding that to this already rediculous tangent) through fitness.

>

> Nobody is saying you will add 40 mph through it alone. I already have given myself as some proof of the merits of one type of fitness regimen, the super speed type of training. There is undeniable information out there yet you and a couple of others are closing your eyes to it. My God, I have never seen such nativity. I mean, the proof is out there, look for it and teach yourself a new fact. Apparently those of us trying to show you are not reliable sources so I suggest you open your minds to learning something new and look it up.

Well. I better get to the gym then. I haven’t touched a weight since 1998. ( truth) and was clocked yesterday at 117 on trackman while sitting in on a friends driver fitting with ping. , admittedly on a high from wrapping up some home / personal struggles. From what you’re saying I can expect to see 124-130 with ease .... ? Maybe so. But I doubt it , at least doing it with any control. 3-4 mph maybe.

At any rate the long drive guys analogy is bunk. That’s not golf. Not even close to the discussion we’re having.

bladehunter · November 9, 2019

> @Titleist99 said:

> > @LICC said:

> > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > @butterysnaphook said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > @mahonie said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh dear! That’s moving towards the game I call ‘American Golf’...it’s not golf but it seems that’s where the ‘fans’ of the modern game are pushing it. Now I’ve realised that you are not actually debating about the game I’m familiar with I’ll leave you to your long drive games and get on with the proper game...cheers ?

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > So wait, you move from being a fitness can increase distance is BS, to that's American golf and doesn't matter, then to those guys are not real golfers so its meaningless type stance? What are you smoking? Those guys prove a point, they are the extreme end of golfers who are trying to get distance. In order to compete at the highest level every single one of those guys have to push their bodies to the limit and beyond. They have to train to be stronger in ways that do several things, help them be faster, more accurate and prevent injury. All of those guys no doubt have innate talent or a head start with swing speed via sports they played growing up or what have you, but most if not all need to focus a great deal on fitness in order to achieve what they achieve.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Each one of us has a limit that we can get to just by swinging a club and practicing swinging fast. Doing so trains your body and muscles to sync everything together and also fire as fast as possible. Add swing efficiency and technique improvements to that and you can get a long ways. Some are going to get all the speed they care to have by doing this, I think Bubba Watson is a good example. Doesn't really work out to my knowledge but swings plenty fast. If he felt he needed to, he very well could add some speed via golf specific fitness. Explosive workouts are big helpers, overspeed training can be a big help, lifting heavy can be a big help. It has all been proven.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > This is all easy to see. I would ask you deniers to google it, open your eyes and understand the simple truth that you can indeed add significant speed and therefore distance via various forms of fitness regimens. It is a more common practice today and their is better understanding of what exercises work vs Jacks day for instance. It is one of the many reasons more and more players today are very long and it is a significant one at that.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Making a bunch of conclusory statements and speculations doesn’t make them any less ridiculous.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Read the studies. There are plenty more if you want them. I know you think you are incapable of being wrong but you are 100% incorrect. Science has proved you wrong 5+ times.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Phil Mickelson

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Jerry Kelly

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > David Duval

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > All stated in interviews that they gained distance due to fitness training and more swing speed. Duval took it to the extreme though.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > DL3 who stated in past interviews he needed to hit the gym and change his routine to keep up with the young guys on tour. Iirc it was on feherty where told a story of during a delay he saw the young guy us going to work out an instead of going to get lunch he went and got his gym clothes an hit the gym.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > DL3 is hitting it 10 yards shorter than he did 10 years ago and 6 yards shorter than 5 years ago

> > > > >

> > > > > DL3 is also 10 years older and 5 years older than what you are saying. But when he was playing in that time span he knew he needed to be in the gym to even be able to keep up. You continue to provide zero facts or studies for your point of view but that is just consistent with every thread you are in where you are proven wrong.

> > > > > Like the scientific examples already provided

> > > >

> > > > I’m providing the best facts possible- the actual distances. And my point on DL is that his distances don’t support the argument that fitness training gave him greater length. It may have helped his game in other ways, but not added distance.

> > >

> > > Your facts don’t equal the truth. Facts have already been given that prove you wrong and you keep using your opinion as fact. Distances on tour have multiple variables to include limited to a couple holes each tourney and club choice not factored in or course conditions.

> > >

> > > In the meantime let’s see your scientific data that dispute ls the data given in the cited studies.

> >

> > Name three Tour players who increased distance after starting a fitness regimen they weren’t > @Titleist99 said:

> > @oikos1 said:

> > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

>

> No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

> @Titleist99 said:

> > @oikos1 said:

> > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

>

> No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

You want someone popped for disagreeing with you ? Wow. As if you aren’t saying the same thing over and over. That’s the last 27 pages. EVERYONE saying the same thing over and over. Your poop smells just like everyone else’s. Come on.

Why I clicked back in here I don’t know. Turrible downer of a click it is.

clevited · November 9, 2019

> @bladehunter said:

> > @clevited said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > >

> > > Using gorillas as an example isn’t really helping. When anyone here says distance they mean relative to accuracy. Those guys don’t hit a 150 yard runway more than once every 15 swings. So yes. To your point. If you want to swing off balance and never hit it in play , you can add speed to a already fast guy. But what are yo I going to use it for ?

> >

> > What are you smoking? They are simply examples that prove distance can be increased (accurate or not, comon with this accuracy twist, seriously adding that to this already rediculous tangent) through fitness.

> >

> > Nobody is saying you will add 40 mph through it alone. I already have given myself as some proof of the merits of one type of fitness regimen, the super speed type of training. There is undeniable information out there yet you and a couple of others are closing your eyes to it. My God, I have never seen such nativity. I mean, the proof is out there, look for it and teach yourself a new fact. Apparently those of us trying to show you are not reliable sources so I suggest you open your minds to learning something new and look it up.

>

> Well. I better get to the gym then. I haven’t touched a weight since 1998. ( truth) and was clocked yesterday at 117 on trackman while sitting in on a friends driver fitting with ping. , admittedly on a high from wrapping up some home / personal struggles. From what you’re saying I can expect to see 124-130 with ease .... ? Maybe so. But I doubt it , at least doing it with any control. 3-4 mph maybe.

>

> At any rate the long drive guys analogy is bunk. That’s not golf. Not even close to the discussion we’re having.

Obviously everyone is different and results from gym workouts alone can be smallish or largish. Obviously I am not an expert and you don't have to believe me but I would fully expect to gain 5 to 10 mph within a year or so of doing a well designed strength training program. I know my legs aren't strong, and I know my forearms and hands and wrists for sure need some work. My core needs to lean out to free up some speed and also add some potentially from some muscle. Many people have done it, many people have made significant gains from a purposeful golf work out regimen. It isn't rocket science, it is simple truth. When you work on swing speed however, I know for sure it CAN mess up your game and swing if not careful. Super Speed Golf and or going to the range and swinging out of your shoes regularly can mess with your swing, but from the success stories in the thread about SSG, I would say you stand a very good chance of getting into the 120s and having a higher average when swinging stable and smooth.

clevited · November 10, 2019

> @bladehunter said:

> > @Titleist99 said:

> > > @LICC said:

> > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @butterysnaphook said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > @mahonie said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh dear! That’s moving towards the game I call ‘American Golf’...it’s not golf but it seems that’s where the ‘fans’ of the modern game are pushing it. Now I’ve realised that you are not actually debating about the game I’m familiar with I’ll leave you to your long drive games and get on with the proper game...cheers ?

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > So wait, you move from being a fitness can increase distance is BS, to that's American golf and doesn't matter, then to those guys are not real golfers so its meaningless type stance? What are you smoking? Those guys prove a point, they are the extreme end of golfers who are trying to get distance. In order to compete at the highest level every single one of those guys have to push their bodies to the limit and beyond. They have to train to be stronger in ways that do several things, help them be faster, more accurate and prevent injury. All of those guys no doubt have innate talent or a head start with swing speed via sports they played growing up or what have you, but most if not all need to focus a great deal on fitness in order to achieve what they achieve.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Each one of us has a limit that we can get to just by swinging a club and practicing swinging fast. Doing so trains your body and muscles to sync everything together and also fire as fast as possible. Add swing efficiency and technique improvements to that and you can get a long ways. Some are going to get all the speed they care to have by doing this, I think Bubba Watson is a good example. Doesn't really work out to my knowledge but swings plenty fast. If he felt he needed to, he very well could add some speed via golf specific fitness. Explosive workouts are big helpers, overspeed training can be a big help, lifting heavy can be a big help. It has all been proven.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > This is all easy to see. I would ask you deniers to google it, open your eyes and understand the simple truth that you can indeed add significant speed and therefore distance via various forms of fitness regimens. It is a more common practice today and their is better understanding of what exercises work vs Jacks day for instance. It is one of the many reasons more and more players today are very long and it is a significant one at that.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Making a bunch of conclusory statements and speculations doesn’t make them any less ridiculous.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Read the studies. There are plenty more if you want them. I know you think you are incapable of being wrong but you are 100% incorrect. Science has proved you wrong 5+ times.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Phil Mickelson

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Jerry Kelly

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > David Duval

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > All stated in interviews that they gained distance due to fitness training and more swing speed. Duval took it to the extreme though.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > DL3 who stated in past interviews he needed to hit the gym and change his routine to keep up with the young guys on tour. Iirc it was on feherty where told a story of during a delay he saw the young guy us going to work out an instead of going to get lunch he went and got his gym clothes an hit the gym.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > DL3 is hitting it 10 yards shorter than he did 10 years ago and 6 yards shorter than 5 years ago

> > > > > >

> > > > > > DL3 is also 10 years older and 5 years older than what you are saying. But when he was playing in that time span he knew he needed to be in the gym to even be able to keep up. You continue to provide zero facts or studies for your point of view but that is just consistent with every thread you are in where you are proven wrong.

> > > > > > Like the scientific examples already provided

> > > > >

> > > > > I’m providing the best facts possible- the actual distances. And my point on DL is that his distances don’t support the argument that fitness training gave him greater length. It may have helped his game in other ways, but not added distance.

> > > >

> > > > Your facts don’t equal the truth. Facts have already been given that prove you wrong and you keep using your opinion as fact. Distances on tour have multiple variables to include limited to a couple holes each tourney and club choice not factored in or course conditions.

> > > >

> > > > In the meantime let’s see your scientific data that dispute ls the data given in the cited studies.

> > >

> > > Name three Tour players who increased distance after starting a fitness regimen they weren’t > @Titleist99 said:

> > > @oikos1 said:

> > > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> >

> > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

>

> > @Titleist99 said:

> > > @oikos1 said:

> > > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> >

> > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

>

> You want someone popped for disagreeing with you ? Wow. As if you aren’t saying the same thing over and over. That’s the last 27 pages. EVERYONE saying the same thing over and over. Your **** smells just like everyone else’s. Come on.

>

> Why I clicked back in here I don’t know. Turrible downer of a click it is.

You know very well the person he is referring to is spamming and won't stop until he gets what he wants. He is seriously disrupting and degrading the conversation in this thread. Good reason Imo to kick anyone out. It has been too much for too long that he has spammed his question over and over again.

GoGoErky · November 10, 2019

> @bladehunter said:

> > @clevited said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > >

> > > Using gorillas as an example isn’t really helping. When anyone here says distance they mean relative to accuracy. Those guys don’t hit a 150 yard runway more than once every 15 swings. So yes. To your point. If you want to swing off balance and never hit it in play , you can add speed to a already fast guy. But what are yo I going to use it for ?

> >

> > What are you smoking? They are simply examples that prove distance can be increased (accurate or not, comon with this accuracy twist, seriously adding that to this already rediculous tangent) through fitness.

> >

> > Nobody is saying you will add 40 mph through it alone. I already have given myself as some proof of the merits of one type of fitness regimen, the super speed type of training. There is undeniable information out there yet you and a couple of others are closing your eyes to it. My God, I have never seen such nativity. I mean, the proof is out there, look for it and teach yourself a new fact. Apparently those of us trying to show you are not reliable sources so I suggest you open your minds to learning something new and look it up.

>

> Well. I better get to the gym then. I haven’t touched a weight since 1998. ( truth) and was clocked yesterday at 117 on trackman while sitting in on a friends driver fitting with ping. , admittedly on a high from wrapping up some home / personal struggles. From what you’re saying I can expect to see 124-130 with ease .... ? Maybe so. But I doubt it , at least doing it with any control. 3-4 mph maybe.

>

> At any rate the long drive guys analogy is bunk. That’s not golf. Not even close to the discussion we’re having.

It’s a golf swing and they can play some golf. Kyle Berkshire is shooting low scores on some tough courses on his non training days and his play golf swing speed is 143 and accurate.

LICC · November 10, 2019

> > > > > >

> > > > > > DL3 is also 10 years older and 5 years older than what you are saying. But when he was playing in that time span he knew he needed to be in the gym to even be able to keep up. You continue to provide zero facts or studies for your point of view but that is just consistent with every thread you are in where you are proven wrong.

> > > > > > Like the scientific examples already provided

> > > > >

> > > > > I’m providing the best facts possible- the actual distances. And my point on DL is that his distances don’t support the argument that fitness training gave him greater length. It may have helped his game in other ways, but not added distance.

> > > >

> > > > Your facts don’t equal the truth. Facts have already been given that prove you wrong and you keep using your opinion as fact. Distances on tour have multiple variables to include limited to a couple holes each tourney and club choice not factored in or course conditions.

> > > >

> > > > In the meantime let’s see your scientific data that dispute ls the data given in the cited studies.

> > >

> > > Name three Tour players who increased distance after starting a fitness regimen they weren’t > @Titleist99 said:

> > > @oikos1 said:

> > > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> >

> > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

>

> > @Titleist99 said:

> > > @oikos1 said:

> > > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> >

> > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

>

> You want someone popped for disagreeing with you ? Wow. As if you aren’t saying the same thing over and over. That’s the last 27 pages. EVERYONE saying the same thing over and over. Your **** smells just like everyone else’s. Come on.

>

> Why I clicked back in here I don’t know. Turrible downer of a click it is.

> @clevited said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @butterysnaphook said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @mahonie said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh dear! That’s moving towards the game I call ‘American Golf’...it’s not golf but it seems that’s where the ‘fans’ of the modern game are pushing it. Now I’ve realised that you are not actually debating about the game I’m familiar with I’ll leave you to your long drive games and get on with the proper game...cheers ?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > So wait, you move from being a fitness can increase distance is BS, to that's American golf and doesn't matter, then to those guys are not real golfers so its meaningless type stance? What are you smoking? Those guys prove a point, they are the extreme end of golfers who are trying to get distance. In order to compete at the highest level every single one of those guys have to push their bodies to the limit and beyond. They have to train to be stronger in ways that do several things, help them be faster, more accurate and prevent injury. All of those guys no doubt have innate talent or a head start with swing speed via sports they played growing up or what have you, but most if not all need to focus a great deal on fitness in order to achieve what they achieve.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Each one of us has a limit that we can get to just by swinging a club and practicing swinging fast. Doing so trains your body and muscles to sync everything together and also fire as fast as possible. Add swing efficiency and technique improvements to that and you can get a long ways. Some are going to get all the speed they care to have by doing this, I think Bubba Watson is a good example. Doesn't really work out to my knowledge but swings plenty fast. If he felt he needed to, he very well could add some speed via golf specific fitness. Explosive workouts are big helpers, overspeed training can be a big help, lifting heavy can be a big help. It has all been proven.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is all easy to see. I would ask you deniers to google it, open your eyes and understand the simple truth that you can indeed add significant speed and therefore distance via various forms of fitness regimens. It is a more common practice today and their is better understanding of what exercises work vs Jacks day for instance. It is one of the many reasons more and more players today are very long and it is a significant one at that.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Making a bunch of conclusory statements and speculations doesn’t make them any less ridiculous.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Read the studies. There are plenty more if you want them. I know you think you are incapable of being wrong but you are 100% incorrect. Science has proved you wrong 5+ times.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Phil Mickelson

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Jerry Kelly

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > David Duval

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > All stated in interviews that they gained distance due to fitness training and more swing speed. Duval took it to the extreme though.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > DL3 who stated in past interviews he needed to hit the gym and change his routine to keep up with the young guys on tour. Iirc it was on feherty where told a story of during a delay he saw the young guy us going to work out an instead of going to get lunch he went and got his gym clothes an hit the gym.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > DL3 is hitting it 10 yards shorter than he did 10 years ago and 6 yards shorter than 5 years ago

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > DL3 is also 10 years older and 5 years older than what you are saying. But when he was playing in that time span he knew he needed to be in the gym to even be able to keep up. You continue to provide zero facts or studies for your point of view but that is just consistent with every thread you are in where you are proven wrong.

> > > > > > > Like the scientific examples already provided

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I’m providing the best facts possible- the actual distances. And my point on DL is that his distances don’t support the argument that fitness training gave him greater length. It may have helped his game in other ways, but not added distance.

> > > > >

> > > > > Your facts don’t equal the truth. Facts have already been given that prove you wrong and you keep using your opinion as fact. Distances on tour have multiple variables to include limited to a couple holes each tourney and club choice not factored in or course conditions.

> > > > >

> > > > > In the meantime let’s see your scientific data that dispute ls the data given in the cited studies.

> > > >

> > > > Name three Tour players who increased distance after starting a fitness regimen they weren’t > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > @oikos1 said:

> > > > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> > >

> > > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

> >

> > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > @oikos1 said:

> > > > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> > >

> > > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

> >

> > You want someone popped for disagreeing with you ? Wow. As if you aren’t saying the same thing over and over. That’s the last 27 pages. EVERYONE saying the same thing over and over. Your **** smells just like everyone else’s. Come on.

> >

> > Why I clicked back in here I don’t know. Turrible downer of a click it is.

>

> You know very well the person he is referring to is spamming and won't stop until he gets what he wants. He is seriously disrupting and degrading the conversation in this thread. Good reason Imo to kick anyone out. It has been too much for too long that he has spammed his question over and over again.

It is this kind of crap why you and @Titleist99 have lost respect on this thread. Censor people who counter your assertions and make your comments look bad. Go to another golf forum site for that. Or just grow up and have a spirited debate and be open minded.

LICC · November 10, 2019

> @clevited said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @clevited said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > > >

> > > > Using gorillas as an example isn’t really helping. When anyone here says distance they mean relative to accuracy. Those guys don’t hit a 150 yard runway more than once every 15 swings. So yes. To your point. If you want to swing off balance and never hit it in play , you can add speed to a already fast guy. But what are yo I going to use it for ?

> > >

> > > What are you smoking? They are simply examples that prove distance can be increased (accurate or not, comon with this accuracy twist, seriously adding that to this already rediculous tangent) through fitness.

> > >

> > > Nobody is saying you will add 40 mph through it alone. I already have given myself as some proof of the merits of one type of fitness regimen, the super speed type of training. There is undeniable information out there yet you and a couple of others are closing your eyes to it. My God, I have never seen such nativity. I mean, the proof is out there, look for it and teach yourself a new fact. Apparently those of us trying to show you are not reliable sources so I suggest you open your minds to learning something new and look it up.

> >

> > Well. I better get to the gym then. I haven’t touched a weight since 1998. ( truth) and was clocked yesterday at 117 on trackman while sitting in on a friends driver fitting with ping. , admittedly on a high from wrapping up some home / personal struggles. From what you’re saying I can expect to see 124-130 with ease .... ? Maybe so. But I doubt it , at least doing it with any control. 3-4 mph maybe.

> >

> > At any rate the long drive guys analogy is bunk. That’s not golf. Not even close to the discussion we’re having.

>

> Obviously everyone is different and results from gym workouts alone can be smallish or largish. Obviously I am not an expert and you don't have to believe me but I would fully expect to gain 5 to 10 mph within a year or so of doing a well designed strength training program. I know my legs aren't strong, and I know my forearms and hands and wrists for sure need some work. My core needs to lean out to free up some speed and also add some potentially from some muscle. Many people have done it, many people have made significant gains from a purposeful golf work out regimen. It isn't rocket science, it is simple truth. When you work on swing speed however, I know for sure it CAN mess up your game and swing if not careful. Super Speed Golf and or going to the range and swinging out of your shoes regularly can mess with your swing, but from the success stories in the thread about SSG, I would say you stand a very good chance of getting into the 120s and having a higher average when swinging stable and smooth.

Over 30 yards gain in distance from working out. Smh. This from the guy who says he can regularly CARRY 300 yards with a persimmon driver.

oikos1 · November 10, 2019

> @bladehunter said:

> > @Titleist99 said:

> > > @LICC said:

> > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @butterysnaphook said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > @mahonie said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh dear! That’s moving towards the game I call ‘American Golf’...it’s not golf but it seems that’s where the ‘fans’ of the modern game are pushing it. Now I’ve realised that you are not actually debating about the game I’m familiar with I’ll leave you to your long drive games and get on with the proper game...cheers ?

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > So wait, you move from being a fitness can increase distance is BS, to that's American golf and doesn't matter, then to those guys are not real golfers so its meaningless type stance? What are you smoking? Those guys prove a point, they are the extreme end of golfers who are trying to get distance. In order to compete at the highest level every single one of those guys have to push their bodies to the limit and beyond. They have to train to be stronger in ways that do several things, help them be faster, more accurate and prevent injury. All of those guys no doubt have innate talent or a head start with swing speed via sports they played growing up or what have you, but most if not all need to focus a great deal on fitness in order to achieve what they achieve.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Each one of us has a limit that we can get to just by swinging a club and practicing swinging fast. Doing so trains your body and muscles to sync everything together and also fire as fast as possible. Add swing efficiency and technique improvements to that and you can get a long ways. Some are going to get all the speed they care to have by doing this, I think Bubba Watson is a good example. Doesn't really work out to my knowledge but swings plenty fast. If he felt he needed to, he very well could add some speed via golf specific fitness. Explosive workouts are big helpers, overspeed training can be a big help, lifting heavy can be a big help. It has all been proven.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > This is all easy to see. I would ask you deniers to google it, open your eyes and understand the simple truth that you can indeed add significant speed and therefore distance via various forms of fitness regimens. It is a more common practice today and their is better understanding of what exercises work vs Jacks day for instance. It is one of the many reasons more and more players today are very long and it is a significant one at that.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Making a bunch of conclusory statements and speculations doesn’t make them any less ridiculous.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Read the studies. There are plenty more if you want them. I know you think you are incapable of being wrong but you are 100% incorrect. Science has proved you wrong 5+ times.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Phil Mickelson

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Jerry Kelly

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > David Duval

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > All stated in interviews that they gained distance due to fitness training and more swing speed. Duval took it to the extreme though.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > DL3 who stated in past interviews he needed to hit the gym and change his routine to keep up with the young guys on tour. Iirc it was on feherty where told a story of during a delay he saw the young guy us going to work out an instead of going to get lunch he went and got his gym clothes an hit the gym.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > DL3 is hitting it 10 yards shorter than he did 10 years ago and 6 yards shorter than 5 years ago

> > > > > >

> > > > > > DL3 is also 10 years older and 5 years older than what you are saying. But when he was playing in that time span he knew he needed to be in the gym to even be able to keep up. You continue to provide zero facts or studies for your point of view but that is just consistent with every thread you are in where you are proven wrong.

> > > > > > Like the scientific examples already provided

> > > > >

> > > > > I’m providing the best facts possible- the actual distances. And my point on DL is that his distances don’t support the argument that fitness training gave him greater length. It may have helped his game in other ways, but not added distance.

> > > >

> > > > Your facts don’t equal the truth. Facts have already been given that prove you wrong and you keep using your opinion as fact. Distances on tour have multiple variables to include limited to a couple holes each tourney and club choice not factored in or course conditions.

> > > >

> > > > In the meantime let’s see your scientific data that dispute ls the data given in the cited studies.

> > >

> > > Name three Tour players who increased distance after starting a fitness regimen they weren’t > @Titleist99 said:

> > > @oikos1 said:

> > > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> >

> > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

>

> > @Titleist99 said:

> > > @oikos1 said:

> > > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> >

> > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

>

> You want someone popped for disagreeing with you ? Wow. As if you aren’t saying the same thing over and over. That’s the last 27 pages. EVERYONE saying the same thing over and over. Your **** smells just like everyone else’s. Come on.

>

> Why I clicked back in here I don’t know. Turrible downer of a click it is.

Actually, no. I haven't been saying the same phrase over and over and over. You want to tie your wagon to this horse, giddy up!

bladehunter · November 10, 2019

> @oikos1 said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @butterysnaphook said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @mahonie said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh dear! That’s moving towards the game I call ‘American Golf’...it’s not golf but it seems that’s where the ‘fans’ of the modern game are pushing it. Now I’ve realised that you are not actually debating about the game I’m familiar with I’ll leave you to your long drive games and get on with the proper game...cheers ?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > So wait, you move from being a fitness can increase distance is BS, to that's American golf and doesn't matter, then to those guys are not real golfers so its meaningless type stance? What are you smoking? Those guys prove a point, they are the extreme end of golfers who are trying to get distance. In order to compete at the highest level every single one of those guys have to push their bodies to the limit and beyond. They have to train to be stronger in ways that do several things, help them be faster, more accurate and prevent injury. All of those guys no doubt have innate talent or a head start with swing speed via sports they played growing up or what have you, but most if not all need to focus a great deal on fitness in order to achieve what they achieve.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Each one of us has a limit that we can get to just by swinging a club and practicing swinging fast. Doing so trains your body and muscles to sync everything together and also fire as fast as possible. Add swing efficiency and technique improvements to that and you can get a long ways. Some are going to get all the speed they care to have by doing this, I think Bubba Watson is a good example. Doesn't really work out to my knowledge but swings plenty fast. If he felt he needed to, he very well could add some speed via golf specific fitness. Explosive workouts are big helpers, overspeed training can be a big help, lifting heavy can be a big help. It has all been proven.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is all easy to see. I would ask you deniers to google it, open your eyes and understand the simple truth that you can indeed add significant speed and therefore distance via various forms of fitness regimens. It is a more common practice today and their is better understanding of what exercises work vs Jacks day for instance. It is one of the many reasons more and more players today are very long and it is a significant one at that.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Making a bunch of conclusory statements and speculations doesn’t make them any less ridiculous.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Read the studies. There are plenty more if you want them. I know you think you are incapable of being wrong but you are 100% incorrect. Science has proved you wrong 5+ times.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Phil Mickelson

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Jerry Kelly

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > David Duval

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > All stated in interviews that they gained distance due to fitness training and more swing speed. Duval took it to the extreme though.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > DL3 who stated in past interviews he needed to hit the gym and change his routine to keep up with the young guys on tour. Iirc it was on feherty where told a story of during a delay he saw the young guy us going to work out an instead of going to get lunch he went and got his gym clothes an hit the gym.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > DL3 is hitting it 10 yards shorter than he did 10 years ago and 6 yards shorter than 5 years ago

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > DL3 is also 10 years older and 5 years older than what you are saying. But when he was playing in that time span he knew he needed to be in the gym to even be able to keep up. You continue to provide zero facts or studies for your point of view but that is just consistent with every thread you are in where you are proven wrong.

> > > > > > > Like the scientific examples already provided

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I’m providing the best facts possible- the actual distances. And my point on DL is that his distances don’t support the argument that fitness training gave him greater length. It may have helped his game in other ways, but not added distance.

> > > > >

> > > > > Your facts don’t equal the truth. Facts have already been given that prove you wrong and you keep using your opinion as fact. Distances on tour have multiple variables to include limited to a couple holes each tourney and club choice not factored in or course conditions.

> > > > >

> > > > > In the meantime let’s see your scientific data that dispute ls the data given in the cited studies.

> > > >

> > > > Name three Tour players who increased distance after starting a fitness regimen they weren’t > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > @oikos1 said:

> > > > I've never seen a thread train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> > >

> > > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

> >

> > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > @oikos1 said:

> > > > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> > >

> > > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

> >

> > You want someone popped for disagreeing with you ? Wow. As if you aren’t saying the same thing over and over. That’s the last 27 pages. EVERYONE saying the same thing over and over. Your **** smells just like everyone else’s. Come on.

> >

> > Why I clicked back in here I don’t know. Turrible downer of a click it is.

>

> Actually, no. I haven't been saying the same phrase over and over and over. You want to tie your wagon to this horse, giddy up!

K. I disagree. Completely. Sure. I can play semantics and tell you I’ve rephrased my opinion multiple times thus not saying the exact same thing. But I’d be bending the truth if I did.

bladehunter · November 10, 2019

> @GoGoErky said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @clevited said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > > >

> > > > Using gorillas as an example isn’t really helping. When anyone here says distance they mean relative to accuracy. Those guys don’t hit a 150 yard runway more than once every 15 swings. So yes. To your point. If you want to swing off balance and never hit it in play , you can add speed to a already fast guy. But what are yo I going to use it for ?

> > >

> > > What are you smoking? They are simply examples that prove distance can be increased (accurate or not, comon with this accuracy twist, seriously adding that to this already rediculous tangent) through fitness.

> > >

> > > Nobody is saying you will add 40 mph through it alone. I already have given myself as some proof of the merits of one type of fitness regimen, the super speed type of training. There is undeniable information out there yet you and a couple of others are closing your eyes to it. My God, I have never seen such nativity. I mean, the proof is out there, look for it and teach yourself a new fact. Apparently those of us trying to show you are not reliable sources so I suggest you open your minds to learning something new and look it up.

> >

> > Well. I better get to the gym then. I haven’t touched a weight since 1998. ( truth) and was clocked yesterday at 117 on trackman while sitting in on a friends driver fitting with ping. , admittedly on a high from wrapping up some home / personal struggles. From what you’re saying I can expect to see 124-130 with ease .... ? Maybe so. But I doubt it , at least doing it with any control. 3-4 mph maybe.

> >

> > At any rate the long drive guys analogy is bunk. That’s not golf. Not even close to the discussion we’re having.

>

> It’s a golf swing and they can play some golf. Kyle Berkshire is shooting low scores on some tough courses on his non training days and his play golf swing speed is 143 and accurate.

>

Right. But he can’t play golf with his long drive game.

So is it a gain ? As far as golf is concerned ? I don’t think so.

bladehunter · November 10, 2019

> @clevited said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @butterysnaphook said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @mahonie said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh dear! That’s moving towards the game I call ‘American Golf’...it’s not golf but it seems that’s where the ‘fans’ of the modern game are pushing it. Now I’ve realised that you are not actually debating about the game I’m familiar with I’ll leave you to your long drive games and get on with the proper game...cheers ?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > So wait, you move from being a fitness can increase distance is BS, to that's American golf and doesn't matter, then to those guys are not real golfers so its meaningless type stance? What are you smoking? Those guys prove a point, they are the extreme end of golfers who are trying to get distance. In order to compete at the highest level every single one of those guys have to push their bodies to the limit and beyond. They have to train to be stronger in ways that do several things, help them be faster, more accurate and prevent injury. All of those guys no doubt have innate talent or a head start with swing speed via sports they played growing up or what have you, but most if not all need to focus a great deal on fitness in order to achieve what they achieve.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Each one of us has a limit that we can get to just by swinging a club and practicing swinging fast. Doing so trains your body and muscles to sync everything together and also fire as fast as possible. Add swing efficiency and technique improvements to that and you can get a long ways. Some are going to get all the speed they care to have by doing this, I think Bubba Watson is a good example. Doesn't really work out to my knowledge but swings plenty fast. If he felt he needed to, he very well could add some speed via golf specific fitness. Explosive workouts are big helpers, overspeed training can be a big help, lifting heavy can be a big help. It has all been proven.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is all easy to see. I would ask you deniers to google it, open your eyes and understand the simple truth that you can indeed add significant speed and therefore distance via various forms of fitness regimens. It is a more common practice today and their is better understanding of what exercises work vs Jacks day for instance. It is one of the many reasons more and more players today are very long and it is a significant one at that.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Making a bunch of conclusory statements and speculations doesn’t make them any less ridiculous.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Read the studies. There are plenty more if you want them. I know you think you are incapable of being wrong but you are 100% incorrect. Science has proved you wrong 5+ times.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Phil Mickelson

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Jerry Kelly

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > David Duval

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > All stated in interviews that they gained distance due to fitness training and more swing speed. Duval took it to the extreme though.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > DL3 who stated in past interviews he needed to hit the gym and change his routine to keep up with the young guys on tour. Iirc it was on feherty where told a story of during a delay he saw the young guy us going to work out an instead of going to get lunch he went and got his gym clothes an hit the gym.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > DL3 is hitting it 10 yards shorter than he did 10 years ago and 6 yards shorter than 5 years ago

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > DL3 is also 10 years older and 5 years older than what you are saying. But when he was playing in that time span he knew he needed to be in the gym to even be able to keep up. You continue to provide zero facts or studies for your point of view but that is just consistent with every thread you are in where you are proven wrong.

> > > > > > > Like the scientific examples already provided

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I’m providing the best facts possible- the actual distances. And my point on DL is that his distances don’t support the argument that fitness training gave him greater length. It may have helped his game in other ways, but not added distance.

> > > > >

> > > > > Your facts don’t equal the truth. Facts have already been given that prove you wrong and you keep using your opinion as fact. Distances on tour have multiple variables to include limited to a couple holes each tourney and club choice not factored in or course conditions.

> > > > >

> > > > > In the meantime let’s see your scientific data that dispute ls the data given in the cited studies.

> > > >

> > > > Name three Tour players who increased distance after starting a fitness regimen they weren’t > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > @oikos1 said:

> > > > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> > >

> > > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

> >

> > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > @oikos1 said:

> > > > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> > >

> > > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

> >

> > You want someone popped for disagreeing with you ? Wow. As if you aren’t saying the same thing over and over. That’s the last 27 pages. EVERYONE saying the same thing over and over. Your **** smells just like everyone else’s. Come on.

> >

> > Why I clicked back in here I don’t know. Turrible downer of a click it is.

>

> You know very well the person he is referring to is spamming and won't stop until he gets what he wants. He is seriously disrupting and degrading the conversation in this thread. Good reason Imo to kick anyone out. It has been too much for too long that he has spammed his question over and over again.

If that was true , then you’d need to stop answering the same thing over and over ( everyone ) to stop it. Nobody here is talking to themselves. It absolutely takes two to argue.

clevited · November 10, 2019

> @bladehunter said:

> > @clevited said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > @butterysnaphook said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @mahonie said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh dear! That’s moving towards the game I call ‘American Golf’...it’s not golf but it seems that’s where the ‘fans’ of the modern game are pushing it. Now I’ve realised that you are not actually debating about the game I’m familiar with I’ll leave you to your long drive games and get on with the proper game...cheers ?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So wait, you move from being a fitness can increase distance is BS, to that's American golf and doesn't matter, then to those guys are not real golfers so its meaningless type stance? What are you smoking? Those guys prove a point, they are the extreme end of golfers who are trying to get distance. In order to compete at the highest level every single one of those guys have to push their bodies to the limit and beyond. They have to train to be stronger in ways that do several things, help them be faster, more accurate and prevent injury. All of those guys no doubt have innate talent or a head start with swing speed via sports they played growing up or what have you, but most if not all need to focus a great deal on fitness in order to achieve what they achieve.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Each one of us has a limit that we can get to just by swinging a club and practicing swinging fast. Doing so trains your body and muscles to sync everything together and also fire as fast as possible. Add swing efficiency and technique improvements to that and you can get a long ways. Some are going to get all the speed they care to have by doing this, I think Bubba Watson is a good example. Doesn't really work out to my knowledge but swings plenty fast. If he felt he needed to, he very well could add some speed via golf specific fitness. Explosive workouts are big helpers, overspeed training can be a big help, lifting heavy can be a big help. It has all been proven.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is all easy to see. I would ask you deniers to google it, open your eyes and understand the simple truth that you can indeed add significant speed and therefore distance via various forms of fitness regimens. It is a more common practice today and their is better understanding of what exercises work vs Jacks day for instance. It is one of the many reasons more and more players today are very long and it is a significant one at that.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Making a bunch of conclusory statements and speculations doesn’t make them any less ridiculous.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Read the studies. There are plenty more if you want them. I know you think you are incapable of being wrong but you are 100% incorrect. Science has proved you wrong 5+ times.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Phil Mickelson

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Jerry Kelly

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > David Duval

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > All stated in interviews that they gained distance due to fitness training and more swing speed. Duval took it to the extreme though.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > DL3 who stated in past interviews he needed to hit the gym and change his routine to keep up with the young guys on tour. Iirc it was on feherty where told a story of during a delay he saw the young guy us going to work out an instead of going to get lunch he went and got his gym clothes an hit the gym.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > DL3 is hitting it 10 yards shorter than he did 10 years ago and 6 yards shorter than 5 years ago

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > DL3 is also 10 years older and 5 years older than what you are saying. But when he was playing in that time span he knew he needed to be in the gym to even be able to keep up. You continue to provide zero facts or studies for your point of view but that is just consistent with every thread you are in where you are proven wrong.

> > > > > > > > Like the scientific examples already provided

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I’m providing the best facts possible- the actual distances. And my point on DL is that his distances don’t support the argument that fitness training gave him greater length. It may have helped his game in other ways, but not added distance.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Your facts don’t equal the truth. Facts have already been given that prove you wrong and you keep using your opinion as fact. Distances on tour have multiple variables to include limited to a couple holes each tourney and club choice not factored in or course conditions.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > In the meantime let’s see your scientific data that dispute ls the data given in the cited studies.

> > > > >

> > > > > Name three Tour players who increased distance after starting a fitness regimen they weren’t > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > @oikos1 said:

> > > > > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> > > >

> > > > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

> > >

> > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > @oikos1 said:

> > > > > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> > > >

> > > > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

> > >

> > > You want someone popped for disagreeing with you ? Wow. As if you aren’t saying the same thing over and over. That’s the last 27 pages. EVERYONE saying the same thing over and over. Your **** smells just like everyone else’s. Come on.

> > >

> > > Why I clicked back in here I don’t know. Turrible downer of a click it is.

> >

> > You know very well the person he is referring to is spamming and won't stop until he gets what he wants. He is seriously disrupting and degrading the conversation in this thread. Good reason Imo to kick anyone out. It has been too much for too long that he has spammed his question over and over again.

>

> If that was true , then you’d need to stop answering the same thing over and over ( everyone ) to stop it. Nobody here is talking to themselves. It absolutely takes two to argue.

I have done my part best I can, it is almost impossible to stop everyone from replying to his spam, I am sure you can understand that. Anyways, I think this thread had a good run. I am going to do my best to stay away. All it does is make me shake my head and facepalm.

bladehunter · November 10, 2019

> @clevited said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @clevited said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > > >

> > > > Using gorillas as an example isn’t really helping. When anyone here says distance they mean relative to accuracy. Those guys don’t hit a 150 yard runway more than once every 15 swings. So yes. To your point. If you want to swing off balance and never hit it in play , you can add speed to a already fast guy. But what are yo I going to use it for ?

> > >

> > > What are you smoking? They are simply examples that prove distance can be increased (accurate or not, comon with this accuracy twist, seriously adding that to this already rediculous tangent) through fitness.

> > >

> > > Nobody is saying you will add 40 mph through it alone. I already have given myself as some proof of the merits of one type of fitness regimen, the super speed type of training. There is undeniable information out there yet you and a couple of others are closing your eyes to it. My God, I have never seen such nativity. I mean, the proof is out there, look for it and teach yourself a new fact. Apparently those of us trying to show you are not reliable sources so I suggest you open your minds to learning something new and look it up.

> >

> > Well. I better get to the gym then. I haven’t touched a weight since 1998. ( truth) and was clocked yesterday at 117 on trackman while sitting in on a friends driver fitting with ping. , admittedly on a high from wrapping up some home / personal struggles. From what you’re saying I can expect to see 124-130 with ease .... ? Maybe so. But I doubt it , at least doing it with any control. 3-4 mph maybe.

> >

> > At any rate the long drive guys analogy is bunk. That’s not golf. Not even close to the discussion we’re having.

>

> Obviously everyone is different and results from gym workouts alone can be smallish or largish. Obviously I am not an expert and you don't have to believe me but I would fully expect to gain 5 to 10 mph within a year or so of doing a well designed strength training program. I know my legs aren't strong, and I know my forearms and hands and wrists for sure need some work. My core needs to lean out to free up some speed and also add some potentially from some muscle. Many people have done it, many people have made significant gains from a purposeful golf work out regimen. It isn't rocket science, it is simple truth. When you work on swing speed however, I know for sure it CAN mess up your game and swing if not careful. Super Speed Golf and or going to the range and swinging out of your shoes regularly can mess with your swing, but from the success stories in the thread about SSG, I would say you stand a very good chance of getting into the 120s and having a higher average when swinging stable and smooth.

It’s an interesting idea.

I’d also say I’m a guy who does lots of manual labor. For work and the farm I live on. So likely equal to office dwellers who work out daily. lol n other words I’m not really out of shape at all. Certainly not by medical standards. ( 34 inch waist , 6ft3 212lbs )

I believe I could work on balance and maybe flexibility somewhat ( I am very flexible ). And that may translate to retaining speed longer and more useable speed. But I just don’t know where you pickup real mph if you are fast already.

At any rate. Things in here are really out of hand. We have one guy who’s mad at the world because I included him in “ everyone “ pertaining to proliferating this argument. As if there is a party here with clean hands when we’ve argued for 12 pages plus. A guy who knows every golfer in his county by name and feels like folks who disagree with him should be banned(lol) and not just this thread. In each one he starts he picks someone to call for a ban. An 12 year old anime character calling folks “ old guys “ , a USga Rep who lets us know how dumb we are. Daily ....a couple new guys who started this “ workout vs distance “ tangent out of the blue , that’s currently blazing. and lord knows how many people watching this dumpster burn.

I said I was out yesterday. Im going to try harder this time. I love a good debate. But this isn’t going anywhere fast.

GoGoErky · November 10, 2019

> @bladehunter said:

> > @GoGoErky said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > > > >

> > > > > Using gorillas as an example isn’t really helping. When anyone here says distance they mean relative to accuracy. Those guys don’t hit a 150 yard runway more than once every 15 swings. So yes. To your point. If you want to swing off balance and never hit it in play , you can add speed to a already fast guy. But what are yo I going to use it for ?

> > > >

> > > > What are you smoking? They are simply examples that prove distance can be increased (accurate or not, comon with this accuracy twist, seriously adding that to this already rediculous tangent) through fitness.

> > > >

> > > > Nobody is saying you will add 40 mph through it alone. I already have given myself as some proof of the merits of one type of fitness regimen, the super speed type of training. There is undeniable information out there yet you and a couple of others are closing your eyes to it. My God, I have never seen such nativity. I mean, the proof is out there, look for it and teach yourself a new fact. Apparently those of us trying to show you are not reliable sources so I suggest you open your minds to learning something new and look it up.

> > >

> > > Well. I better get to the gym then. I haven’t touched a weight since 1998. ( truth) and was clocked yesterday at 117 on trackman while sitting in on a friends driver fitting with ping. , admittedly on a high from wrapping up some home / personal struggles. From what you’re saying I can expect to see 124-130 with ease .... ? Maybe so. But I doubt it , at least doing it with any control. 3-4 mph maybe.

> > >

> > > At any rate the long drive guys analogy is bunk. That’s not golf. Not even close to the discussion we’re having.

> >

> > It’s a golf swing and they can play some golf. Kyle Berkshire is shooting low scores on some tough courses on his non training days and his play golf swing speed is 143 and accurate.

> >

>

> Right. But he can’t play golf with his long drive game.

>

> So is it a gain ? As far as golf is concerned ? I don’t think so.

You are silly

LICC · November 10, 2019

> @clevited said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @clevited said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > @butterysnaphook said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @mahonie said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh dear! That’s moving towards the game I call ‘American Golf’...it’s not golf but it seems that’s where the ‘fans’ of the modern game are pushing it. Now I’ve realised that you are not actually debating about the game I’m familiar with I’ll leave you to your long drive games and get on with the proper game...cheers ?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So wait, you move from being a fitness can increase distance is BS, to that's American golf and doesn't matter, then to those guys are not real golfers so its meaningless type stance? What are you smoking? Those guys prove a point, they are the extreme end of golfers who are trying to get distance. In order to compete at the highest level every single one of those guys have to push their bodies to the limit and beyond. They have to train to be stronger in ways that do several things, help them be faster, more accurate and prevent injury. All of those guys no doubt have innate talent or a head start with swing speed via sports they played growing up or what have you, but most if not all need to focus a great deal on fitness in order to achieve what they achieve.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Each one of us has a limit that we can get to just by swinging a club and practicing swinging fast. Doing so trains your body and muscles to sync everything together and also fire as fast as possible. Add swing efficiency and technique improvements to that and you can get a long ways. Some are going to get all the speed they care to have by doing this, I think Bubba Watson is a good example. Doesn't really work out to my knowledge but swings plenty fast. If he felt he needed to, he very well could add some speed via golf specific fitness. Explosive workouts are big helpers, overspeed training can be a big help, lifting heavy can be a big help. It has all been proven.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is all easy to see. I would ask you deniers to google it, open your eyes and understand the simple truth that you can indeed add significant speed and therefore distance via various forms of fitness regimens. It is a more common practice today and their is better understanding of what exercises work vs Jacks day for instance. It is one of the many reasons more and more players today are very long and it is a significant one at that.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Making a bunch of conclusory statements and speculations doesn’t make them any less ridiculous.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Read the studies. There are plenty more if you want them. I know you think you are incapable of being wrong but you are 100% incorrect. Science has proved you wrong 5+ times.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Phil Mickelson

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Jerry Kelly

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > David Duval

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > All stated in interviews that they gained distance due to fitness training and more swing speed. Duval took it to the extreme though.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > DL3 who stated in past interviews he needed to hit the gym and change his routine to keep up with the young guys on tour. Iirc it was on feherty where told a story of during a delay he saw the young guy us going to work out an instead of going to get lunch he went and got his gym clothes an hit the gym.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > DL3 is hitting it 10 yards shorter than he did 10 years ago and 6 yards shorter than 5 years ago

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > DL3 is also 10 years older and 5 years older than what you are saying. But when he was playing in that time span he knew he needed to be in the gym to even be able to keep up. You continue to provide zero facts or studies for your point of view but that is just consistent with every thread you are in where you are proven wrong.

> > > > > > > > > Like the scientific examples already provided

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I’m providing the best facts possible- the actual distances. And my point on DL is that his distances don’t support the argument that fitness training gave him greater length. It may have helped his game in other ways, but not added distance.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Your facts don’t equal the truth. Facts have already been given that prove you wrong and you keep using your opinion as fact. Distances on tour have multiple variables to include limited to a couple holes each tourney and club choice not factored in or course conditions.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > In the meantime let’s see your scientific data that dispute ls the data given in the cited studies.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Name three Tour players who increased distance after starting a fitness regimen they weren’t > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > @oikos1 said:

> > > > > > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> > > > >

> > > > > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

> > > >

> > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > @oikos1 said:

> > > > > > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> > > > >

> > > > > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

> > > >

> > > > You want someone popped for disagreeing with you ? Wow. As if you aren’t saying the same thing over and over. That’s the last 27 pages. EVERYONE saying the same thing over and over. Your **** smells just like everyone else’s. Come on.

> > > >

> > > > Why I clicked back in here I don’t know. Turrible downer of a click it is.

> > >

> > > You know very well the person he is referring to is spamming and won't stop until he gets what he wants. He is seriously disrupting and degrading the conversation in this thread. Good reason Imo to kick anyone out. It has been too much for too long that he has spammed his question over and over again.

> >

> > If that was true , then you’d need to stop answering the same thing over and over ( everyone ) to stop it. Nobody here is talking to themselves. It absolutely takes two to argue.

>

> I have done my part best I can, it is almost impossible to stop everyone from replying to his spam, I am sure you can understand that. Anyways, I think this thread had a good run. I am going to do my best to stay away. All it does is make me shake my head and facepalm.

You can answer my question by either: 1- finding players on Tour who have added distance after taking on fitness programs that weren’t ancillary to obvious swing changes made to add distance, or 2- state that you can’t find any players like that so maybe the equipment is much more of a factor on distance than you thought. Instead, you come up with dodgy answers to try to disparage an opposing opinion. And then you call to censor someone because you can’t win the debate.

GoGoErky · November 10, 2019

> @LICC said:

> > @clevited said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @butterysnaphook said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @mahonie said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh dear! That’s moving towards the game I call ‘American Golf’...it’s not golf but it seems that’s where the ‘fans’ of the modern game are pushing it. Now I’ve realised that you are not actually debating about the game I’m familiar with I’ll leave you to your long drive games and get on with the proper game...cheers ?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So wait, you move from being a fitness can increase distance is BS, to that's American golf and doesn't matter, then to those guys are not real golfers so its meaningless type stance? What are you smoking? Those guys prove a point, they are the extreme end of golfers who are trying to get distance. In order to compete at the highest level every single one of those guys have to push their bodies to the limit and beyond. They have to train to be stronger in ways that do several things, help them be faster, more accurate and prevent injury. All of those guys no doubt have innate talent or a head start with swing speed via sports they played growing up or what have you, but most if not all need to focus a great deal on fitness in order to achieve what they achieve.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Each one of us has a limit that we can get to just by swinging a club and practicing swinging fast. Doing so trains your body and muscles to sync everything together and also fire as fast as possible. Add swing efficiency and technique improvements to that and you can get a long ways. Some are going to get all the speed they care to have by doing this, I think Bubba Watson is a good example. Doesn't really work out to my knowledge but swings plenty fast. If he felt he needed to, he very well could add some speed via golf specific fitness. Explosive workouts are big helpers, overspeed training can be a big help, lifting heavy can be a big help. It has all been proven.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is all easy to see. I would ask you deniers to google it, open your eyes and understand the simple truth that you can indeed add significant speed and therefore distance via various forms of fitness regimens. It is a more common practice today and their is better understanding of what exercises work vs Jacks day for instance. It is one of the many reasons more and more players today are very long and it is a significant one at that.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Making a bunch of conclusory statements and speculations doesn’t make them any less ridiculous.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Read the studies. There are plenty more if you want them. I know you think you are incapable of being wrong but you are 100% incorrect. Science has proved you wrong 5+ times.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Phil Mickelson

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Jerry Kelly

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > David Duval

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > All stated in interviews that they gained distance due to fitness training and more swing speed. Duval took it to the extreme though.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > DL3 who stated in past interviews he needed to hit the gym and change his routine to keep up with the young guys on tour. Iirc it was on feherty where told a story of during a delay he saw the young guy us going to work out an instead of going to get lunch he went and got his gym clothes an hit the gym.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > DL3 is hitting it 10 yards shorter than he did 10 years ago and 6 yards shorter than 5 years ago

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > DL3 is also 10 years older and 5 years older than what you are saying. But when he was playing in that time span he knew he needed to be in the gym to even be able to keep up. You continue to provide zero facts or studies for your point of view but that is just consistent with every thread you are in where you are proven wrong.

> > > > > > > > > > Like the scientific examples already provided

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I’m providing the best facts possible- the actual distances. And my point on DL is that his distances don’t support the argument that fitness training gave him greater length. It may have helped his game in other ways, but not added distance.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Your facts don’t equal the truth. Facts have already been given that prove you wrong and you keep using your opinion as fact. Distances on tour have multiple variables to include limited to a couple holes each tourney and club choice not factored in or course conditions.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > In the meantime let’s see your scientific data that dispute ls the data given in the cited studies.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Name three Tour players who increased distance after starting a fitness regimen they weren’t > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > @oikos1 said:

> > > > > > > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

> > > > >

> > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > @oikos1 said:

> > > > > > > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

> > > > >

> > > > > You want someone popped for disagreeing with you ? Wow. As if you aren’t saying the same thing over and over. That’s the last 27 pages. EVERYONE saying the same thing over and over. Your **** smells just like everyone else’s. Come on.

> > > > >

> > > > > Why I clicked back in here I don’t know. Turrible downer of a click it is.

> > > >

> > > > You know very well the person he is referring to is spamming and won't stop until he gets what he wants. He is seriously disrupting and degrading the conversation in this thread. Good reason Imo to kick anyone out. It has been too much for too long that he has spammed his question over and over again.

> > >

> > > If that was true , then you’d need to stop answering the same thing over and over ( everyone ) to stop it. Nobody here is talking to themselves. It absolutely takes two to argue.

> >

> > I have done my part best I can, it is almost impossible to stop everyone from replying to his spam, I am sure you can understand that. Anyways, I think this thread had a good run. I am going to do my best to stay away. All it does is make me shake my head and facepalm.

>

> You can answer my question by either: 1- finding players on Tour who have added distance after taking on fitness programs that weren’t ancillary to obvious swing changes made to add distance, or 2- state that you can’t find any players like that so maybe the equipment is much more of a factor on distance than you thought. Instead, you come up with dodgy answers to try to disparage an opposing opinion. And then you call to censor someone because you can’t win the debate.

You can’t find or state any facts that dispute the studies quoted that have proven your theories and opinions wrong.

bladehunter · November 10, 2019

> @GoGoErky said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Using gorillas as an example isn’t really helping. When anyone here says distance they mean relative to accuracy. Those guys don’t hit a 150 yard runway more than once every 15 swings. So yes. To your point. If you want to swing off balance and never hit it in play , you can add speed to a already fast guy. But what are yo I going to use it for ?

> > > > >

> > > > > What are you smoking? They are simply examples that prove distance can be increased (accurate or not, comon with this accuracy twist, seriously adding that to this already rediculous tangent) through fitness.

> > > > >

> > > > > Nobody is saying you will add 40 mph through it alone. I already have given myself as some proof of the merits of one type of fitness regimen, the super speed type of training. There is undeniable information out there yet you and a couple of others are closing your eyes to it. My God, I have never seen such nativity. I mean, the proof is out there, look for it and teach yourself a new fact. Apparently those of us trying to show you are not reliable sources so I suggest you open your minds to learning something new and look it up.

> > > >

> > > > Well. I better get to the gym then. I haven’t touched a weight since 1998. ( truth) and was clocked yesterday at 117 on trackman while sitting in on a friends driver fitting with ping. , admittedly on a high from wrapping up some home / personal struggles. From what you’re saying I can expect to see 124-130 with ease .... ? Maybe so. But I doubt it , at least doing it with any control. 3-4 mph maybe.

> > > >

> > > > At any rate the long drive guys analogy is bunk. That’s not golf. Not even close to the discussion we’re having.

> > >

> > > It’s a golf swing and they can play some golf. Kyle Berkshire is shooting low scores on some tough courses on his non training days and his play golf swing speed is 143 and accurate.

> > >

> >

> > Right. But he can’t play golf with his long drive game.

> >

> > So is it a gain ? As far as golf is concerned ? I don’t think so.

>

> You are silly

At times yes , I find it mixes well with Obstinance, arrogance , and narcissism . Life is about balance. If one doest have a little silly , he’s surely lopsided.

LICC · November 10, 2019

> @GoGoErky said:

> > @LICC said:

> > > @clevited said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @butterysnaphook said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @mahonie said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh dear! That’s moving towards the game I call ‘American Golf’...it’s not golf but it seems that’s where the ‘fans’ of the modern game are pushing it. Now I’ve realised that you are not actually debating about the game I’m familiar with I’ll leave you to your long drive games and get on with the proper game...cheers ?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So wait, you move from being a fitness can increase distance is BS, to that's American golf and doesn't matter, then to those guys are not real golfers so its meaningless type stance? What are you smoking? Those guys prove a point, they are the extreme end of golfers who are trying to get distance. In order to compete at the highest level every single one of those guys have to push their bodies to the limit and beyond. They have to train to be stronger in ways that do several things, help them be faster, more accurate and prevent injury. All of those guys no doubt have innate talent or a head start with swing speed via sports they played growing up or what have you, but most if not all need to focus a great deal on fitness in order to achieve what they achieve.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Each one of us has a limit that we can get to just by swinging a club and practicing swinging fast. Doing so trains your body and muscles to sync everything together and also fire as fast as possible. Add swing efficiency and technique improvements to that and you can get a long ways. Some are going to get all the speed they care to have by doing this, I think Bubba Watson is a good example. Doesn't really work out to my knowledge but swings plenty fast. If he felt he needed to, he very well could add some speed via golf specific fitness. Explosive workouts are big helpers, overspeed training can be a big help, lifting heavy can be a big help. It has all been proven.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is all easy to see. I would ask you deniers to google it, open your eyes and understand the simple truth that you can indeed add significant speed and therefore distance via various forms of fitness regimens. It is a more common practice today and their is better understanding of what exercises work vs Jacks day for instance. It is one of the many reasons more and more players today are very long and it is a significant one at that.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Making a bunch of conclusory statements and speculations doesn’t make them any less ridiculous.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Read the studies. There are plenty more if you want them. I know you think you are incapable of being wrong but you are 100% incorrect. Science has proved you wrong 5+ times.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Phil Mickelson

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jerry Kelly

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > David Duval

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > All stated in interviews that they gained distance due to fitness training and more swing speed. Duval took it to the extreme though.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > DL3 who stated in past interviews he needed to hit the gym and change his routine to keep up with the young guys on tour. Iirc it was on feherty where told a story of during a delay he saw the young guy us going to work out an instead of going to get lunch he went and got his gym clothes an hit the gym.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > DL3 is hitting it 10 yards shorter than he did 10 years ago and 6 yards shorter than 5 years ago

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > DL3 is also 10 years older and 5 years older than what you are saying. But when he was playing in that time span he knew he needed to be in the gym to even be able to keep up. You continue to provide zero facts or studies for your point of view but that is just consistent with every thread you are in where you are proven wrong.

> > > > > > > > > > > Like the scientific examples already provided

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I’m providing the best facts possible- the actual distances. And my point on DL is that his distances don’t support the argument that fitness training gave him greater length. It may have helped his game in other ways, but not added distance.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Your facts don’t equal the truth. Facts have already been given that prove you wrong and you keep using your opinion as fact. Distances on tour have multiple variables to include limited to a couple holes each tourney and club choice not factored in or course conditions.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > In the meantime let’s see your scientific data that dispute ls the data given in the cited studies.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Name three Tour players who increased distance after starting a fitness regimen they weren’t > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > @oikos1 said:

> > > > > > > > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > @oikos1 said:

> > > > > > > > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > You want someone popped for disagreeing with you ? Wow. As if you aren’t saying the same thing over and over. That’s the last 27 pages. EVERYONE saying the same thing over and over. Your **** smells just like everyone else’s. Come on.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Why I clicked back in here I don’t know. Turrible downer of a click it is.

> > > > >

> > > > > You know very well the person he is referring to is spamming and won't stop until he gets what he wants. He is seriously disrupting and degrading the conversation in this thread. Good reason Imo to kick anyone out. It has been too much for too long that he has spammed his question over and over again.

> > > >

> > > > If that was true , then you’d need to stop answering the same thing over and over ( everyone ) to stop it. Nobody here is talking to themselves. It absolutely takes two to argue.

> > >

> > > I have done my part best I can, it is almost impossible to stop everyone from replying to his spam, I am sure you can understand that. Anyways, I think this thread had a good run. I am going to do my best to stay away. All it does is make me shake my head and facepalm.

> >

> > You can answer my question by either: 1- finding players on Tour who have added distance after taking on fitness programs that weren’t ancillary to obvious swing changes made to add distance, or 2- state that you can’t find any players like that so maybe the equipment is much more of a factor on distance than you thought. Instead, you come up with dodgy answers to try to disparage an opposing opinion. And then you call to censor someone because you can’t win the debate.

>

> You can’t find or state any facts that dispute the studies quoted that have proven your theories and opinions wrong.

The studies quoted are not on point to the issue- whether distance gains on Tour from 20+ years ago to now are predominantly the result of equipment, and fitness is not a material cause.

GoGoErky · November 10, 2019

> @LICC said:

> > @GoGoErky said:

> > > @LICC said:

> > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @butterysnaphook said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @mahonie said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh dear! That’s moving towards the game I call ‘American Golf’...it’s not golf but it seems that’s where the ‘fans’ of the modern game are pushing it. Now I’ve realised that you are not actually debating about the game I’m familiar with I’ll leave you to your long drive games and get on with the proper game...cheers ?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So wait, you move from being a fitness can increase distance is BS, to that's American golf and doesn't matter, then to those guys are not real golfers so its meaningless type stance? What are you smoking? Those guys prove a point, they are the extreme end of golfers who are trying to get distance. In order to compete at the highest level every single one of those guys have to push their bodies to the limit and beyond. They have to train to be stronger in ways that do several things, help them be faster, more accurate and prevent injury. All of those guys no doubt have innate talent or a head start with swing speed via sports they played growing up or what have you, but most if not all need to focus a great deal on fitness in order to achieve what they achieve.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Each one of us has a limit that we can get to just by swinging a club and practicing swinging fast. Doing so trains your body and muscles to sync everything together and also fire as fast as possible. Add swing efficiency and technique improvements to that and you can get a long ways. Some are going to get all the speed they care to have by doing this, I think Bubba Watson is a good example. Doesn't really work out to my knowledge but swings plenty fast. If he felt he needed to, he very well could add some speed via golf specific fitness. Explosive workouts are big helpers, overspeed training can be a big help, lifting heavy can be a big help. It has all been proven.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is all easy to see. I would ask you deniers to google it, open your eyes and understand the simple truth that you can indeed add significant speed and therefore distance via various forms of fitness regimens. It is a more common practice today and their is better understanding of what exercises work vs Jacks day for instance. It is one of the many reasons more and more players today are very long and it is a significant one at that.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Making a bunch of conclusory statements and speculations doesn’t make them any less ridiculous.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Read the studies. There are plenty more if you want them. I know you think you are incapable of being wrong but you are 100% incorrect. Science has proved you wrong 5+ times.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Phil Mickelson

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jerry Kelly

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > David Duval

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > All stated in interviews that they gained distance due to fitness training and more swing speed. Duval took it to the extreme though.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > DL3 who stated in past interviews he needed to hit the gym and change his routine to keep up with the young guys on tour. Iirc it was on feherty where told a story of during a delay he saw the young guy us going to work out an instead of going to get lunch he went and got his gym clothes an hit the gym.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > DL3 is hitting it 10 yards shorter than he did 10 years ago and 6 yards shorter than 5 years ago

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > DL3 is also 10 years older and 5 years older than what you are saying. But when he was playing in that time span he knew he needed to be in the gym to even be able to keep up. You continue to provide zero facts or studies for your point of view but that is just consistent with every thread you are in where you are proven wrong.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Like the scientific examples already provided

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I’m providing the best facts possible- the actual distances. And my point on DL is that his distances don’t support the argument that fitness training gave him greater length. It may have helped his game in other ways, but not added distance.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Your facts don’t equal the truth. Facts have already been given that prove you wrong and you keep using your opinion as fact. Distances on tour have multiple variables to include limited to a couple holes each tourney and club choice not factored in or course conditions.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > In the meantime let’s see your scientific data that dispute ls the data given in the cited studies.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Name three Tour players who increased distance after starting a fitness regimen they weren’t > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > @oikos1 said:

> > > > > > > > > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > @oikos1 said:

> > > > > > > > > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > You want someone popped for disagreeing with you ? Wow. As if you aren’t saying the same thing over and over. That’s the last 27 pages. EVERYONE saying the same thing over and over. Your **** smells just like everyone else’s. Come on.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Why I clicked back in here I don’t know. Turrible downer of a click it is.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > You know very well the person he is referring to is spamming and won't stop until he gets what he wants. He is seriously disrupting and degrading the conversation in this thread. Good reason Imo to kick anyone out. It has been too much for too long that he has spammed his question over and over again.

> > > > >

> > > > > If that was true , then you’d need to stop answering the same thing over and over ( everyone ) to stop it. Nobody here is talking to themselves. It absolutely takes two to argue.

> > > >

> > > > I have done my part best I can, it is almost impossible to stop everyone from replying to his spam, I am sure you can understand that. Anyways, I think this thread had a good run. I am going to do my best to stay away. All it does is make me shake my head and facepalm.

> > >

> > > You can answer my question by either: 1- finding players on Tour who have added distance after taking on fitness programs that weren’t ancillary to obvious swing changes made to add distance, or 2- state that you can’t find any players like that so maybe the equipment is much more of a factor on distance than you thought. Instead, you come up with dodgy answers to try to disparage an opposing opinion. And then you call to censor someone because you can’t win the debate.

> >

> > You can’t find or state any facts that dispute the studies quoted that have proven your theories and opinions wrong.

>

> The studies quoted are not on point to the issue- whether distance gains on Tour from 20+ years ago to now are predominantly the result of equipment, and fitness is not a material cause.

The studies don’t fit your narrative therefore you ignore them. It’s ok to be wrong and admit it, but then again in your mind you are smarter that the researchers

rangersgoalie · November 10, 2019

> @LICC said:

> > @butterysnaphook said:

> >

> > I did back in 1997. Hired an amazing trainer in March. But August I was 8+ longer with driver and nearly a club with my irons. What I learned was amazing, and has led me to send serious students to him though he is an hour away from where I teach. All but one of 8 students who have worked with him picked up substantial distance (6+ yards.

> >

> > Gains from fitness can also be from gaining mobility. I have no idea on Molinari but maybe his ability to move better due to his work allowed him to rotate and use his lower half better.

> >

> > I worked with an ART practicioner and he helped me pick up 7-8 degrees in thoracic rotation. He’s done the same helping many students gain mobility

> >

> > Argue what you like, but I’ve seen fitness and being able to move better (which IS part of a great training program imo) help almost every student that does it to hit it further and more efficiently.

> >

>

> I agree that stretching/flexibility exercises can help. But this is not new. Golfers have been doing this for ages.

FWIW

I did weight training, Plyometrics, intervals fro cardio.

My strength and power increases in the gym were pretty linear with distance gains on the course...with the same golf equipment.

As a old fart, the ART helped increase my mobility.

The training, yes even the weight and strength training increased my range of motion in my swing, and to me, the plyometrics was a big part of my increase in distance.

And I seen the same in students who were attempting to play professionally, mostly mini tour or overseas.

So, continue on, I've personally experienced the gains as well as watching students from collegiate through professional make measurable gains by improving their fitness and training.

airjammer · November 10, 2019

> @bladehunter said:

> > @GoGoErky said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > > > >

> > > > > Using gorillas as an example isn’t really helping. When anyone here says distance they mean relative to accuracy. Those guys don’t hit a 150 yard runway more than once every 15 swings. So yes. To your point. If you want to swing off balance and never hit it in play , you can add speed to a already fast guy. But what are yo I going to use it for ?

> > > >

> > > > What are you smoking? They are simply examples that prove distance can be increased (accurate or not, comon with this accuracy twist, seriously adding that to this already rediculous tangent) through fitness.

> > > >

> > > > Nobody is saying you will add 40 mph through it alone. I already have given myself as some proof of the merits of one type of fitness regimen, the super speed type of training. There is undeniable information out there yet you and a couple of others are closing your eyes to it. My God, I have never seen such nativity. I mean, the proof is out there, look for it and teach yourself a new fact. Apparently those of us trying to show you are not reliable sources so I suggest you open your minds to learning something new and look it up.

> > >

> > > Well. I better get to the gym then. I haven’t touched a weight since 1998. ( truth) and was clocked yesterday at 117 on trackman while sitting in on a friends driver fitting with ping. , admittedly on a high from wrapping up some home / personal struggles. From what you’re saying I can expect to see 124-130 with ease .... ? Maybe so. But I doubt it , at least doing it with any control. 3-4 mph maybe.

> > >

> > > At any rate the long drive guys analogy is bunk. That’s not golf. Not even close to the discussion we’re having.

> >

> > It’s a golf swing and they can play some golf. Kyle Berkshire is shooting low scores on some tough courses on his non training days and his play golf swing speed is 143 and accurate.

> >

>

> Right. But he can’t play golf with his long drive game.

>

> So is it a gain ? As far as golf is concerned ? I don’t think so.

His swing is very close to being good enough that if he can score he can compete at the highest level. I do believe that playing professionally is a goal of his down the road. I believe he will get to 155+ clubhead speed in the next 12 months. If he can control a driver at 140-145 he has serious upside nobody else has and he is still very young.

bladehunter · November 10, 2019

> @airjammer said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Using gorillas as an example isn’t really helping. When anyone here says distance they mean relative to accuracy. Those guys don’t hit a 150 yard runway more than once every 15 swings. So yes. To your point. If you want to swing off balance and never hit it in play , you can add speed to a already fast guy. But what are yo I going to use it for ?

> > > > >

> > > > > What are you smoking? They are simply examples that prove distance can be increased (accurate or not, comon with this accuracy twist, seriously adding that to this already rediculous tangent) through fitness.

> > > > >

> > > > > Nobody is saying you will add 40 mph through it alone. I already have given myself as some proof of the merits of one type of fitness regimen, the super speed type of training. There is undeniable information out there yet you and a couple of others are closing your eyes to it. My God, I have never seen such nativity. I mean, the proof is out there, look for it and teach yourself a new fact. Apparently those of us trying to show you are not reliable sources so I suggest you open your minds to learning something new and look it up.

> > > >

> > > > Well. I better get to the gym then. I haven’t touched a weight since 1998. ( truth) and was clocked yesterday at 117 on trackman while sitting in on a friends driver fitting with ping. , admittedly on a high from wrapping up some home / personal struggles. From what you’re saying I can expect to see 124-130 with ease .... ? Maybe so. But I doubt it , at least doing it with any control. 3-4 mph maybe.

> > > >

> > > > At any rate the long drive guys analogy is bunk. That’s not golf. Not even close to the discussion we’re having.

> > >

> > > It’s a golf swing and they can play some golf. Kyle Berkshire is shooting low scores on some tough courses on his non training days and his play golf swing speed is 143 and accurate.

> > >

> >

> > Right. But he can’t play golf with his long drive game.

> >

> > So is it a gain ? As far as golf is concerned ? I don’t think so.

>

> His swing is very close to being good enough that if he can score he can compete at the highest level. I do believe that playing professionally is a goal of his down the road. I believe he will get to 155+ clubhead speed in the next 12 months. If he can control a driver at 140-145 he has serious upside nobody else has and he is still very young.

>

If he wins a pga tour event I’ll eat my hat on camera.

BNGL · November 10, 2019

Ladies ladies your all pretty!

LICC · November 10, 2019

> @bladehunter said:

> > @airjammer said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Using gorillas as an example isn’t really helping. When anyone here says distance they mean relative to accuracy. Those guys don’t hit a 150 yard runway more than once every 15 swings. So yes. To your point. If you want to swing off balance and never hit it in play , you can add speed to a already fast guy. But what are yo I going to use it for ?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > What are you smoking? They are simply examples that prove distance can be increased (accurate or not, comon with this accuracy twist, seriously adding that to this already rediculous tangent) through fitness.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Nobody is saying you will add 40 mph through it alone. I already have given myself as some proof of the merits of one type of fitness regimen, the super speed type of training. There is undeniable information out there yet you and a couple of others are closing your eyes to it. My God, I have never seen such nativity. I mean, the proof is out there, look for it and teach yourself a new fact. Apparently those of us trying to show you are not reliable sources so I suggest you open your minds to learning something new and look it up.

> > > > >

> > > > > Well. I better get to the gym then. I haven’t touched a weight since 1998. ( truth) and was clocked yesterday at 117 on trackman while sitting in on a friends driver fitting with ping. , admittedly on a high from wrapping up some home / personal struggles. From what you’re saying I can expect to see 124-130 with ease .... ? Maybe so. But I doubt it , at least doing it with any control. 3-4 mph maybe.

> > > > >

> > > > > At any rate the long drive guys analogy is bunk. That’s not golf. Not even close to the discussion we’re having.

> > > >

> > > > It’s a golf swing and they can play some golf. Kyle Berkshire is shooting low scores on some tough courses on his non training days and his play golf swing speed is 143 and accurate.

> > > >

> > >

> > > Right. But he can’t play golf with his long drive game.

> > >

> > > So is it a gain ? As far as golf is concerned ? I don’t think so.

> >

> > His swing is very close to being good enough that if he can score he can compete at the highest level. I do believe that playing professionally is a goal of his down the road. I believe he will get to 155+ clubhead speed in the next 12 months. If he can control a driver at 140-145 he has serious upside nobody else has and he is still very young.

> >

>

> If he wins a pga tour event I’ll eat my hat on camera.

Berkshire is not a musclebound guy. Maurice Allen hit monster drives before he bulked up. The LD guys are not supportive examples of this wild view that new fitness training is a big factor in distance increases on Tour. It’s the equipment.

oikos1 · November 10, 2019

> @bladehunter said:

> > @oikos1 said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > @butterysnaphook said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @mahonie said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh dear! That’s moving towards the game I call ‘American Golf’...it’s not golf but it seems that’s where the ‘fans’ of the modern game are pushing it. Now I’ve realised that you are not actually debating about the game I’m familiar with I’ll leave you to your long drive games and get on with the proper game...cheers ?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So wait, you move from being a fitness can increase distance is BS, to that's American golf and doesn't matter, then to those guys are not real golfers so its meaningless type stance? What are you smoking? Those guys prove a point, they are the extreme end of golfers who are trying to get distance. In order to compete at the highest level every single one of those guys have to push their bodies to the limit and beyond. They have to train to be stronger in ways that do several things, help them be faster, more accurate and prevent injury. All of those guys no doubt have innate talent or a head start with swing speed via sports they played growing up or what have you, but most if not all need to focus a great deal on fitness in order to achieve what they achieve.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Each one of us has a limit that we can get to just by swinging a club and practicing swinging fast. Doing so trains your body and muscles to sync everything together and also fire as fast as possible. Add swing efficiency and technique improvements to that and you can get a long ways. Some are going to get all the speed they care to have by doing this, I think Bubba Watson is a good example. Doesn't really work out to my knowledge but swings plenty fast. If he felt he needed to, he very well could add some speed via golf specific fitness. Explosive workouts are big helpers, overspeed training can be a big help, lifting heavy can be a big help. It has all been proven.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is all easy to see. I would ask you deniers to google it, open your eyes and understand the simple truth that you can indeed add significant speed and therefore distance via various forms of fitness regimens. It is a more common practice today and their is better understanding of what exercises work vs Jacks day for instance. It is one of the many reasons more and more players today are very long and it is a significant one at that.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Making a bunch of conclusory statements and speculations doesn’t make them any less ridiculous.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Read the studies. There are plenty more if you want them. I know you think you are incapable of being wrong but you are 100% incorrect. Science has proved you wrong 5+ times.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Phil Mickelson

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Jerry Kelly

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > David Duval

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > All stated in interviews that they gained distance due to fitness training and more swing speed. Duval took it to the extreme though.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > DL3 who stated in past interviews he needed to hit the gym and change his routine to keep up with the young guys on tour. Iirc it was on feherty where told a story of during a delay he saw the young guy us going to work out an instead of going to get lunch he went and got his gym clothes an hit the gym.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > DL3 is hitting it 10 yards shorter than he did 10 years ago and 6 yards shorter than 5 years ago

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > DL3 is also 10 years older and 5 years older than what you are saying. But when he was playing in that time span he knew he needed to be in the gym to even be able to keep up. You continue to provide zero facts or studies for your point of view but that is just consistent with every thread you are in where you are proven wrong.

> > > > > > > > Like the scientific examples already provided

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I’m providing the best facts possible- the actual distances. And my point on DL is that his distances don’t support the argument that fitness training gave him greater length. It may have helped his game in other ways, but not added distance.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Your facts don’t equal the truth. Facts have already been given that prove you wrong and you keep using your opinion as fact. Distances on tour have multiple variables to include limited to a couple holes each tourney and club choice not factored in or course conditions.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > In the meantime let’s see your scientific data that dispute ls the data given in the cited studies.

> > > > >

> > > > > Name three Tour players who increased distance after starting a fitness regimen they weren’t > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > @oikos1 said:

> > > > > I've never seen a thread train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> > > >

> > > > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

> > >

> > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > @oikos1 said:

> > > > > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> > > >

> > > > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

> > >

> > > You want someone popped for disagreeing with you ? Wow. As if you aren’t saying the same thing over and over. That’s the last 27 pages. EVERYONE saying the same thing over and over. Your **** smells just like everyone else’s. Come on.

> > >

> > > Why I clicked back in here I don’t know. Turrible downer of a click it is.

> >

> > Actually, no. I haven't been saying the same phrase over and over and over. You want to tie your wagon to this horse, giddy up!

>

> K. I disagree. Completely. Sure. I can play semantics and tell you I’ve rephrased my opinion multiple times thus not saying the exact same thing. But I’d be bending the truth if I did.

Let's cut to the chase. Do you actually believe that not a single professional golfer has gained distance as a result of a fitness regimen? You don't believe any of the examples given? You don't believe the words of Rory Mcilroy, Phil Mickelson, or rangersgoalie?

LICC · November 10, 2019

> @oikos1 said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @oikos1 said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > @butterysnaphook said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @mahonie said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @clevited said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @BarnbougleDunes03 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Apparently 'Fitness' has nothing to do with Distance. The heavy majority of the World's Long-Drivers say don't believe your lying eyes!!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Don't you know that they go to the gym just for fun and the golf specific workouts they do absolutely did nothing for their swing speed, and distance? I mean comon, this has been argued against time and time again by a few people that obviously know. :neutral:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh dear! That’s moving towards the game I call ‘American Golf’...it’s not golf but it seems that’s where the ‘fans’ of the modern game are pushing it. Now I’ve realised that you are not actually debating about the game I’m familiar with I’ll leave you to your long drive games and get on with the proper game...cheers ?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So wait, you move from being a fitness can increase distance is BS, to that's American golf and doesn't matter, then to those guys are not real golfers so its meaningless type stance? What are you smoking? Those guys prove a point, they are the extreme end of golfers who are trying to get distance. In order to compete at the highest level every single one of those guys have to push their bodies to the limit and beyond. They have to train to be stronger in ways that do several things, help them be faster, more accurate and prevent injury. All of those guys no doubt have innate talent or a head start with swing speed via sports they played growing up or what have you, but most if not all need to focus a great deal on fitness in order to achieve what they achieve.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Each one of us has a limit that we can get to just by swinging a club and practicing swinging fast. Doing so trains your body and muscles to sync everything together and also fire as fast as possible. Add swing efficiency and technique improvements to that and you can get a long ways. Some are going to get all the speed they care to have by doing this, I think Bubba Watson is a good example. Doesn't really work out to my knowledge but swings plenty fast. If he felt he needed to, he very well could add some speed via golf specific fitness. Explosive workouts are big helpers, overspeed training can be a big help, lifting heavy can be a big help. It has all been proven.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is all easy to see. I would ask you deniers to google it, open your eyes and understand the simple truth that you can indeed add significant speed and therefore distance via various forms of fitness regimens. It is a more common practice today and their is better understanding of what exercises work vs Jacks day for instance. It is one of the many reasons more and more players today are very long and it is a significant one at that.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Making a bunch of conclusory statements and speculations doesn’t make them any less ridiculous.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Read the studies. There are plenty more if you want them. I know you think you are incapable of being wrong but you are 100% incorrect. Science has proved you wrong 5+ times.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Back to my question- name three Tour players who significantly increased distance by doing fitness training they weren’t doing previously. You can’t. Scott Stalings- perfect example.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Phil Mickelson

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Jerry Kelly

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > David Duval

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > All stated in interviews that they gained distance due to fitness training and more swing speed. Duval took it to the extreme though.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > DL3 who stated in past interviews he needed to hit the gym and change his routine to keep up with the young guys on tour. Iirc it was on feherty where told a story of during a delay he saw the young guy us going to work out an instead of going to get lunch he went and got his gym clothes an hit the gym.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > DL3 is hitting it 10 yards shorter than he did 10 years ago and 6 yards shorter than 5 years ago

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > DL3 is also 10 years older and 5 years older than what you are saying. But when he was playing in that time span he knew he needed to be in the gym to even be able to keep up. You continue to provide zero facts or studies for your point of view but that is just consistent with every thread you are in where you are proven wrong.

> > > > > > > > > Like the scientific examples already provided

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I’m providing the best facts possible- the actual distances. And my point on DL is that his distances don’t support the argument that fitness training gave him greater length. It may have helped his game in other ways, but not added distance.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Your facts don’t equal the truth. Facts have already been given that prove you wrong and you keep using your opinion as fact. Distances on tour have multiple variables to include limited to a couple holes each tourney and club choice not factored in or course conditions.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > In the meantime let’s see your scientific data that dispute ls the data given in the cited studies.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Name three Tour players who increased distance after starting a fitness regimen they weren’t > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > @oikos1 said:

> > > > > > I've never seen a thread train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> > > > >

> > > > > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

> > > >

> > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > @oikos1 said:

> > > > > > I've never seen a thread get train wrecked by someone saying the same phrase over and over and over like a three year old with their hands over their ears. Mods should just shut this one down,

> > > > >

> > > > > No !!!!…..The moderators should shut him down. The thread is just fine,

> > > >

> > > > You want someone popped for disagreeing with you ? Wow. As if you aren’t saying the same thing over and over. That’s the last 27 pages. EVERYONE saying the same thing over and over. Your **** smells just like everyone else’s. Come on.

> > > >

> > > > Why I clicked back in here I don’t know. Turrible downer of a click it is.

> > >

> > > Actually, no. I haven't been saying the same phrase over and over and over. You want to tie your wagon to this horse, giddy up!

> >

> > K. I disagree. Completely. Sure. I can play semantics and tell you I’ve rephrased my opinion multiple times thus not saying the exact same thing. But I’d be bending the truth if I did.

>

> Let's cut to the chase. Do you actually believe that not a single professional golfer has gained distance as a result of a fitness regimen? You don't believe any of the examples given? You don't believe the words of Rory Mcilroy, Phil Mickelson, or rangersgoalie?

>

I believe what the data and stats say. As you haven’t shown any that support your claim, then that is what we have.

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Lets take a closer look at distance off the Tee....

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