Strokes Gained Question...

[Obee]

10 hours ago, isaacbm said:

We both know you hit driver off the tee on one… 😂

 

I have been known to hit driver there "if I'm really feelin' it"....

 

[DLiver]

Late to the thread but you got the problem figured out. The number for your approach shot looks low to me. Hitting it to 18 feet from 144 seems like you should gain more than .06. Pretty much any time you hit it inside 20' you gain strokes (>.06 IMO), particularly if you are outside 100 yards. I could be wrong though.

[PracticeSwinger]

4 hours ago, DLiver said:

Late to the thread but you got the problem figured out. The number for your approach shot looks low to me. Hitting it to 18 feet from 144 seems like you should gain more than .06. Pretty much any time you hit it inside 20' you gain strokes (>.06 IMO), particularly if you are outside 100 yards. I could be wrong though.

Unrelated to Obee's question here but, 145 fairway to 18 feet (2.93 to 1.83 is a 0.10 SG Approach gain); had it been in the rough or in a fairway bunker, now that's a different story. Just wanted to reply to show that tour guys are insane from that range and the 150-200. That bucket and their median proximity (and thus how hard the SG App gains are) is the best argument as to what is the biggest differenciator between low caps, scratch guys, pluses and Tour players

[golfing_penguin]

Golfmetrics is off. Badly in this case at least, based on the assumption they use Mark Broadie's data.

 

360 off the tee into the fairway, 140 left to the green is only losing 0.05 shots off the tee (3.92 - 2.97 - 1 = -0.05SG)

[ThinkingPlus]

5 hours ago, golfing_penguin said:

Golfmetrics is off. Badly in this case at least, based on the assumption they use Mark Broadie's data.

 

360 off the tee into the fairway, 140 left to the green is only losing 0.05 shots off the tee (3.92 - 2.97 - 1 = -0.05SG)

If you read the entire thread, you would see that the OP did not enter the yardage correctly into the app.  Once this was done, the numbers were much more reasonable.

[2smooth]

On 4/28/2023 at 6:40 PM, ThinkingPlus said:

How about laying up to a lake that's 100 yards across.  There are situations where 220 yards is optimal.  SG is statistical by definition and cannot take into account specific situations such as this one.

there is no situation where hitting it 220 on a 360 hole is optimal these holes are not dog legs they are short drivable holes for long hitters. he hit his driver 220 nobody lays up to 140 they do it to 100 or less if he had the capabilities that is where he would have laid up to. 

[ThinkingPlus]

10 hours ago, 2smooth said:

there is no situation where hitting it 220 on a 360 hole is optimal these holes are not dog legs they are short drivable holes for long hitters. he hit his driver 220 nobody lays up to 140 they do it to 100 or less if he had the capabilities that is where he would have laid up to. 

So you would layup a couple yards short of the lake on a downhill tee shot? Good luck with that. Or you would take on a 320 - 330 yard carry over the lake?   Hmmm, in both cases those would be overly risky shots bringing in the high likelihood of penalty strokes.

 

You must leave margin if you layup to avoid needless penalty strokes trying to shave a tenth stroke or two getting 20 or 30 yards closer. Trying to carry the lake is a poor choice unless you are long driver long. Almost no one including the pros are.

[nsxguy]

11 hours ago, 2smooth said:

there is no situation where hitting it 220 on a 360 hole is optimal these holes are not dog legs they are short drivable holes for long hitters. he hit his driver 220 nobody lays up to 140 they do it to 100 or less if he had the capabilities that is where he would have laid up to. 

 

Ummmm,,,,,,,  did you happen to notice, as you yourself quoted, the 100-yard LAKE in the fairway she mentioned ?

 

 

[jimecherry]

9 minutes ago, nsxguy said:

 

Ummmm,,,,,,,  did you happen to notice, as you yourself quoted, the 100-yard LAKE in the fairway she mentioned ?

 

 

we really need a picture of the hole in question. strokes gained may dictate missing the fairway in order to avoid being short or in the water.

[nsxguy]

35 minutes ago, jimecherry said:

we really need a picture of the hole in question. strokes gained may dictate missing the fairway in order to avoid being short or in the water.

 

I suppose one could think of the lake being 100 yards WIDE, and only 10 yards wide (tee towards green) but I think TP's post was clear enough to understand her point - a likely layup that is shorter than driver and carrying the water is far longer than most players would consider "worth it".

 

And yes, any rough, or other objectionable area, in front of the water would be another consideration.