Get your arm swing and pivot in sync

[zzilb]

[quote name='iteachgolf' timestamp='1432166054' post='11597074']
You're already over thinking it. The difference between chest and hip high is incredibly small. The drill is to gets big picture idea and get the arm swing and pivot moving in sync. It's not about hitting a specific position or strict rules. It's about swinging the clubhead and loading and unloading the club while arms stay "in front" of you.
[/quote]

Fair enough. Thanks

[zzilb]

This seems like what I see Spieth do in his pre-shot routine

[tommybc]

For this drill, should the right wrist start the backswing by hinging backwards so that the club is parallel to the ground?

[joeunc]

[quote name='tommybc' timestamp='1432208091' post='11599532']
For this drill, should the right wrist start the backswing by hinging backwards so that the club is parallel to the ground?
[/quote]

no, do nothing with the wrists initially, try to keep the position of the left wrist in the first part, just try to have right wrist bent at hip high, but don't bend it right off the ball

[goatbarn]

Wrist hinging can happen whenever, as long as it's hinged by 9 oclock, and rehinged by 3 oclock. That's one of the only 2 parts of this drill.

Arms straight 9 to 3, hinge wrists on both sides.

[Dave D]

as dan said don't overthink it, keep the arms what feels straight and have the wrists cocked by chest high, and the same on the way through, start of slowly without a ball and build up speed, then start with a ball.

[mmakowski]

Dan, I've been working on this drill and starting to get better results. On video I look to be in good positions until the downswing where my left leg straightens before impact, hips open too fast, and arms finish too far left instead of in front of my body. Any ideas on what I am missing. I try to think all arms but naturally my body still outraces the arms. I can't seem to get rid of the wipe

[iteachgolf]

Have to let the club and arms swing. To most it will FEEL flippy when done correctly

[mmakowski]

Thanks for the feedback. So I probably want to feel like I'm swinging to the right and allowing the hands release more?

[iteachgolf]

I can't tell you what to feel and certainly can't tell you what to do without seeing a swing. Feel is different to everyone. Do the mechanics correctly and whatever it feels like it feels like

[tembolo1284]

[quote name='iteachgolf' timestamp='1432306841' post='11608104']
Have to let the club and arms swing. To most it will FEEL flippy when done correctly
[/quote]

It feels flippy to me for sure.

[gaz7788]

[quote name='tembolo1284' timestamp='1432312172' post='11608740']
[quote name='iteachgolf' timestamp='1432306841' post='11608104']
Have to let the club and arms swing. To most it will FEEL flippy when done correctly
[/quote]

It feels flippy to me for sure.
[/quote]

Feels like right wrist fully unbend post impact?

[goatbarn]

[quote name='gaz7788' timestamp='1432312343' post='11608758']
[quote name='tembolo1284' timestamp='1432312172' post='11608740']
[quote name='iteachgolf' timestamp='1432306841' post='11608104']
Have to let the club and arms swing. To most it will FEEL flippy when done correctly
[/quote]

It feels flippy to me for sure.
[/quote]

Feels like right wrist fully unbend post impact?
[/quote]

Yes it will. Certainly if you're coming from a stuck, body release, probably with a chicken wing of some extend. A fully extended left arm post impact with a full wrist hinge felt reallllly weird to me.

[mmakowski]

[quote name='goatbarn' timestamp='1432314222' post='11608974']
[quote name='gaz7788' timestamp='1432312343' post='11608758']
[quote name='tembolo1284' timestamp='1432312172' post='11608740']
[quote name='iteachgolf' timestamp='1432306841' post='11608104']
Have to let the club and arms swing. To most it will FEEL flippy when done correctly
[/quote]

It feels flippy to me for sure.
[/quote]

Feels like right wrist fully unbend post impact?
[/quote]

Yes it will. Certainly if you're coming from a stuck, body release, probably with a chicken wing of some extend. A fully extended left arm post impact with a full wrist hinge felt reallllly weird to me.
[/quote]Good stuff. That's exactly my issue, looking forward to trying this today. I assume the same felling applies to a full swing as well?

[goatbarn]

If you happen to do it correctly on the full swing, yes.

It'll feel like that until that feeling feels normal...

[mmakowski]

Happy Friday Everyone

Dan, been working on this drill and as others have said, I like using it in my preshot routine. I still struggle with leaving my arms behind, and from comparing a video of myself to yours I have a few questions:

1) I lock up my left knee prior to impact, dumping my leverage, where as you have the left knee flexed at impact and straightens about halfway into the FT. Any thoughts on how to work on this? Possibly more hip slide or just consciously thinking about keeping it flexed?

2) Although I seem to get in a similar position by the top of the BS, I get the club head more inside on the takeaway. It looks like you keep the club head in between the arms until about mid thigh to hip high. I understand everyone's feel can be different, but interested to know what yours is on the takeaway. I'm trying to take my hands/arms out of the takeaway and let the shoulders/body do the work.

Thanks for all the advice you share on here

[reddobeman]

[quote name='mmakowski' timestamp='1432926123' post='11651260']
Happy Friday Everyone

Dan, been working on this drill and as others have said, I like using it in my preshot routine. I still struggle with leaving my arms behind, and from comparing a video of myself to yours I have a few questions:

1) I lock up my left knee prior to impact, dumping my leverage, where as you have the left knee flexed at impact and straightens about halfway into the FT. Any thoughts on how to work on this? Possibly more hip slide or just consciously thinking about keeping it flexed?

2) Although I seem to get in a similar position by the top of the BS, I get the club head more inside on the takeaway. It looks like you keep the club head in between the arms until about mid thigh to hip high. I understand everyone's feel can be different, but interested to know what yours is on the takeaway. I'm trying to take my hands/arms out of the takeaway and let the shoulders/body do the work.

Thanks for all the advice you share on here
[/quote]
I noticed my left knee locking up as well when I started working on this drill. Your issues could be completely different than mine, but here's what I did to implement the drill correctly. I practiced Monte's "Perfect Golf Shoulder Turn" video in conjunction with this drill-to start the DS, I rotated my right shoulder toward the ball (i.e. perpendicular to the spine) and focused on the feel in my left leg/hip. I also practiced this drill at first by swinging an alignment stick which is much lighter than a golf club allowing me to swing my arms much faster. It's really an amazing drill that has improved my swing tremendously.

[iteachgolf]

If leg is straightening it's because you're lower body is too active. The whole point is to get the clubhead swinging and the arms and pivot to sync up. For left left to straighten that early hips would need to be way in front of shoulders and arms. The goal here is for the legs to be passive and reactionary.

[mmakowski]

Thanks for the feedback. Even when I try to think about all arms, my lower body outraces my arms when doing this drill and normal swings. I suck the clubhead in so far on the backswing and my arms get stuck way behind my chest. Once I'm in that position I feel like I have no chance to sync everything up on the downswing.

I've been reading up a lot on the ASI thread and your 'Tilting correctly and handpath' thread. I had no idea that is how the arms work in the BS. I always thought they swung across your chest. I've been working on a slight pushaway of the arms and vertical wrist set in the takeaway along with turning deep, steeper shoulder turn and flatter arms. Although it is going to take some time to get used to, I can feel what it is like to get the hands deep in the backswing yet still out in front of the chest. From that position a nice smooth downswing gets me a lot closer to proper compression. I am seeing a slight draw instead of fade, lower trajectory, and more distance with effortless power.

I know I'm still probably not doing it correctly, but definitely a lot closer than before. I'll get in a video for an online lesson once I get more comfortable with this new backswing.

[Dave D]

[quote name='mmakowski' timestamp='1433427919' post='11688350']
Thanks for the feedback. Even when I try to think about all arms, my lower body outraces my arms when doing this drill and normal swings. I suck the clubhead in so far on the backswing and my arms get stuck way behind my chest. Once I'm in that position I feel like I have no chance to sync everything up on the downswing.

I've been reading up a lot on the ASI thread and your 'Tilting correctly and handpath' thread. I had no idea that is how the arms work in the BS. I always thought they swung across your chest. I've been working on a slight pushaway of the arms and vertical wrist set in the takeaway along with turning deep, steeper shoulder turn and flatter arms. Although it is going to take some time to get used to, I can feel what it is like to get the hands deep in the backswing yet still out in front of the chest. From that position a nice smooth downswing gets me a lot closer to proper compression. I am seeing a slight draw instead of fade, lower trajectory, and more distance with effortless power.

I know I'm still probably not doing it correctly, but definitely a lot closer than before. [b]I'll get in a video for an online lesson once I get more comfortable with this new backswing.[/b]
[/quote]
my advice would be get a video and start a lesson now and let Dan advise you on the best way to proceed with changes. you probably aren't doing what you think you are doing and like me in my lessons things need to be fixed in a certain order for the changes to really work. get working with him asap.

[wmblake2000]

[quote name='Hstead' timestamp='1366119999' post='6855985']

For guys asking about taking it to the course etc and how you do a full swing, I by no means want to put words in Dan's mouth, but for me, he showed me how to work the hands straight up from the ground once the club goes past chest high, just raise the hands straight up, not around behind. It actually makes hitting longer clubs easier. I love hitting the driver now, just feel like the right arm stays straight to chest high and then raise my hands straight up a little and then let it rip. My biggest trouble is the half and three quarter wedges. I hit everything too far as my swing is longer than it feels, so I have to feel really really short and cut the follow through off really really short or the ball goes forever.
[/quote]

I had seen this thread but sort of forget it. Then in trying to accomplish the goal (synch arm and pivot) I stumbled onto trying a straight r arm in backswing and wrist hinge - and remembered this thread. Immediately the r arm in transition got more 'authoritative' and speed, quality of impact, plane all improved. It gives me a simple focus that seems very useful. I can understand my most common misses from this r arm focus. This seems like a motion and focus of lasting value.

[ofortuna]

Awesome thread!

At first I was swinging my arms too high (increasing the gab between my hands and my body too much). How much should this be happening? I know you said that the spine tilt would be mainly responsible for the the UP in the hands/arms so would that be only a few inches of the hands moving away from the body on the backswing and returning closer to the body on the way down?

To someone like me that always thought the arms/hands should be "passive" and lag behind the pivot, this drill is really eye opening and I'm feeling the sync of body with arms for the first time ever.

[freekick]

[url="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_5UWJJwRlng"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_5UWJJwRlng[/url]

This actually reminds me Jordan Spieth's pre shot routine.

I started doing this on my preshot routine as well, and I think it definately helps.

Quite similar to the dan carragher drill dont you think?

[freekick]

[quote name='zzilb' timestamp='1432167754' post='11597278']
This seems like what I see Spieth do in his pre-shot routine
[/quote]

i wasn't the only one seeing. yep. exactly

[rainkingjr]

I just took an online lesson from Dan and have been working on this drill for the past two days with not so great results. Been getting a little frustrated knowing that I'm just not getting things to sync up. Finally went into my garage tonight and video'd myself practicing this drill with no ball. I could immediately see that my arms working too up, even for such a short swing. What I felt like having the club intersect my spine angle at close to 90 degrees was nowhere close on video. Once my wrists were hinged the shaft was way above plane. I finally exaggerated the feel by turning and having the club feel like it was pointing at the wall behind me. Took video of those swings and voila, on plane. I then took some video of full swings using that feel. On plane again.Once again, feel versus real. I feel like I am chopping down a tree. Like I'm just chucking the club head behind my back.

[Garp]

I came across this thread whilst looking for a cure for lifting out of posture in the last part of the backswing. I find it incredible that I can achieve quite some distance with such a short swing. Whenever I go to a full swing I seem to fall back in my old rythm, I maintain the feeling of a stretched right arm but the video shows differently. As bizarre as it may seem but the shot from the stills below was, at least for me, quasi perfect. Slight draw travelling 165 yards with a 6-iron. It does look pretty ugly though, text book chicken wing. Any tips to cure this or should I just be happy with my ball flight and forget about a cute follow-through. Many thanks.

 

[goatbarn]

You need to feel more "straightness" of your leading arm on the follow through. You're missing the 2nd half of the drill.

Once your intent is to maintain the width of your arm triangle, your arms should speed up and your chicken wing will diminish. Straight right arm on backswing and straight left arm on follow through, full wrist hinge by chest high on both sides.

Only way to make solid contact with this drill is for the arms to speed up, which you need. That's what this drill does, speeds up the arms. For you, the follow through should feel very rigid.

[chigolfer1]

Why do you consider that "such a short swing?"



[quote name='Garp' timestamp='1435170036' post='11826964']
I came across this thread whilst looking for a cure for lifting out of posture in the last part of the backswing. I find it incredible that I can achieve quite some distance with such a short swing. Whenever I go to a full swing I seem to fall back in my old rythm, I maintain the feeling of a stretched right arm but the video shows differently. As bizarre as it may seem but the shot from the stills below was, at least for me, quasi perfect. Slight draw travelling 165 yards with a 6-iron. It does look pretty ugly though, text book chicken wing. Any tips to cure this or should I just be happy with my ball flight and forget about a cute follow-through. Many thanks.

[/quote]

[Garp]

[quote name='goatbarn' timestamp='1435174160' post='11827486']
You need to feel more "straightness" of your leading arm on the follow through. You're missing the 2nd half of the drill.

Once your intent is to maintain the width of your arm triangle, your arms should speed up and your chicken wing will diminish. Straight right arm on backswing and straight left arm on follow through, full wrist hinge by chest high on both sides.

Only way to make solid contact with this drill is for the arms to speed up, which you need. That's what this drill does, speeds up the arms. For you, the follow through should feel very rigid.
[/quote]
Will try . Should I swing the arms more upwards also? Thanks.

[Garp]

[quote name='chigolfer1' timestamp='1435174731' post='11827548']
Why do you consider that "such a short swing?"



[quote name='Garp' timestamp='1435170036' post='11826964']
I came across this thread whilst looking for a cure for lifting out of posture in the last part of the backswing. I find it incredible that I can achieve quite some distance with such a short swing. Whenever I go to a full swing I seem to fall back in my old rythm, I maintain the feeling of a stretched right arm but the video shows differently. As bizarre as it may seem but the shot from the stills below was, at least for me, quasi perfect. Slight draw travelling 165 yards with a 6-iron. It does look pretty ugly though, text book chicken wing. Any tips to cure this or should I just be happy with my ball flight and forget about a cute follow-through. Many thanks.

[/quote]
[/quote]
The swing I posted is a full swing but the short swing is more as described in the OP, just above waist high. I can more or less have straight arms after contact but for now it's impossible with a full swing.