Asian domination on PGA tour coming? (Spoiler)

[Outlier]

I don't think that it will end up being so much of a "domination" as it will be a more profound presence.

 

And I honestly believe that this may well be the year that an Asian wins a major in the US. WAY too much talent!

 

It is going to be such an awesome Masters...

 

What was YE Yang? Swedish?

 

IRONIC you should say that......

 

Reminds me of the time our friend Brandel Chamblee went on and on bloviating about women's golf and got so carried away with his xenophobic crap that his entire thesis was based on the #alternativefact that Annika Sorrenstam is American. She had just won a bunch of majors, was dominating the world and Brandel pointed to her as evidence "we" were OK with the state of American womens' golf vs. the Koreans and other Asians, because look at..... Annika.

[bscinstnct]

Ok, maybe clickbait. And I hope this has no resemblance to jimmy the greek ; )

 

But

 

With 2 young Asians leading the WM, I was thinking that with these guys at 6' and 200 lbs, its been the physical size difference that has been the reason we havent seen Asian dominance on the PGA the way it is seen on the lpga.

 

If the work ethic and golf culture from youth is there, and they are becoming just a big and physical as the rest of the tour, could be looking at very strong showings in the future.

 

Im all for it, btw. Let the best be the best.

 

Dear O.P.; just as you surmised, I agree your "theory" has "junk science" / Jimmy the Greek nonsense written all over it.

 

I am reminded of the piece I saw on Golf Channel circa 1999? This African fella living in (Montreal I think), married a young lady from Thailand. They and their 2 beautiful young children a boy & girl lived in a relatively modest apartment in which they had converted 1 of the 2 bedrooms to a makeshift "hitting bay". As I recall they had mattresses leaning against the walls and the kids were going through a basic daily regimen of school/read about golf/hit balls /repeat.

 

It was shockingly obvious this dude was trying to breed his own Tiger Woods and figured his "pure African" genes would be that much more potent than Earl Woods diluted down version. When you think about it, this could be the plot of any number of science fiction movies. I always wonder 2 things how golf channel actually spent money producing that piece; and 2 what ever became of the little kittens.

 

Now as for this thread:

 

Let me quote my 12 year old daughter who is quoting a movie or TV show or something...."that's not how this works, that's not how any of this works!"

 

If you bathe a large enough population with OPPORTUNITY eventually statistics say you'll get a golfer. Note my screen-name. Check into Malcolm Gladwell....he has simplified this kind of thing in a quite entertaining format.

 

I enjoyed outliers. Enlightening on multiple levels.

 

Nonetheless,

 

Athletics, by definition, is about *physical* capability.

 

On the whole, all other factors equal, a bigger person hits the ball farther than a smaller person. And no arguing that distance is a key factor to success in golf.

 

So, all things equal, cultural conditions that promote emphasis on a certain athletic endevour, for example, an increase in physical stature will produce more effective athletes.

 

What say you?

 

I say that "all things equal" says it all. Our world is of nearly infinite randomness. That's kind of the whole point....just when you think you can "reverse engineer" a human out come you realize things get messy, recessive genes, evolution, time. To me Outliers is an interesting view on some interesting people, it IS NOT however a realistic blueprint to building a human of any sort. Why hasn't the tour been overrun by 6'2" fast-twitch African Americans? Once upon a time a Black quarterback in big-time football was an oddity. Bob Gibson was a notable exception as a pitcher in big time baseball for a long time. Now a black pitcher or quarterback is a bit more common. What has changed?

 

What if I go try to find 5,000 Americans who fit Dustin Johnson physical specs (height, weight, body composition, bench press, vertical jump, broad jump etc.) how many could be African American, white, Latino, Asian? What if I limited my search to only inner cities?

 

What if I go try to find 5,000 Americans who fit Rory's same physical specs how many are could be African American, white, Latino, Asian? What if I limited my search to only country clubs?

 

To me those would be interesting endeavors but alone would do nothing statistically significant to identify a "world's best golfer"...

 

Despite all the mathematical, statistical and philosophical gymnastics one cares to do, it all comes down to a unique talent, meeting with a unique circumstance. Obviously the larger the sample size the better- "all things being equal"....which of course they NEVER are.

 

My argument as it relates to athletic success is actually completely race agnostic.

[mosesgolf]

My question is why does race even enter into the equation? It all boils down to hard work, talent and a little luck. To say the one race has more of it than the other is _______________.

[MtlJeff]

Humans have had very, very little time in the grand scheme of things to evolve differently based on circumstances. Minor differences sure but not major limiting ones. Success in athletics is going to come down to size of population and your ability to capitalize it vs the countries you are competing against.

[bscinstnct]

Humans have had very, very little time in the grand scheme of things to evolve differently based on circumstances. Minor differences sure but not major limiting ones. Success in athletics is going to come down to size of population and your ability to capitalize it vs the countries you are competing against.

 

Check this out. South Korean men increase in height from 1914 to 2014>

 

http://www.koreatime...316_210478.html

 

 

"South Korean men have grown from 159.8 centimeters to 174.9 centimeters, on average."

 

 

That's and increase from 5'2.5 to 5'7.5!!! For women, it's actually been an even greater percentage increase.

 

Other countries have experienced increase but not close in those percentage terms.

 

So, it's not that this race is better than that. More that with this increase in size, better athletic performance will be realized

[MtlJeff]

Yeah that's interesting for sure. I mean I think there's going to be some small difference in people based on geography and other over many years (I imagine if you put one group of people on Antarctica and another in say, Texas, 20000 years from now there would be some differences based on conditions and how we adapt to them, and also foods we'd eat and have access to etc)

 

But I think the differences overall with people on earth are fairly minor. A couple of inches in terms of height I think would only be mildly limiting.

 

It is an interesting subject that I am fairly terrified to talk about much. Given undertones

[Medic]

I don't think that it will end up being so much of a "domination" as it will be a more profound presence.

 

And I honestly believe that this may well be the year that an Asian wins a major in the US. WAY too much talent!

 

It is going to be such an awesome Masters...

 

What was YE Yang? Swedish?

 

My mistake. Guess I let my excitement get the best of me.

 

Swedish...

 

Almost choked on my after work cold adult beverage. : )

[Outlier]

Ok, maybe clickbait. And I hope this has no resemblance to jimmy the greek ; )

 

But

 

With 2 young Asians leading the WM, I was thinking that with these guys at 6' and 200 lbs, its been the physical size difference that has been the reason we havent seen Asian dominance on the PGA the way it is seen on the lpga.

 

If the work ethic and golf culture from youth is there, and they are becoming just a big and physical as the rest of the tour, could be looking at very strong showings in the future.

 

Im all for it, btw. Let the best be the best.

 

Dear O.P.; just as you surmised, I agree your "theory" has "junk science" / Jimmy the Greek nonsense written all over it.

 

I am reminded of the piece I saw on Golf Channel circa 1999? This African fella living in (Montreal I think), married a young lady from Thailand. They and their 2 beautiful young children a boy & girl lived in a relatively modest apartment in which they had converted 1 of the 2 bedrooms to a makeshift "hitting bay". As I recall they had mattresses leaning against the walls and the kids were going through a basic daily regimen of school/read about golf/hit balls /repeat.

 

It was shockingly obvious this dude was trying to breed his own Tiger Woods and figured his "pure African" genes would be that much more potent than Earl Woods diluted down version. When you think about it, this could be the plot of any number of science fiction movies. I always wonder 2 things how golf channel actually spent money producing that piece; and 2 what ever became of the little kittens.

 

Now as for this thread:

 

Let me quote my 12 year old daughter who is quoting a movie or TV show or something...."that's not how this works, that's not how any of this works!"

 

If you bathe a large enough population with OPPORTUNITY eventually statistics say you'll get a golfer. Note my screen-name. Check into Malcolm Gladwell....he has simplified this kind of thing in a quite entertaining format.

 

I enjoyed outliers. Enlightening on multiple levels.

 

Nonetheless,

 

Athletics, by definition, is about *physical* capability.

 

On the whole, all other factors equal, a bigger person hits the ball farther than a smaller person. And no arguing that distance is a key factor to success in golf.

 

So, all things equal, cultural conditions that promote emphasis on a certain athletic endevour, for example, an increase in physical stature will produce more effective athletes.

 

What say you?

 

I say that "all things equal" says it all. Our world is of nearly infinite randomness. That's kind of the whole point....just when you think you can "reverse engineer" a human out come you realize things get messy, recessive genes, evolution, time. To me Outliers is an interesting view on some interesting people, it IS NOT however a realistic blueprint to building a human of any sort. Why hasn't the tour been overrun by 6'2" fast-twitch African Americans? Once upon a time a Black quarterback in big-time football was an oddity. Bob Gibson was a notable exception as a pitcher in big time baseball for a long time. Now a black pitcher or quarterback is a bit more common. What has changed?

 

What if I go try to find 5,000 Americans who fit Dustin Johnson physical specs (height, weight, body composition, bench press, vertical jump, broad jump etc.) how many could be African American, white, Latino, Asian? What if I limited my search to only inner cities?

 

What if I go try to find 5,000 Americans who fit Rory's same physical specs how many are could be African American, white, Latino, Asian? What if I limited my search to only country clubs?

 

To me those would be interesting endeavors but alone would do nothing statistically significant to identify a "world's best golfer"...

 

Despite all the mathematical, statistical and philosophical gymnastics one cares to do, it all comes down to a unique talent, meeting with a unique circumstance. Obviously the larger the sample size the better- "all things being equal"....which of course they NEVER are.

 

My argument as it relates to athletic success is actually completely race agnostic.

 

Mine post is in specific response to references in the original post about 6 and 200 lbs. Asians potentially coming to dominate world golf. It seemed to suggest that now that they are as big and physical (in addition to their culture and work ethic) it's a wrap. It just seemed I was being similarly agnostic when pointing to other large samples of people who may not be Asian. apologies if I missed.

[slimeone]

Referring to a vague demographic as "Asians" with stereotypical references to physical size, skills and work ethic seems pretty ignorant to me.

[bscinstnct]

Referring to a vague demographic as "Asians" with stereotypical references to physical size, skills and work ethic seems pretty ignorant to me.

 

So, its wrong to refer to people from countries on the continent of Asia as Asians?

 

Think about it.

 

And as far as size, I later posted a link to and article in a South Korean news site citing data from a study.

 

http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/culture/2016/07/316_210478.html

 

I agree mentioning work ethic may have come across as a stereotype. But it was meant in tandem with a reference to countries with a culture, like others, that have a passion for golf.

[slimeone]

Referring to a vague demographic as "Asians" with stereotypical references to physical size, skills and work ethic seems pretty ignorant to me.

 

So, its wrong to refer to people from countries on the continent of Asia as Asians?

 

Think about it.

 

And as far as size, I later posted a link to and article in a South Korean news site citing data from a study.

 

http://www.koreatime...316_210478.html

 

I agree mentioning work ethic may have come across as a stereotype. But it was meant in tandem with a reference to countries with a culture, like others, that have a passion for golf.

Well the main ones that come to mind with a strong golf culture and presence are obviously Korea, Japan and Thailand and potentially China and amongst all those nations there are a lot of distinct differences in terms of culture, economy, access to opportunities etc.

[Sean2]

Referring to a vague demographic as "Asians" with stereotypical references to physical size, skills and work ethic seems pretty ignorant to me.

 

Not when referring to a certain part of the world: Europeans, South Americans, Africans, and the like. Look how many nations encompass each one of those geographic localities.

[heavy_hitter]

At the risk of sounding overly political, I think the golf community is going to have to be a little more mindful of its speech and "trigger warnings" as Asians begin to dominate.

 

I was watching the Sony Open a couple weeks ago and the announcer made a statement about one of the Asian players "sneaking up the leaderboard" as the camera panned out to Pearl Harbor. That's just mindless and obviously triggers notions of the surprise attack in 1941. Even in this thread, we have McIlroy and Day needing to "look over their shoulders" for Matsuyama, as if to ward off a surprise attack. Can Asians not face their competitors head on? Why can't Matsuyama just show up and dominate the field from the top down? Again, I think it plays to those classic, damaging stereotypes of the Asian male as "small," "quiet" and "sneaky." Not saying the poster meant anything by it, but just pointing out how ingrained its become in our language.

 

Same thing with references to their "work ethic" - calling to mind classic stereotypes of the Asian huddled over a math book, laboring through the problems, etc. Can't they be naturally gifted as anyone else? Maybe they don't need to practice much at all and like to spend more time partying? Is that why it was so difficult for the golf community to accept Anthony Kim? He didn't fit that stereotype of the "naturally subordinate, technologically gifted Asian who counts well, stays in line, etc.," as Eddie Huang wrote. Why aren't the Asian players allowed to hit a few balls and then go get wasted if they want to?

 

There have been several studies demonstrating that Asian males are basically the final frontier in terms of racial punching bags. I think back to Na being mercilessly heckled at Sawgrass that one year - would Harold Varner III have been heckled in that manner? And I've often cringed thinking about our first Asian winner of the Master's having to fend off references to General Tso's being served at the Champions Dinner, and what not. Especially if it happens during this current administration, which has seemed to embolden a lot of that behavior. I think that's what Elizabeth Warren was warning us about when she discussed how important it is not to normalize that behavior.

 

Given the golf community's dark past with some of these issues, I think it's something that enlightened observers will need to monitor and help keep in check as we move forward with more of an Asian presence.

 

If you think you are being political, you shouldn't post it.

 

Too PC. This post is the very reason why Trump is the President. Too many sensitive people. Was nothing wrong with the commentary or the presentation.

[Medic]

At the risk of sounding overly political, I think the golf community is going to have to be a little more mindful of its speech and "trigger warnings" as Asians begin to dominate.

 

I was watching the Sony Open a couple weeks ago and the announcer made a statement about one of the Asian players "sneaking up the leaderboard" as the camera panned out to Pearl Harbor. That's just mindless and obviously triggers notions of the surprise attack in 1941. Even in this thread, we have McIlroy and Day needing to "look over their shoulders" for Matsuyama, as if to ward off a surprise attack. Can Asians not face their competitors head on? Why can't Matsuyama just show up and dominate the field from the top down? Again, I think it plays to those classic, damaging stereotypes of the Asian male as "small," "quiet" and "sneaky." Not saying the poster meant anything by it, but just pointing out how ingrained its become in our language.

 

Same thing with references to their "work ethic" - calling to mind classic stereotypes of the Asian huddled over a math book, laboring through the problems, etc. Can't they be naturally gifted as anyone else? Maybe they don't need to practice much at all and like to spend more time partying? Is that why it was so difficult for the golf community to accept Anthony Kim? He didn't fit that stereotype of the "naturally subordinate, technologically gifted Asian who counts well, stays in line, etc.," as Eddie Huang wrote. Why aren't the Asian players allowed to hit a few balls and then go get wasted if they want to?

 

There have been several studies demonstrating that Asian males are basically the final frontier in terms of racial punching bags. I think back to Na being mercilessly heckled at Sawgrass that one year - would Harold Varner III have been heckled in that manner? And I've often cringed thinking about our first Asian winner of the Master's having to fend off references to General Tso's being served at the Champions Dinner, and what not. Especially if it happens during this current administration, which has seemed to embolden a lot of that behavior. I think that's what Elizabeth Warren was warning us about when she discussed how important it is not to normalize that behavior.

 

Given the golf community's dark past with some of these issues, I think it's something that enlightened observers will need to monitor and help keep in check as we move forward with more of an Asian presence.

 

If you think you are being political, you shouldn't post it.

 

Too PC. This post is the very reason why Trump is the President. Too many sensitive people. Was nothing wrong with the commentary or the presentation.

 

And the irony is that most of the time those being "protected" from things being said tell everyone they weren't being offended in the first place.

 

One of the nicest guys I know came from Viet Nam. He is just an amazing person. His fight against cancer after losing his daughter has been remarkable. I happily play in his tourney (in memory of his daughter) every year.

In him I see the American Dream. He came here with nothing only 4 decades ago. He went to school, became an engineer, has made a good living, raised a family, bought a home, and has a good life. I see an American. Period.

 

Drives me sort of nuts when people refer to their heritage along with being American. (Asian-American, African American, German-American, etc) I prefer to just say American. And as for the Asians from China, Korea, Japan, Taiwan, and elsewhere - in them I just see awesome players. Again not so much concern over where they are from. But I have an enormous amount of respect for their commitment and their talent. I am envious of it to be honest. (Who wouldn't be?)

I think, in short sum, that the world has become much smaller with the Internet coming of age and travel being so accessible. This should change how we view each other as humans before seeing anything else. Trying to keep this post on point and apolitical. I guess my job has afforded me an ability to just see things (and people) in a different light.

 

Just as I thoroughly enjoyed watching Tiger take over the events he played in, seeing anyone play well and dominate is a fun watch in my book. Who doesn't love seeing someone unexpected step up and take home a win? : )

[Outlier]

Referring to a vague demographic as "Asians" with stereotypical references to physical size, skills and work ethic seems pretty ignorant to me.

 

Seems that way to me. Seemed pretty clear in the O.P. too. But alas there always "alternative facts" to consider.

[Outlier]

At the risk of sounding overly political, I think the golf community is going to have to be a little more mindful of its speech and "trigger warnings" as Asians begin to dominate.

 

 

I was watching the Sony Open a couple weeks ago and the announcer made a statement about one of the Asian players "sneaking up the leaderboard" as the camera panned out to Pearl Harbor. That's just mindless and obviously triggers notions of the surprise attack in 1941. Even in this thread, we have McIlroy and Day needing to "look over their shoulders" for Matsuyama, as if to ward off a surprise attack. Can Asians not face their competitors head on? Why can't Matsuyama just show up and dominate the field from the top down? Again, I think it plays to those classic, damaging stereotypes of the Asian male as "small," "quiet" and "sneaky." Not saying the poster meant anything by it, but just pointing out how ingrained its become in our language.

 

Same thing with references to their "work ethic" - calling to mind classic stereotypes of the Asian huddled over a math book, laboring through the problems, etc. Can't they be naturally gifted as anyone else? Maybe they don't need to practice much at all and like to spend more time partying? Is that why it was so difficult for the golf community to accept Anthony Kim? He didn't fit that stereotype of the "naturally subordinate, technologically gifted Asian who counts well, stays in line, etc.," as Eddie Huang wrote. Why aren't the Asian players allowed to hit a few balls and then go get wasted if they want to?

 

There have been several studies demonstrating that Asian males are basically the final frontier in terms of racial punching bags. I think back to Na being mercilessly heckled at Sawgrass that one year - would Harold Varner III have been heckled in that manner? And I've often cringed thinking about our first Asian winner of the Master's having to fend off references to General Tso's being served at the Champions Dinner, and what not. Especially if it happens during this current administration, which has seemed to embolden a lot of that behavior. I think that's what Elizabeth Warren was warning us about when she discussed how important it is not to normalize that behavior.

 

Given the golf community's dark past with some of these issues, I think it's something that enlightened observers will need to monitor and help keep in check as we move forward with more of an Asian presence.

 

POST OF THE YEAR!

[John L.]

At the risk of sounding overly political, I think the golf community is going to have to be a little more mindful of its speech and "trigger warnings" as Asians begin to dominate.

 

I was watching the Sony Open a couple weeks ago and the announcer made a statement about one of the Asian players "sneaking up the leaderboard" as the camera panned out to Pearl Harbor. That's just mindless and obviously triggers notions of the surprise attack in 1941. Even in this thread, we have McIlroy and Day needing to "look over their shoulders" for Matsuyama, as if to ward off a surprise attack. Can Asians not face their competitors head on? Why can't Matsuyama just show up and dominate the field from the top down? Again, I think it plays to those classic, damaging stereotypes of the Asian male as "small," "quiet" and "sneaky." Not saying the poster meant anything by it, but just pointing out how ingrained its become in our language.

 

Same thing with references to their "work ethic" - calling to mind classic stereotypes of the Asian huddled over a math book, laboring through the problems, etc. Can't they be naturally gifted as anyone else? Maybe they don't need to practice much at all and like to spend more time partying? Is that why it was so difficult for the golf community to accept Anthony Kim? He didn't fit that stereotype of the "naturally subordinate, technologically gifted Asian who counts well, stays in line, etc.," as Eddie Huang wrote. Why aren't the Asian players allowed to hit a few balls and then go get wasted if they want to?

 

There have been several studies demonstrating that Asian males are basically the final frontier in terms of racial punching bags. I think back to Na being mercilessly heckled at Sawgrass that one year - would Harold Varner III have been heckled in that manner? And I've often cringed thinking about our first Asian winner of the Master's having to fend off references to General Tso's being served at the Champions Dinner, and what not. Especially if it happens during this current administration, which has seemed to embolden a lot of that behavior. I think that's what Elizabeth Warren was warning us about when she discussed how important it is not to normalize that behavior.

 

Given the golf community's dark past with some of these issues, I think it's something that enlightened observers will need to monitor and help keep in check as we move forward with more of an Asian presence.

 

This post gave me cancer.

 

Not sure why you think the golf community didn't accept AK? People love Anthony Kim for the exact reasons you say the golf community doesn't accept him. Not sure a prejudiced society would love a player who doesn't fit their supposed stereotypes. Seems like you're imagining things.

 

Second, players who take forever get heckled all the time. Remember Sergio's brutal heckling in New York due to regrippig issues? I'm almost 100% positive that Harold Varner would in fact get heckled if he was leading a major tournament and couldnt pull the trigger for mental yip/mental weakness reasons. I would also be positive that it would have nothing to do with his skin color.

 

So much more in this post that just blows my mind. As "Asians begin to dominate?" Because one Asian player is on a hot streak that we have seen from many, many times from many different players before.

 

Just LOL at you insinuating Jason Day, an Australian, and Mcilroy, Irish, needing to "look over their shoulders" for Matsuyama, has anything to do with the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor, America. "Look over your shoulders" is a metaphor derived from being chased while running, as Day and McIlroy currently are in the OWGR.

 

The golf communities' dark past? LMFAO. What are you even talking about? We have had some insensitive one-off comments from Fuzzy Zoeller and Sergio about Tiger, but if you think that is representative of the entire golf community, then you are guilty of the crime you are accusing others of! A common theme with a certain demographic of people in today's society .

 

Praising an Asian for their "work ethic" is now wrong too? What about when it was said about Vijay Singh or Tiger Woods or Tom Kite? I highly doubt the number 5 golfer in the world doesn't have a great work ethic. Even Dustin Johnson, one of the most talented players ever (who clearly likes to party), has credited his recent success due to his work with wedges on trackman.

 

I do think that your first point about sneaking up the leaderboard and showing Pearl Harbor is a little awkward. Every other point you made is completely delusional.

 

 

Lets dig up Charles Sifford and ask him what he thinks about your opinion..

[bscinstnct]

At the risk of sounding overly political, I think the golf community is going to have to be a little more mindful of its speech and "trigger warnings" as Asians begin to dominate.

 

 

I was watching the Sony Open a couple weeks ago and the announcer made a statement about one of the Asian players "sneaking up the leaderboard" as the camera panned out to Pearl Harbor. That's just mindless and obviously triggers notions of the surprise attack in 1941. Even in this thread, we have McIlroy and Day needing to "look over their shoulders" for Matsuyama, as if to ward off a surprise attack. Can Asians not face their competitors head on? Why can't Matsuyama just show up and dominate the field from the top down? Again, I think it plays to those classic, damaging stereotypes of the Asian male as "small," "quiet" and "sneaky." Not saying the poster meant anything by it, but just pointing out how ingrained its become in our language.

 

Same thing with references to their "work ethic" - calling to mind classic stereotypes of the Asian huddled over a math book, laboring through the problems, etc. Can't they be naturally gifted as anyone else? Maybe they don't need to practice much at all and like to spend more time partying? Is that why it was so difficult for the golf community to accept Anthony Kim? He didn't fit that stereotype of the "naturally subordinate, technologically gifted Asian who counts well, stays in line, etc.," as Eddie Huang wrote. Why aren't the Asian players allowed to hit a few balls and then go get wasted if they want to?

 

There have been several studies demonstrating that Asian males are basically the final frontier in terms of racial punching bags. I think back to Na being mercilessly heckled at Sawgrass that one year - would Harold Varner III have been heckled in that manner? And I've often cringed thinking about our first Asian winner of the Master's having to fend off references to General Tso's being served at the Champions Dinner, and what not. Especially if it happens during this current administration, which has seemed to embolden a lot of that behavior. I think that's what Elizabeth Warren was warning us about when she discussed how important it is not to normalize that behavior.

 

Given the golf community's dark past with some of these issues, I think it's something that enlightened observers will need to monitor and help keep in check as we move forward with more of an Asian presence.

 

POST OF THE YEAR!

 

It sounds paranoid. Really paranoid.

 

And suggesting that the golf community didnt love AK?

 

Thats even more paranoid.

 

For me, growing up in NY, going to school from a young age with representatives of every continent,and countries incliding

 

Japan, china, south korea, philippines, thailand, iran, afghanistan (and many others). And spending time with families, never seeing race as a factor in how to value another person.

 

I am disappointed that me stating that

 

Asians getting bigger (a fact) is going to produce more competitive golfers

 

Is seen in so many weird angles rather than the simple logic of the statement.

 

 

[PGArox]

Amazing this thread wasn't locked long ago. Mods must be on vacation.

[mjen43]

At the risk of sounding overly political, I think the golf community is going to have to be a little more mindful of its speech and "trigger warnings" as Asians begin to dominate.

 

I was watching the Sony Open a couple weeks ago and the announcer made a statement about one of the Asian players "sneaking up the leaderboard" as the camera panned out to Pearl Harbor. That's just mindless and obviously triggers notions of the surprise attack in 1941. Even in this thread, we have McIlroy and Day needing to "look over their shoulders" for Matsuyama, as if to ward off a surprise attack. Can Asians not face their competitors head on? Why can't Matsuyama just show up and dominate the field from the top down? Again, I think it plays to those classic, damaging stereotypes of the Asian male as "small," "quiet" and "sneaky." Not saying the poster meant anything by it, but just pointing out how ingrained its become in our language.

 

Same thing with references to their "work ethic" - calling to mind classic stereotypes of the Asian huddled over a math book, laboring through the problems, etc. Can't they be naturally gifted as anyone else? Maybe they don't need to practice much at all and like to spend more time partying? Is that why it was so difficult for the golf community to accept Anthony Kim? He didn't fit that stereotype of the "naturally subordinate, technologically gifted Asian who counts well, stays in line, etc.," as Eddie Huang wrote. Why aren't the Asian players allowed to hit a few balls and then go get wasted if they want to?

 

There have been several studies demonstrating that Asian males are basically the final frontier in terms of racial punching bags. I think back to Na being mercilessly heckled at Sawgrass that one year - would Harold Varner III have been heckled in that manner? And I've often cringed thinking about our first Asian winner of the Master's having to fend off references to General Tso's being served at the Champions Dinner, and what not. Especially if it happens during this current administration, which has seemed to embolden a lot of that behavior. I think that's what Elizabeth Warren was warning us about when she discussed how important it is not to normalize that behavior.

 

Given the golf community's dark past with some of these issues, I think it's something that enlightened observers will need to monitor and help keep in check as we move forward with more of an Asian presence.

 

This post gave me cancer.

 

Not sure why you think the golf community didn't accept AK? People love Anthony Kim for the exact reasons you say the golf community doesn't accept him. Not sure a prejudiced society would love a player who doesn't fit their supposed stereotypes. Seems like you're imagining things.

 

Second, players who take forever get heckled all the time. Remember Sergio's brutal heckling in New York due to regrippig issues? I'm almost 100% positive that Harold Varner would in fact get heckled if he was leading a major tournament and couldnt pull the trigger for mental yip/mental weakness reasons. I would also be positive that it would have nothing to do with his skin color.

 

So much more in this post that just blows my mind. As "Asians begin to dominate?" Because one Asian player is on a hot streak that we have seen from many, many times from many different players before.

 

Just LOL at you insinuating Jason Day, an Australian, and Mcilroy, Irish, needing to "look over their shoulders" for Matsuyama, has anything to do with the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor, America. "Look over your shoulders" is a metaphor derived from being chased while running, as Day and McIlroy currently are in the OWGR.

 

The golf communities' dark past? LMFAO. What are you even talking about? We have had some insensitive one-off comments from Fuzzy Zoeller and Sergio about Tiger, but if you think that is representative of the entire golf community, then you are guilty of the crime you are accusing others of! A common theme with a certain demographic of people in today's society ��.

 

Praising an Asian for their "work ethic" is now wrong too? What about when it was said about Vijay Singh or Tiger Woods or Tom Kite? I highly doubt the number 5 golfer in the world doesn't have a great work ethic. Even Dustin Johnson, one of the most talented players ever (who clearly likes to party), has credited his recent success due to his work with wedges on trackman.

 

I do think that your first point about sneaking up the leaderboard and showing Pearl Harbor is a little awkward. Every other point you made is completely delusional.

 

 

Lets dig up Charles Sifford and ask him what he thinks about your opinion..

 

If you think I'm wrong let's hear your thoughts. What does your post even mean? It has nothing to do with what I said.

[mokedaddy]

:looks around: Looking awfully white in here. :leaves quietly:

[PGArox]

:looks around: Looking awfully white in here. :leaves quietly:

 

We just painted. ?

[Outlier]

At the risk of sounding overly political, I think the golf community is going to have to be a little more mindful of its speech and "trigger warnings" as Asians begin to dominate.

 

 

I was watching the Sony Open a couple weeks ago and the announcer made a statement about one of the Asian players "sneaking up the leaderboard" as the camera panned out to Pearl Harbor. That's just mindless and obviously triggers notions of the surprise attack in 1941. Even in this thread, we have McIlroy and Day needing to "look over their shoulders" for Matsuyama, as if to ward off a surprise attack. Can Asians not face their competitors head on? Why can't Matsuyama just show up and dominate the field from the top down? Again, I think it plays to those classic, damaging stereotypes of the Asian male as "small," "quiet" and "sneaky." Not saying the poster meant anything by it, but just pointing out how ingrained its become in our language.

 

Same thing with references to their "work ethic" - calling to mind classic stereotypes of the Asian huddled over a math book, laboring through the problems, etc. Can't they be naturally gifted as anyone else? Maybe they don't need to practice much at all and like to spend more time partying? Is that why it was so difficult for the golf community to accept Anthony Kim? He didn't fit that stereotype of the "naturally subordinate, technologically gifted Asian who counts well, stays in line, etc.," as Eddie Huang wrote. Why aren't the Asian players allowed to hit a few balls and then go get wasted if they want to?

 

There have been several studies demonstrating that Asian males are basically the final frontier in terms of racial punching bags. I think back to Na being mercilessly heckled at Sawgrass that one year - would Harold Varner III have been heckled in that manner? And I've often cringed thinking about our first Asian winner of the Master's having to fend off references to General Tso's being served at the Champions Dinner, and what not. Especially if it happens during this current administration, which has seemed to embolden a lot of that behavior. I think that's what Elizabeth Warren was warning us about when she discussed how important it is not to normalize that behavior.

 

Given the golf community's dark past with some of these issues, I think it's something that enlightened observers will need to monitor and help keep in check as we move forward with more of an Asian presence.

 

POST OF THE YEAR!

 

It sounds paranoid. Really paranoid.

 

And suggesting that the golf community didnt love AK?

 

Thats even more paranoid.

 

For me, growing up in NY, going to school from a young age with representatives of every continent,and countries incliding

 

Japan, china, south korea, philippines, thailand, iran, afghanistan (and many others). And spending time with families, never seeing race as a factor in how to value another person.

 

I am disappointed that me stating that

 

Asians getting bigger (a fact) is going to produce more competitive golfers

 

Is seen in so many weird angles rather than the simple logic of the statement.

 

I may have thought it paranoid until about November 9, 2016. Unfortunately it's NOT paranoid it is the a sad commentary on the very real way things work in America, what motivates our populous and how we can collectively be moved by hysterical fiction. We are literally rallying the troops to avoid another massacre at Bowling Green (which of course never happened). "Dog whistles" are real not paranoia and I applaud the post for pointing it out in the context of the "Oriental" immigrant golfer.