Leadbetters A Swing

[Hammerboy]

[quote name='firstbatch' timestamp='1430758658' post='11495857']
[quote name='Steve Ryan' timestamp='1430757977' post='11495779']
Watched the video last night. The concept seems simple enough and I agree that it doesn't lead to EE because the club ends up in a good position at the top.

He didn't go into great detail about it, but it's based on the idea of simplifying the backswing so that it's easier to get into a good position at the top and avoid coming over the top on the way down. The way he explains this is to avoid rolling the hands over early in the backswing. He want's you to keep the right hand on top of the left a bit longer than you normally would. For some people, this will lead to "Hooding" the club, but the natural tendency is to eventually roll the hands over as you approach the top of the swing. This basically forces a loop in the swing and makes it easier to avoid coming over the top.

I like the idea and think it's worth looking into the book for the rest of the details.
[/quote]

Sounds a lot like the Joe Dante's Magic move described in his book many years ago. Just another re-hash of the same old stuff
[/quote]

It is absolutely nothing like Joe Dantes Magic Move, not even remotely close. Where do some of you come up with this stuff?

How do you know that the A Swing is just another re-hash of the same old stuff? Have you seen the book, to my knowledge it has not even been released yet? Did you get an advance preview, I bet not.

[Hammerboy]

[quote name='Steve Ryan' timestamp='1430757977' post='11495779']
Watched the video last night. The concept seems simple enough and I agree that it doesn't lead to EE because the club ends up in a good position at the top.

He didn't go into great detail about it, but it's based on the idea of simplifying the backswing so that it's easier to get into a good position at the top and avoid coming over the top on the way down. The way he explains this is to avoid rolling the hands over early in the backswing. He want's you to keep the right hand on top of the left a bit longer than you normally would. For some people, this will lead to "Hooding" the club, but the natural tendency is to eventually roll the hands over as you approach the top of the swing. This basically forces a loop in the swing and makes it easier to avoid coming over the top.

I like the idea and think it's worth looking into the book for the rest of the details.
[/quote]

Excellent synopsis. Good to see that there are some here with an open mind.

THe A swing IMHO is nothing more than a better way to get to the top. And makes it a whole lot easier to slot the club on the way down. What LEadbetter has accomplished is just simplifying it all to a few steps.

This is probably a scary prospect to many instructors out there, that try and make this more than it is. And charge accordingly. Don't worry guys, less lessons mean you can spend more time here being a naysayer. LOL!!!!!!!!!!

THis book has been long anticipated, and I bet it will be a hit. The game is in trouble, courses are closing, rounds are down nationally, so we need a breath of fresh air. Maybe this will be it. I have played 2 rounds using just what I saw on the videos, love the simplicity of it all. Won't say 50 more yards off the tee, just less swing thoughts, more simpicity.

I see nothing that predisposes this swing to EE and hooks any more than other swings, still waiting for a convincing argument here.

Book comes out next week. Hope we can see some intelligent discussion here

[GaryRead]

Not bothered to see if this has been posted yet but it's probably the most thorough explanation of the swing for free

http://vola.com/filedata/1/product_data/service_explode/PDF/ser_A34.pdf

[myreside]

[quote name='Hammerboy' timestamp='1430813150' post='11501113']
[quote name='firstbatch' timestamp='1430758658' post='11495857']
[quote name='Steve Ryan' timestamp='1430757977' post='11495779']
Watched the video last night. The concept seems simple enough and I agree that it doesn't lead to EE because the club ends up in a good position at the top.

He didn't go into great detail about it, but it's based on the idea of simplifying the backswing so that it's easier to get into a good position at the top and avoid coming over the top on the way down. The way he explains this is to avoid rolling the hands over early in the backswing. He want's you to keep the right hand on top of the left a bit longer than you normally would. For some people, this will lead to "Hooding" the club, but the natural tendency is to eventually roll the hands over as you approach the top of the swing. This basically forces a loop in the swing and makes it easier to avoid coming over the top.

I like the idea and think it's worth looking into the book for the rest of the details.
[/quote]

Sounds a lot like the Joe Dante's Magic move described in his book many years ago. Just another re-hash of the same old stuff
[/quote]

It is absolutely nothing like Joe Dantes Magic Move, not even remotely close. Where do some of you come up with this stuff?

How do you know that the A Swing is just another re-hash of the same old stuff? Have you seen the book, to my knowledge it has not even been released yet? Did you get an advance preview, I bet not.
[/quote]

I thought no-one had seen the book yet as it hasn't been released yet...

[flatnstuck]

[quote name='woody089' timestamp='1430759432' post='11495959']
[quote name='rpmgolfer' timestamp='1430251894' post='11460455']
Michelle Wie just called. She wants the last decade of swing changes to disappear. Can you refute that Lydia is not lowering and stuck now? She's got some serious pelvic tilt now and her left arm is pointing well off to the right in the downswing. No surprise Wie had her best year on tour when she ditched Leadbetter for six months. And I already applauded Lydia's old coach and the swing he helped form with her.
[/quote]

I hope Leadbetter is not going to Michelle Wie Lydia Ko.
[/quote]

Too late. Her backswing is already taking on and odd look. Watching Lead's explanation of the method explains why.

[eagle1997]

[quote name='Hammerboy' timestamp='1430814113' post='11501131']
This is probably a scary prospect to many instructors out there, that try and make this more than it is. [b]And charge accordingly.[/b] Don't worry guys, less lessons mean you can spend more time here being a naysayer. LOL!!!!!!!!!!

THis book has been long anticipated, and I bet it will be a hit. [b]The game is in trouble, courses are closing, rounds are down nationally, so we need a breath of fresh air. Maybe this will be it.[/b] I have played 2 rounds using just what I saw on the videos, love the simplicity of it all. Won't say 50 more yards off the tee, just less swing thoughts, more simpicity.
[/quote]

1. a swingfix lesson with monte or iteach is $20.

2. [i]david leadbetter, saving golf one book sale at a time![/i] you cannot be serious with this. are you his social media agent or something?



i'm not saying that he won't sell a ton of books, he probably will and good for him.

however, your statements are so over the top, it's comical.

[bph7]

[quote name='eagle1997' timestamp='1430834521' post='11502105']
[quote name='Hammerboy' timestamp='1430814113' post='11501131']
This is probably a scary prospect to many instructors out there, that try and make this more than it is. [b]And charge accordingly.[/b] Don't worry guys, less lessons mean you can spend more time here being a naysayer. LOL!!!!!!!!!!

THis book has been long anticipated, and I bet it will be a hit. [b]The game is in trouble, courses are closing, rounds are down nationally, so we need a breath of fresh air. Maybe this will be it.[/b] I have played 2 rounds using just what I saw on the videos, love the simplicity of it all. Won't say 50 more yards off the tee, just less swing thoughts, more simpicity.
[/quote]

1. a swingfix lesson with monte or iteach is $20.

2. [i]david leadbetter, saving golf one book sale at a time![/i] you cannot be serious with this. are you his social media agent or something?



i'm not saying that he won't sell a ton of books, he probably will and good for him.

however, your statements are so over the top, it's comical.
[/quote]

This, also love being told to have an open mind by one who already has their mind made up that the book is great before its even released. Wouldn't doing that make one close minded to the possibility that the book might not be great?

[kyle75]

The new digital edition of Golf Digest is available for download and the A swing is featured in it. After reading it and watching the video's, I would be very hesitant to try this swing. You basically take the club straight up and then have to dramatically flatten it on the way down. It seems like this swing will just make people's swing very steep and cause more problems. It's like Stack and Tilt 2.0

[Hammerboy]

[quote name='kyle75' timestamp='1430844697' post='11503307']
The new digital edition of Golf Digest is available for download and the A swing is featured in it. After reading it and watching the video's, I would be very hesitant to try this swing. You basically take the club straight up and then have to dramatically flatten it on the way down. It seems like this swing will just make people's swing very steep and cause more problems. It's like Stack and Tilt 2.0
[/quote]

Wrong wrong wrong!

You do not dramatically flatten the club in the way down. It GETS flattened on the way down. There is a differerence.

There is no conscious exertion to flatten the club. That is very hard with any type of swing instruction.

Oh brother, what people will come up with!

[kyle75]

[quote name='Hammerboy' timestamp='1430845655' post='11503413']
[quote name='kyle75' timestamp='1430844697' post='11503307']
The new digital edition of Golf Digest is available for download and the A swing is featured in it. After reading it and watching the video's, I would be very hesitant to try this swing. You basically take the club straight up and then have to dramatically flatten it on the way down. It seems like this swing will just make people's swing very steep and cause more problems. It's like Stack and Tilt 2.0
[/quote]

Wrong wrong wrong!

You do not dramatically flatten the club in the way down. It GETS flattened on the way down. There is a differerence.

There is no conscious exertion to flatten the club. That is very hard with any type of swing instruction.

Oh brother, what people will come up with!
[/quote]Have you read the article on Golf Digest?? That is how it is explained, that you make a v with the swing. To make this v, you have to flatten the swing, it just doesn't happen by some miracle. Just read the article and you can see how dramatically you have to flatten the club on the downswing.

[MonteScheinblum]

[quote name='kyle75' timestamp='1430847557' post='11503623']
[quote name='Hammerboy' timestamp='1430845655' post='11503413']
[quote name='kyle75' timestamp='1430844697' post='11503307']
The new digital edition of Golf Digest is available for download and the A swing is featured in it. After reading it and watching the video's, I would be very hesitant to try this swing. You basically take the club straight up and then have to dramatically flatten it on the way down. It seems like this swing will just make people's swing very steep and cause more problems. It's like Stack and Tilt 2.0
[/quote]

Wrong wrong wrong!

You do not dramatically flatten the club in the way down. It GETS flattened on the way down. There is a differerence.

There is no conscious exertion to flatten the club. That is very hard with any type of swing instruction.

Oh brother, what people will come up with!
[/quote]Have you read the article on Golf Digest?? That is how it is explained, that you make a v with the swing. To make this v, you have to flatten the swing, it just doesn't happen by some miracle. Just read the article and you can see how dramatically you have to flatten the club on the downswing.
[/quote]


...and that's why many people will EE.

[flatnstuck]

[quote name='Hammerboy' timestamp='1430845655' post='11503413']
[quote name='kyle75' timestamp='1430844697' post='11503307']
The new digital edition of Golf Digest is available for download and the A swing is featured in it. After reading it and watching the video's, I would be very hesitant to try this swing. You basically take the club straight up and then have to dramatically flatten it on the way down. It seems like this swing will just make people's swing very steep and cause more problems. It's like Stack and Tilt 2.0
[/quote]

Wrong wrong wrong!

You do not dramatically flatten the club in the way down. It GETS flattened on the way down. There is a differerence.

There is no conscious exertion to flatten the club. That is very hard with any type of swing instruction.

Oh brother, what people will come up with!
[/quote]

Trying really hard to sell this aren't you?

[Atrayn]

Glad Monte piped in on the "why" about the EE. He is on point with that. All Leadbetter is really trying to do is get the club as close to being on plane all the way through the swing as possible. There's no ground breaking stuff here. It actually makes some sense from a theoretical view point. I guarantee some people will have some success with it, because it may take some of the other variability out of their backswing.

However, one size doesn't fit all.

[MonteScheinblum]

[quote name='Atrayn' timestamp='1430857784' post='11504837']
Glad Monte piped in on the "why" about the EE. He is on point with that. All Leadbetter is really trying to do is get the club as close to being on plane all the way through the swing as possible. There's no ground breaking stuff here. It actually makes some sense from a theoretical view point. I guarantee some people will have some success with it, because it may take some of the other variability out of their backswing.

However, one size doesn't fit all.
[/quote]

I understand the theory. The body reacts on the downswing the best it can to hit the ball. So let's back the body into a corner and force it to shallow the club.

This swing will work nicely in the beginning for many. Many will eventually fight the shanks, others will fight the hooks with the driver...some will fight both.

The end result will be many chronic slicers will be fixed (indefinitely, but not permenantly)...but the majority will struggle from the massive shallowing.

[Atrayn]

[quote name='MonteScheinblum' timestamp='1430858132' post='11504897']
[quote name='Atrayn' timestamp='1430857784' post='11504837']
Glad Monte piped in on the "why" about the EE. He is on point with that. All Leadbetter is really trying to do is get the club as close to being on plane all the way through the swing as possible. There's no ground breaking stuff here. It actually makes some sense from a theoretical view point. I guarantee some people will have some success with it, because it may take some of the other variability out of their backswing.

However, one size doesn't fit all.
[/quote]

I understand the theory. The body reacts on the downswing the best it can to hit the ball. So let's back the body into a corner and force it to shallow the club.

This swing will work nicely in the beginning for many. Many will eventually fight the shanks, others will fight the hooks with the driver...some will fight both.

The end result will be many chronic slicers will be fixed (indefinitely, but not permenantly)...but the majority will struggle from the massive shallowing.
[/quote]

Monte - that was not directed at you. Of course you understand the theory.

[dukeman]

So what's the "A"?

[northgolf]

[quote name='Steve Ryan' timestamp='1430244243' post='11459469']
Coming to this forum and starting a thread about David Leadbetters swing is actually pretty funny. Yes, we know who he is and most of us are familiar with his teaching principals. It's nothing new. Starting this thread is similar to someone going to an all [s]Republican [/s] Democratic forum and starting a thread asking if anyone has heard of a guy named [s]Ronald Reagan[/s] Rush Limbaugh.

Anyway....I hope the Leadbetter swing works out for ya. Go to the range and hit a few more balls though. If you can take it past the honeymoon stage then congrats.
[/quote]

FIFY

[northgolf]

[quote name='Hammerboy' timestamp='1430813150' post='11501113']
[quote name='firstbatch' timestamp='1430758658' post='11495857']
[quote name='Steve Ryan' timestamp='1430757977' post='11495779']
Watched the video last night. The concept seems simple enough and I agree that it doesn't lead to EE because the club ends up in a good position at the top.

He didn't go into great detail about it, but it's based on the idea of simplifying the backswing so that it's easier to get into a good position at the top and avoid coming over the top on the way down. The way he explains this is to avoid rolling the hands over early in the backswing. He want's you to keep the right hand on top of the left a bit longer than you normally would. For some people, this will lead to "Hooding" the club, but the natural tendency is to eventually roll the hands over as you approach the top of the swing. This basically forces a loop in the swing and makes it easier to avoid coming over the top.

I like the idea and think it's worth looking into the book for the rest of the details.
[/quote]

Sounds a lot like the Joe Dante's Magic move described in his book many years ago. Just another re-hash of the same old stuff
[/quote]

It is absolutely nothing like Joe Dantes Magic Move, not even remotely close. Where do some of you come up with this stuff?

How do you know that the A Swing is just another re-hash of the same old stuff? Have you seen the book, to my knowledge it has not even been released yet? Did you get an advance preview, I bet not.
[/quote]

So it sounds like you did get an advanced preview. Do you have a dog in this hunt?

[eagle1997]

[quote name='dukeman' timestamp='1430860077' post='11505155']
So what's the "A"?
[/quote]

"A" is actually english short hand for 'balloon knot.'

[Ghost of Snead]

Looks like a hybrid of the swings of Calvin Peete and Jim Furyk ... Leadbetter even mentioned in his PGA Show presentation how he liked that Peete kept the club head outside the hands for so long in the swing.

[northgolf]

[quote name='Hammerboy' timestamp='1430814113' post='11501131']
[quote name='Steve Ryan' timestamp='1430757977' post='11495779']
Watched the video last night. The concept seems simple enough and I agree that it doesn't lead to EE because the club ends up in a good position at the top.

He didn't go into great detail about it, but it's based on the idea of simplifying the backswing so that it's easier to get into a good position at the top and avoid coming over the top on the way down. The way he explains this is to avoid rolling the hands over early in the backswing. He want's you to keep the right hand on top of the left a bit longer than you normally would. For some people, this will lead to "Hooding" the club, but the natural tendency is to eventually roll the hands over as you approach the top of the swing. This basically forces a loop in the swing and makes it easier to avoid coming over the top.

I like the idea and think it's worth looking into the book for the rest of the details.
[/quote]

Excellent synopsis. Good to see that there are some here with an open mind.

THe A swing IMHO is nothing more than a better way to get to the top. And makes it a whole lot easier to slot the club on the way down. What LEadbetter has accomplished is just simplifying it all to a few steps.

This is probably a scary prospect to many instructors out there, that try and make this more than it is. And charge accordingly. Don't worry guys, less lessons mean you can spend more time here being a naysayer. LOL!!!!!!!!!!

THis book has been long anticipated, and I bet it will be a hit. The game is in trouble, courses are closing, rounds are down nationally, so we need a breath of fresh air. Maybe this will be it. I have played 2 rounds using just what I saw on the videos, love the simplicity of it all. Won't say 50 more yards off the tee, just less swing thoughts, more simpicity.

I see nothing that predisposes this swing to EE and hooks any more than other swings, still waiting for a convincing argument here.

Book comes out next week. Hope we can see some intelligent discussion here
[/quote]

Been there, done that. Gets you completely set for punch elbow in the downswing as you are loading into your right palm (you have to fight a flying right elbow). I can play from in the fairway from that position all day long, but I'll be twenty yards shorter on every club. If you are strong and fast enough, that trade of twenty yards shorter for in the fairway and on target is money. For me, that 20 yards per club means I'm not reaching any hole longer than 470 in 2 - I'm giving to much away to the opponent. I can keep the pitch elbow swing in play, so why?

Say, did Faldo get shorter when he went to Lead - maybe my memory is playing tricks on me? Very similar to square to square and shut to open swings.

Hmmm, was I a big proponent of the Faldo drill a few years back, and do you think I have a reason I don't like it so much anymore (insidious poison that once drank never leaves your neural paths).

All my bias and bad attitude aside, I think there is space for a conversation about loading into the right palm at the top vs. loading into a cocked flat left wrist and the implications of the two on the downswing.

[northgolf]

[quote name='dukeman' timestamp='1430860077' post='11505155']
So what's the "A"?
[/quote]

Well, in this thread it's probably me.

[notsohard]

[quote name='woody089' timestamp='1430759432' post='11495959']
[quote name='rpmgolfer' timestamp='1430251894' post='11460455']
Michelle Wie just called. She wants the last decade of swing changes to disappear. Can you refute that Lydia is not lowering and stuck now? She's got some serious pelvic tilt now and her left arm is pointing well off to the right in the downswing. No surprise Wie had her best year on tour when she ditched Leadbetter for six months. And I already applauded Lydia's old coach and the swing he helped form with her.
[/quote]

I hope Leadbetter is not going to Michelle Wie Lydia Ko.
[/quote]

Unfortunately it looks like going down that road.
Whoever gave her that advice is a fool, she should have remained with her coach that took her to number one.
I have watched her play since she was 14 and this latest swing change is ugly.
Her natural ability will get her over the line for now, but who knows how much this will affect her game later.
Time will tell.

[glord1894]

I really like Leadbetter's "Faults and Fixes" in terms of swing instruction. The "A" swing seems a bit unorthodox to me - I think I would prefer his earlier work. It might benifit people who come over the top all the time.

[chigolfer1]

To my untrained eye, the whole swing looks like a virtual copy of Calvin's.


[quote name='lefty57' timestamp='1430862220' post='11505381']
Looks like a hybrid of the swings of Calvin Peete and Jim Furyk ... Leadbetter even mentioned in his PGA Show presentation how he liked that Peete kept the club head outside the hands for so long in the swing.
[/quote]

[Chunky]

Lead stated during his presentation at the 2015 PGA show that the "A" stands for Alternative. There are some Youtube available presentations on this method.

[Ghost of Snead]

[quote name='Chunky' timestamp='1430925674' post='11509833']
Lead stated during his presentation at the 2015 PGA show that the "A" stands for Alternative. There are some Youtube available presentations on this method.
[/quote]

Alternative to what ?

[Atrayn]

[quote name='lefty57' timestamp='1430925845' post='11509851']
[quote name='Chunky' timestamp='1430925674' post='11509833']
Lead stated during his presentation at the 2015 PGA show that the "A" stands for Alternative. There are some Youtube available presentations on this method.
[/quote]

Alternative to what ?
[/quote]

Everything else... to stay relevant.

[mikpga]

I'm not a fan of restricting trail hip from "turning" during backswing.

[MacMan]

[quote name='notsohard' timestamp='1430866261' post='11505773']
[quote name='woody089' timestamp='1430759432' post='11495959']
[quote name='rpmgolfer' timestamp='1430251894' post='11460455']
Michelle Wie just called. She wants the last decade of swing changes to disappear. Can you refute that Lydia is not lowering and stuck now? She's got some serious pelvic tilt now and her left arm is pointing well off to the right in the downswing. No surprise Wie had her best year on tour when she ditched Leadbetter for six months. And I already applauded Lydia's old coach and the swing he helped form with her.
[/quote]

I hope Leadbetter is not going to Michelle Wie Lydia Ko.
[/quote]

Unfortunately it looks like going down that road.
Whoever gave her that advice is a fool, she should have remained with her coach that took her to number one.
I have watched her play since she was 14 and this latest swing change is ugly.
Her natural ability will get her over the line for now, but who knows how much this will affect her game later.
Time will tell.
[/quote]

This^^^^^