Low vs High Bounce Wedges. Which?

[Righty to Lefty]

On 11/26/2022 at 4:32 AM, J13 said:

 

Agree for the most part.  You don't want to take big divots with partial shots but sometimes turf/course conditions make that impossible. For any diggers out there that want IMO the best anti dig wedge on the planet it's the Edel SMS D grind.  Nothing touches it if you don't might paying a few bucks more for a Forged wedge.  For guys that love opening the face on tight lies i've found the Tiger grind to be really great.

I managed to get some lefty Edel wedges a few years ago that were ground to have 25 degrees of bounce in them and I have yet to put them in play despite having them for over 4 years now because I know that there are no replacements available. The lefty life is rough?!! You should NEVER take a divot on a partial wedge shot even in soggy conditions because if you are using the bounce you are no taking a divot.  

 

This is not a divot and you can tell because the turf just explodes on impact with the ground: 

 

[JSSPRADLIN]

On 11/17/2022 at 3:14 PM, crivas said:

Man, how times have changed on available grinds and bounce. Look at those Cleveland numbers from back in the day.

 

Low Bounce 56 was 12* down from 14* 🙃

 

 

It's really interesting that you post this chart.  I've struggled with wedge play all of my adult life.  I don't have the yips, but I have crazy inconsistent contact around the green with a lot of deceleration and hesitancy.  Except for flop shots and bunker shots.  I can hit pretty much any flop or bunker shot you need to hit.

 

Growing up though I never had that problem.  I had a 56 degree 588 that I used for everything.  I could get up and down from anywhere from any lie.  But I also had a 60 degree 588 that I couldn't do anything with.  Everything around the green was chunked.  

 

As a kid I never understood why.  I didn't know what bounce was nor what each club had.  

 

When researching new wedges I remembered that 588 sand wedge was the best my short game has ever been, so I looked up what you posted.  I went and demo'd a Vokey SM9 56F14 and it was like going back in time.  My current SW has 8 degrees of bounce and that change made all the difference in the world.    

 

 

[ballzo]

I played low bounce wedges when I first started. I figured if tiger played it.....it must be right. I struggled with wedges for years before I went to high bounce scratch wedges. Changed my game. Its like playing with a safety net.

[Begbie]

How many degrees of bounce are you adding when you open the face?

[J13]

On 12/1/2022 at 12:12 AM, ballzo said:

I played low bounce wedges when I first started. I figured if tiger played it.....it must be right. I struggled with wedges for years before I went to high bounce scratch wedges. Changed my game. Its like playing with a safety net.

Majority of golfers need more bounce than what they are currently playing.  IMO there are more than a few reasons why this happens but the top few would be

1. Wedges are the least fit club in players bags (next to putters)

2. Wedge grinds/bounce is a lot of smoke and mirrors (bounce numbers on most wedges are not even close to accurate)

3. Players don't understand what bounce is or does or why it's important.

[nitram]

3 minutes ago, J13 said:

Majority of golfers need more bounce than what they are currently playing.  IMO there are more than a few reasons why this happens but the top few would be

1. Wedges are the least fit club in players bags (next to putters)

2. Wedge grinds/bounce is a lot of smoke and mirrors (bounce numbers on most wedges are not even close to accurate)

3. Players don't understand what bounce is or does or why it's important.

 

I'll take #3 for a thousand, Alex.

[5hort5tuff]

Not only do players not understand or use bounce correctly, I feel the is some "stigma"? Haha in using higher bounce wedges. Everyone wants a nice, clean looking wedge. People who can't make a routine chip or bump and run will buy 6* and 8* bounce wedges because they think it will help.  It's a bit if a vicous cycle. 

 

I think in order to justify this entire conversation, one has to consider bounce + sole width + grind. You really can't compare one without the others imo. 

 

Will I be caught using a 35* infomercial wedge? Absolutely not. I do use some Clevelend CBX Zipcores that I find quite forgiving. 

[bluedot]

Anytime a question like this is asked here, MOST of the answers are going to be based on what the individual posting is using, and what they believe works best for them and therefore probably would work best for everyone else, too.  Whether you call that sort of thought process an availability bias or a confirmation bias, it’s very much human nature.

 

And, of course, not especially helpful.  

 

The reason there are lots of bounce and grind options out there is because players have different abilities and competencies, different swings, play on different courses with different conditions, and use their wedges for different purposes.  The idea that there is one right answer to the OP’s question is so simplistic as to be absurd.

 

If at all possible, spend some time with somebody who knows their business, and try different bounce and grind options. Even for “average” players, it isn’t difficult to tell the differences, and a good fitter will be able to ask important questions to help you decide what YOU need and can play best.

 

If you can’t spend time with a fitter, the Vokey online wedge fitting tool is useful, if only to make you think about what you are using your wedges for, as well as course conditions, skill and confidence levels, and so on.  
 

Golf equipment is rarely an “either or” decision, and the very question that started this thread is a perfect example, if only because it completely ignores grind.  

 

 

 

 

[sratacik]

High bounce will give you a little more time before the leading edge catches the turf. Ultimately it comes down to the turf conditions. Low bounce is good for firm conditions and high bounce better for soft. I've found vokey's M and D grinds to be the most versatile and forgiving.

[i*windows]

what's the reasoning behind having a high bounce in a 56, then a much lower bounce in anything higher lofted such as a 58 or 60?

[bluedot]

1 minute ago, i*windows said:

what's the reasoning behind having a high bounce in a 56, then a much lower bounce in anything higher lofted such as a 58 or 60?

I think this would depend on the grind in each, as well as what each would typically be used for.  A 58 with a lower bounce but with a particular grind (like the Vokey M grind) could be very versatile because you could open it up and add bounce in the process. 
 

But I don’t think you’d find many players using “much lower bounce” in a 58 or 60 than in a 56; maybe a couple of degrees.

[Righty to Lefty]

First shot is leading edge....the second shot is bounce. You should not make a divot on a partial wedge shot. Note that he said to hit the ground before the ball. Doing that engages the bounce.

 

 

Time stamp 13:20 he talks about bounce. 

[Trouble_shooter]

On 11/16/2022 at 4:35 AM, Righty to Lefty said:

Yes he would and if he had enough bounce then his club would skid along the turf and not rip up a 2 foot divot on a partial wedge shot which should not happen. 

 

I didn't say Rory isn't a good player, we all know that he is, but he could be more efficient. Just like the majority of players hitting down on driver while knowing that a positive angle of attack is more efficient. They still play good golf, but they are sacrificing some performance and Rory's wedge play is no different. 

I find it interesting the observation you made with rory, good eye. I was watching a youtube short with rory and he was basically saying the exact same thing. He said he didnt realize he had too low of bounce and since adding bounce to his wedges his contact has gotten a lot better.

[Righty to Lefty]

On 3/21/2024 at 2:30 AM, Trouble_shooter said:

I find it interesting the observation you made with rory, good eye. I was watching a youtube short with rory and he was basically saying the exact same thing. He said he didnt realize he had too low of bounce and since adding bounce to his wedges his contact has gotten a lot better.

I just felt that as an amateur player that has just switched over from play "Righty to Lefty" that I didn't have time to waste learning a less efficient method. I was a crap wedge player when I switched to lefty but I kept saying to myself that there has to be a reason why I can't get the ball to stop when it hits the green.  Of course at this time my bunker play was also trash so once I begin to clean that up, I begin to work on figure out the pitch and chip shots, and not using the bounce was the culprit, and my wedge play has become a strength.  Using the bounce is the exact same method as hitting a bunker shot where you engage the surface behind the ball trusting the club will skid along the surface instead of digging.

 

The margin for error increase with using the bounce was the real eye opener and that is why I play wedges that can create a crazy amount of bounce and then use the amount that I can on a given shot and it has done wonders for my game.  If my club is going to engage the turf at all, I am using the bounce because it is an added insurance policy.  Contrary to what is often said, the club will not bounce into the ball unless your low point of your swing arc is behind the ball because as long as the leading edge gets below the equator of the ball and stays below it the ball will not be skulled. There is no scenario that I can think of where you want the wedge to dig on a partial wedge shot.  Also shots struck closer to the equator of the ball actually spin more so the leading edge rising up off the ground is actually not a bad thing because you will strike the shot lower on the face which creates more spin.  

Edited March 24 by Righty to Lefty

[mogc60]

Too little attention is paid to where the bounce is located as well. People have success with say a 10 degree bounce wedge and think that’s the magic number without paying much attention to where the actual “used” bounce is located. They replace the wedge with a different 10 degree model and it doesn’t work. The bounce ends up being too far forward or too far back or the camber and roll is wrong.  I personally love forward bounce and very little in the back. It matches my technique but I also like an ample amount of it 

Edited March 21 by mogc60

[Trouble_shooter]

19 hours ago, Righty to Lefty said:

I just felt that as an amateur player that has just switched over from play "Righty to Lefty" that I didn't have time to waste learning a less efficient method. I was a crap wedge player when I switched to lefty but I kept saying to myself that there has to be a reason why I can't get the ball to stop when it hits the green.  Of course at this time my bunker play was also trash so once I begin to clean that up I begin to work on figure out the pitch and chip shots and not using the bounce was the culprit and my wedge play has become a strength.  Using the bounce is the exact same method as hitting a bunker shot where you engage the surface behind the ball trusting the club will skid along the surface instead of digging.

 

The margin for error increase with using the bounce was the real eye opener and that is why I play wedges that can create a crazy amount of bounce and then use the amount that I can on a given shot and it has done wonders for my game.  If my club is going go engage the turf at all, I am using the bounce because it is an added insurance policy.  Contrary to what is often said, the club will not bounce into the ball unless you low point of your swing arc is behind the ball because as long as the leading edge gets below the equator of the ball and stays below it the ball will not be skulled. There is no scenario that I can think of where you want the wedge to dig on a partial wedge shot.  Also shots struck closer to the equator of the ball actually spin more so the leading edge rising up off the ground is actually not a bad thing because you will strike the shot lower on the face which creates more spin.  

Hey I agree. Ive got a couple of vokeys, the 54 is 8 degrees of bounce, and the 60 is 7 degrees of bounce. Not bad wedges, I get the occasional skull with the 60. I ordered a 54 and 60 edel with D grind. Im a huge edel fanboy, same with ping. Both are high bounce companies. Im not a long hitter, 220-240 max. The game is hard enough, i'll take all the help i can get. You make a lot of good points.

[Righty to Lefty]

On 3/22/2024 at 2:38 AM, Trouble_shooter said:

Hey I agree. Ive got a couple of vokeys, the 54 is 8 degrees of bounce, and the 60 is 7 degrees of bounce. Not bad wedges, I get the occasional skull with the 60. I ordered a 54 and 60 edel with D grind. Im a huge edel fanboy, same with ping. Both are high bounce companies. Im not a long hitter, 220-240 max. The game is hard enough, i'll take all the help i can get. You make a lot of good points.

I have three lefty Edel wedges that I don't have to heart to put in play because they only made lefty wedges for one year.  I like the way that JP uses camber to increase leading edge bounce but of course he doesn't make lefty wedges either but that is probably saving me from having multiple $500 dollar wedges!  I don't know of any others that make wedges with high amounts of leading edge bounce so if you or anyone else does please  point em out. For now I play wedges in the C3i and Cleveland Smartsole ilk because I like how the leading edge rises as you open the face up because of the added spin created by striking the ball lower on the face.  I was nervous about it at first until I learned over time that it is a benefit.  

[Trouble_shooter]

On 3/24/2024 at 8:39 AM, Righty to Lefty said:

I have three lefty Edel wedges that I don't have to heart to put in play because they only made lefty wedges for one year.  I like the way that JP uses camber to increase leading edge bounce but of course he doesn't make lefty wedges either but that is probably saving me from having multiple $500 dollar wedges!  I don't know of any others that make wedges with high amounts of leading edge bounce so if you or anyone else does please  point em out. For now I play wedges in the C3i and Cleveland Smartsole ilk because I like how the leading edge rises as you open the face up because of the added spin created by striking the ball lower on the face.  I was nervous about it at first until I learned over time that it is a benefit.  

Man I understand what your saying. Golf is brutal most times in options for lefties. For high bounce players like you and I, the options are slim. I had a buddy that played a mizuno wedge that i believe was a 56.14. And this guy was always all over the pin with it. 

[robbie91]

As a general rule, low handicap golfers tend to lean toward mid bounce wedges in the GW and SW and a a lower bounce wedge in the LW. However, the is NOT a rule and there are plenty of skilled golfers using wedge bounces across the spectrum. Choosing bounce really comes down to attack angle and wedge technique. If you are really that against getting fitted, I'd recommend looking for something mid bounce throughout the wedge set up. This will offer you the most versatility and will have the highest likelihood of working with your swing. If you are truly a "sub par" golfer though, you really should invest in a fitting.