Launch Monitors

[vandyfan]

Just now, darter79 said:

r10 (a joke)

 

Into a net or full flight or...*gulp*...both?

[phillyspecial]

11 minutes ago, blackbdmillsaps said:

 

That is what I always wonder about all these "indoor sims" that use Trackman. Would they not be better served using a GCQuad *ducks head for going COMPLETELY off topic*

 

 

We can always keep praying for software updates...

Foresight software experience not even in the same universe as TM.  While the GCQ hardware is better suited for indoors, the overall experience is not even close if youre spending that kind of coin.  TM pivoted years ago toward indoors and has poured a ton of resources into indoor accuracy with its firmware (and now the RCT balls etc).  

[darter79]

17 minutes ago, blackbdmillsaps said:

 

Into a net or full flight or...*gulp*...both?

both.  granted I had it early on. 

[tiger1873]

14 minutes ago, blackbdmillsaps said:

 

That is what I always wonder about all these "indoor sims" that use Trackman. Would they not be better served using a GCQuad *ducks head for going COMPLETELY off topic*

 

 

We can always keep praying for software updates...

 

 

If you find a indoor simulator place with a trackman it usually the cheapest way to rent a trackman for a practice session.   They good ones record every swing and puts the numbers up.  Spend an hour in the bay working on what you need then come home and review your swings.   

 

There is one local here and for $35 an hour that pretty cheap to play with a trackman.

 

[tiger1873]

58 minutes ago, BloctonGolf11 said:

That is not related to using an LM warming up or pre tournament. There is absolutely nothing wrong with having the hard numbers while you are out on a range and it can be insightful and useful. 

 

Teaching and practicing to the numbers on a LM is an entirely different issue. 

 

When I see a kid using a launch monitor when there warming up or pre tournament it's sure sign that there tournament is not going  to be good for that kid.

 

You need to just play with what you got that day.  There not that accurate even trackmans can be way off if you just plunked it down without any setup time.

 

What could you possibly gain from the numbers a launch monitor gives you that you don't already know on the day of the tournament.

[BloctonGolf11]

7 minutes ago, tiger1873 said:

 

When I see a kid using a launch monitor when there warming up or pre tournament it's sure sign that there tournament is not going  to be good for that kid.

 

You need to just play with what you got that day.  There not that accurate even trackmans can be way off if you just plunked it down without any setup time.

 

What could you possibly gain from the numbers a launch monitor gives you that you don't already know on the day of the tournament.

I can't even reply to this, just have to let Picard handle it....

 

Edited January 20, 2022 by BloctonGolf11

[heavy_hitter]

1 hour ago, blackbdmillsaps said:

As someone who just ordered a garmin r10, my reasoning is this. I have a net that I hit into about 3-4 nights per week. I work with an instructor so I am usually trying to ingrain a swing feel or just continue working on what is working. All I can really go off is feedback from the club and/or footspray on the clubface. I use an old blade 7 iron because it gives the best feedback and I can tell if I am hitting the center or not. So I am already out there, hitting into a net. For me, I am hoping the Garmin r10 will give me some semblance of if I am hitting it left right or center. I am not going to use a $600 personal launch monitor as the gospel on all my carry yardages. I have been playing golf for years, I know my numbers. It is more of keeping my practice engaging and FUN (hopefully). If I center a driver and it says Carry 210 yds with 4000 rpm spin, I know that is wrong. 

 

The real question I have and I want to test is if I can trust the launch direction into a net. I would test that on a range or course obviously. It seems like it is difficult/impossible for these units to measure gear effect properly when hitting into a net. 

 

My goal is do a review of the garmin r10 vs a trackman on my range (I have access to rent a trackman). I have seen this on YouTube but with all the "sponsored content" out there, I am losing my trust in youtube reviews. There is just too much money to be made from garmin or rapsodo to pay one of these guys/gals off to say their launch monitor is "within 1-2% of trackman." I need to see it for myself. 

 

The Garmin R10 is complete trash.

[heavy_hitter]

1 hour ago, blackbdmillsaps said:

 

You may be right since the R10 is doppler and likely gets less and less accurate the less ball flight it can see. I may have purchased a $600 toy. On the flip side, the worst case scenario is the numbers are bad and I wasted money. They suckered me in with the home tee hero and being able to play a cartoon version of my home courses. That is not what a "serious" golfer would buy but a serious golfer also can probably get to the range twice a week whereas I am stuck at home with two kids under 3. Can't justify $4-8k for a GC3 and at worst I think I can re-sell my Garmin R10 for $500 (likely much closer to original retail than that). 

 

Also, the way my back yard opens up I have about 130 yards of runout, so realistically I can still hit wedges on it. Not a total waste if the doppler unit is decent on full flight but bad into a net.

Trackman, Mevo, Mevo+, Flightscope all use doppler radar.  It is the tech in the chip that makes it go.  I wouldn't trust R10 number past Swing Speed and ball speed.  Yes I have one.  It is highly inaccurate using a net.  Better outside on the range, but still has a ton of issues that haven't been ironed out.  

 

Take note also.  My kid knows exactly what his numbers are and what they should be.  

Edited January 20, 2022 by heavy_hitter

[Medson]

My biggest issue with any LM outdoor is the poor quality range balls. The ball speed & carry distance reading are quite shorter than what I observe on the real course with her game balls. 

 

Above is the biggest reason preventing me from using LM outdoor consistently. 

[BloctonGolf11]

1 minute ago, Medson said:

My biggest issue with any LM outdoor is the poor quality range balls. The ball speed & carry distance reading are quite shorter than what I observe on the real course with her game balls. 

 

Above is the biggest reason preventing me from using LM outdoor consistently. 

Range balls are the bane of my existence. We have a beautiful course but our range is extremely sandy at times and we have the yellow Srixon range balls that are absolutely awful. Makes the range time miserable. 

[phillyspecial]

TM fights the "best for outdoors" narrative but inside with RCT ProVs may even be better than outdoor+range balls

 

[leezer99]

41 minutes ago, BloctonGolf11 said:

Range balls are the bane of my existence. We have a beautiful course but our range is extremely sandy at times and we have the yellow Srixon range balls that are absolutely awful. Makes the range time miserable. 

I take the mevo + on course. Yardages are spot on. 

[heavy_hitter]

33 minutes ago, phillyspecial said:

TM fights the "best for outdoors" narrative but inside with RCT ProVs may even be better than outdoor+range balls

 

 

Some of the worst numbers I have ever seen are inside on a Trackman with Prov's.  If I am inside I am buying a monitor using cameras.

Edited January 20, 2022 by heavy_hitter

[phillyspecial]

47 minutes ago, heavy_hitter said:

 

Some of the worst numbers I have ever seen are inside on a Trackman with Prov's.  If I am inside I am buying a monitor using cameras.

Ive owned both and hit thousands of balls on both inside.  TM w the RCT balls are spot on and is an overall far superior product imo.  

[heavy_hitter]

1 minute ago, phillyspecial said:

Ive owned both and hit thousands of balls on both inside.  TM w the RCT balls are spot on and is an overall far superior product imo.  

I just know at our local fitter the numbers are inaccurate inside the bay.  The spin numbers are really, really high.  If looking at face, path, speeds, etc. it is pretty good.  If you are trying to dial in optimal numbers with a driver, the golfer just isn't going to get there.  I trust it as much as the R10 in that aspect.

[RmoorePE]

I have the Full Swing Kit and it is not updated for indoor use yet, but we use it indoors on a net all the time. I am hoping it lives up to the hype, certainly has a lot of bad reviews out there. 

 

Outdoors I tested the distance with range finder using crappy range balls and it was accurate. It provides a lot of different data, but as far as accuracy of the spin rate etc, I cannot say. I do know the path and face is accurate in that if you hit a draw it shows path and face to match.

 

If the question is does it make your junior better, it comes down to what you want. I would not say to use it indoors to gap your clubs, but by all means use it on the course with your typical balls to do that. Lately, my youngest and I have been out in our garage/shop lifting weights, shooting baskets and hitting golf balls into the net. Seems like a good way to spend time instead of staring at her phone. We have distance control contests with it and stuff like that. Neither of us feel like the ranges are far off from what our swing is. I would definitely say she is getting better than doing something else.

 

I like using it for net sessions in that you can tick off what you want it to tell you in your ear buds and after each shot I have it tell me my distance, distance left or right, and apex. Don't even have to look at anything it just tells you. I don't expect perfect distances I just look for consistency. I.e. normal swing I hit my 7i about 160, but the FSK reads it about 152 on the net every time. So If I am hitting my 7 and it gives 148 through 155, I feel like I am making good contact and grooving my swing.

 

I think when you show up to the golf course each day is when you drill down to your distances for that day's conditions.

[MWhack]

bought my daughter a TM4 and it makes a big difference, she can see the numbers, doesnt need to guess and it helps her to get more feeling for distance.
Dont think kids need lot of numbers probably carry total and club speed is nearly enough on the range without a coach.
the putting software on TM is amazing, she improved in a very short time so much thats amazing. 
 

[Ray Jackson]

Been using a GC Quad for 18 months. Rarely use it at the range due to the poor quality range balls, but when that happens the focus is on path, face angle, those data points etc rather than ball metrics. Nice to be outside some days. 

 

Indoors the focus is on everything, ball and clubhead. My son and his coach work on the numbers a lot as the goal rather than the perfect text book swing. So if my son is 3 - 5* in to out path then that's not an issue if the ball flight is right. 

 

So my son calibrates at home between sessions with the coach. Pre tournament round doesn't use it, but may after a tournament day in the evening. 

 

And it was a good excuse to get it for me too 🙂 

[darter79]

Trackman GC quad versus everything else isn’t even a fair conversation those are by far industry standards regardless of which you view is more accurate they will blow away everything else and it’s not even close argument.  Just due to the amount of data they provide.  Of course the new GC3 is a water down quad the ball data is as accurate as a quad but you don’t get face and other parameters that you do with a quad. 

[RmoorePE]

I could have asked my daughter if she wanted to cancel family vacation for the next few years, I will get her a GC Quad. Rest of family might have been mad though.

 

I will say this, my daughter uses the FSK pretty much every third day (indoors). She hits about 250 balls a session and she only looks at carry, and height, and spin rate with driver. Even if it is giving her imperfect data, she knows when she hits a good shot just by feel.

 

Last night she told me she was practicing knock down 9i, trying to hit it 120 yards. I watched her hit a 119, 120, 122 and then I asked her to hit it regular swing, and the machine went to 133 with higher apex. So I'm guessing that she is getting better by using it even if the numbers are wrong. I think these tools are all useful, if you have parameters in mind for the use. 

 

She is not at a level where tracking spin matters much, but having a grooved swing really matters and she is getting that. Again, not sure if the extra $1500 beyond the mevo+ was worth it yet.