Vokeys for mid-handicapper

[JPH]

Question: Am I the only one who is very inconsistent with Vokey Wedges? I have three that are wonderful during practice but challenging during a round. I'm going to go back to my iron set gap and maybe return to the Cleveland cbx style soon. But honestly, have I bitten off more than I can chew? thanks.

[XHoop24]

44 minutes ago, JPH said:

Question: Am I the only one who is very inconsistent with Vokey Wedges? I have three that are wonderful during practice but challenging during a round. I'm going to go back to my iron set gap and maybe return to the Cleveland cbx style soon. But honestly, have I bitten off more than I can chew? thanks.

Mid Handicap here! But play Vokey's in the 54 and 50. I think it depends on how you use the wedge, on full shots a set matching gap wedge will likely be more forgiving than say a 50 degree vokey.  When I've tried a vokey at 50 degrees, I had too many mishits on full shots that ended up short of the green to keep using it. But I've kept the 54 and 58 in the bag. I love the turf interaction on pitches, chips, and sand shots with both. 

Edited July 31, 2023 by XHoop24

[Puttersaurus Rex]

1 hour ago, JPH said:

Question: Am I the only one who is very inconsistent with Vokey Wedges? I have three that are wonderful during practice but challenging during a round. I'm going to go back to my iron set gap and maybe return to the Cleveland cbx style soon. But honestly, have I bitten off more than I can chew? thanks.

No to the first question, and yes to the second.  
 

If you are already thinking it, then it will bug you until you are consistent with playing bladed wedges.

 

Nothing wrong with admitting shortcomings in your game though, and working to find what works!

 

*I play a 58M SM7, and struggled with a 58L SM5.  Depends on the grind and your ability.

 

Cheers!

[philly2kuk]

I’m a 12 and just switched from set gap to vokey gap to match my other wedges. It’s been great, suddenly nearer the pin and can pull off lots of different shots I couldn’t do before. 
 

However if you’ve lost confidence then it  may be worth trying something else to satisfy that itch.

[Pepperturbo]

1 hour ago, JPH said:

Question: Am I the only one who is very inconsistent with Vokey Wedges? I have three that are wonderful during practice but challenging during a round. I'm going to go back to my iron set gap and maybe return to the Cleveland cbx style soon. But honestly, have I bitten off more than I can chew? thanks.

Which ever wedge you use is up to you, there is NO rule.  And you're not alone, except on Golfwrx CB wedge users are more than likely a minority. 

Most beginners chose a CB wedge matching their irons; nothing wrong with that.  Others don't have issues with Vokey, but if you do use a CB wedge.

[PuffyC]

I've seen that with Vokeys before but it had nothing to do with the design of the club head. Unless you're never shooting under 100 I'd be absolutely stunned if you hit a blade wedge worse than a CB wedge, even on full shots, assuming it was a blind test. As has been stated before, once you get down to your 8i, 9i, wedges, etc, forgiveness is largely irrelevant, and that goes triple for chipping. That said, if you mentally struggle with a club then you're going to have a bad time so play with whatever club you're confident playing.

[WilderMan]

I got an old pair of 52/56 Vokey oilcans from a friend before I ever had a handicap, played them for another 10 years going from a 24 hcp down to 12.  As posted above, the blade style makes little difference in the high loft clubs, and with practice you'll learn to appreciate the consistency and feedback from them.  Finally replaced them last year with Calloway RTX in 54/58 (also blades) as the faces were pretty smooth.  Wish the rest of my game had improved as much as my wedges did, but they're pretty easy to practice at home, and there's a hole in my carpet.  Need a bigger hallway so I can work on driver.

[Jeff58]

What are your irons and iron shafts?

[Tyler724]

I would guess you may have grinds that are not a good fit for you. I am a mid capper and could not imagine going to a thicker cavity back wedge for my higher lofts. I play my set A (gap) wedge, but use a 54 and 60 degree Vokey with no issues. 
 

Play around and find a grind you like and practice as much as you can to get comfortable with it. 

[AC168]

On your shots around the green with your lob wedge, you should be able to handle a Vokey.  On full gap wedge shots from 115 yards or so, there are many gap wedges that are more forgiving.

[JPH]

5 hours ago, Jeff58 said:

What are your irons and iron shafts?

T200 with AMT Black reg.

[blades_are_life]

How much do you like the appearance of the Vokey clubhead when you set up behind the ball?

[North Butte]

For what it's worth, I'm what I guess you'd call a mid-handicapper (currently playing to an 11hcp but not that long ago it was in the 14-16 range) and have always preferred Vokey wedges. According to my Stroke Gained app, my wedge play is roughly in keeping with my overall game.

 

From 20-60 yards (partial wedges) my Strokes Gained is equivalent to an 11hcp.

From 60-100 yards (full wedges) my Strokes Gained is equivalent to a 10hcp.

My bunker game has a Strokes Gained equivalent of an 8hcp.

 

None of those categories has seen improved results when I experimented with oversized Sure Out, Mack Daddy CB, CBX2, CBX Full Face or CBX Zip Core wedges over the years. The Vokeys have always worked as well as anything for me and I much prefer playing them.

[grochol17]

17 hours ago, JPH said:

Question: Am I the only one who is very inconsistent with Vokey Wedges? I have three that are wonderful during practice but challenging during a round. I'm going to go back to my iron set gap and maybe return to the Cleveland cbx style soon. But honestly, have I bitten off more than I can chew? thanks.

 

Once you get down into the wedges, the forgiveness due to high MOI that we think of with game improvement irons doesn't really apply any more, so you're not really losing anything by playing Vokey wedges.  That being said, if you don't have confidence in them, then that's an entirely different story.

 

You say that they are working for you in practice, but not out on the course... however, you don't mention what kinds of shots you're having trouble with on course.  Full shots, half swings, bunkers, chips, etc? 

 

Before blindly buying new wedges, it would probably be a good idea to get the specs on your T200 P and W compared to your vokeys.  Assuming that you have the DG wedge flex shaft in your vokeys, your vokeys have shafts that are about 15g heavier than your iron shafts and probably also have a higher swing weight.  Either or both of those could be causing a feel problem for you and, while it might not matter on the chipping green, on course it might be hanging out in the back of your mind that something doesn't feel right.  As someone else mentioned, depending on what kinds of shots you're having trouble with, you might not have a sole grind that matches what you need. 

[Papadibs]

I played (and struggled) with Vokeys for years with the sm8s being the last clubs owned.  Last year I swapped them out for Callaway CB wedges and it has been amazing.  My problems were never green side but I had consistency issues with 50-100 yard shots.  I have standard Apex 21s down to gap wedge and then play a 52 and 56 CB wedge. Best change I've made in a long time.  I'm playing off a 9 fwiw.    

[Brentwood]

Vokeys are sweet wedges, there's no doubt. However, after having owned both, the CBX Zipcores (to me) are so much easier to hit and inspire more confidence at address. Another benefit (some might say weakness) of the CBX is that you don't have to go down the rabbit hole of determining which grind is best fit for you as they are a one size fits all.

 

At the end of the day, I think you go with whichever option yields the most confidence and feels good in your hands. 

[NoTalentLefty]

Must be up to the individual in this classification. I’ve use Vokey’s in the past with no problem. I’m currently at 10.0 but even when I was at 14 had no issues. Currently using PXG forged wedges just to go along with Gen4 XP irons.

[JPH]

5 hours ago, blades_are_life said:

How much do you like the appearance of the Vokey clubhead when you set up behind the ball?

I'm a fan. Love the dark finish. I think its a combo of technique and grind. I really don't effectively know how to use the bounce. I should probably have a couple sets since right now the ground is very hard and during spring and fall, its a bit more spongy around here.

 

[SwingBlade]

1st, perhaps the intended question was  concerned with bladed wedges vs cb wedges and not just "Vokey" wedges.
 

Although Vokey wedges can lead to somewhat unique decision scenarios of so many gen's, so many lofts, so many grinds and so many bounces.  
 

2nd, the statement that they work "wonderful during practice but are challenging on the course" perhaps pinpoints more pertinent questions. 
 

With respect, I would hazard that you do have the wrong wedges and perhaps need a more disciplined consistent approach to wedge utilization as well, as do most of us.  
 

The old adage "bounce is your friend" particularly applies to blade wedges. Next, some specialized grinds require a higher skill set than others and perhaps should be avoided by many of us.  
 

Then, there is the belief by even some pros that full wedge swings open the door to failure.  
 

With wedges, none of us should go beyond the smooth tempo 1/2 swing until that is mastered.  Then the smooth tempo 3/4 swing.  Leave the full wedge swing for "get out of jail" challenges. 
 

Maybe have a wedge off using a higher bounce generic grind 54-56 blade SW  vs your old cbx SW using only smooth 1/2 swings with square and slightly open setups until the contact results are consistent and only then focus on the same consistency with 3/4 swing sessions.

 

Then consider the same approach to deciding on a GW, leaving a LW decision til last.  Then maybe document a Pelz wedge matrix.  Most importantly, the winner should be yielding similar results both in practice and on course.

Edited August 1, 2023 by SwingBlade

[Jeri6gt]

If the club does not give you confidence, I would not use it regardless of handicap.

I use 4 Vokeys all the way up to a 46 and actually play them with a stiffer shaft and higher swing weight.

I actually have a T100S PW and Gap(bent weaker) but prefer the "feel" of the Vokey when it is in 

scoring club range.

 

[Jeff58]

15 hours ago, JPH said:

T200 with AMT Black reg.

We don’t know specifically if this applies to you, but…

 

If there is a particular club that you hit it well in practice but not on the course, it’s often because its overall weigh, swing weight, shaft characteristics, etc are significantly different than other clubs, and your ability to produce a different swing mechanic on demand isn’t always successful.

 

A T200 AMT Regular would fit that model. Many players prefer the CBX type of wedge and attribute that to the head design. However, they also come with a 115g shaft and D2/3 swing weight that likely better matches their iron setup.

[blades_are_life]

7 hours ago, JPH said:

I'm a fan. Love the dark finish. I think its a combo of technique and grind. I really don't effectively know how to use the bounce. I should probably have a couple sets since right now the ground is very hard and during spring and fall, its a bit more spongy around here.

 

Yeah having more options than you can carry at one time to allow yourself to adapt the bag for course conditions and how you are feeling is always a good idea if financial resources permit.

[@_the_crook]

FWIW, I have two older Vokeys, 52/08 and 56/13. love them and they will stay until someone steals them out of my bag.

tried an RTX once and didn't like it much.

 

I currently play CB irons and began to carry the CB 52 wedge for that set.

the overlap on the 52's isn't problem.  I feel more confidence making a full swing with the CB.

the Vokeys are superb from serious rough and bunkers.

as you know,  how the player feels when setting up is half the battle.

 

best of luck on your search.

 

 

 

 

[greenlight]

Bounce and grind has far more to do with how well you do with any wedge than the brand. Unless of course the brand has positive or negative juju in your head…because confidence plays a role in it too. 

[North Butte]

8 hours ago, SwingBlade said:

1st, perhaps the intended question was  concerned with bladed wedges vs cb wedges and not just "Vokey" wedges.
 

Although Vokey wedges can lead to somewhat unique decision scenarios of so many gen's, so many lofts, so many grinds and so many bounces.  
 

2nd, the statement that they work "wonderful during practice but are challenging on the course" perhaps pinpoints more pertinent questions. 
 

With respect, I would hazard that you do have the wrong wedges and perhaps need a more disciplined consistent approach to wedge utilization as well, as do most of us.  
 

The old adage "bounce is your friend" particularly applies to blade wedges. Next, some specialized grinds require a higher skill set than others and perhaps should be avoided by many of us.  
 

Then, there is the belief by even some pros that full wedge swings open the door to failure.  
 

With wedges, none of us should go beyond the smooth tempo 1/2 swing until that is mastered.  Then the smooth tempo 3/4 swing.  Leave the full wedge swing for "get out of jail" challenges. 
 

Maybe have a wedge off using a higher bounce generic grind 54-56 blade SW  vs your old cbx SW using only smooth 1/2 swings with square and slightly open setups until the contact results are consistent and only then focus on the same consistency with 3/4 swing sessions.

 

Then consider the same approach to deciding on a GW, leaving a LW decision til last.  Then maybe document a Pelz wedge matrix.  Most importantly, the winner should be yielding similar results both in practice and on course.

I actually find a smooth tempo 1/2 swing that makes clean, solid contact is much more challenging than making solid contact with a "full" swing. I put "full" in quotes because my full wedge swing is certainly not as long and high speed as a mid-iron or driver swing. But I consider partial wedge shots require more practice to be consistent with than full wedge swings.

 

Now if we're talking little 20-yard pitch shots and such it can be done with a much simplified technique that's low maintenance. 

[ChipNRun]

On 7/31/2023 at 3:02 PM, JPH said:

But honestly, have I bitten off more than I can chew?

 

First, the news on Vokey.

• The good news: Vokey wedges have a lot to offer
• The bad news: Vokey wedges have a lot to offer, and finding what you need can be a challenge

Vokey offers lots of goodies: lofts from 46* to 64*, scattered across seven sole grinds:

 

 

Here are two more a basic of the seven wedge grinds for the SM9 model:

 

So, the challenge is to find the loft/grind mix that works best for you. If you can find a Titleist Thursday fitting and check out different loft and grind combos in the wild, your chances of finding what you need are better. Think twice about buying a Vokey wedge just because a fellow golfer in happy hour said a 58*/12 D.grind was the ultimate weapon.

 

And, don't forget your normal turf conditions.

 

If you play mainly square-face shots, the F or S grind may be what you need. For Lob Wedge, you need to check out other grinds.

 

Further, if you play mainly square-face shots without a lot of hand manipulation, iron set wedges may do you just as well as Vokeys or other specialty wedge models. 

Edited August 2, 2023 by ChipNRun
Spelling.

[Chunkitgood]

You don’t need forgiving wedges.

[greenlight]

Someone told me that the letter was just another way of expressing the bounce…that D grind is always 12 degrees for example. Vokey got a lot less intimidating when I learned that was the case. I thought D grind came in different types of bounces. Still a lot, but not AS much as I was thinking.

 

[Big_Smooth]

Just my 2 cents: most "mid" handicappers (call it 6-15 index) try to hit their wedges too far and too hard - definitely not what they are built for.

From a technical standpoint, perhaps your lies are off a little? Vokeys are stock 64*, which works for me, but if you hand me one at 63* or 65* I can barely hit the green with full swings...

[North Butte]

8 hours ago, Big Smooth said:

Just my 2 cents: most "mid" handicappers (call it 6-15 index) try to hit their wedges too far and too hard - definitely not what they are built for.

From a technical standpoint, perhaps your lies are off a little? Vokeys are stock 64*, which works for me, but if you hand me one at 63* or 65* I can barely hit the green with full swings...

I'm in that mid-'cap range and quite a few years ago my swing coach convinced me I needed a "wedge swing" that's distinct from my normal "iron swing". Just about everything is different...alignment, length of backswing, face angle of the wedge, ball position, even my wedges are bent 2 degrees flatter than my short irons. 

 

Before making that change, I was no more likely to hit a green or to get close to the hole from 75 yards than I was from 125. Bad contact, no distance control, frequent OTT pulls and pull-hooks, you name. And no spin, oddly enough. I was spinning a 75-yard SW shot less than a 125-yard 8-iron. 

 

To your point about hitting wedges too far, I'd have thought my new wedge-specific swing would hit the ball a lot shorter than when I was just lining up square and swinging wedges like I would an 8-iron. But the reduction in distance from a more controlled swing was maybe 6-8 yard at most. It just brought the flight down, the spin increased and my accuracy was night and day better.