Everybody's favorite youtuber; "It's not the muscles!" With Dan (s)mackintosh

[Nels55]

Looks similar to Milo's teaching and swing:

 

 

I don't know this seems like a fairly simple type of instruction?

Edited February 6 by Nels55

[MonteScheinblum]

Hips move last in backswing and fire everything together on downswing.  What a novel concept . 😜

 

He has to be careful people don’t interpret this as restrict hip turn.

[Deadaimz]

I thought the video was great and used his split hand grip on my 5yr old son and his swing instantly improved.

[johnrobison]

5 hours ago, MonteScheinblum said:

He has to be careful people don’t interpret this as restrict hip turn.

The way he describes core bracing, it's going to be hard for players to allow the hips to rotate.

[hafnia]

47 minutes ago, johnrobison said:

The way he describes core bracing, it's going to be hard for players to allow the hips to rotate.

 

Its sparked an interest with me - think about any natural speed/power move and I realise that I tense my core as though I'm inviting someone to punch me in the stomach.   I used to do throw ins at football (soccer) and could get some serious distance - a few mates asked for tips and I said "ab strength".

 

When lifting weights engaging the core immediately provides an extra bit of oomph.  The thing is you just don't notice that you do it automatically for some things and somehow neglect it for others and there is no tell tale sign that you are doing it.

 

I love the fact that I can identify he gets his arms out in front - which is one thing I'm working hard at the moment.

[hafnia]

6 hours ago, MonteScheinblum said:

Hips move last in backswing and fire everything together on downswing.  What a novel concept . 😜

 

He has to be careful people don’t interpret this as restrict hip turn.

 

I thought this was interesting cos I started thinking "X factor" and people getting bad backs.  

 

Monte - What's the key feel to not take this to the extreme? Reminds me of your description of "no turn cast" - very easy to start restricting turn rather than just not actively trying to do it.

 

 

[johnrobison]

7 minutes ago, hafnia said:

 

Its sparked an interest with me - think about any natural speed/power move and I realise that I tense my core as though I'm inviting someone to punch me in the stomach.   I used to do throw ins at football (soccer) and could get some serious distance - a few mates asked for tips and I said "ab strength".

 

When lifting weights engaging the core immediately provides an extra bit of oomph.  The thing is you just don't notice that you do it automatically for some things and somehow neglect it for others and there is no tell tale sign that you are doing it.

 

I love the fact that I can identify he gets his arms out in front - which is one thing I'm working hard at the moment.

Agreed with the other sports movements, and definitely for lifting. But they don't require the twisting of the spine that's required in a good golf swing.

[cgasucks]

His students are much welcomed by chiropractors.

[Nels55]

1 hour ago, cgasucks said:

His students are much welcomed by chiropractors.

I don't know, I have lower back problems and my back gives me grief when I swing too much regardless of swing mechanics.  Lately I have noticed that doing a more arm oriented swing seems to hurt my back more then the body oriented core driven swing. 

 

I don't really see where this swing is more dangerous for the spine if executed properly and at a safe speed for whatever condition you are in.  It is definitely a pro type of swing which is supposed to be the most efficient.  Anyway when I do it more correctly without EE it seems to be a motion that does not hurt my back.  But the jury is out on that one.  Time will tell.  Maybe Mr. Smackintosh will end up having back surgery when he gets older or maybe he has a swing for a lifetime and will be happily winning long drive contests when he is 90 years old.   

[Nels55]

8 hours ago, MonteScheinblum said:

Hips move last in backswing and fire everything together on downswing.  What a novel concept . 😜

 

He has to be careful people don’t interpret this as restrict hip turn.

Yeah, I thought the same in regards to restricted hip turn while watching the video.  We all know that a big X factor can be a problem for lower backs.  It seems like Dan's swing is pretty sound biomechanically though?

[Zitlow]

1 hour ago, cgasucks said:

His students are much welcomed by chiropractors.

 

He's a long driver and also owns a string of chiropractic offices conveniently located next to all the driving ranges in Canada. 

[Nard_S]

Delay of hip turn does not mean restriction of hip turn. 

 

My #1 fault, my 70% problem is overdoing of hip move and precisely because I sync it too much to upper body turn and much too early in sequence.

 

Back issues come into play when the stacking of mass become out of sorts. If hip moves remain in a levered "stepping back" motion and re-pivot stays stacked, back issues are benign. I used to hit a ton of balls, never hurt the back. Cannot right now, have a torn rotator cuff that is waiting on surgery. 

[Cliffy2020]

Had breakfast with Dan last summer.  Incredibly nice guy.  In person he’s even thicker than on video.  Tree truck legs and thick muscular core.  (I’m built more like Gumby for comparison). He emphasized core, legs, flexibility, diet, nutrition & rest.  He’s a specimen and takes his job seriously.  How HE gets it done is not for everybody.  He’s a professional athlete.

 

I showed up on 4 hours sleep and a double Tito’s Bloody Mary. He only outdrove me by 70yards.

 

370 on a string!  Most impressive driver of the golf ball I’ve ever witnessed first hand.

[PedronNiall]

23 minutes ago, Nels55 said:

I don't know, I have lower back problems and my back gives me grief when I swing too much regardless of swing mechanics.  Lately I have noticed that doing a more arm oriented swing seems to hurt my back more then the body oriented core driven swing. 

 

I don't really see where this swing is more dangerous for the spine if executed properly and at a safe speed for whatever condition you are in.  It is definitely a pro type of swing which is supposed to be the most efficient.  Anyway when I do it more correctly without EE it seems to be a motion that does not hurt my back.  But the jury is out on that one.  Time will tell.  Maybe Mr. Smackintosh will end up having back surgery when he gets older or maybe he has a swing for a lifetime and will be happily winning long drive contests when he is 90 years old.   

One issue I see is in the drill they use to start teaching the feel of this. 

 

They say: only turn the upper body, keep lower body still. 

 

They do: allow the lower body to turn to accommodate a rib to rib or higher swing 

 

Someone at home: actually keeps their lower body still and hurts themselves trying to get range of motion that's impossible with lower body restriction. 

 

This lesson is way too fast and loose and a perfect example of feels not being reals. Same as guys who tell people to encourage more hip flexibility by keeping the legs still. You find me someone who can move their hips around with still legs who isn't a cartoon character and I'll dance at your wedding. 

 

This would have been a good chance to blend the explanation of using the muscles such as the obliques that can physically be felt & seen activating by someone trying this with some GEARS capture or the like. Then the simple idea of activate these muscles is paired with what's actually happening in the swing to see what, if anything, is novel here. 

 

Crazy to me that there are so many tools people at this level have available now to give precise explanation as to what's going on yet they ignore it. Also confused on why you CAPS LOCK a statement about how it's not the muscles then dive into the work for how to get this swing going by explaining what muscles people need to learn to focus on. I also question adding tension to the core in the way they mention while simply sitting over the ball. That also seems like a great way to tear some muscle and put yourself out of doing anything for a while. 

 

I think it's great to have an off-the-cuff discussion on something when it's warranted, but videos like this are exactly why it's often better to script and do multiple takes to create something coherent and complete. This is a recipe for $*#&♡♤☆ some people up. 

[iacas]

1 hour ago, Nels55 said:

It is definitely a pro type of swing which is supposed to be the most efficient.

 

Ehhh, I’d be careful there.

 

1 hour ago, Nels55 said:

Maybe Mr. Smackintosh will end up having back surgery when he gets older or maybe he has a swing for a lifetime and will be happily winning long drive contests when he is 90 years old.   

 

I’m not sold on his swing being a “Milo swing” to begin with. I haven’t seen a slow-mo of his swing to know what he actually looks like (I didn’t even frame-by-frame the regular speed), but I didn’t get the sense it was particularly Milo-sequel.

[MonteScheinblum]

5 hours ago, johnrobison said:

The way he describes core bracing, it's going to be hard for players to allow the hips to rotate.

Agree that’s why I said he needs to be careful to let people know this is the hips being that last to move not they don’t move at all.

[MonteScheinblum]

6 hours ago, hafnia said:

 

I thought this was interesting cos I started thinking "X factor" and people getting bad backs.  

 

Monte - What's the key feel to not take this to the extreme? Reminds me of your description of "no turn cast" - very easy to start restricting turn rather than just not actively trying to do it.

 

 

People say there is nothing new in the golf swing.  Well, yes and no.

 

A good golf swing 50 years ago is a good swing now.  However, what we now know, what actually happens in the swing is very different than what people have thought for 50 years and many don’t like to hear that info.  This has led to new interpretations of the swing.
 

 

The two keys to teaching.

 

1.  Give out the right information as it stands now.

2.  Find good ways to communicate.

 

As far as the no turn cast is concerned, we know UD happens, we know flexion of the lead wrist happens, we know we want the center of mass at or behind the hands at p6, we know the body shifts before p4 and then starts to rotate and we know we don’t want the body to go into right tilt early.

 

Those things being the case and almost none of them have been taught forever…….many/most golfers need to feel UD first move down in order to get all of those things to happen.

 

So as counter intuitive as it seems to many, we can either get or allow all of the above list to happen in sequence with one intent.  Cast to 8.

 

All he needed to say was your intent is to move the hips last.  He gets his point across and doesn’t risk losing people back into the horrific X factor craze, which seems to me making a comeback.

Edited February 6 by MonteScheinblum

[iacas]

8 minutes ago, MonteScheinblum said:

The two keys to teaching.

 

1.  Give out the right information as it stands now.

2.  Find good ways to communicate.

I’d add:

0. Prioritize well.

 

It was assumed in your list but I like to get that out there specifically. I think I prioritize well and others can see what’s wrong but don’t prioritize well.

[MonteScheinblum]

1 hour ago, iacas said:

I’d add:

0. Prioritize well.

 

It was assumed in your list but I like to get that out there specifically. I think I prioritize well and others can see what’s wrong but don’t prioritize well.

Good call.  My running joke is if you have tendinitis in your left knee and a broken right foot, working on your knee tendinitis is useless 

[virtuoso]

If I had to crunch my abs before I took a swing, I would just quit the game.

[iacas]

1 hour ago, virtuoso said:

If I had to crunch my abs before I took a swing, I would just quit the game.

 

I'm still trying to figure out what you do if you don't know where your abs are.

[Nels55]

5 hours ago, PedronNiall said:

One issue I see is in the drill they use to start teaching the feel of this. 

 

They say: only turn the upper body, keep lower body still. 

 

They do: allow the lower body to turn to accommodate a rib to rib or higher swing 

 

Someone at home: actually keeps their lower body still and hurts themselves trying to get range of motion that's impossible with lower body restriction. 

 

This lesson is way too fast and loose and a perfect example of feels not being reals. Same as guys who tell people to encourage more hip flexibility by keeping the legs still. You find me someone who can move their hips around with still legs who isn't a cartoon character and I'll dance at your wedding. 

 

This would have been a good chance to blend the explanation of using the muscles such as the obliques that can physically be felt & seen activating by someone trying this with some GEARS capture or the like. Then the simple idea of activate these muscles is paired with what's actually happening in the swing to see what, if anything, is novel here. 

 

Crazy to me that there are so many tools people at this level have available now to give precise explanation as to what's going on yet they ignore it. Also confused on why you CAPS LOCK a statement about how it's not the muscles then dive into the work for how to get this swing going by explaining what muscles people need to learn to focus on. I also question adding tension to the core in the way they mention while simply sitting over the ball. That also seems like a great way to tear some muscle and put yourself out of doing anything for a while. 

 

I think it's great to have an off-the-cuff discussion on something when it's warranted, but videos like this are exactly why it's often better to script and do multiple takes to create something coherent and complete. This is a recipe for $*#&♡♤☆ some people up. 

That is a boatload of good points in one post!  If any of my kids ever get married maybe I'll hire you to dance at their wedding!

[Nels55]

Brendon's deal is pretty interesting, he seems to be making a living doing what a lot of us do which is jump around from one youtube instructor to the next.  He is making money while the rest of us are simply screwing up our games. 

 

I don't think that there is any way that Brendon can play golf with the millions of swing thoughts and techniques that he has running around in his head.  To become a really good golfer he would need to stick with one instructor and practice like Tiger did in his prime.  Something like 18 holes a day along with 300 balls on the range practicing every shot that you need to be able to hit in order to go low.  Also, short game, sand, putting, yikes that's a lot of work!  Hogan said that there were not enough hours in the day to practice all of the shots that needed to be practiced.

 

Of course if Brendon did that he would go broke and also he would not have as much fun as he has looking for the secret to being better at golf...  My prediction is that he will never find it on his current path!  What do you think?

[GolfTurkey]

1 hour ago, Nels55 said:

Brendon's deal is pretty interesting, he seems to be making a living doing what a lot of us do which is jump around from one youtube instructor to the next.  He is making money while the rest of us are simply screwing up our games. 

 

I don't think that there is any way that Brendon can play golf with the millions of swing thoughts and techniques that he has running around in his head.  To become a really good golfer he would need to stick with one instructor and practice like Tiger did in his prime.  Something like 18 holes a day along with 300 balls on the range practicing every shot that you need to be able to hit in order to go low.  Also, short game, sand, putting, yikes that's a lot of work!  Hogan said that there were not enough hours in the day to practice all of the shots that needed to be practiced.

 

Of course if Brendon did that he would go broke and also he would not have as much fun as he has looking for the secret to being better at golf...  My prediction is that he will never find it on his current path!  What do you think?

 

Jumping around from instructor to instructor obviously isn't ideal if your goal is to improve as much as possible.

 

Any idea what his handicap was before he started BBG and what it is now?

[kool-aid]

https://x.com/McLeanGolf/status/1752402975866110175?s=20

 

X factor 2 is coming

Edited February 7 by kool-aid

[hafnia]

15 hours ago, MonteScheinblum said:

People say there is nothing new in the golf swing.  Well, yes and no.

 

A good golf swing 50 years ago is a good swing now.  However, what we now know, what actually happens in the swing is very different than what people have thought for 50 years and many don’t like to hear that info.  This has led to new interpretations of the swing.
 

 

The two keys to teaching.

 

1.  Give out the right information as it stands now.

2.  Find good ways to communicate.

 

As far as the no turn cast is concerned, we know UD happens, we know flexion of the lead wrist happens, we know we want the center of mass at or behind the hands at p6, we know the body shifts before p4 and then starts to rotate and we know we don’t want the body to go into right tilt early.

 

Those things being the case and almost none of them have been taught forever…….many/most golfers need to feel UD first move down in order to get all of those things to happen.

 

So as counter intuitive as it seems to many, we can either get or allow all of the above list to happen in sequence with one intent.  Cast to 8.

 

All he needed to say was your intent is to move the hips last.  He gets his point across and doesn’t risk losing people back into the horrific X factor craze, which seems to me making a comeback.

 

yeah spot on - the one thing I've noticed recently when feeling a change in hand path "out is down" from Brad Hughes is that "intention" is the key to instruction.  To teach by "what you feel" may lead others down a rabbit hole but give a lightbulb to others.  Once I grasp the feel its supposed to invoke I then look at other instruction and think "now I know what he was on about".  This has been the biggest swing change improvement for me bar none.  

 

What I find very interesting is when you see Rory Mcilroy explain his swing (which I think he does very well) - his choice of words is "FOR ME" before explaining what works for him.  

 

 

[hafnia]

The one piece I'm garnering from this is engaging the core/tensing - I've thought back to a few shots where I've felt serious power and it was when my ball was sat in semi rough, for some reason I think when I know I have to be strong through the swing I prep my core and the feeling was that I was loaded.

 

May be a load of tosh but certainly something I will try.

 

 

[virtuoso]

1 hour ago, hafnia said:

The one piece I'm garnering from this is engaging the core/tensing - I've thought back to a few shots where I've felt serious power and it was when my ball was sat in semi rough, for some reason I think when I know I have to be strong through the swing I prep my core and the feeling was that I was loaded.

 

May be a load of tosh but certainly something I will try.

 

 

Have you ever heard of anyone trying to go into full crunchy stiff mode before triggering a fluid athletic motion? Anyone, ever? This is an idea that sounds “new” and “interesting”……until you sober up.

Edited February 7 by virtuoso

[hafnia]

48 minutes ago, virtuoso said:

Have you ever heard of anyone trying to go into full crunchy stiff mode before triggering a fluid athletic motion? Anyone, ever? This is an idea that sounds “new” and “interesting”……until you sober up.

 

I don't believe he said "perform a crunch" - I believe he demonstrated the feeling of activating the core by mimicking the intention of doing a crunch.

 

As for what fluid athletic motions require activating the core?:- boxing, throwing, kicking, rowing, jumping .  If you ever find yourself doing a momentary breath hold in an action - then you are activating your core. 

 

Not sure why this thread has all of a sudden taken on a mocking tone but its quite clear that any sport that requires energy from the ground upwards to upper body is going to require core activation and lack of will result in power leaks.  Just read that Steve Elkington says the exact same thing, before swinging tighten abs.

 

Quick get on to Rory and tell him to ditch the core exercises he does! - you will struggle to stop Gary Player doing his 1000 a day though.

 

 

Edited February 7 by hafnia

[virtuoso]

1 hour ago, hafnia said:

 

I don't believe he said "perform a crunch" - I believe he demonstrated the feeling of activating the core by mimicking the intention of doing a crunch.

 

As for what fluid athletic motions require activating the core?:- boxing, throwing, kicking, rowing, jumping .  If you ever find yourself doing a momentary breath hold in an action - then you are activating your core. 

 

Not sure why this thread has all of a sudden taken on a mocking tone but its quite clear that any sport that requires energy from the ground upwards to upper body is going to require core activation and lack of will result in power leaks.  Just read that Steve Elkington says the exact same thing, before swinging tighten abs.

 

Quick get on to Rory and tell him to ditch the core exercises he does! - you will struggle to stop Gary Player doing his 1000 a day though.

 

 

So just to be clear, because I’m not trying to be a D-bag, you are saying tighten your abs. No? So, muscle contraction. And you’re saying that when you throw a baseball, you tighten your abs first. Yes?

Edited February 7 by virtuoso