Scotty Cameron Classic Mini

[Tim Delgado]

Good grief man.

 

I find the posts about the putter and the Cameron-Bettinardi history interesting and would like to continue to hear more.

 

NOONE needs to hear the BS about your lame theory/accusation regarding whether someone is skimming some money out of a deal that you have absolutely no knowledge or involvement in. For goodness sake, even if you were right, who cares and what business is it of yours. :russian_roulette:

 

You are just making yourself look foolish, so please just stop it so this thread will stay SOMEWHAT on the topic of the putters.

 

Tim

[Jesperday]

This has been an interesting thread, but we are getting a little off course. Please if you don't have something constructive to add, move on. I would hate to see this thread get locked because of a few immature posts.

 

 

Agreed

[Jesperday]

Good grief man.

 

I find the posts about the putter and the Cameron-Bettinardi history interesting and would like to continue to hear more.

 

NOONE needs to hear the BS about your lame theory/accusation regarding whether someone is skimming some money out of a deal that you have absolutely no knowledge or involvement in. For goodness sake, even if you were right, who cares and what business is it of yours. :russian_roulette:

 

You are just making yourself look foolish, so please just stop it so this thread will stay SOMEWHAT on the topic of the putters.

 

Tim

 

 

I too would love to here more about the Cameron-Bettinardi history as it is extremely interesting but that makes for a different topic. Fact is, this got off topic from the OP a long time ago as NickPoz was simply stating the putter and the price. Now...if you really want to hear more start a different post. Last time I checked we are all allowed to make comments. Or..... we can all just set here for hours upon hours waiting on Bob and Scotty to post there stories. Read the entire thread....you'll notice it got off topic quite a bit. Gotta love someone who just reads the last page.

[stage1350]

I'd like to hear what Jick has to say about this thread.

 

It's the only way it could be more entertaining than it already is. :rolleyes:

[blkdiamond]

I'd like to hear what Jick has to say about this thread.

 

It's the only way it could be more entertaining than it already is. :rolleyes:

 

+1

 

I am surprised he hasn't chimed in already.

[Mekeni]

My thoughts exactly! *loud speaker* Jick where are you?!

[captain3jack]

So what is this thread about? The putter? Who actually made the putter? Is Nickpoz or Foregasim more truthful?

[rrkman]

FWIW......he was here a couple times earlier today but was able to avoid posting (lucky him).

 

Also, I'll apologize again. I asked for the pics of the mini in the bettinardi 3/4 thread. Thanks Nick for the pics and the additional info (I believe that you feel what you said is true and that is good enough for me - same for anyone else that posted useful information, even if it contradicted the OP...I'm in no position to know what is true and what is not but I will continue to try and learn and make my own opinions). Also, this would have been a great thread if we could have learned where the mini came from, why it was made, how many Scotty wanted, why bettinardi still has 3, how many are still out there, etc. Instead it turned into another cameron vs. anti-cameron thread.....that is too bad. Those of us not in the know could have learned some valuable info about a unique putter and situation. Hopefully next time.

[rrkman]

So what is this thread about? The putter? Who actually made the putter? Is Nickpoz or Foregasim more truthful?

 

 

Sorry, you've pretty much missed the boat on this one. I think the thread has run it's course. The thread initially answered my request to see a pic of the mini (after seeing the bettinardi 3/4 in another thread) but quickly, like so many cameron threads, turned into personal attacks, he said / she said, etc. Like I said in my previous post, it would have been nice if this could have turned into an informative thread about the putter.....maybe next time.

[Jesperday]

FWIW......he was here a couple times earlier today but was able to avoid posting (lucky him).

 

Also, I'll apologize again. I asked for the pics of the mini in the bettinardi 3/4 thread. Thanks Nick for the pics and the additional info (I believe that you feel what you said is true and that is good enough for me - same for anyone else that posted useful information, even if it contradicted the OP...I'm in no position to know what is true and what is not but I will continue to try and learn and make my own opinions). Also, this would have been a great thread if we could have learned where the mini came from, why it was made, how many Scotty wanted, why bettinardi still has 3, how many are still out there, etc. Instead it turned into another cameron vs. anti-cameron thread.....that is too bad. Those of us not in the know could have learned some valuable info about a unique putter and situation. Hopefully next time.

 

 

I agree completely. FWIW...my comments about skimming off the topic were all in good fun. Personally, I would love to here anyone who knows the history about the putters. Why Scotty only claims he had 5 made? If he considers the other 3 (not authentic). Do the 5 he considers to have made have numbers on them?

 

Did I read correctly that he said his wife gave him the mini? Or did Bob give him the mini?

 

On another note....I would love to know the history in general between Bettinardi and Cameron. Timelines they were together and why they split. Why would Cameron sue Bettinardi and also ask for a non disclosure of there deals together.

[blkdiamond]

I was searching through the registry today and could only find 2 of 5 (or 8) of the mini's in the registry. I wonder why so few putters, that many Cameron collectors consider to be the "holy grail" of Camerons, are in the registry.

[rrkman]

If we would truly like to get this back on track, here is what I was able to learn today....I have no idea what is 100% true, this is just the info that was posted.

 

Bettinardi designed and milled the first mini as a gift to Scotty's wife when she was pregnant with their first child....since these were milled in pairs, I'm not sure what happened to the other 'first'.

 

A total of 8 were made....not sure if this includes the 'gift' or not......then the scotty number was 5 - he either ordered that many or could only account for that many or some other reason.

 

There is a 1/5 stamped mini in Vog's cameron book...nothing was confirmed that there are 4 other 'numbered' putters.

 

The head is similar to the byron morgan DH-9.....but 'mini'. And byron is now making a 'mini' as well.

 

A mini sold for around $35,000 a while back and there was almost a more recent transaction for $40,000 but it has not happened.

 

The other thing that most of us already know is that Bettinardi/Cameron split and the TCC/PT split, lines were drawn and a lot of knowledgeable and talented people are no longer collaborating on collecting, discussions, designing, milling, marketing, etc....which is where the average golf enthusiast is probably hurt the most....not to mention the friendships that must have been destroyed as well. IMHO, they are both talented individuals....I'm a cameron guy but certainly have respect and admiration for just about all of the putter makers.....especially the basement guys that put their heart and soul into that one putter a month (or however long it takes) that they make by hand on old equipment. Now that's a putter maker.

[Jesperday]

I will say... I think its pretty cool that Bob B has a mini among other Camerons he milled for the simple fact that it was a part of history. No disrespect to Scotty (even though this may sound disrespectful) but it just seems like he tries to forget or elimate that history before the late 90's/ early 2000's. I mean does Scotty ever acknowledge the history that took place between the two? If so, I'd love to see it. My opinion would change a little.

 

Just like the proto honeycomb putter Bob made up. Why wouldn't Scotty just say "yeah it was a proto bob came up with but never made it to production"? Or "bob showed me something that i never authorized". I just don't understand why he would say he has never in his life seen that putter before and it is a completely altered cameron that would not even deserve a COA but rather get sent back. oh well.... to be a fly on the wall during those days.

[xxio]

Jick no longer games a Cameron. A young Asean Tour pro borrowed his hot-rodded Mid Sur and will probably return it after the season.

 

I love the concept behind the mini. Such a nice looking putter. Nice to hear it was conceived by Mr. Bettinardi as a gift, unless Mrs. Cameron thought of something like that for her husband. It shows how solid the friendship was then. Sad that Mr. Bettinardi was never acknowledged in any of the work and designing even during that era. I have briefly read Cameron's "books" and no mention at all.

 

 

by the way I still stand by this comment:

 

 

I still don't get why people want to make profit on putters.

 

IMHO this is the root of all the anti-Cameron and pro-Cameron sides.

 

People used to get lucky before with the Cameron "collectibles". Those were the days when the really limited and the really hard to find in great condition putters attracted buyers...i.e. the Scottsman, the true early handmades, etc. Nowadays people try to create their own collectible market, not going to happen the true collectors (collecting not just for investment/to flip) already have what they want. In fact the true collectibles have gone down in price because of all the customs, which is good.

 

I guess the same goes for Bettinardis. I "collect" (but game every one) a few but it has never crossed my mind to sell any of them and make a profit.

 

We are not talking stocks and bonds here people. Just like the aforemeentioned Gremlin or any car for that matter, once you take it out of the lot the value has gone down. If your Cameron/Bettinardi was bought cheap and you flip it and make money, then good for you but don't buy putters with expectations to make money. If you do that is very very STUPID, go invest it in something else and stop defending your putters value on golf forums.

[jhperna]

This has been an interesting thread, but we are getting a little off course. Please if you don't have something constructive to add, move on. I would hate to see this thread get locked because of a few immature posts.

 

A few immature posts???????...my goodness this has been 4 pages of spit, vinegar, piss, fire, and venom flying around over either information or misinformation of putter development. Seriously guys come on. i know i'm going to get flamed now with the "this is a thread on putters" stuff, or, "these threads are here to discuss these things" but are you kidding me? The debate starts with the disagreement of the # of putters made, 5 vs. 8. I REPEAT 5 VS. 8!!!! We're not talking about mass production here. From there it turns into Ali vs. Fraser MMA style. Having said that my money is on Foregasim in 4 rounds.

 

I wonder if Bob(may i call him Bob) and Scott(y) are together drinking a scotch, reading these posts and laughing about how much money they've made off of the masses.

 

Please guys let's try to find some perspective here!!!!!!

[Johnny]

I bet $40,000 that this topic gets locked soon....

 

I'd make a deal with the other mods and split the money just to keep it open.. still wanna bet ?

[geogolf]

I will say... I think its pretty cool that Bob B has a mini among other Camerons he milled for the simple fact that it was a part of history. No disrespect to Scotty (even though this may sound disrespectful) but it just seems like he tries to forget or elimate that history before the late 90's/ early 2000's. I mean does Scotty ever acknowledge the history that took place between the two? If so, I'd love to see it. My opinion would change a little.

 

Just like the proto honeycomb putter Bob made up. Why wouldn't Scotty just say "yeah it was a proto bob came up with but never made it to production"? Or "bob showed me something that i never authorized". I just don't understand why he would say he has never in his life seen that putter before and it is a completely altered cameron that would not even deserve a COA but rather get sent back. oh well.... to be a fly on the wall during those days.

 

 

Agreed. Some of the best Camerons of that era in the early 90's are overlooked by most today.

[tpariff]

This has been an interesting thread, but we are getting a little off course. Please if you don't have something constructive to add, move on. I would hate to see this thread get locked because of a few immature posts.

 

A few immature posts???????...my goodness this has been 4 pages of spit, vinegar, piss, fire, and venom flying around over either information or misinformation of putter development. Seriously guys come on. i know i'm going to get flamed now with the "this is a thread on putters" stuff, or, "these threads are here to discuss these things" but are you kidding me? The debate starts with the disagreement of the # of putters made, 5 vs. 8. I REPEAT 5 VS. 8!!!! We're not talking about mass production here. From there it turns into Ali vs. Fraser MMA style. Having said that my money is on Foregasim in 4 rounds.

 

I wonder if Bob(may i call him Bob) and Scott(y) are together drinking a scotch, reading these posts and laughing about how much money they've made off of the masses.

 

Please guys let's try to find some perspective here!!!!!!

 

Believe it or not, there's actually some GOOD information in this thread. It's not all spit, vinegar, etc. There are FACTS whether one side or the other chooses to accept them.

 

With regard to the number of Classic Mini putters, IMO it's quite important to the rarity and, dare I even say it, value. If there are 8 instead of 5, then that means there is 60% more supply than advertised. Keep in mind that according to many sources, one of the five is "lost". The reality is that there are very few people willing to spend upwards of $30,000 for a putter. I'd guess that at any given point there MIGHT be only ONE for sale, and that might not even technically be on the market. I can't imagine there are a couple of these putters "on the market" at any given time.

 

And from what I've read and heard, I think I have a better chance of becoming the next President of the USA than there is of BB and SC sitting around together drinking a scotch.

 

Kevin

[Slapjax7s]

Aren't the guys from Table Rock in this forum?

 

Can we get their views?

[bbeard10]

I'd make a deal with the other mods and split the money just to keep it open.. still wanna bet ?

 

I hope you're right, because this thread has some great info, but the personal attacks were getting pretty crazy.

[KMoney34]

I'm still wondering what is wrong with "sweater folders." Why insult a Class A PGA professional?

[captain3jack]

Aren't the guys from Table Rock in this forum?

 

Can we get their views?

 

 

 

Not if they want to stay a distributor.

[Dizz]

I kinda hope that forgeism is an insider of somebody because it would be hilarious if it turned out that he is getting his information from just reading other internet forums. I hate when people act like they are something they are not. If he is or isn't, the info is interesting anyway. Kinda weird that he would insult a Class A PGA Professional if he was truly in the know.

[Seth Pistol]

i don't want to speak for John, but as mentioned earlier in this thread, John used to be one of the bigger Cameron collectors out there. his collection rivaled anyone's out there. this was pre-tcc fiasco though...

[Jesperday]

I kinda hope that forgeism is an insider of somebody because it would be hilarious if it turned out that he is getting his information from just reading other internet forums. I hate when people act like they are something they are not. If he is or isn't, the info is interesting anyway. Kinda weird that he would insult a Class A PGA Professional if he was truly in the know.

 

i'll be honest...i thought it was hilarious how foregasm went nuts from the get go. i found his information extremely interesting and would love to hear more. i would buy his book if he wrote one. call it the "x files of scotty cameron" (the sh*t you never knew)! LOL!

[Dizz]

i don't want to speak for John, but as mentioned earlier in this thread, John used to be one of the bigger Cameron collectors out there. his collection rivaled anyone's out there. this was pre-tcc fiasco though...

 

So if it truly is him why does he have a bone to pick with Cameron now?

[psygolf]

what is TCC again??

[xxio]

what is TCC again??

 

 

Forum for Cameron Collectors.

 

There is no more TCC, that was Mr. Doug's place.

 

Now there is CC that is Vog's place.

 

 

cameroncollector.com

[tpariff]

i don't want to speak for John, but as mentioned earlier in this thread, John used to be one of the bigger Cameron collectors out there. his collection rivaled anyone's out there. this was pre-tcc fiasco though...

 

So if it truly is him why does he have a bone to pick with Cameron now?

 

There's no evidence provided thus far that "foregasim" is indeed John Roxxxxino. But if you want to get in touch with John and ask him if/why he has a bone to pick with Cameron, he is easily reached at puttertalk.com. His id is "jr" and he's a mod. Very easy to find and PM if you want it straight from the man himself.

 

Kevin

[nickpoz]

Sorry but there are too many people here to use the quotes as often as I need to and ill know ill miss a bunch of questions.

As stated earlier I have been awfully quiet due to the fact that I have a job and family which come before this place. I tried to post earlier but had computer problems and it locked up on me

By naming John I was doing so that he can no longer make personal attacks to me or Cameron and hide behind a screen name. Yes John was a very big collector and is no longer. Its up to him if he wants to share what all happened. I dont know the whole story and could care less.

The part where I said ill agree to disagree was about the fact that he doesn't like Cameron and his practices and I do not have a problem with it from what I have seen and experienced.

How many Minis are out there? I said there were 5 because of the putter I saw stamped 1 of 5. If there are 8 thats fine. I mentioned the price in this thread because I thought it was pretty darn impressive.

 

Venno, I have been to both places. I am very happy that you have been to both as many times as you have, im sure each time must have been a real treat. I remember speaking to you about the Cameron studio and your visit there and how your were almost giddy about it, my how times have changed.

 

Geo, agree with you also there are some awesome putters from the early 90s. The good thing is that most of the newer guys don't go for them so that means for the guys who do want them they can be had for good prices.

 

If people want to talk putters id be more than happy to. if they want to discuss other things I will continue to defend myself.

 

Just so more conspiracy theories do not pop up why I am taking so long to respond is due to the fact that I am going to sleep.