Scotty Cameron Classic Mini

[woodmont]

Okay, this is retarded, foregasim, first of all I'm sixteen and even I can see that: one- you are making personal attacks, two- much of the information you are so readily handing out could certainly be presented in a more civilized fashion without the whole melodrama of describing that so and so from so and so other web site said some such thing, we don't need that you could simply state a fact and end it. Instead you consistently in other threads repeatedly try to assert that you know more about putter history than all of us; maybe you do and maybe you don't. Either way get off your high horse, stop being an Word not allowed to other people who merely wish to post pictures of an extremely beautiful and intriguing putter. I don't care about how, when, or who made it and all the other rumors behind it. I simply want to appreciate the beauty of an impressive piece of art. Stop making this about your information and just appreciate other's kindness in posting the pics. And nickpoz, you don't need to go on about how he keeps making personal attacks toward you, it's childish and immature. I do thank you for posting the pics though.

[Bomb and Gouge]

Just curious, did you talk to Bob?

 

 

I'm starting to think you have a serious man crush on RJB. HOLY CRAP DUDE! :man_in_love: :man_in_love:

[tangojay]

There is so many things I want to say,,,,,, let's just say:

 

I want to thank the hardcore Cameron fans for turning me off so bad about Cameron products, your ego's and demeaning words towards other puttermakers had me look at what other putter makers had to offer.

I found out that their products were of better quality, one in particular, made what I WANTED, I did not have to settle for what ever he thought I "wanted" and more at a fraction of the cost,,get this, when he found out I lived an hour away, he invited me to his shop to insure the putter was adjusted to me so it indeed was made for just me,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

[stage1350]

Okay, this is retarded, foregasim, first of all I'm sixteen and even I can see that: one- you are making personal attacks, two- much of the information you are so readily handing out could certainly be presented in a more civilized fashion without the whole melodrama of describing that so and so from so and so other web site said some such thing, we don't need that you could simply state a fact and end it. Instead you consistently in other threads repeatedly try to assert that you know more about putter history than all of us; maybe you do and maybe you don't. Either way get off your high horse, stop being an Word not allowed to other people who merely wish to post pictures of an extremely beautiful and intriguing putter. I don't care about how, when, or who made it and all the other rumors behind it. I simply want to appreciate the beauty of an impressive piece of art. Stop making this about your information and just appreciate other's kindness in posting the pics. And nickpoz, you don't need to go on about how he keeps making personal attacks toward you, it's childish and immature. I do thank you for posting the pics though.

 

1) Regarding Cameron putter history, he definitely knows more than you, more than me, and more than probably everyone else on this board.

 

2) If photos had been the only thing posted, the rest of this thread many not have happened. But when the questionable "1/5" statement was made, the need was felt to correct that. And then there was the talk about the money.... always with the money.

 

3) The beauty of Internet websites is that information, posts, and entire storylines can suddenly change or disappear. What usually doesn't disappear are people's memories. This phenomenon is not unique to TCC. Other golf message boards have made statements that have been retracted or erased, usually with comments like "I talked to him and bottom line, we're good." So sometimes, people post what was said because that post may not be there tomorrow.

[woodmont]

Okay, this is retarded, foregasim, first of all I'm sixteen and even I can see that: one- you are making personal attacks, two- much of the information you are so readily handing out could certainly be presented in a more civilized fashion without the whole melodrama of describing that so and so from so and so other web site said some such thing, we don't need that you could simply state a fact and end it. Instead you consistently in other threads repeatedly try to assert that you know more about putter history than all of us; maybe you do and maybe you don't. Either way get off your high horse, stop being an Word not allowed to other people who merely wish to post pictures of an extremely beautiful and intriguing putter. I don't care about how, when, or who made it and all the other rumors behind it. I simply want to appreciate the beauty of an impressive piece of art. Stop making this about your information and just appreciate other's kindness in posting the pics. And nickpoz, you don't need to go on about how he keeps making personal attacks toward you, it's childish and immature. I do thank you for posting the pics though.

 

1) Regarding Cameron putter history, he definitely knows more than you, more than me, and more than probably everyone else on this board.

 

2) If photos had been the only thing posted, the rest of this thread many not have happened. But when the questionable "1/5" statement was made, the need was felt to correct that. And then there was the talk about the money.... always with the money.

 

3) The beauty of Internet websites is that information, posts, and entire storylines can suddenly change or disappear. What usually doesn't disappear are people's memories. This phenomenon is not unique to TCC. Other golf message boards have made statements that have been retracted or erased, usually with comments like "I talked to him and bottom line, we're good." So sometimes, people post what was said because that post may not be there tomorrow.

 

With regards and I certainly do not want a quarrel, but I have nothing against the information he brings to the table nor with where he gets his information, it's the way he presents this information that could perhaps be... improved, less condescending and arrogant seeming perhaps. Again, I meant no quarrel to be started, and really I do benefit from the information as does I think most everyone. The matter had been cleared within the first few lines of his posts; it was unneeded for him to continue. This is only my opinion and I most certainly probably know much less about golf clubs and putters than most on this site, but that's why I joined, to learn.

[MrParr1Noid]

It seems as if everyone here is shuffling their feet, kicking the dirt, and searching for something to say. I believe just about all there is to say has been said..for now that is.

 

Should someone want to add something to this topic? Let me know but I believe this topic is about to be closed for lack of something useful.

 

We'll give it a few before shutting the door. :ok:

[TuffKukae]

Okay, this is retarded, foregasim, first of all I'm sixteen and even I can see that: one- you are making personal attacks, two- much of the information you are so readily handing out could certainly be presented in a more civilized fashion without the whole melodrama of describing that so and so from so and so other web site said some such thing, we don't need that you could simply state a fact and end it. Instead you consistently in other threads repeatedly try to assert that you know more about putter history than all of us; maybe you do and maybe you don't. Either way get off your high horse, stop being an Word not allowed to other people who merely wish to post pictures of an extremely beautiful and intriguing putter. I don't care about how, when, or who made it and all the other rumors behind it. I simply want to appreciate the beauty of an impressive piece of art. Stop making this about your information and just appreciate other's kindness in posting the pics. And nickpoz, you don't need to go on about how he keeps making personal attacks toward you, it's childish and immature. I do thank you for posting the pics though.

 

1) Regarding Cameron putter history, he definitely knows more than you, more than me, and more than probably everyone else on this board.

 

2) If photos had been the only thing posted, the rest of this thread many not have happened. But when the questionable "1/5" statement was made, the need was felt to correct that. And then there was the talk about the money.... always with the money.

 

3) The beauty of Internet websites is that information, posts, and entire storylines can suddenly change or disappear. What usually doesn't disappear are people's memories. This phenomenon is not unique to TCC. Other golf message boards have made statements that have been retracted or erased, usually with comments like "I talked to him and bottom line, we're good." So sometimes, people post what was said because that post may not be there tomorrow.

 

With regards and I certainly do not want a quarrel, but I have nothing against the information he brings to the table nor with where he gets his information, it's the way he presents this information that could perhaps be... improved, less condescending and arrogant seeming perhaps. Again, I meant no quarrel to be started, and really I do benefit from the information as does I think most everyone. The matter had been cleared within the first few lines of his posts; it was unneeded for him to continue. This is only my opinion and I most certainly probably know much less about golf clubs and putters than most on this site, but that's why I joined, to learn.

 

 

While his delivery could be better, I like it! The style resembles my own so I am biased. You have to forgive us older gentleman, we have been around the block more then a few times and have known the posters we make fun of for YEARS over many a message board. You being 16 and pretty noob, you have to realize that many of us have a "history" and not all of it is good.

[Tim Delgado]

Aren't the guys from Table Rock in this forum?

 

Can we get their views?

 

 

 

Not if they want to stay a distributor.

 

 

 

LOL

 

I certainly HOPE that is not the case, but it almost wouldn't surprise me.

 

As for the post about why does the real count matter, well I guess if you are talking about a very rare and highly sought after putter that can sell for over $30,000, it WOULD matter quite a bit if the advertised number of pieces was off by a few. :lol:

 

Tim

[TM golf guy]

Pretty sure this is the best thread ever. Just need some popcorn and I'm ready to go.

[Tim Delgado]

Pretty sure this is the best thread ever. Just need some popcorn and I'm ready to go.

 

 

 

I'm pretty sure that new putter of yours is the best-looking putter ever! :man_in_love:

 

I WILL be calling you to make sure you have that beauty with you when I stop back in the shop!

 

Tim

[woodmont]

Okay, this is retarded, foregasim, first of all I'm sixteen and even I can see that: one- you are making personal attacks, two- much of the information you are so readily handing out could certainly be presented in a more civilized fashion without the whole melodrama of describing that so and so from so and so other web site said some such thing, we don't need that you could simply state a fact and end it. Instead you consistently in other threads repeatedly try to assert that you know more about putter history than all of us; maybe you do and maybe you don't. Either way get off your high horse, stop being an Word not allowed to other people who merely wish to post pictures of an extremely beautiful and intriguing putter. I don't care about how, when, or who made it and all the other rumors behind it. I simply want to appreciate the beauty of an impressive piece of art. Stop making this about your information and just appreciate other's kindness in posting the pics. And nickpoz, you don't need to go on about how he keeps making personal attacks toward you, it's childish and immature. I do thank you for posting the pics though.

 

1) Regarding Cameron putter history, he definitely knows more than you, more than me, and more than probably everyone else on this board.

 

2) If photos had been the only thing posted, the rest of this thread many not have happened. But when the questionable "1/5" statement was made, the need was felt to correct that. And then there was the talk about the money.... always with the money.

 

3) The beauty of Internet websites is that information, posts, and entire storylines can suddenly change or disappear. What usually doesn't disappear are people's memories. This phenomenon is not unique to TCC. Other golf message boards have made statements that have been retracted or erased, usually with comments like "I talked to him and bottom line, we're good." So sometimes, people post what was said because that post may not be there tomorrow.

 

With regards and I certainly do not want a quarrel, but I have nothing against the information he brings to the table nor with where he gets his information, it's the way he presents this information that could perhaps be... improved, less condescending and arrogant seeming perhaps. Again, I meant no quarrel to be started, and really I do benefit from the information as does I think most everyone. The matter had been cleared within the first few lines of his posts; it was unneeded for him to continue. This is only my opinion and I most certainly probably know much less about golf clubs and putters than most on this site, but that's why I joined, to learn.

 

 

While his delivery could be better, I like it! The style resembles my own so I am biased. You have to forgive us older gentleman, we have been around the block more then a few times and have known the posters we make fun of for YEARS over many a message board. You being 16 and pretty noob, you have to realize that many of us have a "history" and not all of it is good.

 

True, but even so, I did not think that so much of it would, could, be rather... rude and disrespectful. but again this is just my opinion.

[psygolf]

Cameron v. Bettinardi reminds me of the old Newman/Redford feud: Redford sent Newman a case of toilet paper with Paul's face on it ...Paul mailed it back USED!

[xxio]

Maybe we should have a Cameron history thread.

 

Actually 2.

 

History according to NickPoz. History according to Foregasim.

[Pure745]

 

From my Studio B trip :)

[scottyallanb]

I am so glad that I never really jumped to the side of one putter maker. They all have beautiful putters and I have owned putters from every company. Unless you are buying these rare putters lets get back to reality and buy what makes you put the ball in the hole and forget about all this back in forth. I just put my Scotty Cameron putter right next to the Bettinardi and they seem to be getting a long just fine.

 

 

Scotty B

[xxio]

I am so glad that I never really jumped to the side of one putter maker. They all have beautiful putters and I have owned putters from every company. Unless you are buying these rare putters lets get back to reality and buy what makes you put the ball in the hole and forget about all this back in forth. I just put my Scotty Cameron putter right next to the Bettinardi and they seem to be getting a long just fine.

 

 

Scotty B

 

 

Maybe your Cameron was from the "milled by Bob" era :)

[coops]

Entertaining thread....

 

If you're interested in a smaller headed putter do a search on the Miura KM-350..... cute as anything and forged then milled. (and less than $500 I'd think....)

 

Some threads here at golfwrx and here's some pics to enjoy

 

 

 

 

Love my Byron channel island....

[housey63]

and I thought Days of Our Lives was trashy

[alucard655]

I like foregasim.

[varsityhacker]

I have to agree with foregasim posting a name was a lowball tactic and the post should have been removed because it has taken away from the original discussion the history of the mini and how many were made. Foregasim has been the only poster to present any real information and then back it up. Some might think it is silly to argue over 5 versus 8 putters however, given the value of these putters as a collectible it is a very serious issue. If Scotty claims that only 5 were made and we know that not to be true then the question is why would Scotty claim only 5? I think the answer is pretty clear. Scotty is a genius at marketing and influencing the market for his putters. Like most collectibles’ the only real value is the perceived value!! So if the perception is only 5 were made then the value goes up in the market. History has shown us that Scotty and his fanatical collectors are not above weaving BS to make a putters value go up or apparently evening changing the putter to make it more valuable.

[Jesperday]

i think its all a matter of one chooses to believe. for new C collectors, they may not know anything about the history and chose to believe what they hear from the other collectors. for the older C collectors.. the only thing they can go off of is what scotty tells them and they choose to believe him. i also think that if it CC's did believe the evidence provided that it may in some way deminish/tarnish the things they worked so hard to get.

[varsityhacker]

i think its all a matter of one chooses to believe. for new C collectors, they may not know anything about the history and chose to believe what they hear from the other collectors. for the older C collectors.. the only thing they can go off of is what scotty tells them and they choose to believe him. i also think that if it CC's did believe the evidence provided that it may in some way deminish/tarnish the things they worked so hard to get.

 

Bingo that is why they don't want to know the truth and will hide it to protect their investment. They would rather believe that 5 were made and that everything in Scotty land is spot on. That way they don't doubt the value of the putters they own. In a collectibles market all that choose to partake have to drink the cool-aide or the market would collapse, the value in the putters is dictated by the market not in the materials or labor or even the design.

[Dizz]

First of all if that's all the information you have is just being a huge fan of RJB and not Cameron and linking posts from another golf forum then why should anyone take you serious? The information might be correct but it is pathetic that a grown man with nothing but a bone to pick with a putter maker comes on a golf forum and rips into him. Now if the information was actually inside information from a big time Cameron collector that turned sides because of bad marketing and business practices, etc then your posts actually make sense. However this reminds me of the pro Stack and Tilt guys versus the guys against it. Its funny how the Stack and Tilt guys get mad because people call their theory of the golf swing stupid when they don't actually know much about it. Same can be said here, if all your information is just from reading posts from other websites then its just funny that you take the time to come here to dispute the difference that there were actually 8 instead of 5. You act as if you are a close friend of Bettinardi and that Cameron is a bad person. Basically what I mean is, I can read all I want about something and then spew the information anywhere but the credibility of the source makes that information. I am not a fan of either side, I like some of both of their putters. You attack Cameron and his followers when it could turn out to be that you are nothing but one on the other side.

[goinglow72]

First of all if that's all the information you have is just being a huge fan of RJB and not Cameron and linking posts from another golf forum then why should anyone take you serious? The information might be correct but it is pathetic that a grown man with nothing but a bone to pick with a putter maker comes on a golf forum and rips into him. Now if the information was actually inside information from a big time Cameron collector that turned sides because of bad marketing and business practices, etc then your posts actually make sense. However this reminds me of the pro Stack and Tilt guys versus the guys against it. Its funny how the Stack and Tilt guys get mad because people call their theory of the golf swing stupid when they don't actually know much about it. Same can be said here, if all your information is just from reading posts from other websites then its just funny that you take the time to come here to dispute the difference that there were actually 8 instead of 5. You act as if you are a close friend of Bettinardi and that Cameron is a bad person. Basically what I mean is, I can read all I want about something and then spew the information anywhere but the credibility of the source makes that information. I am not a fan of either side, I like some of both of their putters. You attack Cameron and his followers when it could turn out to be that you are nothing but one on the other side.

 

 

Ding.. Ding.. Ding.. WINNER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[jarederco]

This would be a great season finale on "Judge Judy" or The People's Court.

[Slapjax7s]

Those that read internet forums know very little about the people they are interacting with. People come across very differently in person than they do when they are typing away at a keyboard "talking" to people they are not face to face with. For what ever reason many people feel that tying what they believe is a "real" name to a persons screen name somehow give them the ability to "know" that person. In reality what do you really know about the people you converse with over a keyboard?

 

A couple of points:

 

First, regarding being disrespectful to Nick: Here is a guy that has publicly, on more than one occasion, insinuated that Bob Bettinardi manufactured unauthorized or non authentic Scotty Cameron putters. He basically accused Bob Bettinardi of committing fraud. This type of pubic posts has occurred in the past, remember the Classic I with the honeycomb face? The absolute highest quality most collectable Cameron putters of all time are the putters that were made by Bettinardi for Cameron. This really pisses off Cameron and his followers and they take shots at Bettinardi when there is absolutely no reason to. You would think that Cameron would keel over if he ever said something complementary about Bettinardi or his work. This permeates down to those like Nick that are close to Cameron and they act accordingly.

 

If someone does not want to be disrespected in public then I suggest that they refrain from sending derogatory PM's when they disagree with what is posted publicly. If Nick is going to poke a sleeping bear then he should expect that something is going to happen in return.

 

Respect is earned, it is not something that is given as part of a title. Passing a test and being classified as a PGA Professional does not elevate a person to a higher level of respect unless they act accordingly. Posting derogatory and inflammatory statements about people like Bettinardi and the other actions Nick has taken in the past in contrary to the standards that the PGA has set forth and to which Nick agreed to abide by.

 

Second, why was it so important for Nick and a few others to try and associate a "real" person with the user foregasim? Pretty simple answer. If there is a person associated with the user name then they have another target to attack, which will allow them to transfer the topic away from the real issues and make the subject about the other person. It gives them someone else to attack and try and discredit instead of responding to the facts about the subject at hand.

 

Do you find it interesting that what I was posting was being discredited until such time that I posted "sources". I was a lier and a fraud claiming that there were 8 Mini's made. My posts about Scott Cameron handmade putters being restamped and improved were BS unless I could provide sources and references. Everything I posted was attacked by the Cameron guys unless I could back up what I posted with third party references.

 

As soon as I posted a link to a CameronCollector thread where a prominent member who is close friends with Jim Butler confirmed that Jim Butler is the person that let it be known that there were 8 Mini's made, things changed. As soon as I posted sources to confirm what I said about the Scott Cameron handmade putters, things changed. Immediately after I provided third party verification and sources to substantiate what I said, out of the blue Nick posts that he has "discovered" who "foregasim" is in real life. He posts a "name" and then the posts from him and the other Cameron fanatics take a turn.

 

It no longer is about the facts; it is no longer about the sources of the information; it is no longer about verifying what is true; now it is about the poster, this poster is a former big collector who is disgruntled, this poster is a former member of another forum who had a problem with Cameron so he can not be trusted, etc. It is classic smoke and mirrors, distract the person and draw their attention to something else and maybe they will forget about what is really going on.

 

All Nick had to do was give Jim Butler a call and ask about the Mini's. He then could have posted that he was mistaken. Instead he spends his time "brain"storming with his fellow Cameron fanatics in their private forum section that none of the regular TCC members have access to, and they decide the best way to avoid the big iceberg dead ahead is to throw out the name of a former "friend" and draw attention away from the facts and issues. Look how quickly new posters started to "contribute" to the thread when it became about the "person" they named. No longer does Nick or any of the other Cameron fanatics feel the need to discuss the false information they previously posted or to discuss the issues of market manipulation.

 

You all can feel free to associate my screen name with anyone you like but that does not change the facts of what was posted. As requested, that information was backed up with other sources and verified. I am not going to play 20 questions about who I am in public or in private nor am I going to confirm or deny who I am each time someone decides to post a name and claim they know that is who I am. If who I am is so important to make my posts believable and if posts from a person you do not "know" can not be believed unless they provide detailed personal information, then you should not believe a single word written or spoken by anyone that you have not personally met and have a close personal relationship with.

 

My apologize to anyone past, present or future who the Cameron fanatics decide to associate with my screen name and then unmercifully attack in public in an attempt to change history and reality.

 

 

A robust argument, whoever foregasim is.

 

Why's that?

[Six Pints]

It appears to me that we are talking about Beanie Baby's for golfers... Once you learn just how many putters are made by the "Franklin Mint" that are purportedly special, then you will realize that the only real value of a putter is in its use. It's a tool... not unlike the fifteen-hundred dollar hammers the government buys...

 

To me a handmade putter is worth maybe $600 of my dollars... if it was made for me. If it was made for you and you want to get rid of it, its worth a couple hundred to me... if I can use it. Maybe you can convince someone else it's worth more... great.

 

Cameron putters to me are tools like any other. Similar in quality and performance and some are visually appealing. Good product.

 

I always find it entertaining to view the disputes and the turmoil over products and their endorsements. If you've ever been a watch collector or know watch brands then you know that Rolex is a middle of the road brand that is completely souped with hype and mystery. Rolex has its defenders and fanatics. Some (like me) would call them mass produced crap. Send in a Rolex for repair and if they believe some unauthorized work was done... confiscated. Scotty sounds a little like that. And like Rolex, Scotty is able to keep the masses informed with his own brand of reality. Good for him/them... just let them be and let them enjoy their menagerie.

 

In fifty years collectors may be using Cameron putters in shipping to protect the newest collected thing from being damaged... and it remains to be seen what from this period will retain any long-term value at all. I for one am not ready to add Cameron to the same list as Philp, McEwan, or Cossar...

[xxio]

Since we are OT from the OP.

 

NickPoz claimed in a post on this forum a few days ago his total Cameron putter value is US$500 IIRC it was 3 putterss. Nick, can I buy the "scots dale" putter from you for $500 or $498 you can value the other 2 at $1 if you want. :) Paypal ready.

 

Foregasim,

 

Were you the one who wrote the geocities blog about a year ago. If you did the links to actual posts were very informative.

 

Who knows who you are? You may be "JR", you maybe Jick, you maybe be a disgruntled K-tech employee? What ever it is it is good reading and even better research whether people here believe it or not.

[jarederco]

What is K-Tech? Where are Cameron retail putters made today?

[varsityhacker]

It appears to me that we are talking about Beanie Baby's for golfers... Once you learn just how many putters are made by the "Franklin Mint" that are purportedly special, then you will realize that the only real value of a putter is in its use. It's a tool... not unlike the fifteen-hundred dollar hammers the government buys...

 

To me a handmade putter is worth maybe $600 of my dollars... if it was made for me. If it was made for you and you want to get rid of it, its worth a couple hundred to me... if I can use it. Maybe you can convince someone else it's worth more... great.

 

Cameron putters to me are tools like any other. Similar in quality and performance and some are visually appealing. Good product.

 

I always find it entertaining to view the disputes and the turmoil over products and their endorsements. If you've ever been a watch collector or know watch brands then you know that Rolex is a middle of the road brand that is completely souped with hype and mystery. Rolex has its defenders and fanatics. Some (like me) would call them mass produced crap. Send in a Rolex for repair and if they believe some unauthorized work was done... confiscated. Scotty sounds a little like that. And like Rolex, Scotty is able to keep the masses informed with his own brand of reality. Good for him/them... just let them be and let them enjoy their menagerie.

 

In fifty years collectors may be using Cameron putters in shipping to protect the newest collected thing from being damaged... and it remains to be seen what from this period will retain any long-term value at all. I for one am not ready to add Cameron to the same list as Philp, McEwan, or Cossar...

 

 

I like the classic books in your screen pic. A man well read.