Tiger wont beat Jacks 18

[sapguy]

[quote name='crtssxc' post='1892192' date='Aug 16 2009, 07:57 PM']I am always confused why the fact that Nicklaus came in 2nd 19 times was a good thing. Sure, he was an incredible player, still the best of all time IMO based on the record books. But maybe we should say what a terrible closer he was, I mean, to not be able to win when he was that close and all. Now, that isnt my opinion, I just dont get why when tiger comes in 2nd people say he is washed up and cant break a record, and the fact that JAck came in 2nd was a good thing. I just dont get it; seems like a double standard.[/quote]

The answer to your rhetorical question: someone on this thread called the OP an "idiot". Seems like pretty strong language to me, but I would have to agree.

1) Tiger is 15-1 when he has a lead in Majors (you can't win them all), so the odds are very good he'll win a few more Majors (just the facts, and not cheerleading for Tiger).
2) Tiger has about 12 good years left (unless he pulls a Tom Watson), and assuming that he wins ONE Majors every OTHER year, that's 6 Majors for a total of 20 Majors.
3) Tiger will come out of the gate in 2010 very hungry! He has won on the green at other Majors, and at Hazeltine in 2009, he lost on the green. He will work extra hard on putting to recapture the magic of Torrey Pines.
4) So people can think whatever they want, but Tiger will beat Jack's record, and my prediction is that he will do it between 2012 and 2014, when he will be 36 or 38.
5) I am no expert or crystal ball reader, but the historical record suggests that Tiger will win something like 22 Majors before he's done.
6) Now beating Jack's record of 19 second places finish may be harder to do!

[Shanks For The Memories]

I've aquired something very interesting here...

Tiger has a black side, and an asian side, and they sometimes conflict. His black side gives him his rythym and athleticism, while his asian side gives him precision and determination.

This is a transcript of Tiger's conversation to himself in the locker room after the round:

Eldrick: Ah, dis where you fair Tigah Wood, you rack disciprine.
Tiger: Say what homie? I win 35% of the time!
Eldrick: You do mafs? You do mafs? Who de Chinesa man here?
Tiger: I knows how to do maf you hatah.
Eldrick: Oh yeah, what cosine of 45 deglee angre?
Tiger: 1.414... Or is it 7.07? Wait, sine or cosine?
Eldrick: Ha, you no never get maths right you letard.
Tiger: Well, you do the maf, I'z won 5 times dis year!
Eldrick: Oh yeah, werr, you no win most!
Tiger: Like hell I didn't fool!
Eldrick: Blian Gay win more event dan you Tigah!
Tiger: No, he won 2, fool. 2 is less than 5, ***********.
Eldrick: Ha, but he have-a good season, you no have good season, exprain dat!
Tiger: He's not expected to win as much, I am.
Eldrick: Wait, wha you mean a-Tiguh?
Tiger: I won more than anyone, and I am #1 in the Fed Ex cup points, and money list, and yet it's still considered a bad season for me.
Eldrick: Ah, I see, is dis what you tark about being carred "disclimination".
Tiger: Sort of.
Eldrick: Oh, ha, I see now... Peopre stupid.
Tiger: Yes they are.
Eldrick: Which part of us has the p**** again?
Tiger: I do.
Eldrick: Dat one stereotype I rik!

[fua1]

[quote name='Shanks For The Memories' post='1896243' date='Aug 18 2009, 12:39 AM']I've aquired something very interesting here...

Tiger has a black side, and an asian side, and they sometimes conflict. His black side gives him his rythym and athleticism, while his asian side gives him precision and determination.

This is a transcript of Tiger's conversation to himself in the locker room after the round:

Eldrick: Ah, dis where you fair Tigah Wood, you rack disciprine.
Tiger: Say what homie? I win 35% of the time!
Eldrick: You do mafs? You do mafs? Who de Chinesa man here?
Tiger: I knows how to do maf you hatah.
Eldrick: Oh yeah, what cosine of 45 deglee angre?
Tiger: 1.414... Or is it 7.07? Wait, sine or cosine?
Eldrick: Ha, you no never get maths right you letard.
Tiger: Well, you do the maf, I'z won 5 times dis year!
Eldrick: Oh yeah, werr, you no win most!
Tiger: Like hell I didn't fool!
Eldrick: Blian Gay win more event dan you Tigah!
Tiger: No, he won 2, fool. 2 is less than 5, ***********.
Eldrick: Ha, but he have-a good season, you no have good season, exprain dat!
Tiger: He's not expected to win as much, I am.
Eldrick: Wait, wha you mean a-Tiguh?
Tiger: I won more than anyone, and I am #1 in the Fed Ex cup points, and money list, and yet it's still considered a bad season for me.
Eldrick: Ah, I see, is dis what you tark about being carred "disclimination".
Tiger: Sort of.
Eldrick: Oh, ha, I see now... Peopre stupid.
Tiger: Yes they are.
Eldrick: Which part of us has the p**** again?
Tiger: I do.
Eldrick: Dat one stereotype I rik![/quote]

Lame post on many levels.

[sshadow2]

People seem to forget that its not luck or magic that Tiger does/plays so well. It is his training ethic, drive to succeed, and drive to get better all the time. That hasn't changed. And neither will be his multiple tour wins. Major and otherwise.

I bet that if he hasn't been doing the 2 hour putting practice per day this year like he used to, he probably will soon.

[GregP]

I'm pretty sure he continues to improve his game as he always has, and will have at least two or three more years in his career where he wins multiple majors. He is in his golfing prime right now, and with his fitness level, he will continue to be head and shoulders above everyone else.

One of the stats that was most internesting was that of the 20+ majors that were par 72 that Woods played in, he has won just less than half. It was something like 10 for 21, this would have been 11-22. So, he is 10 for 22 now in par 72 majors.

Sooner or later, the field was going to catch up to him in terms of providing competition. With his drive and his proven track record for improving his game, I bet he crosses the 20 major mark in 4 years max. I think he wins 6 of the next 16 majors at least.

There is absolutely no evidence he has slowed down in terms of his skill level. He's still the best golfer on the planet by a large margin.

[lagwagon23]

[quote name='Shanks For The Memories' post='1896243' date='Aug 17 2009, 09:39 PM']I've aquired something very interesting here...

Tiger has a black side, and an asian side, and they sometimes conflict. His black side gives him his rythym and athleticism, while his asian side gives him precision and determination.

This is a transcript of Tiger's conversation to himself in the locker room after the round:

Eldrick: Ah, dis where you fair Tigah Wood, you rack disciprine.
Tiger: Say what homie? I win 35% of the time!
Eldrick: You do mafs? You do mafs? Who de Chinesa man here?
Tiger: I knows how to do maf you hatah.
Eldrick: Oh yeah, what cosine of 45 deglee angre?
Tiger: 1.414... Or is it 7.07? Wait, sine or cosine?
Eldrick: Ha, you no never get maths right you letard.
Tiger: Well, you do the maf, I'z won 5 times dis year!
Eldrick: Oh yeah, werr, you no win most!
Tiger: Like hell I didn't fool!
Eldrick: Blian Gay win more event dan you Tigah!
Tiger: No, he won 2, fool. 2 is less than 5, ***********.
Eldrick: Ha, but he have-a good season, you no have good season, exprain dat!
Tiger: He's not expected to win as much, I am.
Eldrick: Wait, wha you mean a-Tiguh?
Tiger: I won more than anyone, and I am #1 in the Fed Ex cup points, and money list, and yet it's still considered a bad season for me.
Eldrick: Ah, I see, is dis what you tark about being carred "disclimination".
Tiger: Sort of.
Eldrick: Oh, ha, I see now... Peopre stupid.
Tiger: Yes they are.
Eldrick: Which part of us has the p**** again?
Tiger: I do.
Eldrick: Dat one stereotype I rik![/quote]


*Crickets*

[Jer-Jer]

[quote name='Shanks For The Memories' post='1896243' date='Aug 18 2009, 12:39 AM']I've aquired something very interesting here...

Tiger has a black side, and an asian side, and they sometimes conflict. His black side gives him his rythym and athleticism, while his asian side gives him precision and determination.

This is a transcript of Tiger's conversation to himself in the locker room after the round:

Eldrick: Ah, dis where you fair Tigah Wood, you rack disciprine.
Tiger: Say what homie? I win 35% of the time!
Eldrick: You do mafs? You do mafs? Who de Chinesa man here?
Tiger: I knows how to do maf you hatah.
Eldrick: Oh yeah, what cosine of 45 deglee angre?
Tiger: 1.414... Or is it 7.07? Wait, sine or cosine?
Eldrick: Ha, you no never get maths right you letard.
Tiger: Well, you do the maf, I'z won 5 times dis year!
Eldrick: Oh yeah, werr, you no win most!
Tiger: Like hell I didn't fool!
Eldrick: Blian Gay win more event dan you Tigah!
Tiger: No, he won 2, fool. 2 is less than 5, ***********.
Eldrick: Ha, but he have-a good season, you no have good season, exprain dat!
Tiger: He's not expected to win as much, I am.
Eldrick: Wait, wha you mean a-Tiguh?
Tiger: I won more than anyone, and I am #1 in the Fed Ex cup points, and money list, and yet it's still considered a bad season for me.
Eldrick: Ah, I see, is dis what you tark about being carred "disclimination".
Tiger: Sort of.
Eldrick: Oh, ha, I see now... Peopre stupid.
Tiger: Yes they are.
Eldrick: Which part of us has the p**** again?
Tiger: I do.
Eldrick: Dat one stereotype I rik![/quote]

[DemolitionMan]

Not to stop anyone from having an opinion, except for that lame conversation between eldrick and tiger someone, but at least we can agree the two greatest golfers at hand are Tiger and Nicklaus. So let's look at basic math. Nicklaus took 25 seasons to get 18 majors, or roughly three majors every four years. Tiger is at 14 in 13 seasons, pretty close to one a year on average. Is he a lock to get to 19? Not when you factor in potential injury. But by performance, yes it's enough of a lock I would be betting any amount on it.

Given this was a year he was re-learning a golf swing post several months of layoff, it's not a big deal he didn't win a major in 2009. But I don't see any reason why he will not post roughly one major win a year in the next 5 years. I'm not saying it's going to happen, but I wouldn't bet against it right now. Yes, majors get much harder to win as you get older, even for Nicklaus, but time is on Tiger's side. And it looks like the knee is too.

What do people think is going to happen to Tiger so that he cannot contend and pull out some wins in majors??? When you have the best short game in the world, you are going to be near the top pretty much every time you tee it up.

[Shanks For The Memories]

[quote name='Jer-Jer' post='1896760' date='Aug 18 2009, 09:56 AM'][quote name='Shanks For The Memories' post='1896243' date='Aug 18 2009, 12:39 AM']I've aquired something very interesting here...

Tiger has a black side, and an asian side, and they sometimes conflict. His black side gives him his rythym and athleticism, while his asian side gives him precision and determination.

This is a transcript of Tiger's conversation to himself in the locker room after the round:

Eldrick: Ah, dis where you fair Tigah Wood, you rack disciprine.
Tiger: Say what homie? I win 35% of the time!
Eldrick: You do mafs? You do mafs? Who de Chinesa man here?
Tiger: I knows how to do maf you hatah.
Eldrick: Oh yeah, what cosine of 45 deglee angre?
Tiger: 1.414... Or is it 7.07? Wait, sine or cosine?
Eldrick: Ha, you no never get maths right you letard.
Tiger: Well, you do the maf, I'z won 5 times dis year!
Eldrick: Oh yeah, werr, you no win most!
Tiger: Like hell I didn't fool!
Eldrick: Blian Gay win more event dan you Tigah!
Tiger: No, he won 2, fool. 2 is less than 5, ***********.
Eldrick: Ha, but he have-a good season, you no have good season, exprain dat!
Tiger: He's not expected to win as much, I am.
Eldrick: Wait, wha you mean a-Tiguh?
Tiger: I won more than anyone, and I am #1 in the Fed Ex cup points, and money list, and yet it's still considered a bad season for me.
Eldrick: Ah, I see, is dis what you tark about being carred "disclimination".
Tiger: Sort of.
Eldrick: Oh, ha, I see now... Peopre stupid.
Tiger: Yes they are.
Eldrick: Which part of us has the p**** again?
Tiger: I do.
Eldrick: Dat one stereotype I rik![/quote]


[/quote]


I was going for "as lame as this thread". I think I did it.

[Pure745]

You did wayyyyyyyyyyyyyy more than that.. way more.

[allyjs]

Shanks that post was piss poor. Think before you type.

[Shanks For The Memories]

[quote name='Pure745' post='1898824' date='Aug 18 2009, 10:35 PM']You did wayyyyyyyyyyyyyy more than that.. way more.[/quote]


Ha! I just typed the stupidest thing I could think of.

[mosesgolf]

Do the math. Even going the conservative route say 1 major every 2 years multiplied for 15-16 years makes 7-8 more majors. How about 2 majors every 3 years makes 10. He loses one tournament to a guy who shot the round of his life and Tiger's not going to win any more majors? C'mon dude.

[Shanks For The Memories]

[quote name='mosesgolf' post='1899333' date='Aug 19 2009, 02:46 AM']Do the math. Even going the conservative route say 1 major every 2 years multiplied for 15-16 years makes 7-8 more majors. How about 2 majors every 3 years makes 10. He loses one tournament to a guy who shot the round of his life and Tiger's not going to win any more majors? C'mon dude.[/quote]


Agreed 100%.

Btw, I'm not a fan of the left side either, but that's usually where I end up on a mishit. Sometimes I see the ball leave the clubhead going nearly 45° to the right, and it just hooks around and turns to traveling 45° to the left.

Last time it happened, I laked the ball, and took a double on a par 5.

[mosesgolf]

[quote name='Shanks For The Memories' post='1898856' date='Aug 18 2009, 09:46 PM'][quote name='Pure745' post='1898824' date='Aug 18 2009, 10:35 PM']You did wayyyyyyyyyyyyyy more than that.. way more.[/quote]


Ha! I just typed the stupidest thing I could think of.
[/quote]
True dat.
What were you thinking? :D

[Shanks For The Memories]

[quote name='mosesgolf' post='1899362' date='Aug 19 2009, 03:18 AM'][quote name='Shanks For The Memories' post='1898856' date='Aug 18 2009, 09:46 PM'][quote name='Pure745' post='1898824' date='Aug 18 2009, 10:35 PM']You did wayyyyyyyyyyyyyy more than that.. way more.[/quote]


Ha! I just typed the stupidest thing I could think of.
[/quote]
True dat.
What were you thinking?
[/quote]

What could be stupider than this see-saw of "he'll win 50 majors!" to "He'll never win another tournament!"

My god, people act like golfers don't have good days and bad days, and that's like the most fundimental part of golf. It just so happens that Tiger often has good days, and his bad days are still good enough for second.

[gedo68]

Simmer down. Not everyone can be a the top of their game 24x7. To me it just seems like people are getting tired of him winning and would like to see a new fresh face take over. which is ok i guess. *silly humans*

[ghodges]

[quote name='Shanks For The Memories' post='1896243' date='Aug 18 2009, 12:39 AM']I've aquired something very interesting here...

Tiger has a black side, and an asian side, and they sometimes conflict. His black side gives him his rythym and athleticism, while his asian side gives him precision and determination.

This is a transcript of Tiger's conversation to himself in the locker room after the round:

Eldrick: Ah, dis where you fair Tigah Wood, you rack disciprine.
Tiger: Say what homie? I win 35% of the time!
Eldrick: You do mafs? You do mafs? Who de Chinesa man here?
Tiger: I knows how to do maf you hatah.
Eldrick: Oh yeah, what cosine of 45 deglee angre?
Tiger: 1.414... Or is it 7.07? Wait, sine or cosine?
Eldrick: Ha, you no never get maths right you letard.
Tiger: Well, you do the maf, I'z won 5 times dis year!
Eldrick: Oh yeah, werr, you no win most!
Tiger: Like hell I didn't fool!
Eldrick: Blian Gay win more event dan you Tigah!
Tiger: No, he won 2, fool. 2 is less than 5, ***********.
Eldrick: Ha, but he have-a good season, you no have good season, exprain dat!
Tiger: He's not expected to win as much, I am.
Eldrick: Wait, wha you mean a-Tiguh?
Tiger: I won more than anyone, and I am #1 in the Fed Ex cup points, and money list, and yet it's still considered a bad season for me.
Eldrick: Ah, I see, is dis what you tark about being carred "disclimination".
Tiger: Sort of.
Eldrick: Oh, ha, I see now... Peopre stupid.
Tiger: Yes they are.
Eldrick: Which part of us has the p**** again?
Tiger: I do.
Eldrick: Dat one stereotype I rik![/quote]

There has been some idiotic stuff here in the past, but this easily tops the list.

[og512]

I think he will adapt and eventually break the record.

I really think that he felt that the guy he was playing with would do the usual "oh god, i'm playing with Tiger. I know he's gonna win... blah blah blah" and buckle under the pressure. But this dude played like he has nothing to lose and thus Tiger lost his psychological edge.

It will be more difficult than in the past because he's loat his aura of invincibility but barring another major injury or setback, he'll probably break it in next couple years.

[AcesAZ]

Thought Id bump this post from a year and a half ago. Anyone change there mind that Tiger is a given to break Jacks record? I think its more unlikely now then ever. Tiger is playing his worst golf of his career!

[bamoore]

Tiger will beat Jacks 18 and probably win 6-8 at minimum. Once he gets his new swing pattern figured out combined with finally working with trackman he will be back.

I agree though that the Tiger mystique where everyone folds on Sunday won't happen as frequently. I don't think he ever intimidated people so much with his physical golf game but his mental strength. IMO that went out the window with his crash. All you have to do examine some of the fugly broads he was gaming to realize he doesn't have it all figured out upstairs!

[CryMeARiver]

[quote name='bamoore' timestamp='1302272322' post='3132634']
Tiger will beat Jacks 18 and probably win 6-8 more at minimum. Once he gets his new swing pattern figured out combined with finally working with trackman he will be back.

I agree though that the Tiger mystique where everyone folds on Sunday won't happen as frequently. I don't think he ever intimidated people so much with his physical golf game but his mental strength. IMO that went out the window with his crash. All you have to do examine some of the fugly broads he was gaming to realize he doesn't have it all figured out upstairs!
[/quote]

So he's gonna win 10-12 more majors minimum? I'll take that bet...

[bamoore]

[quote name='CryMeARiver' timestamp='1302273514' post='3132688']
[quote name='bamoore' timestamp='1302272322' post='3132634']
Tiger will beat Jacks 18 and probably win 6-8 more at minimum. Once he gets his new swing pattern figured out combined with finally working with trackman he will be back.

I agree though that the Tiger mystique where everyone folds on Sunday won't happen as frequently. I don't think he ever intimidated people so much with his physical golf game but his mental strength. IMO that went out the window with his crash. All you have to do examine some of the fugly broads he was gaming to realize he doesn't have it all figured out upstairs!
[/quote]

So he's gonna win 10-12 more majors minimum? I'll take that bet...
[/quote]

Ooops..yea I meant 6-8 total not on top of the 4 he needs. But once he gets his swing figured out and if he putts like he did...I wouldn't put it past Eldrick. I know that sounds like a 12 year old Tiger homer but I'm far from that.

[AcesAZ]

[quote name='bamoore' timestamp='1302273996' post='3132706']
[quote name='CryMeARiver' timestamp='1302273514' post='3132688']
[quote name='bamoore' timestamp='1302272322' post='3132634']
Tiger will beat Jacks 18 and probably win 6-8 more at minimum. Once he gets his new swing pattern figured out combined with finally working with trackman he will be back.

I agree though that the Tiger mystique where everyone folds on Sunday won't happen as frequently. I don't think he ever intimidated people so much with his physical golf game but his mental strength. IMO that went out the window with his crash. All you have to do examine some of the fugly broads he was gaming to realize he doesn't have it all figured out upstairs!
[/quote]

So he's gonna win 10-12 more majors minimum? I'll take that bet...
[/quote]

Ooops..yea I meant 6-8 total not on top of the 4 he needs. But once he gets his swing figured out and if he putts like he did...I wouldn't put it past Eldrick. I know that sounds like a 12 year old Tiger homer but I'm far from that.
[/quote]

I'll take that bet too. People thought I was nuts thinking Tiger wasnt a given to break Jacks record. He might not even win one more. The players as a whole have gotten much better, Tiger will have a hard time winning 5 more majors. What is he 35 years old with a bum knee? I just dont see it. How many guys win majors in their late 30's and 40's? Not many! Tiger is getting old and time is starting to run out.

[SmileyDan]

[quote name='AcesAZ' timestamp='1302277644' post='3132852']
[quote name='bamoore' timestamp='1302273996' post='3132706']
[quote name='CryMeARiver' timestamp='1302273514' post='3132688']
[quote name='bamoore' timestamp='1302272322' post='3132634']
Tiger will beat Jacks 18 and probably win 6-8 more at minimum. Once he gets his new swing pattern figured out combined with finally working with trackman he will be back.

I agree though that the Tiger mystique where everyone folds on Sunday won't happen as frequently. I don't think he ever intimidated people so much with his physical golf game but his mental strength. IMO that went out the window with his crash. All you have to do examine some of the fugly broads he was gaming to realize he doesn't have it all figured out upstairs!
[/quote]

So he's gonna win 10-12 more majors minimum? I'll take that bet...
[/quote]

Ooops..yea I meant 6-8 total not on top of the 4 he needs. But once he gets his swing figured out and if he putts like he did...I wouldn't put it past Eldrick. I know that sounds like a 12 year old Tiger homer but I'm far from that.
[/quote]

I'll take that bet too. People thought I was nuts thinking Tiger wasnt a given to break Jacks record. He might not even win one more. The players as a whole have gotten much better, Tiger will have a hard time winning 5 more majors. What is he 35 years old with a bum knee? I just dont see it. How many guys win majors in their late 30's and 40's? Not many! Tiger is getting old and time is starting to run out.
[/quote]

Phil has won 4 from 34-40? Ben Hogan won 8 from 36-41? Nicklaus won 6 from 35-46?

I cannot believe people are doubting someone that has dominated the game of golf for the last 12 years. It's probably the same crowd that doubted him each time he has overhauled his game... Or the same crowd that has disliked him from day one. I'm sorry, but having seen everything this guy has done with a golf ball it is near impossible to doubt his ability to break that record. I find it funny too that with 'how bad' he is playing, he is playing better than the average shmoe on tour. He's gone through drastic changes before and he's come out on top. He will once again and he'll be giving a big thanks to all of the naysayers for giving him more motivation.

Tiger will beat Nicklaus' record. It's just a matter of by how many.

[sk373]

[quote]I find it funny too that with 'how bad' he is playing, he is playing better than the average shmoe on tour. [/quote]

well, sure. but just being better than the average guy on tour is a long way from being the guy destined to break Jack's major record.

[quote]He's gone through drastic changes before and he's come out on top. [/quote]

yes, he has. but he's not a young man anymore, and he's got a bum knee. furthermore, Tiger still had the all-world short game, the all-time clutch putter, the power advantage, and the intimidation factor over the rest of the field the previous two times that he made drastic swing changes. now, there are quite a few guys who hit it past Tiger--Tiger has become merely above average in terms of length. the young guys don't fear Tiger. his short game is not what it once was, and he's no longer automatic inside of 10 ft. history has shown that once a player loses some ability to make putts, it's exceedingly rare that he gets that back.

i still have the nagging suspicion that history will bear Woods out to be a better Tom Watson (the OG Stanford TW), rather than the man who eclipsed Nicklaus. Watson won nearly all his tournaments in a brilliantly dominant 7 year stretch. Watson had 8 majors by the age of 33, 6 straight POY's, and then never won another major or POY. the putter left Watson. there are similarities here. Woods has had an unparalleled stretch of brilliantly dominant golf over a span of 12 years--14 majors, 10 POY. his putter has seemed to have left him. i hope i'm not right, but i have that nagging suspicion.

in contrast, Nicklaus's career is more of one of unparalleled sustained excellence over a long period of time--Nicklaus has only 5 POY awards. think about it.

[ITBVolks]

I'm a Phil guy personally but......

This talk about how Tiger doesn't intimidate people like he use to. It's pretty simple, if your not winning, you don't intimidate. I'd bet if Tiger got his shiot together and went out there and threw down some 8 and 10 stroke beatings, he'd all of a sudden he'd intimidate people again.


Do I think he'll beat Jack's record..... Not sure. He's showing signs of getting his game together again but it'll really come down to regaining his short game (150yds and in) for him to really start scoring. It's not like he's been a FIR guy ever anyway. His putting and short game have left him which is what's hurting his scoring currently.

[SmileyDan]

[quote name='sk373' timestamp='1302288817' post='3133307']
well, sure. but just being better than the average guy on tour is a long way from being the guy destined to break Jack's major record.[/quote]

So what do you call Jack when he went through his slump between the 1978 British Open and 1980 US Open?


[quote name='sk373' timestamp='1302288817' post='3133307']
yes, he has. but he's not a young man anymore, and he's got a bum knee. [/quote]

Bum knee? As far as I can tell his knee is fine at the moment. Every athlete goes through physical ailments, no one is immune. Injuries don't prevent champions from playing great golf. Look at Ben Hogan for God's sake.

[quote name='sk373' timestamp='1302288817' post='3133307']
furthermore, Tiger still had the all-world short game, the all-time clutch putter, the power advantage, and the intimidation factor over the rest of the field the previous two times that he made drastic swing changes. now, there are quite a few guys who hit it past Tiger--Tiger has become merely above average in terms of length. the young guys don't fear Tiger. his short game is not what it once was, and he's no longer automatic inside of 10 ft. history has shown that once a player loses some ability to make putts, it's exceedingly rare that he gets that back. [/quote]

How do you know the young guys don't fear Tiger? Have they had him breathing down their neck when he is on his game? No. If Tiger is playing at 90% of ability on Sunday chasing a leader I guarantee you these kids will fold like Origami.

And as far as length, correct me if I'm wrong but Tiger hasn't been trying to use his length as of late. He has been trying to use his head to beat golf courses. Wasn't it at Doral that he smoked a drive 340 something off the tee? The power is there, he chooses not to use it; especially since he is still struggling with his swing mechanics. Why swing at 100% and increase your margin of error?


[quote name='sk373' timestamp='1302288817' post='3133307']
i still have the nagging suspicion that history will bear Woods out to be a better Tom Watson (the OG Stanford TW), rather than the man who eclipsed Nicklaus. Watson won nearly all his tournaments in a brilliantly dominant 7 year stretch. Watson had 8 majors by the age of 33, 6 straight POY's, and then never won another major or POY. the putter left Watson. there are similarities here. Woods has had an unparalleled stretch of brilliantly dominant golf over a span of 12 years--14 majors, 10 POY. his putter has seemed to have left him. i hope i'm not right, but i have that nagging suspicion.

in contrast, Nicklaus's career is more of one of unparalleled sustained excellence over a long period of time--Nicklaus has only 5 POY awards. think about it.
[/quote]

A better Tom Watson? I don't think the word [i]better[/i] really means much when you look at the number of wins... There needs to be a bigger word.


Jack won 6 ( 33%) of his majors after the age of 35. Tiger is in a slump but with everything that he has done in such a short period of time, i have no clue how people can write him off as being done or something of the past. He is overhauling the mechanics of his entire game. His swing is obviously different, but like he has said time and time again. When he changes his swing, he changes the mechanics of his entire game, all the way down to his putting stroke. This isn't something that can be done in a year's time for any professional, let alone someone who is also trying to manage his life outside the game.

Time will tell but I would be willing to put everything i own on the line on a bet that tiger will surpass 18.

[Bob57]

You are dead wrong---each time he overhauled his game he did not change his chipping or putter stroke... This time he has changed his chipping and lost his putting stroke. Nobody was able to correct what Tiger was doing with his putter other than his father. Not his first two teachers, not Butch, not Hank, and certainly not Terry the Toad....

[sk373]

[quote]A better Tom Watson? I don't think the word better really means much when you look at the number of wins... There needs to be a bigger word.


Jack won 6 ( 33%) of his majors after the age of 35. Tiger is in a slump but with everything that he has done in such a short period of time, i have no clue how people can write him off as being done or something of the past. He is overhauling the mechanics of his entire game. His swing is obviously different, but like he has said time and time again. When he changes his swing, he changes the mechanics of his entire game, all the way down to his putting stroke. This isn't something that can be done in a year's time for any professional, let alone someone who is also trying to manage his life outside the game.

Time will tell but I would be willing to put everything i own on the line on a bet that tiger will surpass 18. [/quote]

saying Tiger Woods won't break Jack's record hardly qualifies as "writing him off." i think that Tiger might have one or two majors left in him. however, one or two is a long way from 5. 5 majors in a player's career is a Hall of Fame career--Tiger must have what amounts to another entire HOF career after the age of 35 to break Jack's record. he must do so in an era that is deeper than ever, with more players from around the world, who all train harder than ever, and who are increasingly more athletic than ever. that's asking *a lot*.

and, no, Tiger hasn't monkeyed with his short game or putting stroke until now. he's even changed putters, which has surprised me--Tiger is not known as an equipment tinkerer. how long did TW use that Scotty Cameron putter? changing putters is a sure sign that a golfer isn't confident with the flatstick.

[quote]This talk about how Tiger doesn't intimidate people like he use to. It's pretty simple, if your not winning, you don't intimidate. I'd bet if Tiger got his shiot together and went out there and threw down some 8 and 10 stroke beatings, he'd all of a sudden he'd intimidate people again.
[/quote]

[quote]How do you know the young guys don't fear Tiger? Have they had him breathing down their neck when he is on his game? No. If Tiger is playing at 90% of ability on Sunday chasing a leader I guarantee you these kids will fold like Origami.
[/quote]

Tiger had the aura of invincibility--that he was unbeatable. he had that because he *was* unbeatable. now he's beatable--Y.E. Yang broke the first chink in Tiger's armor when he stared TW down in the 2009 PGA. once people see that you can be beat, you don't get to have that aura of invincibility back, even if you taste success again.

how do i know the young guys don't fear Tiger? see any Rory McIlroy interviews lately? the young guys haven't known the unbeatable Tiger--they watched him while they grew up, but they didn't have to play against him. the TW they play against is the human, beatable TW. the young guys haven't had to suffer countless TW beatings, so why *would* they be afraid?

one thing i *am* quite confident in saying is that 8 and 10 stroke TW beatings are a thing of the past. he isn't that much better than everyone else anymore, and i don't think he will be again.