Pitch Shots: 30, 40 And 50 Yards

[EmperorPenguin]

I find that of all the non-pro golfers I have met in my life, if there is one shot I can say these golfers do not have, it is the 30-, 40- and 50-yard pitch shot.  After experimenting on the range and on the course, I can share with you how I hit these shots.  Mind you, these are my methods of hitting theses shots, and they may work for you, maybe not, but I hope we can all get some ideas on how to hit these shots in this thread.

 

I believe that the best way to understand a pitch shot is to consider it a mini golf swing.  You do all the things you do in a golf swing, but in a smaller scale.  That helped me immensely in my method.  I think of my left arm as the arm of a clock, and for the 50-yard shot I swing to about 3 o'clock, letting my wrist hinge naturally so I form the "L," and do the rest as I would a mini golf swing.  If I want 60 yards I swing to about 2 o'clock, and for 40 I try to swing to about 4 o'clock.  30 yards is a little trickier: I try to swing at about 5 o'clock and hinge my wrists early, and take a swing from there; that seems to work for me.  For many years I have had 30 yards and 50 yards, and for me the most difficult was 40 yards.  I recently found my method for 40 yards and I am happy to finally have it.

 

How do you guys hit 30, 40 and 50 yards?

[mcputter]

I'm confused, doesn't your left arm start at about the six o'clock position at address?

[gsrjc]

Perhaps he’s left handed. 

[iacas]

If he's a righty, and he's looking out from his eyes at the clock facing him, then he swings counter-clockwise (again, from his perspective) on the backswing.

 

I feel like y'all know what he's saying, no?

[North Butte]

I'm glad you've found a feeling that works for you (miniature version of your full swing) and I've heard lots of people say they feel it the same way. For me, any workable 30-50 yard pitching motion feels nothing at all like my full swing.

 

I have a very quick full swing tempo (I once did a frame-by-frame comparison with video of Matt Fitzpatrick and he is only a tiny bit quicker than me) and everything about my full swing has evolved to work on that quick tempo and the feeling of hitting the top of my backswing and immediately rebounding into the downswing. Not saying that's a good way to swing but I've pretty much done some version of that since the first time I picked up a golf club decades ago.

 

So if I try to just shorten my swing to hit a 40-yard pitch but make it feel like a miniature version of the same thing, it totally falls apart. I don't have the coordination to hit a pitch shot at that tempo. And when I slow it down, pause at the top then swing down and through...well, it doesn't fell remotely like my full swing. 

 

For me, the ability to do the 40-yard pitch waxes and wanes depending on how well I'm able to switch gears between my quick tempo, quick transition full swing and that lazy, smooth pitching motion with a little pause at the top. I'll go for weeks or months able to switch tempos just fine but then suddenly I'll just lose the slower pitching motion entirely for a while. Eventually it'll come back. It's frustrating (of course it would come back quicker if I'd just spend 10-20 hours in the short game practice area a few times a year). 

 

This topic is kind of like that common advice to chip by "using your putting stroke with an 8-iron". My putting stroke is so upright (i.e. my ideal putter lie angle is about 80 degrees), my grip pressure is so light and my acceleration through the ball with a putter is so gradual, trying to do that with an iron off a tight lie or out of the rough is completely doomed. It's well intentioned advice that works for people who putt with low hands, standing well inside the ball and with a good bit of acceleration. But not every "putting stroke" is like that. 

[SNIPERBBB]

For me, its basically an all arm swing. Gotta really quite the lower and upper body rotation or youll start hoseling it.

[EmperorPenguin]

11 hours ago, mcputter said:

I'm confused, doesn't your left arm start at about the six o'clock position at address?

I think of the clock from my side, not outside looking at me.  Yes, the left arm starts at 6 o'clock, and halfway back it is at 3 o'clock.  Sorry for the confusion.

Edited May 5 by EmperorPenguin

[TheDeanAbides]

I do what Monte teaches and feel like they’re like an underarm throw. It’s all feel, and just an extension of the Use The Bounce chip shot. 

[Sean124]

42 minutes ago, TheDeanAbides said:

I do what Monte teaches and feel like they’re like an underarm throw. It’s all feel, and just an extension of the Use The Bounce chip shot. 

Yeah, I’ve tried all the clock stuff and do much better with “hit it about that far.”

[TheDeanAbides]

5 minutes ago, Sean124 said:

Yeah, I’ve tried all the clock stuff and do much better with “hit it about that far.”

Exactly. I found that this intuitive approach makes more sense. I never think about how long my backswing is when I’m tossing a ball. 

[SNIPERBBB]

24 minutes ago, Sean124 said:

Yeah, I’ve tried all the clock stuff and do much better with “hit it about that far.”

I think the clock system is a good reference point but when you try to get mechanical with it, saying I have to hit X o'clock, bad things happen because it tends to get you out of sync.

[North Butte]

28 minutes ago, SNIPERBBB said:

I think the clock system is a good reference point but when you try to get mechanical with it, saying I have to hit X o'clock, bad things happen because it tends to get you out of sync.

I think on a touch shot like that ANY thought about my swing mechanics, even something as simple as a “clock” position, takes me out of feel mode. 
 

Athough, looking at it in the other direction, I think Dave Pelz’s idea when he presented that clock thing was to make those shots algorithmic rather than feel. Basically to give you a bunch of numbers you can hit with a repeatable, pre-programmed type swing, and then you only have to adjust for slightly more or less distance off those numbers.

Edited May 5 by North Butte

[st1800e]

 

[byoshio82]

For me it’s 100% feel and practice. Lots and lots of reps over the years. I use 5 wedges for these shots and the 8 & 9 iron so lots of options and visualizing landing spot and what the ball is going to do after landing is part of the equation.  
 

I do the same thing with putting. I stand behind the ball and take 3 quick practice swings to get a feel and visualize the shot/landing spot and what it’s going to do after landing. 
 

For putts I’m seeing the ball roll to the hole and where it’s going to enter the cup (clock). 

[596]

All by feel.  For my basic shot at that distance it's feet together, most of my weight on the lead foot, then feel a swing for the distance.  This results in a lower then normal pitch for me. 

 

My other shot is feet about 12" apart, more neutral stance, sometimes open stance, sometimes closed stance, ball just forward. This results in a higher shot.

 

I'll hit either shot with either a gap or sand wedge.  

[animalgolfs]

20 minutes ago, st1800e said:

 

Trevino is a treasure

[Haroputt]

By feel.  Assess the green reception to either a hi pitch with spin. Or pitch and run 

Have both those type of shots available. Tighter pin then hi pitch    My feel is mostly right handed and I don’t think of left arm as a clock. I visualized the landing spot for pitch and run or apex of the hi pitch that sometimes fades 

[shellbmb]

Was taught the Pelz clock system as a young high school/college golfer, but it has morphed over time.  I have certain feels to how far I take it back for these types of shots.  If it's 9:00, 10:00, 11:00 I don't really care as long as I know what it feels like and how far it goes.  Then I take those feels and change clubs, ball position and sometimes open the face depending on how much green I have to work with.  I'll hit 20-30 of those shots on the practice range/trackman and see how far it goes repeatedly.  So I do like to know how far it is.  But then if it's any closer than say 30 yards, then it's all feel.  

 

I have three ball positions:  middle, front and back.  Then three face positions:  square, 20-30 degrees-ish open, and then 45 degrees-ish open.  I use mostly my 60 unless I just have a ton of green to work with.  But with the same feel swing, that covers a ton of distances and conditions.  

[Nels55]

This works pretty good:

 

[Priceyd]

Few years ago I had a lesson as i really struggled to hit full wedges, was told to just learn how to hit half shots. So few years later of practice I feel I have the half shot mastered. Love being between 75 (SW) up to 120 (8iron) just feel in control with it, clock system what I would say feels like 3pm.

 

But this year really noticed how uncomfortable I am with shots less then that, the other day was the last straw. Went to the range Friday on top tracer and just practiced a 1/4 shot with LW up to pw and wrote down the averages. Same with a little bigger putting stroke and wrote them down. 

 

On my phone I have them all written down on the notes, quick check and now I feel really comfortable anything under 120. Thats my major goal this summer to keep practicing these distances, 

 

[Mcgeeno]

Posted my story on here a dozen times or so but I essentially shanked a 63 yard flip wedge in a playoff to lose an important even in my city a decade or so ago in front of a bunch of people.

 

From that moment of pain I went on a mission to fix my 100 and in game.

 

Mine is slightly different than what has been mentioned. Might not work for many but it worked for me as a more analytical type of guy:

 

I worked on a hand feel  "knee to knee" "hip to hip" and "shoulder to shoulder" shot with my four wedges and essentially built a practice system around all the yardages all 4 clubs could go. Pretty much a dumbed down version of a clock system with 3 spots x 4 clubs covering 12 carry yardages inside of 100 or so. 

 

I hit 500 knee to knee lob wedges. Lasered it off, found the number. Dialed it in. Hit a bunch more with a towel placed in a field to find the consistency. Did the same with the other clubs and pretty much established a base shot for every number from 110 down. 

 

 

 

 

[ezra76]

All feel.

 

I find doing a count saying "one" on backswing and "two" on downswing helps me a lot with tempo.

 

It's my most practiced area since I have no decent range nearby. I have a place I can hit shots inside 100 at bucket though. I setup little green boundries and hit different shots at it. Recently put together a nice set with a 46* PW so been using that a lot experimenting. 

 

 

Edited May 6 by ezra76

[Hawkeye77]

The clock "system" has been around forever, Pelz was all over it and Tom Kite using it, back in the day.  Kite had his wedge distances taped to his wedges with a little piece of paper under a piece of scotch tape, if you want to trigger some folks in the rules section bring that up, haha, and yes, it is 100% legal.  Hey, Kite was an incredible pitcher of the golf ball (and practiced more in a week than most work at their jobs).

 

If it works do it.

 

It absolutely doesn't work for me and I tried it back in the 80s/early 90s and flirted again many years ago.  Feel and practice and more reliable technique has worked wonders. I chuckle at average golfers who think that laying up to 100 yards just because the pros supposedly do is how to play vs. having better games from 40-80 yards or whatever and I'm not going all Broadie about it, but folks just don't work on their short wedge games so no wonder they freak out on short pitches or think they'll get closer from 100.  I'm no pro and I'm no master of spin for situations but 30-60 yard pitches are fun and not that hard.

Edited May 6 by Hawkeye77

[CasualLie]

As mentioned above, I keep lower body quiet.  It's not rigid, but I am not trying to shift/pressure into right side.  Start with about 60% pressure left and stay there. 

 

I do not use a clock system, but when practicing, I work on feeling hip to hip swings, pec to pec, then shoulder to shoulder.  The important thing is downswing rotation and keeping it in sync; think hip and grip moving together.  Even more important, tempo.

 

I work on knowing my yardages for these three swings for lob, sand, gap.

 

When playing, all that range work is good for club selection and confidence in the tempo.  But once the club is selected, it is much more a "feel", like Monte's system, "it's about like that" vs some mechanical adherence to exact position.  And the swing is setup/tempo.

 

Whatever happens after that...just deal with it.

  

[Pepperturbo]

Everyone is different. 

 

Yesterday, during my uneventful round, on an odd length, short course, I experienced a number of 30-70yd shots so, for sh** & giggles, experimented with mechanical clock shots, mostly to see if I could do it; I could NOT!  It's remarkable that people using that technique can be successful, as the process requires a lot of coordinated arm to head conceptualization to execute a shot.  

 

I visualize the shot, then when over the ball, won't know when my arms will stop, until I am done.  I simply sense where my swing needs to stop to hit a chip or short pitch shot to the target spot on the green.  The biggest contributing factor is switching from my standard Vardon grip to a reverse overlap grip, which makes my right hand/arm dominate, thus controls how far to underhandedly through the ball to hit the target.

 

If you want to practice what I am talking about, set targets at various length, then underhandedly throw the golf ball at the target.  Writing this explanation is more laborious than what I do over the ball.  Yesterday, I got up and down seven times using this technique.  

 

  

Edited May 6 by Pepperturbo

[Pepperturbo]

@Hawkeye77 So true. 

 

The biggest culprit working against short-game improvement is that people don't have the time, want to take the time, or too lazy to use the time to better their games, but like talking about improvement.  Their solution is banging a bucket of balls using a driver, then cringe, skull or chunk to bogie or double-bogie golf inside 100yds. 

 

It's laughable, people talk as if they can mimic touring pro, LM stats, yet they simply do not have the physical ability or natural talent, plus many are swinging around their beer gut with a beer in hand. 😜 The only way to improve any aspect of this great game is to practice.  I hit baby pitch shots at least 4 days a week.

 

Then there's this common occurrence; yesterday, the foursome in front of us were playing the blue tees, yet, three of them, most of the time, couldn't hit the ball further than 100yds off the tee, then we'd see them standing around bull-sh***** for a bit before hitting their ball.   The whole round they were sucking down suds like there was no tomorrow, while hitting on the blonde cart girl, which they failed at too.  LOL 

[jonsnow]

39 minutes ago, Pepperturbo said:

@Hawkeye77 So true. 

 

The biggest culprit working against short-game improvement is that people don't have the time, want to take the time, or too lazy to use the time to better their games, but like talking about improvement.  Their solution is banging a bucket of balls using a driver, then cringe, skull or chunk to bogie or double-bogie golf inside 100yds. 

 

It's laughable, people talk as if they can mimic touring pro, LM stats, yet they simply do not have the physical ability or natural talent, plus many are swinging around their beer gut with a beer in hand. 😜 The only way to improve any aspect of this great game is to practice.  I hit baby pitch shots at least 4 days a week.

 

Then there's this common occurrence; yesterday, the foursome in front of us were playing the blue tees, yet, three of them, most of the time, couldn't hit the ball further than 100yds off the tee, then we'd see them standing around bull-sh***** for a bit before hitting their ball.   The whole round they were sucking down suds like there was no tomorrow, while hitting on the blonde cart girl, which they failed at too.  LOL 

Was that you behind us?

[kiawah]

I have tried and failed using the clock system. I find that I set the club a bit too late in the backswing to really make the most of the clock system on these shots. Whenever I took a video of myself trying to take it back to a certain "time," I would often be taking it back further than I thought. Rather than try to reinvent my whole swing just to make it work on a few shots, I have shifted gears to just practicing hitting the ball a certain distance and then really take a beat to visualize hitting a shot to a specific landing point when it comes time to hit it on the course. I am more of a feel player anyway, so it is more of a natural throwing kind of motion for me. When I played baseball, I would never think about how far back my arm has to go to make a throw from center field to the cutoff man, I would just look the ball into his glove. The same idea applies to my short game action.

[kiawah]

42 minutes ago, Pepperturbo said:

@Hawkeye77 So true. 

 

The biggest culprit working against short-game improvement is that people don't have the time, want to take the time, or too lazy to use the time to better their games, but like talking about improvement.  Their solution is banging a bucket of balls using a driver, then cringe, skull or chunk to bogie or double-bogie golf inside 100yds. 

 

It's laughable, people talk as if they can mimic touring pro, LM stats, yet they simply do not have the physical ability or natural talent, plus many are swinging around their beer gut with a beer in hand. 😜 The only way to improve any aspect of this great game is to practice.  I hit baby pitch shots at least 4 days a week.

 

Then there's this common occurrence; yesterday, the foursome in front of us were playing the blue tees, yet, three of them, most of the time, couldn't hit the ball further than 100yds off the tee, then we'd see them standing around bull-sh***** for a bit before hitting their ball.   The whole round they were sucking down suds like there was no tomorrow, while hitting on the blonde cart girl, which they failed at too.  LOL 

The ironic thing is I find working on my short game to be so much more fun than beating balls. The feedback is infinitely better assuming you're chipping to an actual green rather than targets on the driving range. Puring chips and painting up a wedge is so satisfying. Stop telling people that they need to work on their short game! I love when I have the green all to myself, lol. 

 

FWIW, I am around scratch and keep my strokes gained stats. I work on my short game and putting as probably 85-90% of my practice and yet it always seems to be the place where I could stand to gain the most shots. I just think that once you're hitting ~10 greens per round, the only way you're really going to ever put up some great low rounds is if you are proficient from <100 yards, especially that 30-75 yard zone. If you can really hit an approach sideways and still find a way to scramble out of it, that's when you know you can play anywhere, any day, in any conditions. Your A swing is only going to show up so often. But you can really avoid ever playing a truly honest to goodness bad round if you are able to scramble.

[Nels55]

41 minutes ago, jonsnow said:

Was that you behind us?

You know, it sounds like the group in front of our friend Mr. Turbo had a good time as did Pepper so it's all good.  More than one way to enjoy a round of golf!