HOW do you tell a friend ...

[Hidalgo]

that his shafts are too strong ?

A dear friend of mine who is now 64 years young (I'm 56) has been on a "power drain" for most of this year. His iron distances are down 10-15 yards at times from the yardages he played 1-2 years ago. He insists that it is his swing and ball-striking that are the culprits.

..................... But I know better.

He is still playing S300 shafts. His ball flight has become "rainbow-like" and there is no zip to the shots anymore. It is obvious to my trained eye that he DESPERATELY needs to make a shaft change to something more managable.

But here's the problem: HOW do I tell him that he needs to back off on his shafts without hurting his feelings or making him otherwise feel badly? I am still playing SLX100s (although they're getting marginal at times) and for me to tell him that he needs to change might not be well-received. I have played regularly with this friend for 3 years now, and I would truly like to see him make a change that would make his game more enjoyable.

But I am very hesitant to say anything to him.

Any suggestions?

[ShankingShanks]

I'd say something like this "You know Bill, I reckon you need a softer shaft", then smile and say "We aren't geting any younger you know", Now if he answers in the positive you can help him, if he answers in the negative you can hold your arms up and say, "Just trying to help" and never mention it again.................Steve

[Greenie]

I would just go ahead and tell him what you think. Then I would say" it's just my opinion" and talk him into going to get fit by someone that really knows. For me I was willing to accept a shaft change after seeing the results that supported it. If you really don't want to mention it then just get him to go to a fitter to be fit. Let the fitter be the bad guy if your buddy is going to react that way. Or maybe get him to a demo day and have him hit a few with regular shafts. In my group we are all in our 50's. We really don't have a problem discussing issues that might help any of us out , as we age.

[MadGolfer76]

Give him a sleeve of Slazenger Raw Distance.

[jrjones60]

I'm 63 and have been losing distance this year. I went to Gsmith and checked my swing speed. It had dropped from 90-93 down to 75-82. I checked my ego at the door and immediately ordered senior flex shafts for my driver in a 45 gram. I also bought some Precept LADY IQ Plus golf balls that are 55 compression. I had been playing the Srixon Z Star. I have gained 20+ yards off tee and in some cases 30+. I'll be having the same Grafalloy ProLaunch Blue 45 senior flex shaft put in my 3 wood and 5 wood this week. It's really nice to be able to hit a 6 or 7 iron into a par 4 green instead of a 5 wood or a hybrid. Just relate what happened to me when you suggest it to him. Hope this helps.

[Guest]

Really hope this doesn't sound flip, don't mean it to, but how close are you to this guy? My close friends and I play by a pretty brutally honest set of rules, sometimes it gets harsh, but we always know where we stand. I would tell one of my friends to give it up and get some equipment that fit him. I'm considerably younger than you or your friend, but I tell my dad, who's 64, something to that effect all the time, especially when he picks up my big boy clubs on the range and tries to muscle them. I'd much rather hear it straight. I expect my sons/good friends to tell me to quit being a stubborn old geezer in about 30 yrs.

[harold baines]

you don't tell him, that's insulting!

if you're that involved in doing something about hit, take him to a demo day and make the club rep break it to him!

[gboldman23]

If I were you, I'd only mention it if I switched shafts. Something like, "I gained back X yards by switching to regular flex," might make him think about changing too.

If not, just let him play his shafts and continue to take his money when you play.

[HenryBall]

Have your friend hit a lighter shaft and have him watch the improvement... Hopefully he will make the switch.

[hurricanes7]

[quote name='Hidalgo' timestamp='1280243888' post='2602015']
A dear friend of mine who is now 64 years young (I'm 56) has been on a "power drain" for most of this year. His iron distances are down 10-15 yards at times from the yardages he played 1-2 years ago. He insists that it is his swing and ball-striking that are the culprits.

..................... But I know better.

He is still playing S300 shafts. His ball flight has become "rainbow-like" and there is no zip to the shots anymore. It is obvious to my trained eye that he DESPERATELY needs to make a shaft change to something more managable.

But here's the problem: HOW do I tell him that he needs to back off on his shafts without hurting his feelings or making him otherwise feel badly? I am still playing SLX100s (although they're getting marginal at times) and for me to tell him that he needs to change might not be well-received. I have played regularly with this friend for 3 years now, and I would truly like to see him make a change that would make his game more enjoyable.

But I am very hesitant to say anything to him.

Any suggestions?
[/quote]

borrow a demo from the pro shop with a lighter shaft and tell him you are looking at new irons/shafts and let him try them out. he will figure it out on his own

[dalehead]

[quote name='twaynewise' timestamp='1280263294' post='2602702']
Really hope this doesn't sound flip, don't mean it to, but how close are you to this guy? My close friends and I play by a pretty brutally honest set of rules, sometimes it gets harsh, but we always know where we stand. I would tell one of my friends to give it up and get some equipment that fit him. I'm considerably younger than you or your friend, but I tell my dad, who's 64, something to that effect all the time, especially when he picks up my big boy clubs on the range and tries to muscle them. I'd much rather hear it straight. I expect my sons/good friends to tell me to quit being a stubborn old geezer in about 30 yrs.
[/quote]

Well, for starters I wouldn't refer to my clubs as "the big boy clubs". Don't think that would get the discussion off to a good start. Might work with you and your Dad, but most guys would think a remark like that was a put down.

[ExRidd]

Mention you recently hit some whippy shafts and couldn't believe the improvement as well! Maybe he'll get the idea.

[Asleep]

You don't ... unless he asks.

[vgagolfer]

[quote name='Asleep' timestamp='1280705254' post='2611987']
You don't ... unless he asks.
[/quote]

Words to live by. I don't understand why people feel the need to offer unsolicited advice. This is equivalent to offering swing tips during a round. It's worth repeating, don't offer unless asked.

[dalehead]

Go with him to a demo day in your area. You'll get to hit a variety of clubs and shafts. May be helpful for both of you. At the least it should be a fun day.

[Ezgolfer]

[quote name='Asleep' timestamp='1280705254' post='2611987']
You don't ... unless he asks.
[/quote]


Plus one .

[mozgolf]

You mentioned your own X shafts were getting marginal, why don't you both go and get fit together, you might also benefit from a step back to an S shaft as you seem to be hinting at. "Hey bud I am looking to get fit for some easier shafts that don't beat me up so much, want o come along and get fit as well...."

Or if you feel you need to be sneaky just go and change the grips and put a lighter flex decal on your shafts....

[Hateto3Putt]

Raise the bets!

[petter7]

Give him some clubs with softer flex shafts and let him compare them side by side.

 

If he truly needs a softer flex, he'll notice the difference pretty quick. I've done this

quite a bit with good buddies that feel it is a sign of lesser ability to go to a softer

flex. Most of these guys never have been properly fit for shafts, so when they start

to struggle with those really stiff shafts, I let them experience just how good the next

flex down can be for them, especially those getting up in years.

[puttingmatt]

Do not do it !! If you value your friendship, It is
not your place, and if he spends money and no
improvement, he will probably consider getting
a new golf partner and friend.

[Vapor]

[quote name='vgagolfer' timestamp='1280709669' post='2612132']
[quote name='Asleep' timestamp='1280705254' post='2611987']
You don't ... unless he asks.
[/quote]

Words to live by. I don't understand why people feel the need to offer unsolicited advice. This is equivalent to offering swing tips during a round. It's worth repeating, don't offer unless asked.
[/quote]


I understand the mentality behind this reasoning but I hardly see it as unsolicited advice in the way of a mid round swing tip . I can guarantee you will temporarily hurt his ego but I am pretty sure he will thank you for it when he is shooting lower and longer, thats what its all about at the end of the day. If you're close enough he'll accept it, if you're not then don't give it. If it is the latter then go with a sneaky trip to a demo day, it may bring out the golf ho in him. As with a mid round swing tip, he may only appreciate the advice from a pro, I know I would.

[crtssxc]

I dont understand the comparison to an in round swing tip (which I am highly against). If it was my good friend, I would tell him straight away in a nice way, and I would expect him to do the same for me.

[elvis]

[quote name='HenryBall' timestamp='1280680159' post='2611368']
Have your friend hit a lighter shaft and have him watch the improvement... Hopefully he will make the switch.
[/quote]

That's what I was thinking. bring a lighter flex iron with you. tell him your thinking of trying them and would he hit it to give you his opinion. Maybe the light will go on.

[mozgolf]

Any feedback from the OP??

[freddiec]

Can somebody tell my why its bad practice to tell a friend something that could help him? I'm not a big fan of the don't tell if your not asked rule, especially when it comes to golf, we are talking about improving fun, are we not? Whats the big deal? I played with a very good Pro a couple of years ago who was close to 60 and he told me he played X100s for years, but now since he's getting older he's down to S300. Use that as an example and help your friend, if you really feel he could benefit.

[wrmiller]

Not to hijack this thread, but last Sunday I played with a couple of gentlemen, older and of average ability with regards to the golf swing.

On the first tee, before we'd even hit our first drives, one gentleman asked me what I do differently to hit a draw as opposed to a normal swing. I explained that I do things a little differently than most golf rags/pros teach, but then went ahead and explained how I hit a draw. I then demonstrated with my tee shot, hitting about a 15 yd draw.

I watched him swing, and realized the origins of the question: He has a really, really bad over the top move, using a reverse Furyk move i.e., WAY inside, big loop at the top to the outside, and cut across the ball at about 30 deg and sending a big slice into the right rough.

I said absolutely nothing.

About half way through the back nine, he hit another weak slice on a approach shot, and looked at me with this look of complete frustration on his face. So, I decided to do something I rarely do: I asked if he would like a suggestion. He responded with something like "are you kidding?", so I made a suggestion, thinking he would take it to the range with him next time, and sort out the details there.

Nope.

Next tee shot had him attempting to implement my suggestion, with better, but not great results. So I ended up telling him a little more, showing him an example, and the last two holes had him hitting this little power fade that ended up right center of the fairway. He hit three fairways all day. The grin on his face was something to see, and I could tell that he appreciated the help.

This time worked out ok, but it is not something I normally do. I was taught early on that I should keep my opinions to myself, unless asked. But I do sometimes break my own rule when I feel the situation warrants.

[MAGICoronado]

Well I will say this, I have a good friend who plays 3 times a month, and out drives me all day everyday, but he can't hit his irons as far as I do and they are starting to go straight up and straight down.

I told him, keep in mind I hit the ball 270-290 (depending on the course), to start driving through the ball on his iron shots instead of scooping them, he did it and now is hitting a piercing ball flight and is 2 club lengths longer off the tee. I'd look at swing before I would equipment to be honest.

That was my 2 cents I hope it was a little insightful. BTW the guy I play with is 65 and is in really good shape.

[Pepperturbo]

[quote name='Hidalgo' timestamp='1280243888' post='2602015']
A dear friend of mine who is now 64 years young (I'm 56) has been on a "power drain" for most of this year. His iron distances are down 10-15 yards at times from the yardages he played 1-2 years ago. He insists that it is his swing and ball-striking that are the culprits.

..................... But I know better.

He is still playing S300 shafts. His ball flight has become "rainbow-like" and there is no zip to the shots anymore. It is obvious to my trained eye that he DESPERATELY needs to make a shaft change to something more managable.

But here's the problem: HOW do I tell him that he needs to back off on his shafts without hurting his feelings or making him otherwise feel badly? I am still playing SLX100s (although they're getting marginal at times) and for me to tell him that he needs to change might not be well-received. I have played regularly with this friend for 3 years now, and I would truly like to see him make a change that would make his game more enjoyable.

But I am very hesitant to say anything to him.

Any suggestions?
[/quote]

If he's a "good" friend he should be able to handle, and want the truth from not only a friend but someone that plays better. If he's not that good of a friend, and or he's that insecure - I wouldn't bother. Let him learn on his own.

[viperstudio]

[quote name='Asleep' timestamp='1280705254' post='2611987']
You don't ... unless he asks.
[/quote]

I agree, don't tell him anything unless he ask you.

[DaveLeeNC]

[quote name='viperstudio' timestamp='1281517065' post='2631892']
[quote name='Asleep' timestamp='1280705254' post='2611987']
You don't ... unless he asks.
[/quote]

I agree, don't tell him anything unless he ask you.
[/quote]

I am kind of late to this thread, but ....

I would not tell him because there is no guarantee that it will matter. I have a mid-90's kind of driver SS and I have played everything from stiff to a very weak A flex in my clubs (I build my own so can experiment pretty cheaply). It hardly matters TO MY SWING.

I once was experimenting with some super-soft steel iron shafts. I ended up with a 6i with a butt frequency of 282 cpm 6i and a 310 7i (3-4 cpm/club from that point on). It didn't matter much although I did ultimately reshaft the 6i to match the rest of my irons.

dave